Q&A: Pat Ryan on the Israel-Hamas war and calls for a cease-fire

On Oct. 7, Hamas launched a vicious multi-pronged attack on Israel, taking 240 hostages and killing an estimated 1,400 Israeli soldiers and civilians. In response, Israel has launched waves of airstrikes in pursuit of eliminating Hamas, killing an estimated 10,000 Palestinian civilians, including 4,100 children, in the Gaza Strip.

The effects of the conflict have reverberated around the world, including in the Hudson Valley. U.S. Rep. Pat Ryan, whose 18th Congressional District includes a large number of Jewish residents, has been working with locals who have family members in the region — including two families with relatives who were taken hostage by Hamas.

As an Iraq War combat veteran, a former Army intelligence officer, and a member of the House Armed Services Committee, Ryan has first-hand experience with war and deep insight into Israel’s importance as an ally to the United States. But he has also faced growing calls to back a cease-fire from advocates critical of Israel’s brutal campaign in Gaza and Ryan’s acceptance of political donations from the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, or AIPAC — the influential lobbying group that contributed nearly $26,000 to his 2022 congressional campaign.

Hundreds of Ryan’s constituents have turned out at two rallies — one on Oct. 25 in Poughkeepsie and another on Nov. 9 in Kingston — to urge him to back a cease-fire in the Israel-Hamas war. Ryan has been a vocal supporter of Israel’s right to defend itself since the Oct. 7 attacks. In a 20-minute interview with the Times Union on Nov. 9, which has been lightly edited for clarity, he discussed the conflict, his vote to censure U.S. Rep. Rashida Tlaib, and what it would take for “both sides (to) commit to a cease-fire.”

Several people from your district have been affected by the Hamas attack on Oct. 7. What details can you share about the constituents who have family members caught up in this, and do you have any updates on the people taken hostage?

We had dozens of families in Israel, and we worked closely with the State Department to get them home. A few are still there, but it’s been their decision to stay, rather than any delays on our side.

More worryingly, two families in the district have relations currently held by Hamas as hostages. There are about a dozen American hostages; two of them are from Goshen. I’ve been texting and speaking almost daily with the niece of these two individuals, who are 72 and 73 years old. They were out on a morning walk in their kibbutz when they were taken hostage. We think the gentleman, 73, was shot by Hamas terrorists. We have no idea where they are now. The last time their phone was pinged by the Israeli Defense Forces, they were in Gaza. So we’re working night and day, 24/7 to do everything we can to get them home.

Then there’s another family in Kingston whose grandparents tragically were killed that day. Their children, who are in their 40s, and their two young grandchildren were taken hostage. We just learned a few days ago that the father, we believe, was also killed, based on the family identifying him in some video that Hamas posted.

I guess all this is to say that when you sit with these families, the thing they both said to me was, “We can’t forget our family members are being held.” They’re worried that in all that has followed — both on the ground in Gaza and also here in the U.S., the antisemitism, the tensions — they’re worried about their family members. They just want them to come home.

We’ve seen an uptick in the U.S. of antisemitism and Islamophobia. What have you seen in your district and what are you doing to combat that?

We were already at incredibly elevated levels of, in particular, antisemitism before the attacks on Oct. 7. Now, we’re at near unprecedented levels, at least in my lifetime, of both antisemitism and Islamophobia. We’ve had many more incidences of antisemitism reported to us — not to say that there aren’t others that haven’t been reported.

Personally, my wife and her family are Jewish. It’s very scary talking to rabbis and religious leaders across the district. Their fear about just having their congregations meet for services is unprecedented. It is infuriating and also saddening that we’ve reached this point where we’re pitting American against American. That’s exactly what our adversaries in Iran and in Hamas want.

You’ve served in the Army, you’ve been in active combat zones, and you’ve done intelligence work. What insights or perspectives from those experiences are informing your approach in this conflict and what do you think elected leaders without military service may be missing?

Those who have served in combat, more than anyone else, are always going to be aware of the horrific nature of war — that it brings out the absolute worst in humanity, and that it’s almost always innocent civilians on both sides of any conflict that pay the price.

So to see the images coming from Gaza, and to see the video and images and hear the stories of the Israelis and Americans affected by Hamas’ attacks — it’s all just gut-wrenching and heartbreaking. It just ups the urgency to figure out how to achieve not just a short-term pause but a lasting cessation, a lasting peace, which is incredibly hard and feels almost impossible right now.

There are understandable and I think well-intentioned calls for a cease-fire — but that requires two parties to agree. What I’ve been calling for is that as soon as Hamas is willing to stop its attacks and commit to not continuing them, Israel must do the same, and then we will have an effective and lasting cease-fire.

Hamas has built tunnels under civilian areas like hospitals, and in Israel’s attempt to eradicate the organization, it has killed scores of civilians, which it claims is justified. You’ve said Israel has a right to defend itself. But do you think these aggressive bombing campaigns are the only or most effective way to eliminate Hamas?

The most effective way is always direct action with ground forces to target and defeat an enemy that holds ground, whether that’s Hamas or, in my case, ISIS, when we were fighting them in Iraq.

Of course, it is important to recognize that daily, Hamas is grossly violating the laws of armed conflict and the Geneva Conventions, and they’ve been doing this for decades. Israel has to take the high ground from a moral perspective and do everything it can to minimize civilian casualties. Airstrikes are always going to have higher levels of civilian casualties than ground forces taking similar action.

So, I think this is one of those situations where, again, until Hamas agrees to take back its standing threat to destroy the state of Israel, kill all Jews, and continue to attack Israel, it’s extremely difficult for Israel, which must protect its people, to stop its actions. It’s an incredibly delicate situation. It calls for understanding all the nuance and complexity if we’re serious about actually solving it.

On Oct. 8, a rally in Times Square in support of Palestine attracted condemnation because some protesters chanted antisemitic slogans and one flashed a swastika. That day, you tweeted that it was an “absolute disgrace” and that our “ONLY focus should be mourning those we lost and supporting Israel’s ongoing defense against terrorism.” But since then, Israel has dropped roughly 20,000 bombs in Gaza, killing at least 10,000 people — including an estimated 4,100 children, according to the Gaza Ministry of Health. There have also been rallies in your district to call for a cease-fire. Is there room for Americans to protest or speak out against the collateral killing of civilians?

One of our foundational rights and freedoms is the right to free speech and to peacefully protest anything and everything that any American wants. I’ve literally put my life on the line for that right and I respect those who exercise it. When there’s hate speech involved or threats of violence, that’s where we have to draw a line. That’s why I was deeply concerned and fearful of what was being said by many at that rally that you mentioned.

I’ve been engaging, listening and speaking with folks from my district who have reached out. We’ve heard a wide breadth of opinions, from many who’ve called for an even more forceful response from Israel, to those who have expressed other views. I think the common thread I’m hearing from everybody, which I agree with, is we have to stop the cycle of horrific violence that’s escalating. To me, the only way to do that is to have both sides commit to a cease-fire.

A recent Siena poll found that 59 percent of upstate New Yorkers support the U.S. sending more economic and military aid to Israel. But just 33 percent of upstate voters support Israel “doing everything it can — including a large-scale attack in Gaza — to make sure it never happens again, regardless of casualties.” Why do you think there’s a gap between those two sentiments?

I think that represents how many people I’ve talked to (feel), so that feels right. How could you turn on your TV every night and see what’s happening on the ground, and not, as a human being, want it to stop, want to not see the loss of innocent civilian lives? I mean, that’s how all of us feel.

I think the question is, how do we get to that point? There is where a deep understanding of the history of the conflict, what’s brought us to this point, and the dynamics on the ground (is important). How do you get two sides to ratchet down what’s currently an escalating situation? It’s incredibly difficult, especially given the long history.

We support Israel as an ally. We also want them to honor our shared values of commitment to democracy and a commitment to — wherever and in every way possible — minimize the tragic loss of innocent lives.

Do you think Israel has made a sufficient effort so far?

The folks who are on the ground, responding to these horrific Hamas attacks, I’m sure are doing their best to both go after the terrorists that hurt their fellow Israeli citizens and also minimize the loss of any innocent life on either side. The situation as it’s happening now cannot continue. We have to figure out how to get to a durable and lasting peace. I think Israel is doing the best it can in an incredibly difficult and complex situation.

You joined 22 Democrats and the majority of Republicans in voting to censure U.S. Rep. Rashida Tlaib, the only Palestinian American in Congress, for her use of the phrase “from the river to the sea” as well as her tweet about the bombing of a hospital that I understand you saw as misleading. Do you believe that Congresswoman Tlaib holds antisemitic sentiments towards Jewish people?

What I know for certain — including in my own family and many of my Jewish constituents — they uniformly view “from the river to the sea” as calling for the destruction of the state of Israel. They view it as antisemitic and as inciting more violence on the ground, not only in Gaza and Israel, but also leading to the growing and really scary acceleration of antisemitism (domestically), including right here in our district. I can never understand her intention — only she knows what her intention was. But her language in propagating that call and her intentionally continuing to spread proven misinformation about who was culpable in the early, confusing days of the war for an attack that got an incredible amount of press coverage across the world — to not admit when you’re wrong in such a volatile situation, those are the things that actually perpetuate violence and put more fuel on the fire of hatred.

We need leaders at all levels to be doing what they can to not propagate the cycle of antisemitism and Islamophobia. I ultimately voted the way I did because I think her words and actions have, unfortunately, inflamed them.

Then do you feel the need to disavow Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s Likud Party stating in its manifesto: “Between the sea and the Jordan, there will only be Israeli sovereignty?” It’s very similar phrasing but used by the Israelis instead of the Palestinians. And it’s the Prime Minister’s party.

I’ve not heard him say that. What’s clear to anyone who wants to see a resolution here, who’s studied the history, and who’s followed the facts on the ground, is the only durable solution is a two-state solution, which I certainly remain committed to, which the United States has to remain committed to.

Even though it feels near impossible right now, it’s even more important that we redouble our efforts towards that. So that means, ultimately, a recognition of the shared history and shared claims to many parts of what is currently the state of Israel. We were getting increasingly close to some resolution through the Abraham Accords, and tragically, Hamas’ decision to conduct this attack has set back that progress and made it harder to get to a durable two-state solution and ultimately to peace.

Israeli President Isaac Herzog claimed about the Oct. 7 attacks: “It is an entire nation out there that is responsible.” Do you agree with that statement? And if not, how can you confidently support an entity that has announced it will collectively punish civilians?

No one has said they’re going to collectively punish (Palestinians).

He said it is an entire nation that is responsible — not just Hamas, but the entire nation of Palestine. This is from the president of Israel.

Hamas is responsible for the attack. Hamas is also essentially the de facto governing power over Gaza. And they’ve ruled it in a way that has made the lives of Palestinians objectively worse in every dimension, which is tragic. The actions of Hamas do not represent the actions of every Palestinian both in Gaza and in other places. That’s very clear to me.