LONDON, ENGLAND - FEBRUARY 12: Rich Robinson (R) and Chris Robinson of The Black Crowes perform at ... [+]
"Like anything else we're gonna persevere," Black Crowes frontman Chris Robinson says. He is talking specifically about life in the last year and a half of COVID, but 31 years after the band exploded into rock stardom with the chart-topping Shake Your Money Maker, he could just as easily be referring to the band's long career.
The band has had a very Behind The Music worthy career, with breakups, in-fighting between Chris and his brother, guitarist Rich Robinson, massive success and more. They've been through the roller coaster of rock and roll for shire.
Yet, Robinson says, "I still look at rock and roll as a great adventure." And he believes it. Maybe in some ways he believes it now more than ever. Now 54 years old, reunited with brother Rich, he is in a great place, which he credits in large part to his wife.
Not only does he musically have his brother back, he says they talk three or four times a week. You can see the dynamic between them in the just released Brothers Of A Feather film, a live acoustic performance recorded in San Francisco last March, released this week as part of the Coda Collection. And with live music they can resume their thirtieth anniversary tour for Shake Your Money Maker, which will find the band doing the album in full from start to finish.
I spoke with the colorful and quote-heavy Robinson at length about some very surprising musical influences, "She Talks To Angels," learning from mistakes he made when he was younger and why the band is proud to have survived telling the music industry to go "f**k themselves" many times.
Steve Baltin: When did you decide you could sing?
Chris Robinson: Where my voice would take me is much different than where we started cause we were punk rock. We were '80s American hardcore. I loved hardcore music but then I found my interest more in like Jeffrey Lee Pierce [Gun Club], John Doe and Exene (Cervenka, X), those kind of bands more. Then the Paisley underground hit and that was really big, Dream Syndicate, Rain Parade. And indie rock - R.E.M., Let's Active, Game Theory, and things like the Cure and Siouxsie And The Banshees, all these things. We hadn't really found our connection to roots music yet, I hadn't really found my voice. I didn't know. I grew up listening to P-Funk, Prince, Lakeside and S.O.S. Band. I'm from Atlanta, there was a lot of black music influence. Sly And The Family Stone, James Brown and P-Funk are huge. And then the R&B stuff, Otis (Redding), Sam & Dave, Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, Buddy Holly, all these things. So we start to let that come into it and then I allowed some of that sound into my voice. Then we find George Drakoulias, our producer and A&R man. One day he played me "Miss Judy's Farm," by the Faces, and it was just like one of those, "Whoa, wait a minute!" I knew Rod Stewart from other stuff, I didn't know that. They never played the Faces on 96 Rock in Atlanta. And you never heard any of that music in our punk/new wave scene either (laughs). And when I heard that it was like, "Oh my word." I was into the Stones, but I got into the Stones deeply through Gram Parsons. Then we just kind of crept up to there. George pushed me. And you would do shows and someone would say, "Oh, you ever listen to Terry Reid?" Then you go out and buy as many Terry Reid records as you can. "Did you listen to Lowell George? To Steve Marriott?" Then digging deeper, Paul Rodgers and Frankie Miller and all these white rock/soul singers.
Baltin: Some of these influences might surprise people. And I love you mention Dream Syndicate, my vote for most underrated L.A. band.
Robinson: I totally agree with you. And I've been friends with Steve Wynn for many, many years. And also I love Kendra Smith so much. When she and David Roback started Clay Allison, then Opal and those groups. That's my favorite, favorite record. All that music and I can never emphasize the importance of R.E.M. to young Rich Robinson and I. R.E.M. was influential in our initial forays into rock and roll.
Baltin: I agree, R.E.M. one of the greatest bands ever. And a perfect example of leave people wanting more. At the end of their career people seemed to have lost interest and now if they came back it'd be massive.
Robinson: It'd be huge. Before the pandemic hit my brother and I were finishing up our "Brothers Of A Feather" acoustic tour we were doing and we were in Portland where Peter Buck lives. I used to try to dress like Peter and cut my hair like Peter. And we've sold 20 million albums or whatever, we're the Black Crowes. But we're having lunch with Peter and I know he still sees me and Rich as those kids, "Here's a cassette of our new demos," when we'd see him at the club at the DB's concert or something. But he sat in with us at the club that night and it was so funny, we did "7 Chinese Brothers" acoustic. I've jammed with a lot of people, I was in a band with f**king Jimmy Page and I've never been more nervous than to get onstage with Peter.
Baltin: How has that new wave and hardcore influence stuck with you over the years?
Robinson: That music meant so much about your culture and who you were as well, to kind of step outside of what was deemed normal. And that's always been a huge influence on the politics of the Black Crowes. Us versus them. And did it serve us? Not always, but I'm still here and we told a lot of people to go f**k themselves in the business in the best way. Not that we were self-important or we thought we were previous in any way. It was just like, "You don't f**king care." They don't care about your talent, your vision, your art, your soul, your sincerity, They care about how much money they make. And that's cool too, man. I'm nowhere near naive enough to pretend it's not that. But I always felt as a true Rasta man no one gets by me, no matter what. and my idols were that way, from the writers that I loved to the directors to the records. Was it problematic? Yes. But I also think it was buoyancy through some of the bulls**t of the business. Rich and I, as different as we are, both believe in the mythos of rock and roll. We believe in the legend that music means something. We understand the muse is a vengeful goddess and you have to prostrate yourself in front of her and give her your loyalty or she'll take it away.
Baltin: Who are the definitive f**k off artists for you? Those artists who have set the pattern for doing your own thing.
Robinson: I think Johnny Lydon, especially going from the Pistols to PiL is really one. Like I read his book and I was like, "Wow." I wouldn't say he's a huge influence on me, but his attitude...that's the whole point of being an artist. If I had wanted to be in the service industry I would be in it. A great waiter can make a s**t dinner amazing. I look at Siousxie Sioux and I go on these deep, deep dives of watching every bit of live footage, of just how powerful and amazing and she was a woman standing there and did not give a f**king rat's ass what you thought. It was her belief in what she was doing that's so inspiring and so deep and unique. But there are millions. Put whoever you want in the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame. Until you put X in there I don't give a s**t. To me, X is one of the great, great, great American rock bands of all time. Or someone like Joe Strummer, who I was lucky enough to get horribly drunk with back in the late '90s. But Strummer didn't give a s**t either and that's why his soul is beautiful. Money is powerful, ego is powerful. And I'm a capitalist. I'm not even gonna pretend. But I'm also an artist. And Rich is the same way. We want to make a lot of money, it's nice. We have families, we have responsibility. I like to have nice things and I buy a lot of records, or whatever (laughs). I like French restaurants, but I'm not ever gonna be something I'm not to obtain material things when I've been given the blessing of being able to live like this.
Baltin: Do you find that over time the differences between you and Rich dissipate and you focus on the positive?
Robinson: Yeah, definitely. I think also I'm a dyslexic extrovert and Rich is an OCD introvert (laughs). That's the yin and yang symbol right there. Now that I'm older, and I always have to say, my wife Camille has opened my heart so much and allows me to see the world in a different way without so much other stuff. I like a crowded dressing room with people after the show, I like that energy. Rich has social anxiety. Every night a room full of different people would just make him shut down. But I didn't really care. That's my own callousness. And when you're in rock and roll and trying to keep that f**king train on the tracks and keep it rolling and trying to keep everybody fed I didn't f**king care, But now that I'm older now I see it. Rich is a grown man, but I want to be able to make this experience the best for Rich and I understand him better. When we spent life without each other in different projects we understand the special gift each of us brings to our musical communion. My ego was hurt or whatever and it's like, "The Black Crowes should be about this, or about me." And then I realized, "Wow, it is me and Rich, It's always been me and Rich. And now that we have connected in life and experience, that's why this whole thing is working so well. Rich and I, we're on the phone with each other just about bulls**t, family business three or four times a week and on the weekend. It's taken a long time. We're obviously not that clever.
Baltin: I am sure for you the most gratifying thing is that you repaired your relationship with your brother.
Robinson: Our mom's 82 years old, we have s**t to deal with and the kids. The kids are funny, well Rich has seven children, I have two, so he's an overachiever. But my daughter is 11, this was a couple of years ago, she's like, "What's the deal with you and Uncle Rich?" I'm like, "Now I have to explain this s**t to her?" But it's good, it demands you dig deeper into the subject than just passing it off. I was laughing, back in the '90s I used to hang out at the Sunset Marquis in the whiskey bar (Bar 1200) a lot. And Dave Gahan, from Depeche Mode, was there a lot and he was very nice and always wanted to be friendly. But I would always be such a dick and I didn't listen to Depeche Mode. And now, 30 years later when I hear Depeche Mode on Sirius I'm like, "God damn, I wish I could be friends with Dave Gahan now. I love Depeche Mode, these songs are so good." It's just funny how things are. And you change.
Baltin: Let's go back to writing. As a writer, are there things that really stand out for you looking at Shake Your Money Maker 30 years later?
Robinson: The first example that sticks out like some kind of a compound fracture would be "She Talks To Angels." My youth was dark and romantic, I had these existential sort of themes (laughing). I came up with a character and then I wrote a song that's resonated for so many years with so many people. But really it's just a made up song. I don't think I'd even probably tried cocaine at that time in my life, let alone heroin. Later in life, of course, you find yourself in some more adult situations if you will. Or a darker place sometimes. But I look back and I think, "That's a pretty good start." I'm proud of that little film we made. A lot of times I look at the lyrics as scenes and I look at it as a film. I just want to write songs that are like Robert Altman movies. But it's also funny because back when we were kids it'd be like, "'She Talks To Angels,' I got my first blow job when that song was on." Or, "My cousin died in a car crash and that was the cassette in the player." The whole spectrum of, "I played at the song at my wedding," or, "I played the song at my dad's funeral." Those kind of things. And I'm the same way. My wife knows the playlist when I'm gone. It's mostly just The Madcap Laughs, Syd Barrett. But I can definitely look back. "Jealous Again," even. I always loved, Bob Dylan is still the king. And Neil Young, but Mick Jagger, man. People love, "You Can't Always Get What You Want," but the best line in that song is, "We're gonna blow a 50-amp fuse." That's so rad. Or Chuck Berry, there's no Bob Dylan without Chuck Berry, the way he changes into rock and roll. I like cool rock and roll lyrics too. But the same thing, when I'm writing I'm still trying my best to represent the image and the story. I want it to represent some sort of emotional place. It has to resonate with the listener, not just yourself.
