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I just wanted to write something in case anyone is on the fence about wanting to try and learn ToB, or if they think they aren't good enough. Decided on a whim to run learner/low KC ToB over the weekend as I'd never done it outside of the quest version and holy shit it's been a blast. Even when I fuck up and die/take unnecessary damage I'm still having fun because it's a challenge to try and improve from one run to the next. I went from wiping on Maiden multiple times and fucking up freezes to getting all the way to P2 Verzik while using minimal supplies over the span of just a few raids, and I'm not even a great PvMer at all. If you think you're not good enough to give it a shot, just put yourself out there and try it! Remember, the first step to getting good at something is being bad at it.
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![r/2007scape - [Suggestion] Make Revenant Cave entrance single area larger to prevent clan/spearing abuse and give solo players a chance](https://b.thumbs.redditmedia.com/E3RqRKyqtqelodfTyAsNOWXga_BtBsSwwgbM-fCp0MY.jpg)
i wish more people dared to take the plunge, tob was the only content keeping me in the game for a couple of years
It’s the fact that it mostly requires a group to complete.
Hopping on Discord with random people I’ve never met isn’t the most fun idea for me. Luckily I have real life friends that play and we’re going to try CoX and TOB soon, but I can totally understand why a lot of players don’t try TOB
Don’t need discord for it if you don’t want
I think once you get comfortable doing TOB, then you don’t need discord. But at first, you definitely need discord so people can tell you what to do
Thank god someone gets it. As an average skill solo player I feel locked out of so much content. I love osrs, my childhood was osrs, but now I have my own children and I can't be pissing off friends by leaving because they woke up. More solo content or reduced difficulty for solos please Jagex!
Why have kids when u wanna raid
Theres an easy mode solo… and that was almost just as fun as doing it in a group? Why arent u guys talking about solo easy mode where its lierally a breeze to walk through?
As far as I know the easy mode for TOB doesn’t give uniques right? I did A Night at the Theatre when it first released and I haven’t been back since. That’s why I don’t do easy mode for TOB
they want easy purples, that's it
Yeah I just want a shot at uniques, even if it's rarer
Genuinely OSRS has taught me that anything is learnable. People who are really good at this game were once bad too.
Learning zulrah and cg have been a lot of fun. I sucked so much at the start and now I'm 200 kc into cg and Zulrah is a cakewalk.
Hopefully soon I can take on inferno and colo
And yet again, another who tries tob finds it the best experience they've had. They perfect the formula and then bring toa into the game... here's hoping raids 4 returns to the tob format
Hey raids 3 was something completely unique and has gotten a lot of people unafraid of pvm and learning more of it.
I definitely hate doing it personally and the invocation system gives me mixed feelings, but overall it's a good thing.
ToA was the first raid I did and it was a great entry point because you can make it as hard as you want it to be. I honestly just got tired of the monkey room and akkah lmao
Simple way to do Akkha is to just get carried by someone butterflying or just setup radius markers with his colors
Cum phase is what is most annoying about akkha. Butterfly is not difficult to learn anyway.
It’s also my real entry to end game I’m just here till I have tbow and shadow then I’ll go learn either tob or cox did a little of both
CoX is far easier than you'd think, definitely worth giving a shot if you have any interest. I had never done it 2 weeks ago and now have 50kc, it's a blast with some chill duos or trios (or solos if you're a gamer)
Toa did some things great but fell short of basically every high level player's expectations. Tob remains the best content in the game and probably will for a long time.
Toa is the most accessible raid with the whole invocation system which is awesome. Easy to pick up solo/duo/in a team even if nobody has any raiding experience and you can slowly ramp up the difficulty to your liking.
The problem is that the majority of invocations do absolutely nothing in terms of adding actual mechanics. A 300 and a 500 are mostly the same, in a 500 the bosses just hit harder and take longer to die while you are more limited on supplies. Double trouble+keep back are two of only a few that impact the raid more significantly and few people bother actually turning them on because it requires learning new strategies over just leaving them off.
In the end a high invocation run is nearly the same as a 300, you red x, you butterfly, and you are only allowed a couple of mistakes. It's more punishing, but not mechanically any different from a 300.
Edit: typo
The way to increase your purples at CoX and ToB is to go faster and more exciting.
The way to increase your purples at ToA is to make the raid slower and more boring.
Yeah I farmed normals as an 80 combats boy and over time I ended up going for my fang kit. I really just had to start using blood fury, learn how to set up red x more consistently (I just do the red x from anywhere method except I never used to set it up at all I'd just kinda feel out the stomp) and how to transition butterfly quadrants a little better.
Honestly I think where ToA went wrong is that the mechanics aren't meant to be solved with skill and moreso just bugs. Think about Kephri and zebak. You don't really do anything other than pray well and kinda stand there. Then you dodge waves and solve the rocks. It's boring, but at least it's not buggy. Kephri is also not just bugs (no pun intended) unless you trap the range scarab. Then you look at baba and Akkha. Baba has a terrible version of nylos and Akkha has a boring puzzle mixed with butterfly which is just unintended movement. If you have a shadow butterfly is by far your best dps, so you're incentivized to butterfly even in a level 0. It's silly.
I'm a cox enjoyer though. Chill and not annoying puzzle rooms, complicated final boss that takes extra skill if you're soloing.. it's great all around. They just need to touch up the drops and allow us to make stams in the raid and it'll be perfect imo.
Pretty sure they said they wouldn’t be doing tob type content again because only a small minority would actually do it. By that I mean group based and challenging.
Tbf, that was before we all saw how terrible toa turned out
I feel like it's possible to make something like ToA on the low-end (easy modes accessible to low-level Larrys) while still having the top-end be as good as ToB. I don't really think there's anything mutually exclusive about the two tbh, they just fucked up when it came to high-invo ToA
I mean I agree but the vast majority of people really love TOA
Make a decent solo mode for tob and it will have more people to play the team version too.
Solo mode defeats what makes tob good. You can't have both.
tob should never be made viably solo-able
Learning ToB with 4 learners all using whips was the most fun I’ve ever had playing this game, feel bad for people who learn by just getting carried by scythes with 500+ kc
Most fun for me was doing mory only gym achievement because i was going for masters and my buddy was a few tasks away from gm. This mfer was so iron he did NFZ with Torag hammers lmao.
That was a big thing for me as well, I don’t wanna get carried to get my KC because I know I just won’t learn anything. Way more fun and informative to just grind it out with some learners
I agree.
Been learning some ToB this past week and having a blast. Even more so after getting my first kc yesterday and being rewarded with a scythe lmao. On a 2death raid even.
I just don’t like playing with randoms. Me and my GIM partner tried some duo’s in leagues and struggled with that, whereas we picked CoX and TOA up in the main game in a day.
If I was good enough to do it with 2 people I’m sure I’d agree haha.
ToB has a minimum scaling of 3 people, so duos is more of a challenge than a typical team setup
Duos is pretty solid, even for people who are more experienced. Find at least a third and you'll enjoy yourself way more.
There’s a ton of other learners at WDR, and it’s not as bad as you would imagine to learn with them together. I still frequently raid with the guys I learned ToB the hard way with years ago
Most fun I had in this game was pking in multi revs.
Facts. Or DMM was fun too when the whole clan got into the final week
I want to learn especially cuz I’m 1 kc from being ranked, but I don’t like playing with ransoms and my friends are pussies
Really want to but the idea of doing it on mobile terrifies me... Trying to muster up the courage (and the funds for a dwh/bgs) for Cox
Looks really fun but still... Mobile is scary esp since I can't be looking things up or watching stuff in-between lol it's just go big or go home
I wish I understood the hype, I really do.
It has nothing to do with a false perception of "gatekeeping", I have clanmates who actively invite me to join them. It has nothing to do with planking, I don't get tilted at TOB the way I do at TOA. I really don't understand what it is, but whenever I spend a night at the theatre, I come away wondering whether I had any fun at all.
At this point I'm hoping if I just send enough raids I'll eventually convince myself I enjoy it.
Different people always enjoy different things, its totally fine if you tried it and liked other content better. Kudo's for atleast trying it out
Yeah, I just wish I could pinpoint what it is that turns me off. It's a shame not to find joy in what many consider to be OSRS's best-designed piece of content.
I think the fun in ToB is the feeling that you get slightly better every time you do it
TOB is super fun but the entry bar is pretty high, it’s hard to get into low kc raids and you will generally be harassed if you mess up.
ive actually never seen people harass learners. the only people who get shouted at are mid-kc players who think theyre experts and grief the raid trying overcomplicated strategies.
It’s really not. You only need elite void, blowpipe, tent whip, zenytes, BGS/DWH, and a chally/claws. It might actually be the cheapest starter setup of any raid
It’s actually extremely low
The gear reqs are basically nothing and you can learn everything you need to know in entry mode
Entry mode is completely different.
For completions, yeah. But don’t do that.
It’s a sandbox. Set up scenarios and learn. Die to reset the room and go again.
Go put on your bronze scimitar and practice P1 timing running out from behind the pillars, practice P2, practice popping crabs, practice tanking P3, web running, get a feel for dodging maiden blood, find your max range for BP and tbow at maiden for freezing. List goes on.
When you’re ready to melee Xarpus, learn it in Entry. Tick eating bloat stomp and sote balls and yellows? Entry. Practicing pre-fires? Entry. Proper speccing and getting on right tick at xarpus. Same thing. Boak? Can learn it in 10min of entry mode practice.
With an hour or two of entry mode practice, you can be better than people with 100kc easy
I freshen up in entry mode all the time.
Shhhh dont tell reddit about boak, theyll start losing their minds
How is entry completely different besides having scaling for solo and just being less punishing?
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Just start trimming peoples armour! That’s what I did to fund it
Well once you have the gp you should give it a go then
Buy a bond for $8 and you’re good to go!