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Will I probably always be single if I don't make the first move/go out on a limb?

I'm a 29 year-old male who is getting nervous that he'll never have a romantic relationship. I've never had a girlfriend, but I've also never been able to bring myself to try to flirt. Since I've never made a move, are the odds pretty good that being a man no woman is ever going to show romantic interest in me unless I take a risk and try flirting? I've never really tried flirting for a lot of reasons, but am willing to change that now.

I guess I'd say I'm average looking. And since scientific research shows that it matters, I've graduated from law school and have passed the bar exam, but am a law clerk at the present and won't be a lawyer for a year or two. I heard a friend tell me that the relatively high social status of lawyers is enough that many women will be attracted to it. Still, that won't happen for a little while.

My question - is the reason I've never had a romantic relationship (in contrast to most of my peers) likely that I just haven't tried? Or what advice would you give me?

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u/Chip-Less avatar

One thing I’ll say is don’t listen to your friend about social status as being a lawyer because that is the wrong outlook on finding a romantic relationship. Doesn’t matter how long it takes, don’t listen to the shit that takes about how to “get” women because it’s better to live an authentic life being yourself.

Now, do I think you should make the first move? If you want, then yes, you should. But, don’t think that means you should be flirting with any woman that you can. Be friendly, cordial, and if you feel something, listen to that feeling and see where it takes you. Keep on going lad.

u/chicago2008 avatar

Thanks. And to be clear, my friend's advice wasn't that having higher social status would "get" me women so much as it was that it would make me much more attractive to women. I was wondering if I'd have to wait to be a full-fledged attorney before I'd have a realistic chance of a woman being interested in me/actually reciprocating interest. If I'm being as objective as possible, I'd say that I'm like a 5 out of 10 on attractiveness. I wasn't sure if a man who only looks average would have to wait to have higher social status before there was any plausible chance of a romantic relationship working out.

u/Chip-Less avatar

Okay, but you are proving my point that your social status would make you more attractive as in people want you therefore getting women. I understand this can be true, but that also means that a woman is attracted to you not for you, but what you are providing. You considering an attractiveness a 5/10 like…don’t think about the world that way. I’ve certainly seen many many many men unattractive but being in healthy relationships and women as well. You have to think with the mindset that someone finds you attractive…you don’t have to think you’re Ryan Gosling ya know?

u/chicago2008 avatar

Yeah, I get what you mean. I mean, scientifically it is shown that while men gravitate towards women for their physical appearance, women gravitate towards men for their social status.

But I understand what you mean about that being shallow, and an undesirable way to conceptualize relationships from the start.

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u/Chip-Less avatar

Also I literally saw that there was some dating advice post about an unemployed 42 year old dude living with his parents getting a girl so…just consider that you are in a MUCH better position already

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I think that unless you conquer your shyness, you'll remain as you are indefinitely. Your suggestion is basically, inaction. Has this have brought you anything so far? Nope. So you have to face your demons.

In fact, I would put it on a priority. Because if you do become a lawyer, goldiggers will likely get you and you'll be worse than you already are. Good luck

Yea you’re gonna have to make the first move. You honesty don’t need to flirt fr. Just give them a compliment and start a small convo.

As a woman, i would say if you’re looking on dating apps to say outright ‘message me first’ if u want them to do so. For me at least, i dont mind if someone does that because otherwise i will wait for a man to initiate convo. Having a flirty line in your pocket can also be a good ice breaker. But it doesn’t all have to be flirting depending on your setting, a good conversation starter, compliment, or something like that still feels genuine. If youre looking for something serious, do not ask a girl for her socials in real life. Ask for her number, and then if she isn’t confortable but offers socials, take that.

But yeah, your lack of trying is a part of the reason. If initiating isn’t your thing, just try and make yourself as open to conversation and new experiences as possible. You may be making yourself look more closed off than you feel.

Obviously im just one girl and this is how i think, others may feel differently about it.

26 going on 27 and I have the same fears. The thing is I have nobody to even consider asking out. I’ve tried and didn’t like online dating because I want to gain real world experience if that makes sense?

My problem isn’t so much a fear of rejection it’s that I literally have zero options.

u/thirtyplusanddating avatar

Make moves.

It is a learnable skill, and you get used to it. Start with online where there are no consequences, and then move on to real life where there are still no consequences so long as you are respectful and can handle rejection.

If you don't ask, you don't get. This applies to many areas of life, but also in the dating scene.

This applies to anyone who is chronically single : if you don't flirt, don't make moves, don't take risks, you will obviously stay single. Even if someone someday hits on you, if you don't flirt back, nothing will happen.

This is something a lot of men don't understand about women. They will do the approaching first, but not often explicitly ask for a date/number, leaving it up to the man to do that. And if he doesn't pick up on those cues from her, she just moves on. So he has to be able to reciprocate the flirting even if she initiates contact. I'm 40, and can look back at my early 20s the times I had women pointing bright green lights in my face and not seeing them, and then crying about how women didn't want me.

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Yes, as a man you will have to initiate. You may be the exception and have a relationship fall into your lap, but it’s far less probable than seeking out your own. Besides, don’t you want a choice in it?

Get amongst it. Drop all the lawyer shit, too. Nobody wants to hear about it and you’ll attract the wrong people. Just enjoy other people’s company and work on your confidence and humour.

Have fun!

u/chicago2008 avatar

Thanks. Can I ask what you mean though by the "Drop all the lawyer shit" comment?

I'm not sure nobody wants to hear about it. Psychologically, while men tend to be most attracted to women's physical appearance, women tend to be most attracted to men's social status. So while being a lawyer doesn't mean having the absolute highest status in society it's still a widely respected profession.

If you don't believe me about social status, there's a reason men like Donald Trump have attracted so many women. When it comes to physical attractiveness Trump has got to come in just about last place, but that hasn't been a problem for him. And it's not just because the women he marries are gold diggers - why did women have affairs with Trump and not expect money in return? I can't read their minds, but if I had to bet I'd say it's because women tend to be most attracted to men who have high social status.

So wouldn't being a lawyer logically improve the odds that a woman would reciprocate my interest if I flirted with her?

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Whenever I hear guys have never had a relationship by your age, it's because they never have made a move or flirted. Most people literally can't get into a relationship without trying... to get into a relationship.

Do you expect to get paid when you don't show up for work? Do your teeth get cleaned if you don't go to the dentist?

u/simon_dateup avatar

Not trying means having a lack of experience. A lack of experience brings a lack of confidence. A lack of confidence makes you stay the same. So find the confidence to create your first experience. But don't expect this to go right; indeed, you're probably going to make some mistakes. And it's totally fine. I was a perfectionist in my younger years, the school system taught me that there's no space for making a mistake, and if I ever failed at something, I would have been considered stupid forever. Therefore, I always overthought a lot before making a move, before asking for a phone number, or even before going for the kiss. But then I understood something crucial: nobody will ever judge you for trying and failing, and the only bad feeling I was experiencing was actually coming from doing the opposite, from not taking a chance in inviting someone on a date, holding hands, or sharing my emotions. I think you being a future lawyer, this perfectionist mindset also affects your profession, but I suggest that when it comes to dating, you must remove your perfectionism and enjoy the feeling of being capable of failing for the sake of gaining a lesson that will stay within you forever.

u/One_Coat8225 avatar

Hey bro, not everyone grows or is at the same pace. I was in your position. I am 31 years old and have just started dating met an amazing woman who I love very much and she set up our first date and it has been great ever since I was very nervous on the first day, so the only “move” I made was a hug and kiss on the cheek. I asked her for a second date and she agreed, and that is when I kissed her on the lips we have been kissing on the lips ever since even in front of her parents and in church. If you feel comfortable, take a chance and go out on that limb I’m telling you it will be worth it brother

It will certainly improve your chance drastically to learn some social skills and how to flirt, lead a conversation with a woman and ask for her digits or a date. At 29 I’d even consider signing up for a PUA boot camp.

Yes. You have to make a move. It's like anything in life, if wishing for it is your only strategy, your chances of success are pretty slim.

My question - is the reason I've never had a romantic relationship (in contrast to most of my peers) likely that I just haven't tried? 

Yes but its also the reasons you haven't tried which can be linked to low self-esteem, social anxiety, communication problems, and fear of disapproval.

Since I've never made a move, are the odds pretty good that being a man no woman is ever going to show romantic interest in me unless I take a risk and try flirting? 

Sometimes women do make the first move but its pretty rare.

Yep

u/__orb__ avatar

Sometimes woman do make the first move but most the time no. Just be confident or atleast fake confidence at first. The worst that can happen is they say no to you asking them out. I struggle sometimes too man for example made eye contact with a cute girl at the grocery store the other day , she was checking me out first but I got too shy to say anything. It feels weird in certain settings like that I get worried going to come off as a creep. Most girls I meet are at concerts and raves and from mutual friend and also dating apps but the apps suck. If you don’t party at all lots of people say the gym can be good too or any social events or gatherings. For me personally almost every gf I’ve had met at a music festival or a rave

Lol. I was literally just talking about how whenever I make the first move, I get rejected, and then I see this. 😂😂😂

u/No_Detective_But_304 avatar

Man up, make some moves.

u/ImProbablySleepin avatar

This guy deserves more hate as a person

u/No_Detective_But_304 avatar

Oh I see, he should play it safe and do nothing. Great plan.

Shut up dude

u/No_Detective_But_304 avatar

No, dude.

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