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Her?
George Michael has a GF?
She's probably funny...
1st. If ken really wanted to hurt war machine, he is a professional fighter. Its pretty easy to go to one of his fights. He is ken shamrock, it wouldnt be hard to get backstage access ect...
2nd. If ken shamrock ever said I need help mentally, I'd probably just kill myself because thats REALLY bad...
Really though War Machine would demolish Shamrock. Ken don't want none of that.
Ehh, not sure about that ... Ken's like 6'1 220 or at least last time I saw him he was. Much bigger than War Machine. Of course WM is younger and might be more skilled, but I wouldn't say he'd demolish him.
WM might be younger, but he definitely isnt more skilled.
You don't think so? I just assumed that Ken was just so much part of the "old guard" - e.g. the fighters of the days where MMA was largely an underground, unpopular and thus not so lucrative or attractive sport to great athletes with high skill levels - that with the evolution of MMA we've seen, someone of War Machine's standing today would be better. I could be wrong, like I said I just assumed that.
Ken is definitely OG. But his presence persisted into the new age. His leg lock game was way ahead of his time. You might be right though, I just personally think ken is more skilled. For instance, I dont think WM would have EVER been able to beat Bas.
He's 5'11 and 50 years old, hasn't fought in four years and the last time he did, he pulled a hammy and the fight had to be stopped.
Whatever stat you're basing the 5'11 claim on, it's wrong. I trained under him for almost 2 years and he's a BIG guy. At least 6 feet for sure. You can believe it or not but he has taken a bunch of HGH.Everything else you brought up: meh
His current condition and past fights are meh when talking about a hypothetical match up? Ok. Sure. He's 6'1. He wins.
Only thing Ken can demolish anymore is his own reputation.
I bet he could demolish you and everyone else on this subreddit.
Ken Shamrock is a former Intercontinental Champion! Nobody can come close to beating him in a fight without a steel chair!
...in a fair fight maybe. In a no-rules backstage brawl, where Shamrock gets the drop on him?
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Comment deleted by user
The World's Most Dangerous Grandfather
Pause....AHAHAHAHAHA!
Thankfully if Ken starts beating on you he will quit after having a heart attack
Unless you're name is Tito... Or you're any other active MMA fighter.
If you ever hurt his daughter he'd lay an pray on you till you gave up.
More like he would try to take you down so he could leg lock you, but his knees don't bend anymore so he would box with you, but his chin can't hold up anymore so he would get knocked out :(
Turns out Ken never knew UFC 9 was open handed strikes only and had fought normally.
I'm just keeping my Ken Shamrock references current.
I'm not the most liberal or compassionate observer of the American justice system, but even I must concede that a lot of times rehabilitation or "help" is the better solution than prison. That being said, War Machine gave up his chance for eliciting any sympathy from me a long long long time ago. Rehabilitation should be reserved for people who are willing to try and change, not people who are so belligerently violent and narcissistic that they are utterly unwilling to examine their own roles in the events of their lives. We don't look at a rabid dog and say "man, if he'd just have been born in better conditions, maybe this wouldn't have happened." We don't let the rabid dog off with a vacation in a minimum security "rehabilitation" camp. We put rabid dogs down because society's right to be free of vicious criminals overwhelmingly trumps War Machine's "right" to be rehabilitated. You have lost your chance to be helped, War Machine, and if there is any valid concept of justice in this world, you will be punished for a long fucking time. Shamrock is doing MMA and the multitude victims of War Machine's crimes a great disservice by attributing his barbarism to anything other than it's true cause: War Machine's refusal to abide by society's most basic mores. War Machine is not the victim of his environment or upbringing, and any attempt to remove his culpability is insulting and irrelevant. He is the result of the selfish, inexcusable choices he made and he should be forcibly and permanently removed from civilized society, period.
end of my rant, but also Ken Shamrock should seriously question his judgment of character and his judgment as a father for letting his underage daughter leave the country with some meat head alpha male wannabe that he barely knows.
Right, because every time a 17 year old girl runs off with an older badboy, she makes sure to get her father's permission first.
I have a feeling the more we learn about how the brain works, the less true your statement will be. i could be wrong though.
No. Regardless of what we know about the brain and upbringing, at some point personal responsibility have to take precedence. Most child abusers were abused themselves. It has to stop somewhere.
The question of where human ideas come from (even evil ones) is a massively complex subject. I'm no expert but I believe neuroscience is opening doors every day into these fields and there's deep philosophical discussion about the actual existence of true "free will" with a shift towards the negative. Don't confuse "help" with let off easy. You can still have your pound of flesh.
As a mad thought experiment. Imagine during his court case it turns out he has a brain tumor affecting his aggression or judgement skills. One which can be fairly easily treated or removed so he is returned back to normal (too lazy to look but I think there's been cases). How much would you want to punish him then? That makes me uncomfortable to think about because it leads to the question, "Well what if there's something wrong with him that doesn't show up in an MRI?"
If he did that to MY loved one I'd still want his head on a fucking stick of course but the process of law isn't (thankfully) as passionate as you or I.
The American rehabilitation system appears to be one of the most vile things on Earth after the Catholic church. I don't think we should forget that "better" is possible.
Edit: Intended as a reply to PinkySlayer (inspired by bouras).
Free will is a perfectly viable construct if you're honest about the terms in which you use it. It's not magic like most people make it out to be. It's the tangible result of causality acting on a deterministic brain that is able to chemically produce striving, choosing, anticipation, etc. Using neurochemistry/physics to negate thousands of years of organic development in social moral systems is pretty crass.
I strongly believe there is no such thing as "free will" in the sense that most people think there is. Free will essentially boils down to the concept of choice, and that if we control what choices we make, what actions we take, then we possess "free will" to do what we may. But I believe that we don't really have a choice in our choices. In other words, at any given moment, while we do feel as though we control what decision we are making in that moment, we actually have almost zero control over what we do when you look at it in the long term (or another way to put it would be the longer the time frame that you consider, the less choice we actually had in any decision that we make). I'll try to explain why.
Basically, from what we understand about how the brain works, every decision you make is made based on a combination of your brain chemistry, the connections of neurons, the way that hormones and neurotransmitters react and interact in your synapses, the patterns that have formed and the connections that have been made over the years, genetic factors, and all of that coupled with the experiences that we've had in our life and the inputs and data that we have accumulated. So we can simplify that down to basically "brain wiring" and "knowledge" (I guess this is akin to the age old "nature vs nurture" debate, only here I'm not caught up in how much of a role each plays, but rather just acknowledging that they both exist and are the two determinants of our choices).
The way your brain is "wired", or structured, or whatever you want to call it, is not really within your control, now is it? That is basically the result of genetics and physiological changes from things like diet, trauma, drug use, etc. Maybe it is indirectly affected by your choices (especially things like diet and drugs) but even then, if you made the choice in the past, and now it affects the way you think/choose/act even though you are unaware of the difference, then that is not really in your control either. So basically the whole brain wiring part is out of your control. Ok.
As far as the knowledge side, that encompasses all of the things you have learned, seen, heard, and experienced. All of the data that you have been inputted throughout your life. Now, did you really choose what things would happen to you, who your parents/family would be, where you would grow up, etc.? Of course not. Many things that you experience/learn are a direct result of past choices (what books you read, etc.) but if the choice to do those things was made directly based on the wiring and previous experiences you've had. In other words, you didn't really control that choice.
Your brain will process all the knowledge/data you have, run it through the "program" that it has (wiring) and make what it thinks is the best choice from the available options. But you didn't decide what knowledge you'd have, or what brain wiring you'd have, so you didn't really control the choice you made. Yes, you chose. But it was basically predetermined already.
It's much more complex than that, but that's the summary of my belief. Sorry for the wall of text.
There's a neuroscientist named Jim Fallon that has found some very interesting things about the brains of people who are psychopaths. He scanned the brains of a bunch of Hannibal Lectors and found some common trait. When people with this trait are severely abused as children (not just a little abuse I think he said) they almost always turn into psychopaths. The interesting thing is that his mom came to him and said "you talk about this as if we don't have killers in the family". Turns out his cousin is Lizzie Borden and a relative of his was the first recorded case of matricide. This researchers brain apparently shows the traits he talked about. He said he and those who know him recognize him as being somewhat antisocial. YouTube has his TED talk and other videos.
This thread has been linked to from elsewhere on reddit.
[r/badphilosophy] Is the debate on free will's existence really shifting to the negative?
If you follow any of the above links, respect the rules of reddit and don't vote or comment. Questions? Abuse? Message me ^here.
I never understood the need to punish people to be honest. If he could prove that "it was not his fault", why would we punish the guy?
Couldn`t agree with you more.
I wish your viewpoint and the comment above it was considered by more people. Maybe we shouldn't be so quick to harshly judge people, given how many anomalies could be in affect of the given person. It just doesn't seem smart how easily so many people can come to conclusions of absolute fact.
To some extent i agree with you, but where do we mark the line?I personally believe that pedophilia is a mental illness and that it is demonized for political expediency rather than any real or looming threat it poses.I believe that pedophiles should have access to therapy to help them overcome their urges.the same applies to war machine;I have no problem IN THEORY with us taking a rehabilitation-centric approach.but once you've raped a child, once you've gruesomely beaten your ex to within an inch of her life, then it is not the responsibility of society to bear the burden of your poor choices.You do not get to invoke the merciful nature of people like you who would rather rehabilitate than punish while simultaneously taking advantage of our limp wristed approach to your deviancy. I would MUCH rather prefer that we prevent child abuse and domestic violence rather than simply catch the offenders after the fact, but the reality is that these biological determinist approaches fail to address the fact that people are still responsible for the choices they made and they should be held accountable for their actions.Its very sad we live in a world where we can't prevent more war machines, but that doesn't mean we should give war machine carte Blanche because of his upbringing.the man deserves, in every sense of the word, to be fairly, justly, and fully punished for his crimes.
If he is suffering from mental illness though, what will punishment achieve? I mean other than a sense of vengeance to the bereaved. Honestly, I believe we as society should try at least once to rehab and help people like this, and if that fails, the next strike should put them into a system that separates them from the general public forever (sort of like prison, but a bit different). I have pretty radical ideas when it comes to this stuff though, so take my opinion however you like, lol.
Edited a word
If we are simply the sum of our experiences how can we justify any personal accountability?
I'm actually rather curious if the reason why war machine is the way that he is is because he is demonstrating signs of cte.
I partly agree with you - only because I don't think the issue is black and white. War Machine is a lethal mixture of being mentally ill, along with a product of his environment. Either way, he is/was a ticking time bomb and cannot handle an ounce of stress in ANY situation - not just MMA. Give him an office job and I bet he goes postal. What if this guy had kids?
I do agree, and hope he stays away for a long, long time. If not, I can't imagine the beyond fucked up monster that society will be getting in 10 years.
he needs 6 months of acid and mushroom trips in the middle of the forest followed by a year of meditation.
Replace shrooms and acid with Ayahuasca and you got it.
and forest with isolation tank
Also, he should take some Alphabrain from Onnit, codeword rogan for 20% off. 100% return policy etc.
He will probably fight his spirit elves.
What I assume it will look like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otFYYqNVbAI
24 hour, nonstop repeats of his shitty behavior on video while being mega-dosed with mushrooms. And forced to watch himself at his shitty, abusive, worst. Like the clockwork Orange theater scene. Pry his eyes open and make it impossible to look away.
Ftfy
He did 1.5yrs in solitary. And that was AFTER he was already completely fucked up mentally. I have no problem with an insanity defense and mental rehabilitation.
Who did 1.5yrs in solitary? War Machine? That's brutal for any person in the world to handle, the death penalty is better than 1.5yrs in solitary. That's just cold.
I mean, the guy is a grade-A douche, but 1.5 years... Damn.
Yeah he talked about it on the Joe Rogan podcast.
He said he did one year that was basically full solitary, then during another stint he was in solitary for 6 months.
I don't see how anybody could be considered mentally fit for public life after that.
Damn. What did he get solitary for? Fights?
I think he said the 12 months was because when he got there they said "you're a fighter? you can't be in gen pop." and just put him in the hole preemptively.
The other one would have been for fights I believe.
Oh shit.. I have 1 year /timeplayed in Warcraft. Thats basically solitary confinement.
Death? I would not mind 1 and half of year of silence and alone time. Just feed me books and I'm fine.
Man, I like my alone time too, but 1.5 year of it? That's just inhumane.
I believe its the lack to feel compassion or remorse. No matter how many times your try to help a person some will never change.
Actually, we do say that any dogs. If a dog is crazy it's usually the owners fault and that's a shame.
He might not completely be a product of his environment but according to wikipedia he failed to resuscitate his own father who then died in his arms. Whatever WM was predisposed to was likely activated by that trauma and exacerbated by brain damage and poor coping strategies.
Because telling a kid not to do something always works...
I have been saying all along that Warmachine is a victim of the MMA lifestyle and I have mostly blamed the MMA community for his actions but given this new information I now hold Ken Shamrock fully responsible for all of his misdeeds. Ken Shamrock took an innocent boy and introduced him to a bloodsport that ruined his brain and gave him the fighting skills to become an unstoppable asshole. The name Ken Shamrock shouldn't even be allowed in this subreddit after all the grief Christy Mack had to endure because of him. Ken is a true scumbag and a terrible parent for letting those monsters he trained near his underage daughter let alone take her to Mexico.
Couldn't believe what I was reading until I saw the username
I didn't get it until your post.
Still don't get it.
The culinary union is the big reason why MMA is banned in New York. Zuffa owns or has shares with station casinos, which isn't unionized. Culinary union acts like Fox News towards democrats when it comes to anything MMA.
Whats MMA? You mean human cock fighting?
http://i.imgur.com/T4rYutM.gif
lmfao I fucking love this troll! I got all the way until "bloodsport that ruined" and was like FUCKIN WAIT, IS THIS THAT CULINARYUNION POSTER?' and sure enough, there he is hahahha. good for lolz on the daily
http://x4.fjcdn.com/thumbnails/comments/3445930+_1963bf79c4f02f5fd66d6647a471e464.jpg
That is a really bad novelty account.
It's brilliant. People always fall for it.
I'm out of the loop. Who is this guy?
Just going to leave this here and walk away...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M35fHsC3e4A
This is brilliant, I love this
He's fucking hilarious man.
I like him an the treee fitty guy.
Any pics of his daughter?
None that i could find.
Damnit man! That's the only reason I came to the thread!! OP plz!
Her name is Fallon Marie and shes 18 all I know.
Ken Shamrock dad of the year.
War Machine kicked my dog and slapped my wife's ass while asking for a medium rare steak.
He'd better be careful, Ken will beat him into the living death...
Why are people allowing War Machine to take their children anywhere?
Whats up with Shammy's nose
Damn so is he pissed because War Machine fucked his daughter, or left her in Mexico?..... Or both...?
Yeah right because Ken Shamrocks 50yo's ass could break someone actively training to fight. Its funny that he brings it up right now when warmachine is in prison and he cant get to him.. :)
Grasping at anything he can attach his name too.
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As if no father has ever had trouble controlling their 17 year old daughter...
true, if he really wanted revenge he would be better for waiting it out.
With war machines history (if/when) he gets out - if Shamrock beat the hell out of him everyone would have assumed that he was defending himself against the 'crazy' war machine.
Once you admit ' you want to kill so -and so' nobody will believe your self defense story.