The Triune God!
Discussion:
The Triune God!
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martus
2004-05-28 07:50:46 UTC
Permalink
God fills the universes and is in everything everywhere, the Father!

Mankind in comparison to God is less than the size of the smallest
particle of the smallest atom but God knows us personally and speaks
to us through God's Word who was made small enough not to destroy us
by that very same power of God, Jesus the Son of God, the voice of God
contained in the form of man.

The power of God to shape and change the bulk of God, the Father, to
the shape of The Word of God, the Son, is done by the Holy
Spirit(Michael and the angels that obey God).

There is only one God and God operates through God's Word and power in
creating!


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
End
times:
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
'enry VIII
2004-05-28 19:55:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
God fills the universes and is in everything everywhere, the Father!
Mankind in comparison to God is less than the size of the smallest
particle of the smallest atom but God knows us personally and speaks
to us through God's Word who was made small enough not to destroy us
by that very same power of God, Jesus the Son of God, the voice of God
contained in the form of man.
And you are a crazy fundy! <G>

Join the Christian's trip to South Carolina!

www.christianexodus.org

'enry VIII
Libertarius
2004-05-29 23:07:39 UTC
Permalink
"Triune" is like "square circle". -- L.
martus
2004-06-02 08:22:26 UTC
Permalink
The New Age & Devil Worship
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter

Do those who practice paganism worship "devils?"

RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - A few years ago during the Christmas
season my wife and I walked through a local mall. As we perused the
different shops, we came across a New Age bookstore conducting a
"Grand Opening". In a derisive tone I said to my wife, "Can you
believe some people's lack of intelligence?"

Casually, I strolled into the store, and without hesitation snatched a
book from the shelf and began offering a sarcastic commentary as I
read from the pages. I noticed my wife growing uncomfortable and so I
placed the book back on the shelf, and proceeded out of the store.

Suddenly, a dull sensation hit me. It began in my stomach and shot
upward through my head, impacting my equilibrium. As I stepped
outside, into the main mall walkway, my head started to spin, my hands
started shaking. I felt as if I was going to faint. It was literally
as if an invisible terror had "jumped" on me, and was somehow
injecting powerful feelings of nausea and anxiety throughout my entire
body. I tried shaking it off, but couldn't. I attempted to walk it
off and failed. At last, feigning interest in something, I moved away
from my wife and began to pray. I asked the Lord to forgive me for my
sarcastic attitude, my lack of caution, and for my want of concern for
the lost. I prayed for deliverance from evil and for healing of the
body and mind. After several hours of such walking and praying, I was
finally restored.

I discovered a valuable lesson that day: while a Christian may not be
demon-possessed, it's equally true that the "princes" of this world
are powerful, and we should enter their arena only after prayer, and
at the prompting of the Lord.

I also learned the mystical forces of the New Age movement are genuine
(and willing to protect their territory!), and that much of what is
currently published under the guise of New Age "enlightenment", is
nothing less than Old Age doctrines of nefarious invisible hosts.

As in antiquity, so in modern times, those who practice paganism are
guilty of worshipping "devils" (Rev. 9:20). The dogmas which were
once embraced (and still are through the New Age Movement) as the
wisdom of the gods, are defined in the scriptures as the "doctrines of
devils". The Apostle Paul declared: "the things which the Gentiles
sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils" (1 Cor. 10:20). In Acts 7:41-42
(Jerusalem Bible), we find that those who worship idols are joined to
the "army of heaven" [stratos, the "fallen angel army"], and Psalm
96:5 concludes that "all the gods of the nations are idols" (elilim,
LXX daimonia [demons]). Thus, pagan images, such as represented the
ancient gods and goddesses, were elilim (empty, nothing, vanity), but
behind the empty idols were the living dynamics of idolatry, and
spiritual objects of heathen adoration, the daimonia (demons) of the
Bible.

Since the Bible clearly defines idolatry as the worship of demons, and
since demons are eternal personalities which desire the worship of
men, it is fair to conclude the characterization of such deities as
"Zeus," "Amun-Ra," "Demeter," and "Isis," were simply the classical
names attributed to specific fallen spirits. In other words, Apollo
was a real personality; Osiris was a genuine underworld fiend; Hecate
actually lived, and still does!

One also concludes that the images of the gods (falcon headed statues,
animal forms, etc) served the purposes of such spirits by providing a
point of focus, and by revealing the "nature" of the particular spirit
existing within the god. The iconographies, myths and rituals of each
deity exhibited the specific characteristics (nature, gender,
underworld authority, etc) of that particular entity. Thus, the myths
and images of Zeus, according to such theory, were the physical
manifestations of a literal demon of air, while statues of the goddess
Demeter represented an earth spirit.

Today, it is my assertion and the claim of my book THE GODS WHO WALK
AMONG US, that the same spirits of antiquity, including Zeus, Athene,
Dionysus, and others, continue to express themselves within modern
paganism. My coauthor, Dr. Jones agrees, asserting that the connection
between the New Age Movement and the gods of mythology is strong.

"Nothing has changed in Satan's game plan," says Jones, "just the
names of the players, and, in some instances, even the names are the
same."

Paganism in America is exploding as we enter the new millennium.
Throughout Hollywood, government, cyberspace, and even the church, the
masses are embracing the religious philosophies of the New Age of
Aquarius.

As a modernistic process by which the old gods are worshipped, the New
Age Movement emerged in the United States during the 1960s, and has
experienced a steady growth ever since. The broad appeal of the New
Age Movement as a Western phenomenon can be explained to some degree
as the result of a changing culture. Americans have gradually
abandoned the fundamental precepts of Christianity (prayer in school,
Bible in courts, etc) which provided the cornerstone of civil life and
jurisprudence in American society for more than 200 years. As a
generation of baby-boomers has focused on human potential and the "god
within us all", Eastern philosophies of Monism, Pantheism, Hinduism,
and Self Realization are providing Americans and even some Christians
with an alluring opportunity to throw off the "outdated ideas" of
fundamental Christianity and to espouse a more "enlightened" worldview
of God and reality.

Some notable celebrities have joined the political ambitions of the
New Age Movement (goals include a United Nation's sponsored
Environmental Sabbath for the Goddess Earth), including Shirly
MacLaine, Dick Gregory, Lindsay Wagner, Dennis Weaver, Dirk Benedict,
Cloris Leachman, Richard Gere, Ally Sheedy, and the late John Denver.
Many mainstream "Christian" denominations have also annexed the New
Age ideas, and believers who once held strong doctrinal positions of
the supremacy of Christ, have abandoned those views in exchange for a
New Age universal philosophy. Examples include a witch who teaches
principles of Goddess worship at a Roman Catholic college in
California, and United Methodist pastors who propose replacing the
name of Jesus with Sophia (Goddess of Wisdom) when reading about the
crucifixion. Such persons claim we should join the efforts of New
Agers and be sympathetic to "Goddess-minded Christians."

Former New Age devotee, Judy Vorfeld re-discovered the real Jesus
after embracing such ideas. She became involved in freelance writing
as a result of experiencing the dangers involved in participating in
the New Age Movement. For many years she actively avoided anything to
do with the Christianity of her childhood. When she was in her early
forties, a neighborhood minister said he was starting a new church,
and she thought the time might be right to look at Christianity again.
Judy writes:

‘For a time I was involved in a fellowship that worshipped a different
deity than the God of the Bible....I joined a church that evolved from
ecumenism to religious syncretism....Six months after I became part of
the fellowship, fundamental Christianity was retired in favor of a
universal religious system, one designed to be inoffensive to people
of any theological persuasion. The fellowship then put together a
creed that would be acceptable for any visitors coming to worship with
us. Jews, Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists were welcome, as were
Theosophists, Rosicrucians, and Hare Krishnas....Our minister brought
a popular seminar, advertised as a self-improvement course, into our
church. Most of us were impressed with the professional manner of the
leaders and their sophisticated system of teaching
self-realization....The organization's format, we were told, held the
answers to all our problems....Church leadership eagerly blended the
organization's ideas into an agenda that became a part of our church
curriculum. Eastern meditation, physic healing, and guided imagery
were all practiced.'

Judy Vorfeld is a friend of mine and has provided me with guidance on
the New Age Movement. In a recent correspondence she described modern
Druids, and spoke of their methods of magic healing through
"visualization." She confessed: "Tom.... When we were involved in
Silva Mind Control [through her local church!], we did the same thing
[visualized healing]. At that time, I thought God was behind all this
stuff. I "saw" people in my mind's eye who had various diseases, and
I sent energy to heal them. In groups like this, the leader often has
a list of people who are sick. This gives them a way to follow
through and see who was healed. I have no doubt some people were
healed, but since we were invoking a power other than that of the real
God, what were we doing?"

What indeed.

An amazing component of the New Age Movement (as verified by such
examples as my friend, Judy) is its capacity to adapt to a variety of
religious, even Christian ideas. Consequently, many of the popular
"Christian" doctrines advocated today are nothing more than the cultic
propositions of Eastern mysticism and ancient paganism. These include
concepts of psychic healing, self-realization, emotional experiences,
rules of success, breathing techniques, positive confession, name it
and claim it, environmental theology, the ecumenical movement,
visualization, hypnosis by clergy, mind manipulation, and so on.

At times, and I say this with caution, even the activity within the
"fundamental" church, including certain physical phenomena we
sometimes embrace as the miraculous evidence of "revival," is a modern
form of magic and opens the door for "old gods" and their mysticism to
invade the church. The line between a true manifestation of God, and
human orchestration, is often blurred. Sincere people, in a quest to
experience God, frequently mimic the doctrinal and physical activity
of others. Some physical phenomena (crawling on the church floor and
making animal sounds, etc) is extra-biblical in nature (not everything
that is extra-biblical is un-biblical, however) and therefore
undefined by New Testament teachings.

As a result, some Christians have been drawn after mystical
experiences rather than concentrating on God and His Word. Even
sermons preached by well-meaning ministers have tempted Christians to
pursue "supernatural" encounters with "God", rather than instructing
them to live by faith. The danger of such undisciplined sincerity is
that human nature rarely limits its opportunity for experience. If
the Bible has no clear guidlines of conduct and order, and the
activity is being promoted by church authorities as a way of
experiencing God, then the person seeking the "experience" may have
trouble defining what is, and what isn't acceptable, and thus go too
far. For emotional people the "experience" may be expressed by a
physical reaction, while academics tend to interpret mystical
"experiences" with God as divine revelations or imparted knowledge.
The dangerous consequences of such conduct often leads to religious
behavior more reminiscent of Dionysus or Apollo worship than of New
Testament Christianity. As a result, people like Judy Vorfeld start
out in a Christian church and wind up in the New Age movement.

The dangers of mysticism, such as those inherent with emphasizing
experiences over doctrine, were soundly illustrated in a recent report
by Samantha Smith. She writes:

‘I became strongly concerned about this movement after observing a
"service" at a south Denver Vineyard church....[a woman] stood in the
middle of a group of people who ran their hands over her body (within
an inch or so of the clothing), then kept swooshing some invisible
thing toward her heart area. Saddened, I walked toward the door,
where a church member said, "You should come back on Sunday night.
That's when they levitate."...[another group] in Seattle...sit in
circles, clucking, flapping their tucked arms and visualizing
themselves hatching the "Man Child Company," a heretical Manifested
Sons of God concept. In Kansas City, a pastor watched in horror as
men and women lay on the floor with their knees up and legs spread
apart, trying to birth the same thing....I tape-recorded a group of
Episcopalians howling at the moon, like wolves—giving a "Howl-le-lu-ia
Chorus" for Earth Day. It gets worse. There are reports of "holy
vomiting" (seance ectoplasm?) and of Christians becoming demonized by
being "slain in the spirit." How can this be?'

I echo Samantha Smith's concerns.


PANDEMONIUM!—THE PAGAN GOSPEL OF THE NEW AGE GOD-KING

The gospel according to the New Age Movement is an expansive idea
centered around the birth of a new world "consciousness." As a
religion of monism (all is one), New Agers hope to accomplish what the
builders of the Tower of Babel failed to do—unify the masses of the
world under a single religious umbrella, and, at the macro level,
harmonically converge the world's energies with the power of Gaia. To
promote such goals, New Agers claim that God is pantheistic (God is
all and all is God) and that humans are divine members of the whole
"that God is." According to New Ageism, Jesus came to reveal this
pantheistic nature of God and to teach humanity the gospel of
Self-Realization. After illustrating the divine principle of "God
within us all," Jesus ascended to a place of distinction to live among
the Masters of the Spiritual Hierarchy—Buddha and Krishna. Jesus
promised that the essence of God would be revealed from time to time,
and thus New Agers look for the imminent appearing of a World Teacher
who will, as Jesus did, illustrate the divine human potential. In
this way, New Age theology prepares the world for the coming of the
False Prophet and the Antichrist.

Pagans claim such a religion of Self-realization—a belief that will be
championed by the Antichrist—is older than Christianity.

That's true.

The gospel according to the New Age Movement—a gospel of "becoming
god"— is as old as the fall of man. It began when the serpent said to
the woman "ye shall be as gods" (Gen. 3:5), and it will zenith during
the reign of the Tribulation god-king. The New Age movement provides
the perfect creed for implementing such an end-time religion. It
unifies the religions of the world. It consecrates the forces of
nature. It provides for human divinity, and it is vogue, post modern,
and politically correct.

Tal Brooke—former New Age disciple of Hindu holy man, Sai Baba,
confirms that "the New Age movement, and its progeny, Gaia, are
spiritually correct for a new world order. Christianity is not."

Thus, history repeats itself, and the ancient Egyptian gospel of men
becoming "gods" is fashionable again!

Consequently, New Age celebrities such as Shirley MacLaine represent
themselves as "I AM that I AM" at human potential symposiums around
the world, and the Vice President of the United States, Al Gore,
describes God in terms of "a constant and holy spiritual presence in
all people, all life, and all things" [emphasis added]. Ex
president's wife, Hillary Clinton, channels the spirits of the dead,
and members of the House of Representatives warn Congress of
"increasing evidence of a government-sponsored religion in
America...[a] cloudy mixture of New Age mysticism, Native American
folklore and primitive earth worship."

For many years Christians wondered how the Antichrist would deceive
the earth's masses. How does one convince millions of people,
especially in countries where Christianity exists, to exchange their
souls for temporary earthly benefits? Then the New Age Movement came
along with its focus on human-potential and self-empowerment and
successfully drew many Christians away from Christ-exalting doctrines.
Old-fashioned gospel preaching was replaced with positive thinking,
self-realization, and pop psychology, and mystical experiences which
tantalize the flesh were sanctioned as "the last great revival." As a
result, celebrity preachers advance sermons focusing on "the inner
self," and Sunday morning services begin with shouts of "Are you ready
for God to do great things!?" The implication that God will meet with
believers and grant their many requests is touted as dynamic
Christianity. The days of unconditional Christian devotion are
threatened as contemporary congregations expect God to "manifest"
Himself and please the whims of the audience. Although Jesus warned
of an "evil and adulterous generation [that] seeketh after a sign,"
physical and mystical "thrills" have become the benchmark of many
popular Christian gathering places. The result is a growing
superficiality among some Christians who are preoccupied with
mysticism and "me-ism."

As a businessman and ministry leader I've tasted the bitter results of
the "new age" segment of Christianity. Too often these believers
fall, flop, quiver, shake, and gyrate on Sunday, but can't get out of
bed and go to work Monday morning. Among such employees, I've found
insignificant character differences between religious groups, and
"Christians" have been just as likely as non-believers to lie, cheat,
and steal at my place of business. Perhaps I've been unlucky, or
maybe, as I believe the case to be, twenty years of popular New Age
metaphysical focusing on "self" has so impacted this generation that
many "Christians" are willing to dilute their character to acquire
what pleases them.

Either way, an inward-focusing generation of "religious people"
willing to trade their soul for whatever makes them happy is exactly
what is necessary for the appearance of Antichrist. "You can stamp my
hand if you'l give me what I want" is the required attitude. While
many Christians and New Age devotees are sincere, giving people, the
lasting result of the New Age Movement is nevertheless demonic,
self-absorbed, and paves the way for the coming of paganism's
preeminent materialization—the god-king of the Great Tribulation.'



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Read God's Word in the Bible or you will be deceived!

Romans 1:18-32 (NRSV)


The Guilt of Humankind

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all
ungodliness and wickedness of those who by their wickedness suppress
the truth. 19 For what can be known about God is plain to them,
because God has shown it to them. 20 Ever since the creation of the
world his eternal power and divine nature, invisible though they are,
have been understood and seen through the things he has made. So they
are without excuse; 21 for though they knew God, they did not honor
him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their
thinking, and their senseless minds were darkened. 22 Claiming to be
wise, they became fools; 23 and they exchanged the glory of the
immortal God for images resembling a mortal human being or birds or
four-footed animals or reptiles.

24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to
impurity, to the degrading of their bodies among themselves, 25
because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and
served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever!
Amen.

26 For this reason God gave them up to degrading passions. Their women
exchanged natural intercourse for unnatural, 27 and in the same way
also the men, giving up natural intercourse with women, were consumed
with passion for one another. Men committed shameless acts with men
and received in their own persons the due penalty for their error.

28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up
to a debased mind and to things that should not be done. 29 They were
filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, covetousness, malice. Full
of envy, murder, strife, deceit, craftiness, they are gossips, 30
slanderers, God-haters, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of
evil, rebellious toward parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless,
ruthless. 32 They know God's decree, that those who practice such
things deserve to die—yet they not only do them but even applaud
others who practice them.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
'enry VIII
2004-06-03 03:34:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
The New Age & Devil Worship
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter
Do those who practice paganism worship "devils?"
RNU.com - (Raiders News Update) - A few years ago during the Christmas
season my wife and I walked through a local mall. As we perused the
different shops, we came across a New Age bookstore conducting a
"Grand Opening". In a derisive tone I said to my wife, "Can you
believe some people's lack of intelligence?"
Casually, I strolled into the store, and without hesitation snatched a
book from the shelf and began offering a sarcastic commentary as I
read from the pages. I noticed my wife growing uncomfortable and so I
placed the book back on the shelf, and proceeded out of the store.
Suddenly, a dull sensation hit me. It began in my stomach and shot
upward through my head, impacting my equilibrium. As I stepped
outside, into the main mall walkway, my head started to spin, my hands
started shaking. I felt as if I was going to faint. It was literally
as if an invisible terror had "jumped" on me, and was somehow
injecting powerful feelings of nausea and anxiety throughout my entire
body. I tried shaking it off, but couldn't. I attempted to walk it
off and failed. At last, feigning interest in something, I moved away
from my wife and began to pray. I asked the Lord to forgive me for my
sarcastic attitude, my lack of caution, and for my want of concern for
the lost. I prayed for deliverance from evil and for healing of the
body and mind. After several hours of such walking and praying, I was
finally restored.
So! You're one of millions of nut cases walking around, panic attacks are
rather common.

But you may be possessed, run not walk to your nearest Catholic church and
ask a priest to exorcise you demons, ASAP.

If you disregard this advice you will start growing a baby from your spinal
cord.

'enry VIII
Pangur Ban
2004-06-03 12:34:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
The New Age & Devil Worship
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter
Do those who practice paganism worship "devils?"
RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - A few years ago during the Christmas
season my wife and I walked through a local mall. As we perused the
different shops, we came across a New Age bookstore conducting a
"Grand Opening". In a derisive tone I said to my wife, "Can you
believe some people's lack of intelligence?"
Casually, I strolled into the store, and without hesitation snatched a
book from the shelf and began offering a sarcastic commentary as I
read from the pages. I noticed my wife growing uncomfortable and so I
placed the book back on the shelf, and proceeded out of the store.
Suddenly, a dull sensation hit me. It began in my stomach and shot
upward through my head, impacting my equilibrium. As I stepped
outside, into the main mall walkway, my head started to spin, my hands
started shaking. I felt as if I was going to faint. It was literally
as if an invisible terror had "jumped" on me, and was somehow
injecting powerful feelings of nausea and anxiety throughout my entire
body. I tried shaking it off, but couldn't. I attempted to walk it
off and failed. At last, feigning interest in something, I moved away
from my wife and began to pray. I asked the Lord to forgive me for my
sarcastic attitude, my lack of caution, and for my want of concern for
the lost. I prayed for deliverance from evil and for healing of the
body and mind. After several hours of such walking and praying, I was
finally restored.
Tums would have worked much more quickly, although
I am sure the walking helped with the gas.
Post by martus
I discovered a valuable lesson that day: while a Christian may not be
demon-possessed, it's equally true that the "princes" of this world
are powerful, and we should enter their arena only after prayer, and
at the prompting of the Lord.
I also learned the mystical forces of the New Age movement are genuine
(and willing to protect their territory!),
Yes, the Old Gods and Goddesses are genuine. As
they are all aspects of the one Creator, what else
would one expect?


and that much of what is
Post by martus
currently published under the guise of New Age "enlightenment", is
nothing less than Old Age doctrines of nefarious invisible hosts.
Call an aspect of the Creator "nefarious" and you
have denigrated the Creator.
Post by martus
As in antiquity, so in modern times, those who practice paganism are
guilty of worshipping "devils" (Rev. 9:20). The dogmas which were
once embraced (and still are through the New Age Movement) as the
wisdom of the gods, are defined in the scriptures as the "doctrines of
devils". The Apostle Paul declared: "the things which the Gentiles
sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils" (1 Cor. 10:20). In Acts 7:41-42
(Jerusalem Bible), we find that those who worship idols are joined to
the "army of heaven" [stratos, the "fallen angel army"], and Psalm
96:5 concludes that "all the gods of the nations are idols" (elilim,
LXX daimonia [demons]).
There are no demons; the above are all efforts by
religious leaders to frighten the ignorant.
Religious propaganda - nothing more.

Thus, pagan images, such as represented the
Post by martus
ancient gods and goddesses, were elilim (empty, nothing, vanity), but
behind the empty idols were the living dynamics of idolatry, and
spiritual objects of heathen adoration, the daimonia (demons) of the
Bible.
Pagan images were not worshiped - any more than
the cross, paintings of Jesus, bibles, images of
doves, statues of saints, and the rest of
christian symbolism are worshiped by the
congregations which use them.
Post by martus
Since the Bible clearly defines idolatry as the worship of demons, and
since demons are eternal personalities which desire the worship of
men, it is fair to conclude the characterization of such deities as
"Zeus," "Amun-Ra," "Demeter," and "Isis," were simply the classical
names attributed to specific fallen spirits. In other words, Apollo
was a real personality; Osiris was a genuine underworld fiend; Hecate
actually lived, and still does!
The above mentioned are all aspects of the one
Creator - just as god and Jesus are.
Post by martus
One also concludes that the images of the gods (falcon headed statues,
animal forms, etc) served the purposes of such spirits by providing a
point of focus, and by revealing the "nature" of the particular spirit
existing within the god. The iconographies, myths and rituals of each
deity exhibited the specific characteristics (nature, gender,
underworld authority, etc) of that particular entity. Thus, the myths
and images of Zeus, according to such theory, were the physical
manifestations of a literal demon of air, while statues of the goddess
Demeter represented an earth spirit.
And the point is? Demeter was/is an "earth
spirit" and was/is the focus of giving thanks to
the Creator for the abundance of the earth - for
fertility of the herds and a good harvest. Zeus
was/is the aspect of the Creator which interacted
with mankind.
Post by martus
Today, it is my assertion and the claim of my book THE GODS WHO WALK
AMONG US, that the same spirits of antiquity, including Zeus, Athene,
Dionysus, and others, continue to express themselves within modern
paganism. My coauthor, Dr. Jones agrees, asserting that the connection
between the New Age Movement and the gods of mythology is strong.
The crux of the post - BUY MY BOOK so I may make
money from your fear.
Post by martus
"Nothing has changed in Satan's game plan," says Jones, "just the
names of the players, and, in some instances, even the names are the
same."
Paganism in America is exploding as we enter the new millennium.
Perhaps paganism offers something (or maybe some
things) to people that christianity does not? If
people are seeking to have their religious needs
met in paganism, perhaps the christian church
needs to reassess itself and determine where and
why it no longer meets people's needs?
Post by martus
Throughout Hollywood, government, cyberspace, and even the church, the
masses are embracing the religious philosophies of the New Age of
Aquarius.
Maybe the "masses" have found something in those
philosophies? If one is satisfied with one's
religion, one doesn't go seeking elsewhere.
Post by martus
As a modernistic process by which the old gods are worshipped, the New
Age Movement emerged in the United States during the 1960s, and has
experienced a steady growth ever since.
A signal to the christian churches that they are
losing religious seekers. Has christianity
examined itself as to why Americans are turning to
pagan religions?
Post by martus
The broad appeal of the New
Age Movement as a Western phenomenon can be explained to some degree
as the result of a changing culture.
The broad appeal of the New Age Movement is (just
maybe) a signal that christianity has lost its
appeal?
Post by martus
Americans have gradually
abandoned the fundamental precepts of Christianity (prayer in school,
Bible in courts, etc) which provided the cornerstone of civil life and
jurisprudence in American society for more than 200 years.
And why might this be?
Post by martus
As a
generation of baby-boomers has focused on human potential and the "god
within us all", Eastern philosophies of Monism, Pantheism, Hinduism,
and Self Realization are providing Americans and even some Christians
with an alluring opportunity to throw off the "outdated ideas" of
fundamental Christianity and to espouse a more "enlightened" worldview
of God and reality.
Sounds about right.
Post by martus
Some notable celebrities have joined the political ambitions of the
New Age Movement (goals include a United Nation's sponsored
Environmental Sabbath for the Goddess Earth), including Shirly
MacLaine, Dick Gregory, Lindsay Wagner, Dennis Weaver, Dirk Benedict,
Cloris Leachman, Richard Gere, Ally Sheedy, and the late John Denver.
Many mainstream "Christian" denominations have also annexed the New
Age ideas, and believers who once held strong doctrinal positions of
the supremacy of Christ, have abandoned those views in exchange for a
New Age universal philosophy. Examples include a witch who teaches
principles of Goddess worship at a Roman Catholic college in
California, and United Methodist pastors who propose replacing the
name of Jesus with Sophia (Goddess of Wisdom) when reading about the
crucifixion. Such persons claim we should join the efforts of New
Agers and be sympathetic to "Goddess-minded Christians."
This tactic might work a bit better than clinging
to the male dominated, male ruled christianity.
Post by martus
Former New Age devotee, Judy Vorfeld re-discovered the real Jesus
after embracing such ideas. She became involved in freelance writing
as a result of experiencing the dangers involved in participating in
the New Age Movement. For many years she actively avoided anything to
do with the Christianity of her childhood. When she was in her early
forties, a neighborhood minister said he was starting a new church,
and she thought the time might be right to look at Christianity again.
‘For a time I was involved in a fellowship that worshipped a different
deity than the God of the Bible....I joined a church that evolved from
ecumenism to religious syncretism....Six months after I became part of
the fellowship, fundamental Christianity was retired in favor of a
universal religious system, one designed to be inoffensive to people
of any theological persuasion. The fellowship then put together a
creed that would be acceptable for any visitors coming to worship with
us. Jews, Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists were welcome, as were
Theosophists, Rosicrucians, and Hare Krishnas....Our minister brought
a popular seminar, advertised as a self-improvement course, into our
church. Most of us were impressed with the professional manner of the
leaders and their sophisticated system of teaching
self-realization....The organization's format, we were told, held the
answers to all our problems....Church leadership eagerly blended the
organization's ideas into an agenda that became a part of our church
curriculum. Eastern meditation, physic healing, and guided imagery
were all practiced.'
And tolerance and acceptance that the Creator has
many aspects is somehow wrong?
Post by martus
Judy Vorfeld is a friend of mine and has provided me with guidance on
the New Age Movement. In a recent correspondence she described modern
Druids, and spoke of their methods of magic healing through
"visualization." She confessed: "Tom.... When we were involved in
Silva Mind Control [through her local church!], we did the same thing
[visualized healing]. At that time, I thought God was behind all this
stuff. I "saw" people in my mind's eye who had various diseases, and
I sent energy to heal them. In groups like this, the leader often has
a list of people who are sick. This gives them a way to follow
through and see who was healed. I have no doubt some people were
healed, but since we were invoking a power other than that of the real
God, what were we doing?"
LOL They were tapping into that part of
themselves called the soul (the Divine Spark in
each of us). There is nothing wrong or evil in
invoking the power of the Creator no matter what
aspect is used.
Post by martus
What indeed.
An amazing component of the New Age Movement (as verified by such
examples as my friend, Judy) is its capacity to adapt to a variety of
religious, even Christian ideas.
Most of the "pagan" religious pre-date
christianity by several thousand years.....who
borrowed whose ideas , religious festivals, and
practices?

Consequently, many of the popular
Post by martus
"Christian" doctrines advocated today are nothing more than the cultic
propositions of Eastern mysticism and ancient paganism. These include
concepts of psychic healing, self-realization, emotional experiences,
rules of success, breathing techniques, positive confession, name it
and claim it, environmental theology, the ecumenical movement,
visualization, hypnosis by clergy, mind manipulation, and so on.
At times, and I say this with caution, even the activity within the
"fundamental" church, including certain physical phenomena we
sometimes embrace as the miraculous evidence of "revival," is a modern
form of magic and opens the door for "old gods" and their mysticism to
invade the church.
Perhaps the ancient gods and goddesses are merely
reclaiming their own? *smile*

*snip*
Post by martus
PANDEMONIUM!—THE PAGAN GOSPEL OF THE NEW AGE GOD-KING
The gospel according to the New Age Movement is an expansive idea
centered around the birth of a new world "consciousness." As a
religion of monism (all is one), New Agers hope to accomplish what the
builders of the Tower of Babel failed to do—unify the masses of the
world under a single religious umbrella, and, at the macro level,
harmonically converge the world's energies with the power of Gaia. To
promote such goals, New Agers claim that God is pantheistic (God is
all and all is God) and that humans are divine members of the whole
"that God is." According to New Ageism, Jesus came to reveal this
pantheistic nature of God and to teach humanity the gospel of
Self-Realization. After illustrating the divine principle of "God
within us all," Jesus ascended to a place of distinction to live among
the Masters of the Spiritual Hierarchy—Buddha and Krishna. Jesus
promised that the essence of God would be revealed from time to time,
and thus New Agers look for the imminent appearing of a World Teacher
who will, as Jesus did, illustrate the divine human potential. In
this way, New Age theology prepares the world for the coming of the
False Prophet and the Antichrist.
One religion's false prophet/antichrist is
another's Teacher. A matter of perception.
*snip*

Pangur
BringerOfLight
2004-06-03 19:32:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by martus
The New Age & Devil Worship
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter
Do those who practice paganism worship "devils?"
RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - A few years ago during the Christmas
season my wife and I walked through a local mall. As we perused the
different shops, we came across a New Age bookstore conducting a
"Grand Opening". In a derisive tone I said to my wife, "Can you
believe some people's lack of intelligence?"
Casually, I strolled into the store, and without hesitation snatched a
book from the shelf and began offering a sarcastic commentary as I
read from the pages. I noticed my wife growing uncomfortable and so I
placed the book back on the shelf, and proceeded out of the store.
Suddenly, a dull sensation hit me. It began in my stomach and shot
upward through my head, impacting my equilibrium. As I stepped
outside, into the main mall walkway, my head started to spin, my hands
started shaking. I felt as if I was going to faint. It was literally
as if an invisible terror had "jumped" on me, and was somehow
injecting powerful feelings of nausea and anxiety throughout my entire
body. I tried shaking it off, but couldn't. I attempted to walk it
off and failed. At last, feigning interest in something, I moved away
from my wife and began to pray. I asked the Lord to forgive me for my
sarcastic attitude, my lack of caution, and for my want of concern for
the lost. I prayed for deliverance from evil and for healing of the
body and mind. After several hours of such walking and praying, I was
finally restored.
Tums would have worked much more quickly, although
I am sure the walking helped with the gas.
Post by martus
I discovered a valuable lesson that day: while a Christian may not be
demon-possessed, it's equally true that the "princes" of this world
are powerful, and we should enter their arena only after prayer, and
at the prompting of the Lord.
I also learned the mystical forces of the New Age movement are genuine
(and willing to protect their territory!),
Yes, the Old Gods and Goddesses are genuine. As
they are all aspects of the one Creator, what else
would one expect?
and that much of what is
Post by martus
currently published under the guise of New Age "enlightenment", is
nothing less than Old Age doctrines of nefarious invisible hosts.
Call an aspect of the Creator "nefarious" and you
have denigrated the Creator.
Post by martus
As in antiquity, so in modern times, those who practice paganism are
guilty of worshipping "devils" (Rev. 9:20). The dogmas which were
once embraced (and still are through the New Age Movement) as the
wisdom of the gods, are defined in the scriptures as the "doctrines of
devils". The Apostle Paul declared: "the things which the Gentiles
sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils" (1 Cor. 10:20). In Acts 7:41-42
(Jerusalem Bible), we find that those who worship idols are joined to
the "army of heaven" [stratos, the "fallen angel army"], and Psalm
96:5 concludes that "all the gods of the nations are idols" (elilim,
LXX daimonia [demons]).
There are no demons; the above are all efforts by
religious leaders to frighten the ignorant.
Religious propaganda - nothing more.
Thus, pagan images, such as represented the
Post by martus
ancient gods and goddesses, were elilim (empty, nothing, vanity), but
behind the empty idols were the living dynamics of idolatry, and
spiritual objects of heathen adoration, the daimonia (demons) of the
Bible.
Pagan images were not worshiped - any more than
the cross, paintings of Jesus, bibles, images of
doves, statues of saints, and the rest of
christian symbolism are worshiped by the
congregations which use them.
Post by martus
Since the Bible clearly defines idolatry as the worship of demons, and
since demons are eternal personalities which desire the worship of
men, it is fair to conclude the characterization of such deities as
"Zeus," "Amun-Ra," "Demeter," and "Isis," were simply the classical
names attributed to specific fallen spirits. In other words, Apollo
was a real personality; Osiris was a genuine underworld fiend; Hecate
actually lived, and still does!
The above mentioned are all aspects of the one
Creator - just as god and Jesus are.
Post by martus
One also concludes that the images of the gods (falcon headed statues,
animal forms, etc) served the purposes of such spirits by providing a
point of focus, and by revealing the "nature" of the particular spirit
existing within the god. The iconographies, myths and rituals of each
deity exhibited the specific characteristics (nature, gender,
underworld authority, etc) of that particular entity. Thus, the myths
and images of Zeus, according to such theory, were the physical
manifestations of a literal demon of air, while statues of the goddess
Demeter represented an earth spirit.
And the point is? Demeter was/is an "earth
spirit" and was/is the focus of giving thanks to
the Creator for the abundance of the earth - for
fertility of the herds and a good harvest. Zeus
was/is the aspect of the Creator which interacted
with mankind.
Post by martus
Today, it is my assertion and the claim of my book THE GODS WHO WALK
AMONG US, that the same spirits of antiquity, including Zeus, Athene,
Dionysus, and others, continue to express themselves within modern
paganism. My coauthor, Dr. Jones agrees, asserting that the connection
between the New Age Movement and the gods of mythology is strong.
The crux of the post - BUY MY BOOK so I may make
money from your fear.
Post by martus
"Nothing has changed in Satan's game plan," says Jones, "just the
names of the players, and, in some instances, even the names are the
same."
Paganism in America is exploding as we enter the new millennium.
Perhaps paganism offers something (or maybe some
things) to people that christianity does not? If
people are seeking to have their religious needs
met in paganism, perhaps the christian church
needs to reassess itself and determine where and
why it no longer meets people's needs?
Post by martus
Throughout Hollywood, government, cyberspace, and even the church, the
masses are embracing the religious philosophies of the New Age of
Aquarius.
Maybe the "masses" have found something in those
philosophies? If one is satisfied with one's
religion, one doesn't go seeking elsewhere.
Post by martus
As a modernistic process by which the old gods are worshipped, the New
Age Movement emerged in the United States during the 1960s, and has
experienced a steady growth ever since.
A signal to the christian churches that they are
losing religious seekers. Has christianity
examined itself as to why Americans are turning to
pagan religions?
Post by martus
The broad appeal of the New
Age Movement as a Western phenomenon can be explained to some degree
as the result of a changing culture.
The broad appeal of the New Age Movement is (just
maybe) a signal that christianity has lost its
appeal?
Post by martus
Americans have gradually
abandoned the fundamental precepts of Christianity (prayer in school,
Bible in courts, etc) which provided the cornerstone of civil life and
jurisprudence in American society for more than 200 years.
And why might this be?
Post by martus
As a
generation of baby-boomers has focused on human potential and the "god
within us all", Eastern philosophies of Monism, Pantheism, Hinduism,
and Self Realization are providing Americans and even some Christians
with an alluring opportunity to throw off the "outdated ideas" of
fundamental Christianity and to espouse a more "enlightened" worldview
of God and reality.
Sounds about right.
Post by martus
Some notable celebrities have joined the political ambitions of the
New Age Movement (goals include a United Nation's sponsored
Environmental Sabbath for the Goddess Earth), including Shirly
MacLaine, Dick Gregory, Lindsay Wagner, Dennis Weaver, Dirk Benedict,
Cloris Leachman, Richard Gere, Ally Sheedy, and the late John Denver.
Many mainstream "Christian" denominations have also annexed the New
Age ideas, and believers who once held strong doctrinal positions of
the supremacy of Christ, have abandoned those views in exchange for a
New Age universal philosophy. Examples include a witch who teaches
principles of Goddess worship at a Roman Catholic college in
California, and United Methodist pastors who propose replacing the
name of Jesus with Sophia (Goddess of Wisdom) when reading about the
crucifixion. Such persons claim we should join the efforts of New
Agers and be sympathetic to "Goddess-minded Christians."
This tactic might work a bit better than clinging
to the male dominated, male ruled christianity.
Post by martus
Former New Age devotee, Judy Vorfeld re-discovered the real Jesus
after embracing such ideas. She became involved in freelance writing
as a result of experiencing the dangers involved in participating in
the New Age Movement. For many years she actively avoided anything to
do with the Christianity of her childhood. When she was in her early
forties, a neighborhood minister said he was starting a new church,
and she thought the time might be right to look at Christianity again.
‘For a time I was involved in a fellowship that worshipped a different
deity than the God of the Bible....I joined a church that evolved from
ecumenism to religious syncretism....Six months after I became part of
the fellowship, fundamental Christianity was retired in favor of a
universal religious system, one designed to be inoffensive to people
of any theological persuasion. The fellowship then put together a
creed that would be acceptable for any visitors coming to worship with
us. Jews, Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists were welcome, as were
Theosophists, Rosicrucians, and Hare Krishnas....Our minister brought
a popular seminar, advertised as a self-improvement course, into our
church. Most of us were impressed with the professional manner of the
leaders and their sophisticated system of teaching
self-realization....The organization's format, we were told, held the
answers to all our problems....Church leadership eagerly blended the
organization's ideas into an agenda that became a part of our church
curriculum. Eastern meditation, physic healing, and guided imagery
were all practiced.'
And tolerance and acceptance that the Creator has
many aspects is somehow wrong?
Post by martus
Judy Vorfeld is a friend of mine and has provided me with guidance on
the New Age Movement. In a recent correspondence she described modern
Druids, and spoke of their methods of magic healing through
"visualization." She confessed: "Tom.... When we were involved in
Silva Mind Control [through her local church!], we did the same thing
[visualized healing]. At that time, I thought God was behind all this
stuff. I "saw" people in my mind's eye who had various diseases, and
I sent energy to heal them. In groups like this, the leader often has
a list of people who are sick. This gives them a way to follow
through and see who was healed. I have no doubt some people were
healed, but since we were invoking a power other than that of the real
God, what were we doing?"
LOL They were tapping into that part of
themselves called the soul (the Divine Spark in
each of us). There is nothing wrong or evil in
invoking the power of the Creator no matter what
aspect is used.
Post by martus
What indeed.
An amazing component of the New Age Movement (as verified by such
examples as my friend, Judy) is its capacity to adapt to a variety of
religious, even Christian ideas.
Most of the "pagan" religious pre-date
christianity by several thousand years.....who
borrowed whose ideas , religious festivals, and
practices?
Consequently, many of the popular
Post by martus
"Christian" doctrines advocated today are nothing more than the cultic
propositions of Eastern mysticism and ancient paganism. These include
concepts of psychic healing, self-realization, emotional experiences,
rules of success, breathing techniques, positive confession, name it
and claim it, environmental theology, the ecumenical movement,
visualization, hypnosis by clergy, mind manipulation, and so on.
At times, and I say this with caution, even the activity within the
"fundamental" church, including certain physical phenomena we
sometimes embrace as the miraculous evidence of "revival," is a modern
form of magic and opens the door for "old gods" and their mysticism to
invade the church.
Perhaps the ancient gods and goddesses are merely
reclaiming their own? *smile*
*snip*
Post by martus
PANDEMONIUM!—THE PAGAN GOSPEL OF THE NEW AGE GOD-KING
The gospel according to the New Age Movement is an expansive idea
centered around the birth of a new world "consciousness." As a
religion of monism (all is one), New Agers hope to accomplish what the
builders of the Tower of Babel failed to do—unify the masses of the
world under a single religious umbrella, and, at the macro level,
harmonically converge the world's energies with the power of Gaia. To
promote such goals, New Agers claim that God is pantheistic (God is
all and all is God) and that humans are divine members of the whole
"that God is." According to New Ageism, Jesus came to reveal this
pantheistic nature of God and to teach humanity the gospel of
Self-Realization. After illustrating the divine principle of "God
within us all," Jesus ascended to a place of distinction to live among
the Masters of the Spiritual Hierarchy—Buddha and Krishna. Jesus
promised that the essence of God would be revealed from time to time,
and thus New Agers look for the imminent appearing of a World Teacher
who will, as Jesus did, illustrate the divine human potential. In
this way, New Age theology prepares the world for the coming of the
False Prophet and the Antichrist.
One religion's false prophet/antichrist is
another's Teacher. A matter of perception.
*snip*
Pangur
An excellent and very patient reply Pangur, but one which Im afraid
will be wasted on Martus and his fundie brethren. For a
control-domination type of religion to survive it has to go to the
lowest common denominatory level of demonising and slandering the
"opposition" (i.e. anyone or anything that doesn't fall under the
jurisdiction of their "book") to survive, hence the "siege mentality"
of the typical antichrist-obssessed fudamentalist. What I find
totally funny (and the irony will no doubt be lost on Martus) that the
people whom he mentions as being "new-age" (i.e. therefore "unsaved"
in christian terms) are some of the people who have taken the time to
try and contribute healthily to the world (Gere's humanitarian
interest in the Tibetan buddhists human rights under the invasion of
chinese communists, John Denver's conservation and environmentalist
campaigns, Dick Gregory's campaigning for equal rights for blacks) -
in all respects, people who try to make the world, in whatever small
way that they can, into a better place for all.

As for the usual pagan and occult bashing that we've heard through
Martus's posts, thats nothing new Im afraid. Most pagans believe in
the old "live and let live" type of philosophy, its just a damn pity
that fundies can't get seem to get a grip on this simple but effective
rule of thumb.
Pangur Ban
2004-06-03 23:47:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by BringerOfLight
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by martus
The New Age & Devil Worship
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter
Do those who practice paganism worship "devils?"
RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - A few years ago during the Christmas
season my wife and I walked through a local mall. As we perused the
different shops, we came across a New Age bookstore conducting a
"Grand Opening". In a derisive tone I said to my wife, "Can you
believe some people's lack of intelligence?"
Casually, I strolled into the store, and without hesitation snatched a
book from the shelf and began offering a sarcastic commentary as I
read from the pages. I noticed my wife growing uncomfortable and so I
placed the book back on the shelf, and proceeded out of the store.
Suddenly, a dull sensation hit me. It began in my stomach and shot
upward through my head, impacting my equilibrium. As I stepped
outside, into the main mall walkway, my head started to spin, my hands
started shaking. I felt as if I was going to faint. It was literally
as if an invisible terror had "jumped" on me, and was somehow
injecting powerful feelings of nausea and anxiety throughout my entire
body. I tried shaking it off, but couldn't. I attempted to walk it
off and failed. At last, feigning interest in something, I moved away
from my wife and began to pray. I asked the Lord to forgive me for my
sarcastic attitude, my lack of caution, and for my want of concern for
the lost. I prayed for deliverance from evil and for healing of the
body and mind. After several hours of such walking and praying, I was
finally restored.
Tums would have worked much more quickly, although
I am sure the walking helped with the gas.
Post by martus
I discovered a valuable lesson that day: while a Christian may not be
demon-possessed, it's equally true that the "princes" of this world
are powerful, and we should enter their arena only after prayer, and
at the prompting of the Lord.
I also learned the mystical forces of the New Age movement are genuine
(and willing to protect their territory!),
Yes, the Old Gods and Goddesses are genuine. As
they are all aspects of the one Creator, what else
would one expect?
and that much of what is
Post by martus
currently published under the guise of New Age "enlightenment", is
nothing less than Old Age doctrines of nefarious invisible hosts.
Call an aspect of the Creator "nefarious" and you
have denigrated the Creator.
Post by martus
As in antiquity, so in modern times, those who practice paganism are
guilty of worshipping "devils" (Rev. 9:20). The dogmas which were
once embraced (and still are through the New Age Movement) as the
wisdom of the gods, are defined in the scriptures as the "doctrines of
devils". The Apostle Paul declared: "the things which the Gentiles
sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils" (1 Cor. 10:20). In Acts 7:41-42
(Jerusalem Bible), we find that those who worship idols are joined to
the "army of heaven" [stratos, the "fallen angel army"], and Psalm
96:5 concludes that "all the gods of the nations are idols" (elilim,
LXX daimonia [demons]).
There are no demons; the above are all efforts by
religious leaders to frighten the ignorant.
Religious propaganda - nothing more.
Thus, pagan images, such as represented the
Post by martus
ancient gods and goddesses, were elilim (empty, nothing, vanity), but
behind the empty idols were the living dynamics of idolatry, and
spiritual objects of heathen adoration, the daimonia (demons) of the
Bible.
Pagan images were not worshiped - any more than
the cross, paintings of Jesus, bibles, images of
doves, statues of saints, and the rest of
christian symbolism are worshiped by the
congregations which use them.
Post by martus
Since the Bible clearly defines idolatry as the worship of demons, and
since demons are eternal personalities which desire the worship of
men, it is fair to conclude the characterization of such deities as
"Zeus," "Amun-Ra," "Demeter," and "Isis," were simply the classical
names attributed to specific fallen spirits. In other words, Apollo
was a real personality; Osiris was a genuine underworld fiend; Hecate
actually lived, and still does!
The above mentioned are all aspects of the one
Creator - just as god and Jesus are.
Post by martus
One also concludes that the images of the gods (falcon headed statues,
animal forms, etc) served the purposes of such spirits by providing a
point of focus, and by revealing the "nature" of the particular spirit
existing within the god. The iconographies, myths and rituals of each
deity exhibited the specific characteristics (nature, gender,
underworld authority, etc) of that particular entity. Thus, the myths
and images of Zeus, according to such theory, were the physical
manifestations of a literal demon of air, while statues of the goddess
Demeter represented an earth spirit.
And the point is? Demeter was/is an "earth
spirit" and was/is the focus of giving thanks to
the Creator for the abundance of the earth - for
fertility of the herds and a good harvest. Zeus
was/is the aspect of the Creator which interacted
with mankind.
Post by martus
Today, it is my assertion and the claim of my book THE GODS WHO WALK
AMONG US, that the same spirits of antiquity, including Zeus, Athene,
Dionysus, and others, continue to express themselves within modern
paganism. My coauthor, Dr. Jones agrees, asserting that the connection
between the New Age Movement and the gods of mythology is strong.
The crux of the post - BUY MY BOOK so I may make
money from your fear.
Post by martus
"Nothing has changed in Satan's game plan," says Jones, "just the
names of the players, and, in some instances, even the names are the
same."
Paganism in America is exploding as we enter the new millennium.
Perhaps paganism offers something (or maybe some
things) to people that christianity does not? If
people are seeking to have their religious needs
met in paganism, perhaps the christian church
needs to reassess itself and determine where and
why it no longer meets people's needs?
Post by martus
Throughout Hollywood, government, cyberspace, and even the church, the
masses are embracing the religious philosophies of the New Age of
Aquarius.
Maybe the "masses" have found something in those
philosophies? If one is satisfied with one's
religion, one doesn't go seeking elsewhere.
Post by martus
As a modernistic process by which the old gods are worshipped, the New
Age Movement emerged in the United States during the 1960s, and has
experienced a steady growth ever since.
A signal to the christian churches that they are
losing religious seekers. Has christianity
examined itself as to why Americans are turning to
pagan religions?
Post by martus
The broad appeal of the New
Age Movement as a Western phenomenon can be explained to some degree
as the result of a changing culture.
The broad appeal of the New Age Movement is (just
maybe) a signal that christianity has lost its
appeal?
Post by martus
Americans have gradually
abandoned the fundamental precepts of Christianity (prayer in school,
Bible in courts, etc) which provided the cornerstone of civil life and
jurisprudence in American society for more than 200 years.
And why might this be?
Post by martus
As a
generation of baby-boomers has focused on human potential and the "god
within us all", Eastern philosophies of Monism, Pantheism, Hinduism,
and Self Realization are providing Americans and even some Christians
with an alluring opportunity to throw off the "outdated ideas" of
fundamental Christianity and to espouse a more "enlightened" worldview
of God and reality.
Sounds about right.
Post by martus
Some notable celebrities have joined the political ambitions of the
New Age Movement (goals include a United Nation's sponsored
Environmental Sabbath for the Goddess Earth), including Shirly
MacLaine, Dick Gregory, Lindsay Wagner, Dennis Weaver, Dirk Benedict,
Cloris Leachman, Richard Gere, Ally Sheedy, and the late John Denver.
Many mainstream "Christian" denominations have also annexed the New
Age ideas, and believers who once held strong doctrinal positions of
the supremacy of Christ, have abandoned those views in exchange for a
New Age universal philosophy. Examples include a witch who teaches
principles of Goddess worship at a Roman Catholic college in
California, and United Methodist pastors who propose replacing the
name of Jesus with Sophia (Goddess of Wisdom) when reading about the
crucifixion. Such persons claim we should join the efforts of New
Agers and be sympathetic to "Goddess-minded Christians."
This tactic might work a bit better than clinging
to the male dominated, male ruled christianity.
Post by martus
Former New Age devotee, Judy Vorfeld re-discovered the real Jesus
after embracing such ideas. She became involved in freelance writing
as a result of experiencing the dangers involved in participating in
the New Age Movement. For many years she actively avoided anything to
do with the Christianity of her childhood. When she was in her early
forties, a neighborhood minister said he was starting a new church,
and she thought the time might be right to look at Christianity again.
‘For a time I was involved in a fellowship that worshipped a different
deity than the God of the Bible....I joined a church that evolved from
ecumenism to religious syncretism....Six months after I became part of
the fellowship, fundamental Christianity was retired in favor of a
universal religious system, one designed to be inoffensive to people
of any theological persuasion. The fellowship then put together a
creed that would be acceptable for any visitors coming to worship with
us. Jews, Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists were welcome, as were
Theosophists, Rosicrucians, and Hare Krishnas....Our minister brought
a popular seminar, advertised as a self-improvement course, into our
church. Most of us were impressed with the professional manner of the
leaders and their sophisticated system of teaching
self-realization....The organization's format, we were told, held the
answers to all our problems....Church leadership eagerly blended the
organization's ideas into an agenda that became a part of our church
curriculum. Eastern meditation, physic healing, and guided imagery
were all practiced.'
And tolerance and acceptance that the Creator has
many aspects is somehow wrong?
Post by martus
Judy Vorfeld is a friend of mine and has provided me with guidance on
the New Age Movement. In a recent correspondence she described modern
Druids, and spoke of their methods of magic healing through
"visualization." She confessed: "Tom.... When we were involved in
Silva Mind Control [through her local church!], we did the same thing
[visualized healing]. At that time, I thought God was behind all this
stuff. I "saw" people in my mind's eye who had various diseases, and
I sent energy to heal them. In groups like this, the leader often has
a list of people who are sick. This gives them a way to follow
through and see who was healed. I have no doubt some people were
healed, but since we were invoking a power other than that of the real
God, what were we doing?"
LOL They were tapping into that part of
themselves called the soul (the Divine Spark in
each of us). There is nothing wrong or evil in
invoking the power of the Creator no matter what
aspect is used.
Post by martus
What indeed.
An amazing component of the New Age Movement (as verified by such
examples as my friend, Judy) is its capacity to adapt to a variety of
religious, even Christian ideas.
Most of the "pagan" religious pre-date
christianity by several thousand years.....who
borrowed whose ideas , religious festivals, and
practices?
Consequently, many of the popular
Post by martus
"Christian" doctrines advocated today are nothing more than the cultic
propositions of Eastern mysticism and ancient paganism. These include
concepts of psychic healing, self-realization, emotional experiences,
rules of success, breathing techniques, positive confession, name it
and claim it, environmental theology, the ecumenical movement,
visualization, hypnosis by clergy, mind manipulation, and so on.
At times, and I say this with caution, even the activity within the
"fundamental" church, including certain physical phenomena we
sometimes embrace as the miraculous evidence of "revival," is a modern
form of magic and opens the door for "old gods" and their mysticism to
invade the church.
Perhaps the ancient gods and goddesses are merely
reclaiming their own? *smile*
*snip*
Post by martus
PANDEMONIUM!—THE PAGAN GOSPEL OF THE NEW AGE GOD-KING
The gospel according to the New Age Movement is an expansive idea
centered around the birth of a new world "consciousness." As a
religion of monism (all is one), New Agers hope to accomplish what the
builders of the Tower of Babel failed to do—unify the masses of the
world under a single religious umbrella, and, at the macro level,
harmonically converge the world's energies with the power of Gaia. To
promote such goals, New Agers claim that God is pantheistic (God is
all and all is God) and that humans are divine members of the whole
"that God is." According to New Ageism, Jesus came to reveal this
pantheistic nature of God and to teach humanity the gospel of
Self-Realization. After illustrating the divine principle of "God
within us all," Jesus ascended to a place of distinction to live among
the Masters of the Spiritual Hierarchy—Buddha and Krishna. Jesus
promised that the essence of God would be revealed from time to time,
and thus New Agers look for the imminent appearing of a World Teacher
who will, as Jesus did, illustrate the divine human potential. In
this way, New Age theology prepares the world for the coming of the
False Prophet and the Antichrist.
One religion's false prophet/antichrist is
another's Teacher. A matter of perception.
*snip*
Pangur
An excellent and very patient reply Pangur, but one which Im afraid
will be wasted on Martus and his fundie brethren.
Oh, I know Martus. I think he has me killfiled - LOL.
Post by BringerOfLight
For a
control-domination type of religion to survive it has to go to the
lowest common denominatory level of demonising and slandering the
"opposition" (i.e. anyone or anything that doesn't fall under the
jurisdiction of their "book") to survive, hence the "siege mentality"
of the typical antichrist-obssessed fudamentalist.
Agreed. I truly don't expect Martus or his
brethren to be affected by my post, but someone
with a mite of curiosity might just examine the
ideas presented and do a bit of thought and
reading. I told Martus once that I felt much pity
for him and the mental world in which in he lives.
It must be a terrible place.
Post by BringerOfLight
What I find
totally funny (and the irony will no doubt be lost on Martus) that the
people whom he mentions as being "new-age" (i.e. therefore "unsaved"
in christian terms) are some of the people who have taken the time to
try and contribute healthily to the world (Gere's humanitarian
interest in the Tibetan buddhists human rights under the invasion of
chinese communists, John Denver's conservation and environmentalist
campaigns, Dick Gregory's campaigning for equal rights for blacks) -
in all respects, people who try to make the world, in whatever small
way that they can, into a better place for all.
*Nod* The fundamentalists don't seem to care
about the world around them - except in terms of
trying to control everyone in it.

Something I have found amusing in the short time I
have been on some of the christian ngs is my
stating that I am not a christian; not ONE has
asked what religion I do follow. I instead get
threats and warnings about hell and demons and -
prayers that I will find god/Jesus.

Pangur - ever a seeker
Post by BringerOfLight
As for the usual pagan and occult bashing that we've heard through
Martus's posts, thats nothing new Im afraid. Most pagans believe in
the old "live and let live" type of philosophy, its just a damn pity
that fundies can't get seem to get a grip on this simple but effective
rule of thumb.
Your Name Here=Harvey
2004-06-04 08:50:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by BringerOfLight
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by martus
The New Age & Devil Worship
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter
Do those who practice paganism worship "devils?"
RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - A few years ago during the Christmas
season my wife and I walked through a local mall. As we perused the
different shops, we came across a New Age bookstore conducting a
"Grand Opening". In a derisive tone I said to my wife, "Can you
believe some people's lack of intelligence?"
Casually, I strolled into the store, and without hesitation snatched a
book from the shelf and began offering a sarcastic commentary as I
read from the pages. I noticed my wife growing uncomfortable and so I
placed the book back on the shelf, and proceeded out of the store.
Suddenly, a dull sensation hit me. It began in my stomach and shot
upward through my head, impacting my equilibrium. As I stepped
outside, into the main mall walkway, my head started to spin, my hands
started shaking. I felt as if I was going to faint. It was literally
as if an invisible terror had "jumped" on me, and was somehow
injecting powerful feelings of nausea and anxiety throughout my entire
body. I tried shaking it off, but couldn't. I attempted to walk it
off and failed. At last, feigning interest in something, I moved away
from my wife and began to pray. I asked the Lord to forgive me for my
sarcastic attitude, my lack of caution, and for my want of concern for
the lost. I prayed for deliverance from evil and for healing of the
body and mind. After several hours of such walking and praying, I was
finally restored.
Tums would have worked much more quickly, although
I am sure the walking helped with the gas.
Post by martus
I discovered a valuable lesson that day: while a Christian may not be
demon-possessed, it's equally true that the "princes" of this world
are powerful, and we should enter their arena only after prayer, and
at the prompting of the Lord.
I also learned the mystical forces of the New Age movement are genuine
(and willing to protect their territory!),
Yes, the Old Gods and Goddesses are genuine. As
they are all aspects of the one Creator, what else
would one expect?
and that much of what is
Post by martus
currently published under the guise of New Age "enlightenment", is
nothing less than Old Age doctrines of nefarious invisible hosts.
Call an aspect of the Creator "nefarious" and you
have denigrated the Creator.
Post by martus
As in antiquity, so in modern times, those who practice paganism are
guilty of worshipping "devils" (Rev. 9:20). The dogmas which were
once embraced (and still are through the New Age Movement) as the
wisdom of the gods, are defined in the scriptures as the "doctrines of
devils". The Apostle Paul declared: "the things which the Gentiles
sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils" (1 Cor. 10:20). In Acts 7:41-42
(Jerusalem Bible), we find that those who worship idols are joined to
the "army of heaven" [stratos, the "fallen angel army"], and Psalm
96:5 concludes that "all the gods of the nations are idols" (elilim,
LXX daimonia [demons]).
There are no demons; the above are all efforts by
religious leaders to frighten the ignorant.
Religious propaganda - nothing more.
Thus, pagan images, such as represented the
Post by martus
ancient gods and goddesses, were elilim (empty, nothing, vanity), but
behind the empty idols were the living dynamics of idolatry, and
spiritual objects of heathen adoration, the daimonia (demons) of the
Bible.
Pagan images were not worshiped - any more than
the cross, paintings of Jesus, bibles, images of
doves, statues of saints, and the rest of
christian symbolism are worshiped by the
congregations which use them.
Post by martus
Since the Bible clearly defines idolatry as the worship of demons, and
since demons are eternal personalities which desire the worship of
men, it is fair to conclude the characterization of such deities as
"Zeus," "Amun-Ra," "Demeter," and "Isis," were simply the classical
names attributed to specific fallen spirits. In other words, Apollo
was a real personality; Osiris was a genuine underworld fiend; Hecate
actually lived, and still does!
The above mentioned are all aspects of the one
Creator - just as god and Jesus are.
Post by martus
One also concludes that the images of the gods (falcon headed statues,
animal forms, etc) served the purposes of such spirits by providing a
point of focus, and by revealing the "nature" of the particular spirit
existing within the god. The iconographies, myths and rituals of each
deity exhibited the specific characteristics (nature, gender,
underworld authority, etc) of that particular entity. Thus, the myths
and images of Zeus, according to such theory, were the physical
manifestations of a literal demon of air, while statues of the goddess
Demeter represented an earth spirit.
And the point is? Demeter was/is an "earth
spirit" and was/is the focus of giving thanks to
the Creator for the abundance of the earth - for
fertility of the herds and a good harvest. Zeus
was/is the aspect of the Creator which interacted
with mankind.
Post by martus
Today, it is my assertion and the claim of my book THE GODS WHO WALK
AMONG US, that the same spirits of antiquity, including Zeus, Athene,
Dionysus, and others, continue to express themselves within modern
paganism. My coauthor, Dr. Jones agrees, asserting that the connection
between the New Age Movement and the gods of mythology is strong.
The crux of the post - BUY MY BOOK so I may make
money from your fear.
Post by martus
"Nothing has changed in Satan's game plan," says Jones, "just the
names of the players, and, in some instances, even the names are the
same."
Paganism in America is exploding as we enter the new millennium.
Perhaps paganism offers something (or maybe some
things) to people that christianity does not? If
people are seeking to have their religious needs
met in paganism, perhaps the christian church
needs to reassess itself and determine where and
why it no longer meets people's needs?
Post by martus
Throughout Hollywood, government, cyberspace, and even the church, the
masses are embracing the religious philosophies of the New Age of
Aquarius.
Maybe the "masses" have found something in those
philosophies? If one is satisfied with one's
religion, one doesn't go seeking elsewhere.
Post by martus
As a modernistic process by which the old gods are worshipped, the New
Age Movement emerged in the United States during the 1960s, and has
experienced a steady growth ever since.
A signal to the christian churches that they are
losing religious seekers. Has christianity
examined itself as to why Americans are turning to
pagan religions?
Post by martus
The broad appeal of the New
Age Movement as a Western phenomenon can be explained to some degree
as the result of a changing culture.
The broad appeal of the New Age Movement is (just
maybe) a signal that christianity has lost its
appeal?
Post by martus
Americans have gradually
abandoned the fundamental precepts of Christianity (prayer in school,
Bible in courts, etc) which provided the cornerstone of civil life and
jurisprudence in American society for more than 200 years.
And why might this be?
Post by martus
As a
generation of baby-boomers has focused on human potential and the "god
within us all", Eastern philosophies of Monism, Pantheism, Hinduism,
and Self Realization are providing Americans and even some Christians
with an alluring opportunity to throw off the "outdated ideas" of
fundamental Christianity and to espouse a more "enlightened" worldview
of God and reality.
Sounds about right.
Post by martus
Some notable celebrities have joined the political ambitions of the
New Age Movement (goals include a United Nation's sponsored
Environmental Sabbath for the Goddess Earth), including Shirly
MacLaine, Dick Gregory, Lindsay Wagner, Dennis Weaver, Dirk Benedict,
Cloris Leachman, Richard Gere, Ally Sheedy, and the late John Denver.
Many mainstream "Christian" denominations have also annexed the New
Age ideas, and believers who once held strong doctrinal positions of
the supremacy of Christ, have abandoned those views in exchange for a
New Age universal philosophy. Examples include a witch who teaches
principles of Goddess worship at a Roman Catholic college in
California, and United Methodist pastors who propose replacing the
name of Jesus with Sophia (Goddess of Wisdom) when reading about the
crucifixion. Such persons claim we should join the efforts of New
Agers and be sympathetic to "Goddess-minded Christians."
This tactic might work a bit better than clinging
to the male dominated, male ruled christianity.
Post by martus
Former New Age devotee, Judy Vorfeld re-discovered the real Jesus
after embracing such ideas. She became involved in freelance writing
as a result of experiencing the dangers involved in participating in
the New Age Movement. For many years she actively avoided anything to
do with the Christianity of her childhood. When she was in her early
forties, a neighborhood minister said he was starting a new church,
and she thought the time might be right to look at Christianity again.
‘For a time I was involved in a fellowship that worshipped a different
deity than the God of the Bible....I joined a church that evolved from
ecumenism to religious syncretism....Six months after I became part of
the fellowship, fundamental Christianity was retired in favor of a
universal religious system, one designed to be inoffensive to people
of any theological persuasion. The fellowship then put together a
creed that would be acceptable for any visitors coming to worship with
us. Jews, Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists were welcome, as were
Theosophists, Rosicrucians, and Hare Krishnas....Our minister brought
a popular seminar, advertised as a self-improvement course, into our
church. Most of us were impressed with the professional manner of the
leaders and their sophisticated system of teaching
self-realization....The organization's format, we were told, held the
answers to all our problems....Church leadership eagerly blended the
organization's ideas into an agenda that became a part of our church
curriculum. Eastern meditation, physic healing, and guided imagery
were all practiced.'
And tolerance and acceptance that the Creator has
many aspects is somehow wrong?
Post by martus
Judy Vorfeld is a friend of mine and has provided me with guidance on
the New Age Movement. In a recent correspondence she described modern
Druids, and spoke of their methods of magic healing through
"visualization." She confessed: "Tom.... When we were involved in
Silva Mind Control [through her local church!], we did the same thing
[visualized healing]. At that time, I thought God was behind all this
stuff. I "saw" people in my mind's eye who had various diseases, and
I sent energy to heal them. In groups like this, the leader often has
a list of people who are sick. This gives them a way to follow
through and see who was healed. I have no doubt some people were
healed, but since we were invoking a power other than that of the real
God, what were we doing?"
LOL They were tapping into that part of
themselves called the soul (the Divine Spark in
each of us). There is nothing wrong or evil in
invoking the power of the Creator no matter what
aspect is used.
Post by martus
What indeed.
An amazing component of the New Age Movement (as verified by such
examples as my friend, Judy) is its capacity to adapt to a variety of
religious, even Christian ideas.
Most of the "pagan" religious pre-date
christianity by several thousand years.....who
borrowed whose ideas , religious festivals, and
practices?
Consequently, many of the popular
Post by martus
"Christian" doctrines advocated today are nothing more than the cultic
propositions of Eastern mysticism and ancient paganism. These include
concepts of psychic healing, self-realization, emotional experiences,
rules of success, breathing techniques, positive confession, name it
and claim it, environmental theology, the ecumenical movement,
visualization, hypnosis by clergy, mind manipulation, and so on.
At times, and I say this with caution, even the activity within the
"fundamental" church, including certain physical phenomena we
sometimes embrace as the miraculous evidence of "revival," is a modern
form of magic and opens the door for "old gods" and their mysticism to
invade the church.
Perhaps the ancient gods and goddesses are merely
reclaiming their own? *smile*
*snip*
Post by martus
PANDEMONIUM!—THE PAGAN GOSPEL OF THE NEW AGE GOD-KING
The gospel according to the New Age Movement is an expansive idea
centered around the birth of a new world "consciousness." As a
religion of monism (all is one), New Agers hope to accomplish what the
builders of the Tower of Babel failed to do—unify the masses of the
world under a single religious umbrella, and, at the macro level,
harmonically converge the world's energies with the power of Gaia. To
promote such goals, New Agers claim that God is pantheistic (God is
all and all is God) and that humans are divine members of the whole
"that God is." According to New Ageism, Jesus came to reveal this
pantheistic nature of God and to teach humanity the gospel of
Self-Realization. After illustrating the divine principle of "God
within us all," Jesus ascended to a place of distinction to live among
the Masters of the Spiritual Hierarchy—Buddha and Krishna. Jesus
promised that the essence of God would be revealed from time to time,
and thus New Agers look for the imminent appearing of a World Teacher
who will, as Jesus did, illustrate the divine human potential. In
this way, New Age theology prepares the world for the coming of the
False Prophet and the Antichrist.
One religion's false prophet/antichrist is
another's Teacher. A matter of perception.
*snip*
Pangur
An excellent and very patient reply Pangur, but one which Im afraid
will be wasted on Martus and his fundie brethren.
Oh, I know Martus. I think he has me killfiled - LOL.
Post by BringerOfLight
For a
control-domination type of religion to survive it has to go to the
lowest common denominatory level of demonising and slandering the
"opposition" (i.e. anyone or anything that doesn't fall under the
jurisdiction of their "book") to survive, hence the "siege mentality"
of the typical antichrist-obssessed fudamentalist.
Agreed. I truly don't expect Martus or his
brethren to be affected by my post, but someone
with a mite of curiosity might just examine the
ideas presented and do a bit of thought and
reading. I told Martus once that I felt much pity
for him and the mental world in which in he lives.
It must be a terrible place.
Post by BringerOfLight
What I find
totally funny (and the irony will no doubt be lost on Martus) that the
people whom he mentions as being "new-age" (i.e. therefore "unsaved"
in christian terms) are some of the people who have taken the time to
try and contribute healthily to the world (Gere's humanitarian
interest in the Tibetan buddhists human rights under the invasion of
chinese communists, John Denver's conservation and environmentalist
campaigns, Dick Gregory's campaigning for equal rights for blacks) -
in all respects, people who try to make the world, in whatever small
way that they can, into a better place for all.
*Nod* The fundamentalists don't seem to care
about the world around them - except in terms of
trying to control everyone in it.
Something I have found amusing in the short time I
have been on some of the christian ngs is my
stating that I am not a christian; not ONE has
asked what religion I do follow. I instead get
threats and warnings about hell and demons and -
prayers that I will find god/Jesus.
Pangur - ever a seeker
Post by BringerOfLight
As for the usual pagan and occult bashing that we've heard through
Martus's posts, thats nothing new Im afraid. Most pagans believe in
the old "live and let live" type of philosophy, its just a damn pity
that fundies can't get seem to get a grip on this simple but effective
rule of thumb.
I don't think it really doesn't matter what one believes in, as long as
you've done nothing wrong to another human being.

But I do tend to think, that those who deceive others, is just as
bad, as the evil doers, they preach against.
And that christianity and other religions too, deceive more than reveal
the truth.
It is the real message that matters and not the garbage that goes along with
it.

There's the garbage in - garbage out analogy. I think that applies a great
deal. Only if you sift through the garbage and sort it out, do you gain
anything useful. But to swallow things hook, line and sinker, is not useful
to do.

Harvey
Pangur Ban
2004-06-04 12:27:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by BringerOfLight
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by martus
The New Age & Devil Worship
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter
Do those who practice paganism worship "devils?"
RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - A few years ago during the Christmas
season my wife and I walked through a local mall. As we perused the
different shops, we came across a New Age bookstore conducting a
"Grand Opening". In a derisive tone I said to my wife, "Can you
believe some people's lack of intelligence?"
Casually, I strolled into the store, and without hesitation snatched a
book from the shelf and began offering a sarcastic commentary as I
read from the pages. I noticed my wife growing uncomfortable and so I
placed the book back on the shelf, and proceeded out of the store.
Suddenly, a dull sensation hit me. It began in my stomach and shot
upward through my head, impacting my equilibrium. As I stepped
outside, into the main mall walkway, my head started to spin, my hands
started shaking. I felt as if I was going to faint. It was literally
as if an invisible terror had "jumped" on me, and was somehow
injecting powerful feelings of nausea and anxiety throughout my entire
body. I tried shaking it off, but couldn't. I attempted to walk it
off and failed. At last, feigning interest in something, I moved away
from my wife and began to pray. I asked the Lord to forgive me for my
sarcastic attitude, my lack of caution, and for my want of concern for
the lost. I prayed for deliverance from evil and for healing of the
body and mind. After several hours of such walking and praying, I was
finally restored.
Tums would have worked much more quickly, although
I am sure the walking helped with the gas.
Post by martus
I discovered a valuable lesson that day: while a Christian may not be
demon-possessed, it's equally true that the "princes" of this world
are powerful, and we should enter their arena only after prayer, and
at the prompting of the Lord.
I also learned the mystical forces of the New Age movement are genuine
(and willing to protect their territory!),
Yes, the Old Gods and Goddesses are genuine. As
they are all aspects of the one Creator, what else
would one expect?
and that much of what is
Post by martus
currently published under the guise of New Age "enlightenment", is
nothing less than Old Age doctrines of nefarious invisible hosts.
Call an aspect of the Creator "nefarious" and you
have denigrated the Creator.
Post by martus
As in antiquity, so in modern times, those who practice paganism are
guilty of worshipping "devils" (Rev. 9:20). The dogmas which were
once embraced (and still are through the New Age Movement) as the
wisdom of the gods, are defined in the scriptures as the "doctrines of
devils". The Apostle Paul declared: "the things which the Gentiles
sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils" (1 Cor. 10:20). In Acts 7:41-42
(Jerusalem Bible), we find that those who worship idols are joined to
the "army of heaven" [stratos, the "fallen angel army"], and Psalm
96:5 concludes that "all the gods of the nations are idols" (elilim,
LXX daimonia [demons]).
There are no demons; the above are all efforts by
religious leaders to frighten the ignorant.
Religious propaganda - nothing more.
Thus, pagan images, such as represented the
Post by martus
ancient gods and goddesses, were elilim (empty, nothing, vanity), but
behind the empty idols were the living dynamics of idolatry, and
spiritual objects of heathen adoration, the daimonia (demons) of the
Bible.
Pagan images were not worshiped - any more than
the cross, paintings of Jesus, bibles, images of
doves, statues of saints, and the rest of
christian symbolism are worshiped by the
congregations which use them.
Post by martus
Since the Bible clearly defines idolatry as the worship of demons, and
since demons are eternal personalities which desire the worship of
men, it is fair to conclude the characterization of such deities as
"Zeus," "Amun-Ra," "Demeter," and "Isis," were simply the classical
names attributed to specific fallen spirits. In other words, Apollo
was a real personality; Osiris was a genuine underworld fiend; Hecate
actually lived, and still does!
The above mentioned are all aspects of the one
Creator - just as god and Jesus are.
Post by martus
One also concludes that the images of the gods (falcon headed statues,
animal forms, etc) served the purposes of such spirits by providing a
point of focus, and by revealing the "nature" of the particular spirit
existing within the god. The iconographies, myths and rituals of each
deity exhibited the specific characteristics (nature, gender,
underworld authority, etc) of that particular entity. Thus, the myths
and images of Zeus, according to such theory, were the physical
manifestations of a literal demon of air, while statues of the goddess
Demeter represented an earth spirit.
And the point is? Demeter was/is an "earth
spirit" and was/is the focus of giving thanks to
the Creator for the abundance of the earth - for
fertility of the herds and a good harvest. Zeus
was/is the aspect of the Creator which interacted
with mankind.
Post by martus
Today, it is my assertion and the claim of my book THE GODS WHO WALK
AMONG US, that the same spirits of antiquity, including Zeus, Athene,
Dionysus, and others, continue to express themselves within modern
paganism. My coauthor, Dr. Jones agrees, asserting that the connection
between the New Age Movement and the gods of mythology is strong.
The crux of the post - BUY MY BOOK so I may make
money from your fear.
Post by martus
"Nothing has changed in Satan's game plan," says Jones, "just the
names of the players, and, in some instances, even the names are the
same."
Paganism in America is exploding as we enter the new millennium.
Perhaps paganism offers something (or maybe some
things) to people that christianity does not? If
people are seeking to have their religious needs
met in paganism, perhaps the christian church
needs to reassess itself and determine where and
why it no longer meets people's needs?
Post by martus
Throughout Hollywood, government, cyberspace, and even the church, the
masses are embracing the religious philosophies of the New Age of
Aquarius.
Maybe the "masses" have found something in those
philosophies? If one is satisfied with one's
religion, one doesn't go seeking elsewhere.
Post by martus
As a modernistic process by which the old gods are worshipped, the New
Age Movement emerged in the United States during the 1960s, and has
experienced a steady growth ever since.
A signal to the christian churches that they are
losing religious seekers. Has christianity
examined itself as to why Americans are turning to
pagan religions?
Post by martus
The broad appeal of the New
Age Movement as a Western phenomenon can be explained to some degree
as the result of a changing culture.
The broad appeal of the New Age Movement is (just
maybe) a signal that christianity has lost its
appeal?
Post by martus
Americans have gradually
abandoned the fundamental precepts of Christianity (prayer in school,
Bible in courts, etc) which provided the cornerstone of civil life and
jurisprudence in American society for more than 200 years.
And why might this be?
Post by martus
As a
generation of baby-boomers has focused on human potential and the "god
within us all", Eastern philosophies of Monism, Pantheism, Hinduism,
and Self Realization are providing Americans and even some Christians
with an alluring opportunity to throw off the "outdated ideas" of
fundamental Christianity and to espouse a more "enlightened" worldview
of God and reality.
Sounds about right.
Post by martus
Some notable celebrities have joined the political ambitions of the
New Age Movement (goals include a United Nation's sponsored
Environmental Sabbath for the Goddess Earth), including Shirly
MacLaine, Dick Gregory, Lindsay Wagner, Dennis Weaver, Dirk Benedict,
Cloris Leachman, Richard Gere, Ally Sheedy, and the late John Denver.
Many mainstream "Christian" denominations have also annexed the New
Age ideas, and believers who once held strong doctrinal positions of
the supremacy of Christ, have abandoned those views in exchange for a
New Age universal philosophy. Examples include a witch who teaches
principles of Goddess worship at a Roman Catholic college in
California, and United Methodist pastors who propose replacing the
name of Jesus with Sophia (Goddess of Wisdom) when reading about the
crucifixion. Such persons claim we should join the efforts of New
Agers and be sympathetic to "Goddess-minded Christians."
This tactic might work a bit better than clinging
to the male dominated, male ruled christianity.
Post by martus
Former New Age devotee, Judy Vorfeld re-discovered the real Jesus
after embracing such ideas. She became involved in freelance writing
as a result of experiencing the dangers involved in participating in
the New Age Movement. For many years she actively avoided anything to
do with the Christianity of her childhood. When she was in her early
forties, a neighborhood minister said he was starting a new church,
and she thought the time might be right to look at Christianity again.
‘For a time I was involved in a fellowship that worshipped a different
deity than the God of the Bible....I joined a church that evolved from
ecumenism to religious syncretism....Six months after I became part of
the fellowship, fundamental Christianity was retired in favor of a
universal religious system, one designed to be inoffensive to people
of any theological persuasion. The fellowship then put together a
creed that would be acceptable for any visitors coming to worship with
us. Jews, Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists were welcome, as were
Theosophists, Rosicrucians, and Hare Krishnas....Our minister brought
a popular seminar, advertised as a self-improvement course, into our
church. Most of us were impressed with the professional manner of the
leaders and their sophisticated system of teaching
self-realization....The organization's format, we were told, held the
answers to all our problems....Church leadership eagerly blended the
organization's ideas into an agenda that became a part of our church
curriculum. Eastern meditation, physic healing, and guided imagery
were all practiced.'
And tolerance and acceptance that the Creator has
many aspects is somehow wrong?
Post by martus
Judy Vorfeld is a friend of mine and has provided me with guidance on
the New Age Movement. In a recent correspondence she described modern
Druids, and spoke of their methods of magic healing through
"visualization." She confessed: "Tom.... When we were involved in
Silva Mind Control [through her local church!], we did the same thing
[visualized healing]. At that time, I thought God was behind all this
stuff. I "saw" people in my mind's eye who had various diseases, and
I sent energy to heal them. In groups like this, the leader often has
a list of people who are sick. This gives them a way to follow
through and see who was healed. I have no doubt some people were
healed, but since we were invoking a power other than that of the real
God, what were we doing?"
LOL They were tapping into that part of
themselves called the soul (the Divine Spark in
each of us). There is nothing wrong or evil in
invoking the power of the Creator no matter what
aspect is used.
Post by martus
What indeed.
An amazing component of the New Age Movement (as verified by such
examples as my friend, Judy) is its capacity to adapt to a variety of
religious, even Christian ideas.
Most of the "pagan" religious pre-date
christianity by several thousand years.....who
borrowed whose ideas , religious festivals, and
practices?
Consequently, many of the popular
Post by martus
"Christian" doctrines advocated today are nothing more than the cultic
propositions of Eastern mysticism and ancient paganism. These include
concepts of psychic healing, self-realization, emotional experiences,
rules of success, breathing techniques, positive confession, name it
and claim it, environmental theology, the ecumenical movement,
visualization, hypnosis by clergy, mind manipulation, and so on.
At times, and I say this with caution, even the activity within the
"fundamental" church, including certain physical phenomena we
sometimes embrace as the miraculous evidence of "revival," is a modern
form of magic and opens the door for "old gods" and their mysticism to
invade the church.
Perhaps the ancient gods and goddesses are merely
reclaiming their own? *smile*
*snip*
Post by martus
PANDEMONIUM!—THE PAGAN GOSPEL OF THE NEW AGE GOD-KING
The gospel according to the New Age Movement is an expansive idea
centered around the birth of a new world "consciousness." As a
religion of monism (all is one), New Agers hope to accomplish what the
builders of the Tower of Babel failed to do—unify the masses of the
world under a single religious umbrella, and, at the macro level,
harmonically converge the world's energies with the power of Gaia. To
promote such goals, New Agers claim that God is pantheistic (God is
all and all is God) and that humans are divine members of the whole
"that God is." According to New Ageism, Jesus came to reveal this
pantheistic nature of God and to teach humanity the gospel of
Self-Realization. After illustrating the divine principle of "God
within us all," Jesus ascended to a place of distinction to live among
the Masters of the Spiritual Hierarchy—Buddha and Krishna. Jesus
promised that the essence of God would be revealed from time to time,
and thus New Agers look for the imminent appearing of a World Teacher
who will, as Jesus did, illustrate the divine human potential. In
this way, New Age theology prepares the world for the coming of the
False Prophet and the Antichrist.
One religion's false prophet/antichrist is
another's Teacher. A matter of perception.
*snip*
Pangur
An excellent and very patient reply Pangur, but one which Im afraid
will be wasted on Martus and his fundie brethren.
Oh, I know Martus. I think he has me killfiled - LOL.
Post by BringerOfLight
For a
control-domination type of religion to survive it has to go to the
lowest common denominatory level of demonising and slandering the
"opposition" (i.e. anyone or anything that doesn't fall under the
jurisdiction of their "book") to survive, hence the "siege mentality"
of the typical antichrist-obssessed fudamentalist.
Agreed. I truly don't expect Martus or his
brethren to be affected by my post, but someone
with a mite of curiosity might just examine the
ideas presented and do a bit of thought and
reading. I told Martus once that I felt much pity
for him and the mental world in which in he lives.
It must be a terrible place.
Post by BringerOfLight
What I find
totally funny (and the irony will no doubt be lost on Martus) that the
people whom he mentions as being "new-age" (i.e. therefore "unsaved"
in christian terms) are some of the people who have taken the time to
try and contribute healthily to the world (Gere's humanitarian
interest in the Tibetan buddhists human rights under the invasion of
chinese communists, John Denver's conservation and environmentalist
campaigns, Dick Gregory's campaigning for equal rights for blacks) -
in all respects, people who try to make the world, in whatever small
way that they can, into a better place for all.
*Nod* The fundamentalists don't seem to care
about the world around them - except in terms of
trying to control everyone in it.
Something I have found amusing in the short time I
have been on some of the christian ngs is my
stating that I am not a christian; not ONE has
asked what religion I do follow. I instead get
threats and warnings about hell and demons and -
prayers that I will find god/Jesus.
Pangur - ever a seeker
Post by BringerOfLight
As for the usual pagan and occult bashing that we've heard through
Martus's posts, thats nothing new Im afraid. Most pagans believe in
the old "live and let live" type of philosophy, its just a damn pity
that fundies can't get seem to get a grip on this simple but effective
rule of thumb.
I don't think it really doesn't matter what one believes in, as long as
you've done nothing wrong to another human being.
I agree with you completely.
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
But I do tend to think, that those who deceive others, is just as
bad, as the evil doers, they preach against.
And that christianity and other religions too, deceive more than reveal
the truth.
It is the real message that matters and not the garbage that goes along with
it.
The real message of most religions is living
without harming others and that message is the
cake. The rest (rites, rituals, the nature of
god, etc.) are the icing . I like my cake with
little or no icing, thank you. :-)
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
There's the garbage in - garbage out analogy. I think that applies a great
deal. Only if you sift through the garbage and sort it out, do you gain
anything useful. But to swallow things hook, line and sinker, is not useful
to do.
And a dangerous thing to do - *grin*

Pangur
Your Name Here=Harvey
2004-06-05 02:47:40 UTC
Permalink
In article <7VZvc.31801$***@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,
Pangur-***@SatisHouse.org says...
Harvey wrote: ---
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
I don't think it really doesn't matter what one believes in, as long as
you've done nothing wrong to another human being.
I agree with you completely.
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
But I do tend to think, that those who deceive others, is just as
bad, as the evil doers, they preach against.
And that christianity and other religions too, deceive more than reveal
the truth.
It is the real message that matters and not the garbage that goes along with
it.
The real message of most religions is living
without harming others and that message is the
cake. The rest (rites, rituals, the nature of
god, etc.) are the icing . I like my cake with
little or no icing, thank you. :-)
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
There's the garbage in - garbage out analogy. I think that applies a great
deal. Only if you sift through the garbage and sort it out, do you gain
anything useful. But to swallow things hook, line and sinker, is not useful
to do.
And a dangerous thing to do - *grin*
Pangur
Of course all religions have some good things in common - initating a
moral code, and recomending people to live it.
That's probably the ultimate goal of religion, to prepare people for
this world, and not so much for the next (which takes care of itself
anyway --- you'll see for yourself, when you make the actual journey).
In bringing people from savagery to civilisation.

You should not accept anything blindly, but question things to your
satisfaction - because everything has to make sense in the greater
realm of things.


Some weird things do not go away - and can defy anything you try to make
of it.
eg. There was a television program, called 'The Entity' which looked at
people violently scared during the night/morning by an undisclosed entity,
which savagely attacks them. This happened often in their lives.
One case was monitored, and looked like it was by a 'demon' - though
invisible. It is strange that this has kept on happening, in these modern
times.

Harvey
Pangur Ban
2004-06-05 02:59:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
Harvey wrote: ---
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
I don't think it really doesn't matter what one believes in, as long as
you've done nothing wrong to another human being.
I agree with you completely.
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
But I do tend to think, that those who deceive others, is just as
bad, as the evil doers, they preach against.
And that christianity and other religions too, deceive more than reveal
the truth.
It is the real message that matters and not the garbage that goes along
with
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
it.
The real message of most religions is living
without harming others and that message is the
cake. The rest (rites, rituals, the nature of
god, etc.) are the icing . I like my cake with
little or no icing, thank you. :-)
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
There's the garbage in - garbage out analogy. I think that applies a great
deal. Only if you sift through the garbage and sort it out, do you gain
anything useful. But to swallow things hook, line and sinker, is not useful
to do.
And a dangerous thing to do - *grin*
Pangur
Of course all religions have some good things in common - initating a
moral code, and recomending people to live it.
That's probably the ultimate goal of religion, to prepare people for
this world, and not so much for the next (which takes care of itself
anyway --- you'll see for yourself, when you make the actual journey).
In bringing people from savagery to civilisation.
Agreed. Religion can be one of the most
civilizing factors humankind has - and also one of the
dehumanizing. When men use religion to promote
war, to enslave, to commit genocide, etc. ,
religion ;then becomes a terrible weapon against
civilization.
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
You should not accept anything blindly, but question things to your
satisfaction - because everything has to make sense in the greater
realm of things.
If you are speaking to me and not just the ng in
general, I question.
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
Some weird things do not go away - and can defy anything you try to make
of it.
eg. There was a television program, called 'The Entity' which looked at
people violently scared during the night/morning by an undisclosed entity,
which savagely attacks them. This happened often in their lives.
One case was monitored, and looked like it was by a 'demon' - though
invisible. It is strange that this has kept on happening, in these modern
times.
Harvey
When one considers the immensity of the earth
(compared to we humans) and the great areas which
are still unexplored - many things are possible.

Pangur
'enry VIII
2004-06-05 03:46:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
Harvey wrote: ---
When one considers the immensity of the earth (compared to we humans) and
the great areas which are still unexplored - many things are possible.
Yep, natural things.

'enry VIII
'enry VIII
2004-06-05 03:44:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name Here=Harvey
Harvey wrote: ---
eg. There was a television program, called 'The Entity' which looked at
people violently scared during the night/morning by an undisclosed entity,
which savagely attacks them. This happened often in their lives.
One case was monitored, and looked like it was by a 'demon' - though
invisible. It is strange that this has kept on happening, in these modern
times.
It's even stranger that you would believe that without first investigating
it thoroughly.

'enry VIII
martus
2004-06-03 13:00:42 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends –

Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
Contact with supernatural powers other than the God of the Holy
Bible is obvious. Saul, the first king of Israel, is said to have
put away those that had familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of
the land. (1 Sam. 28:3) Yet, Saul's end was not good, as he later
sought out a witch at Endor, to bring up the spirit of the prophet
Samuel who had died. (1 Sam. 28:7). And Saul, though anointed as
king of God's people Israel, and a great hero of the nation of
Israel, is probably burning in hell today.

Although different kinds of divination and magic are reported to
have been practiced widely in ancient Israel and among her neighbors
(Deut. 18:9-14; 1 Sam. 6:2; Isa. 19:3; Ezek. 21:21; Dan. 2:2),
Israel was clearly and firmly admonished to have NO part in such
activities. If one is a born again Christian this same admonition
most certainly applies.

It is clear that the God HATES witchcraft and sorcery. It is a sad
commentary on how extensive is today's great falling away from The
Faith. Where is the cry of OUTRAGE that should be heard from
Christian leadership against such things like the Harry Potter
series. The answer to that question may be found in the fine print
of the 501c3 state contract most churches have signed to be in the
religion business. The Harry Potter series clearly teaches
witchcraft to its intended target group of CHILDREN.

Ye shall be holy: for I the LORD your God am holy. Holy means
Sanctified or Separated unto God, having nothing to do with anything
which would claim to be supernatural other than the God and Father
or our Lord Jesus Christ. Lev 19:26 says, neither shall ye use
enchantment, nor observe times." Lev 20:6-7 States the issue very
clearly - And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar
spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even
set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his
people. Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the
LORD your God.

There is NO SUCH THING AS GOOD WITCHCRAFT or beneficial magic. The
true God has made it very clear that ALL magic is an abomination to
the Lord. Another good summary of what God thinks about the sort of
thing taught by the Harry Potter books and movies may be seen in
Deut 18:9-14. There we see that the witchcraft and sorcery, were the
abominable practices of the Canaanites, and the very reason why God
commanded His people, Israel, to destroy them. There shall not be
found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass
through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times,
or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with
familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do
these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these
abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.

We do know that the Last Days would be marked by the antichrist war
on the saints. One of the things about the antichrist is that
according to Dan 8:25 through his policy also he shall cause craft
to prosper in his hand.

The Bible is clear that in the last days witchcraft and sorcery will
be widespread. In fact, it even reveals that many so-called
Christians will be caught up in it, and ensnared and destroyed by
it! HARRY POTTER SHOULD BE AS FAR REMOVED FROM REAL CHRISTIANS AS
THE NORTH POLE IS REMOVED FROM THE SOUTH POLE. These Harry Potter
books and movies are right on time, in the antichrist end time
scenario.

We all know it. We all expect it. But it is so sad to watch. It is
hard to watch so many young children embracing blatant witchcraft.
There was a time when children's fiction stories contained dragons
and witches; yet they were always evil. Then things began to change.
Modern fiction and fantasy began to divide witchcraft into the "good
magic" and "bad magic". Even extremely talented writers such as
J.R.R. Tolkien (1892-1973) and C.S. Lewis (1898-1963) helped to
plant the foundation for the sorceries revival in our day. As wise
as they were in so many things, they were often very naive in regard
to evil, and Satan's whole agenda.

Tolkien did write about evil goblins; yet he would make the wizard
to be a good guy. C.S. Lewis followed this practice by pretending
that there is good and bad magic, and that God Himself used
the "good" kind. He would make "magicians" (i.e. sorcerers) to be
the good guys. For these reasons, these most wonderful books, filled
with deep, Christian insights, deserve to be thrown into the trash
can. What a waste. No parent should allow a child to read such
books. And I must confess that there was a time when I though the
C.S. Lewis Series the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, was good,
and wonderful. I had read the whole series and even given the series
as a gift on several occasions. I DO REPENT AND REGRET HAVING READ
THEM OR GIVEN THEM AS GIFTS.

What does God think about Christians making wizards and sorcerers
out to be good guys for the minds of young children?
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.

These Harry Potter books are dangerous because they are ten times
more blatant about the so-called wonders and glories of witchcraft
and magic. Yet, they contain none of the insights or Christian
analogies of early children's books. We must beware. Sorcery brings
evil wherever it goes. It is not just fantasy. We have children
killing one another all across the land because they think Satan
will give them power if they shed blood.

J.K. Rowling needs to hang her head in shame for her
irresponsibility. She is a talented writer. However, Satan has
allowed her to become a multi-millionaire for reasons besides her
writing talents! She is bringing millions of young minds into the
occult, and is helping to bring in the Antichrist. If you are a
Christian and these words offend you, it is probably because your
mind has been seduced by a devil.

"You're famous, Harry Potter." That is a remark in Harry Potter and
the Sorcerer's Stone. That book was the first in a seven-book series
on popular witchcraft. The first three books hit the world –
schools, libraries, and the New York Times best-sellers list – like
a spiritual tidal wave. Those books crashed and broke down the
barriers to the forbidden mysteries which God clearly has said are
an ABOMINATION. These books have captivated children around the
world.

Harry Potter is a student wizard with amazing powers and an
enticingly scary destiny. Harry, like other students at Hogwarts
School of Witchcraft and Wizardry travels back and forth between two
worlds: the mystical world of magic and the mundane world of
muggles – those boring, blinded, and biased humans who either don't
believe in the world of witches or who despise it as evil.

Harry's cruel aunt and uncle fit the last category. And, from
Harry's point of view, so would you, if you see witchcraft as
dangerous and demonic.

The skinny, green-eyed kid with glasses and a thunder-bolt scar
under a shock of unruly black hair makes a sympathetic hero.

Harry was orphaned at age one. Harry mysteriously survived a
murderous assault by the wicked wizard Lord Voldemort. Most are too
frightened to even say the name of this scary villain. The cowardly
refer to him as the one "Who Must Not Be Named." It was this
Voldemort who killed Harry's parents. When he tried but failed to
kill their one-year-old baby, Voldemort lost much of his power. The
thunderbolt scar on Harry's forehead marks his peculiar psychic
strength and triumph over evil.

PARENTS THIS IS NOT GOOD READING MATERIAL FOR CHILDREN. CHILDREN YOU
SHOULD THANK GOD THAT YOU HAVE PARENTS WHO WOULD TRY TO KEEP YOU
FREE OF THIS ABOMINATION OF THE DEVIL. SURE ALL THE KIDS LIKE IT
BECAUSE IT IS A MASTERPIECE OF THE DEVIL'S SUBTLTY.

For the next ten years, Harry lives a miserable muggle life in his
uncle's London home, constantly tormented by his cruel guardians and
a spoiled bully of a cousin. But on his eleventh birthday everything
changes. He discovers that he is a wizard of great fame, someone who
once conquered death and crippled a devilish foe. Even better, he
receives an acceptance to Hogwarts – a coveted boarding school for
aspiring wizards.

More than seven million adults and children alike have, in their
imagination, followed Harry through that mystical veil between
ordinary reality and occult fantasy. Most find it hard to put the
book down once they start it, and when finished, many read it again
and again. Immersed in this mystical world of spiritual forces, they
feel Harry's struggles and share his fears. They sit with him
through his classes on Potions, Spells, Transformation ("turning
something into something else") and Divination, and, like him, learn
some tricks of the old Craft. They sense the pain of his miserable
return visits to London, and they soar with him above the earth on a
fantastic magical broomstick.

Joanne K. Rowling is a brilliant writer. I will say flat out that
she is demonically inspired and knows how to make her characters
come alive in a reader's mind.

It is common to hear people argue that Harry Potter is just fantasy.
Many will say that our fairy tales were scary, like Peter and the
Wolf, or Hansel & Gretel, and that it is just entertaining, and can
not hurt.

IT IS BY NO MEANS THAT SIMPLE OR IS IT BY ANY MEANS THE SAME AS
PREVIOUS SCARY CHILDREN'S STORIES.

The stories and the times have changed. The situation for children
today, is far more dangerous. The children being exposed to Harry
Potter are much more vulnerable to deception than we were.

So what are some of the changes and differences?

First, the culture has changed. Just a single generation ago the
culture may have been considered Biblical in many parts of the
world. Just one generation ago, America outwardly, embraced Bible
values. Whether people were Christian or not, they usually accepted
traditional moral and spiritual boundaries. The old fairy tales
tended to reinforce this Christian or Biblical world view. The good
hero would win over evil forces WITHOUT using "good" MAGIC to
overcome evil MAGIC. Social activities did not include Ouija Boards,
Seances, and an assortment of popular occult role-playing games.
Children were not taught or tempted to alter their consciousness and
invoke the presence of an "animal spirit" or spirit of a "wise
person." Occult experimentation was not tolerated. The blatant
occult was evil and wicked and the general population had sense
enough to know it. The so-called Christian leaders knew better than
to say it was OK; because, the Christians they were leading KNEW
what the KJV Holy Bible said about these things.

Today, children learn their values from a variety of sources other
than the KJV Holy Bible. The entertainment industry is one of the
most persuasive. Sadly, today, it usually teaches global and occult
values, since that is what SELLS in today's antichrist global
market. Children have become so familiar with profanity, occultism,
and explicit sex, that they barely notice. It is just as it was when
Jeremiah wrote in 8:5 - Why then is this people of Jerusalem
slidden back by a perpetual backsliding? they hold fast deceit, they
refuse to return. And just like what he wrote in 8:12 - Were they
ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at
all ashamed, neither could they blush:

Now we are looking at a very different type of fantasy. Now the
books, movies, games, and television, all involve the imagination.
We should see that there is a specific and forbidden fantasy that
directs the child's imagination. The imaginary scenes in books and
movies are NOT NEUTRAL, THEY ARE FORBIDDEN. They are an abomination
to the One True God, and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.

With guided imagery, the child's feelings and responses are
manipulated by the author's views and values. The fact is that the
stories and books children read in the classroom are usually
selected or approved because their message teaches the new
antichrist global values. The textbooks are chosen because they
provide useful discussion topics for the manipulative process of
compromise. The goal is clear that the ability to THINK in godly
ways, is to be replaced with a satanic or luciferian antichrist,
totally secular, and often occult, world view. The books in the
classrooms of public schools are full of strategies for wearing down
traditional boundaries and Biblical spiritual values. The books
teach the new antichrist occult spirituality.

Books such as the Harry Potters series fit, because they reinforce
the global and occult perspective. Page after exciting page brings
the reader into the timeless battle between good and evil. The
problem is that it trains them to see the opposing forces from a
PAGAN, and NOT a Biblical perspective. In this mystical
realm, "good" occult spirits are naturally pitted against bad occult
spirits, just as in pagan cultures where frightened victims would
offer sacrifices to "benevolent" spirits who could help ward off
evil curses and other threats.

Most of the adult readers do not realize, that from a Biblical
perspective, ALL occult forces are dangerous. The child is totally
VULNERABLE without a VERY COURAGEOUS, and LOVING parent. Today, even
so-called Christian leaders are endorsing these things. JUST KNOW
FOR A FACT - ANY CHRISTIAN LEADER ENDORSING THESE THINGS – IT WOULD
BE BETTER FOR THEM TO HAVE A MILLSTONE TIED ABOUT THEIR NECK AND BE
TOSSED INTO THE SEA. Jesus Said, so. So have fun Ms. Rollings, Dr.
Dobson, and Mr. Pope, because your big pay day is coming.

Mat 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which
believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Luke 17:2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about
his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one
of these little ones.

Where are the REAL men of God to rise up and CRY ALOUD against this
exploitation and destruction of children? "Just be tolerant," they
say. Just go along to get along, and just be NICE.

Brethren, nothing is more INTOLERANT than REAL Christianity. The
devil knows that even if the Pope and Dr. Dobson do not. The Lord
had His prophet Isaiah say it right in Isaiah 5:20-23:
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness
for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and
sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and
prudent in their own sight! Woe unto them that are mighty to drink
wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink: Which justify the
wicked for reward, and take away the righteousness of the righteous
from him!

Children do NOT read Harry Potter merely to reach the conclusion and
resolve the suspense. There is a different purpose in the Harry
Potter books. Many read the books over and over because they delight
in identifying with the "good" characters in this newly discovered
world. They build memories based on experiences they feel in an
occult virtual reality. They are desensitized to the danger. The
talent and witchcraft knowledge of the author makes this seductive
world all the more believable.

Think about these little pieces of Harry Potter's Hogwarts theology:

Professor Snape who taught Potions, said "I don't expect you will
really understand the beauty of the softly simmering cauldron with
its shimmering fumes, the delicate power of liquids that creep
through human veins, bewitching the mind, ensnaring the senses…."

A Centaur's views on astrology - "We have sworn not to set ourselves
against the heaven. Have we not read what is to come in the
movements of the planets? ….Or have the planets not let you in on
that secret?"

"He is with me wherever I go," said Quirrell quietly, referring to
the murderous wizard Voldemort. "I met him when I traveled around
the world. A foolish young man I was then, full of ridiculous ideas
about good and evil. Lord Voldemort showed me how wrong I was. There
is no good and evil, there is only power, and those too weak to seek
it.... Since then, I have served him faithfully." (Sounds like the
Hegelian philosophy that produced Hitler.)

Headmaster Dumbledore: "To the well organized mind, death is but the
next great adventure." (Wondering why the teen suicide rate is still
climbing with all the great Christian Psychologists? That term
Christian Psychologist really gets me – why not Christian Idolater?)

Hagrid, the grounds-keeper at Hogwarts, when he told Harry about the
strange power that saved his life, "Happened when a powerful, evil
curse touches you – didn't work on you, and that's why yer famous,
Harry. No one ever lived after he [Voldemort] decided ter kill `em,
no one except you…" (Harry puts superman in the dumpster and has
real modern superhero status even seriously rivaling the Lord Jesus
Christ in the minds of many so-called Christian children.)

Once introduced to spiritism, astrology, palmistry, shape-shifting,
time-travel, and the newest fads of popular occultism, most children
will crave more. They can easily find it. Occult books may be found
in the neighborhood schools and so-called Christian bookstores.
Children today are surrounded by peers who are fascinated by occult
empowerment and would love to share their fun discoveries. Few
children have the Biblical knowledge or discernment needed to
evaluate good and evil, or to resist such threats to their faith.

It should surprise no one that Harry Potter has so quickly reached
the highest level of popularity and acceptance in schools everywhere
in this antichrist world. Dan 8:25 tells us that through the policy
of the antichrist also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand.
Harry Potter's story fits right into sustainable development
programs. When you hear that term "sustainable development," THINK
= Satan's development.

Harry Potter fits perfectly into the international program for the
mindless antichrist global community of tolerance. There is a need
for an antichrist common set of values which excludes and opposes
and ridicules traditional Biblical beliefs. Biblical beliefs are to
be presented as intolerant and narrow, which Harry's cruel aunt and
uncle, masterfully portray. Harry Potter books teach this to
children as masterfully as any of Satan's students of witchcraft
could possibly do. The true God of the Bible simply doesn't fit into
Harry's world of wizards, witches, and other gods.

God will never change. But people, beliefs, and cultures do. And
some changes, such as today's cultural shift away from loving God to
hating His truths, have happened many times. Jesus said it, and with
7 million avid Harry Potter fans, it is expected - Remember the word
that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If
they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have
kept my saying, they will keep yours also. But all these things will
they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that
sent me. John 15:20-21.

Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the
truth?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
RetroProphet
2004-06-03 18:05:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
The Harry Potter series clearly teaches
witchcraft to its intended target group of CHILDREN.
Followers of Bible-based religions do have such a problem
understanding the difference between fact and fiction.

But, let's for the moment accept your claim.

Considering the widespread and completely unprecedented
popularity of the books and movies, surely you can point
to the widespread horrendous results of unleashing
witchcraft on that scale.

The Potter books have outsold just about anything ever written
and it is not an exaggeration to say that the vast majority of
children have been exposed to it.

It's been about six years, surely enough time for the ramifications
of a witchcraft-taught generation to become apparent.

So, what do you offer? Stand and deliver.
BringerOfLight
2004-06-03 18:51:09 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends ?
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
Contact with supernatural powers other than the God of the Holy
Bible is obvious. Saul, the first king of Israel, is said to have
put away those that had familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of
the land. (1 Sam. 28:3) Yet, Saul's end was not good, as he later
sought out a witch at Endor, to bring up the spirit of the prophet
Samuel who had died. (1 Sam. 28:7). And Saul, though anointed as
king of God's people Israel, and a great hero of the nation of
Israel, is probably burning in hell today.
Although different kinds of divination and magic are reported to
have been practiced widely in ancient Israel and among her neighbors
(Deut. 18:9-14; 1 Sam. 6:2; Isa. 19:3; Ezek. 21:21; Dan. 2:2),
Israel was clearly and firmly admonished to have NO part in such
activities. If one is a born again Christian this same admonition
most certainly applies.
It is clear that the God HATES witchcraft and sorcery. It is a sad
commentary on how extensive is today's great falling away from The
Faith. Where is the cry of OUTRAGE that should be heard from
Christian leadership against such things like the Harry Potter
series. The answer to that question may be found in the fine print
of the 501c3 state contract most churches have signed to be in the
religion business. The Harry Potter series clearly teaches
witchcraft to its intended target group of CHILDREN.
Ye shall be holy: for I the LORD your God am holy. Holy means
Sanctified or Separated unto God, having nothing to do with anything
which would claim to be supernatural other than the God and Father
or our Lord Jesus Christ. Lev 19:26 says, neither shall ye use
enchantment, nor observe times." Lev 20:6-7 States the issue very
clearly - And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar
spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even
set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his
people. Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the
LORD your God.
There is NO SUCH THING AS GOOD WITCHCRAFT or beneficial magic. The
true God has made it very clear that ALL magic is an abomination to
the Lord. Another good summary of what God thinks about the sort of
thing taught by the Harry Potter books and movies may be seen in
Deut 18:9-14. There we see that the witchcraft and sorcery, were the
abominable practices of the Canaanites, and the very reason why God
commanded His people, Israel, to destroy them. There shall not be
found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass
through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times,
or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with
familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do
these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these
abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
We do know that the Last Days would be marked by the antichrist war
on the saints. One of the things about the antichrist is that
according to Dan 8:25 through his policy also he shall cause craft
to prosper in his hand.
The Bible is clear that in the last days witchcraft and sorcery will
be widespread. In fact, it even reveals that many so-called
Christians will be caught up in it, and ensnared and destroyed by
it! HARRY POTTER SHOULD BE AS FAR REMOVED FROM REAL CHRISTIANS AS
THE NORTH POLE IS REMOVED FROM THE SOUTH POLE. These Harry Potter
books and movies are right on time, in the antichrist end time
scenario.
We all know it. We all expect it. But it is so sad to watch. It is
hard to watch so many young children embracing blatant witchcraft.
There was a time when children's fiction stories contained dragons
and witches; yet they were always evil. Then things began to change.
Modern fiction and fantasy began to divide witchcraft into the "good
magic" and "bad magic". Even extremely talented writers such as
J.R.R. Tolkien (1892-1973) and C.S. Lewis (1898-1963) helped to
plant the foundation for the sorceries revival in our day. As wise
as they were in so many things, they were often very naive in regard
to evil, and Satan's whole agenda.
Tolkien did write about evil goblins; yet he would make the wizard
to be a good guy. C.S. Lewis followed this practice by pretending
that there is good and bad magic, and that God Himself used
the "good" kind. He would make "magicians" (i.e. sorcerers) to be
the good guys. For these reasons, these most wonderful books, filled
with deep, Christian insights, deserve to be thrown into the trash
can. What a waste. No parent should allow a child to read such
books. And I must confess that there was a time when I though the
C.S. Lewis Series the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, was good,
and wonderful. I had read the whole series and even given the series
as a gift on several occasions. I DO REPENT AND REGRET HAVING READ
THEM OR GIVEN THEM AS GIFTS.
What does God think about Christians making wizards and sorcerers
out to be good guys for the minds of young children?
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
These Harry Potter books are dangerous because they are ten times
more blatant about the so-called wonders and glories of witchcraft
and magic. Yet, they contain none of the insights or Christian
analogies of early children's books. We must beware. Sorcery brings
evil wherever it goes. It is not just fantasy. We have children
killing one another all across the land because they think Satan
will give them power if they shed blood.
J.K. Rowling needs to hang her head in shame for her
irresponsibility. She is a talented writer. However, Satan has
allowed her to become a multi-millionaire for reasons besides her
writing talents! She is bringing millions of young minds into the
occult, and is helping to bring in the Antichrist. If you are a
Christian and these words offend you, it is probably because your
mind has been seduced by a devil.
"You're famous, Harry Potter." That is a remark in Harry Potter and
the Sorcerer's Stone. That book was the first in a seven-book series
on popular witchcraft. The first three books hit the world ?
schools, libraries, and the New York Times best-sellers list ? like
a spiritual tidal wave. Those books crashed and broke down the
barriers to the forbidden mysteries which God clearly has said are
an ABOMINATION. These books have captivated children around the
world.
Harry Potter is a student wizard with amazing powers and an
enticingly scary destiny. Harry, like other students at Hogwarts
School of Witchcraft and Wizardry travels back and forth between two
worlds: the mystical world of magic and the mundane world of
muggles ? those boring, blinded, and biased humans who either don't
believe in the world of witches or who despise it as evil.
Harry's cruel aunt and uncle fit the last category. And, from
Harry's point of view, so would you, if you see witchcraft as
dangerous and demonic.
The skinny, green-eyed kid with glasses and a thunder-bolt scar
under a shock of unruly black hair makes a sympathetic hero.
Harry was orphaned at age one. Harry mysteriously survived a
murderous assault by the wicked wizard Lord Voldemort. Most are too
frightened to even say the name of this scary villain. The cowardly
refer to him as the one "Who Must Not Be Named." It was this
Voldemort who killed Harry's parents. When he tried but failed to
kill their one-year-old baby, Voldemort lost much of his power. The
thunderbolt scar on Harry's forehead marks his peculiar psychic
strength and triumph over evil.
PARENTS THIS IS NOT GOOD READING MATERIAL FOR CHILDREN. CHILDREN YOU
SHOULD THANK GOD THAT YOU HAVE PARENTS WHO WOULD TRY TO KEEP YOU
FREE OF THIS ABOMINATION OF THE DEVIL. SURE ALL THE KIDS LIKE IT
BECAUSE IT IS A MASTERPIECE OF THE DEVIL'S SUBTLTY.
For the next ten years, Harry lives a miserable muggle life in his
uncle's London home, constantly tormented by his cruel guardians and
a spoiled bully of a cousin. But on his eleventh birthday everything
changes. He discovers that he is a wizard of great fame, someone who
once conquered death and crippled a devilish foe. Even better, he
receives an acceptance to Hogwarts ? a coveted boarding school for
aspiring wizards.
More than seven million adults and children alike have, in their
imagination, followed Harry through that mystical veil between
ordinary reality and occult fantasy. Most find it hard to put the
book down once they start it, and when finished, many read it again
and again. Immersed in this mystical world of spiritual forces, they
feel Harry's struggles and share his fears. They sit with him
through his classes on Potions, Spells, Transformation ("turning
something into something else") and Divination, and, like him, learn
some tricks of the old Craft. They sense the pain of his miserable
return visits to London, and they soar with him above the earth on a
fantastic magical broomstick.
Joanne K. Rowling is a brilliant writer. I will say flat out that
she is demonically inspired and knows how to make her characters
come alive in a reader's mind.
It is common to hear people argue that Harry Potter is just fantasy.
Many will say that our fairy tales were scary, like Peter and the
Wolf, or Hansel & Gretel, and that it is just entertaining, and can
not hurt.
IT IS BY NO MEANS THAT SIMPLE OR IS IT BY ANY MEANS THE SAME AS
PREVIOUS SCARY CHILDREN'S STORIES.
The stories and the times have changed. The situation for children
today, is far more dangerous. The children being exposed to Harry
Potter are much more vulnerable to deception than we were.
So what are some of the changes and differences?
First, the culture has changed. Just a single generation ago the
culture may have been considered Biblical in many parts of the
world. Just one generation ago, America outwardly, embraced Bible
values. Whether people were Christian or not, they usually accepted
traditional moral and spiritual boundaries. The old fairy tales
tended to reinforce this Christian or Biblical world view. The good
hero would win over evil forces WITHOUT using "good" MAGIC to
overcome evil MAGIC. Social activities did not include Ouija Boards,
Seances, and an assortment of popular occult role-playing games.
Children were not taught or tempted to alter their consciousness and
invoke the presence of an "animal spirit" or spirit of a "wise
person." Occult experimentation was not tolerated. The blatant
occult was evil and wicked and the general population had sense
enough to know it. The so-called Christian leaders knew better than
to say it was OK; because, the Christians they were leading KNEW
what the KJV Holy Bible said about these things.
Today, children learn their values from a variety of sources other
than the KJV Holy Bible. The entertainment industry is one of the
most persuasive. Sadly, today, it usually teaches global and occult
values, since that is what SELLS in today's antichrist global
market. Children have become so familiar with profanity, occultism,
and explicit sex, that they barely notice. It is just as it was when
Jeremiah wrote in 8:5 - Why then is this people of Jerusalem
slidden back by a perpetual backsliding? they hold fast deceit, they
refuse to return. And just like what he wrote in 8:12 - Were they
ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at
Now we are looking at a very different type of fantasy. Now the
books, movies, games, and television, all involve the imagination.
We should see that there is a specific and forbidden fantasy that
directs the child's imagination. The imaginary scenes in books and
movies are NOT NEUTRAL, THEY ARE FORBIDDEN. They are an abomination
to the One True God, and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.
With guided imagery, the child's feelings and responses are
manipulated by the author's views and values. The fact is that the
stories and books children read in the classroom are usually
selected or approved because their message teaches the new
antichrist global values. The textbooks are chosen because they
provide useful discussion topics for the manipulative process of
compromise. The goal is clear that the ability to THINK in godly
ways, is to be replaced with a satanic or luciferian antichrist,
totally secular, and often occult, world view. The books in the
classrooms of public schools are full of strategies for wearing down
traditional boundaries and Biblical spiritual values. The books
teach the new antichrist occult spirituality.
Books such as the Harry Potters series fit, because they reinforce
the global and occult perspective. Page after exciting page brings
the reader into the timeless battle between good and evil. The
problem is that it trains them to see the opposing forces from a
PAGAN, and NOT a Biblical perspective. In this mystical
realm, "good" occult spirits are naturally pitted against bad occult
spirits, just as in pagan cultures where frightened victims would
offer sacrifices to "benevolent" spirits who could help ward off
evil curses and other threats.
Most of the adult readers do not realize, that from a Biblical
perspective, ALL occult forces are dangerous. The child is totally
VULNERABLE without a VERY COURAGEOUS, and LOVING parent. Today, even
so-called Christian leaders are endorsing these things. JUST KNOW
FOR A FACT - ANY CHRISTIAN LEADER ENDORSING THESE THINGS ? IT WOULD
BE BETTER FOR THEM TO HAVE A MILLSTONE TIED ABOUT THEIR NECK AND BE
TOSSED INTO THE SEA. Jesus Said, so. So have fun Ms. Rollings, Dr.
Dobson, and Mr. Pope, because your big pay day is coming.
Mat 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which
believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Luke 17:2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about
his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one
of these little ones.
Where are the REAL men of God to rise up and CRY ALOUD against this
exploitation and destruction of children? "Just be tolerant," they
say. Just go along to get along, and just be NICE.
Brethren, nothing is more INTOLERANT than REAL Christianity. The
devil knows that even if the Pope and Dr. Dobson do not. The Lord
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness
for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and
sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and
prudent in their own sight! Woe unto them that are mighty to drink
wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink: Which justify the
wicked for reward, and take away the righteousness of the righteous
from him!
Children do NOT read Harry Potter merely to reach the conclusion and
resolve the suspense. There is a different purpose in the Harry
Potter books. Many read the books over and over because they delight
in identifying with the "good" characters in this newly discovered
world. They build memories based on experiences they feel in an
occult virtual reality. They are desensitized to the danger. The
talent and witchcraft knowledge of the author makes this seductive
world all the more believable.
Professor Snape who taught Potions, said "I don't expect you will
really understand the beauty of the softly simmering cauldron with
its shimmering fumes, the delicate power of liquids that creep
through human veins, bewitching the mind, ensnaring the senses?."
A Centaur's views on astrology - "We have sworn not to set ourselves
against the heaven. Have we not read what is to come in the
movements of the planets? ?.Or have the planets not let you in on
that secret?"
"He is with me wherever I go," said Quirrell quietly, referring to
the murderous wizard Voldemort. "I met him when I traveled around
the world. A foolish young man I was then, full of ridiculous ideas
about good and evil. Lord Voldemort showed me how wrong I was. There
is no good and evil, there is only power, and those too weak to seek
it.... Since then, I have served him faithfully." (Sounds like the
Hegelian philosophy that produced Hitler.)
Headmaster Dumbledore: "To the well organized mind, death is but the
next great adventure." (Wondering why the teen suicide rate is still
climbing with all the great Christian Psychologists? That term
Christian Psychologist really gets me ? why not Christian Idolater?)
Hagrid, the grounds-keeper at Hogwarts, when he told Harry about the
strange power that saved his life, "Happened when a powerful, evil
curse touches you ? didn't work on you, and that's why yer famous,
Harry. No one ever lived after he [Voldemort] decided ter kill `em,
no one except you?" (Harry puts superman in the dumpster and has
real modern superhero status even seriously rivaling the Lord Jesus
Christ in the minds of many so-called Christian children.)
Once introduced to spiritism, astrology, palmistry, shape-shifting,
time-travel, and the newest fads of popular occultism, most children
will crave more. They can easily find it. Occult books may be found
in the neighborhood schools and so-called Christian bookstores.
Children today are surrounded by peers who are fascinated by occult
empowerment and would love to share their fun discoveries. Few
children have the Biblical knowledge or discernment needed to
evaluate good and evil, or to resist such threats to their faith.
It should surprise no one that Harry Potter has so quickly reached
the highest level of popularity and acceptance in schools everywhere
in this antichrist world. Dan 8:25 tells us that through the policy
of the antichrist also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand.
Harry Potter's story fits right into sustainable development
programs. When you hear that term "sustainable development," THINK
= Satan's development.
Harry Potter fits perfectly into the international program for the
mindless antichrist global community of tolerance. There is a need
for an antichrist common set of values which excludes and opposes
and ridicules traditional Biblical beliefs. Biblical beliefs are to
be presented as intolerant and narrow, which Harry's cruel aunt and
uncle, masterfully portray. Harry Potter books teach this to
children as masterfully as any of Satan's students of witchcraft
could possibly do. The true God of the Bible simply doesn't fit into
Harry's world of wizards, witches, and other gods.
God will never change. But people, beliefs, and cultures do. And
some changes, such as today's cultural shift away from loving God to
hating His truths, have happened many times. Jesus said it, and with
7 million avid Harry Potter fans, it is expected - Remember the word
that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If
they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have
kept my saying, they will keep yours also. But all these things will
they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that
sent me. John 15:20-21.
Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the
truth?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
More mindless yawnings from the self-righteous and pious fundie
vomitorium. Heard it all before. I'd have thought you fundies could
come up with something original once in a while.
Tristan
2004-06-03 20:46:26 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends ? <-- Cute.
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
Contact with supernatural powers other than the God of the Holy
Bible is obvious. Saul, the first king of Israel, is said to have
put away those that had familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of
the land. (1 Sam. 28:3) Yet, Saul's end was not good, as he later
sought out a witch at Endor, to bring up the spirit of the prophet
Samuel who had died. (1 Sam. 28:7). And Saul, though anointed as
king of God's people Israel, and a great hero of the nation of
Israel, is probably burning in hell today.
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on fiction. The magic in
Harry Potter is fiction. There is no Hogwart's. There aren't really
magic wands with Phoenix feathers in them. True occult practices are
as similar to Harry Potter as a giraffe is similar to a hammer-head
shark.
Although different kinds of divination and magic are reported to
have been practiced widely in ancient Israel and among her neighbors
(Deut. 18:9-14; 1 Sam. 6:2; Isa. 19:3; Ezek. 21:21; Dan. 2:2),
Israel was clearly and firmly admonished to have NO part in such
activities. If one is a born again Christian this same admonition
most certainly applies.
Of course! Obviously the "magic" and "divination" in Harry Potter is
identical to occult pratices in ancient Israel.
It is clear that the God HATES witchcraft and sorcery. It is a sad
commentary on how extensive is today's great falling away from The
Faith. Where is the cry of OUTRAGE that should be heard from
Christian leadership against such things like the Harry Potter
series. The answer to that question may be found in the fine print
of the 501c3 state contract most churches have signed to be in the
religion business. The Harry Potter series clearly teaches
witchcraft to its intended target group of CHILDREN.
Can you provide any specific examples of actual witchcraft, or wicca,
being performed in the Harry Potter stories?
Ye shall be holy: for I the LORD your God am holy. Holy means
Sanctified or Separated unto God, having nothing to do with anything
which would claim to be supernatural other than the God and Father
or our Lord Jesus Christ. Lev 19:26 says, neither shall ye use
enchantment, nor observe times." Lev 20:6-7 States the issue very
clearly - And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar
spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even
set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his
people. Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the
LORD your God.
Whoring?! ROFLMAO! Where is there whoring in Harry Potter?
There is NO SUCH THING AS GOOD WITCHCRAFT or beneficial magic. The
true God has made it very clear that ALL magic is an abomination to
the Lord. Another good summary of what God thinks about the sort of
thing taught by the Harry Potter books and movies may be seen in
Deut 18:9-14. There we see that the witchcraft and sorcery, were the
abominable practices of the Canaanites, and the very reason why God
commanded His people, Israel, to destroy them. There shall not be
found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass
through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times,
or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with
familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do
these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these
abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
We do know that the Last Days would be marked by the antichrist war
on the saints. One of the things about the antichrist is that
according to Dan 8:25 through his policy also he shall cause craft
to prosper in his hand.
The Bible is clear that in the last days witchcraft and sorcery will
be widespread. In fact, it even reveals that many so-called
Christians will be caught up in it, and ensnared and destroyed by
it! HARRY POTTER SHOULD BE AS FAR REMOVED FROM REAL CHRISTIANS AS
THE NORTH POLE IS REMOVED FROM THE SOUTH POLE. These Harry Potter
books and movies are right on time, in the antichrist end time
scenario.
Apparently, the anti-christ has good taste in movies and literature.
We all know it. We all expect it. But it is so sad to watch. It is
hard to watch so many young children embracing blatant witchcraft.
There was a time when children's fiction stories contained dragons
and witches; yet they were always evil. Then things began to change.
Modern fiction and fantasy began to divide witchcraft into the "good
magic" and "bad magic". Even extremely talented writers such as
J.R.R. Tolkien (1892-1973) and C.S. Lewis (1898-1963) helped to
plant the foundation for the sorceries revival in our day. As wise
as they were in so many things, they were often very naive in regard
to evil, and Satan's whole agenda.
Tolkien did write about evil goblins; yet he would make the wizard
to be a good guy. C.S. Lewis followed this practice by pretending
that there is good and bad magic, and that God Himself used
the "good" kind. He would make "magicians" (i.e. sorcerers) to be
the good guys. For these reasons, these most wonderful books, filled
with deep, Christian insights, deserve to be thrown into the trash
can. What a waste. No parent should allow a child to read such
books. And I must confess that there was a time when I though the
C.S. Lewis Series the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, was good,
and wonderful. I had read the whole series and even given the series
as a gift on several occasions. I DO REPENT AND REGRET HAVING READ
THEM OR GIVEN THEM AS GIFTS.
What does God think about Christians making wizards and sorcerers
out to be good guys for the minds of young children?
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
These Harry Potter books are dangerous because they are ten times
more blatant about the so-called wonders and glories of witchcraft
and magic. Yet, they contain none of the insights or Christian
analogies of early children's books. We must beware. Sorcery brings
evil wherever it goes. It is not just fantasy. We have children
killing one another all across the land because they think Satan
will give them power if they shed blood.
Martus, from reading your posts, I am 100% convinced that you know
absolutely nothing about occult or pagan practices. The only thing
you apparently know about witches is from The Wizard of Oz, or kid
cartoons with ugly witches flying on broomsticks. It is sad that you
believe this is the reality of witchcraft.
J.K. Rowling needs to hang her head in shame for her
irresponsibility. She is a talented writer. However, Satan has
allowed her to become a multi-millionaire for reasons besides her
writing talents! She is bringing millions of young minds into the
occult, and is helping to bring in the Antichrist. If you are a
Christian and these words offend you, it is probably because your
mind has been seduced by a devil.
Close. It's because we have a mind.
"You're famous, Harry Potter." That is a remark in Harry Potter and
the Sorcerer's Stone. That book was the first in a seven-book series
on popular witchcraft. The first three books hit the world ?
schools, libraries, and the New York Times best-sellers list ? like
a spiritual tidal wave. Those books crashed and broke down the
barriers to the forbidden mysteries which God clearly has said are
an ABOMINATION. These books have captivated children around the
world.
Umm.. no actually there are factual books out there on the occult that
have always been around. Perhaps, in order to have a clue, you should
read one sometime.
Harry Potter is a student wizard with amazing powers and an
enticingly scary destiny. Harry, like other students at Hogwarts
School of Witchcraft and Wizardry travels back and forth between two
worlds: the mystical world of magic and the mundane world of
muggles ? those boring, blinded, and biased humans who either don't
believe in the world of witches or who despise it as evil.
Harry's cruel aunt and uncle fit the last category. And, from
Harry's point of view, so would you, if you see witchcraft as
dangerous and demonic.
The skinny, green-eyed kid with glasses and a thunder-bolt scar
under a shock of unruly black hair makes a sympathetic hero.
Harry was orphaned at age one. Harry mysteriously survived a
murderous assault by the wicked wizard Lord Voldemort. Most are too
frightened to even say the name of this scary villain. The cowardly
refer to him as the one "Who Must Not Be Named." It was this
Voldemort who killed Harry's parents. When he tried but failed to
kill their one-year-old baby, Voldemort lost much of his power. The
thunderbolt scar on Harry's forehead marks his peculiar psychic
strength and triumph over evil.
PARENTS THIS IS NOT GOOD READING MATERIAL FOR CHILDREN. CHILDREN YOU
SHOULD THANK GOD THAT YOU HAVE PARENTS WHO WOULD TRY TO KEEP YOU
FREE OF THIS ABOMINATION OF THE DEVIL. SURE ALL THE KIDS LIKE IT
BECAUSE IT IS A MASTERPIECE OF THE DEVIL'S SUBTLTY.
For the next ten years, Harry lives a miserable muggle life in his
uncle's London home, constantly tormented by his cruel guardians and
a spoiled bully of a cousin. But on his eleventh birthday everything
changes. He discovers that he is a wizard of great fame, someone who
once conquered death and crippled a devilish foe. Even better, he
receives an acceptance to Hogwarts ? a coveted boarding school for
aspiring wizards.
More than seven million adults and children alike have, in their
imagination, followed Harry through that mystical veil between
ordinary reality and occult fantasy. Most find it hard to put the
book down once they start it, and when finished, many read it again
and again. Immersed in this mystical world of spiritual forces, they
feel Harry's struggles and share his fears. They sit with him
through his classes on Potions, Spells, Transformation ("turning
something into something else") and Divination, and, like him, learn
some tricks of the old Craft. They sense the pain of his miserable
return visits to London, and they soar with him above the earth on a
fantastic magical broomstick.
What do you know of "the Old Craft"??
Joanne K. Rowling is a brilliant writer. I will say flat out that
she is demonically inspired and knows how to make her characters
come alive in a reader's mind.
It is common to hear people argue that Harry Potter is just fantasy.
Many will say that our fairy tales were scary, like Peter and the
Wolf, or Hansel & Gretel, and that it is just entertaining, and can
not hurt.
IT IS BY NO MEANS THAT SIMPLE OR IS IT BY ANY MEANS THE SAME AS
PREVIOUS SCARY CHILDREN'S STORIES.
The stories and the times have changed. The situation for children
today, is far more dangerous. The children being exposed to Harry
Potter are much more vulnerable to deception than we were.
So what are some of the changes and differences?
First, the culture has changed. Just a single generation ago the
culture may have been considered Biblical in many parts of the
world. Just one generation ago, America outwardly, embraced Bible
values. Whether people were Christian or not, they usually accepted
traditional moral and spiritual boundaries. The old fairy tales
tended to reinforce this Christian or Biblical world view. The good
hero would win over evil forces WITHOUT using "good" MAGIC to
overcome evil MAGIC. Social activities did not include Ouija Boards,
Seances, and an assortment of popular occult role-playing games.
Children were not taught or tempted to alter their consciousness and
invoke the presence of an "animal spirit" or spirit of a "wise
person." Occult experimentation was not tolerated. The blatant
occult was evil and wicked and the general population had sense
enough to know it. The so-called Christian leaders knew better than
to say it was OK; because, the Christians they were leading KNEW
what the KJV Holy Bible said about these things.
So, where is there a ouija board in HP? Where do they hold seances?
Where do they alter there consciousness to invoke a presence? Humm...
Today, children learn their values from a variety of sources other
than the KJV Holy Bible. The entertainment industry is one of the
most persuasive. Sadly, today, it usually teaches global and occult
values, since that is what SELLS in today's antichrist global
market. Children have become so familiar with profanity, occultism,
and explicit sex, that they barely notice. It is just as it was when
Jeremiah wrote in 8:5 - Why then is this people of Jerusalem
slidden back by a perpetual backsliding? they hold fast deceit, they
refuse to return. And just like what he wrote in 8:12 - Were they
ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at
Where in HP is there profanity, occultism or explicit sex??
Now we are looking at a very different type of fantasy. Now the
books, movies, games, and television, all involve the imagination.
We should see that there is a specific and forbidden fantasy that
directs the child's imagination. The imaginary scenes in books and
movies are NOT NEUTRAL, THEY ARE FORBIDDEN. They are an abomination
to the One True God, and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.
With guided imagery, the child's feelings and responses are
manipulated by the author's views and values. The fact is that the
stories and books children read in the classroom are usually
selected or approved because their message teaches the new
antichrist global values. The textbooks are chosen because they
provide useful discussion topics for the manipulative process of
compromise. The goal is clear that the ability to THINK in godly
ways, is to be replaced with a satanic or luciferian antichrist,
totally secular, and often occult, world view. The books in the
classrooms of public schools are full of strategies for wearing down
traditional boundaries and Biblical spiritual values. The books
teach the new antichrist occult spirituality.
"the manipulative process of compromise"? It's called critical
thinking. I think you'd probably sound a lot more intelligent if
you'd try it sometime.
Books such as the Harry Potters series fit, because they reinforce
the global and occult perspective. Page after exciting page brings
the reader into the timeless battle between good and evil. The
problem is that it trains them to see the opposing forces from a
PAGAN, and NOT a Biblical perspective. In this mystical
realm, "good" occult spirits are naturally pitted against bad occult
spirits, just as in pagan cultures where frightened victims would
offer sacrifices to "benevolent" spirits who could help ward off
evil curses and other threats.
Actually, in most Pagan mythos, opposing forces are cooperative and
not in conflict.
Most of the adult readers do not realize, that from a Biblical
perspective, ALL occult forces are dangerous. The child is totally
VULNERABLE without a VERY COURAGEOUS, and LOVING parent. Today, even
so-called Christian leaders are endorsing these things. JUST KNOW
FOR A FACT - ANY CHRISTIAN LEADER ENDORSING THESE THINGS ? IT WOULD
BE BETTER FOR THEM TO HAVE A MILLSTONE TIED ABOUT THEIR NECK AND BE
TOSSED INTO THE SEA. Jesus Said, so. So have fun Ms. Rollings, Dr.
Dobson, and Mr. Pope, because your big pay day is coming.
Mat 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which
believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Luke 17:2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about
his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one
of these little ones.
Where are the REAL men of God to rise up and CRY ALOUD against this
exploitation and destruction of children? "Just be tolerant," they
say. Just go along to get along, and just be NICE.
Brethren, nothing is more INTOLERANT than REAL Christianity. The
devil knows that even if the Pope and Dr. Dobson do not. The Lord
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness
for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and
sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and
prudent in their own sight! Woe unto them that are mighty to drink
wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink: Which justify the
wicked for reward, and take away the righteousness of the righteous
from him!
You are absolutely correct, modern Christianity is most intolerant.
Children do NOT read Harry Potter merely to reach the conclusion and
resolve the suspense. There is a different purpose in the Harry
Potter books. Many read the books over and over because they delight
in identifying with the "good" characters in this newly discovered
world. They build memories based on experiences they feel in an
occult virtual reality. They are desensitized to the danger. The
talent and witchcraft knowledge of the author makes this seductive
world all the more believable.
You again use the term "witchcraft knowledge" and I'm quite sure you
don't know anything about "witchcraft knowledge".
Professor Snape who taught Potions, said "I don't expect you will
really understand the beauty of the softly simmering cauldron with
its shimmering fumes, the delicate power of liquids that creep
through human veins, bewitching the mind, ensnaring the senses?."
A Centaur's views on astrology - "We have sworn not to set ourselves
against the heaven. Have we not read what is to come in the
movements of the planets? ?.Or have the planets not let you in on
that secret?"
"He is with me wherever I go," said Quirrell quietly, referring to
the murderous wizard Voldemort. "I met him when I traveled around
the world. A foolish young man I was then, full of ridiculous ideas
about good and evil. Lord Voldemort showed me how wrong I was. There
is no good and evil, there is only power, and those too weak to seek
it.... Since then, I have served him faithfully." (Sounds like the
Hegelian philosophy that produced Hitler.)
For f*%& sake Martus, Quirrell is the EVIL wizard in the story. Of
course he supposed to sound evil.
Headmaster Dumbledore: "To the well organized mind, death is but the
next great adventure." (Wondering why the teen suicide rate is still
climbing with all the great Christian Psychologists? That term
Christian Psychologist really gets me ? why not Christian Idolater?)
Umm... Martus, what does Christianity teach will happen to you after
you die if you're a Christian? I seem to remember an ideal place
where you get to feel immense love for all eternity... What was that
place called... oh yeah, heaven. Sounds like a great adventure to me.
Hagrid, the grounds-keeper at Hogwarts, when he told Harry about the
strange power that saved his life, "Happened when a powerful, evil
curse touches you ? didn't work on you, and that's why yer famous,
Harry. No one ever lived after he [Voldemort] decided ter kill `em,
no one except you?" (Harry puts superman in the dumpster and has
real modern superhero status even seriously rivaling the Lord Jesus
Christ in the minds of many so-called Christian children.)
Once introduced to spiritism, astrology, palmistry, shape-shifting,
time-travel, and the newest fads of popular occultism, most children
will crave more. They can easily find it. Occult books may be found
in the neighborhood schools and so-called Christian bookstores.
Children today are surrounded by peers who are fascinated by occult
empowerment and would love to share their fun discoveries. Few
children have the Biblical knowledge or discernment needed to
evaluate good and evil, or to resist such threats to their faith.
Yes, non-fiction occult books are easily obtainable. And in the
fiction section, a person can find all the HP books.
It should surprise no one that Harry Potter has so quickly reached
the highest level of popularity and acceptance in schools everywhere
in this antichrist world. Dan 8:25 tells us that through the policy
of the antichrist also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand.
Harry Potter's story fits right into sustainable development
programs. When you hear that term "sustainable development," THINK
= Satan's development.
Dan 8:25? Are you and Daniel golf-buddies now?
Harry Potter fits perfectly into the international program for the
mindless antichrist global community of tolerance. There is a need
for an antichrist common set of values which excludes and opposes
and ridicules traditional Biblical beliefs. Biblical beliefs are to
be presented as intolerant and narrow, which Harry's cruel aunt and
uncle, masterfully portray. Harry Potter books teach this to
children as masterfully as any of Satan's students of witchcraft
could possibly do. The true God of the Bible simply doesn't fit into
Harry's world of wizards, witches, and other gods.
I can't seem to remember Christianity or the bible ever being
mentioned in any of the HP books... can you give a reference?
God will never change. But people, beliefs, and cultures do. And
some changes, such as today's cultural shift away from loving God to
hating His truths, have happened many times. Jesus said it, and with
7 million avid Harry Potter fans, it is expected - Remember the word
that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If
they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have
kept my saying, they will keep yours also. But all these things will
they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that
sent me. John 15:20-21.
Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the
truth?
You are my enemy because you are ignorant.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
'enry VIII
2004-06-03 20:58:43 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends -
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
Contact with supernatural powers other than the God of the Holy
Bible is obvious. Saul, the first king of Israel, is said to have
put away those that had familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of
the land. (1 Sam. 28:3) Yet, Saul's end was not good, as he later
sought out a witch at Endor, to bring up the spirit of the prophet
Samuel who had died. (1 Sam. 28:7). And Saul, though anointed as
king of God's people Israel, and a great hero of the nation of
Israel, is probably burning in hell today.
Harry is more real than your supposed bible "God", you have a right to be
pissed! <VBG>

'enry VIII
Robert D. De Mars
2004-06-03 21:24:31 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
Indeed. LOL... Back in the 1980's my freinds & I became
obsessed with playing a game called Dungeons & Dragons. It
was/is a fantasy role playing game. It invloved casting spells,
cutting off heads, stealing, good vs evil, monsters, devils,
deamons, gods (notice the small g..thank you) etc. It was great
& we had a lot of fun, and more importantly, it kept us out of
trouble (other than the beer drinking / pott smoking while we
played..hehe).
I used to hear this same crap (see below) about Dungeons &
Dragons. Same story 20 years latter, just replace D & D with
Harry Potter....Send....
LOL.... It's fake. It's make believe. It's Fantasy. It's not
real.
Your Bible reading has resulted in your head being insterted up
your ass.
Please pull it out....for you own sake....

Take Care,

Robert De Mars
Contact with supernatural powers other than the God of the Holy
Bible is obvious. Saul, the first king of Israel, is said to have
put away those that had familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of
the land. (1 Sam. 28:3) Yet, Saul's end was not good, as he later
sought out a witch at Endor, to bring up the spirit of the prophet
Samuel who had died. (1 Sam. 28:7). And Saul, though anointed as
king of God's people Israel, and a great hero of the nation of
Israel, is probably burning in hell today.
Although different kinds of divination and magic are reported to
have been practiced widely in ancient Israel and among her neighbors
(Deut. 18:9-14; 1 Sam. 6:2; Isa. 19:3; Ezek. 21:21; Dan. 2:2),
Israel was clearly and firmly admonished to have NO part in such
activities. If one is a born again Christian this same admonition
most certainly applies.
It is clear that the God HATES witchcraft and sorcery. It is a sad
commentary on how extensive is today's great falling away from The
Faith. Where is the cry of OUTRAGE that should be heard from
Christian leadership against such things like the Harry Potter
series. The answer to that question may be found in the fine print
of the 501c3 state contract most churches have signed to be in the
religion business. The Harry Potter series clearly teaches
witchcraft to its intended target group of CHILDREN.
Ye shall be holy: for I the LORD your God am holy. Holy means
Sanctified or Separated unto God, having nothing to do with anything
which would claim to be supernatural other than the God and Father
or our Lord Jesus Christ. Lev 19:26 says, neither shall ye use
enchantment, nor observe times." Lev 20:6-7 States the issue very
clearly - And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar
spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even
set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his
people. Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the
LORD your God.
There is NO SUCH THING AS GOOD WITCHCRAFT or beneficial magic. The
true God has made it very clear that ALL magic is an abomination to
the Lord. Another good summary of what God thinks about the sort of
thing taught by the Harry Potter books and movies may be seen in
Deut 18:9-14. There we see that the witchcraft and sorcery, were the
abominable practices of the Canaanites, and the very reason why God
commanded His people, Israel, to destroy them. There shall not be
found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass
through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times,
or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with
familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do
these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these
abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
We do know that the Last Days would be marked by the antichrist war
on the saints. One of the things about the antichrist is that
according to Dan 8:25 through his policy also he shall cause craft
to prosper in his hand.
The Bible is clear that in the last days witchcraft and sorcery will
be widespread. In fact, it even reveals that many so-called
Christians will be caught up in it, and ensnared and destroyed by
it! HARRY POTTER SHOULD BE AS FAR REMOVED FROM REAL CHRISTIANS AS
THE NORTH POLE IS REMOVED FROM THE SOUTH POLE. These Harry Potter
books and movies are right on time, in the antichrist end time
scenario.
We all know it. We all expect it. But it is so sad to watch. It is
hard to watch so many young children embracing blatant witchcraft.
There was a time when children's fiction stories contained dragons
and witches; yet they were always evil. Then things began to change.
Modern fiction and fantasy began to divide witchcraft into the "good
magic" and "bad magic". Even extremely talented writers such as
J.R.R. Tolkien (1892-1973) and C.S. Lewis (1898-1963) helped to
plant the foundation for the sorceries revival in our day. As wise
as they were in so many things, they were often very naive in regard
to evil, and Satan's whole agenda.
Tolkien did write about evil goblins; yet he would make the wizard
to be a good guy. C.S. Lewis followed this practice by pretending
that there is good and bad magic, and that God Himself used
the "good" kind. He would make "magicians" (i.e. sorcerers) to be
the good guys. For these reasons, these most wonderful books, filled
with deep, Christian insights, deserve to be thrown into the trash
can. What a waste. No parent should allow a child to read such
books. And I must confess that there was a time when I though the
C.S. Lewis Series the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, was good,
and wonderful. I had read the whole series and even given the series
as a gift on several occasions. I DO REPENT AND REGRET HAVING READ
THEM OR GIVEN THEM AS GIFTS.
What does God think about Christians making wizards and sorcerers
out to be good guys for the minds of young children?
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
These Harry Potter books are dangerous because they are ten times
more blatant about the so-called wonders and glories of witchcraft
and magic. Yet, they contain none of the insights or Christian
analogies of early children's books. We must beware. Sorcery brings
evil wherever it goes. It is not just fantasy. We have children
killing one another all across the land because they think Satan
will give them power if they shed blood.
J.K. Rowling needs to hang her head in shame for her
irresponsibility. She is a talented writer. However, Satan has
allowed her to become a multi-millionaire for reasons besides her
writing talents! She is bringing millions of young minds into the
occult, and is helping to bring in the Antichrist. If you are a
Christian and these words offend you, it is probably because your
mind has been seduced by a devil.
"You're famous, Harry Potter." That is a remark in Harry Potter and
the Sorcerer's Stone. That book was the first in a seven-book series
on popular witchcraft. The first three books hit the world –
schools, libraries, and the New York Times best-sellers list – like
a spiritual tidal wave. Those books crashed and broke down the
barriers to the forbidden mysteries which God clearly has said are
an ABOMINATION. These books have captivated children around the
world.
Harry Potter is a student wizard with amazing powers and an
enticingly scary destiny. Harry, like other students at Hogwarts
School of Witchcraft and Wizardry travels back and forth between two
worlds: the mystical world of magic and the mundane world of
muggles – those boring, blinded, and biased humans who either don't
believe in the world of witches or who despise it as evil.
Harry's cruel aunt and uncle fit the last category. And, from
Harry's point of view, so would you, if you see witchcraft as
dangerous and demonic.
The skinny, green-eyed kid with glasses and a thunder-bolt scar
under a shock of unruly black hair makes a sympathetic hero.
Harry was orphaned at age one. Harry mysteriously survived a
murderous assault by the wicked wizard Lord Voldemort. Most are too
frightened to even say the name of this scary villain. The cowardly
refer to him as the one "Who Must Not Be Named." It was this
Voldemort who killed Harry's parents. When he tried but failed to
kill their one-year-old baby, Voldemort lost much of his power. The
thunderbolt scar on Harry's forehead marks his peculiar psychic
strength and triumph over evil.
PARENTS THIS IS NOT GOOD READING MATERIAL FOR CHILDREN. CHILDREN YOU
SHOULD THANK GOD THAT YOU HAVE PARENTS WHO WOULD TRY TO KEEP YOU
FREE OF THIS ABOMINATION OF THE DEVIL. SURE ALL THE KIDS LIKE IT
BECAUSE IT IS A MASTERPIECE OF THE DEVIL'S SUBTLTY.
For the next ten years, Harry lives a miserable muggle life in his
uncle's London home, constantly tormented by his cruel guardians and
a spoiled bully of a cousin. But on his eleventh birthday everything
changes. He discovers that he is a wizard of great fame, someone who
once conquered death and crippled a devilish foe. Even better, he
receives an acceptance to Hogwarts – a coveted boarding school for
aspiring wizards.
More than seven million adults and children alike have, in their
imagination, followed Harry through that mystical veil between
ordinary reality and occult fantasy. Most find it hard to put the
book down once they start it, and when finished, many read it again
and again. Immersed in this mystical world of spiritual forces, they
feel Harry's struggles and share his fears. They sit with him
through his classes on Potions, Spells, Transformation ("turning
something into something else") and Divination, and, like him, learn
some tricks of the old Craft. They sense the pain of his miserable
return visits to London, and they soar with him above the earth on a
fantastic magical broomstick.
Joanne K. Rowling is a brilliant writer. I will say flat out that
she is demonically inspired and knows how to make her characters
come alive in a reader's mind.
It is common to hear people argue that Harry Potter is just fantasy.
Many will say that our fairy tales were scary, like Peter and the
Wolf, or Hansel & Gretel, and that it is just entertaining, and can
not hurt.
IT IS BY NO MEANS THAT SIMPLE OR IS IT BY ANY MEANS THE SAME AS
PREVIOUS SCARY CHILDREN'S STORIES.
The stories and the times have changed. The situation for children
today, is far more dangerous. The children being exposed to Harry
Potter are much more vulnerable to deception than we were.
So what are some of the changes and differences?
First, the culture has changed. Just a single generation ago the
culture may have been considered Biblical in many parts of the
world. Just one generation ago, America outwardly, embraced Bible
values. Whether people were Christian or not, they usually accepted
traditional moral and spiritual boundaries. The old fairy tales
tended to reinforce this Christian or Biblical world view. The good
hero would win over evil forces WITHOUT using "good" MAGIC to
overcome evil MAGIC. Social activities did not include Ouija Boards,
Seances, and an assortment of popular occult role-playing games.
Children were not taught or tempted to alter their consciousness and
invoke the presence of an "animal spirit" or spirit of a "wise
person." Occult experimentation was not tolerated. The blatant
occult was evil and wicked and the general population had sense
enough to know it. The so-called Christian leaders knew better than
to say it was OK; because, the Christians they were leading KNEW
what the KJV Holy Bible said about these things.
Today, children learn their values from a variety of sources other
than the KJV Holy Bible. The entertainment industry is one of the
most persuasive. Sadly, today, it usually teaches global and occult
values, since that is what SELLS in today's antichrist global
market. Children have become so familiar with profanity, occultism,
and explicit sex, that they barely notice. It is just as it was when
Jeremiah wrote in 8:5 - Why then is this people of Jerusalem
slidden back by a perpetual backsliding? they hold fast deceit, they
refuse to return. And just like what he wrote in 8:12 - Were they
ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at
Now we are looking at a very different type of fantasy. Now the
books, movies, games, and television, all involve the imagination.
We should see that there is a specific and forbidden fantasy that
directs the child's imagination. The imaginary scenes in books and
movies are NOT NEUTRAL, THEY ARE FORBIDDEN. They are an abomination
to the One True God, and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.
With guided imagery, the child's feelings and responses are
manipulated by the author's views and values. The fact is that the
stories and books children read in the classroom are usually
selected or approved because their message teaches the new
antichrist global values. The textbooks are chosen because they
provide useful discussion topics for the manipulative process of
compromise. The goal is clear that the ability to THINK in godly
ways, is to be replaced with a satanic or luciferian antichrist,
totally secular, and often occult, world view. The books in the
classrooms of public schools are full of strategies for wearing down
traditional boundaries and Biblical spiritual values. The books
teach the new antichrist occult spirituality.
Books such as the Harry Potters series fit, because they reinforce
the global and occult perspective. Page after exciting page brings
the reader into the timeless battle between good and evil. The
problem is that it trains them to see the opposing forces from a
PAGAN, and NOT a Biblical perspective. In this mystical
realm, "good" occult spirits are naturally pitted against bad occult
spirits, just as in pagan cultures where frightened victims would
offer sacrifices to "benevolent" spirits who could help ward off
evil curses and other threats.
Most of the adult readers do not realize, that from a Biblical
perspective, ALL occult forces are dangerous. The child is totally
VULNERABLE without a VERY COURAGEOUS, and LOVING parent. Today, even
so-called Christian leaders are endorsing these things. JUST KNOW
FOR A FACT - ANY CHRISTIAN LEADER ENDORSING THESE THINGS – IT WOULD
BE BETTER FOR THEM TO HAVE A MILLSTONE TIED ABOUT THEIR NECK AND BE
TOSSED INTO THE SEA. Jesus Said, so. So have fun Ms. Rollings, Dr.
Dobson, and Mr. Pope, because your big pay day is coming.
Mat 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which
believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that
believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Luke 17:2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about
his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one
of these little ones.
Where are the REAL men of God to rise up and CRY ALOUD against this
exploitation and destruction of children? "Just be tolerant," they
say. Just go along to get along, and just be NICE.
Brethren, nothing is more INTOLERANT than REAL Christianity. The
devil knows that even if the Pope and Dr. Dobson do not. The Lord
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness
for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and
sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and
prudent in their own sight! Woe unto them that are mighty to drink
wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink: Which justify the
wicked for reward, and take away the righteousness of the righteous
from him!
Children do NOT read Harry Potter merely to reach the conclusion and
resolve the suspense. There is a different purpose in the Harry
Potter books. Many read the books over and over because they delight
in identifying with the "good" characters in this newly discovered
world. They build memories based on experiences they feel in an
occult virtual reality. They are desensitized to the danger. The
talent and witchcraft knowledge of the author makes this seductive
world all the more believable.
Professor Snape who taught Potions, said "I don't expect you will
really understand the beauty of the softly simmering cauldron with
its shimmering fumes, the delicate power of liquids that creep
through human veins, bewitching the mind, ensnaring the senses…."
A Centaur's views on astrology - "We have sworn not to set ourselves
against the heaven. Have we not read what is to come in the
movements of the planets? ….Or have the planets not let you in on
that secret?"
"He is with me wherever I go," said Quirrell quietly, referring to
the murderous wizard Voldemort. "I met him when I traveled around
the world. A foolish young man I was then, full of ridiculous ideas
about good and evil. Lord Voldemort showed me how wrong I was. There
is no good and evil, there is only power, and those too weak to seek
it.... Since then, I have served him faithfully." (Sounds like the
Hegelian philosophy that produced Hitler.)
Headmaster Dumbledore: "To the well organized mind, death is but the
next great adventure." (Wondering why the teen suicide rate is still
climbing with all the great Christian Psychologists? That term
Christian Psychologist really gets me – why not Christian Idolater?)
Hagrid, the grounds-keeper at Hogwarts, when he told Harry about the
strange power that saved his life, "Happened when a powerful, evil
curse touches you – didn't work on you, and that's why yer famous,
Harry. No one ever lived after he [Voldemort] decided ter kill `em,
no one except you…" (Harry puts superman in the dumpster and has
real modern superhero status even seriously rivaling the Lord Jesus
Christ in the minds of many so-called Christian children.)
Once introduced to spiritism, astrology, palmistry, shape-shifting,
time-travel, and the newest fads of popular occultism, most children
will crave more. They can easily find it. Occult books may be found
in the neighborhood schools and so-called Christian bookstores.
Children today are surrounded by peers who are fascinated by occult
empowerment and would love to share their fun discoveries. Few
children have the Biblical knowledge or discernment needed to
evaluate good and evil, or to resist such threats to their faith.
It should surprise no one that Harry Potter has so quickly reached
the highest level of popularity and acceptance in schools everywhere
in this antichrist world. Dan 8:25 tells us that through the policy
of the antichrist also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand.
Harry Potter's story fits right into sustainable development
programs. When you hear that term "sustainable development," THINK
= Satan's development.
Harry Potter fits perfectly into the international program for the
mindless antichrist global community of tolerance. There is a need
for an antichrist common set of values which excludes and opposes
and ridicules traditional Biblical beliefs. Biblical beliefs are to
be presented as intolerant and narrow, which Harry's cruel aunt and
uncle, masterfully portray. Harry Potter books teach this to
children as masterfully as any of Satan's students of witchcraft
could possibly do. The true God of the Bible simply doesn't fit into
Harry's world of wizards, witches, and other gods.
God will never change. But people, beliefs, and cultures do. And
some changes, such as today's cultural shift away from loving God to
hating His truths, have happened many times. Jesus said it, and with
7 million avid Harry Potter fans, it is expected - Remember the word
that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If
they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have
kept my saying, they will keep yours also. But all these things will
they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that
sent me. John 15:20-21.
Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the
truth?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
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--
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Pangur Ban
2004-06-03 23:58:58 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*

Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.

Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.

Pangur
Jim Ledford
2004-06-04 11:29:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by martus
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*
Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.
Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.
Pangur
I wanted to ride the broom. but, since it's all
FICTION written by a person with a great imagination,
I'm not going to get to do that. most times, after
we separate the REALITY from the FICTION, we find out
the fun looking stuff goes with the fiction.

Harry Potter, only an entertaining story, but then
Dan Quale sad enough was real.
Pangur Ban
2004-06-04 12:32:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jim Ledford
Post by Pangur Ban
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*
Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.
Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.
Pangur
I wanted to ride the broom. but, since it's all
FICTION written by a person with a great imagination,
I'm not going to get to do that. most times, after
we separate the REALITY from the FICTION, we find out
the fun looking stuff goes with the fiction.
Harry Potter, only an entertaining story, but then
Dan Quale sad enough was real.
One of my favorite fiction works is the
Dragonriders of Pern series. I would dearly LOVE
to have a telepathic dragon to ride - but I know
the difference between reality and fiction. There
are no dragons - unless one counts the Komodos and
who would want to ride one of them?

Reality can be much fun - just a different sort.

Pangur - who plans to have real fun hunting
fossils and rocks this weekend.
Jim Ledford
2004-06-04 18:13:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by Jim Ledford
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by martus
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*
Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.
Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.
Pangur
I wanted to ride the broom. but, since it's all
FICTION written by a person with a great imagination,
I'm not going to get to do that. most times, after
we separate the REALITY from the FICTION, we find out
the fun looking stuff goes with the fiction.
Harry Potter, only an entertaining story, but then
Dan Quale sad enough was real.
One of my favorite fiction works is the
Dragonriders of Pern series. I would dearly LOVE
to have a telepathic dragon to ride - but I know
the difference between reality and fiction. There
are no dragons - unless one counts the Komodos and
who would want to ride one of them?
when we close our eyes and use our imaginations, then
anything is a possibility. fun, yes. dangerous, only
if one can NOT tell the difference between REALITY and
FICTION with in this case FICTION being the creation in
our own mind. day dreams are made of these.
Post by Pangur Ban
Reality can be much fun - just a different sort.
YES! sometimes I can't even believe it was me doing
what I was doing. how did I get so lucky? why was I
selected to receive such enjoyment? only God can
answer that, so I'll just keep on thanking God for
the grand goodness in my life, since it's my belief
God sent or gave them to me to be enjoyed.
Post by Pangur Ban
Pangur - who plans to have real fun hunting
fossils and rocks this weekend.
I once had a really cool arrowhead collection. then
my brother thought it'd be nice if he polished them
in his rock tumbler polishing machine. he knew no
better, youth and all.

you have fun with your weekend trip, OK.

Jim
RainLover
2004-06-04 13:27:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Pangur Ban
Post by martus
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*
Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.
Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.
Pangur
Well Pangur... since F-U-N spells SIN then I guess YOU are going to hell.


James, Seattle
Robert D. De Mars
2004-06-04 16:42:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by RainLover
Post by Pangur Ban
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*
Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.
Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.
Pangur
Well Pangur... since F-U-N spells SIN then I guess YOU are going to hell.
James, Seattle
Nonsense.....

FUN == SIN
= False

That's all.

Robert De Mars
--
===========================
http://b-o-b.homelinux.com
Long 93:18W Lat 45:09N
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Pangur Ban
2004-06-05 01:05:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by RainLover
Post by Pangur Ban
Dear Friends –
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*
Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.
Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.
Pangur
Well Pangur... since F-U-N spells SIN then I guess YOU are going to hell.
James, Seattle
I'm sure I can ask you for directions as you are
living in your own created hell right now.

Pangur
BringerOfLight
2004-06-06 02:32:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by RainLover
Post by Pangur Ban
Dear Friends ?
Harry Potter has a great deal of emphasis on divination and magic.
*snip*
Harry Potter and Murphy Brown (remember that tv
show?) are NOT REAL. You and Dan Quale have
apparently the same mental problem - the inability
to distinguish between REALITY and FICTION.
Harry Potter was written for amusement - or to use
a simpler word so as to assure comprehension -
FUN. That is spelled F-U-N-. Look it up, see
what it means, and try it - you might just like it.
Pangur
Well Pangur... since F-U-N spells SIN then I guess YOU are going to hell.
James, Seattle
Don't worry James, We'll keep you a front row seat for when you get there as well.
martus
2004-06-03 13:14:01 UTC
Permalink
Church leaders let Charles re-marry
22:12 AEST Thu Jun 3 2004


AFP - Church leaders have cleared the way for Britain's heir to the
throne Prince Charles to marry his long-time companion and fellow
divorcee Camilla Parker Bowles, although it could still be some time
before wedding bells peal, The Times newspaper reported.

In a front page report, it said Rowan Williams, who as Archbishop of
Canterbury is the worldwide leader of the Anglican Church, had given
his personal blessing for the Prince of Wales, 55, to marry Parker
Bowles, 56.

Charles was previously married to Princess Diana, who died in a car
crash in Paris in August 1997 - a year after the couple divorced and
two years after Parker Bowles divorced her own husband.

The issue of whether the royal heir can marry a divorcee has vexed
constitutional experts for years, since the British monarch is the
titular head of the Anglican Church and thus officially expected to be
beyond moral reproach.



Conservative Anglicans have long expressed opposition to Charles and
Parker Bowles marrying in a church, given their well-documented
adultery with each other before the breakdown of their respective
marriages.

But The Times said the couple now were "actively considering wedding
plans", after Williams - well known for his liberal views - dropped
his objections to the union following secret talks with the prince.

Marriage is now a definite possibility, a friend of Charles who was
"authorised" to speak on his behalf, was quoted in The Times as
saying.

"It would be wrong to give the impression that they have not talked
about it. That would not be right," the friend said. "But no one will
rush into it or bounce them into it. It's a personal decision."

However, the friend added that any announcement would be impossible
before the conclusion of a formal British police inquiry into Diana's
death as part of an ongoing English coroner's inquest.

That means that nothing will happen until "next year at the earliest",
the friend said.

The inquiry, headed by Metropolitan Police Commissioner Sir John
Stevens, is meant to resolve once and for all lingering conspiracy
theories alleging that Diana's death was not an accident, but the
result of foul play.

Born Camilla Shand into a well-to-do English family, Parker Bowles
first met Charles at a polo match in 1971, where she reportedly broke
the ice with a flattering remark about his horse.

They dated for a time, then went their separate ways when he joined
the Royal Navy and she married Andrew Parker-Bowles, an army major,
but remained close even after Charles wedded Lady Diana Spencer.

Their romance was rekindled in 1986 - prompting Diana at one point to
publicly reveal: "There were three in the marriage, so it was a bit
crowded".

In the years since Diana's death in the French capital, in a
fast-moving limousine alongside her lover Dodi Fayed, Charles and
Parker Bowles have frequently been seen together at public events.



==================================================================================
Canterbury choice - Rowan Williams

By Alex Kirby
BBC News Online correspondent

In choosing the Most Reverend Rowan Williams as the 104th Archbishop
of Canterbury, the Church of England may be in for a lively ride.
Dr Williams, who published his first book at the age of 29, was only
seven years older when he was appointed professor of divinity at
Oxford - the university's youngest professor.

He is the first Welshman - indeed he is a fluent Welsh speaker - to be
selected for the Church of England's top job for at least 1,000 years.

Dr Williams is an outstanding theologian, a discipline the Church has
increasingly neglected.


One observer says Dr Williams' address to the 1998 Lambeth Conference,
the meeting staged each decade of all the worldwide Anglican church's
bishops, "was seen as the most erudite, though the least understood".

The archbishop is regarded as a liberal, even a radical.

He is sympathetic to the proposal that the Church of England should
lose its established status, and become a church on an equal footing
with the Catholics, the free churches and all the other Christian
denominations.

This is not a view likely to endear him to traditionalists.

Dr Williams also refuses to stigmatise lesbian and gay clergy in the
way some of his fellow Anglican bishops have done.

Raising hackles

He has acknowledged knowingly ordaining a practising gay priest,
something which raises Anglican hackles as few other issues do.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Media coverage of Prince Charles gay sex scandal


The story in a nutshell: royal servant George Smith once claimed to
have seen Prince Charles in bed with his aide Michael Fawcett.

There's more to it than that, but that's the core allegation. The
British media are legally blocked from telling the story and naming
names, though they can tell the story in one article and name names in
another article. Charles has publicly denied that it ever happened.
Some websites and European media outlets have reported the story in
full.

American and Canadian media have picked up the story, but most outlets
are playing coy, reporting Charles's nonspecific denial and feigning
ignorance of the actual allegations. What did Prince Charles not do?
Charles didn't do it - whatever 'it' was. The British papers have a
good reason for not telling the whole story with names: the country's
overly strict libel laws prevent them from doing so. But why would
North American media leave out the specifics? It took me just a few
minutes to piece together the whole story from internet sources. For
whatever reason, they're choosing to keep the allegation under wraps
for now.

The New York Times provides more detail but still requires readers to
connect pieces of the puzzle: denial in one paragraph, allegation of
"compromising sexual encounter" in another paragraph, gay angle in
other paragraphs, names in still other paragraphs. [UPDATE: According
to the Drudge Report, the New York Times website posted this article
Friday afternoon with a more explicit account of the allegation, then
pulled it down after twenty minutes. The original Times story read,
"The allegation (although no one has said so publicly) has to do with
purported sexual contact between Prince Charles, the heir to the
throne, and Michael Fawcett, one of his closest advisers."] This
article does nicely chronicle the escalation of the scandal.

The allegation (which no one here has aired publicly, because of
Britain's tough libel laws) first became an issue last year during the
trial of Paul Burrell, former butler to the late Princess of Wales,
who was unsuccessfully prosecuted on charges of stealing possessions
from the princess's estate after her death in 1997.

One item he was accused of stealing was a cassette tape that Diana had
recorded several years earlier. On the tape, according to news
reports, George Smith, a former royal servant who had suffered from
alcoholism and post-traumatic stress syndrome after fighting in the
Falklands War, said he had been raped by another male royal aide. More
explosively, he also claimed to have witnessed a compromising sexual
encounter involving a member of the royal family.

At the time, Mr. Smith's account threw the ravening British tabloid
press into an almost unbearably frustrating quandary, once they
figured out who was said to be involved.

Yearning to print the rumors but restrained by the law, the newspapers
went the suggestion route, continually printing the same odd
photograph of Prince Charles standing with another man in a field,
without explaining why the photograph had any significance.

Last month, Mr. Burrell began publicizing his tell-all book, "A Royal
Duty," mentioning the now notorious tape and saying that revealing its
contents would have disastrous consequences for the country.
Newspapers seized on the issue again and the allegations began
appearing on various Web sites.
On a completely tangential note — post-traumatic stress syndrome from
the Falklands War?!?

The big question that hasn't been raised yet: how "disastrous" would
full revelation really be for the royals? Would a bisexual king really
be that big a deal in this day and age?
UPDATE: Several readers have pointed out that the Falklands War,
though short as wars go, saw some brutal combat. Wikipedia has a good
overview of the Falklands War. Reader Dave M. adds:

George Smith was in the Welsh Guards, and was on board the 'Sir
Galahad' (a landing ship) when it was bombed by the Argentinean Air
Force on June 8th 1982, along with its sister ship, the 'Sir Tristram'
at Bluff Cove. Both ships were overloaded with men, stores and
munitions, which they'd been transporting from an earlier landing
site. Both caught fire and went up like rockets. 51 men died, and
another 48 were injured. It was the worst single loss for the British
during the Falklands campaign.


A bisexual king would have very interesting implications for the
Church of England (and the rest of the Anglican communion), which is
currently tearing itself apart over the issue of homosexual bishops.

After all, the Archbishop of Canterbury, in principle, is appointed by
and serves at the pleasure of the Crown, which, since the time of
Henry VIII, has enjoyed the titles Head of the Church and Defender of
the Faith.

Public acknowledgement of a British monarch's bisexuality would render
traditional Christian homophobia theoretically untenable in the Church
of England, if it didn't cause the church itself to implode.

If he wasnt the heir to the british throne and one of the most written
about men in the world, he would be free to lead a double life, like a
great many people do, most of them getting away with it. But, Charles
cant "get away with it".Getting caught is a most terrible thing. We,
his subjects, can never respect him again neither can we accept him as
our King. He HAS to leave public life and allow William to prepare to
become our Monarch. All these bullshit statements "he didnt do it etc
etc" have got to stop.He should have the decency and guts to admit
it.....just like George Michael came clean.There is no other way.

Well the whole British Royal Family (except for the late Diana and her
children) are essentially just a bunch of yucky, inbred Germans
anyway. So really... who cares? Besides - would anyone really honestly
be surprised that private-boys'-school-educated Charles might have a
bit of prior experience with mano-a-mano bump 'n' grind? A little slap
& tickle or one-on-one pickle? And anyway, other than having other men
tug on them whilst he knelt, how else do you explain his huge
satellite-dish sized ears? Personally, I'm just surprised Charles
isn't totally G-A-Y! Not that there would be anything wrong with that
of course ;-)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-05 09:51:54 UTC
Permalink
Canadian Church Affirms Same-Sex Unions

Thursday June 3, 2004 6:01 PM


By RICHARD N. OSTLING

AP Religion Writer

ST. CATHARINES, Ontario (AP) - The Anglican Church of Canada approved
a measure Thursday to ``affirm the integrity and sanctity of committed
adult same sex relationships.''

The move stops short of authorizing dioceses to hold same-sex blessing
ceremonies but is still likely to complicate efforts aimed at unifying
the 77 million-member Anglican Communion. The worldwide Anglican body
is deeply divided over homosexuality.

Delegates to a national church meeting handed the victory to
supporters of gays and lesbians as a consolation prize the morning
after they voted to delay any national go-ahead on church blessing
ceremonies for same-sex couples till 2007 and possibly 2010.

The ``integrity and sanctity'' measure was approved by a show of
hands.

World Anglican unity was one reason widely cited for delay on the
same-sex rituals bill, which would have authorized the ceremonies
under a so-called ``local option'' - meaning each diocese could decide
for itself whether to offer them.

Anglicanism is already split over consecration of an openly gay bishop
in the U.S. Episcopal Church and an emergency commission is pondering
how to hold the 38 self-governing national churches together. Many
bishops in Africa, Asia, Latin America and the Mideast are furious
over the Americans' move.

Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams released a statement that
welcomed the Canadian vote on Wednesday, but ignored the action on
Thursday.

``It is important that the Canadian church has held back from a
structural shift that would have run counter to the pleas and wishes
of ... so many around the Communion,'' he said.

The Canadian church action comes in the midst of a federal election
campaign in which full-fledged gay marriage is an issue.

Its ``sanctity'' measure also goes beyond wording put on paper by the
Episcopal Church. The American church passed a measure last year
acknowledging that some dioceses are allowing same-sex blessing
ceremonies, but not affirming the practice as a national policy.

The last-minute ``sanctity'' measure was introduced by Canon Garth
Bulmer from the Ottawa Diocese.

The Rev. Dennis Drainville of the Quebec Diocese, who seconded
Bulmer's motion, told delegates the church needs to express
compassion.

``This says to thousands of people that we love you, we include you
among the faithful, we seek to live with you, to work with you, to
know you,'' he said.

But the Rev. Peter Moore, a former Toronto rector now in the United
States as president of Trinity Episcopal School for Ministry, said
Bulmer's bill ``seems to intentionally confuse the voice with which
the Canadian church speaks on sexual morality, which undercuts the
church's ability to speak on anything.''



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anglican church of England that bends to the habits of it supreme
leader, the future king.

This same church that was first created because the original church
would not bow down to the king wishes of that time and go against
bible teaching.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-06 08:53:37 UTC
Permalink
'Harry' is evil, some clergy say

Does saga make light of witchcraft, open door to devil?
By Lynn Arave and Jody Genessy
Deseret Morning News

Trailers and movie posters for the new Harry Potter movie
proclaim that "Something wicked this way comes."

Daniel Radcliffe plays Harry Potter in the film version of "Harry
Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban."

Murray Close, Warner Bros.
Some concerned Christians couldn't agree more.
Though the spooky-looking ads refer to the dreary Azkaban
prison, soul-sucking Dementors and the re-emergence of the evil
"You-Know-Who" (a k a Lord Voldemort), some church leaders continue to
preach that the real wicked in this case is Harry and all things
Hogwarts — or at least the wizardry and witchcraft upon which
Pottermania is based.
"The Bible calls (witchcraft) an abomination before God," said
Pastor Terry Long of the nondenominational Calvary Chapel of Salt
Lake.
He believes many are making light of this important issue, since
the Bible is so clear about how Christians should classify witchcraft.
"It opens the door" to witchcraft, he said of the Harry Potter
saga, including the movie that opened Friday. "It's geared toward
children."
He believes some children will look up "spells" on the Internet.
"It begins so subtle," he said.
Pastor Long said he warns people to be careful about what
entertainment they choose. He'd like more wholesome movies to be made,
like "Finding Nemo," instead of those with dark overtones.
Pastor Glen Spencer Jr. of the Vernon Baptist Church in
Punkhannock, Pa., stresses in his sermons and his book "The Wicked
World of Harry Potter" that Christians should shun the flicks and
fiction works like they were written by Satan himself and not J.K.
Rowling.
On the Web site christian-parents.net, Pastor Spencer said the
fact that hundreds of millions of Potter books have been sold only
shows "it is obvious that sin and wickedness are popular in this
depraved world."
And while others feel it is a harmless fantasy and a classic
tale of good vs. evil, Pastor Spencer firmly believes there is no
controversy and no middle ground. Good shines light upon evil — and
evil, in this case, happens to wear round spectacles and has a
lightning-bolt scar on his forehead.
"Reading Harry Potter is drinking from the devil's cup," the
pastor writes. "A casual reading of these books will quickly expose
their dangerous and destructive content. The Christian is to be
separated from the wicked things of the world."
As scriptural proof, he quotes Ephesians 5:11, which says to " .
. . have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but
rather reprove them." He also quotes from the Old Testament (Isaiah
5:20): "Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put
darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet,
and sweet for bitter!"
Pastor Spencer adds: "How one can read the Bible, believe what
God has said, and promote Harry Potter is beyond me. . . . Many who
would never think of sacrificing their children physically are
sacrificing them spiritually with Satanism and spiritism found in
Harry Potter books."
Many local ministers, however, don't believe the fictional world
and its characters promote pagan beliefs and practices. They insist
you can enjoy this fictional sorcery and still be spiritual.
"It's just a story, fellas," said the Rev. Neal Humphrey of
Westminster Presbyterian Church in Fruit Heights. "These movies and
books are not teaching witchcraft to our kids — they're fantasy only."
He says the stories have basic values. He adds that the books
have gotten a lot of kids excited about reading when nothing else
would, and after years of their existence there hasn't been any proven
increase in the practice of witchcraft or the belief in it.
"It shows empowered kids solving problems," the Rev. Humphrey
said. "It's not spiritually subversive."
He also believes the magic is just an allegory in the series.
Richard Wolf, an elder in the North Salt Lake congregation of
the Jehovah's Witnesses, said his church doesn't have a specific stand
against most movies or books, including the Potter series. However,
based on various articles written in the "Watchtower," he said ample
information exists for members to make their own decisions. They need
only ponder and pray about what God would consider appropriate
entertainment.
For example, Jehovah's Witnesses have made a strong stand
against spiritism and trying to contact the dead.
"Those involved in spiritism put themselves at grave risk," a
Watchtower article states.
Bishop George Niederauer, of the Catholic Diocese of Salt Lake
City, said he has a friend in California who is very upset at the
witchcraft accent to the Potter series.
"Sometimes it's how strictly you interpret it," he said.
Bishop Niederauer sees it as fantasy only.
"It's entertainment and not threatening," he said.
The Rev. Art Ritter of Salt Lake's First Congregational Church
said he hasn't seen any of the movies, but his children have read the
books. He believes as long as parents discuss it with their kids,
there's no harm in this kind of entertainment.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has made no
official comments regarding the Potter books or movies. Spokesman Dale
Bills said the LDS Church rarely makes comments on commercial
productions.
Chris Crowe, professor of English at Brigham Young University,
with an emphasis in adolescent literature, said he hasn't come across
any concerns by LDS Church leaders or members regarding the Potter
series. He also disputes that the books or the movies have caused any
adolescent increase in witchcraft.
"For me personally, 'The Wizard of Oz' didn't make people turn
to witchcraft," he said, citing a century-old parallel to the Potter
phenomenon.
He said the Potter series, books and movies, make a clear
distinction between good and evil. Some other witchcraft-oriented
productions don't do that.
Crowe stressed that the real-life practice of witchcraft is
indisputably evil but sees no harm in the Potter fantasy world, as
long as you don't confuse fiction with reality.
"I think the stories are fun to read," he said. "It's become a
real phenomenon."
The most recent Potter book was some 700 pages long, and he's
convinced it has helped a lot of young readers.
"It's done a lot for reading," Crowe said, noting that it can be
a confidence-builder for a young reader to get through such a thick
book.
He also said the Potter book series has significantly helped
adolescent literature in general, though the Potter books have been
ranked highly on the American Library Association's list of "The 100
Most Frequently Challenged Books." (The Potter series currently ranks
seventh on that list.)
A Penn State researcher also believes there's no harm with the
Potter series.
Bill Ellis, associate professor of English and America studies
at Penn State's Hazleton campus in University Park, Pa., has said the
lure of the occult — especially for teenagers — is a centuries-old
phenomenon and is not likely to fade away.
He believes witchcraft, magic and contact with the supernatural
are common occurrences — even essential companions of organized
religion because they allow the average person to participate in an
otherworldly experience.
Ellis wrote a book, "Lucifer Ascending: The Occult in Folklore
and Popular Culture," that came out earlier this spring.
The book looks at such things as carrying a rabbit's foot, using
a Ouija board to contact the dead and even "Black Bibles."
Ellis believes adolescents have always been fond of nocturnal
trysts at graveyards and ritual visits to uncanny places. While some
related activities might be a legitimate cause of concern to parents,
most are not.
On a whole, Ellis concluded that these practices do not spring
from an irrational belief in Lucifer or Satan. Witchcraft also is not
a closet counter-religion hostile to Christianity, he said. The occult
complements institutionalized religion by opening the realm of myth to
the ordinary person, especially those with the least power in society
— women, children, the poor and the disenfranchised.
Whatever anyone else says, Pastor Spencer believes Harry Potter
is an evil wolf in a wizard's robes who has captured the hearts and
minds of unsuspecting victims.
"Satan has peddled Harry Potter to the world as something that
is harmless fun. Satan is a great deceiver who is able to make things
look good when they are not," the pastor claims. "The forces of evil
and wickedness are gaining ground because so many Christians have
failed in their duty as a soldier of Jesus Christ and have become
entangled in the affairs of this world."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How far the pendulium has swung in the opposite direction in that all
the forbidden, destructive, soul destroying items and habits people
were banned by God from following have become the staple diet of the
masses on the broad path to hell.

Only goes to show, corrupt the people of influence and the devil can
corrupt the masses through them. The heads of humanity have been
turned and most of the body does surely follow.

Hold firmly to God in these wicked times!




Timothy 6:9-10 (NRSV)
9 But those who want to be rich fall into temptation and are trapped
by many senseless and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and
destruction. 10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil,
and in their eagerness to be rich some have wandered away from the
faith and pierced themselves with many pains.

[1]
[1] The Holy Bible : New Revised Standard Version. 1996, c1989.
Nashville: Thomas Nelson.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Dave Oldridge
2004-06-06 12:53:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
'Harry' is evil, some clergy say
Does saga make light of witchcraft, open door to devil?
By Lynn Arave and Jody Genessy
Deseret Morning News
Trailers and movie posters for the new Harry Potter movie
proclaim that "Something wicked this way comes."
Daniel Radcliffe plays Harry Potter in the film version of "Harry
Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban."
Murray Close, Warner Bros.
Some concerned Christians couldn't agree more.
Though the spooky-looking ads refer to the dreary Azkaban
prison, soul-sucking Dementors and the re-emergence of the evil
"You-Know-Who" (a k a Lord Voldemort), some church leaders continue to
preach that the real wicked in this case is Harry and all things
Hogwarts — or at least the wizardry and witchcraft upon which
Pottermania is based.
"The Bible calls (witchcraft) an abomination before God," said
Pastor Terry Long of the nondenominational Calvary Chapel of Salt
Lake.
Actually, the words used in the Bible's original language refer, not to
people who pray funny rhyming prayers but to people who gaslight you by
putting strange things in your tea. On those grounds, America's food
industry is more witchy than any writers of fairy tales.
--
Dave Oldridge
ICQ 1800667

Paradoxically, most real events are highly improbable.
Robert D. De Mars
2004-06-06 16:22:10 UTC
Permalink
I thought we all discussed this topic already.....
Post by martus
'Harry' is evil, some clergy say
Does saga make light of witchcraft, open door to devil?
By Lynn Arave and Jody Genessy
Deseret Morning News
Trailers and movie posters for the new Harry Potter movie
proclaim that "Something wicked this way comes."
Daniel Radcliffe plays Harry Potter in the film version of "Harry
Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban."
Murray Close, Warner Bros.
Some concerned Christians couldn't agree more.
Though the spooky-looking ads refer to the dreary Azkaban
prison, soul-sucking Dementors and the re-emergence of the evil
"You-Know-Who" (a k a Lord Voldemort), some church leaders continue to
preach that the real wicked in this case is Harry and all things
Hogwarts — or at least the wizardry and witchcraft upon which
Pottermania is based.
"The Bible calls (witchcraft) an abomination before God," said
Pastor Terry Long of the nondenominational Calvary Chapel of Salt
Lake.
He believes many are making light of this important issue, since
the Bible is so clear about how Christians should classify witchcraft.
"It opens the door" to witchcraft, he said of the Harry Potter
saga, including the movie that opened Friday. "It's geared toward
children."
He believes some children will look up "spells" on the Internet.
"It begins so subtle," he said.
Pastor Long said he warns people to be careful about what
entertainment they choose. He'd like more wholesome movies to be made,
like "Finding Nemo," instead of those with dark overtones.
Pastor Glen Spencer Jr. of the Vernon Baptist Church in
Punkhannock, Pa., stresses in his sermons and his book "The Wicked
World of Harry Potter" that Christians should shun the flicks and
fiction works like they were written by Satan himself and not J.K.
Rowling.
On the Web site christian-parents.net, Pastor Spencer said the
fact that hundreds of millions of Potter books have been sold only
shows "it is obvious that sin and wickedness are popular in this
depraved world."
And while others feel it is a harmless fantasy and a classic
tale of good vs. evil, Pastor Spencer firmly believes there is no
controversy and no middle ground. Good shines light upon evil — and
evil, in this case, happens to wear round spectacles and has a
lightning-bolt scar on his forehead.
"Reading Harry Potter is drinking from the devil's cup," the
pastor writes. "A casual reading of these books will quickly expose
their dangerous and destructive content. The Christian is to be
separated from the wicked things of the world."
As scriptural proof, he quotes Ephesians 5:11, which says to " .
.. . have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but
rather reprove them." He also quotes from the Old Testament (Isaiah
5:20): "Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put
darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet,
and sweet for bitter!"
Pastor Spencer adds: "How one can read the Bible, believe what
God has said, and promote Harry Potter is beyond me. . . . Many who
would never think of sacrificing their children physically are
sacrificing them spiritually with Satanism and spiritism found in
Harry Potter books."
Many local ministers, however, don't believe the fictional world
and its characters promote pagan beliefs and practices. They insist
you can enjoy this fictional sorcery and still be spiritual.
"It's just a story, fellas," said the Rev. Neal Humphrey of
Westminster Presbyterian Church in Fruit Heights. "These movies and
books are not teaching witchcraft to our kids — they're fantasy only."
He says the stories have basic values. He adds that the books
have gotten a lot of kids excited about reading when nothing else
would, and after years of their existence there hasn't been any proven
increase in the practice of witchcraft or the belief in it.
"It shows empowered kids solving problems," the Rev. Humphrey
said. "It's not spiritually subversive."
He also believes the magic is just an allegory in the series.
Richard Wolf, an elder in the North Salt Lake congregation of
the Jehovah's Witnesses, said his church doesn't have a specific stand
against most movies or books, including the Potter series. However,
based on various articles written in the "Watchtower," he said ample
information exists for members to make their own decisions. They need
only ponder and pray about what God would consider appropriate
entertainment.
For example, Jehovah's Witnesses have made a strong stand
against spiritism and trying to contact the dead.
"Those involved in spiritism put themselves at grave risk," a
Watchtower article states.
Bishop George Niederauer, of the Catholic Diocese of Salt Lake
City, said he has a friend in California who is very upset at the
witchcraft accent to the Potter series.
"Sometimes it's how strictly you interpret it," he said.
Bishop Niederauer sees it as fantasy only.
"It's entertainment and not threatening," he said.
The Rev. Art Ritter of Salt Lake's First Congregational Church
said he hasn't seen any of the movies, but his children have read the
books. He believes as long as parents discuss it with their kids,
there's no harm in this kind of entertainment.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has made no
official comments regarding the Potter books or movies. Spokesman Dale
Bills said the LDS Church rarely makes comments on commercial
productions.
Chris Crowe, professor of English at Brigham Young University,
with an emphasis in adolescent literature, said he hasn't come across
any concerns by LDS Church leaders or members regarding the Potter
series. He also disputes that the books or the movies have caused any
adolescent increase in witchcraft.
"For me personally, 'The Wizard of Oz' didn't make people turn
to witchcraft," he said, citing a century-old parallel to the Potter
phenomenon.
He said the Potter series, books and movies, make a clear
distinction between good and evil. Some other witchcraft-oriented
productions don't do that.
Crowe stressed that the real-life practice of witchcraft is
indisputably evil but sees no harm in the Potter fantasy world, as
long as you don't confuse fiction with reality.
"I think the stories are fun to read," he said. "It's become a
real phenomenon."
The most recent Potter book was some 700 pages long, and he's
convinced it has helped a lot of young readers.
"It's done a lot for reading," Crowe said, noting that it can be
a confidence-builder for a young reader to get through such a thick
book.
He also said the Potter book series has significantly helped
adolescent literature in general, though the Potter books have been
ranked highly on the American Library Association's list of "The 100
Most Frequently Challenged Books." (The Potter series currently ranks
seventh on that list.)
A Penn State researcher also believes there's no harm with the
Potter series.
Bill Ellis, associate professor of English and America studies
at Penn State's Hazleton campus in University Park, Pa., has said the
lure of the occult — especially for teenagers — is a centuries-old
phenomenon and is not likely to fade away.
He believes witchcraft, magic and contact with the supernatural
are common occurrences — even essential companions of organized
religion because they allow the average person to participate in an
otherworldly experience.
Ellis wrote a book, "Lucifer Ascending: The Occult in Folklore
and Popular Culture," that came out earlier this spring.
The book looks at such things as carrying a rabbit's foot, using
a Ouija board to contact the dead and even "Black Bibles."
Ellis believes adolescents have always been fond of nocturnal
trysts at graveyards and ritual visits to uncanny places. While some
related activities might be a legitimate cause of concern to parents,
most are not.
On a whole, Ellis concluded that these practices do not spring
from an irrational belief in Lucifer or Satan. Witchcraft also is not
a closet counter-religion hostile to Christianity, he said. The occult
complements institutionalized religion by opening the realm of myth to
the ordinary person, especially those with the least power in society
— women, children, the poor and the disenfranchised.
Whatever anyone else says, Pastor Spencer believes Harry Potter
is an evil wolf in a wizard's robes who has captured the hearts and
minds of unsuspecting victims.
"Satan has peddled Harry Potter to the world as something that
is harmless fun. Satan is a great deceiver who is able to make things
look good when they are not," the pastor claims. "The forces of evil
and wickedness are gaining ground because so many Christians have
failed in their duty as a soldier of Jesus Christ and have become
entangled in the affairs of this world."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How far the pendulium has swung in the opposite direction in that all
the forbidden, destructive, soul destroying items and habits people
were banned by God from following have become the staple diet of the
masses on the broad path to hell.
Only goes to show, corrupt the people of influence and the devil can
corrupt the masses through them. The heads of humanity have been
turned and most of the body does surely follow.
Hold firmly to God in these wicked times!
Timothy 6:9-10 (NRSV)
9 But those who want to be rich fall into temptation and are trapped
by many senseless and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and
destruction. 10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil,
and in their eagerness to be rich some have wandered away from the
faith and pierced themselves with many pains.
[1]
[1] The Holy Bible : New Revised Standard Version. 1996, c1989.
Nashville: Thomas Nelson.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
--
===========================
http://b-o-b.homelinux.com
Long 93:18W Lat 45:09N
===========================
Tristan
2004-06-06 17:42:20 UTC
Permalink
Martus,

I would agree with you if there was any witchcraft in HP. The fact is
that there isn't any real witchcraft in HP. If the kids look up
occult websites after seeing the movie, then the parents should sit
down with their kids and explain Christianity and why it is in their
best interest to be Christian.
Thore Schmechtig
2004-06-07 05:57:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
'Harry' is evil, some clergy say
'Harry' is harmless, many other clergy say. Your point being?
Post by martus
Hold firmly to God in these wicked times!
How about you try to be a good example and quit lying?
--
The ten commandments as demonstated by "christian" fundies
(still under development/refinement)

1. I am the wholly babble thy idol, thou shalt have no other idols beside me.
2. Thou shalt not think about anything besides the truths I tell you, lest you find that my truth is really a lie.
3. Thou shalt force every one to bow to me, thy idol, because there is no way a thinking man would choose to worship me.
4. Remember the verses of me that happen to support your worldview, and insist on all the other verses in me, where I contradict myself, are not there at all.
5. Honor thy fellow idol worshippers, but no one else; claim to love everyone, but never really do so.
6. Thou shalt kill anyone who does not bow to me.
7. Thou shalt not commit adultery by taking in any information from anywhere, for it would prove me to be a liar.
8. Thou shalt not steal from thy fellow idolatrists, but cheat anyone else.
9. Thou shalt tell every lie you deem useful to make the unbelievers bow to me.
10. Thou shalt not covet the intelligence and happiness of the unbeliever, but destroy such so that there will not be anything for you to covet thereafter.
martus
2004-06-09 06:40:56 UTC
Permalink
Friday, June 4, 2004

Religious icons can be mysterious
By Father DAVID L. EPPS
Religion Columnist

According to a Reuters report, several statues of Jesus Christ and the
Virgin Mary in a hall near Brisbane, Australia, have apparently been
bleeding and weeping rose oil. The Catholic Church, according to the
report, has launched an investigation. Hundreds of people have flocked
to the Vietnamese community hall near St. Mary's Church following news
that several statues, crucifixes, tablecloths, and a set of prayer
beads were oozing rose-scented oil.

Father Adrian Farrelly, who has been appointed to investigate the
incident, said, "It's one of those matters where you proceed
prudently." The objects, which began oozing the oil two weeks ago,
have been placed behind glass in the hall until investigators can do
their work.

It's not the first report of such things happening. In the spring of
1985, the monks at the Christ of the Hills Monastery (Russian
Orthodox) in Blanco, Tex., several miles outside San Antonio, noticed
what appeared to be tears streaming from the eyes of an Icon of the
Virgin Mary. The aroma was remarkably similar to sweet myrrh and the
Icon has continued to weep until the present day. A spokesman for the
monastery said:

"What the icon weeps is myrrh. We've never had it scientifically
analyzed. Typically, among the Orthodox, we don't do that because what
happens is beyond the natural; it's beyond the realm of the
scientific. The church investigates. The church wants to make sure
first of all that it's not a fake and second of all that it's not
occurring by some natural phenomenon. But once the church is satisfied
that it is in fact a miracle, then that's all that's done. So whether
chemically the substance that the icon weeps is myrrh or not I don't
really care."

Now I have to admit that all this sounds a bit far fetched to a
southern boy who was raised a conservative Protestant. I first heard
about the Blanco icon five years ago and dismissed it as so much
superstition. Then, while visiting San Antonio, I decided to make the
30-mile or so drive to a wide and dusty place in the desert called
Blanco.

The monastery is located in an isolated area that the ancient Desert
Fathers would have loved. I located someone and said that I would like
to see the "weeping icon." I was told that the monks were in prayer
but, after that, someone would assist me. I spent some time in the
small bookstore on the grounds and, eventually, a bearded man wearing
a black cassock came to take me to see the icon.

As I was escorted into the room where the icon was kept under glass,
the monk told me its history and gave me the monks' interpretation of
why the icon wept. The monks do not believe that the icon weeps
because the mother of Jesus is happy. Rather, they see her tears as a
sign of distress over how far we have all gone from Christ. They
interpret the tears as a call to repentance, prayer, fasting, and
change of life-from a worldly way to a divine one. He explained that
it doesn't always weep and that I should not be disappointed if it did
not. The room, not large at all, had a strong sweet smell to it. The
monk explained that the fragrance came from the icon.

Sure enough, as I stared at the icon, oil seemed to leak copiously
from the eyes of the Virgin Mary. Try as I could, I could not locate a
hole in the wooden icon either before, during, or following the
weeping. For his part, the monk just sat praying. A friend of mine
went several months later to the monastery, after hearing my story,
but the icon did not weep on that day. And no one ever asked me for a
donation, so I dismissed the thought that the whole thing was a
fundraiser.

Some 20 minutes later, as I turned to go, I was startled by the number
of crutches, canes, walkers, and wheelchairs that were discarded in
the back of the small room. I hadn't noticed them when I entered. I
inquired of the monk as to what all those were about and he explained
that, over the years, many people had come to the monastery's icon in
wheelchairs or on crutches or with the aid of walkers. "Those are what
they left behind after they were anointed with oil from the icon and
received prayer."

A monastery spokesman said, "The word for oil that is used in the
Greek is very similar to the word for mercy, so oil flowing from an
icon demonstrates for us the pouring forth of God's mercy."

So what do I think? I don't know what I think. I came away with a
sense of wonder about it all. I do believe that there is mystery in
the world (perhaps in Australia and in Texas, for example) and that
things can and sometimes do happen that are not easily explained away.
A Web search on "weeping icons" produced a great number of results on
incidences from all over the world, so such reports are not
infrequent. And, in this technological, bionic, and binary world, I
rather like the idea of some mystery, wonder, and awe.

[Father David Epps is rector of Christ the King Charismatic Episcopal
Church on Ga. Highway 34 between Peachtree City and Newnan. The church
offers Sunday services at 8 a.m. and 10 a.m. He may be contacted at
www.ctkcec.org or at ***@ctkcec.org.]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 Corinthians 10:19-22 (NRSV)
19 What do I imply then? That food sacrificed to idols is anything, or
that an idol is anything? 20 No, I imply that what pagans sacrifice,
they sacrifice to demons and not to God. I do not want you to be
partners with demons. 21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the
cup of demons. You cannot partake of the table of the Lord and the
table of demons. 22 Or are we provoking the Lord to jealousy? Are we
stronger than he?




Revelation 9:20-21 (NRSV)
20 The rest of humankind, who were not killed by these plagues, did
not repent of the works of their hands or give up worshiping demons
and idols of gold and silver and bronze and stone and wood, which
cannot see or hear or walk. 21 And they did not repent of their
murders or their sorceries or their fornication or their thefts.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-11 08:13:30 UTC
Permalink
June 10, 2004 12:00 PM US Eastern Timezone

A Psychic In the Boardroom? Business Intuitive's Clients Have
Competitive Edge

NEW YORK--(BUSINESS WIRE)--June 10, 2004--Recently, when the heads of
a global PR firm found themselves in the running for a huge account,
they made a bold, non-traditional move, calling upon boardroom psychic
Lynn Robinson.


For the past 20 years, Robinson has consulted with companies around
the globe who use her "psychic powers" to get inside the heads of
prospective clients as well as their competition.

In fact, everything she told the global PR firm was "on target," says
one company executive. They now have the inside track on getting that
account.

Robinson is seeing a record number of requests for consultations; the
bulk of it from referrals by clients. For example, a small ad agency
found itself vying with huge competitors for a major account. On a
recommendation, they called in Robinson and described the prospective
client.

Robinson kept seeing visions of Frank Perdue, the founder and former
spokesperson for Perdue Chicken. They were all baffled. "Then it came
to me," says Robinson. "The CEO of the company the agency was
pitching, secretly wanted to be the spokesperson for the product, "

At the next meeting, the agency brought in a campaign built around the
CEO and got the account.

"Business in the 21st century requires an accurate 'read' on what the
most effective decisions are," Robinson says. "That is the key to
success for my clients."

Whether you call her a psychic in a business suit or a savvy savant,
those who use her services call her "awesome," "amazing," "eerily
accurate." Robinson's intuitive advice has turned into positive,
tangible results for hundreds of businesses. Says one successful
business owner and longtime client, "We don't make a move without
her!"



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


WITCHES AND THEIR LIKE
Cackle now, cry later in despair for their is no salvation in Hell.

THOSE WHO PRACTISE WITCHCRAFT ANGER GOD

2 Chronicles 33:5-7 (NRSV)
5 He built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the
house of the Lord . 6 He made his son pass through fire in the valley
of the son of Hinnom, practiced soothsaying and augury and sorcery,
and dealt with mediums and with wizards. He did much evil in the sight
of the Lord , provoking him to anger.


WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD

Galatians 5:19
19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery,
fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft,
hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelling, and such like: of the
which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that
they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

GET THEIR POWER FROM THE DEMONS

Acts 16:16
16 One day as we were going down to the place of prayer, we met a
demon-possessed slave girl. She was a fortune-teller who earned a lot
of money for her masters. 17 She followed along behind us shouting,
These
men are servants of the Most High God, and they have come to tell you
how
to be saved.18 This went on day after day until Paul got so
exasperated that
he turned and spoke to the demon within her. I command you in the
name of
Jesus Christ to come out of her, he said. And instantly it left
her.19 Her masters
hopes of wealth were now shattered, so they grabbed Paul and Silas
and
dragged them before the authorities at the marketplace


ARE THE DEVIL'S PERVERTING CHILDREN

Acts 13:6
8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for that is what his name means) opposed
them and tried to turn the proconsul from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who
was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked straight at
Elymas and said, 10 ;You are a child of the devil and an enemy
of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and
trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?


GOD OR THE DEVIL: NO MIDDLE GROUND, YOUR CHOICE!!

1 Corinthians 10:
20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they
sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should
have fellowship with devils. 21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord,
and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's
table, and of the table of devils. 22Do we provoke the Lord to
jealousy? are we stronger than he?


ULTIMATE FATE OF THOSE THAT PRACTICE
WITCHCRAFT/OCCULT-
LAKE OF FIRE

Revelation 21
8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the
sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all
liars-their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This
is
the second death."

Matthew 25
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-13 08:47:16 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends –

There are some things that every child of God should know about
Harry Potter, and the latest movie, The Prisoner of Azkaban.

When thou art come into the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee,
thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or
his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or
an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, or a charmer, or
a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
For all that do these things are an abomination unto the Lord: and
because of these abominations the Lord thy God doth drive them out
from before thee. Deuteronomy 18:9-12

And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar
spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a
people seek unto their God? For the living to the dead? And they
shall look unto the earth; and behold trouble and darkness, dimness
of anguish; and they shall be driven to darkness. Isaiah 8:19, 22

And many that believed came, and confessed, and shewed their deeds.
Many of them also which used curious arts brought their books
together, and burned them before all men: and they counted the price
of them, and found it fifty thousand pieces of silver. So mightily
grew the word of God and prevailed. Acts 19:18-20

How is it that every so-called Christian man, is NOT CRYING ALOUD IN
RIGHTEOUS INDIGNATION that the children of our nation are being
taught witchcraft,and sorcery,and wizardry by the Harry Potter
series of books and movies? Part of the problem is the so-called
Christian leadership, who in reality, become champions of Satan when
they would dare to make excuses for the books and movies and say
Harry Potter is OK. How dare any so-called minister NOT cry aloud
against the outrage of Harry Potter? My blood boils at the very idea
that such books and movies training and glorifying witchcraft,
wizardry, and sorcery are allowed openly. YES, WE SHOULD BE VERY
OUTRAGED. The target of these Satanic masterpieces of the crafts of
HELL are the young people.

Young people rightly should expect their parents, teachers, and
ministers, to protect them from such attacks on their soul. Yet, the
sad truth today is that teachers, and even so-called Christian
ministers, are promoting this Harry Potter occult attack on the
souls of young people. So-called Christian ministers who FAIL to
take an OUTRAGED and bold stand AGAINST this Harry Potter occult
training will not stand in the day of Judgment.

Mat 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which
believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9:42-46 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones
that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were
hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. And if thy
hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into
life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire
that never shall be quenched: Where their worm dieth not, and the
fire is not quenched. And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is
better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be
cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where
their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

What is the matter with so-called Christians who do not warn of the
grave dangers of witchcraft and occultism? How can so-called
Christians, like Dr. James Dobson, NOT CRY ALOUD IN OUTRAGE about
the witchcraft and sorcery training and glorification of rebellion
against God in the Harry Potter series? Jim Dobson should be
ashamed, and taken to task, for his OUTRAGEOUS FAILURE to speak
against this outrage. His love of money is much more obvious than
his love of God. How dare he and the pope say Harry Potter is OK?

Every Christian should be warned and give warning of the spiritual
hazards of the Harry Potter books and movies. These books and
movies, now over 7 million copies, will bring in a flood of
occultism leading to deeper witchcraft. Without repentance God will
bring JUDGMENT upon any nation which does NOT protect its children
from the attacks of Witches, and Occultists. Very few have joined
with the GJiGT to cry against this evil over these past years. Now
we have another Harry Potter movie to train the children to be
witches and wizards for the devil. We are now seeing the Judgment of
God coming as a result of this outrage and the failure of Christians
to stand against this occult assault on the children.

When we see a nation engrossed with occult fantasy, and glorifying
magic of the dark realm of the occult, we know that a great curse
will come upon it. What is wrong with people who have such an
appetite for the Hogwarts school of Witchcraft and Wizzardry? Why
would a nation, whose economy is sick unto death, spend countless
millions of dollars to feed its occult cravings? America is a
bewitched and dying nation, now coming under the Judgment of God.

Is it any wonder why millions of people, especially young people,
have their bodies pierced? There was a time when only the witches
pierced themselves ritualistically. We know that millions of people
have pierced their ears, noses, tongues, navels, eyebrows, and even
the private areas of their bodies. Tattoos are also common, and
without question, it is the work of Satan preparing people to
receive the ultimate "mark of the beast." The masses of people are
now just a quick and easy step from it. Satan and his evil spirits
have found a very willing last generation of people, who are in
direct defiance of the command of Almighty God. Leviticus 19:28 Ye
shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print
any marks upon you: I am the Lord.

The occult world calls these last days, the dawning of the age of
Aquarius. Since the 1960's, we have seen an ever increasing flood of
witchcraft in books, movies, and television programs. Even Queen
Elizabeth has approved a special Harry Potter coin with the Queen's
image on one side and Harry Potter's image on the other side. Most
witches know that the British Isles are considered to be the "holy
land" to witches throughout the entire world. The latter day revival
of witchcraft started in England. The witchcraft quickly spread to
America, where the "Beast" government makes use of the thousands of
covens, or churches of witchcraft. What is most amazing is the
acceptance of occultism by so-called "fundamental Christian
organizations."

David Meyers reported that he had written a letter to Dr. James
Dobson of Focus on the Family and asked him to take a firm stand
against the Harry Potter materials. David received a reply in the
form of a letter and a tape recording of one of Dobson's radio
programs. David had written a tract stating that Dobson's
organization endorsed Harry Potter, based on an article written by
one of Dobson's writers, Lindy Beam, who claimed that a family had
found the Lord through Harry Potter.

That does NOT sound like a Christian standing in OUTRAGE to me. That
sounds outrageously unbelievable. Who will stand to protect the
children from this occult assault on their souls when the so called
BIG Christian Family Organization makes stands like this. I wrote
Focus on the family and asked how they could dare to call themselves
a Christian family organization and NOT stand against the outrage of
teaching young people the occult, witchcraft, and wizardry. I told
themn that one day they will see OUTRAGE when they see the Lord
Jesus Christ for NOT taking a STRONG stand against Harry Potter
occultism.

Lindy Beam had other positive things to say about Harry Potter and
made reference to Chuck Colson's statement, "Harry and his friends
cast spells, read crystal balls, and turn themselves into animals,
but they don't make contact with a supernatural world." In the Focus
on the Family article, Lindy Beam prefaced the Colson statement by
saying, "Well-respected Christian author Chuck Colson explains that
Harry's magic is of an entirely different nature from real-world
witchcraft."

Brethren, mark those men, and give them NO Support. If Chuck Colson
and Jim Dobson do NOT stand in outrage against this Harry Potter
attack on young people, they need to be MARKED as not worthy of
trust or support. They are sold out ministers of the devil.

There is no difference between what is called fantasy witchcraft and
any other forms of witchcraft. It is ALL of the devil. NO GOOD CAN
COME FROM WIZARDRY, OR MAGIC. The idea of good and bad magic makes
no more sense than a good or bad DEVIL. The devil is the enemy of
God. The devil and the ways of the occult are to be resisted and
HATED by every child of God. Jesus told us clearly that the devil
comes ONLY to steal, kill, and destroy.

Initiated witches make heavy use of fantasy, legends, and myths.
That is what invokes the power of evil spirits, as all of it is
wrapped up in ritual.

In the new movie The Prisoner of Azkaban we see Harry even MORE
DEFIANT, and breaking even more rules, than in the previous movies.
Anyone with a right mind would say Harry is a very angry young man.
It is nothing for Harry to sass and talk back to his aunt and uncle.
He casts a spell on his aunt and she blows up like a helium filled
balloon and floats away. When Harry has to deal with turning his
aunt into a human balloon, he is defiant and unrepentant. Harry
says, "She deserved what she got!"

Hermione is getting more defiant and rebellious too. She actually
punches Malfoy and storms out of class. Hermione's behavior is just
as rebellious as and perhaps even more outrageous than Harry's.
Rebellion and insubordination and disobedience are glorified. Rather
than rebellion being shown as bad behavior, it is glorified.

We continue to see, in this movie, the OUTRAGEOUS presentation of
what is called "good magic" and "bad magic." People who KNOW the
truth, also know that there is no such thing as good magic. All
magic is occult, and evil, and of the devil.

The dementors are characterized as the police. They are presented in
this movie as evil, soulless creatures, who would kill anyone, for
virtually no reason. These soulless evil creatures are presented in
this movie, in Rowling's world of witchcraft and wizardry, as some
sort of public servants. These evil soulless characters are the
guards to keep Azkaban secure. These evil soulless people are
supposed to keep the "really bad" prisoners inside away from the
good people outside.

This is not good. Clear disrespect, and disdain for authority, is
taught by the entire movie. This movie has NO LIGHT IN IT. When
darkness is fought with evil and darkness, there can be NO winners
and there can be no light, when darkness and evil is pitted against
darkness and evil.

1 John 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and
declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at
all.
1 John 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in
darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
1 John 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we
have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his
Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Shalom & Simcha,
Jim Searcy



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matthew 24:24-25 (NRSV)
24 For false messiahsf and false prophets will appear and produce
great signs and omens, to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. 25
Take note, I have told you beforehand
Post by martus
WITCHES AND THEIR LIKE
Cackle now, cry later in despair for their is no salvation in Hell.
THOSE WHO PRACTISE WITCHCRAFT ANGER GOD
2 Chronicles 33:5-7 (NRSV)
5 He built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the
house of the Lord . 6 He made his son pass through fire in the valley
of the son of Hinnom, practiced soothsaying and augury and sorcery,
and dealt with mediums and with wizards. He did much evil in the sight
of the Lord , provoking him to anger.
WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD
Galatians 5:19
19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery,
fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft,
hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelling, and such like: of the
which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that
they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.
GET THEIR POWER FROM THE DEMONS
Acts 16:16
16 One day as we were going down to the place of prayer, we met a
demon-possessed slave girl. She was a fortune-teller who earned a lot
of money for her masters. 17 She followed along behind us shouting,
These
men are servants of the Most High God, and they have come to tell you
how
to be saved.18 This went on day after day until Paul got so
exasperated that
he turned and spoke to the demon within her. I command you in the
name of
Jesus Christ to come out of her, he said. And instantly it left
her.19 Her masters
hopes of wealth were now shattered, so they grabbed Paul and Silas
and
dragged them before the authorities at the marketplace
ARE THE DEVIL'S PERVERTING CHILDREN
Acts 13:6
8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for that is what his name means) opposed
them and tried to turn the proconsul from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who
was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked straight at
Elymas and said, 10 ;You are a child of the devil and an enemy
of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and
trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?
GOD OR THE DEVIL: NO MIDDLE GROUND, YOUR CHOICE!!
20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they
sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should
have fellowship with devils. 21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord,
and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's
table, and of the table of devils. 22Do we provoke the Lord to
jealousy? are we stronger than he?
ULTIMATE FATE OF THOSE THAT PRACTICE
WITCHCRAFT/OCCULT-
LAKE OF FIRE
Revelation 21
8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the
sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all
liars-their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This
is
the second death."
Matthew 25
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Varicose Brain
2004-06-13 14:43:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
Dear Friends –
There are some things that every child of God should know about
Harry Potter, and the latest movie, The Prisoner of Azkaban.
<snip>

The only thing they need to know is that it's a work of fiction. Get
over it!
Daryl S. Kabatoff
2004-06-13 16:42:58 UTC
Permalink
Here in Saskatchewan the little wizard kids are taught to turn
evergreen trees into decorated idols, the Bible documents that
the evergreen tree has been worshipped for centuries (Deuteronomy
12:2; 1 Kings 14:23; 2 Kings 16:4, 17:10; 2 Chronicles 28:4; Isaiah 57:5;
Jeremiah 2:20, 3:6, 3:13, 10:3-4, 17:2 and Ezekiel 6:13.), it is because
it remains green throughout the year and so is viewed as a symbol
of fertility. Here in Saskatchewan the parents take their little
wizard kids to churches that are capped with Egyptian obelisks,
these are representations of penises, the ancient Egyptians
worshipped the penis for their believed it to have a god-like force
through it's reproductive role. The churches are run by witches
who teach the little wizard kids that God's Commandments are
finished, that they are now saved by grace alone, and so can
pretend to be little wizards. And here in Saskatchewan when
God smites one of the little wizard kids, the parents run obituaries
in the paper stating that their kids are now in heaven, and are also
floating around them here on earth, doink what the little spirits
are supposed to be doink. It was Protestants and Catholics that
lobbied my abusive parents to have me arrested and "treated",
the kids of these Protestants and Catholics never cared that I was
being repeatedly arrested and tortured in psychiatric facilities,
and now care little that the arrests and torture have finally ceased.
Here in Saskatchewan I tried to warn people that the schools
and churches were teaching lies, people just don't want to hear
from me, they want to hear the lies. It was a horror show what
the psychiatrists did to me, I begged for years for assistance
to flee the country, after many years of psychiatric torture at the
U of S, I finally found internet access at the U of S and posted
a story written in a humorous way so as to try to get people to
be aware that I was stripped of my rights. My abusive mother
would force her choice of clothes upon me and then have me
arrested and tortured if I dared to tell her to piss off with these
clothes, then she would come to the psychiatric ward and bring
clothes for me there, and tell me how much better I was now
that I was being drugged to the point that my head was pounding
in pain for months at a time. Anyway, God is smiting your
nations, God is smiting your children, God is shortening your
lives, God is involved in removal of your forests and fish,
how I rejoice when I see your children in the obituaries, for
I see this as an answer to my prayers. The people who are
caught up in the deceptions have no compassion for me, but
the people who know better think themselves above me so
that they don't have to welcome me when I arrive to their
church, they don't have to baptise me and make me a member
of their church, and if I dare to criticize the writings of Ellen
White, then I am only worthy of being punched in the head
at a Seventh Day Adventist Church Bible study, and then
worthy of being arrested and returned for 6 weeks of detention
in a psychiatric ward (at the end of 6 weeks I am given one
final injection and the drugs remain in my body for months
after my release). Anyway, Martus opens the following essay
with "Dear Friends", but you people are not friends at all. You
are enemies of God's, you are enemies of mine, you people
are compassionless pieces of dung and I pray to God to
terminate your lives and the lives of your ignorant wizard
children. You people have billions of dollars to spend
annually on turning trees into idols, you people have millions
of dollars to arrest and torture me in an attempt to make me
shut up about your filthy churches, and not one of you has
the compassion to pay me even minimum wage for my work
so that I could attempt to flee Canada on my own dime. You
teach your kids to bow to trees that are turned into decorated
idols and to attend churches capped with penises, you teach
your kids to be compassionless to me when I dared to point
out the error of your theology, it is good that your kids
reject your other advise and now walk to their dooms with
Harry Potter. I don't really care any more about you and your
children, I only want to get out of Canada, it was brutal what
they did to me here and they did it to me year after year,
and year after year you people close your hearts to me
and to God's Word and collectively spend billions of dollars
turning trees into decorated idols. You people make such
a big affair out of the kids spending hundreds of millions
of dollars on Harry Potter witchcraft, but you turn around
and spend so much more on turning trees into decorated
idols. They tortured me year after year after year after year
after year after year after year, I lost my summers here in
cold Saskatchewan, I lost summer after summer after summer
after summer after summer to psychiatric torture, and you
filthy God-damned pieces of shit continue to close your hearts
are now trying to raise money for aircraft for your churches.
May God slam your aircraft into the runways when they
come in to land. -Daryl S. Kabatoff
Dear Friends -
There are some things that every child of God should know about
Harry Potter, and the latest movie, The Prisoner of Azkaban.
When thou art come into the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee,
thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or
his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or
an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, or a charmer, or
a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
For all that do these things are an abomination unto the Lord: and
because of these abominations the Lord thy God doth drive them out
from before thee. Deuteronomy 18:9-12
And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar
spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a
people seek unto their God? For the living to the dead? And they
shall look unto the earth; and behold trouble and darkness, dimness
of anguish; and they shall be driven to darkness. Isaiah 8:19, 22
And many that believed came, and confessed, and shewed their deeds.
Many of them also which used curious arts brought their books
together, and burned them before all men: and they counted the price
of them, and found it fifty thousand pieces of silver. So mightily
grew the word of God and prevailed. Acts 19:18-20
How is it that every so-called Christian man, is NOT CRYING ALOUD IN
RIGHTEOUS INDIGNATION that the children of our nation are being
taught witchcraft,and sorcery,and wizardry by the Harry Potter
series of books and movies? Part of the problem is the so-called
Christian leadership, who in reality, become champions of Satan when
they would dare to make excuses for the books and movies and say
Harry Potter is OK. How dare any so-called minister NOT cry aloud
against the outrage of Harry Potter? My blood boils at the very idea
that such books and movies training and glorifying witchcraft,
wizardry, and sorcery are allowed openly. YES, WE SHOULD BE VERY
OUTRAGED. The target of these Satanic masterpieces of the crafts of
HELL are the young people.
Young people rightly should expect their parents, teachers, and
ministers, to protect them from such attacks on their soul. Yet, the
sad truth today is that teachers, and even so-called Christian
ministers, are promoting this Harry Potter occult attack on the
souls of young people. So-called Christian ministers who FAIL to
take an OUTRAGED and bold stand AGAINST this Harry Potter occult
training will not stand in the day of Judgment.
Mat 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which
believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged
about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mark 9:42-46 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones
that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were
hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. And if thy
hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into
life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire
that never shall be quenched: Where their worm dieth not, and the
fire is not quenched. And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is
better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be
cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where
their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
What is the matter with so-called Christians who do not warn of the
grave dangers of witchcraft and occultism? How can so-called
Christians, like Dr. James Dobson, NOT CRY ALOUD IN OUTRAGE about
the witchcraft and sorcery training and glorification of rebellion
against God in the Harry Potter series? Jim Dobson should be
ashamed, and taken to task, for his OUTRAGEOUS FAILURE to speak
against this outrage. His love of money is much more obvious than
his love of God. How dare he and the pope say Harry Potter is OK?
Every Christian should be warned and give warning of the spiritual
hazards of the Harry Potter books and movies. These books and
movies, now over 7 million copies, will bring in a flood of
occultism leading to deeper witchcraft. Without repentance God will
bring JUDGMENT upon any nation which does NOT protect its children
from the attacks of Witches, and Occultists. Very few have joined
with the GJiGT to cry against this evil over these past years. Now
we have another Harry Potter movie to train the children to be
witches and wizards for the devil. We are now seeing the Judgment of
God coming as a result of this outrage and the failure of Christians
to stand against this occult assault on the children.
When we see a nation engrossed with occult fantasy, and glorifying
magic of the dark realm of the occult, we know that a great curse
will come upon it. What is wrong with people who have such an
appetite for the Hogwarts school of Witchcraft and Wizzardry? Why
would a nation, whose economy is sick unto death, spend countless
millions of dollars to feed its occult cravings? America is a
bewitched and dying nation, now coming under the Judgment of God.
Is it any wonder why millions of people, especially young people,
have their bodies pierced? There was a time when only the witches
pierced themselves ritualistically. We know that millions of people
have pierced their ears, noses, tongues, navels, eyebrows, and even
the private areas of their bodies. Tattoos are also common, and
without question, it is the work of Satan preparing people to
receive the ultimate "mark of the beast." The masses of people are
now just a quick and easy step from it. Satan and his evil spirits
have found a very willing last generation of people, who are in
direct defiance of the command of Almighty God. Leviticus 19:28 Ye
shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print
any marks upon you: I am the Lord.
The occult world calls these last days, the dawning of the age of
Aquarius. Since the 1960's, we have seen an ever increasing flood of
witchcraft in books, movies, and television programs. Even Queen
Elizabeth has approved a special Harry Potter coin with the Queen's
image on one side and Harry Potter's image on the other side. Most
witches know that the British Isles are considered to be the "holy
land" to witches throughout the entire world. The latter day revival
of witchcraft started in England. The witchcraft quickly spread to
America, where the "Beast" government makes use of the thousands of
covens, or churches of witchcraft. What is most amazing is the
acceptance of occultism by so-called "fundamental Christian
organizations."
David Meyers reported that he had written a letter to Dr. James
Dobson of Focus on the Family and asked him to take a firm stand
against the Harry Potter materials. David received a reply in the
form of a letter and a tape recording of one of Dobson's radio
programs. David had written a tract stating that Dobson's
organization endorsed Harry Potter, based on an article written by
one of Dobson's writers, Lindy Beam, who claimed that a family had
found the Lord through Harry Potter.
That does NOT sound like a Christian standing in OUTRAGE to me. That
sounds outrageously unbelievable. Who will stand to protect the
children from this occult assault on their souls when the so called
Focus on the family and asked how they could dare to call themselves
a Christian family organization and NOT stand against the outrage of
teaching young people the occult, witchcraft, and wizardry. I told
themn that one day they will see OUTRAGE when they see the Lord
Jesus Christ for NOT taking a STRONG stand against Harry Potter
occultism.
Lindy Beam had other positive things to say about Harry Potter and
made reference to Chuck Colson's statement, "Harry and his friends
cast spells, read crystal balls, and turn themselves into animals,
but they don't make contact with a supernatural world." In the Focus
on the Family article, Lindy Beam prefaced the Colson statement by
saying, "Well-respected Christian author Chuck Colson explains that
Harry's magic is of an entirely different nature from real-world
witchcraft."
Brethren, mark those men, and give them NO Support. If Chuck Colson
and Jim Dobson do NOT stand in outrage against this Harry Potter
attack on young people, they need to be MARKED as not worthy of
trust or support. They are sold out ministers of the devil.
There is no difference between what is called fantasy witchcraft and
any other forms of witchcraft. It is ALL of the devil. NO GOOD CAN
COME FROM WIZARDRY, OR MAGIC. The idea of good and bad magic makes
no more sense than a good or bad DEVIL. The devil is the enemy of
God. The devil and the ways of the occult are to be resisted and
HATED by every child of God. Jesus told us clearly that the devil
comes ONLY to steal, kill, and destroy.
Initiated witches make heavy use of fantasy, legends, and myths.
That is what invokes the power of evil spirits, as all of it is
wrapped up in ritual.
In the new movie The Prisoner of Azkaban we see Harry even MORE
DEFIANT, and breaking even more rules, than in the previous movies.
Anyone with a right mind would say Harry is a very angry young man.
It is nothing for Harry to sass and talk back to his aunt and uncle.
He casts a spell on his aunt and she blows up like a helium filled
balloon and floats away. When Harry has to deal with turning his
aunt into a human balloon, he is defiant and unrepentant. Harry
says, "She deserved what she got!"
Hermione is getting more defiant and rebellious too. She actually
punches Malfoy and storms out of class. Hermione's behavior is just
as rebellious as and perhaps even more outrageous than Harry's.
Rebellion and insubordination and disobedience are glorified. Rather
than rebellion being shown as bad behavior, it is glorified.
We continue to see, in this movie, the OUTRAGEOUS presentation of
what is called "good magic" and "bad magic." People who KNOW the
truth, also know that there is no such thing as good magic. All
magic is occult, and evil, and of the devil.
The dementors are characterized as the police. They are presented in
this movie as evil, soulless creatures, who would kill anyone, for
virtually no reason. These soulless evil creatures are presented in
this movie, in Rowling's world of witchcraft and wizardry, as some
sort of public servants. These evil soulless characters are the
guards to keep Azkaban secure. These evil soulless people are
supposed to keep the "really bad" prisoners inside away from the
good people outside.
This is not good. Clear disrespect, and disdain for authority, is
taught by the entire movie. This movie has NO LIGHT IN IT. When
darkness is fought with evil and darkness, there can be NO winners
and there can be no light, when darkness and evil is pitted against
darkness and evil.
1 John 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and
declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at
all.
1 John 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in
1 John 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we
have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his
Son cleanseth us from all sin.
Shalom & Simcha,
Jim Searcy
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
Matthew 24:24-25 (NRSV)
24 For false messiahsf and false prophets will appear and produce
great signs and omens, to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. 25
Take note, I have told you beforehand
Post by martus
WITCHES AND THEIR LIKE
Cackle now, cry later in despair for their is no salvation in Hell.
THOSE WHO PRACTISE WITCHCRAFT ANGER GOD
2 Chronicles 33:5-7 (NRSV)
5 He built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the
house of the Lord . 6 He made his son pass through fire in the valley
of the son of Hinnom, practiced soothsaying and augury and sorcery,
and dealt with mediums and with wizards. He did much evil in the sight
of the Lord , provoking him to anger.
WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD
Galatians 5:19
19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery,
fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft,
hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelling, and such like: of the
which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that
they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.
GET THEIR POWER FROM THE DEMONS
Acts 16:16
16 One day as we were going down to the place of prayer, we met a
demon-possessed slave girl. She was a fortune-teller who earned a lot
of money for her masters. 17 She followed along behind us shouting,
These
men are servants of the Most High God, and they have come to tell you
how
to be saved.18 This went on day after day until Paul got so
exasperated that
he turned and spoke to the demon within her. I command you in the
name of
Jesus Christ to come out of her, he said. And instantly it left
her.19 Her masters
hopes of wealth were now shattered, so they grabbed Paul and Silas
and
dragged them before the authorities at the marketplace
ARE THE DEVIL'S PERVERTING CHILDREN
Acts 13:6
8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for that is what his name means) opposed
them and tried to turn the proconsul from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who
was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked straight at
Elymas and said, 10 ;You are a child of the devil and an enemy
of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and
trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?
GOD OR THE DEVIL: NO MIDDLE GROUND, YOUR CHOICE!!
20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they
sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should
have fellowship with devils. 21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord,
and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's
table, and of the table of devils. 22Do we provoke the Lord to
jealousy? are we stronger than he?
ULTIMATE FATE OF THOSE THAT PRACTICE
WITCHCRAFT/OCCULT-
LAKE OF FIRE
Revelation 21
8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the
sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all
liars-their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This
is
the second death."
Matthew 25
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Thomas®
2004-06-13 21:11:46 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 16:42:58 GMT, "Daryl S. Kabatoff"
Post by Daryl S. Kabatoff
I lost summer after summer after summer
after summer after summer to psychiatric torture, and you
filthy God-damned pieces of shit continue to close your hearts
are now trying to raise money for aircraft for your churches.
May God slam your aircraft into the runways when they
come in to land. -Daryl S. Kabatoff-Documented pedophile/stalker
and famous penis worshiper.
<<<snipped a lot of psycho crap from Shawn "pedophile-boy" Kabatoff>>>


The following (courtesy of Waxy.org) is sort of an unofficial "FAQ"
explaining the psychotic nonsense posted to Usenet by Shawn Daryl
Kabatoff AKA "Dar", AKA "Probababbilities". And now AKA "marcia and
me".

WARNING: Read below before even thinking about responding to this
twit.

http://www.waxy.org/archive/2002/05/21/dar_kaba.shtml#000643


Usenet has the tendency to provide a public forum for those who would
normally be scribbling in a closet. For example, take Daryl "Shawn"
Kabatoff. For the last few years, he's methodically gathered
"statistics" from various sources, ranging from local newspaper
obituary pages to the food court of the Saskatoon Midtown Plaza mall.
With all the raw data he's collected, he's attempting to prove daily
that our full names are in "mathematical harmony" with our birthdays.
His rants normally focus on a single individual he's met or read
about, starting with calculations related to their birthdate and full
names, blending in whatever other personal information about their
family members, spouses, birthplace, and career he's been able to
glean. From there, it descends into a mix of numerology, religious
zealotry, and personal torment. I've never seen anything like it.
With all the prime numbers, Fibonacci sequences and biblical
references, it's like reading the notebooks of Maximillian Cohen and
John Nash combined. Unsurprisingly, several posts unfold to reveal a
history of painful mental illness. If you have some time, take a look.
I've detailed his posting history and a several sample posts below.

Usenet Posting History:

January 27, 1999 to July 5, 2000 as ***@home.com

December 9, 2000 to May 4, 2001 as ***@sk.sympatico.ca

Oct 30, 2001 to Oct 31, 2001 as ***@the.link.ca

January 20, 2002 to April 17, 2002 as ***@hotmail.com (original
posts have been

removed from Google Groups archive)

April 26, 2002 to Present as ***@hotmail.com

Selected Posts:
Tessa Lynne Smith
Dastageer Sakhizai and Helen Smith
Brett David Maki
Andrew Meredith Cotton
Kathryn Lee Hipperson
Amanda Dawn Newton
Mona Marie Etcheverry
Tony Peter Nuspl
Lisa Charlene McMillan
Grant Allyn Wood

Comments
scarier still is that saskatoon is my hometown, though not my current
residence. and every single place he's mentioned in his posts (most
notably nervous harold's and the roastary) were either places i've
been (as it's a small city of 200K) or hangouts, ie. the two places
mentioned. chances are i could email some friends back home and find
out if they know of him, they (my friends that is) being of the
broadway-centred slacker ilk. myself, too, until i got out of there.
eh, anyways. thought it odd to see all this. midtown mall. i ate my
meals there, whilst waiting several days in line for star wars episode
one, at the theatre across the street.
posted by andy raad on May 22, 2002 06:20 PM

Fascinating. It's like he's trying to take chaos and bind it into
whatever rules he can find, religious, logical and otherwise. Numbers
and math have a reliable pattern, something that can always be proven
to true or false. People and religion do not. It reminds me of Darren
Aronofsky's movie Pi. It's the story of an paraniod genius who is
trying to find a pattern in Pi. A group that takes interest in his
work is convinced that the existence of Pi, a number whose existence
can be proven but no quantified, is proof of the existence of God.
Kabatoff's hunt for patterns in something as random as name selection
is a way to reconcile his deeply logical thought process with his
conflicting religious views.
posted by matt on May 23, 2002 11:19 AM

Exactly. I probably shouldn't have, but I e-mailed Daryl yesterday,
asking him if he'd be willing to create a numerological analysis for
me. I also asked him if he had seen either Pi or A Beautiful Mind, and
what he thought of them. If he replies, I'll be sure to post it.
posted by Andy Baio on May 23, 2002 11:24 AM

I baked many pumpkin pies for Shawn (he likes pumpkin pies). I rubbed
pumpkin pie all over my breasts for him, and my breasts turned orange.
I am a pumpkin for Shawn.
posted by Trisha Blondie on July 24, 2002 10:41 PM

Um, that's swell. So, you're in love with him?
posted by Andy Baio on July 25, 2002 07:10 AM

Shawn once went to a funeral for a Jehovah Witness that shot himself
and the lemon tarts were very bad, they were not only sour but were
rubbery as well. Shawn said that the guy was some kind of Jehovah
Witness prophet, he saw in advance that the lemon tarts at his funeral
were to be very very bad, and so he shot himself. Shawn said that he
never ate pumpkin pie at a funeral but would like to some day. Shawn
likes pumpkin pie and so I have been practicing to make very good
pumpkin pies.
posted by Trisha Blondie on July 25, 2002 02:49 PM

Shawn said that the lemon tarts were sour, bitter and rubbery.
posted by Trisha Blondie on July 30, 2002 12:32 AM

I don't think this guy takes notes. I think he has Total Recall, and
it has driven him insane...
posted by Todd Smith on December 26, 2002 11:00 AM

Oh... I almost forgot... I didnt spend thousands of dollars a day
tormenting Daryl... We got a deal on tormenting that fiscal year, it
only came to about 37cents a day....
posted by Dr Claw on December 30, 2002 01:56 AM

Mr. Kabatoff attempts to portray himself as a victim, but in fact he
is a violent predatory pedophile who is well known to his local law
enforcement. In his post to multiple newsgroups with the subject
"Collecting Mail For The Coming Anti-Christ", he encourages mothers to
send him photos of their naked daughters. Mr Kabatoff explains, "I
personally did not want photographs being mailed to (the coming
Ant-Christ) that were of underage children unless the parent was
signing consent." He is banned from virtually all the shopping malls
in his community because he stalks young people and sexually harasses
them. He has an extensive arrest record which includes sexual
molestation charges. He's been hospitalized in mental institutions
several times because he likes to accost "nubile cuties." He writes
about his contact with young girls in many posts. Search newsgroup
archives for posts by him containing the word "nubile". As part of his
harrassment, he provides personal details in a public forum, such as
the real names of real children, in these and other posts. About one
girl he met at a mall, he writes, "I wanted Callie in my bed or I
wanted her and her sister dead."
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=Daryl+Shawn+Kabatoff+dead+or+in+my+bed&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=asqm35%24tjq5j%241%40ID-136124.news.dfncis.de&rnu
He not only curses children and prays for their death in his posts, he
also enjoys attending the funerals of young people: "And so, since
nubile sweeties are found in greatest abundance at the funerals of
high school students, then it is the funerals of high school students
that make the very very best funerals, especially if there is food...
I stuff my face (and my pockets) with all the good food and look at
all the pretty nubile sweeties and have the time of my life..
.http://groups.google.com/groups?q=Daryl+Shawn+Kabatoff+nubile+sex&hl=en&l
r=&ie=UTF-8&scoring=d&selm=LfXN8.63042%24R53.25142039%40twister.socal.rr.
com&rnum=1
Many of his posts are sent to alt.teens.advice. However, he liberally
spams, floods and crossposts his off-topic threatening and offensive
missives to countless newsgroups. Some people HAVE problems and some
folks ARE problems. Don't dismiss Mr. Kabatoff as a harmless nut. When
he sends these posts to any newgroup, please help by reporting him to
his ISP. Thanks.
posted by nospam on January 5, 2003 04:39 AM

I knew of him when I was attending the University of Saskatchewan.
He'd hang out in the Arts computer lab and all you'd see is screens of
numbers racing by on his laptop. I have an original copy of his
"Collecting Mail for the Coming Anti-Christ" pamphlet, and have seen
him be hauled away by campus security on more than one occasion. My
friends and I refer to him as "Crazy Number Man".
posted by Mr. Somebody on April 10, 2003 11:09 AM

I've been posting to (and about) Shawn for over two years with big
gaps in between. He has seen Pi and didn't like it and didn't think it
resembled him at all. (Wrong, it fits him to a tee) He doesn't have
total recall and has stated that he travels with a lap top to notate
items. Also, he uses "cut n' paste" a lot if you read all the way
through his ramblings. He is anti-social as shown by his angry
statements towards those who, by his own admission, have been kind
(but not kind enough) to him. Still, he's intelligent and seems to be
able to "take a joke" on occassion. That's where I came in.
posted by Gambol on May 19, 2003 02:22



ALOHA

Reply to group
(Unsolicited e-mail is deleted from the server unread
if it comes from anyone not already in my addressbook.
I'll never even see it)
bluskie
2004-06-13 18:53:35 UTC
Permalink
***@hotmail.com (martus) wrote in message news:<***@posting.google.com>...

KOOK! ALERT!
Post by martus
There are some things that every child of God should know about
Harry Potter, and the latest movie, The Prisoner of Azkaban.
Young people rightly should expect their parents, teachers, and
ministers, to protect them from such attacks on their soul. Yet, the
sad truth today is that teachers, and even so-called Christian
ministers, are promoting this Harry Potter occult attack on the
souls of young people. So-called Christian ministers who FAIL to
take an OUTRAGED and bold stand AGAINST this Harry Potter occult
training will not stand in the day of Judgment.
What is the matter with so-called Christians who do not warn of the
grave dangers of witchcraft and occultism? How can so-called
Christians, like Dr. James Dobson, NOT CRY ALOUD IN OUTRAGE about
the witchcraft and sorcery training and glorification of rebellion
against God in the Harry Potter series?
Every Christian should be warned and give warning of the spiritual
hazards of the Harry Potter books and movies.
Robert D. De Mars
2004-06-14 02:20:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by bluskie
KOOK! ALERT!
Acknowledged......Over...
Post by bluskie
Post by martus
There are some things that every child of God should know about
Harry Potter, and the latest movie, The Prisoner of Azkaban.
Young people rightly should expect their parents, teachers, and
ministers, to protect them from such attacks on their soul. Yet, the
sad truth today is that teachers, and even so-called Christian
ministers, are promoting this Harry Potter occult attack on the
souls of young people. So-called Christian ministers who FAIL to
take an OUTRAGED and bold stand AGAINST this Harry Potter occult
training will not stand in the day of Judgment.
What is the matter with so-called Christians who do not warn of the
grave dangers of witchcraft and occultism? How can so-called
Christians, like Dr. James Dobson, NOT CRY ALOUD IN OUTRAGE about
the witchcraft and sorcery training and glorification of rebellion
against God in the Harry Potter series?
Every Christian should be warned and give warning of the spiritual
hazards of the Harry Potter books and movies.
--
===========================
http://b-o-b.homelinux.com
Long 93:18W Lat 45:09N
===========================
martus
2004-06-13 09:17:44 UTC
Permalink
Church Not Taking Devil Seriously, Exorcist Warns
Saturday, June 12, 2004 12:00:00 AM GMT


The chief exorcist of Rome has warned that the Church is not
sufficiently conscious of the devil.

"The devil is extremely satisfied, because he is at liberty to do his
work," said Father Gabriel Amorth.

Speaking to the Italian daily L'Espresso, Father Amorth took note of
an alarming rise in Satanic practices throughout Italy, and offered
some sharp criticism of Church leaders for failing to warn against the
devil's influence.

"The Church has gone from one excess to another," he said. "To
compensate for the madness of witch-hunting-- in which people were
burned when they should have been exorcised-- we have completely
eliminated the devil and exorcism." He noted with regret that "entire
Catholic regions do not have a single exorcist," naming Spain,
Portugal, Germany, Austria, and Switzerland. In Italy, on the other
hand, there are 160 priests formally charged to act as exorcists, he
reported.

Father Amorth, who has become the world's most famous exorcist by
writing about the practice and the devil's influence, spoke to
L'Espresso about a scandal that has emerged in Italy recently, with
the discovery of the bodies of two adolescents who were apparently
tortured and killed some time ago. The two young people were both
members of a Satanic group, the "Beasts of Satan;" they had been
reported missing in January 1998.

Father Amorth, who has been the official exorcist of the Rome diocese
since 1986 and is now 80, reminded L'Espresso that, as he has reported
in the past, Pope John Paul II (bio - news) has personally performed
at least three exorcisms during his pontificate, of which two were
completely successful.

(The Pope, like any bishop, has the power to perform exorcisms. He has
used that power, in a fashion known to the public, at least three
times: in 1978, at the request of a Roman exorcist at St. John Lateran
basilica; in 1982, for a woman brought to him by the Bishop of
Spoleto, Italy; and in 2002, after a teenage girl exploded in a
furious display of unnatural rage during a public audience.)

However he charged that despite the Pope's clear belief in the reality
of demonic possession, the Roman Curia have been slow to respond to
that reality. "It's been a long time since anyone studied these
subjects in the seminary: angels, devils, exorcisms, or even sins
against the First Commandment." These sins, he said, would include the
use of "magic, spiritualism, and Satanism." In 1999, the Vatican
released a new approved ritual for exorcism, De Exorcismis et
Supplicationibus Quibusdam. Father Amorth said that the revised ritual
is "a disaster for us exorcists." The new ritual, he continued,
prevents the priest from proceeding with an exorcism "unless he is
certain about the condition of a diabolical possession, which is
something that you can only ascertain in the process" of an exorcism.
He explained that once an exorcism is begun, the devil often manifests
his presence by a "visceral and extremely violent aversion to all that
is sacred." That reaction can be shown, he added, through "talking in
unknown languages, the explosion of a superhuman force, levitation,
revealed during the exorcisms." Fortunately, he said, the old ritual
of exorcism remains valid, and can be used rather than the more
limited new form.

Father Amorth cautioned that diabolical possession is by no means the
only evidence of the devil's existence. "Satan is always at work, in
an ordinary way, doing all he can to make man sin," he said. But he
added that there are some special cases in which the devil uses his
power in a special way, known as possession.

Demonic possession is actually quite rare, the Italian priest said. In
most cases, an individual who is brought to consult with an exorcist
suffers from psychological rather than spiritual difficulties.
However, he noted that some people appear to become possessed after
entering a Satanic cult.

Father Amorth noted that only individuals who regret their involvement
with Satanic cults ever consult an exorcist. Thus there is no way to
know how many active members of the cults might also be possessed. The
exorcist offered a chilling reminder: "While it is easy to enter into
these Satanic cults, it is extremely difficult to get out." He warned
that those who enter the cults are quite literally risking their
lives.

There are two types of Satanism, Father Amorth said. In the "high"
cult, members adore the devil, perform Black Masses, and follow a
hierarchy of cultic leaders. The "low" form of Satanism might appeal
to people who do not believe in the existence of a devil, but can be
persuaded to engage in obscene and unnatural acts. Father Amorth
argues that this second form is more dangerous, because it is far more
widespread; he said that the "low" cult has penetrated into the drug
culture, heavy-metal music, the "gothic" cult, and the internet.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-13 09:41:30 UTC
Permalink
The Techno Sapiens Are Coming
When God fashioned man and woman, he called his creation very good.
Transhumanists say that, by manipulating our bodies with microscopic
tools, we can do better. Are we ready for the great debate?
By C. Christopher Hook | posted 12/19/2003


Eradicate cancer. Retain and recall everything you can find on the
Internet. Give your child a high IQ. Drastically reduce fatalities of
U.S. soldiers involved in wars. Give sight to the blind. * Soon, you
won't have to be God to fulfill this wish list. But you may not be
human, either. * Such is the promise and peril of nanotechnology.
First defined by engineer and scientist K. Eric Drexler in the '80s
and '90s, nanotechnology uses tools that operate on the "nano" scale.
A nanometer is one billionth of a meter in length. The DNA molecule is
2.3 nanometers wide. * Nanotechnology, then, deals with the
manipulation of matter at the atomic or molecular level. * While an
average layperson may have seen some depictions of this technology,
few know what its current and future applications are. Fewer yet can
wrap their minds around nanotechnology's ethical implications.

Nanotechnology is developing in two ways. The "top-down" approach
creates microscopic machines or delivery systems. The "bottom up"
approach harnesses the biological world. For example, the ribosome,
present in every cell, is an amazing nanoscale factory—it takes RNA, a
long strand of translated genetic information, and turns it into a
protein that can then serve as an enzyme. In either case,
nanotechnology makes the stuff of miracles possible.

Oncologists use a biological nanomachine—antibodies attached to
ball-shaped molecules—to deliver the radiation drug Zevalin to the
cells specifically affected by lymphoma, which saves healthy tissue
from exposure to radiation.

Wired magazine reported in September 2002 that the Dobelle bionic eye
system enables the blind to see. And Optobionics Corporation in
Naperville, Illinois, has so far successfully tested its artificial
silicon retina—a 2 millimeter-wide chip with 5,000 photodiodes—on
patients with damaged retinal cells.

In my practice as a hematologist, I may soon deal with bioengineered
blood cells. They could serve as a blood alternative to carry oxygen,
and help us avoid many risks and liabilities of blood transfusions.

Other future applications include devices that would: (1) generate and
lay down new connective tissue to heal arthritic joints and torn
ligaments; (2) dissolve plaque in heart and brain blood vessels; (3)
manufacture and deliver certain drugs in the body, such as insulin;
and (4) replace or repair damaged brain cells in people with disorders
such as Parkinson's or Alzheimer's disease.

When you combine nanotechnology with cyborg technology (interfacing
living nervous tissue with electronic devices), the results are
breathtaking. Researchers in Georgia are helping people stricken with
a horrible disorder called the locked-in syndrome. Its sufferers
appear to be in a persistent vegetative state, but are in fact
completely aware of their surroundings. Via electrodes implanted near
the motor regions of these patients' brains, they have been taught to
control the cursor on a computer screen by their thoughts. This means
they essentially type with their thoughts, and thus can communicate
with others.

It's not hard to imagine that such tools will move beyond therapy into
augmentation, or enhancement, of "normal" individuals—or what is more
objectively called "bioengineering."

Direct neural interfacing with computer systems would be attractive to
people who need to have access to lots of information. Centers such as
MIT, Stanford, and the University of Toronto have programs in
developing "wearable computers," devices that seamlessly become part
of our day-to-day apparel, yet allow 24/7 connection to the Internet
and other computer databases. The interface uses optical projectors in
specially engineered glasses, and a small handheld module. Hitachi and
Charmed Technologies are already marketing such devices. We're very
close to taking the ultimate step toward "seamless" interfacing by
direct brain implants.

Astronomer and physicist Robert Jastrow, for example, envisions this
in his 1983 book The Enchanted Loom: "A bold scientist will be able to
tap the contents of his mind and transfer them into the metallic
lattices of a computer… . It can be said that this scientist has
entered the computer and now dwells in it. At last the human brain,
ensconced in a computer, has been liberated from the weakness of the
mortal flesh… . It is in control of its own destiny … housed in
indestructible lattices of silicone, and no longer constrained in its
span of years … such a life could live forever." Well, at least as
long as one can supply the needed batteries or power.

Many scholars are anticipating cyborg and nanotech enhancements as
means of forestalling aging, or even pursuing immortality. The
possibilities belong mostly in the realm of science fiction right now,
but they seem less and less improbable as the years go by.

Join the Dinosaurs!
The ethical implications of nanotechnology are great, but even more
troubling is the philosophy of some of its proponents, who subscribe
to transhumanism. This is the belief that someday we will re-engineer
our natures to such an extent that a posthuman species, or several new
species, will be created that are "superior" to homo sapiens.

That we are biological creatures is simply our current status,
transhumanists believe, but it is not necessary for defining who we
are or who we should be. Bart Kosko, a professor of electrical
engineering at the University of Southern California, puts it more
bluntly in his book Heaven in a Chip (2002): "Biology is not destiny.
It was never more than tendency. It was just nature's first quick and
dirty way to compute with meat. Chips are destiny."

British roboticist Kevin Warwick put it this way: "I was born human.
But this was an accident of fate—a condition merely of time and
place." This sounds startingly reminiscent of what nihilist Frederick
Nietzsche wrote in Thus Spake Zarathustra: "I teach you the overman.
Man is something to be overcome."

Transhumanism is in some ways a new incarnation of gnosticism. It sees
the body as simply the first prosthesis we all learn to manipulate. As
Christians, we have long rejected the gnostic claims that the human
body is evil. Embodiment is fundamental to our identity, designed by
God, and sanctified by the Incarnation and bodily resurrection of our
Lord. Unlike gnostics, transhumanists reject the notion of the soul
and substitute for it the idea of an information pattern.

Katherine Hayles, a professor of English at the University of
California, Los Angeles, says in How We Became Posthuman (1999) that
"in the posthuman, there are no essential differences, or absolute
demarcations, between bodily existence and computer simulation,
cybernetic mechanism and biological organism, robot technology and
human goals." She concludes her book with a warning: "Humans can
either go gently into that good night, joining the dinosaurs as a
species that once ruled the earth but is now obsolete, or hang on for
a while longer by becoming machines themselves. In either case … the
age of the human is drawing to a close."

Are these ideas the musings of a small band of harmless techno geeks?
Unfortunately not. Two summers ago, the National Science Foundation,
the National Science and Technology Council, and the Department of
Commerce published the proceedings of a December 2001 conference on
"Converging Technologies for Improving Human Performance." This
seminal document is a manifesto for government sponsorship of
nanotechnology, biotechnology, information technology, and cognitive
science/cybernetics to enhance human beings.

The report sporadically acknowledges that there may be ethical and
social concerns with implementing these goals and technologies, yet
nowhere does it specifically articulate them. It assumes that
ethicists, when involved at all, will simply provide pragmatic
justification for the plan, rather than actually raising substantive
questions about the underlying philosophy behind the program. On
December 2, 2003, President Bush signed into law the 21st Century
Nanotechnology Research and Development Act. The bill, as nano news
site reported, gives nanotech "a permanent home in the federal
government" and assigns nearly $3.7 billion over four years for nano
research and development programs.

My hope is that those involved in this research will heed the wisdom
of the report of The President's Council on Bioethics released last
October, which examines the ethical and social meanings of using
biotechnologies for purposes "beyond therapy." It is a statement
appropriately skeptical of transhumanist and scientific utopianism.
"In wanting to become more than we are, and in sometimes acting as if
we were already superhuman or divine, we risk despising what we are
and neglecting what we have," the Council admonishes. "In wanting to
improve our bodies and our minds using new tools to enhance their
performance, we risk making our bodies and minds little different from
our tools, in the process also compromising the distinctly human
character of our agency and activity. In seeking by these means to be
better than we are or to like ourselves better than we do, we risk
'turning into someone else,' confounding the identity we have acquired
through natural gift cultivated by genuinely lived experiences, alone
and with others. In seeking brighter outlooks, reliable contentment,
and dependable feelings of self-esteem in ways that bypass their usual
natural sources, we risk flattening our souls, lowering our
aspirations, and weakening our loves and attachments." (Read the
entire report).

We're All Enhanced
But is there really anything wrong with enhancing our attributes? Each
of us engages in various forms of augmentation. We go to school. We
train to improve our endurance and agility. We take vitamins. We use
corrective lenses, false teeth, and hearing aids.

True. But none of these items and activities seeks to transcend our
species' normal capabilities. They are accepted because they merely
optimize performance within the natural constraints of homo sapiens.

How about calculators and computers? They augment our ability to
obtain, store, retrieve, and process vast amounts of information, more
than our brains ever could. But having access to technologies that are
separate from ourselves and that we can turn off is quite different
from permanent implants, or structural or genetic modifications that
can potentially be passed on to subsequent generations.

There are several key questions that our churches and theologians will
have to address. Is it appropriate for members of the Body of Christ
to engage in alterations that go beyond therapy and are irreversible?
Is it just to do so in a world already deeply marked by inequities?
What does it mean that our Lord healed and restored in his
ministry—never enhanced? Is it significant that the gifts of the Holy
Spirit—wisdom, love, patience, kindness—cannot be manufactured by
technology? How would the transformation from homo sapiens to techno
sapiens affect our identity as bearers of the image of God? If
Christians should conclude that such enhancements are not appropriate
for them to receive, should they oppose their use by others?

If we do, we can expect severe rejection. Embryonic stem-cell research
and cloning exploit other helpless human beings, so they become an
ethical problem to many more people. But enhancement technologies may
seem unquestionably beneficent since they are used only by those who
chose to use them. You cannot deprive people of their right to
"better" themselves, especially if it affects only them, right?

The military feels a moral imperative to do whatever is necessary to
make sure that each soldier comes home alive and well. If it takes
genetic, cybernetic, or nanotechnological modifications to do that, so
be it. After all, how could we deny our soldiers the greatest chance
of survival?

Market forces will likely push people to undergo enhancements to be
competitive in the marketplace. It's already happening. Those with
faulty vision cannot be a Navy Seal—unless they undergo irreversible
and still risky LASIK eye surgery. It's only a matter of time before
members of the armed forces will be required to undergo other forms of
augmentation.

Many things are being sold to the public in the name of compassion—but
at what price? A quick look at the history of technology shows that
for almost every technological "fix," myriad other problems arise.
Nuclear power is but one example.

The human lifespan may be expanded, but at what cost to social
structures? What will be the effect on employment and retirement? If
we alter our bodies with stronger components, what is the cost to our
humanity? Although we may not understand the value of our weaknesses,
Paul says, even our imperfections give us opportunities (2 Cor. 12:9,
Phil. 4:11).

Nano-engineered cybernetic implants may provide us access to vast
amounts of information, but will they lead to increased wisdom or
knowledge of the Lord?

Cyber connections in the brain are going to be two-way means of
communication. This means that the last bastion of privacy—our
minds—may no longer be secure. Will such implanted mechanisms force us
to be exposed to unwanted images and ideas? We can't even control spam
in our current computer networks. Imagine computer viruses that could
be engineered to injure brain cells through cybernetic implants!

Remember Sin
Transhumanist philosophy claims that technology can correct the
fundamental problems of humankind. As Christians, we know that our
elemental problems arise from the corruption of the human heart (Mark
7:21–23).

Sin is real, observable, and unexplained by empirical tools. All
technological innovations will not only fail to produce true happiness
but also will be corrupted intrinsically by sin. Tools offered to
produce liberation will also be used to further tyranny. It has always
been so.

But Christians must not become techno-dystopians, suspicious of all
new technologies. While technology is not our salvation, neither is it
intrinsically evil. Technology has enhanced our ability to show
compassion and to spread the gospel. Christians need to be
techno-realists, recognizing the potential goods of innovation, but
realistically anticipating and restricting its potential harms. This
requires a correct understanding of human nature and of God's ultimate
plans for our species that only the gospel can provide. Christians
must boldly engage in the discussion of these issues, both among
themselves and in the public square.

Government policies to deal with the ethical and social consequences
of bioengineering do not now exist. But this isn't stopping the
researchers or the government. As of the end of October, Congress was
estimating that the government would have to spend about $4 billion
for nano research over the next four years.

Woody Allen once quipped, "More than at any time in history, mankind
faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and utter hopelessness,
the other to total extinction. Let us pray that we have the wisdom to
choose correctly."

It is my prayer that the body of Christ, inspired by the Holy Spirit
and the gospel's perfect vision for human flourishing, can help us
avoid either path. Instead, I pray that we will be able to guide our
surrounding culture to a truly human future.

C. Christopher Hook is a hematologist, director of bioethics education
for the Mayo Graduate School of Medicine, and chairman of the Mayo
Clinical Ethics Council. Hook's comments are solely his own and do not
necessarily represent the views of the Mayo Clinic.


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Revelation 13:15-18 (NRSV)


15 and it was allowed to give breathk to the image of the beast so
that the image of the beast could even speak and cause those who would
not worship the image of the beast to be killed. 16 Also it causes
all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to
be marked on the right hand or the forehead, 17 so that no one can buy
or sell who does not have the mark, that is, the name of the beast or
the number of its name. 18 This calls for wisdom: let anyone with
understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number
of a person. Its number is six hundred sixty-six.

Revelation 14:9-11 (NRSV)
9 Then another angel, a third, followed them, crying with a loud
voice, "Those who worship the beast and its image, and receive a mark
on their foreheads or on their hands, 10 they will also drink the wine
of God's wrath, poured unmixed into the cup of his anger, and they
will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy
angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their
torment goes up forever and ever. There is no rest day or night for
those who worship the beast and its image and for anyone who receives
the mark of its name."

[1]
[1] The Holy Bible : New Revised Standard Version. 1996, c1989.
Nashville: Thomas Nelson.
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The Graphic Battle for the Violent Mind
By Thomas Horn
RNU News Sr. Reporter

Many Christians, including Christian psychologists, believe the causes
of physical and mental illness including a propensity for violence are
sometimes connected to original sin.

RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - A state appeals court yesterday
dismissed the guilty plea of a man imprisoned for child pornography
that involved writings, not images. His stories included graphic
depictions of child torture and molestation which prosecutors claimed
could fuel the imaginations of violent pedophiles and result in harm
to children.

Lawyers specializing in the First Amendment convinced the 10th Ohio
District Court of Appeals in Columbus to dismiss the case and send it
back to Franklin County Common Pleas Court.

THE GRAPHIC BATTLE FOR THE VIOLENT MIND

When defense attorneys several years ago argued that 17-year-old Kip
Kinkel should not spend the rest of his life in prison, it was because
Kinkel reportedly "heard voices" telling him to commit murders. During
sentencing hearings Dr. Richard J. Konkol pointed out that "holes" in
what is normally a smooth surface of Kinkel's brain reveal conditions
consistent with schizophrenia. When defense attorney Mark Sabitt asked
if this would make a person "more susceptible to a psychotic episode,"
Konkol responded, "I think it would."

Kinkel pleaded guilty to four counts of murder and 26 counts of
attempted murder in the May 1998 shooting rampage in Springfield,
Oregon. Kinkel's parents and two students at Thurston High School died
as a result of the attack. 25 other students were wounded.

"My dad was sitting at the (breakfast) bar," said Kinkel, "The voices
said, 'Shoot him.' I had nochoice. The voices said I had no choice."
Kinkel testified that after he killed his parents he was instructed by
the voices to "Go to school and kill everybody."

Murderous voices first began speaking to Kinkel at age 12 when he got
off the school bus and was looking at a bush. It said, "You need to
kill everyone, everyone in the world." Kinkel believes the voices came
from the devil, a satellite, or from a computer chip implanted in his
head by the government.

Like Kinkel, the notorious "Son of Sam" killer also claimed
"bloodthirsty voices" commanded him to kill. According to David
Berkowitz, a recent convert of Christianity, a 6,000-year-old demon
named Sam communicated through his neighbor's black Labrador retriever
instructing him to carry out the murders. Berkowitz was subsequently
diagnosed as having paranoid schizophrenia, a disease in which the
person often hears pejorative or threatening voices separate from
their own. Both Kinkel and Berkowitz were known to read pornographic
and violent depictures of torture and murder.

MURDER'S VOICE IN HISTORY

Schizophrenia is an accepted diagnosis of mental disorder and we
cannot underestimate the positive contribution of such science. But
many Christians, including Christian psychologists, believe the causes
of violence in people suffering physical and mental illness can be
connected to violent images and stories in popular media. Some believe
curable, and incurable conditions like schizophrenia, should be
approached both scientifically and spiritually during diagnosis and
treatment. This presupposes a psychological influence of supernatural
evil in some cases, and applies a literal interpretation to the words
of Jesus that the Evil One is "a murderer" (John 8:44). Satan's
violent autosuggestions influence the mind that rejects the voice of
God and fills it with "envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice"
(Romans 1:29).

Early cultures often interpreted such difficult psychological
expressions through metaphysics. In Greece, Dionysus was the
intoxicating god of unbridled human passion. He was the presence that
is otherwise defined as the craving within man that longs to "let
itself go" and to "give itself over" to evil human desires. What a
Christian might resist as the evil thoughts of the carnal man, the
followers of Dionysus embraced as the incarnate power that would, in
the next life, liberate mankind from the constraints of this present
world, and from the customs which sought to define respectability
through a person's obedience to moral law.

Until then, worshippers of Dionysus attempted to bring themselves into
union with their god through ritual casting off of the bonds of sexual
denial and primal constraint by seeking to attain a higher state of
ecstasy. The uninhibited rituals of ecstasy (Greek for "outside the
body") supposedly brought the followers of Dionysus into a
supernatural condition that enabled them to escape the temporary
limitations of the body and mind, and to achieve a state of
enthousiasmos, or, "outside the body and inside the god." In this
sense Dionysus represented a dichotomy within the Greek religion, as
the primary maxim of the Greek culture was one of moderation, or,
"nothing too extreme." But Dionysus embodied the absolute extreme in
that he sought to inflame the forbidden passions and murderous
thoughts of the human mind. Interestingly, as most students of
psychology will understand, this gave Dionysus a stronger allure among
many Greeks who otherwise tried in so many ways to suppress and
control the wild and secret lusts of the human mind.

But Dionysus resisted every such effort, and, according to myth,
visited a terrible madness upon those who tried to deny him his free
expression. The Dionystic idea of mental disease resulting from the
suppression of secret inner desires, especially aberrant sexual
desires, was later reflected in the atheistic teachings of Sigmund
Freud. Thus, Freudianism might be called the grandchild of the cult of
Dionysus.

Conversely, the person who gave himself over to the will of Dionysus
was rewarded with unlimited psychological and physical delights. Such
mythical systems of mental punishments and physical rewards based on
resistance and/or submission to Dionysus, were both symbolically and
literally illustrated in the cult rituals of the Bacchae (the female
participants of the Dionystic mysteries), as the Bacchae women
migrated in frenzied hillside groups, dressed transvestite in fawn
skins and accompanied by screaming, music, dancing, blood letting, and
licentious behavior. When, for instance, a baby animal was too young
and lacking in instinct to sense the danger and run away from the
revelers, it was picked up and suckled by nursing mothers who
participated in the hillside rituals. But when older animals sought to
escape the marauding Bacchae, they were considered "resistant" to the
will of Dionysus and were torn apart and eaten alive as a part of the
fevered ritual.

Human participants were sometimes subjected to the same orgiastic
cruelty, as the rule of the cult was "anything goes," including rape
and other acts of interpersonal violence. Later versions of the ritual
(Bacchanalia) expanded to include pedophilia and male revelers, and
perversions of sexual behavior were often worse between men than they
were between men and women. Any creature that dared to resist such
perversion of Dionysus was subjected to sparagmos ("torn apart') and
omophagia ("consumed raw"). In B.C. 410, Euripides wrote of the bloody
rituals of the Bacchae in his famous play, The Bacchantes:

Bacchantes [with] hands that bore no weapon of steel, attacked our
cattle as they browsed. Then wouldst thou have seen Agave mastering
some sleek lowing calf, while others rent the heifers limb from limb.
Before thy eyes there would have been hurling of ribs and hoofs this
way and that, and strips of flesh, all blood be-dabbled, dripped as
they hung from the pine branches. Wild bulls, that glared but now with
rage along their horns, found themselves tripped up, dragged down to
earth by countless maidens hands.
Euripedes went on to describe how Pentheus, the King of Thebes, was
torn apart and eaten alive by his own mother as, according to the
play, she fell under the spell of Dionysus.
The tearing apart and eating alive of a sacrificial victim may refer
to the earliest history of the murderous voice of Satan. An ancient
and violent cult idea existing since the dawn of paganism stipulated
that, by eating alive, or by drinking the blood, of an enemy or an
animal, a person might somehow capture the essence or "soul-strength"
of the victim. The earliest Norwegian huntsmen believed this, and they
drank the blood of bears in an effort to capture their physical
strength. East African Masai warriors also practiced omophagia, and
they sought to gain the strength of the wild by drinking the blood of
lions. Human victims were treated this way by Arabs before Mohammed,
and head-hunters of the East Indies practiced omophagia in an effort
to capture the essence of their enemies.

Today, omophagia is practiced by certain Voodoo sects as well as by
cult Satanists. Eating human flesh and drinking human blood as an
attempt to "become one" with the devoured is, in many cases, a
demonization of the Eucharist, or Holy Communion. But sparagmos and
omophagia, as practiced by the followers of Dionysus, was not an
attempt of transubstantiation (as in the Catholic Eucharist), nor of
consubstantiation (as in the Lutheran communion), nor yet of a
symbolic ordinance (as in the fundamentalist denomination), all of
which have as a common goal--the elevating of the worshipper into a
sacramental communion with God. The goal of the Bacchae was the
opposite: The frenzied dance, the thunderous song, the licentious
behavior, the murderous activity, all were efforts on the part of the
Bacchae to capture the "voice" of the god (Dionysus) and bring him
down into an incarnated rage within man. The idea was not one of holy
communion, but of possession by the spirit of Dionysus.

WHO'S BEHIND MURDER'S VOICE?

When one recalls the horrific rituals of the followers of Dionysus,
it's easy to believe that demonic possession actually occurred. A
Christian should find this idea as plausible, and, it would seem, so
did the Hebrews. The Hebrew people considered Hades (the Greek god of
the underworld) to be equal with Hell and/or the Devil, and many
ancient writers likewise saw no difference between Hades (in this
sense the Devil) and Dionysus. Euripedes echoed this sentiment in the
Hecuba, and refered to the followers of Dionysus as the "Bacchants of
Hades." In Syracuse, Dionysus was known as Dionysus Morychos ("the
dark one") a fiendish creature; roughly equivalent to the biblical
Satan, who wore goatskins and dwelt in the reqions of the underworld.

In the scholarly book, Dionysus Myth And Cult, Walter F. Otto
connected Dionysus with the prince of the underworld. He wrote: "The
similarity and relationship which Dionysus has with the prince of the
underworld (and this is revealed by a large number of comparisons) is
not only confirmed by an authority of the first rank, but he says the
two deities are actually the same. Heraclitus says, "Hades and
Dionysus, for whom they go mad and rage, are one and the same."

Even the Hebrew prophet Ezekiel condemned the mind-altering madness of
Dionysus as inherently satanic. He spoke of the "magic bands"
(kesatot) of the Bacchae, which, as in the omophgia, were used to
mesmerize the minds of men. We read, "Therefore, thus says the Lord
GOD, Behold I am against your magic bands [kesatot] by which you hunt
lives [minds/souls] there as birds, and I will tear them off your
arms; and I will let them go, even those lives [minds/souls] whom you
hunt as birds" (Ez. 13:20 NAS).

The kesatot, or "magic arm band," were used in connection with a
container called the kiste.Wherever the kiste is inscribed on
sarcophagi and on Bacchic scenes, it is depicted as a sacred vessel (a
mind prison?) with a snake peering through an open lid. How the magic
worked and in what way a mind was imprisoned is still a mystery. Pan,
the half-man/half-goat god (later relegated to devildom) is sometimes
pictured as kicking the lid open and letting the snake (mind?) out.
Such loose snakes were then depicted as being enslaved around the
limbs, and bound in the hair, of the Bacchae women.

The mysterious imagery of Pan, the serpents, the imprisoned minds, and
the magic Kesatot and Kiste, have not been adequately explained by any
available authority, and the interpretation of them as a method of
mind control is subject to ongoing scrutiny. But since the prophet
Ezekiel spoke of the efforts of the Bacchae to mystically imprison the
minds of men through the magic bands of Dionysus, and since Pan was
most beloved of Dionysus, because of his pandemonium ("all the
devils") which struck sudden panic in the hearts of men and beasts,
and as the serpent was universally accepted by the Hebrews as a symbol
of occult devotion, it can be easily surmised that the iconography of
Dionysus represented the most tenacious effort on the part of the
Bacchae to fulfill the psychological whims of evil supernaturalism.

SHUTTING MURDER'S MOUTH

In Acts 17:34 we read of the conversion of Dionysius the Areopagite.
This is significant. Having the name Dionysius probably meant the
parents were devotees of Dionysus, and thus the child was
"predestined" to be a follower of the god. He may have also been under
a mind-altering kesatot spell. But the powers of darkness lost control
over Dionysius's mind when he accepted the Gospel message. Jesus
liberated him like He did the lunatics of Matthew 4:24 and 17:15. When
Jesus touched the wild man, He left him "sitting, and clothed, and in
his right mind" (Mark 5:15).

Jesus is still in the mind-healing business, and testimonies abound of
people whose minds were released from murderous madness into His
marvelous light. Just ask David Berkowitz, the former Son of Sam
killer. David received Christ on the prison floor. "When I finished
talking to God, I got up. My mind seemed to flood with a sense of
peace," said Berkowitz. "I knew from that moment that Jesus Christ
heard me. I sensed in my heart that I was forgiven and that I was now
free."

Ted Bundy pleaded for an interview with Dr. James Dobson prior to his
court-ordered date with destiny. Bundy appeared genuinely sorrowful on
videotaped interview and acknowledged the murderous effects of past
sinful thinking. He asked Jesus to forgive him.

Karla Faye Tucker was the first woman executed in the state of Texas
in 135 years. She testified of the mind-altering effect of drugs. On
the eve of her execution, CBN reporter Kathy Chiero asked Karla, "Why
do you agree to talk to the media regardless of why they are coming to
you?" Karla responded, "God has given me a great big open door to
share the love of Jesus and I'm going to do it. My heart has been to
share with the world the love that he has poured out into me -- the
forgiveness, the mercy, the way that he can change a life."

Most of us view such deathbed conversions with skepticism. Last minute
loyalties attributed to our Savior in the midnight hour often bring
scoffing. Yet we read of the criminal on the cross and see Jesus
honoring his plea for forgiveness. Jesus extended mercy, and offered
eternal fellowship to every repentant soul.

Perhaps Kip Kinkel will discover what David Berkowitz says he has.
That the saving power of Jesus Christ is "mighty through God to the
pulling down of strongholds; Casting down imaginations, and every high
thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing
into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ" (2
Corinthians 10:4-5).

"Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are
honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure,
whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if
there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these
things" (Philippians 4:8).

© 2004 RaidersNewsUpdate.com



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PSYCHICS AND DARK FORCE HAVE SPREAD ACROSS BREADTH OF SOCIETY

For years a rising tide, the occult is now roiling into whitewater and
cresting onto an indifferent Western landscape.

Long the province of witches, magicians, and psychic dabblers -- who
were always in the far backdrop -- the occult is now being thrust
into an open display of what the Bible calls an "abomination."

The tidal surge can be seen from childhood cartoons -- which so often
focus on the saving graces of "magic" -- to the practices of
celebrities and politicians. In the Church, occult ways have slipped
in through Eastern-style meditation, reverence for Mother Earth, and
use of such things as the enneagram. Across society, the occult
ying-yang and other esoteric symbols like the horn necklaces to ward
off "evil eye" have become fixtures -- despite their link to practices
that for centuries have been categorized as witchcraft.

Most worrisome is the effect on our young. In Saturday morning
cartoons are the witches and wizards and at night the teen vampires.
It has permeated our commercials. It is a fixture -- by way of the
horoscope -- in the daily newspaper (despite the Church's specific
condemnation of astrology, which is the devil's prophecy). Movies are
full of occult themes (an actual and often palpable evil exuding from
the screens to ensnare innocent viewers) while those who make or star
in them are involved in practices like the kabbala, a form of Jewish
augury that is now the rage of the "spiritually" svelte. "Today, of
course, the subject is almost 'the flavor of the month,' even for
non-Jews," notes one report. "Trendy movie stars and TV personalities
of both sexes dip into it and talk about how it has changed their
lives."

The kabbala is picking up from where mind control, transcendental
meditation, yoga, EST, and other questionable practices --
questionable when they lead to communion with the dark side -- have
left off.

In England, Prime Minister Tony Blair is said to have made at least
one major decision after waiting for inspiration from a "light."
Although he is Protestant and his wife is Catholic, there is concern
that he is drifting into the New Age. During a family holiday on the
Mexican Riviera, Prime Minister Blair and his wife Cherie went through
a "rebirthing ritual." According to a report in the December 15
edition of the Times of London, the Blairs stayed at the very swanky
Maroma Hotel near Cancun, where rooms fetch as much as $1,000 a night.
While there, they reportedly underwent a hybrid New Age/Mayan
ceremony. "Dressed only in bathing suits, Britain's first couple stood
outside a brick pyramid on the hotel's grounds and bowed toward each
point of the compass while chanting to each of the four winds," said a
report. "The spiritual leader of the ceremony encouraged them 'to feel
at one with Mother Earth,' and to 'experience inner feelings and
visions.'"

Blair may not know it, but if not focused on Jesus, such is
tremendously dangerous -- allowing forces of deception to come as
"angels of light." And however much it may or may not figure into his
actual life, Blair is hardly alone. The occult has gone mainstream.
Wearing crystals or tattoos with occult undertones are practices that
have become startlingly widespread, as has body piercing, which has
long possessed a voodoo-like element. The same is true about the
"gothic" influence, which affects much of today's rock music. The
Goths were barbarians who often formed a cult of blood.

"I love Harry Potter. I think it would be so cool to be a witch,"
Sharon, age 11, of California, tells a newspaper -- indicating another
way the occult has washed over modern society, which is too
"sophisticated" to believe that such things can bring danger.

In Peru, the former president consulted a psychic before fleeing and
around the world police are working with clairvoyants. In Europe two
South Wales psychics were summoned to see what was afoot at a
notoriously haunted naval base in Devonport.

Also in the United Kingdom -- where churchgoing has dropped to
frightening levels -- an illusionist starred in a controversial
televised seance in which 12 people attempted to make contact with a
group of teenagers who had allegedly committed suicide (drawing 600
complaints from viewers who knew the abomination).

On Long Island, a psychic has "channeled" her gifts into a novel
(Miriam the Medium), while the occult game Dungeons and Dragons --
deeply demonic -- continues in popularity, now with a version called
the "Temple of Elemental Evil."

Devilish characters stare down at us from fast-food restaurants or
Halloween shops or from "playing cards" that seem innocent on the
surface, even innocuous , but bear hidden occult significance. Look
more closely or sprinkle a little Holy Water to feel the influence.

Bottom line: an entire generation of Western children is being exposed
to an energy that could affect them for years. These games are more
clever versions of Ouija boards -- which also put youngsters in touch
with dark forces.

According to exorcists, the Ouija and similar occult practices are
frequently behind cases of possession.

Yet our society has already accepted so much and is so open to more
that we have lost our sensitivity.

In historic cities are tours that take the unsuspecting on "fun" trips
to haunted homes while other visit voodooists. Take Charleston, South
Carolina. "With slightly over 330 years of ghostly legends involving
voodoo curses, alleyway duels, cold-blooded murders, hanged pirates
and Revolutionary War and Civil War soldiers bravely going to their
deaths, Charleston has earned a reputation as one of America's most
haunted cities and a popular tourist site to have a possible brush
with the supernatural," notes another news story. "Indeed, walking and
driving tours of historical, contemporary and supernatural interests
are an extremely important part of Charleston's thriving tourism
industry, which brings in $4.5 billion annually to the city and
surrounding area, according to the Charleston Area Convention and
Visitors Bureau."

Fortunately, not everyone has been duped. On the border of Wales and
England, in Shropshire, a councilor has called for a ban on ghost
tours in a castle. The tours are being planned by a "self-styled pagan
high priestess." The same is happening in St. Augustine, Florida,
Savanna, Georgia, New York City, and other cities -- exposing the
unsuspecting to spiritual contamination. At night, "coast to coast"
radio shows deluge sleepy listeners with the occult.



Meantime, New Age shops catering to pagans and witches have even
opened up in the heartland, Kansas.

The ultimate manifestations can be seen in places like Italy -- where
occult-drenched teens have killed other teens in retaliation or
ritual, including a poor young girl who they thought looked like the
Blessed Mother. "An Italian magistrate has warned against the growing
lure of Antichrist cults in Catholic Italy after the discovery of the
bodies of two teenagers killed in a satanic sacrifice," said a
newspaper there recently.

Paranoid? Fundamentalist? What our society allows today on an average
television show would have frightened just about every major Christian
society over the past 2,000 years and has gone so far into the occult
domain that average Christians no longer recognize it. Yet, it has
only been since the Sixties that such things have been allowed into
the open. And as occult experts warn (most recently Father Gabriel
Amorth, the official Rome exorcist), it is all taken far too lightly
by the Church, which has not been preaching the dangers.

Speaking to the Italian daily L'Espresso, Father Amorth underscored an
alarming rise in occult practices across Italy, and offered some sharp
criticism of Church leaders for failing to warn against the devil's
influence. "The Church has gone from one excess to another," he said.
"To compensate for the madness of witch-hunting -- in which people
were burned when they should have been exorcised -- we have completely
eliminated the devil and exorcism." He noted that "entire Catholic
regions do not have a single exorcist," naming Spain, Portugal,
Germany, Austria, and Switzerland.

In North America, even the largest dioceses report few cases where
exorcists are deployed for what they were intended to do, with bishops
instead opting for psychological explanations. While there are cases
in which psychological illness is behind what looks like possession,
more often "psychological" ailments have a spiritual cause. But this
is rarely recognized.

Which is how the Prince of Dark likes it.

"The devil is extremely satisfied, because he is at liberty to do his
work," said Father Amorth.




-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The coming of the Antichrist!

Daniel 8:22-25 (NLT)

23 "At the end of their rule, when their sin is at its height, a
fierce king, a master of intrigue, will rise to power. 24 He will
become very strong, but not by his own power. He will cause a shocking
amount of destruction and succeed in everything he does. He will
destroy powerful leaders and devastate the holy people. 25 He will be
a master of deception, defeating many by catching them off guard.
Without warning he will destroy them. He will even take on the Prince
of princes in battle, but he will be broken, though not by human
power.

(The Antichrist comes into power when the sin of people becomes so
great that the people are deceived into destruction by this
king(A.C).)
Post by martus
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RetroProphet
2004-06-14 20:41:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
Paranoid? Fundamentalist? What our society allows today on an average
television show would have frightened just about every major Christian
society over the past 2,000 years and has gone so far into the occult
domain that average Christians no longer recognize it. Yet, it has
only been since the Sixties that such things have been allowed into
the open.
Rubbish. You guys really say the darndest things in your
never-ending efforts to make it seem that the things you hate
are REALLY just happening NOW, when you just happen to be around
to wise everyone up. It's the way you whitewash the fact that your
predictions of doom have always resulted in absolutely NOTHING.

Yeah, you had to gather in secret basements in order to watch
the "Wizard of Oz" in 1939. And "Topper" before it.

Wizardry and witches have been in popular entertainment
for centuries. In the open.

"I Married A Witch" was one of the most popular movies of 1941.
Actually, if Christians never burned "witches" they probably
never would have made the movie. Hmmm...

Do you advocate finding and killing witches today?
If not, why not? You seem to think they are destroying the world,
like terrorists, but with supernatural powers.

Are you up for a "War on Witchcraft"?
I mean a real killing war, not a war of words.

Or are you "soft on witchcraft"?

I mean, what good is protecting Christian children from
getting into witchcraft if other Evil children are going
to use witchcraft powers to do Evil things to all of us?

Shouldn't we be out killing occult practioners NOW,
while we still have a chance?
Silver Blaze
2004-06-14 21:49:07 UTC
Permalink
It is the occult elements of Paulist Christianity and the occultist
theology of Paul that set western civilisation up for belief in the occult
and the consequent rise of superstition.

Rescuing Christianity from Fundamentalism and reformong theology would be
a major step towards restoring reason.


++++++++++++++++++
martus
2004-06-14 18:06:02 UTC
Permalink
Europe's Cinderella or Ugly Sister?


By Paul Reynolds



The European Parliament (EP) is perhaps the most misunderstood and,
mainly in Britain, probably most reviled institution in the European
Union.

It seems to be in the news solely when there are expense scandals or
when someone takes a shot at it for being an expensive and pretentious
talking shop.

When I joined the parliament's staff in 1979, it was basically a
talking shop but it has gathered power and pace fast


In fact, it has acquired a significant amount of power over the last
20 or so years so that it now stands as a co-equal to the Council of
Ministers, that is the member states, in making decisions about many
European laws.

This power of "co-decision", as it is called in eurospeak, means that,
largely unnoticed by most of the populations which vote in its
members, it can make or break many pieces of legislation which affect
the ordinary lives of European citizens.

It stands to gain even more powers from the new European constitution
as co-decision is spread to more policy areas.

Dermot Scott, the head of the parliament's UK office in London, said:
"When I joined the parliament's staff in 1979, it was basically a
talking shop. But it has gathered power and pace fast. The problem is
that public perception of it has not changed."


The EP wants to play a bigger role in asylum and immigration policy
The agreement of the parliament has to be sought for those issues
which are subject to qualified majority voting in the Council of
Ministers.

There is a procedure, complicated but not impossibly so, under which
the parliament puts forward amendments and its position and that of
the Council of Ministers (who have to resolve their own differences)
are reconciled.

If there is no agreement, then there is a "conciliation" process not
unlike the one between the two Houses of Congress in the United States
and if this fails, then so does the legislation. Usually however,
there is a compromise.

Nitty-gritty

The issues subject to co-decision mainly involve nitty-gritty subjects
and the most important are the environment (40% to 50%), issues
affecting the working of the internal market, health and safety at
work and consumer protection.

Some examples illustrate how and why the parliament now counts.


Testing of animals for cosmetics: The European Commission (which is
the EU's civil service and which has the sole right to introduce
legislation, though members of the Parliament can propose amendments)
proposed a long list of exemptions and long periods of transition. The
EP insisted on fewer exemptions and quicker implementation, despite
vigorous opposition from the French government, which wants to protect
its cosmetic industry.

Air passenger compensation: Soon airline passengers subject to delays
or cancelled flights will be able to claim much greater compensation.
The EP, concerned that low-cost airlines might go out of business if
compensation was too high, toned down the original Commission
proposals. This went to conciliation and was finally agreed last
October. An exemption was allowed for the Scilly Isles which is served
only by helicopters.

Water Treatment: This was an initiative by the EP which resulted in a
directive enforcing higher water standards. Scotch whisky producers
got an exemption for the springs whose water, they argued they had
paid for in perpetuity and which was not wasted.

Lead free petrol, now commonplace, was once championed by the
Parliament.

Financial Services regulation: This directive is an example of how the
British government, often regarded as hostile to European measures,
appealed for help from the EP. The draft directive was held to be too
tough for the City of London and the Parliament accepted some of these
arguments. The result is a measure not as bad as Britain had
originally feared.
Bid for more powers

It can be seen from these examples where the influence and power of
the Parliament lies. The laws are sometimes derided as "widget
directives" but they have to be made by someone and one of those
"someones" is the EP.

"Our major job is the domestic agenda not global issues," says Dermot
Scott.

"It affects the food you eat, the air you breathe, your workplace,
your health and safety and your environment. These issues are decided
jointly by your government and others and by your MEPs."


In the draft constitution, the Parliament stands to gain because of
the larger number of policy areas in which it will have the right to
co-decision.

The most contentious is probably asylum and immigration.

But there are other powers it wants, notably power to regulate
spending on the Common Agricultural Policy which still takes up nearly
50% of the EU budget. France opposes handing powers over this to the
EP and wants to retain its veto.

"The Parliament basically has everything it wants in terms of powers,"
says Dermot Scott, "and now it wants those powers to be generalised.
That means extending them right across the field of legislation."

The struggle for recognition by the European Parliament has been a
long one. It is not over yet. Somehow it has not overcome its poor
image to be accepted for what it wants to be - a democratic workhorse
at the heart of the European Union.






-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Revelation 13:3-18 (NRSV)


3 One of its heads seemed to have received a death-blow, but its
mortal wound had been healed. In amazement the whole earth followed
the beast. 4 They worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority
to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying, "Who is like the
beast, and who can fight against it?"

5 The beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and blasphemous words,
and it was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months. 6 It
opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his
name and his dwelling, that is, those who dwell in heaven. 7 Also it
was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them. It was
given authority over every tribe and people and language and nation, 8
and all the inhabitants of the earth will worship it, everyone whose
name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book
of life of the Lamb that was slaughtered.

9 Let anyone who has an ear listen:

10 If you are to be taken captive,

into captivity you go;

if you kill with the sword,

with the sword you must be killed.

Here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints.

The Second Beast

11 Then I saw another beast that rose out of the earth; it had two
horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. 12 It exercises all the
authority of the first beast on its behalf, and it makes the earth and
its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal woundi had been
healed. 13 It performs great signs, even making fire come down from
heaven to earth in the sight of all; 14 and by the signs that it is
allowed to perform on behalf of the beast, it deceives the inhabitants
of earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that had been
wounded by the sword and yet lived; 15 and it was allowed to give
breath to the image of the beast so that the image of the beast could
even speak and cause those who would not worship the image of the
beast to be killed. 16 Also it causes all, both small and great, both
rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or
the forehead, 17 so that no one can buy or sell who does not have the
mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name. 18
This calls for wisdom: let anyone with understanding calculate the
number of the beast, for it is the number of a person. Its number is
six hundred sixty-six.
Post by martus
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martus
2004-06-17 14:45:01 UTC
Permalink
Dear Friends -

We are thankful to God that we have been sent to participate in the
last days harvest of poor Muslims. We are so blessed to see the way
His Spirit of grace and supplication is being poured upon these
Muslims and setting them free from the Satanic bondage of the
religion of Islam. Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words and
if you would like to see a picture of the better answer than bombing
the evil Muslims to hell click here:

Loading Image...

However the FACT remains that the Satanic religion of Islam is the
overt means to kill commandment keeping Christians and Jews until
the full structure of Vatican Roma's Antichrist extermination
mechanism is fully in place. It is now time for Orthodox faithful
people to become Orthodox in deed and in truth.

Paragraph #841 from the latest Roman Catholic Catechism should be
known by every Child of God. Paragraph #841 "The Church's
relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes
those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom
are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and
together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge
on the last day." That statement alone should convince anyone caught
up in the web of the black witchcraft religion of the Roman Vatican
to COME out of her. Rev 18:4 is a COMMAND of the Lord.

The pope, and/or the president, CAN NOT BE ALLOWED to plead
ignorance, when they say the god of the Muslims is the Same as the
God of the Christians. NO WAY. I know thousands of poor ignorant
Muslims and NOT ONE of them is ignorant enough to say that the God
of the Muslims is the same as the God of the Christians. Allah Akbar
means the god of the Muslims is greater than the god of the
Christians. One can not find a Muslim who does not know that. And
Popes and Presidents are without excuse and should be taken to task
when they dare say otherwise.

Below the DOTTED line of this message is some quotes of the Al-
Quad's Brigade, (Jerusalem Brigade), Commander of the Khobar
Terrorist Squad, of the Muslim Mujahideen, who on May 29, 2004,
religiously murdered 22, in Saudi Arabia. If you want the full
article, which is Muslim propaganda, to whip up the demons in them
to get more young suicidal psychopaths for Satan, here is the link -
http://www.memri.org/bin/opener_latest.cgi?ID=SD73104

The information below the dotted line is gruesome; but, CONFIRMS
beyond any reasonable doubt, HOW ABSOLUTELY Absurd it is for Saudi
Arabia's top leaders to attempt to blame the work of these Muslim
terrorists on the Zionists. The only people that do NOT try to blame
everything on the Jews, are the people who KNOW and identify with
the God of Israel, the I AM, Yeshua, Jesus, the one and only Messiah
and Very God who IS come in the flesh, who is King of the Jews, and
King of Kings, and Lord of Lords.

You are encouraged to read as much of the information as you can.
You will see that Allah, the moon god of Islam, is obviously Satan,
or Lucifer, the devil. That FACT will become very clear to you if
you have the stomach to read the the few portions of the interview
of the Muslim terror squad commander.

Jesus, who is the Truth Personified, tells us that Lucifer, Satan,
Allah, the moon god, is easily identified as one and the same;
because, the devil by any name, even the big "G" god of Freemasonry,
is still the father of lies, and comes only to steal, kill, and
destroy.

Why has Bush given Saudi Arabia a free pass? Saudi Arabia persists
in funding and exporting Islamic terror especially in Arafat land.
How come forcing Israel to accept another terrorist state within her
borders is more important than the problems with Saudi Arabia? (NOT
WAR ON TERRORISM BUT REWARDING TERRORISM)

Part of the answer is in freemasonry. Bush, like all US presidents
in our lifetime, is a high degree freemason. The Crescent Moon may
be seen on the front of EVERY MUSLIM MOSQUE, AND ON EVERY SHRINER'S
HAT.

The main purpose of the Jesuits, the Vatican, the Freemasons, and
hundreds of antichrist organizations like the ACLU, is to destroy
Bible based Christianity, and to war primarily against the great
international hate crime of Biblicism. If the term Biblicism is a
new one to you there is an article by the name BIBLICISM on the
GJiGT.

It should surprise no one that such groups can HYPOCRITICALLY ignore
the rights of parents. Christian-bashing, and war against Biblicism
is the whole purpose of such organizations. Promoting Islam FITS
their real antichrist agenda.

There are just not that many real Christians. There are a lot
of "NICE" fako Christians who "go along to get along" and have been
taught feigned affection, in their 501c3 churches which have no salt
or light. There is much more that should be decried. Christians have
failed to stand to uncover the facts and lies of Relativism, Big
Bangism, and Evolution and much more.

But what about all these crescent moons popping up like mushrooms in
front of Muslim mosques all over America, and other Western cities?
What about these mosques, the multiplied millions of Muslim
immigrants, the increasingly bold Muslim evangelism, like in the
California School System? What is really going on? What is the Truth
behind these things? What is behind the crescent moon and the
religion of Islam?

Historically, "Allah' was not invented by Mohammed or revealed for
the first time in the Koran. In fact, the word 'Allah' was used in
Arabia long before Mohammed was born.... There are over fifty
reference works that state...that Allah was the Moon-god in pre-
Islamic times.... For example, The Dictionary of Non-Classical
Mythology states that Allah, 'originally applied to the moon; he
seems to be preceded by Ilmaqah, the moon god...Allat; the female
counterpart to Allah.'" Historically Arabia was a pagan nation that
worshipped over 300 gods, actually 360 of them, just like the 360
degrees of the occult. Satan, the devil, being 360, and the
antichrist being 359, all the way down to the simple degrees of
freemasonry. One of the 360 pagan gods of Arabia was the moon god
named, al-ilah. Legend has it that the moon god mated with the sun
god and had two daughters, both of whom were worshipped as
goddesses.

When Mohammed claimed to have had his 'vision' and 'revelation' from
Gabriel he chose al-ilah as the god upon which to build his army.
Mohammed was instructed by his Vatican handlers that he could get a
lot more converts by terror, murdering Jews and real Christians for
the pope. Convert or die by this sword is a much quicker way to get
converts than by the truth and freedom to choose. Mohammed shortened
the name, al-ilah, to Allah, and declared that he alone should be
worshipped. He forbade the worship of the daughters. To this day, a
crescent moon can be found at the front of every mosque,
acknowledging that Allah was, and is the moon god.

Most Muslims do not think they are worshipping a pagan moon god when
they worship Allah. However, the modern meaning of a word cannot be
used to refute its original meaning in history.

We must SHOUT the truth that ALLAH IS THE MOON-GOD. If Muslims are
offended by that truth, tell them to check it out. It is important
for these poor deceived followers of the devil, and Satan's great
false prophet Mohammed to have one chance to hear the truth. If THIS
FACT, the TRUTH THAT ALLAH IS THE MOON GOD from pre-Islamic Arab
paganism, is not SHOUTED out by the Christians, who else is going to
try to set these poor deceived people free from the bondage of
Islam? Islam is the fastest growing religion of Satan, AKA Lucifer,
the devil, because Christians have lost their salt and light.

Muslims may try to repress the FACT & TRUTH that Allah is the pagan
moon god. All Muslims are worshipping the pagan moon god. Neither
Muslems or anybody else, can deny that FACT & TRUTH.

This pagan moon god religion is claimed by nearly one in five people
on the earth! Why is there a crescent moon on the front of every
mosque? Why is the same crescent moon on the Fez of a Shriner?? Why
does the definition of a Shriner include this: "Ancient Arabic Order
of Nobles of the Mystic Shrine"?? Why do Shriners meet in "temples"
with Arabic names? The god of Freemasonry is the same. The god of
Freemasonry is also Satan, Lucifer, the devil. The whole Masonic
business is no friend of the Holy Bible, or genuine Christians, or
Jews.

Satan, Lucifer, the devil was once the head of all of the True God's
worshipping angels. It is no marvel then that he comes as an angel
of light. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an
angel of light. Therefore, it is no great thing if his ministers
also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end
shall be according to their works. 2 Cor 11:14-15. NO MARVEL that
religious deception tops the list of Satan's works. Occult Kabbalism
is the hidden source of not only modern cosmology, but also of the
various Jewish sects and Protestant Dispensationalism. Some are
trying to tell me that there is Kabbalism which is not occult in
nature. I must confess ignorance on this issue. All of the Kabbalism
that I have seen is occultic in its nature.

I believe that we see God beginning to awaken His People who love
Truth and hate deception. NOW is the time to LOVE the TRUTH. NOW is
the last hour to come out of whatever deception may be keeping you
from the TRUTH! This awakening of the remnant is a necessary part of
the preparation for His prophesied unmasking and destruction of ALL
deception and the separation of the world's populations into overt
Satan worshippers and those who get on God's side. (Rev.17:14; I Jn.
3:8; Rev. 18:2; 13:4,7) Come out of her (Babylon/confusion) MY
PEOPLE, God says (Rev.18:4). Are we to be surprised that the
revelation of a single Historical Truth (that Islam is founded on
the worship of a pre-Islamic pagan moon-god elevated to the one
sovereign god by Mohammed's vision) is capable of unmasking that
great religion and separating its people into those who can and
cannot receive a love of the Truth (II Thess.2:10-12)?

Same for the Masons. Will Masons love the truth enough to receive
the truth that Lucifer, Satan, the devil, is the god of Freemasonry?
There is ample proof of this on the Freemasonry topic on the GJiGT.
Will you be one who will DO Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the
unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them?

What idol are you bowing to? Do you bow to some idol of science
falsely so called? Have you made an idol out of your doctrines?
Until you dispense with your dispensationalism you will not be able
to see what the Bible prophets tell us. IF you will NOT take off
your pre-trib lala land rose colored glasses, you can not sea what
the bible prophets clearly show of the times in which we now live.
Will you cast down your idols of doctrinal deceptions in your
comfortable brand of Christianity?

Why should a Roman Catholic be any more surprised than the Muslim
that the Roman Catholic church with its Mariolatry is revealed to be
little more than a facelift of ancient paganism stemming from some
version of the Semiramis/Tammuz cult? How many of the 1.2 billion
Catholics will come down on the side of the Bible, and how many on
the side of black witchcraft religion of "the church." It is
DECISION time when it is made clear that the black witchcraft
religion of Rome is irreconcilably contradictory to true Bible
Christianity. One must choose between them. One can not have both
Jesus and the pope, in these last days. It will be either or, but
NOT both Christ and the antichrist false prophet pope.

We do know, based upon the integrity of the word of God, that a
global Government is coming and now is, that is committed to
destroying the real Biblical Christians and Jews. This Satanic,
antichrist global government will have a global antichrist false
prophet leader, who is the Vatican Roman pope. (Rev.17:12-14,
Rev.13:4,7; 17:12,13). This antichrist Illuminati Satanist
controlled world government and religious system will not last long
before it is overcome (13:12,14). Babylon America, the Babylon
economic system, the Babylon world government, and the Babylon world
religious system headed by Vatican Rome, will FALL.

The antichrist has been revealed. Pre-tribbers shake yourselves and
wake up before it is too late. Jews shake yourself and wake up
before it is too late. Both Christian pre-tribbers and Jews are set
up to accept the mark of the beast and receive the FALSE MESSIAH.

There is NO orthodox or Torah based Judaism without a TEMPLE.
Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin. There is
nothing more central to Torah. Yeshua can forgive your sins.

Israel is the name of the Family of God. Only those who KNOW the
REAL Messiah, not just know about Him, can be set free from the
STRONG DELUSION now upon this whole earth. You must KNOW the Real
Messiah or else you will receive the mark of the Beast and receive
the False Messiah and spend eternity in the Lake of Fire.

Allah, the pagan moon-god, and his Koran fails the acid test of
divine fulfillment of century's old prophecies. The Holy Bible has
over 2000 prophecies that are very precisely and accurately
fulfilled. The few remaining prophecies in the Holy Bible are being
fulfilled before our very eyes. Will we have ears to hear and eyes
to see? The answer is yes, IF we can come out of the strong delusion
of pre-trib dispensationalism, or Jewish sects, or Vatican Romanism,
and especially Islam. Those under Islam, who truly love God, will
have the same choice as the rest of the world when Babylon Falls.

As you will see, when you read below the dotted line, these DEMONIAC
Muslims praise their Allah god of death, murder, and destruction.
Yes, all Muslims are demon possessed, some just more so than others.
These poor people need to be set free and the only way to
effectively do battle is in the SPIRITUAL realm. If we are submitted
to God we may resist the devils in the Muslims very effectively, and
often God may even be glorified in setting the Muslims free of the
Satanic bondage religion of Islam.

Shalom & Simcha,
Jim Searcy
----------------------------------------
QUOTES of the Al-Quad's Brigade (Jerusalem Brigade) Commander of the
Khobar Terrorist Squad, of the Muslim Mujahideen, who on May 29,
2004, murdered 22, in Saudi Arabia.

"As soon as we entered, we encountered the car of a Briton, the
investment director of the company, whom Allah had sent to his
death. He is the one whose mobile phone on the seat of his car, with
the blood on it, they kept showing [on television]. We left him in
the street.

"We went out, and drove our car. We had tied the infidel by one leg
[behind the car]. We left the company [compound] and met the
patrols. The first to arrive was the jeep of a patrol, with one
soldier, and we killed him. With the rest we exchanged fire, and we
got through.


"The infidel's clothing was torn to shreds, and he was naked in the
street. The street was full of people, as this was during work
hours, and everyone watched the infidel being dragged, praise and
gratitude be to Allah.

"When we arrived at one of the bridges, we encountered an ambush of
Tawaghit dogs, Saudi government troops, and the guards of the
Americans, and we exchanged fire with them. When we crossed the
bridge, the rope [by which the Briton was tied] snapped and the body
of the infidel fell in the middle of the intersection, between the
four stop signs, and everyone who was stopped at the stop signs saw
the infidel on the day that he fell from the top of the bridge.

"The brothers had exchanged fire with the patrols, all the while
shouting, 'Allah Akbar,' and 'There is no God but Allah.'"

The Second Attack: 'We Are Mujahideen, and We Want the Americans...
We Shot Him In the Head... We Slit His Throat'

"We entered and found youths from Saudi Arabia wearing the Aramco
uniform. They asked, 'What is going on?' We told them, 'Calm down,
don't be afraid, we don't want you. We want only the Americans.'

"We entered one of the companies' offices, and found there an
American infidel who looked like a director of one of the companies.
I went into his office and called him. When he turned to me, I shot
him in the head, and his head exploded. We entered another office
and found one infidel from South Africa, and our brother Hussein
slit his throat. We asked Allah to accept these acts of devotion
from us, and from him. This was the South African infidel.

The officer was killed, Allah be thanked, and his soldiers were
wounded. The soldiers screamed to their brothers in the rear: 'We
want to leave, by Allah, take us out, get us out!' We were
shouting, 'Allah Akbar' and 'Allah is our God. You have no god. Go
to Hell and evil is your fate!' Nimr, may Allah have mercy upon him,
told one of them: 'Come nearer, oh coward, come here!' But he fled
from him.

The Third Attack: 'Brother Nimr Cut Off His Head and Put It at the
Gate of the Building... We Found Hindu Engineers and We Cut Their
Throats Too' "He [the Italian] spoke for several minutes. I asked
the broadcaster, 'Did you record that?' He said, 'Yes,' and then the
hero Nimr cut his throat." We ask Allah to accept this offering from
your hands.

"We began to comb the site looking for infidels. We found Filipino
Christians. We cut their throats and dedicated them to our brothers
the Mujahideen in the Philippines. Likewise, we found Hindu
engineers and we cut their throats too, Allah be praised. That same
day, we purged Muhammad's land of many Christians and polytheists.

When we were next to it, the brothers appeared from the windows of
the car and began shouting 'Allah Akbar,' and shooting them. And I
saw the skull of the soldier standing behind the machine gun explode
before my eyes. Allah be praised.




_______________________________________________________________________________________
Post by martus
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martus
2004-06-17 15:17:35 UTC
Permalink
Why Is An Occult Revival Sweeping the Globe?
By Thomas Horn for Cutting Edge Magazine
RNU News Sr. Reporter

Esoteric festivals with crowds in the tens of thousands are growing in
popularity

RNU.com – (Raiders News Update) - In the UK, Brighton proudly wears
the title these days - Capital of Occulture. This year's Occulture
festivities began on July 19th and exhibited bigger than ever venues -
sacred music and dance, clarivoyance, psychic and tarot readers,
chakra, traditional witchcraft, tatooing, piercing, fetish satanism,
shamanism, transcendent techniques, and lectures favoring paganism
from the original Book of Shadows.

Marquee this year was the 'Pleasure Dome" where magicians, sorcerers
and witches discussed their trade, including Mogg Morgon, founder of
the Golden Dawn Occult Society, Ralph Harvey, a prominent Wiccan High
Priest, and Emrys, a Shaman of the Cromlech Covenant.

According to the Occulture Festival's News Page, Mark Ramsden, an
accomplished jazz musician with deep interest in the occult was this
year's compere. "Old Occulture hands may remember Mark from the
infamous Black Friday 2001 - 'a night of dark lascivious delights'" -
the website says.

IN THE US

In the U.S., the number of earth-worshipping pagans at the Burning Man
Festivals have grown to tens of thousands. People come from Canada,
Brazil, Germany, Russia, and 25 other countries to an isolated corner
of Black Rock Desert in Nevada, where other wiccans, satanists,
goddesses, nudists, and a consortium of party-goers converge on the
hot Nevada desert for a Labor Day weekend of "glorious Hell on earth."

Recent Burning Man festivals included The Floating World, based on the
New Age concept that "Reality is so big we must protect ourselves from
it.... Our little worlds, in truth, are ships that float upon a sea,"
the Chaos Cabaret, a dinner theater devoted to celebrating the two
purest forms of chaos: the Maelstrom (a violent, disordered, turbulent
state bursting with activity) and the Abyss ( an immeasurable place of
the damned), "Motel 666", and "Crucifixion With a Celebrity" where one
could purchase a picture of a crucified obese Elvis while eating
hamburgers sold by devil-worshippers at the McSatan cafe wearing
T-shirts that proudly proclaimed, "Praise The Whore!"

As in the past, this year's clothing-optional Burning Man offers a
no-holds-barred "Woodstock" style festival where neo-pagans, wiccans,
transvestitie entertainers, curiosity seekers, and old hippies can go
to trance, perform rituals, burn sacrifices to deities, fornicate, and
otherwise "express" themselves.

The 40-foot-high effigy Burning Man (the "Spirit Cave Man"-- sacred to
local Indians and New Agers) will be torched as usual together with
just about everything else at the close of the festivity.

UNDERSTANDING THE OCCULT FIRES PHENOMENON

The spirit of the occult has existed since the beginning of time. Like
an insidious cancer—unseen, patient, deadly—it has grown. Indications
of its presence have been felt occasionally, and confirmations of its
actuality have been documented from Brighton to Washington D.C.

As we approach the culmination of the "new order of the ages," cult
experts forecast a continuing revival of such mysticism. While church
attendance continues to decline across the United States and Britain,
adherents of the occult expand their "services" to meet the desires
and mystical interests of a spiritually hungry world.

New Age expert Judy Vorfeld says, "Dabbling in the realm of the occult
is currently stylish. Even some Christians seem unable to avoid the
attraction of this colorful, seductive world."

She's right. From Burning Man festivals to public school Environmental
Education to faddish television good-guys and bad-girls, today's
generation is lapping up as much New Age Occultianity as they can get
their hands on. Whether it's comic book heroes that teach youth the
dangerous Persephonian idea that a person can be in league with the
devil and still be a good person, or the syncretistic goals of the
Occulture Festival and Burning Man, the glowing fire of pagan revival
can no longer be denied.

THE REAL BURNING MAN

From a Biblical point of view, powerful and ancient entities are
behind the revival of paganism. In the air above and the earth beneath
are nefarious progenitors of esoteric mysticism. "Demons" to some and
"gods" to others, such forces have numerous titles. They can appear in
hideous forms or as beautiful angels of light. They are the "wicked
spirits" (poneria: the collective body of demon soldiers comprising
Satan's hordes), "rulers of darkness" (kosmokrators: governing spirits
of darkness), "powers" (exousia: high ranking powers of evil), and
"principalities" (arche: commanding generals over Satan's fallen army)
of Ephesians 6:12. As the "gods and goddesses" of the underworld, they
live today and encourage mysticism among pagans, witches, New Agers
and even church-goers in at least the following ways:

Aphrodite—sensuality, fertility rites, wiccan rituals, sacred
prostitution.
Amun-Ra—masturbation, self realization, environmentalism,
Darwinism.
Apis—animal worship, animal rights, animal channeling,
occultianity.
Apollo—humanism, oracles, channeling, psychics, drugs,
visualization.
Artemis—goddess worship, animal worship, animal rights,
lesbianism.
Asclepius—holistic medicine, psychic dreaming, spirit-guide
animals.
Athene—goddess worship, feminism, the spirituality movement,
lesbianism.
Baal—oracles, polytheism, abortion, fertility issues.
Demeter—environmental education, earth worship, goddess worship.
Dionysus—drunkeness, freudianism, ecstasy, pornography,
lesbianism, abortion.
Eros—eroticism, mystic sex, body worship, body piercing, sacred
prostitution.
Gaia—earth worship, environmentalism, paganism, pantheism, sweat
lodges.
Geb—environmental movement, animal rights, eco-paganism.
Hades—devil worship, occultism, spiritism, necromancy.
Hathor—goddess worship, earth worship, animal rights, animal
worship.
Hecate—witchcraft, necromancy, crystals, spells, druidism,
feminism.
Heka—mysticism, demonism, animal rights, environmentalism.
Hypnos—hypnotism, psychic dreaming, prognostication, e.s.p.,
clairvoyance.
Imhoteb—mystic healing, animal dancing, holistic medicine, vision
quests.
Isis—wicca, witchcraft, goddess worship, magic, channeling,
visualization.
Min and Qetesh—fertility rites, body worship, sensuality,
pornography.
Osiris—occultianity, necromancy, anthropomorphism, occultism,
spiritism.
Persephone—animism, zoroastrianism, dualism, magic, necromancy.
Ptah—universalism, pantheism, mysticism, holistic medicine.
Sekhmet—environmentalism, mystic medicine, animal worship.
Seth—homosexuality, rebellion, earth worship, environmental
movement.
Vatchit—devil worship, channeling, trancing, visualization,
necromancy.
Zeus—satanism, transexualism, pantheism, oracles, animal worship.
By whatever names they may otherwise be called, the underworld spirits
elevated in the Burning Man and Occulture festivals are gathering the
combined efforts of the kingdom of Satan toward a conspiracy of
apocalyptic proportions. As a consequence, we are experiencing an
unprecedented pagan revival at a time when the United States and
Britain are considered the most advanced economic and technological
powers in the world.

Where will the revival of paganism lead?

Billy Graham says, "Lucifer, our archenemy, controls one of the most
powerful and well-oiled war machines in the universe. He controls
principalities, powers, and dominions. Every nation, city, village,
and individual has felt the hot breath of his evil power. He is
already gathering the nations of the world for the last great battle
in the war against Christ—Armageddon."

Many pagans would disagree with Graham, saying they reject the idea of
personal evil spirits such as Satan and his angels. The concepts of
Hell and a future Great Judgment are also disregarded. But the reality
of Hell and the doom of Satan's followers is described in the Bible.
The "old gods" of the underworld will be destroyed by Yahweh. "The
Lord will be terrible unto them: for he will famish all the gods of
the earth" (Zeph. 2:11). "The Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, saith;
Behold, I will punish...the gods" (Jer. 46:25). Yahweh will also
punish the leader of the gods, that old serpent, called the Devil, and
his human followers. In Isaiah we read:

Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors
about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the
indignation be overpast. For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place
to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth
also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain. In
that day the Lord with his sore and great and strong sword shall
punish Leviathan the piercing serpent; and he shall slay the dragon
that is in the sea. (Isa. 26:20-27:1)

However futile, the pagan gods will retaliate, and a war of
indescribable intensity will occur. This is the war mentioned by
Graham. It will be fought on land and sea, in the heavens above, and
in the earth below, in the physical and spiritual worlds. It will
include "Michael and his angels [fighting] against the dragon; and the
dragon [fighting] and his angels" (Rev. 12:7). According to the Bible,
last days pagans will join the battle, calling upon "idols of gold,
and silver, and brass, and stone, and wood" (Rev. 9:20) to summon "the
spirits of devils working miracles, which go forth unto the Kings of
the earth...to gather them to the battle of that great day...[to] a
place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon" (Rev. 16:13-14; 16).
There, in the valley of Megiddo, the omnipotent Christ will utterly
repel the forces of darkness and destroy the pagan armies. Blood will
flow like rivers, and the fowl of the air will "eat the flesh of the
mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth."



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
End
Post by martus
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-17 15:43:00 UTC
Permalink
U.N. Says Globe Drying Up at Fast Pace


Jun 15, 7:17 PM (ET)

By CHRIS HAWLEY

(AP) The desert encroaching onto fertile planting fields, about 100
kilometers west of Yin Chuan,...


UNITED NATIONS (AP) - The world is turning to dust, with lands the
size of Rhode Island becoming desert wasteland every year and the
problem threatening to send millions of people fleeing to greener
countries, the United Nations says.

One-third of the Earth's surface is at risk, driving people into
cities and destroying agriculture in vast swaths of Africa. Thirty-one
percent of Spain is threatened, while China has lost 36,000 square
miles to desert - an area the size of Indiana - since the 1950s.

This week the United Nations marks the 10th anniversary of the
Convention to Combat Desertification, a plan aimed at stopping the
phenomenon. Despite the efforts, the trend seems to be picking up
speed - doubling its pace since the 1970s.

"It's a creeping catastrophe," said Michel Smitall, a spokesman for
the U.N. secretariat that oversees the 1994 accord. "Entire parts of
the world might become uninhabitable."

Slash-and-burn agriculture, sloppy conservation, overtaxed water
supplies and soaring populations are mostly to blame. But global
warming is taking its toll, too.

The United Nations is holding a ceremony in Bonn, Germany, on Thursday
to mark World Day to Combat Desertification, and will hold a meeting
in Brazil this month to take stock of the problem.

The warning comes as a controversial movie, "The Day After Tomorrow"
is whipping up interest in climate change, and as rivers and lakes dry
up in the American West, giving Americans a taste of what's to come
elsewhere.

The United Nations says:

- From the mid-1990s to 2000, 1,374 square miles have turned into
deserts each year - an area about the size of Rhode Island. That's up
from 840 square miles in the 1980s, and 624 square miles during the
1970s.

- By 2025, two-thirds of arable land in Africa will disappear, along
with one-third of Asia's and one-fifth of South America's.

- Some 135 million people - equivalent to the populations of France
and Germany combined - are at risk of being displaced.

Most at risk are dry regions on the edges of deserts - places like
sub-Saharan Africa or the Gobi Desert in China, where people are
already struggling to eke out a living from the land.

As populations expand, those regions have become more stressed. Trees
are cut for firewood, grasslands are overgrazed, fields are
over-farmed and lose their nutrients, water becomes scarcer and
dirtier.

Technology can make the problem worse. In parts of Australia,
irrigation systems are pumping up salty water and slowly poisoning
farms. In Saudi Arabia, herdsmen can use water trucks instead of
taking their animals from oasis to oasis - but by staying in one
place, the herds are getting bigger and eating all the grass.

In Spain, Portugal, Italy and Greece, coastal resorts are swallowing
up water that once moistened the wilderness. Many farmers in those
countries still flood their fields instead of using more miserly "drip
irrigation," and the resulting shortages are slowly baking the life
out of the land.

The result is a patchy "rash" of dead areas, rather than an
easy-to-see expansion of existing deserts, scientists say. These areas
have their good times and bad times as the weather changes. But in
general, they are getting bigger and worse-off.

"It's not as dramatic as a flood or a big disaster like an
earthquake," said Richard Thomas of the International Center for
Agricultural Research in the Dry Areas in Aleppo, Syria. "There are
some bright spots and hot spots. But overall, there is a trend toward
increasing degradation."

The trend is speeding up, but it has been going on for centuries,
scientists say. Fossilized pollen and seeds, along with ancient tools
like grinding stones, show that much of the Middle East, the
Mediterranean and North Africa were once green. The Sahara itself was
a savanna, and rock paintings show giraffes, elephants and cows once
lived there.

Global warming contributes to the problem, making many dry areas
drier, scientists say. In the last century, average temperatures have
risen over 1 degree Fahrenheit worldwide, according to the U.S. Global
Change Research Program.

As for the American Southwest, it is too early to tell whether its
six-year drought could turn to something more permanent. But
scientists note that reservoir levels are dropping as cities like
Phoenix and Las Vegas expand.

"In some respects you may have greener vegetation showing up in
people's yards, but you may be using water that was destined for the
natural environment," said Stuart Marsh of the University of Arizona's
Office of Arid Lands Studies. "That might have an effect on the
biodiversity surrounding that city."

The Global Change Research Program says global warming could
eventually make the Southwest wetter - but it will also cause more
extreme weather, meaning harsher droughts that could kill vegetation.
Now, the Southwest drought has become so severe that even the
sagebrush is dying.

"The lack of water and the overuse of water, that is going to be a
threat to the United States," Thomas said. "In other parts of the
world, the problem is poverty that causes people to overuse the land.
Most of these ecological systems have tipping points, and once you go
past them, things go downhill."

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mat 24:3-7 ASV And as he sat on the mount of Olives, the disciples
came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be?
and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
(4) And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man
lead you astray. (5) For many shall come in my name, saying, I am
the Christ; and shall lead many astray. (6) And ye shall hear of
wars and rumors of wars; see that ye be not troubled: for these things
must needs come to pass; but the end is not yet. (7) For nation
shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom; and there
shall be famines and earthquakes in divers places.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Silver Blaze
2004-06-17 21:55:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
U.N. Says Globe Drying Up at Fast Pace
Here in Eastern Australia we are in what is rapidly becoming the worst
drought on record

Read what you will into this
Jim Ledford
2004-06-17 22:48:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Silver Blaze
Post by martus
U.N. Says Globe Drying Up at Fast Pace
Here in Eastern Australia we are in what is rapidly becoming the worst
drought on record
Read what you will into this
rain patterns have shifted.
Libertarius
2004-06-18 00:07:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jim Ledford
Post by Silver Blaze
Post by martus
U.N. Says Globe Drying Up at Fast Pace
Here in Eastern Australia we are in what is rapidly becoming the worst
drought on record
Read what you will into this
rain patterns have shifted.
===>Is YHWH collecting water again above the "firmament" so he
may send another flood to Earth because this time he is sorry he promised he

would not do it again? -- L.
Silver Blaze
2004-06-18 04:59:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Libertarius
Post by Jim Ledford
Post by Silver Blaze
Post by martus
U.N. Says Globe Drying Up at Fast Pace
Here in Eastern Australia we are in what is rapidly becoming the worst
drought on record
Read what you will into this
rain patterns have shifted.
===>Is YHWH collecting water again above the "firmament" so he
may send another flood to Earth because this time he is sorry he promised he
would not do it again? -- L.
JUST SO LONG AS HE DOESN'T RAIN ON THE DINGO OR DILUTE THE SCHOONER OF
VICTORIA BITTER.

NOTHING WORSE THAN WEAK BEER AND THE SMELL OF A WET DOG
Libertarius
2004-06-18 14:45:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Silver Blaze
Post by Libertarius
Post by Jim Ledford
Post by Silver Blaze
Post by martus
U.N. Says Globe Drying Up at Fast Pace
Here in Eastern Australia we are in what is rapidly becoming the worst
drought on record
Read what you will into this
rain patterns have shifted.
===>Is YHWH collecting water again above the "firmament" so he
may send another flood to Earth because this time he is sorry he promised he
would not do it again? -- L.
JUST SO LONG AS HE DOESN'T RAIN ON THE DINGO OR DILUTE THE SCHOONER OF
VICTORIA BITTER.
NOTHING WORSE THAN WEAK BEER AND THE SMELL OF A WET DOG
===>I see what you mean.
Keep them under your roof, just in case. -- L.
duke
2004-06-18 17:58:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Libertarius
===>Is YHWH collecting water again above the "firmament" so he
may send another flood to Earth because this time he is sorry he promised he
would not do it again? -- L.
Nope.



duke
*****
I have much more to tell you, but you cannot bear
it now. When he comes, the Holy Spirit will declare
to you the things that are coming. John 16:12-15.
*****
'enry VIII
2004-06-18 02:23:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
U.N. Says Globe Drying Up at Fast Pace
Jun 15, 7:17 PM (ET)
By CHRIS HAWLEY
(AP) The desert encroaching onto fertile planting fields, about 100
kilometers west of Yin Chuan,...
UNITED NATIONS (AP) - The world is turning to dust, with lands the
size of Rhode Island becoming desert wasteland every year and the
problem threatening to send millions of people fleeing to greener
countries, the United Nations says.
Good! Anyway we can help to speed it up?

'enry VIII
martus
2004-06-11 08:33:44 UTC
Permalink
Shaking up life sciences by crossing disciplines
June 9, 2004

Page 2 of 2 -- But Melton, a Harvard embryologist who works with stem
cells from human embryos, said the new world of biology will raise
challenging ethical questions as scientists get better at manipulating
life. He said researchers already have crossed a sheep with a goat and
he predicted it would be only a matter of time before human-animal
hybrids are created.


He envisioned a day when, after transplanting human stem cells into a
monkey's brain, "you walk into a lab in 2090 and the monkey says,
'Good morning.' " Would such a creature be a human or a monkey, and
what rights should it have, he asked.
===========================================================================

Leviticus 18:23 (NRSV)


23 You shall not have sexual relations with any animal and defile
yourself with it, nor shall any woman give herself to an animal to
have sexual relations with it: it is perversion.



=--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Playing God?
Salem Radio Commentary


We were told it would happen--and it's almost here. The first human
cloned embryo could be implanted into a woman before year's end. But
before anyone thinks this is a cause for celebration--here are some of
the ghoulish facts behind the headline.

Hundred of embryos were used to practice before arriving at the
current one planned for implant. You and I started out as embryos.
What that means is hundreds of human beings were used for
experimentation--used and destroyed.

But it gets worse. The man behind this human cloning is U.S. fertility
expert Panayiotis Zavos. His Frankensteinian work includes mixing
human cells with cow cells. He says he's mixed his concoction with
600-700 cow eggs and successfully created 200 human-cow embryos.

While Zavos says he's not interested in creating monsters, he insists
on testing every embryo for chromosomal defects before insertion.
Zavos is not only creating horrible anomalies, he is also playing God.

Tell Congress to put an end to these grotesque experiments soon.

I'm Janet Parshall.




'Human-cow' created
From The Sunday Times' Jonathan Leake
September 15, 2003

A CONTROVERSIAL cloning scientist is to announce he has created
"human-cow" embryos that lived for about a fortnight and theoretically
could have been implanted into a woman's womb.

Panayiotis Zavos, who runs a fertility laboratory in the US, made the
hybrid embryos by inserting human DNA into the eggs of a cow.

Professor Zavos said the human-cow embryos were "theoretically viable"
but emphasised that he had no plans to allow such a hybrid to be born.

"We are not trying to create monsters," he said, claiming his aim was
to perfect his cloning techniques without the ethical problems
involved in the use of human egg cells.

Professor Zavos said the embryos grew to several hundred cells and
appeared to have normal DNA. He will announce the breakthrough at a
meeting in London today.

He added that the hybrids had grown beyond the stage, known as
differentiation, at which cells showed the first signs of developing
into tissues and organs.

This is a crucial test because it implies that the human chromosomes,
which contain the DNA, have been left intact. Other people who claim
to have created human clones have failed to produce evidence.
Professor Zavos's work is taken seriously by some of the scientific
community.

The Australian




-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cloning Yields Human-Rabbit Hybrid Embryo

By Rick Weiss
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, August 14, 2003; Page A04


Scientists in China have, for the first time, used cloning techniques
to create hybrid embryos that contain a mix of DNA from both humans
and rabbits, according to a report in a scientific journal that has
reignited the smoldering ethics debate over cloning research.


More than 100 of the hybrids, made by fusing human skin cells with
rabbit eggs, were allowed to develop in laboratory dishes for several
days before the scientists destroyed them to retrieve so-called
embryonic stem cells from their interiors. Although scientists in
Massachusetts had previously mixed human cells and cow eggs in a
similar attempt to make hybrid embryos as a source of stem cells,
those experiments were not successful.

Researchers said yesterday they were hopeful that the rabbit work
would lead to a new and plentiful source of embryonic stem cells for
research and, eventually, for medical use. But theologians and others
decried the work as unethical.

Some wondered aloud what, exactly, such a creature would be if it were
transferred to a womb to develop to term.

The vast majority of the DNA in the embryos is human, with a small
percentage of genetic material -- called mitochondrial DNA --
contributed by the rabbit egg. No one knows if such an embryo could
develop into a viable fetus, though some experiments with other
species suggest it would not.

Congress has been mulling legislation for years that would outlaw
certain human cloning experiments, with some opposed to any creation
of cloned embryos for research and others sympathetic to research uses
as long as the embryos are not allowed to grow into cloned babies. No
law has been passed, however, in part because of researchers' warnings
that the proposed restrictions are so far-reaching that they would
hobble development of new medical treatments.

The new work, led by Hui Zhen Sheng of Shanghai Second Medical
University, appears in the latest issue of Cell Research and was
highlighted in a news report in the journal Nature. Cell Research is a
peer-reviewed -- if little-known in the United States -- bimonthly
scientific journal affiliated with the Shanghai Institute of Cell
Biology and the Chinese Academy of Sciences. Some researchers
yesterday said they were frustrated by the lack of details in the
paper.

The team said it retrieved foreskin tissue from two 5-year-old boys
and two men, and facial tissue from a 60-year-old woman, as a source
of skin cells. They fused those cells with New Zealand rabbit eggs
from which the vast majority of rabbit DNA had been removed. More than
400 of those new, fused entities grew into early embryos, and more
than 100 survived to the blastocyst stage -- the point at which
coveted stem cells begin to form.

The approach could help scientists wishing to mass-produce human
embryos as sources of human embryonic stem cells. Stem cells can morph
into all kinds of tissues and may be able to reverse the effects of
various degenerative diseases. But to make cloned embryos, scientists
need both normal body cells -- such as skin cells -- and egg cells,
which have the unique capacity to "reprogram" the genes in body cells
and make them behave as though they were embryo cells.

Because human egg cells are difficult and costly to retrieve from
women's ovaries -- and because human egg retrieval poses risks to the
donors -- scientists have been wanting to know whether animal eggs may
serve as well. A major question has been whether the remnants of
mitochondrial DNA that typically remain in an animal egg would be
compatible with the nuclear DNA contributed by the human cell.

The new work suggests that the answer to that question is yes,
scientists said -- though with a number of caveats. Most important,
researchers said, the paper stops short of proving beyond a doubt that
the stem cells retrieved from the hybrid embryos are truly capable of
growing for long periods of time in lab dishes, and that they can turn
into every known kind of cell.

Even so, said Douglas Melton, a Harvard University cell biologist and
cloning expert, the work is a big advance because it offers a new
system for exploring the mechanisms by which egg cells get adult cells
to act in embryonic ways. That could provide deep insights into human
development, wound healing and tissue regeneration.

He noted that although this is the first creation of a human
"chimeric" embryo -- a reference to the fabulous chimera of Greek
mythology, which had a lion's head, a goat's body and a serpent's tail
-- it is not the first time scientists have blended human cells into
lab animals. Some mice, for example, have been endowed with human
brain cells or portions of the human immune system for research.

The Chinese work, Melton said, is "extremely interesting, and I hope
they pursue it."

R. Alta Charo, an associate dean of law and professor of bioethics at
the University of Wisconsin at Madison, noted that the work passed
muster with Chinese ethics authorities, who had demanded, among other
things, that the embryos not be allowed to grow more than 14 days.

"Short of putting one of these embryos into a woman's body for
development to term, I don't think this work harms anyone alive,"
Charo said.

She said the experiments should force opponents of cloning research to
identify more clearly than they have until now exactly where they
would draw the line against human embryo cloning -- in effect: How
human does an embryo have to be to have the moral standing these
advocates confer on embryos?

Richard Doerflinger, of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, said
he felt certain that the human-rabbit embryos were human enough to
deserve protections.

"I think because all the nuclear DNA is human," Doerflinger said,
"we'd consider this an organism of the human species."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
GM fish glows in the bowl

By Dr David Whitehouse
BBC News Online science editor


A Taiwanese company has created a genetically modified (GM) ornamental
fish that glows in the dark.

But will they catch on?
The Taikong Corporation took DNA from a jellyfish and inserted it into
a zebra fish to make it shine a yellow-green colour.

GM animals are frequently used in labs and flocks of GM sheep make
valuable proteins in their milk, but the "Night Pearl" zebra fish is
the first gene-altered pet to go on sale to the public.

For some, the animal will be a fascinating novelty; for others, it
will raise fears of a trend for bio-engineered "Frankenstein pets".

The Taikong Corporation reports strong interest in its creation from
the UK, where the aquatic industry is worth millions.

Safe and sterile

Taikong insists the GM fish, designated TK-1, is safe, sterile and
that its additional fluorescent gene is harmless.

The fish was unveiled in 2001, but it took another year and a half to
develop a technique to render the animal sterile. It cannot
cross-breed with natural fish.

TK-1 was developed using the work of HJ Tsai of the National Taiwan
University.

Initially, Taikong plans to sell 30,000 glowing fish at US $17 each
and then increase production to more than 100,000 in three months. But
not everyone is enthusiastic.

Aquatic industry specialists are worried TK-1 may be the first of many
GM pet fish destined for Britain. In particular, some tropical fish
are being bio-engineered to tolerate cold and could colonise UK waters
if they escaped, disturbing the present ecosystem.

According to Derek Lambert, of Today's Fishkeeper magazine, GM
piranhas could survive in our waterways and pose a major problem. He
is urging traders to boycott the TK-1.

Keith Davenport, of the Aquatic Ornamental Trade Association (AOTA),
commented that interfering with the genome was unnecessary and said
people did not want animals to become fashion accessories.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Birds with mouse teeth turn the clock back 70m years
By Mark Henderson and Adam Sage
And they could help to cure baldness
THE first birds with teeth since the age of the dinosaurs have been
created by an Anglo-French team of scientists, raising the prospect of
new dental treatments for people ? and even a cure for baldness.
A batch of chicken embryos raised at a French laboratory have been
coaxed into growing rudimentary teeth, after researchers managed to
re-awaken a gene that has lain dormant in birds for at least 70
million years.
The results of the experiments, which are published in the journal
Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, have caused jaws to
drop all over France: the French expression quand les poules auront
des dents, meaning when hens have teeth, is the equivalent of the
English pigs might fly.
The experiment suggests that one day it may be possible to switch on
similar human genes, governing tooth or hair growth, that have become
inactive. Such a technique could be used to cultivate replacement
teeth and hair for those who have lost their originals to age or
disease.
Although no modern birds have teeth, their ancestors once boasted
beaks bristling with incisors. The teeth sported 147 million years ago
by the Archaeopteryx, the first bird known to science, disappeared
from its descendants between 70 and 80 million years ago.
The DNA that triggers tooth growth did not disappear completely, but
instead lingered uselessly in the avian genetic blueprint. A team led
by Josiane Fontaine-Perus, of the University of Nantes, has managed to
switch this genetic signal back on.
In the experiment, which also involved Paul Sharpe, Professor of
Craniofacial Development at King's College London, and other French
researchers, a few mouse cells were transplanted into chicken embryos
to create hybrids known as chimeras.
Whereas chicken cells are incapable of deciphering genetic messages
telling them to turn into teeth, mouse cells are receptive to them.
They migrated to the correct place in the jaw, and the chicken
embryos, which were otherwise normal, began to develop teeth.
The tissue transplant produces cells that contribute to tooth
formation, Professor Sharpe said. Basically, this tells you that the
bird still has the genetic information required to initiate tooth
development, if there are cells capable of responding to it.
The implications for people remain a long way in the future: no one is
proposing the insertion of mouse cells into human embryos. Insights
into tooth and hair formation, however, which share very similar
mechanisms, could have valuable dental and trichological benefits.
Scientists are particularly hopeful that it might prove possible to
identify the genetic cues that prompt hair follicle and tooth growth,
both of which occur readily in the embryo but cease in adulthood.
If such signals can be traced, drugs could be developed to tell stem
cells to form hair follicles rather than skin, and thus reverse
baldness. In March an American team announced the discovery of two
proteins, named Wnt and noggin, which appear to do exactly that.
Dr Fontaine-Perus said that discovering the genetic key to tooth and
hair growth in the embryo, which the chicken research is assisting,
would help efforts to revive both in older age.
We need to find the spark that would set it off, she said. But I am a
little sceptical as far as teeth are concerned, since there are
perfectly good dentistry techniques as it is. It might be more
interesting for those who have lost their hair."
Professor Sharpe agreed that research into baldness could benefit.
It's possible it will help, but it's a small part in a bigger ongoing
story, he said. The idea is that you could somehow awaken dormant
processes that happen in the embryo but not in the adult."
His research team has also managed to grow mouse teeth from stem cells
in the laboratory, and he hopes to begin human trials of replacement
teeth within five years.
Most palaeontologists believe that modern birds are descended from the
family of predatory dinosaurs known as theropods, which includes
Velociraptor and Tyrannosaurus rex ? a view that was first advanced by
Thomas Henry Huxley in 1868.
The discovery of winged and feathered dinosaur fossils in China,
particularly of Microraptor gui, from 128 million years ago, suggests
strongly that tree-dwelling dinosaurs used feathered limbs to glide
from tree to tree, like flying squirrels. This behaviour eventually
evolved into powered flight.
Microraptor, its relatives and Archaeopteryx all had teeth, but the
last bird-like fossils with toothed beaks have been dated to between
70 and 80 million years ago.
Though Archaeopteryx is almost 20 million years older than
Microraptor, both species are thought to have evolved from similar
feathered dinosaurs. It is not known which evolutionary line went on
to develop into modern birds.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The First Cloning Superpower
Inside China's race to become the clone capital of the world.
By Charles C. Mann
I am peering into a laboratory microscope at what is sort of a cloned
human being.
Sort of a cloned human being because it's only a blastocyst, a very
early stage embryo that's floating under the microscope like a tiny
bit of soap foam. And also sort of because this blastocyst was created
by inserting all the DNA from a human being into the egg of a rabbit.
Sacha Waldman
This little swimming experiment in interspecies biology is taking
place not in some high tech office park or Ivy League research lab,
but on the top floor of an emergency ward at a shabby hospital complex
in mainland China. Downstairs, the reception area is lined with
battered folding chairs occupied by patients with makeshift bandages
or open wounds. Splashed across the linoleum is what looks like dried
blood. But here on the top floor, the elevator opens to a world of
$100,000 microscopes, sperm-washing machines, and egg-denucleating
micropipettes.
Major scientific journals won't publish research that has been
described in the popular media, so I have promised not to divulge
identifying details about the experiment or the scientist performing
it, whom I'll call Dr. X. But I can say that Dr. X's laboratory is one
of three I visited in China where researchers are investigating
interspecies clones. And I can also say that this experiment would be
illicit if not completely illegal in the United States and most of the
developed world. But in China it's all legal, every bit of it, which
is a big reason why Dr. X moved here after spending a decade at a
public institution in the US.
Dr. X has not the slightest interest in creating an actual cloned
human being that will one day walk the earth. Instead, this researcher
- like the other Chinese scientists working in the field - is pursuing
a much more important goal: using special cells within the blastocyst
to grow replacement organs and tissues. The cells, called embryonic
stem cells, are arguably the most important subject in biology today,
and certainly the most controversial. With new organs made from these
cells, biologists believe it will be possible to cure many ailments -
and add years, if not decades, to the human lifespan.
In the Americas and Europe, stem-cell research is the subject of such
visceral dismay - and so many government restrictions - that it has
been nearly impossible for scientists to make progress. Things are
different in China. Not only is the field less controversial, but the
government is erecting state-of-the-art lab buildings, creating
university appointments with princely perks, and providing the capital
to establish new biotech firms. If the current trend continues, the
next great discoveries in biomedical science - and the industries they
spawn - will occur not in San Francisco and Boston but in Shanghai and
Beijing.
"I loved working in the States," Dr. X says. The training, the
laboratories, the equipment - all were first-rate. So were the
colleagues. But because embryonic stem cells are nearly impossible to
obtain in the US, this researcher felt it necessary to move to China,
even though it meant leaving spouse and children behind. "China," Dr.
X says, "is the future."
A new era in medicine
Last May, more than 300 scholars and politicians gathered at Shandong
University, in Jinan, about 250 miles south of Beijing, to honor the
late embryologist Tong Dizhou. Above a large bronze bust of Tong hung
a ceremonial banner emblazoned with the phrase: FATHER OF CLONING.
In 1963, 34 years before Dolly the sheep came into the world, Tong
plucked the DNA from a cell in a male Asian carp, stuck it into an egg
from a female Asian carp, and produced the world's first cloned fish.
In previous decades, researchers had cloned microorganisms and
nematodes, as well as amphibians, which readers of Jurassic Park will
remember are genetically malleable. But before Tong, nobody had ever
managed to clone such a complex organism. To all appearances, the
experiment was entirely successful. The cloned carp swam around, ate
its fill, and even sired baby carp.
Ten years later, Tong inserted the DNA from an Asian carp into an egg
from a European crucian carp, a related species, and created the first
interspecies clone. Based on such research, Chinese scientists
developed fish-breeding techniques so powerful that the nation now
produces more than half of the world's aquaculture harvest. But few if
any Western scientists knew of Tong's work, partly because he
published in relatively obscure Chinese journals; Acta Zoologica
Sinica, in which the interspecies cloning research appeared, didn't
even offer the English-language abstracts common in non-Western
scientific periodicals. In any case, Tong performed his experiments
not to study cloning per se but to investigate the interactions
between DNA and the egg containing it. To the Chinese, extending this
work to humans seemed pointless. "We have a huge population problem
and a one-child policy," says Qi Yaqiang, a demographer at Peking
University (which retains Beijing's old Romanized name). "Why would
you think about making people in a laboratory?"
Attitudes toward cloning changed in November 1998, when James Thomson
of the University of Wisconsin announced the isolation of embryonic
stem cells. Five days later, a team led by John Gearhart of the Johns
Hopkins University School of Medicine made a similar proclamation.
Together the two stem-cell papers, one published in Science, the other
in Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, created enormous
excitement. And suddenly, cloning - or, more precisely, one special
type of cloning - seemed to have real value.
Most of the cells in the body can't reproduce themselves; instead,
they simply perform their specific function until they die. Creating
new cells is the province of stem cells, a distinct class that can, in
the jargon, proliferate. Stem cells are located in many parts of the
body; the best known are those in the bone marrow, which make billions
of red blood cells, white blood cells, and platelets each day. When
doctors perform bone-marrow transplants, they're essentially stocking
patients with new stem cells that they hope will proliferate, creating
healthy new blood cells.
Man-Mouse Off The Laboratory Floor
Scientists put a bit of man into a mouse
By Lisa M. Krieger
Mercury News
In a cross-species experiment that raises provocative ethical
questions -- but offers potential therapeutic advances -- scientists
at Stanford University have created a pint-sized hybrid: a healthy
mouse with paws, whiskers and millions of human cells in its brain.
The mouse acts like any other mouse, researchers say. But its brain
contains a small yet significant number of injected human cells, which
have taken up residence in several areas of the brain, including those
that govern smell and coordination of movement.
The goal of the experiment is not to create a rodent that thinks and
acts like a person. Instead, researchers are trying to make a tiny
model for the study of such devastating human illnesses and injuries
such as stroke, schizophrenia, Alzheimer's and Parkinson's disease --
impairments not easily studied in people.
But in crossing such a provocative scientific frontier, the project
raises questions about the ethics of mingling animal and human tissues
in an organ as sacred as the brain, long seen as the seat of the soul
and human consciousness. In future research, might an animal brain
adopt human characteristics? How would researchers know? Is there
anything wrong with that?
Those questions are intriguing enough that the privately funded
research team, lead by renowned researcher Dr. Irving Weissman, has
paused further work until it gets the green light from Stanford's
bioethical community. Recommendations on how to proceed, contained in
a report by law professor Henry Greely, are expected within several
months.
We're taking it one step at a time, said Weissman, a professor of
developmental biology and pathology at Stanford University Medical
School and an international leader in the field of stem cell research.
There are many scientific issues that need answers, but we're not
jumping the gun, Weissman said.
In the experiments, started about 1 1/2 years ago by Weissman, Fred
Gage of the Salk Institute of La Jolla and colleagues at Palo
Alto-based StemCells, neural stem cells from 10-week-old human fetuses
survived when injected into a mouse brain. Stem cells are the cells
from which all others evolve.
Many of the cells continue to thrive in the brain, 14 months later.
Even more remarkably, the stem cells traveled to various regions of
the mouse brain, made themselves at home there and then matured into
the type of adult human cell characteristic of that region of the
brain. This suggests that they respond to chemical signals in the
mouse brain, instructing them how to grow up.
Every part of the brain was populated with human cells, Weissman said.
Some cells traveled to the hippocampus, which has a role in emotion as
well as the construction of mental maps of surroundings. Others ended
up in the cerebellum, which is responsible for movement. Still others
took up residency in the cerebral cortex, responsible for
communication and information processing.
The mice in the experiment suffered no ill effects.
The big question -- do these human cells function? -- is not yet
known. That awaits further research. It is not enough just to inject a
scattering of cells; the cells must build pathways to communicate with
each other. Ideally, networks of these cells would be able to take
over the work of dead or damaged brain cells.
If it works, what's next? Then you have a real debate, Weissman said.
Right now, these are just mice that have a mixture of brain cells.''
A mouse would never have human mental function, emphasized Weissman
and other scientists. A mouse brain lacks the size, complexity and
organizational structure to engage in human thought.
One of our uniquely human characteristics is our ability to be
self-aware, self-conscious -- and this is an important property that
won't metamorphose in a mouse, said Weissman.
While other forms of animal-human fusion have been achieved -- such as
implanting the pancreas of a dog, or the heart valve of a pig -- the
brain is something different, said Arthur Caplan of the University of
Pennsylvania.
We identify with our brain, Caplan said. In American society, the
secular tradition is that our soul, our mind, our consciousness is in
our brain. It is the seat of our identity.
Ethicists like Caplan pose intellectually rich questions: Is a mouse
with human brain cells something more than a mouse? Could human
consciousness be transplanted? If so, how would we know?
No one knows how to tell where human or animal consciousness resides,
said Donald R. Griffin, an emeritus professor of biology at
Rockefeller University in New York. The best guess is that
consciousness is widely distributed and coordinated.
So far, no one has come close to building a human brain, with all its
neurons, in another species, Griffin said. The neurons of humans and
mice may not be all that different. Rather, it is the arrangements and
interconnections that distinguish the minds of each species.
Animal-rights activist Marc Bekoff, a professor of biology at the
University of Colorado at Boulder who, with primatologist Jane
Goodall, founded the organization Ethologists for the Ethical
Treatment of Animals, said, This research violates some boundary
between humans and animals, but a mouse brain does not become a human
brain just because it has human neurons in it.
Assuming that Weissman's experiment is highly unlikely to boost the
mental capabilities of the mouse, what might occur if brain tissue
were transplanted into a higher creature -- say, a primate much more
closely related to humans?
If human cells can be implanted into mice, could they also be put in
chimpanzees? Is it possible to develop animals that are of a cognition
and sentience that rival our own? asked Larry Shapiro, a lawyer and
bioethicist with the University of Southern California. What actual
properties of a mind does an animal have to have before it is
considered a person? It's not precise.
If you create a mentally augmented chimp, does it become a person? Can
you keep it in a zoo? Can it apply for admission into law school?
These are legitimate questions, he said.
We are a long way from creating human consciousness. . . . While it is
tempting to engage in fantastic science fiction scenarios, science is
highly regulated.
Ultimately, the acceptability of such research could depend on how
much brain tissue is transplanted, how it affects the animal, and what
benefits it offers humans, said Maxwell J. Mehlman, director of the
Law-Medicine Center at Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland.
Although it is now not technically possible to model a human brain in
a mouse, we lack any clear guidelines on under what circumstances, if
any, the boundary between human and non-human should be crossed, he
said.
In the future, society may want to decide how far to proceed in
building a better mouse, the scientists and ethicists agreed.
At some point, if it becomes technically feasible to bestow some of
the mental capacities that we associate with humans, we may want to
decide whether to set limits, said bioethicist Leroy Walters of
Georgetown University.
Thoughtful discussion of the issue is important, Weissman said. But he
cautions that exaggerated ethical concerns should not slow important
research. Weissman and most other scientists support the use of
impartial bodies such as the National Academy of Sciences and the
National Institutes of Health, as well as internal committees at
universities, to guard against unethical research.
This research is very different than anything that has been ever done
before, Caplan said. In this arena, the stakes are high.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Spidergoat milk smooth as silk
Tim Utton
24jun02
AS comic-book hero Spider-Man fills cinemas with his adventures,
prepare to meet an equally astonishing creation: Spidergoat
Scientists have combined the DNA from a goat and spider to create an
animal which produces silk five times stronger than steel.
The fibre, from the goat's milk, harnesses the huge strength, relative
to their size, of silk from spiders.
The breakthrough could be worth millions because the silk-milk fibre
can be used to make body armour far tougher than normal bullet-proof
vests while weighing little more than a cotton shirt.
The hybrid goats were created by inserting a single gene from an
orb-weaving spider into a goat embryo.
The genetically-engineered goats are outwardly normal, but carry the
gene responsible for production of a spider silk protein.
Each goat is only 1/70,000th spider, but when fully grown the females
produce milk which can be treated to produce a fibre with spider-silk
strength.
Nexia, the Canadian biotech company which produced the goats, hopes
the fibre &#8211; dubbed Biosteel &#8211; could take a large chunk of
the $2.6 billion market in industrial fibres.
The firm has signed a deal with a textile company to produce the silk
from its herd of goats. In experiments, Nexia researchers have been
able to produce 83m of Biosteel an hour.
The company is working with US Army scientists to develop protective
clothing which could be four times stronger than Kevlar, the material
used in bulletproof vests.
Nexia plans to produce ropes and nets, sporting goods and equipment,
biodegradable fishing lines and surgical stitches for use in hospitals
and in medical procedures.
Jeffrey Turner, president and chief executive of Nexia, said the silk
breakthrough was the holy grail of material science.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Frankenstein fish will glow in the bowl
By Thair Shaikh
(Filed: 05/05/2002)
A TAIWANESE company has created a genetically modified zebra fish that
will glow in the dark, raising fears among environmentalists and the
aquarium industry that the fish will start a trend for bio-engineered
"Frankenstein pets". The modified fish are expected to be imported
into Britain later in the year.
They are the first ornamental fish to be genetically modified. A
jellyfish gene has been added to make them glow yellow-green. The GM
Medaka or zebra fish - an east Asian freshwater variety - has been
developed by Taiwan's Taikong Corporation. It is called the TK-1.
Taikong reported strong interest in Britain, where the aquatic
industry is worth £300 million a year. It insisted that the TK-1 was
safe, sterile and the fluorescent gene was not harmful. Taikong said
it would satisfy European Union rules that genetically modified
imports must not threaten health or the environment.
Aquatic industry specialists are worried, however, that the TK-1 is
the first of many GM pet fish destined for Britain. Tropical fish are
being bio-engineered to tolerate cold and could colonise British
waters if they escaped.
"Piranhas that could survive in our waterways would be a major
problem," said Derek Lambert, the editor of Today's Fishkeeper
magazine, who is urging traders to boycott the TK-1. "We are worried
about Frankenstein fish."
Keith Davenport, the Ornamental Trade Association chief executive,
said: "Interfering with the genome is unnecessary. We don't want
animals to become fashion accessories."
Taiwanese scientists announce birth of the island's first cloned pigs
Taiwan has cloned pigs using human as well as pig cells.
The breakthrough could lead to new treatments for haemophilia and
other diseases, say scientists.
The clones, three female pigs between two weeks and two months old,
were delivered by Caesarean section and were in excellent health, the
government-funded Animal Technology Institute said.
To create the clones, scientists first transferred genetic material
from both human and pig cells into a 3-year-old pig, said Wu
Shinn-chih, a researcher of the institute. The genetic material
included a human clotting factor and a pig protein.
Scientists then took cells from the pig's ear and injected them into
the egg cells of other pigs to create the clones, Wu said.
Until now, animal clones have been created by injecting the genetic
material from a single animal cell into an egg cell that had its own
genes removed.
Wong Chung-nan, director of the institute, said five foreign
organisations had already successfully cloned pigs but Taiwan is the
first to clone them from two cells, instead of a single cell.
The addition of a human cell is expected to enable the clones, when
they grow up and reproduce, to provide milk containing a human
clotting factor that can be used to heal people with haemophilia, Wong
said. The milk will also contain a pig protein that could prevent baby
pigs from having diarrhoea, a major cause of pig death, he said.
The Taiwanese institute is undertaking a four-year project to clone
more pigs and produce clotting and other serums, he said.
The institute also plans to work with foreign organisations to advance
cloning technology so it can develop pigs whose organs can be
transplanted into human beings, Wong said.
Story filed: 13:18 Friday 19th April 2002
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


End
times:
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-09 06:49:26 UTC
Permalink
Satanic ritual blamed for death of Italian teens
Mon 7 June, 2004 18:44

By Rachel Sanderson

ROME (Reuters) - An Italian magistrate has warned against the growing
lure of Antichrist cults in Catholic Italy after the discovery of the
bodies of two teenagers killed in a satanic sacrifice.

Police announced at the weekend they had uncovered the bodies of
19-year-old Chiara Marino and 16-year-old Fabio Tollis, last seen in
January 1998 leaving a pizzeria with other members of their heavy
metal rock band "Beasts of Satan".

As forensic experts searched the two metre deep grave in a wood in
northern Italy, police said they had arrested four of the band members
for murdering the pair for a human sacrifice.

"It is a crime with a level of cruelty and savagery, with an intent to
cause extreme pain through ritual activity, that I have never seen
before in my career," chief investigating magistrate Antonio Pizzi
told Reuters on Monday.

"There was a very specific ritual with very specific rites and at the
end of that Chiara and Fabio were killed."

Italian media said witness statements showed Marino and Tollis died
during a cocaine-fuelled ritual where Marino, a petite brunette, was
killed under a full moon by knife plunged into her heart.

Tollis, the lead singer of the band, was killed with a hammer blow to
the head when he realised the other band members were going ahead with
Marino's murder and tried to stop it.

BLACK CANDLES AND GOATS' SKULLS

The deaths have horrified Catholic Italy, home of Vatican City, with
pages of newspapers given over to descriptions of the black candles
and goats' skulls decorating Marino's bedroom and witness statements
of sexual violence.

What has fuelled the fear are suggestions the double sacrifice near
the town of Busto Arsizio may not be isolated.

"Four people have been arrested for the murder of the two teenagers,
but the investigations are ongoing. We are looking at other levels of
involvement," Pizzi said.

One of those arrested in the double murder is already in prison for
the murder of a former girlfriend.

As many as 5,000 people are thought to be members of satanic cults in
Italy with 17- to 25-year-olds making up three quarters of them,
officials say.

"The phenomenon always existed in Catholic countries where the figure
of Satan is prominent in teachings as the alter-ego of Christ," La
Sapienza University professor Maria Matioti said.

"What has changed is the age of those involved, who are younger," she
said.

She said satanic cults tended to be found in northern Italy, where
traditional family communities had been split up due to migration to
find work, leaving some people demoralised and isolated. "In the
south, people are more open," she said.

Pizzi said investigators were looking into the possibility the "Beasts
of Satan" band members were instructed by Satanists in their late 20s
or early 30s. He said police were also reviewing two suspicious
suicides in the area.

"I am convinced there are others involved in this," Michele Tollis,
father of Fabio told RAI state television.





-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WITCHES AND THEIR LIKE
Cackle now, cry later in despair for their is no salvation in Hell.

THOSE WHO PRACTISE WITCHCRAFT ANGER GOD

2 Chronicles 33:5-7 (NRSV)
5 He built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the
house of the Lord . 6 He made his son pass through fire in the valley
of the son of Hinnom, practiced soothsaying and augury and sorcery,
and dealt with mediums and with wizards. He did much evil in the sight
of the Lord , provoking him to anger.


WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD

Galatians 5:19
19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery,
fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft,
hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelling, and such like: of the
which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that
they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

GET THEIR POWER FROM THE DEMONS

Acts 16:16
16 One day as we were going down to the place of prayer, we met a
demon-possessed slave girl. She was a fortune-teller who earned a lot
of money for her masters. 17 She followed along behind us shouting,
These
men are servants of the Most High God, and they have come to tell you
how
to be saved.18 This went on day after day until Paul got so
exasperated that
he turned and spoke to the demon within her. I command you in the
name of
Jesus Christ to come out of her, he said. And instantly it left
her.19 Her masters
hopes of wealth were now shattered, so they grabbed Paul and Silas
and
dragged them before the authorities at the marketplace


ARE THE DEVIL'S PERVERTING CHILDREN

Acts 13:6
8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for that is what his name means) opposed
them and tried to turn the proconsul from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who
was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked straight at
Elymas and said, 10 ;You are a child of the devil and an enemy
of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and
trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?


GOD OR THE DEVIL: NO MIDDLE GROUND, YOUR CHOICE!!

1 Corinthians 10:
20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they
sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should
have fellowship with devils. 21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord,
and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's
table, and of the table of devils. 22Do we provoke the Lord to
jealousy? are we stronger than he?


ULTIMATE FATE OF THOSE THAT PRACTICE
WITCHCRAFT/OCCULT-
LAKE OF FIRE

Revelation 21
8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the
sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all
liars-their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This
is
the second death."

Matthew 25
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Besq
2004-06-10 01:54:47 UTC
Permalink
I guess we can gather from your header you are delighted these "pukes" died.
That says a lot about you and your "faith".
Post by martus
Satanic ritual blamed for death of Italian teens
Mon 7 June, 2004 18:44
By Rachel Sanderson
ROME (Reuters) - An Italian magistrate has warned against the growing
lure of Antichrist cults in Catholic Italy after the discovery of the
bodies of two teenagers killed in a satanic sacrifice.
Police announced at the weekend they had uncovered the bodies of
19-year-old Chiara Marino and 16-year-old Fabio Tollis, last seen in
January 1998 leaving a pizzeria with other members of their heavy
metal rock band "Beasts of Satan".
As forensic experts searched the two metre deep grave in a wood in
northern Italy, police said they had arrested four of the band members
for murdering the pair for a human sacrifice.
"It is a crime with a level of cruelty and savagery, with an intent to
cause extreme pain through ritual activity, that I have never seen
before in my career," chief investigating magistrate Antonio Pizzi
told Reuters on Monday.
"There was a very specific ritual with very specific rites and at the
end of that Chiara and Fabio were killed."
Italian media said witness statements showed Marino and Tollis died
during a cocaine-fuelled ritual where Marino, a petite brunette, was
killed under a full moon by knife plunged into her heart.
Tollis, the lead singer of the band, was killed with a hammer blow to
the head when he realised the other band members were going ahead with
Marino's murder and tried to stop it.
BLACK CANDLES AND GOATS' SKULLS
The deaths have horrified Catholic Italy, home of Vatican City, with
pages of newspapers given over to descriptions of the black candles
and goats' skulls decorating Marino's bedroom and witness statements
of sexual violence.
What has fuelled the fear are suggestions the double sacrifice near
the town of Busto Arsizio may not be isolated.
"Four people have been arrested for the murder of the two teenagers,
but the investigations are ongoing. We are looking at other levels of
involvement," Pizzi said.
One of those arrested in the double murder is already in prison for
the murder of a former girlfriend.
As many as 5,000 people are thought to be members of satanic cults in
Italy with 17- to 25-year-olds making up three quarters of them,
officials say.
"The phenomenon always existed in Catholic countries where the figure
of Satan is prominent in teachings as the alter-ego of Christ," La
Sapienza University professor Maria Matioti said.
"What has changed is the age of those involved, who are younger," she
said.
She said satanic cults tended to be found in northern Italy, where
traditional family communities had been split up due to migration to
find work, leaving some people demoralised and isolated. "In the
south, people are more open," she said.
Pizzi said investigators were looking into the possibility the "Beasts
of Satan" band members were instructed by Satanists in their late 20s
or early 30s. He said police were also reviewing two suspicious
suicides in the area.
"I am convinced there are others involved in this," Michele Tollis,
father of Fabio told RAI state television.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
Post by martus
WITCHES AND THEIR LIKE
Cackle now, cry later in despair for their is no salvation in Hell.
THOSE WHO PRACTISE WITCHCRAFT ANGER GOD
2 Chronicles 33:5-7 (NRSV)
5 He built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the
house of the Lord . 6 He made his son pass through fire in the valley
of the son of Hinnom, practiced soothsaying and augury and sorcery,
and dealt with mediums and with wizards. He did much evil in the sight
of the Lord , provoking him to anger.
WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD
Galatians 5:19
19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery,
fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft,
hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelling, and such like: of the
which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that
they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.
GET THEIR POWER FROM THE DEMONS
Acts 16:16
16 One day as we were going down to the place of prayer, we met a
demon-possessed slave girl. She was a fortune-teller who earned a lot
of money for her masters. 17 She followed along behind us shouting,
These
men are servants of the Most High God, and they have come to tell you
how
to be saved.18 This went on day after day until Paul got so
exasperated that
he turned and spoke to the demon within her. I command you in the
name of
Jesus Christ to come out of her, he said. And instantly it left
her.19 Her masters
hopes of wealth were now shattered, so they grabbed Paul and Silas
and
dragged them before the authorities at the marketplace
ARE THE DEVIL'S PERVERTING CHILDREN
Acts 13:6
8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for that is what his name means) opposed
them and tried to turn the proconsul from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who
was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked straight at
Elymas and said, 10 ;You are a child of the devil and an enemy
of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and
trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?
GOD OR THE DEVIL: NO MIDDLE GROUND, YOUR CHOICE!!
20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they
sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should
have fellowship with devils. 21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord,
and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's
table, and of the table of devils. 22Do we provoke the Lord to
jealousy? are we stronger than he?
ULTIMATE FATE OF THOSE THAT PRACTICE
WITCHCRAFT/OCCULT-
LAKE OF FIRE
Revelation 21
8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the
sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all
liars-their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This
is
the second death."
Matthew 25
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
BringerOfLight
2004-06-10 15:21:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Besq
I guess we can gather from your header you are delighted these "pukes" died.
That says a lot about you and your "faith".
Of course it does Besq. Marty and his fundie brethren would to love
drag us all back to the Dark Ages where the churches ruled and
anything of a differing opinion was denounced as "heretical" and
conveniently denounced and snuffed out. This is of course the true
goal of the fundamentalists and their mindset of spiritual nazism,
control and domination with the Bible being utilised as a convenient
"Divide & Conquer" tool (i.e. if it ain't in the good book it must be
satanic/evil/not of divine origin!" - Delete whichevers applicable).
It would of course be a tad more helpful if fundieboy could actually
tell the difference between modern-day witches and satanists,
considering the origin of his article was about a satanic murder and
not Wiccans, Dianics etc but he stills see's fit to include them in
his pathetic little diatribe of "WITCHES AND THEIR LIKE Cackle now,
cry later in despair for their is no salvation in Hell.." nonsense.
Of course considering his fervent belief in the book has warped his
fragile little mind beyond any reason and logic why shouldn't that
surprise me much?

"Religion is comparable to a childhood neurosis."
- Sigmund Freud, Future of an Illusion (1927)

"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god
than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other
possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."
- Stephen Roberts

"The reason I know I am God is because one day as I was praying, I
realized I was talking to myself."
- Nicholas Patterson


"An apology for the Devil: It must be remembered that we have only
heard one side of the case. God has written all the books."
- Samuel Butler

"The idea of God is the sole wrong for which I can not forgive
mankind."
- Marquis de Sade

"If Jesus had been killed 20 years ago, Catholic school children would
be wearing little electric chairs around their necks instead of
crosses."
- Lenny Bruce

Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.
- John Milton, Paradise Lost

"Hell must be a really swell spot because the guys who invented the
religion are trying hard to keep everyone else out."
- Al Capone
Post by Besq
Post by martus
Satanic ritual blamed for death of Italian teens
Mon 7 June, 2004 18:44
By Rachel Sanderson
ROME (Reuters) - An Italian magistrate has warned against the growing
lure of Antichrist cults in Catholic Italy after the discovery of the
bodies of two teenagers killed in a satanic sacrifice.
Police announced at the weekend they had uncovered the bodies of
19-year-old Chiara Marino and 16-year-old Fabio Tollis, last seen in
January 1998 leaving a pizzeria with other members of their heavy
metal rock band "Beasts of Satan".
As forensic experts searched the two metre deep grave in a wood in
northern Italy, police said they had arrested four of the band members
for murdering the pair for a human sacrifice.
"It is a crime with a level of cruelty and savagery, with an intent to
cause extreme pain through ritual activity, that I have never seen
before in my career," chief investigating magistrate Antonio Pizzi
told Reuters on Monday.
"There was a very specific ritual with very specific rites and at the
end of that Chiara and Fabio were killed."
Italian media said witness statements showed Marino and Tollis died
during a cocaine-fuelled ritual where Marino, a petite brunette, was
killed under a full moon by knife plunged into her heart.
Tollis, the lead singer of the band, was killed with a hammer blow to
the head when he realised the other band members were going ahead with
Marino's murder and tried to stop it.
BLACK CANDLES AND GOATS' SKULLS
The deaths have horrified Catholic Italy, home of Vatican City, with
pages of newspapers given over to descriptions of the black candles
and goats' skulls decorating Marino's bedroom and witness statements
of sexual violence.
What has fuelled the fear are suggestions the double sacrifice near
the town of Busto Arsizio may not be isolated.
"Four people have been arrested for the murder of the two teenagers,
but the investigations are ongoing. We are looking at other levels of
involvement," Pizzi said.
One of those arrested in the double murder is already in prison for
the murder of a former girlfriend.
As many as 5,000 people are thought to be members of satanic cults in
Italy with 17- to 25-year-olds making up three quarters of them,
officials say.
"The phenomenon always existed in Catholic countries where the figure
of Satan is prominent in teachings as the alter-ego of Christ," La
Sapienza University professor Maria Matioti said.
"What has changed is the age of those involved, who are younger," she
said.
She said satanic cults tended to be found in northern Italy, where
traditional family communities had been split up due to migration to
find work, leaving some people demoralised and isolated. "In the
south, people are more open," she said.
Pizzi said investigators were looking into the possibility the "Beasts
of Satan" band members were instructed by Satanists in their late 20s
or early 30s. He said police were also reviewing two suspicious
suicides in the area.
"I am convinced there are others involved in this," Michele Tollis,
father of Fabio told RAI state television.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
Post by martus
WITCHES AND THEIR LIKE
Cackle now, cry later in despair for their is no salvation in Hell.
THOSE WHO PRACTISE WITCHCRAFT ANGER GOD
2 Chronicles 33:5-7 (NRSV)
5 He built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the
house of the Lord . 6 He made his son pass through fire in the valley
of the son of Hinnom, practiced soothsaying and augury and sorcery,
and dealt with mediums and with wizards. He did much evil in the sight
of the Lord , provoking him to anger.
WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD
Galatians 5:19
19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery,
fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft,
hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelling, and such like: of the
which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that
they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.
GET THEIR POWER FROM THE DEMONS
Acts 16:16
16 One day as we were going down to the place of prayer, we met a
demon-possessed slave girl. She was a fortune-teller who earned a lot
of money for her masters. 17 She followed along behind us shouting,
These
men are servants of the Most High God, and they have come to tell you
how
to be saved.18 This went on day after day until Paul got so
exasperated that
he turned and spoke to the demon within her. I command you in the
name of
Jesus Christ to come out of her, he said. And instantly it left
her.19 Her masters
hopes of wealth were now shattered, so they grabbed Paul and Silas
and
dragged them before the authorities at the marketplace
ARE THE DEVIL'S PERVERTING CHILDREN
Acts 13:6
8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for that is what his name means) opposed
them and tried to turn the proconsul from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who
was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked straight at
Elymas and said, 10 ;You are a child of the devil and an enemy
of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and
trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?
GOD OR THE DEVIL: NO MIDDLE GROUND, YOUR CHOICE!!
20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they
sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should
have fellowship with devils. 21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord,
and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's
table, and of the table of devils. 22Do we provoke the Lord to
jealousy? are we stronger than he?
ULTIMATE FATE OF THOSE THAT PRACTICE
WITCHCRAFT/OCCULT-
LAKE OF FIRE
Revelation 21
8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the
sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all
liars-their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This
is
the second death."
Matthew 25
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-09 07:17:41 UTC
Permalink
Liberal Churches Oppose FMA
by Stuart Shepard, correspondent


Who are they and what are their reasons for rebelling?

More than two dozen religious groups have signed a letter calling on
Congress to reject the proposed Federal Marriage Amendment (FMA).

The letter is signed by leaders of groups such as the Episcopal Church
USA, the Presbyterian Church USA and the Disciples of Christ. It
alleges that the FMA "reflects a fundamental disregard for individual
civil rights."

The Rev. Barry Lynn, who heads Americans United for Separation of
Church and State, helped orchestrate the letter.

"Religious groups and religious individuals in America have very
differing views about marriage and what is or is not acceptable within
the church," Lynn said. "I don't think the federal government should
be amending the Constitution to reflect only one religious viewpoint."

Tom Minnery, vice president of government and public policy at Focus
on the Family, finds the letter sad — but humorous.

"That's a mind-boggling thing when you think about it for two
seconds," he explained. "For example: ‘Thou shalt not steal' is a
religious concept.' "

Society is better off, he added, because that religious idea is
defined in law.

Mark Tooley of the Institute on Religion and Democracy said the groups
signing the letter represent less than 10 percent of America 's church
members.

"Even these purported spokesmen of the denominations represented there
don't represent all of their claimed constituency," Tooley said.

Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council, agreed.

"I don't think you should be surprised," he said, that a few liberal
churches within denominations that have compromised on the truth of
Scripture would oppose marriage as being between a man and a woman."


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matthew 19:3-5 (NRSV)
3 Some Pharisees came to him, and to test him they asked, "Is it
lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any cause?" 4 He answered,
"Have you not read that the one who made them at the beginning ‘made
them male and female,' 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave
his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall
become one flesh'



Leviticus 18:22 (NRSV)
22 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an
abomination.



End
Post by martus
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Ninure Saunders
2004-06-09 13:20:34 UTC
Permalink
Defend marriage just as God has ordered

As certain politicians work diligently to prevent marriage between two
people of the same sex, others of us have been busy drafting a
Constitutional Amendment codifying all marriages entirely on biblical
principles. After all, God wouldn't want us to pick and choose which of
the Scriptures we elevate to civil law and which we choose to ignore:

Draft of a Constitutional Amendment to Defend Biblical Marriage:

* Marriage in the United States of America shall consist of a union
between one man and one or more women. (Gen 29:17-28; II Sam 3:2-5.)

* Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take concubines in addition
to his wife or wives. (II Sam 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chron 11:21)

* A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If
the wife is not a virgin, she shall be executed. (Deut 22:13-21)

* Marriage of a believer and a non-believer shall be forbidden. (Gen 24:3;
Num 25:1-9; Ezra 9:12; Neh 10:30)

* Since marriage is for life, neither the US Constitution nor any state
law shall permit divorce. (Deut 22:19; Mark 10:9-12)

* If a married man dies without children, his brother must marry the
widow. If the brother refuses to marry the widow, or deliberately does not
give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise
punished in a manner to be determined by law.
(Gen. 38:6-10; Deut 25:5-10)

* In lieu of marriage (if there are no acceptable men to be found), a
woman shall get her father drunk and have sex with him.(Gen 19:31-36)

I hope this helps to clarify the finer details of the Government's
righteous struggle against the infidels and heathens among us.
Happy New Year!

Elisia and Carrie



http://www.thecommongood.org/CGN/3_3/biblicalmarriage.html

Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
http://Rainbow-Christian.tk

The Lord is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
http://Ninure-Saunders.tk

My latest Poll
Who would Jesus vote for?
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Votelet/34458


My Yahoo Group
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My Online Diary
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Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches
http://www.MCCchurch.org

To send e-mail, remove nohate from address
vera
2004-06-13 21:15:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ninure Saunders
http://www.thecommongood.org/CGN/3_3/biblicalmarriage.html
Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
http://Rainbow-Christian.tk
The Lord is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
http://Ninure-Saunders.tk
My latest Poll
Who would Jesus vote for?
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Votelet/34458
My Yahoo Group
http://Ninure.tk
My Online Diary
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-
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To send e-mail, remove nohate from address
Ninure Saunders
2004-06-14 13:43:14 UTC
Permalink
In article <***@uni-berlin.de>, "vera"
<***@acc-growing-deeper.de> wrote:

-In news:RainbowChristiannohate-***@h-68-164-15-240.chcgilgm.dynamic.covad.net,
-Ninure Saunders <***@Rainbow-Christian.tk> wrote:
-> http://www.thecommongood.org/CGN/3_3/biblicalmarriage.html
->
-> Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
-> http://Rainbow-Christian.tk
->
-> The Lord is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
-> http://Ninure-Saunders.tk
->
-> My latest Poll
-> Who would Jesus vote for?
-> http://www.network54.com/Hide/Votelet/34458
->
->
-> My Yahoo Group
-> http://Ninure.tk
->
-> My Online Diary
-> http://www.ninure.deardiary.net
-> -
-> Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches
-> http://www.MCCchurch.org
->
-> To send e-mail, remove nohate from address

I reallu do not understand why someone who supposedly ibjects to the way
I "sign" my posts would delete everything in my post EXCEPT the "sig"?



Doesn't make a whole ot of sense to me.
vera
2004-06-14 14:23:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ninure Saunders
-> http://www.thecommongood.org/CGN/3_3/biblicalmarriage.html
->
-> Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
-> http://Rainbow-Christian.tk
->
-> The Lord is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
-> http://Ninure-Saunders.tk
->
-> My latest Poll
-> Who would Jesus vote for?
-> http://www.network54.com/Hide/Votelet/34458
->
->
-> My Yahoo Group
-> http://Ninure.tk
->
-> My Online Diary
-> http://www.ninure.deardiary.net
-> -
-> Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches
-> http://www.MCCchurch.org
->
-> To send e-mail, remove nohate from address
I reallu do not understand why someone who supposedly ibjects to the
way I "sign" my posts would delete everything in my post EXCEPT the
"sig"?
Doesn't make a whole ot of sense to me.
Paradox intervening.

I wanted to point out what your posts are about. An interpretation.

::: vera :::
--
:::::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de ::::::::::
:::::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm ::::::::::
Rev 22:15 Outside [are] the dogs and the sorcerers and the sexual sinners and the
murderers and the idolaters and every one affectionately loving and practicing falsehood.
vera
2004-06-14 14:22:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ninure Saunders
http://www.thecommongood.org/CGN/3_3/biblicalmarriage.html
Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
http://Rainbow-Christian.tk
The Lord is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
http://Ninure-Saunders.tk
My latest Poll
Who would Jesus vote for?
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Votelet/34458
My Yahoo Group
http://Ninure.tk
My Online Diary
http://www.ninure.deardiary.net
-
Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches
http://www.MCCchurch.org
To send e-mail, remove nohate from address
martus
2004-06-14 19:27:17 UTC
Permalink
Anglican Templer Knights
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So Benny Hinn is participating in the deceptive peace process that
will mislead the Jews to receive a false Christ, who will drive them
from the Holy Land which will then become the headquarters of said
Antichrist, who will place the Abomination of Desolation therein
(Matt. 24:16) and proclaim himself to be God. "...that man of
sin...the son of perdition; who opposeth and exalteth himself above
all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God
sitteth in the temple of God, shewing
himself that he is God." (II Thes.2:3-4) Evangelical Christians seem
strangely ignorant of the end-time prophecies, judging from their
support for the Antichrist's program with millions of dollars in
donations to ministries like Benny Hinn's -- $$$$$$ that will be spent
rebuilding the Masonic Temple of Solomon.

The Anglican Templar organization with Jesuit leadership that Benny
works with also promotes Christian reconciliation with homosexuals and
the ordination of homosexuals as ministers, priests and bishops. The
Knights Templar were the powerful medieval chivalric order from which
the present orders of Freemasonry evolved. They claim to be working to
restore traditional values, however, the evidence of history presents
a rather different testimony as to moral values of the Templars. Dr.
Cathy Burns wrote of the homosexual proclivities of the medieval
Templars in her book, /Hidden Secrets of the Eastern Star/:

"In the book entitled /The Guilt of the Templars, /we are told that
'the Knights Templar's confessions show them to have been basically
homosexual warrior order...' Other chargers were that the Knights
Templar participated in black magic and pederasty (anal intercourse,
usually with a boy). They practiced 'phallicism
<http://watch.pair.com/new-religion.html#21.G>or sex-worship and
Satanism and venerated 'The Baphomet,' the idol of the Luciferians.
The
crime of sodomy was a rite of Templar
initiation." (p.104)


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Britain to give gay couples equal rights

LONDON, Nov. 10 (UPI) -- Next week's Queen's Speech to be read in
British parliament will suggest same-sex couples be given the same
rights as married couples, a report said Monday.

In what amounts to legal recognition of "gay marriage," thousands of
gay couples will be able to register their partnerships and benefit
from inheritance, tax and next-of-kin rights, the Times of London
reported.

The Civil Partnerships Bill would be the most far-reaching change to
British laws relating to homosexuality since gay sex was legalized in
the 1960s, the newspaper said.

Under the proposed legislation, which will also apply in Scotland, gay
couples will be able to sign an official document at a registry office
in front of the registrar and two witnesses, although this would not
be taken as a "marriage ceremony".

The scheme would include "divorce," with maintenance claims. Gay
couples who split would have access to legal aid to sort out disputes
over contact with children or finances.

(**suprise suprise**)

=====================================================================================
Daniel 11:37 (KJV)
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, NOR THE DESIRE OF
WOMEN, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Prince Charles flies back into vortex of scandal
John Arlidge and Jessica Hodgson
Sunday November 9, 2003
The Observer
Prince Charles flies back to Britain today after his two-week tour of
India and the Middle East as the scandal over allegations of a sexual
incident involving him and a royal servant(male) reaches new heights.
Internet sites in Europe and the US yesterday published lurid details
of the alleged incident while British newspapers, gagged by a court
injunction, subjected the prince to the worst criticism he has faced.
Clarence House was bracing itself for fresh revelations in today's
newspapers.
(rest cut)
=================================================================================
Pastor Urges Episcopalians to Shun 'Church of Anti-Christ'
Jim Brown and Jody Brown
Agape Press
A best-selling Christian author and pastor is encouraging believers to
separate themselves from the Anglican Episcopal Church.
On Sunday, November 2, the Episcopal Church USA consecrated a
homosexual man, Vicki Gene Robinson, as bishop of New Hampshire. The
ceremony was the culmination of months of heated debate within ECUSA
over Robinson's election to the post -- and likely the catalyst to
what the worldwide leaders of the Anglican Communion have stated will
put the unity of their denomination "in jeopardy" and "tear the fabric
of the communion at its deepest level." The denomination also allows
same-sex "blessing" ceremonies.
Dr. John MacArthur is pastor of Grace Community Church in Sun Valley,
California, a best-selling author, and host of the worldwide radio
program "Grace to You." gty.org) Regarding the recent steps taken by
the Episcopal Church, MacArthur minces no words, saying the church is
not the Church of Jesus Christ but "the church of Anti-Christ. The
denomination, he says, should be shunned because of its unbiblical
actions.
"This is not the true Church. Their theology is aberrant, their
conduct is aberrant, and they engage themselves in things that are
utterly ungodly and unbiblical," MacArthur says. "I think you have to
see it as the church of Anti-Christ -- and why would a believer want
to be a part of the church of Anti-Christ?"
MacArthur admits he was not surprised to see the Episcopal Church
consecrate an openly homosexual bishop. He says for years the
denomination has reinvented the gospel.
"Their view of Christ is apostate, therefore their view of everything
else is warped and twisted. So this is no stretch for them; this is
normal conduct for an organization that is opposed to Jesus Christ and
the Word of God," he says. "If anybody in it [the Episcopal Church]
is a true believer, they need to get out."
MacArthur says Christians should heed the Apostle Paul's warning to
the Corinthians when he told them not to be "unequally yoked together
with unbelievers" in any spiritual enterprise. In his recent book
Hard to Believe, the author-pastor confronts man-centered theology
being promoted in many evangelical churches.
Story by Paul Majendie
When he eventually takes over as King and Supreme Governor of the
Anglican Church of England,Charles sees himself as "Defender of
Faiths"
in a country that is a multicultural mix.
(i.e all faiths)
2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 (NRSV)
2 As to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered
together to him, we beg you, brothers and sisters, 2 not to be quickly
shaken in mind or alarmed, either by spirit or by word or by letter,
as though from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord is already
here. 3 Let no one deceive you in any way; for that day will not come
unless the rebellion comes first and the lawless one is revealed, the
one destined for destruction.
4 He opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object
of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, declaring
himself to be God.
==================================================================================
Isaiah 14:10-21 (NRSV)
10 All of them will speak and say to you: "You too have become as weak
as we!
You have become like us!"11 Your pomp is brought down to Sheol,and the
sound of your harps; maggots are the bed beneath you,and worms are
your covering.
12 How you are fallen from heaven,O Day Star, son of Dawn!
How you are cut down to the ground,you who laid the nations low!
13 You said in your heart,"I will ascend to heaven;
I will raise my throne above the stars of God;I will sit on the mount
of assembly on the heights of Zaphon;
14 I will ascend to the tops of the clouds,I will make myself like the
Most High."15 But you are brought down to Sheol,to the depths of the
Pit.
"Is this the man who made the earth tremble,who shook kingdoms,17 who
made the world like a desert and overthrew its cities,who would not
let his prisoners go home?"
18 All the kings of the nations lie in glory,each in his own tomb;19
but you are cast out, away from your grave,like loathsome
carrion,clothed with the dead, those pierced by the sword,who go down
to the stones of the Pit,like a corpse trampled underfoot.
20 You will not be joined with them in burial,because you have
destroyed your land,you have killed your people. May the descendants
of evildoers nevermore be named!
21 Prepare slaughter for his sons because of the guilt of their
father.
Let them never rise to possess the earth or cover the face of the
world with cities.
==================================================================================
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/martsindex.htm
Has Prince Charles found his true spiritual home on a Greek rock?

Visits spark claims of royal's commitment to Orthodoxy

Helena Smith in Athens
Wednesday May 12, 2004
The Guardian

On Monday night a resplendent yacht docked at the watery entrance to
the world's only monastic republic. A middle-aged man, followed by two
bodyguards, stepped on to the jetty of the peninsula in northern
Greece and into the "state" known variously as Mount Athos, Aghio Oros
and the Holy Mount.
A few monks in black robes and pillar-box hats stood waiting, but,
under orders to keep the identity of this particular pilgrim secret,
it was a reception without fanfare. Their guest - clean-shaven in
contrast to the bearded clerics - was Prince Charles, on his third
clandestine retreat to Athos in the past 12 months.

According to friends and associates of the prince, the future head of
the Church of England has become enamoured of the Orthodox faith to
the point that he has adorned a section of his home at Highgrove with
prized Byzantine icons. Many are believed to originate from the Mount,
the Orthodox world's holiest site.

"There is no question that the British royal is Orthodox in his
heart," confided one Athonite monk, making a rare trip outside the
remote republic. "Sadly, he is very constrained by his position."

Athos, they say, encapsulates Charles's profound admiration for
tradition, ancient wisdom and a divine natural order - even if it has
maintained a ban on women since AD1060.

Women are still forbidden from going within 500 metres of the monks'
republic. Yellow signs along the shores of the 400-square-mile
peninsula shoo away "female intruders", despite growing calls within
the EU to have the ban lifted. For the nearly 2,000 monks who have
devoted their lives to shunning sexual desire through prayer, the
Virgin Mary is the only acceptable female presence.

The prince, like his friend, the composer Sir John Tavener, who
converted to Greek Orthodoxy in 1977, is said to be especially drawn
to the Orthodox church's rugged spirituality. Orthodox faithful are
allowed to marry up to three times.

Not since the Stuarts has an heir to the throne taken such an
intellectual interest in religion. For years Charles, who assumes the
title of Defender of the Faith when he becomes king, has displayed an
unprecedented interest in denominations as divergent as Islam and
Buddhism.

But his regular meetings with Ephraim, the abbot of Vatopedion - his
adopted monastery on the Mount - have helped fuel speculation that the
prince is being personally instructed in eastern Christianity, even if
it is fiercely denied by courtiers.

The Cypriot-born abbot is said to be a frequent visitor to Highgrove.

Witnesses say that when the prince arrived in Athos days after the
death of Princess Diana almost seven years ago, it was Ephraim who
induced him to join the faith. Closeted in a chamber alone with the
abbot, Charles is believed to have made a "spiritual commitment" to
Christian Orthodoxy.

"What people forget is that Orthodoxy is in his family," Archbishop
Grigorios of Thyateira, who heads the 500,000-strong Orthodox
community in Britain, told the Guardian.

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"One of Charles's aunts, the Grand Duchess Eugenia, was proclaimed an
Orthodox saint after she was murdered in Moscow where she had
established a monastery. His paternal grandmother, Aliki [Alice], was
a nun for most of her life. She spoke very good Greek and in her later
years, when she came to live in London, she kept an Orthodox chapel in
Buckingham Palace," added the prelate. "Aliki was a very powerful
woman whom I'm sure had a very strong influence on Charles in his
early years."

As the religious centre of eastern Orthodoxy, Athos is a magnet for
pilgrims dedicated to the faith. Many - as testified by the growing
number of monks from the EU, Canada, Australia and the US - don't look
back. And among Europe's wealthy blue bloods, the luxuriant territory
is seen as the perfect "detox" getaway.

But the prince's affection for a place where visitors sleep on lumpy
mattresses and rise at 4am has also raised the inevitable question of
whether the heir to the throne harbours desires of eventually
converting to the religion.

Prince Philip, his Corfu-born father who like Charles is an honorary
member of the Friends of Mount Athos, had to switch to Anglicanism
from Greek Orthodoxy to marry the Queen.

In their large, decaying monasteries the clerics cherish the sort of
Spartan conditions that Charles hated at Gordonstoun, his stern
Scottish boarding school. Most also make no secret of their loathing
of other western religions.

In the wake of last year's allegations of rape and the sale of gifts
which engulfed the house of Windsor and its staff, senior Greek
Orthodox priests launched a spirited defence of the prince. Many
denounced the claims as an "international conspiracy" unleashed by
forces bent on destroying the reluctant royal's new-found affection
for the religion.

"All these attacks against Charles are doubtless due to the fact that
he has embraced Orthodoxy," said His Beatitude, Anthimos, the Bishop
of Alexandroupolis. "If his Orthodox beliefs were ever to be made
official, people would find it very troubling."

Officially, St James's Palace says the prince's trips to the car-free
Mount are a purely "personal affair".

"He goes there as a private individual, not in his official capacity
as the Prince of Wales," said Kirstine Clark, a spokeswoman at the
palace. "Visits are very much in his private time, so we don't issue
details. What I can say is that he is interested in the architecture
and spirituality of Mount Athos."

But, perhaps because he stands to become the Supreme Governor of the
Church of England, Charles is also unusually sensitive about his trips
to the Mount. His visits have been shrouded in secrecy. Countless
Greeks with access to the community told the Guardian they were under
oath never to mention them.

Government officials and diplomats are politely told not to escort the
prince to Vatopedion, which he helped restore with money from the
auction of his watercolours.

Attending the opening of the newly refurbished monastery last year,
the prince said he hoped each of the Mount's 23 monasteries would soon
regain their former splendour. He would, he said, work hard to ensure
that happened.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Canadian Church Affirms Same-Sex Unions
Thursday June 3, 2004 6:01 PM
By RICHARD N. OSTLING
AP Religion Writer
ST. CATHARINES, Ontario (AP) - The Anglican Church of Canada approved
a measure Thursday to ``affirm the integrity and sanctity of committed
adult same sex relationships.''
The move stops short of authorizing dioceses to hold same-sex blessing
ceremonies but is still likely to complicate efforts aimed at unifying
the 77 million-member Anglican Communion. The worldwide Anglican body
is deeply divided over homosexuality.
Delegates to a national church meeting handed the victory to
supporters of gays and lesbians as a consolation prize the morning
after they voted to delay any national go-ahead on church blessing
ceremonies for same-sex couples till 2007 and possibly 2010.
The ``integrity and sanctity'' measure was approved by a show of
hands.
World Anglican unity was one reason widely cited for delay on the
same-sex rituals bill, which would have authorized the ceremonies
under a so-called ``local option'' - meaning each diocese could decide
for itself whether to offer them.
Anglicanism is already split over consecration of an openly gay bishop
in the U.S. Episcopal Church and an emergency commission is pondering
how to hold the 38 self-governing national churches together. Many
bishops in Africa, Asia, Latin America and the Mideast are furious
over the Americans' move.
Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams released a statement that
welcomed the Canadian vote on Wednesday, but ignored the action on
Thursday.
``It is important that the Canadian church has held back from a
structural shift that would have run counter to the pleas and wishes
of ... so many around the Communion,'' he said.
The Canadian church action comes in the midst of a federal election
campaign in which full-fledged gay marriage is an issue.
Its ``sanctity'' measure also goes beyond wording put on paper by the
Episcopal Church. The American church passed a measure last year
acknowledging that some dioceses are allowing same-sex blessing
ceremonies, but not affirming the practice as a national policy.
The last-minute ``sanctity'' measure was introduced by Canon Garth
Bulmer from the Ottawa Diocese.
The Rev. Dennis Drainville of the Quebec Diocese, who seconded
Bulmer's motion, told delegates the church needs to express
compassion.
``This says to thousands of people that we love you, we include you
among the faithful, we seek to live with you, to work with you, to
know you,'' he said.
But the Rev. Peter Moore, a former Toronto rector now in the United
States as president of Trinity Episcopal School for Ministry, said
Bulmer's bill ``seems to intentionally confuse the voice with which
the Canadian church speaks on sexual morality, which undercuts the
church's ability to speak on anything.''
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anglican church of England that bends to the habits of it supreme
leader, the future king.
This same church that was first created because the original church
would not bow down to the king wishes of that time and go against
bible teaching.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-17 15:46:39 UTC
Permalink
Guess who's at super-secret Bilderberg meeting today
Italy hosts 50th-anniversary confab of mysterious society of world
leaders

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: June 4, 2004
1:00 a.m. Eastern



© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com

The 50th anniversary conference of the elite Bilderberg group – which
many believe conspires semi-annually to foster global government – is
under way in Stresa, Italy.

The conference, which began yesterday and will run through Sunday, is
being hosted at the Grand Hotel des Iles Borromees.

Since 1953, the Bilderberg group has convened government, business,
academic and journalistic representatives from the U.S., Canada and
Europe with the express purpose of exploring the future of the North
Atlantic community.

According to sources that have penetrated the high-security meetings
in the past, the Bilderberg meetings emphasize a globalist agenda and
promote the idea that the notion of national sovereignty is antiquated
and regressive.

'Shadowy aura'

"It's officially described as a private gathering," noted a BBC report
last year, "but with a guest list including the heads of European and
American corporations, political leaders and a few intellectuals, it's
one of the most influential organizations on the planet."

And according to a current BBC report on the conference in Stresa:
"Not a word of what is said at Bilderberg meetings can be breathed
outside. No reporters are invited in and while confidential minutes of
meetings are taken, names are not noted. The shadowy aura extends
further – the anonymous answerphone message, for example; the fact
that conference venues are kept secret. The group, which includes
luminaries such as Henry Kissinger and former UK chancellor Kenneth
Clarke, does not even have a website."

But, counter participants, the secrecy is not evidence of a grand
conspiracy, but only an opportunity to speak frankly with other world
leaders out of the limelight of press coverage and its inevitable
repercussions.

"There's absolutely nothing in it," argues the UK's Lord Denis Healey,
one of the four founders of Bilderberg. "We never sought to reach a
consensus on the big issues at Bilderberg," he told the BBC. "It's
simply a place for discussion."

Here is the partial guest list of the current meeting obtained by
WorldNetDaily – which includes Senators John Edwards, D-N.C. and Jon
Corzine, D-N.J., Henry Kissinger, Richard Perle, Melinda Gates (wife
of



Bill Gates),





David Rockefeller, Timothy F. Geithner, president of the Federal
Reserve Bank of New York, Donald Graham, chairman and CEO of the
Washington Post Company, and even Ralph Reed, former head of the
Christian Coalition:


N - Auser, Svein - CEO, DnB NOR ASA; D - Ackermann, Josef - Chairman,
Group Executive Committee, Deutsche Bank AG; I - Ambrosetti, Alfredo -
Chairman, Abbrosetti Group; TR - Babacan, Ali - Minister of Economic
Affairs; P - Balsemao, Francisco Pinto - Chairman and CEO, IMPRESA,
SGPS, Former Prime Minister; ISR - Barnavie, Elie - Department of
General History, Tel-Aviv University; I - Benedetti, Rodolfo De - CEO,
CIR; I - Bernabe, Franco - Vice Chairman, Rothschild Europe; F -
Beytout, Nicolas - Editor In Chief, Les Echos; INT - Bolkestein, Frits
- Commissioner for the Internal Market, European Commission, former
leader of Dutch right wing Liberal Party VVD; USA - Boot, Max -
Neoconservative, Council on foreign Relations, Features Editor, Wall
Street Journal; CH - Borel, Daniel - Chairman, Logitech International
S.A.; I - Bortoli, Ferrucio de - CEO, RCS Libri; S - Brock, Gunnar -
CEO, Atlas Copco AB; GB - Browne, John - Group Chief Executive, BP
plc; NL - Burgmans, Antony - Chairman, Unilever NV; F - Camus,
Phillipe - CEO, European Aeronautic Defence and Space NV; I -
Caracciolo, Lucio - Director, Limes Geopolitical Review; F - Castries,
Henri de - Chairman, AXA Insurance; E - Cebrian, Juan Luis - CEO,
PRISA (Spanish language media company), former Chairman, International
Press Institute; TR - Cemal, Hasan - Senior Columnist, Milliyet
Newspaper; GB - Clarke, Kenneth - Member of Parliament (Con.), Deputy
Chairman, British American Tobacco; USA - Collins, Timothy C - MD and
CEO, Ripplewood Holdings LLC, Yale School of Management, Trilateral
Commission; USA - Corzine, Jon S. - Senator (D, New Jersey), Chairman
and CEO, Goldman Sachs; CH - Couchepin, Pascal - Former Swiss
President, Head of Home affairs Dept.; GR - David, George A. -
Chairman, Coca-Cola Hellenic Bottling Company SA; B - Dehaene,
Jean-Luc - Former Prime Minister, Mayor of Vilvoorde; TR - Dervis,
Kemal - Member of Parliament, former senior World bank official; GR -
Diamantopoulou, Anna - Member of Parliament, former European
Commissioner for Social Affairs; USA - Donilon, Thomas L -
Vice-President, Fannie Mae, Council on Foreign Relations; I - Draghi,
Mario - Vice Chairman and Managing Director, Goldman Sachs; USA -
Edwards, John - Senator (D. North Carolina), Democratic Presidential
Candidate; DK - Eldrup, Anders - Chairman, DONG gas company (becoming
privatised) A/S; DK - Federspiel, Ulrik - Ambassador to the USA; USA -
Feith, Douglas J. - Undersecretary for Policy, Department of Defense;
I - Galateri, Gabriele - Chairman, Mediobanca; USA - Gates, Melinda F.
- Co-Founder, Gates Foundation, wife of Bill Gates; USA - Geithner,
Timothy F. - President, Federal Reserve Bank of New York; I -
Giavazzi, Francesco - Professor of Economics, Bocconi University;
adviser, world bank and European Central bank; IRL - Gleeson, Dermot -
Chairman Allied Irish Bank Group (currently being investigated for
personal and corporate tax evasion); USA - Graham, Donald E. -
Chairman and CEO, Washington Post Company; USA - Haas, Richard N. -
President, Council on Foreign Relations, former Director of Policy and
Planning staff, State Department; NL - Halberstadt, Victor - Professor
of Economics, Leiden University; B - Hansen, Jean-Pierre - Chairman,
Suez Tractabel SA; S - Heikensten, Lars - Governor, Swedish Central
Bank; USA - Holbrooke, Richard C - Vice Chairman, Perseus, former
Director, Council on Foreign Relations, former Assistant Secretary of
State; USA - Hubbard, Allen B - President E&A Industries; USA -
Issacson, Walter - President and CEO, Aspen Institute; USA - Janow,
Merit L. - Professor, International Economic Law and International
Affairs, Columbia University; USA - Jordan, Vernon E. Senior Managing
Director, Lazard Freres & Co LLC; USA - Kagan, Robert - Senior
Associate, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace; GB - Kerr, John
- Director, Shell, Rio Tinto, Scottish American Investment Trust; USA
- Kissinger Henry A. - Chairman, Kissinger Associates Inc.; TR - Koc,
Mustafa V. - Chairman, Koc Holdings AS; NL - Koenders, Bert (AG) -
Member of Parliament, president, Parliamentary Network of the World
Bank; USA - Kovner, Bruce - Chairman Caxton Associates LLC, Chairman,
American Enterprise Institute; USA - Kravis, Henry R. - Founding
Partner, Kohlberg Kravis Roberts & Co., acquisitions financier; USA -
Kravis, Marie Josee - Senoir Fellow, Hudson Institute Inc.; FIN -
Lehtomaki, Paula - Minister of Foreigh Trade and Development; FIN -
Lipponen, Paavo - Speaker of Parliament; CHN - Long, Yongtu -
Secretary General, Boao forum for Asia; P - Lopes, Pedro M. Santana -
Mayor of Lisbon; USA - Luti, William J. - Deputy Under Secretary of
Defense for Near Eastern and South Asian Affairs; CDN - Lynch, Kevin
G. - Deputy Minister, Department of Finance; USA - Mathews, Jessica T.
- President, Carnegie Endowment for International War Peace; USA -
McDonough, William J. - Chairman and CEO, Public Company Accounting
Oversight Board, former president, Federal Reserve Bank of New York;
CDN - McKenna, Frank - Counsel, McInnes Cooper, former premier of New
Brunswick; I - Merlini, Cesare - Executive Vice Chairman, Council for
the United States and Italy, Council on Foreign Relations, former
director, Italian Institute for International Affairs; F - Montbrial,
Thierry de - President, French Institute of International Relations;
INT - Monti, Mario - Competition Commissioner, European Commission;
USA - Mundie, Craig J. - Chief Technical Officer, Advanced Strategies
and Policies, Microsoft Corporation; N - Myklebust, Egil - Chairman,
Scandinavian Airline System (SAS); D - Naas, Matthias - Deputy Editor,
Die Zeit; NL - Netherlands, HM Queen Beatrix; GB - Neville-Jones,
Pauline - Chairman, QuinetiQ (UK privatized military research/services
company), governor of the BBC, Chairman Information Assurance Advisory
Council, formar Chairman Joint Intelligence Committee, former Managing
Director NatWest Markets; USA - Nooyi, Indra K. - President and CEO,
PepsiCo Inc.; PL - Olechowski, Andrzej - Leader, Civic Platform; FIN -
Ollila, Jorma - Chairman, Nokia Corporation; INT - Padoa-Schioppa,
Tommaso - Director, European Central Bank; CY - Pantelides, Leonidas -
Ambassador to Greece; I - Passera, Corrado - CEO, Banca Intesa SpA;
USA - Perle, Richard N. - Resident Fellow, American Enterprise
Institute for Public Policy Research, former Likud policy adviser,
former chair Defence Policy Board, former co-chairman, Hollinger
Digital; B - Phillipe,


HRH Prince;



USA - Reed, Ralph E. - President, Century Strategies; CDN - Reisman,
Heather - President and CEO, Indigo Books and Music Inc.; I - Riotta,
Gianni - Editorialist, Corriere della Serra; USA - Rockefeller, David
- Member JP Morgan International Council, Chairman, Council of the
Americas; E - Riodriguez Inearte, Matias - Vice Chairman, Grupo
Santander; USA - Ross, Dennis B - Director, The Washington Institute
for Near East Policy; D - Sandschneider, Eberhard - Director, Research
Institute, German Society for Foreign Policy; I - Scaroni, Paolo -
CEO, Enel SpA; D - Schilly, Otto - Minister of the Interior; USA -
Schnabel, Rockwell A. - Ambassador to the EU; A - Scholten, Rudolf -
Director, Oesterreichische Kontrollbank AG; D - Schrempp, Jurgen E. -
Chairman, DaimlerChrysler AG; E - Serra Rexach, Eduardo - Head, Real
Institute Elcano; RUS - Shevtsova, Lilia - Senior Associate. Carnegie
Endowment for International Peace; PL - Sikora, Slawomir - President
and CEO, Citibank Handlowy; I - Siniscalo, Domenico - Director General
Ministry of the Economy; P - Socrates, Jose - Member of Parliament;
USA - Strmecki, Marin J. - Smith Richardson Foundation; B - Struye de
Swielande, Dominique - Permanant repressentative of Belguim, NATO; IRL
- Sutherland, Peter D. - Chairman, Goldman Sachs International,
Chairman, BP plc; USA - Thornton, John L. - Chairman, Brookings
Institution, Professor, Tsinghua University; I - Tremonti, Giulio -
Minister of Economy and Finance; INT - Trichet, Jean-Claude -
President, European Central Bank; I - Tronchetti Provera, Marco -
Chairman and CEO, Pirelli SpA; N - Underdal, Arild - Rector,
University of Oslo; CH - Vasella, Daniel L. - Chairman and CEO,
Novartis AG; NL - Veer, Jeroen van der - Chairman, Committee of
Managing Directors, Royal Dutch/Shell; GB - Verwaayen, Ben J. M. -
CEO, British Telecom; former director, Lucent Technologies; I - Visco,
Ignazio - Foriegn Affairs Manager, Banca D'Italia; INT - Vitorino,
Antonio M. - Justice and Home Affairs Commissioner, European Union;
INT - Vries, Gijs M. de - EU Counter Terrorism Co-ordinator; S -
Wallenberg, Jacob - Chairman, SEB investments (including biotech);
Chairman, W Capital Management AB; D - Weber, Jurgen - Chairman of the
Supervisory Board, Deutche Lufthansa AG; GB/USA - Weinberg, Peter -
CEO, Goldman Sachs International; NL - Wijers, Hans - Chairman,
AkzoNobel NV; D - Wissmann, Matthias - Member of Parliament; GB -
Wolf, Martin H. - Associate Editor/Economic Commentator, The Financial
Times; INT/USA - Wolfenson, James D. - President, The World Bank; RUS
- Yavlinsky, Grigory A. - Member of Parliament; USA - Yergin, Daniel -
Chairman, Cambridge Energy Research Associates; D - Zumwinkel, Llaus -
Chairman, Deutche Post Worldnet AG.

In addition, according to the Bilderberg.org website, two reporters
("rapporteurs") from the British publication The Economist will also
be attending: Gideon Rachman, Brussels correspondent, and Adrian D.
Wooldridge, the magazine's foreign correspondent.

That may afford slightly more transparency than in the past. In 1998,
British free-lance journalist Campbell Thomas attempted to cover the
conference in Turnberry, Scotland, for the Daily Mail. Thomas began by
seeking the opinions of neighbors to the secret meeting being held
nearby. One of those was a young woman who told him he was in the
hotel's staff quarters and should leave immediately, which he did. A
short while later, two local police officers arrested Thomas, who
reportedly remained in custody for eight hours.

British journalist Jon Ronson, who is the author of a book on
Bilderberg, had this to say: "I'm a sort of semi-conspiracy theorist
when it comes to Bilderberg because I think they wouldn't go to that
much trouble of having this incredibly expensive international
conference every year and they'd go to all this trouble to keep
themselves out of the press and be really secret and invite the
world's most powerful people if it was just a chat and a game of golf,
which is basically what they say it is. So I do think they have some
impact on world affairs."

Some observers are even speculating that President Bush will make an
appearance at this year's event, just as Bill Clinton did at the
group's 2000 meeting. By coincidence, it just happens that Bush will
be in Italy over the weekend …





----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Daniel 11:36-39 (DARBY)

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt
himself, and magnify himself above every god, and speak monstrous
things against the God of gods; and he shall prosper until the
indignation be accomplished: for that which is determined shall be
done. 37 And he will not regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire
of women; nor regard any god: for he will magnify himself above all.
38 And in his place will he honour the god of *fortresses; and a god
whom his fathers knew not will he honour with gold and silver, and
with precious stones and pleasant things.

39 And he will practise in the strongholds of fortresses with a
strange god: whoso acknowledgeth him will he increase with glory; and
he shall cause them to rule over the many, and shall divide the land
to them for a reward.

(*Strongholds/fortresses of power)
Post by martus
End
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martus
2004-06-27 08:43:39 UTC
Permalink
FALLEN ANGELS AND DEMONS
There is a great deal of misunderstanding regarding the fallen angels
and the demons. Many people believe these designations are simply
different names for the same beings. However, this assumption is
inaccurate. In this article, we will examine the origin and activities
of both these evil entities, and look at what the Scriptures and other
reliable sources say about them.

The Scriptures don't explicitly tell us when the angelic realm was
created. However, the available information implies that the angels
were formed on the first day of creation, after God created the
heavens but before he made the earth (Gen. 1:1). Passages from Job and
Nehemiah seem to bolster this view:

JOB 38:4 "Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth? Tell
Me, if you have understanding, 5 Who set its measurements? Since you
know. Or who stretched the line on it? 6 On what were its bases sunk?
Or who laid its cornerstone, 7 When the morning stars sang together
and all the sons of God shouted for joy? (NASU)
NEHEMIAH 9:6 You alone are the LORD; You have made heaven, the heaven
of heavens, with all their host, the earth and everything on it, the
seas and all that is in them, and You preserve them all. The host of
heaven worships You. (NKJV)
The expressions "morning stars" and "sons of God" used in Job 38:7
refer to the angels, as does the phrase "host of heaven" used in
Nehemiah 9:6. These passages indicate that the angelic domain was
created after the heavens, but before the earth.

Very soon after the creation, Satan (a powerful and high-ranking
cherub) sinned by tempting Eve in the Garden of Eden (Eze. 28:12-15).
For more information about the fallen angel Satan, refer to my article
"Satan, the Adversary of Mankind."

Satan's fall from grace is the first instance documented in the Bible
of angels disobeying God, but it is not the only one. There is another
incident recorded in Genesis 6 which occurred soon after Satan's
rebellion:

GENESIS 6:1 When men began to increase in number on the earth and
daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters
of men were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose. . . .
4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days -- and also afterward
-- when the sons of God went to the daughters of men and had children
by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown. (NIV)
Just as it did in Job 38:7, the term "sons of God" in Genesis 6:2, 4
refers to the angels. For detailed proof that these "sons of God" were
angels and not men, see my article "Genesis 6 - Who Were the Sons of
God?"

The ancient books of Enoch and Jubilees also record the angelic
rebellion of the "sons of God" in detail. As Hershel Shanks reveals in
his book on the Dead Sea Scrolls, these books were highly thought of
at the time the New Testament was written:

Before the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls the apocryphal book of
Enoch (more precisely, I Enoch) was known only in an Ethiopic
translation. Now as many as twenty fragmentary copies of the Aramaic
original have been found at Qumran, which suggests that Enoch and
perhaps other books now considered apocryphal were regarded as
authoritative Scripture at least by some groups. Allusions to Enoch
occur at least fourteen times in the New Testament; the New Testament
Letter of Jude quotes from Enoch as having the authority of inspired
Scripture (Jude 14-15). In some copies of the Ethiopic Bible Enoch is
included in the canon.
Jubilees, the so-called Rewritten Bible, was apparently considered
authoritative at Qumran: At least fifteen copies of this book have
been identified, an immediate indication of the importance the Qumran
sectarians attached to it. To this day, it is considered canonical by
the Abyssinian Church in Ethiopia. (pp. 160-161, The Mystery and
Meaning of the Dead Sea Scrolls)

From the Book of Enoch, we learn more about the sin of the Watchers
(Dan. 4:17), angels charged with watching over mankind:

ENOCH 6:1 And it came to pass when the children of men had multiplied
that in those days were born unto 2 them beautiful and comely
daughters. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and lusted
after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us wives
from among the children of men 3 and beget us children.' (The
Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
The Book of Jubilees also elaborates on the sin of these angels:

JUBILEES 5:1 And it came to pass when the children of men began to
multiply on the face of the earth and daughters were born unto them,
that the angels of God saw them on a certain year of this jubilee,
that they were beautiful to look upon; and they took themselves wives
of all whom they 2 chose, and they bare unto them sons and they were
giants. . . . (The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament,
R.H. Charles)
After the angels sinned by marrying human women, they bore them
gigantic hybrid children. The Bible calls these offspring nephilim,
the "mighty men of old, warriors of renown" (Gen. 6:4). When they
appear again later in the Scriptures, they are called by a variety of
names, including Rephaim, Zumim, Emim (Gen. 14:5), Anakim (Deu. 2:11),
and Zamzummim (Deu. 2:20).

The Book of Enoch and the Book of Jubilees both speak of these
crossbred beings:

ENOCH 7:1 And all the others together with them took unto themselves
wives, and each chose for himself one, and they began to go in unto
them and to defile themselves with them . . . And they 3 became
pregnant, and they bare great giants, whose height was three thousand
ells: Who consumed 4 all the acquisitions of men. And when men could
no longer sustain them, the giants turned against 5 them and devoured
mankind. And they began to sin against birds, and beasts, and
reptiles, and 6 fish, and to devour one another's flesh, and drink the
blood. Then the earth laid accusation against the lawless ones. (The
Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
JUBILEES 5:2 . . . And lawlessness increased on the earth and all
flesh corrupted its way, alike men and cattle and beasts and birds and
everything that walks on the earth - all of them corrupted their ways
and their orders, and they began to devour each other, and lawlessness
increased on the earth and every imagination of the thoughts of all
men 3 (was) thus evil continually. . . . (The Apocrypha and
Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
Both these ancient books, recorded long before the New Testament,
speak of two primary identifying signs of the pre-Flood age: (1) the
illicit marriage of the angels with humans, and (2) the voracious
eating and drinking by their hybrid offspring, the nephilim. It's very
interesting that these two signs mirror those spoken of by Yeshua when
he described the situation which would exist on the earth before his
second coming:

MATTHEW 24:37 "But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming
of the Son of Man be. 38 For as in the days before the flood, they
were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the
day that Noah entered the ark, 39 and did not know until the flood
came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man
be. (NKJV)
God was very angry at the rebellion of the Watchers, and decreed that
these wayward angels would be locked up underneath the earth in a
prison for spirits until the day of judgment. The Book of Jubilees and
the Book of Enoch both speak of this punishment:

JUBILEES 5:6 And against the angels whom He had sent upon the earth,
He was exceedingly wroth, and He gave commandment to root them out of
all their dominion, and He bade us to bind them in the depths of the
earth, and 7 behold they are bound in the midst of them, and are
(kept) separate. (The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old
Testament, R.H. Charles)
ENOCH 10:11 . . . And the Lord said unto Michael: 'Go, bind Semjaza
and his associates who have united themselves with women so as to have
defiled themselves 12 with them in all their uncleanness. And when
their sons have slain one another, and they have seen the destruction
of their beloved ones, bind them fast for seventy generations in the
valleys of the earth, till the day of their judgement and of their
consummation, till the judgement that is 13 for ever and ever is
consummated. In those days they shall be led off to the abyss of fire:
and 14 to the torment and the prison in which they shall be confined
for ever. . . .' (The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old
Testament, R.H. Charles)
The Book of Enoch and Book of Jubilees agree with the Scriptures which
show that a portion of the fallen angels are currently restrained in a
spiritual prison called "the Abyss" (Luke 8:31):

JUDE 6 And the angels who did not keep their own position, but left
their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains in deepest
darkness for the judgment of the great Day. (NRSV)
II PETER 2:4 For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast
them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be
reserved for judgment; (NKJV)
I PETER 3:19 . . . He went and preached to the spirits in prison, 20
who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering
waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which
a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water. (NKJV)
While there are clearly some fallen angels who can move around freely,
the Bible teaches that the Watchers who lusted after human women are
currently locked up in "chains of darkness."

Mankind was originally given dominion and rulership over the earth
(Gen. 1:26-28). However, the fall of man set the stage for Satan and
the angels to assume control. Several biblical passages allude to the
fact that both good and evil angels currently have different levels of
authority over the peoples of the earth:

DEUTERONOMY 32:8 When the Most High divided the nations, when he
separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the nations according
to the number of the angels of God. 9 And his people Jacob became the
portion of the Lord, Israel was the line of his inheritance.
(Brenton's LXX)
The passage of Scripture shown above is from the third-century B.C.E.
Greek translation of the Hebrew Old Testament known as the Septuagint.
When God divided mankind into 70 nations at the tower of Babel, He
apportioned rulership of the world among the angels, reserving only
the future nation of Israel for Himself. God gave the angels varying
levels of authority over the resulting nations of mankind.

In the official Jewish version of the Old Testament, the Masoretic
Text, Deuteronomy 32:8 reads "sons of Israel" (Heb. beney Yisrael)
instead of "angels of God." However, an Aramaic copy of the book of
Deuteronomy found among the Dead Sea Scrolls has "sons of God" (Heb.
beney 'elohim) instead of "sons of Israel" in verse 8. The Septuagint
translators understood that the "sons of God" spoken of in Deuteronomy
32:8 and elsewhere were the angels, and rendered it that way several
times (Deu 32:8; Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7). The ancient text found at Qumran
verifies the Septuagint rendering of this verse, indicating that the
official Jewish version was altered at a later date for some reason.

Psalm 82 speaks of the angelic council which was given rulership over
the 70 nations of the earth:

PSALM 82:1 {A Psalm of Asaph.} God has taken his place in the divine
council; in the midst of the gods he holds judgment: 2 "How long will
you judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked? Selah 3 Give
justice to the weak and the fatherless; maintain the right of the
afflicted and the destitute. 4 Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver
them from the hand of the wicked." 5 They have neither knowledge nor
understanding, they walk about in darkness; all the foundations of the
earth are shaken. 6 I say, "You are gods, sons of the Most High, all
of you; 7 nevertheless, you shall die like men, and fall like any
prince." 8 Arise, O God, judge the earth; for to thee belong all the
nations! (RSV)
In this psalm, God chastises the angelic rulers ("the gods") for their
injustice and iniquity in carrying out the responsibilities that He
has assigned to them. God tells them their fate for disobedience will
be to "die like men." Asaph ends the psalm by exhorting God to judge
the earth and its angelic rulers, because all the nations actually
belong to Him. For more information on these ruling spirit beings, see
my article "The Heavenly Divine Council."

The book of Daniel gives us some further verification of this angelic
authority over humanity.

DANIEL 10:5 I lifted my eyes and looked, and behold, a certain man
clothed in linen, whose waist was girded with gold of Uphaz! 6 His
body was like beryl, his face like the appearance of lightning, his
eyes like torches of fire, his arms and feet like burnished bronze in
color, and the sound of his words like the voice of a multitude. . . .
12 Then he said to me, "Do not fear, Daniel, for from the first day
that you set your heart to understand, and to humble yourself before
your God, your words were heard; and I have come because of your
words. 13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me
twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came
to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia.
(NKJV)
The passage above gives us a fascinating inside glimpse into the order
and activities of the spiritual realm. The angel that visited Daniel
was sent to give him an understanding of what would happen to his
people (the Jews) in "the latter days." However, this angel was
delayed for 21 days because "the prince of the kingdom of Persia"
stood against him. Here we see a three-week spiritual battle described
by one of the participants, a holy angel! Indeed, if Michael, who is
described in Dan. 12:1 as "the great prince who has charge of your
people," had not helped in this fight, Daniel's messenger might not
have been able to deliver his information.

DANIEL 10:20 Then he said, "Do you know why I have come to you? Now I
must return to fight against the prince of Persia, and when I am
through with him, the prince of Greece will come. 21 But I am to tell
you what is inscribed in the book of truth. There is no one with me
who contends against these princes except Michael, your prince."
(NRSV)
After conveying his message to Daniel, the angel states that he must
return once again to do battle with "the prince of Persia." But he
says that he will also have to combat "the prince of Greece" after he
has finished with "the Prince of Persia." The picture derived from
this brief account is one of continual spiritual warfare between the
holy angels and the numerous spirit beings who have been given
dominion over the nations of this world. For additional information on
Michael, the spiritual prince over Israel, refer to my article "Christ
in the Old Testament."

The apostle Paul takes this idea one step further by showing that
mortal Christians are also involved in this spiritual warfare:

EPHESIANS 6:12 For we are not contending against flesh and blood, but
against the principalities, against the powers, against the world
rulers of this present darkness, against the spiritual hosts of
wickedness in the heavenly places. (RSV)
The phrase "world rulers" in Ephesians 6:12 comes from the Greek word
kosmokratoras. Friberg's Analytical Lexicon to the Greek New Testament
defines this word as "one holding power over the world; plural in the
NT for devilish forces, spirit-beings who control parts of the world
system, world rulers (EP 6.12)." Paul here clearly states that the
fallen angels hold sway over the world! Paul goes on to describe the
"whole armor of God" that is needed to defeat these wicked angels in
the heavens and spiritual world rulers (Eph. 6:13-18).

In Hebrews 2:5, the author indirectly establishes the current
rulership of our world by angels:

HEBREWS 2:5 It was not under angels that He put the world to come,
about which we are speaking. (NJB)
By saying that God has not appointed angels to rule the coming world,
the author implies that the current world is being ruled by angels.
Indeed, the Bible clearly teaches that Satan is the supreme ruler and
"god" (II Cor. 4:4) of this present world.

The Bible shows that God uses fallen angels and evil spirits to
accomplish certain tasks which fulfill His plan:

I KINGS 22:19 Then Micaiah said, "Therefore hear the word of the LORD:
I saw the LORD sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven
standing by, on His right hand and on His left. 20 And the LORD said,
'Who will persuade Ahab to go up, that he may fall at Ramoth Gilead?'
So one [angel] spoke in this manner, and another [angel] spoke in that
manner. 21 Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, and
said, 'I will persuade him.' 22 The LORD said to him, 'In what way?'
So he said, 'I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all
his prophets.' And the LORD said, 'You shall persuade him, and also
prevail. Go out and do so.' 23 Therefore look! The LORD has put a
lying spirit in the mouth of all these prophets of yours, and the LORD
has declared disaster against you." (NKJV)
The story of Saul recorded in I Samuel reveals another instance where
God used an evil spirit to do His will:

I SAMUEL 16:14 Now the Spirit of the LORD departed from Saul, and an
evil spirit from the LORD tormented him. 15 And Saul's servants said
to him, "Behold now, an evil spirit from God is tormenting you. 16 Let
our lord now command your servants, who are before you, to seek out a
man who is skilful in playing the lyre; and when the evil spirit from
God is upon you, he will play it, and you will be well. . . ." 23 And
whenever the evil spirit from God was upon Saul, David took the lyre
and played it with his hand; so Saul was refreshed, and was well, and
the evil spirit departed from him. (RSV)
I SAMUEL 18:10 And on the morrow an evil spirit from God rushed upon
Saul, and he raved within his house, while David was playing the lyre,
as he did day by day. Saul had his spear in his hand; 11 and Saul cast
the spear, for he thought, "I will pin David to the wall." But David
evaded him twice. 12 Saul was afraid of David, because the LORD was
with him but had departed from Saul. (RSV)
I SAMUEL 19:9 Then an evil spirit from the LORD came upon Saul, as he
sat in his house with his spear in his hand; and David was playing the
lyre. 10 And Saul sought to pin David to the wall with the spear; but
he eluded Saul, so that he struck the spear into the wall. And David
fled, and escaped. (RSV)
In the first instance, the "lying spirit" that persuaded Ahab was one
of the "host of heaven," or an angel. But was the "evil spirit" that
God sent upon Saul an angel, or was it a demon? To understand the
difference between the two, we have to understand the fate of the
nephilim that were killed in the Flood. To do that, let's go back to
the Book of Enoch.

We've already seen from the Bible, the Book of Enoch, and the Book of
Jubilees that the Watchers were locked in the Abyss for their sins.
However, as additional punishment, God decreed that the nephilim, the
children of the angels, would be destroyed from the face of the earth:

ENOCH 12:4 . . . Enoch, thou scribe of righteousness, go, declare to
the Watchers of the heaven who have left the high heaven, the holy
eternal place, and have defiled themselves with women, and have done
as the children of earth do, and have taken unto themselves 5 wives:
"Ye have wrought great destruction on the earth: And ye shall have no
peace nor forgiveness 6 of sin: and inasmuch as they delight
themselves in their children, the murder of their beloved ones shall
they see, and over the destruction of their children shall they
lament, and shall make supplication unto eternity, but mercy and peace
shall ye not attain." (The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old
Testament, R.H. Charles)
The Bible teaches that a human being is made up of body, spirit, and
soul (I The. 5:23; Heb. 4:12). The body is the physical part of a man,
the spirit is the non-physical part, and the soul (Gr. psuche, Eng.
"psyche") is the character or personality. When a person dies
physically, their spirit (which has no consciousness apart from the
body) returns to God who gave it (Ecc. 12:7).

However, since the hybrid nephilim had both physical and spiritual
natures, they were able to survive (in a fashion) the deaths of their
physical bodies. These hybrid spirits, which were not part of God's
creation, had nowhere to go when their physical existence ceased. The
Book of Enoch tells us what became of the departed spirits of these
crossbreeds:

ENOCH 15:8 And now, the giants, who are produced from the spirits and
flesh, shall be called evil spirits upon 9 the earth, and on the earth
shall be their dwelling. Evil spirits have proceeded from their
bodies; because they are born from men and from the holy Watchers is
their beginning and primal origin; 10 they shall be evil spirits on
earth, and evil spirits shall they be called. [As for the spirits of
heaven, in heaven shall be their dwelling, but as for the spirits of
the earth which were born upon the earth, on the earth shall be their
dwelling.] And the spirits of the giants afflict, oppress, destroy,
attack, do battle, and work destruction on the earth, and cause
trouble: they take no food, but nevertheless 12 hunger and thirst, and
cause offences. And these spirits shall rise up against the children
of men and against the women, because they have proceeded from them.
(The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
The departed spirits of the nephilim became what we know as "demons."
These entities are mentioned in the Old Testament (for example, see
Lev. 17:7; Deu. 32:17; II Chr. 11:15; Psa. 106:37), and numerous times
in the New Testament, where they are called "demons," "unclean
spirits," and "evil spirits."

One of the activities of evil spirits mentioned in the Bible is that
of "familiar" or "divining" spirits. These demons appear to have the
ability to rouse the spirits of the dead from their ordained sleep.
They also seem to be able to foretell the future, to some extent. The
first mention we see of these spirits in the Scriptures is a warning
from God to avoid consorting with them or the mediums that contact
them.

LEVITICUS 19:31 "Give no regard to mediums and familiar spirits; do
not seek after them, to be defiled by them: I am the LORD your God."
(NKJV)
LEVITICUS 20: 6 "And the person who turns to mediums and familiar
spirits, to prostitute himself with them, I will set My face against
that person and cut him off from his people." (NKJV)
LEVITICUS 20:27 "A man or a woman who is a medium, or who has familiar
spirits, shall surely be put to death; they shall stone them with
stones. Their blood shall be upon them." (NKJV)
DEUTERONOMY 18:10 There shall not be found in thee one who purges his
son or his daughter with fire, one who uses divination, who deals with
omens, and augury, 11 a sorcerer employing incantation, one who has in
him a divining spirit, an observer of signs, questioning the dead.
(Brenton's LXX)
I SAMUEL 28:7 Then Saul said to his servants, Seek for me a woman who
has in her a divining spirit, and I will go to her, and enquire of
her: and his servants said to him, Behold, there is a woman who has in
her a divining spirit at Aendor. 8 And Saul disguised himself, and put
on other raiment, and he goes, and two men with him, and they come to
the woman by night; and he said to her, Divine to me, I pray thee, by
the divining spirit within thee, and bring up to me him whom I shall
name to thee. 9 And the woman said to him, Behold now, thou knowest
what Saul has done, how he has cut off those who had in them divining
spirits, and the wizards from the land, and why dost thou spread a
snare for my life to destroy it? (Brenton's LXX)
ACTS 16:16 It happened that as we were going to the place of prayer, a
slave-girl having a spirit of divination met us, who was bringing her
masters much profit by fortune-telling. 17 Following after Paul and
us, she kept crying out, saying, "These men are bond-servants of the
Most High God, who are proclaiming to you the way of salvation." 18
She continued doing this for many days. But Paul was greatly annoyed,
and turned and said to the spirit, "I command you in the name of Jesus
Christ to come out of her!" And it came out at that very moment.
(NASU)
The New Testament clearly records many instances where these evil
spirits afflicted people by taking up residence within them. Below are
a few of the examples available from the Scriptures.

MARK 7:25 But after hearing of Him, a woman whose little daughter had
an unclean spirit immediately came and fell at His feet. 26 Now the
woman was a Gentile, of the Syrophoenician race. And she kept asking
Him to cast the demon out of her daughter. 27 And He was saying to
her, "Let the children be satisfied first, for it is not good to take
the children's bread and throw it to the dogs." 28 But she answered
and said to Him, "Yes, Lord, but even the dogs under the table feed on
the children's crumbs." 29 And He said to her, "Because of this answer
go; the demon has gone out of your daughter." 30 And going back to her
home, she found the child lying on the bed, the demon having left.
(NASU)
LUKE 9:38 Suddenly a man from the multitude cried out, saying,
"Teacher, I implore You, look on my son, for he is my only child. 39
"And behold, a spirit seizes him, and he suddenly cries out; it
convulses him so that he foams at the mouth, and it departs from him
with great difficulty, bruising him. 40 So I implored Your disciples
to cast it out, but they could not." 41 Then Jesus answered and said,
"O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you and
bear with you? Bring your son here." 42 And as he was still coming,
the demon threw him down and convulsed him. Then Jesus rebuked the
unclean spirit, healed the child, and gave him back to his father.
(NKJV)
ACTS 19:11 Now God worked unusual miracles by the hands of Paul, 12 so
that even handkerchiefs or aprons were brought from his body to the
sick, and the diseases left them and the evil spirits went out of
them. 13 Then some of the itinerant Jewish exorcists took it upon
themselves to call the name of the Lord Jesus over those who had evil
spirits, saying, "We exorcise you by the Jesus whom Paul preaches." 14
Also there were seven sons of Sceva, a Jewish chief priest, who did
so. 15 And the evil spirit answered and said, "Jesus I know, and Paul
I know; but who are you?" 16 Then the man in whom the evil spirit was
leaped on them, overpowered them, and prevailed against them, so that
they fled out of that house naked and wounded. (NKJV)
During his ministry, Yeshua gave his disciples dominion and supremacy
over these unclean spirits:

LUKE 9:1 Then He called His twelve disciples together and gave them
power and authority over all demons, and to cure diseases. (NKJV)
We can conclude from this grant of authority that demons and fallen
angels are indeed separate entities. Otherwise, Yeshua's grant of
power to the twelve disciples over all demons would have included
Satan and the other angelic rulers of the divine council. Clearly this
was not the case.

In his Gospel, Luke records an incident between Christ and some demons
who had possessed a man which gives us additional insight:

LUKE 8:26 Then they sailed to the country of the Gadarenes, which is
opposite Galilee. 27 And when He stepped out on the land, there met
Him a certain man from the city who had demons for a long time. And he
wore no clothes, nor did he live in a house but in the tombs. 28 When
he saw Jesus, he cried out, fell down before Him, and with a loud
voice said, "What have I to do with You, Jesus, Son of the Most High
God? I beg You, do not torment me!" 29 For He had commanded the
unclean spirit to come out of the man. For it had often seized him,
and he was kept under guard, bound with chains and shackles; and he
broke the bonds and was driven by the demon into the wilderness. 30
Jesus asked him, saying, "What is your name?" And he said, "Legion,"
because many demons had entered him. 31 And they begged Him that He
would not command them to go out into the Abyss. 32 Now a herd of many
swine was feeding there on the mountain. So they begged Him that He
would permit them to enter them. And He permitted them. 33 Then the
demons went out of the man and entered the swine, and the herd ran
violently down the steep place into the lake and drowned. (NKJV)
As the Scripture above shows, the demons who inhabited this man were
terrified of being banished by Christ into the Abyss. This is the same
place where the fallen angels were chained. Apparently, those fallen
angels and demons who get too far out of line here on earth are
restrained in the Abyss until the day of judgment.

In the end-time prophecy recorded by John in the book of Revelation,
the Abyss plays a large part in the events leading up to the return of
the Messiah. During the period of the "seven trumpets," when God's
wrath is poured out on an unrepentant mankind, the Abyss is opened at
the sounding of the fifth trumpet:

REVELATION 9:1 The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star
that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key
to the shaft of the Abyss. 2 When he opened the Abyss, smoke rose from
it like the smoke from a gigantic furnace. The sun and sky were
darkened by the smoke from the Abyss. 3 And out of the smoke locusts
came down upon the earth and were given power like that of scorpions
of the earth. 4 They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or
any plant or tree, but only those people who did not have the seal of
God on their foreheads. 5 They were not given power to kill them, but
only to torture them for five months. And the agony they suffered was
like that of the sting of a scorpion when it strikes a man. 6 During
those days men will seek death, but will not find it; they will long
to die, but death will elude them. 7 The locusts looked like horses
prepared for battle. On their heads they wore something like crowns of
gold, and their faces resembled human faces. 8 Their hair was like
women's hair, and their teeth were like lions' teeth. 9 They had
breastplates like breastplates of iron, and the sound of their wings
was like the thundering of many horses and chariots rushing into
battle. 10 They had tails and stings like scorpions, and in their
tails they had power to torment people for five months. (NIV)
The unlocking of the Abyss releases a horde of fallen angels and
depraved demons upon mankind. God uses them as an instrument of His
wrath for five months; they are allowed to torment those on the earth
who don't have God's seal on their foreheads (Rev. 7:2-8).

In his commentary on Revelation 9:1, 3, Daniel H. Stern writes:

1 The star is not Satan (despite Isaiah 14:12, Lk 10:17), but an
angel, who still has the key at 20:1. The Abyss is not Sh'ol (as at Ro
10:7), but a place where demonic beings are imprisoned (vv. 2-11,
11:7, 17:8, 20:2-3). In the Apocrypha, God is called, "You who close
and seal the Abyss with your fearful and glorious name" (Prayer of
Manasseh 3). . . .
3 Demonic monsters are released which fly like locusts (Exodus
10:12-20; Joel 1:4, 2:4-14) and sting like scorpions (Ezekiel 2:6, Lk
11:12). (pp. 815, 816, Jewish New Testament Commentary)

In Revelation 9:11, a mysterious character is introduced into the
story. He is released from the Abyss along with the multitude of
angels and demons, and is identified as their king or ruler:

REVELATION 9:11 They had as king over them the angel of the Abyss,
whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek, Apollyon. (NIV)
Abaddon/Apollyon (literally "destroyer" in Hebrew/Greek ) is the
angelic ruler of the Abyss. He is the highest ranking evil angel now
confined in the Abyss. Although not specifically mentioned by these
names anywhere else in the Bible, Abaddon plays a major role in the
events at the end of this current age. For additional information on
the identity of this powerful fallen angel and his activities in the
end-time, see my articles "Who Is The 'Destroyer'?" and "The Goat For
Azazel."

After the release of the angels and demons from the Abyss, another
group of evil spirits is released onto the earth:

REVELATION 9:13 Then the sixth angel sounded: And I heard a voice from
the four horns of the golden altar which is before God, 14 saying to
the sixth angel who had the trumpet, "Release the four angels who are
bound at the great river Euphrates." 15 So the four angels, who had
been prepared for the hour and day and month and year, were released
to kill a third of mankind. 16 Now the number of the army of the
horsemen was two hundred million; I heard the number of them. 17 And
thus I saw the horses in the vision: those who sat on them had
breastplates of fiery red, hyacinth blue, and sulfur yellow; and the
heads of the horses were like the heads of lions; and out of their
mouths came fire, smoke, and brimstone. 18 By these three plagues a
third of mankind was killed -- by the fire and the smoke and the
brimstone which came out of their mouths. 19 For their power is in
their mouth and in their tails; for their tails are like serpents,
having heads; and with them they do harm. 20 But the rest of mankind,
who were not killed by these plagues, did not repent of the works of
their hands, that they should not worship demons . . . (NKJV)
In this passage of Scripture, we see that to further punish those who
will not obey Him, God authorizes the release of four powerful angels
who have been held for just this occasion. Their mission is the
destruction of 1/3 of mankind. To accomplish this feat, they are given
an army of 200 million evil spirits. Just as Christ and his angelic
army later ride white horses (Rev. 19:11, 14), these demons also ride
"horses." Fire, smoke, and brimstone issue from the mouths of their
horses, and with these plagues possibly a billion and a half people
are killed.

Both Abaddon, the evil spirit currently ruling over the Abyss, and the
four angels now "bound at the great river Euphrates" appear to be
high-ranking and powerful angels. They will be freed to fulfill their
part of God's plan at the end of the age.

Yeshua tells us the fate of Satan and the fallen angels is to go into
the age-lasting fire which has been prepared for them:

MATTHEW 25:41 "Then He will also say to those on the left hand,
'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for
the devil and his angels: (NKJV)
Only Satan and his angels are mentioned here by Yeshua as going into
fire. The demons have a different fate awaiting them. During the
millennial reign of Yeshua, these unclean spirits will be restricted
to the destroyed and uninhabited land of Babylon (Isa. 13:19-22; Jer.
51:37; Rev. 18:2). The Scriptures teach that the spirits of these
hybrid giants will not be resurrected:

ISAIAH 26:14 Let not the dead live, let not the giants [repha'im] rise
again: therefore hast visited and destroyed them, and hast destroyed
all their memory. (DRA)
CONCLUSION
The earth is currently ruled over by angelic principalities and
powers. Spiritual conflict is unseen but ongoing, with the holy angels
often battling the fallen angels to fulfill God's will. Demons, the
evil spirits of the departed nephilim, roam the earth tormenting and
afflicting mankind.

The fallen angels and the demons will be fully unleashed on the earth
during the end of this age, when God's wrath is vented on a sinning
and unrepentant humanity. In the end, however, Christ will return and
subjugate all who won't submit to God's authority, including Satan and
the fallen host. Their punishment will be age-lasting destruction and
refinement within the lake of fire. The disembodied spirits of the
giants will eventually be destroyed forever.

Bryan T. Huie
July 5, 1997
Revised: October 18, 2002

Back to Topic Index


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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martus
2004-06-17 16:00:12 UTC
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Dim Chance for Global Cloning Ban

By M. Asif Ismail
Center for Public Integrity

WASHINGTON -- Deep divisions within the international community, fed
by religious views, economic interests and U.S. domestic politics, are
hampering efforts to outlaw human reproductive cloning worldwide,
reports the Center for Public Integrity.

Nearly all countries agree that reproductive cloning, or the creation
of an identical human being through asexual reproductive methods,
should be banned. But fewer than 30 of the 191 states recognized by
the United Nations have outlawed researchers from attempting the
procedure, according to the center's newly released study.

More than 150 countries have no law on the books that bars
reproductive cloning, including many -- like the United States -- that
have the scientific resources and facilities necessary to produce a
human clone. In the absence of either national laws or an
international agreement outlawing the procedure, researchers are
developing techniques around the world -- in South America and Asia --
that could be used for reproductive cloning. In Europe, several
countries have adopted laws banning reproductive cloning, but research
continues, while in Israel, which has adopted a five year ban on the
procedure, scientists work with little oversight and can easily
transport the products of their research abroad.

Despite the ongoing scientific advances, there has been little
progress on adopting international agreements outlawing the procedure,
according to dozens of diplomats contacted by the Center for Public
Integrity. The global rift on the issue was clearly evident when the
U.N. General Assembly's Legal Committee voted last November to delay
any decision on the issue, after a contentious debate that was marked
by a flurry of lobbying.

The General Assembly's Legal Committee is scheduled to take up the
issue again on Oct. 21, but diplomats involved in past discussions and
others who have closely followed the U.N. effort say it is unlikely
that a global convention, agreeable to all nations, will be ratified,
as countries remain divided over the scope and breadth of such a
treaty.

A group of nations, led by the United States and Costa Rica, want a
total ban on human cloning. Their view is in sync with the Vatican,
which has also called for a comprehensive ban.

Costa Rica is planning to submit a revised proposal calling for a
total ban on cloning research, including research for therapeutic
purposes.

That echoes an earlier proposal the country filed with the U.N. that
was tabled last year.

"The cloning of human beings, whether carried out on an experimental
basis, in the context of fertility treatments or pre-implantation
diagnosis, for tissue transplantation or for any other purpose
whatsoever, is morally repugnant, unethical and contrary to respect
for the person and constitutes a grave violation of fundamental human
rights…," states a draft resolution filed by Bruno Stagno, permanent
representative of Costa Rica to the United Nations.

Another group of more than two dozen countries, including Belgium,
Germany, France and Britain, wants to limit the ban to just
reproductive cloning. These nations favor the regulation of research
cloning, which they think should be left for individual countries.
"The [United Kingdom] believes that all types of stem cell research,
including therapeutic cloning, should be encouraged," Adam Thomson,
deputy permanent representative to the U.K. mission to the United
Nations, told the General Assembly last December. "Indeed we believe
that it would be indefensible to stop this research and deny millions
of people -- and their families -- the chance of new treatments which
could save their lives," Thomson said.

Diplomats, many of whom spoke to the Center for Public Integrity on
the condition that their names not be used, do not see a breaking of
the impasse any time soon.

"[The stalemate] will continue, even if there is a vote," said a
diplomat from a Western European country active in the U.N.
negotiations. "The vote can go either way, but whichever way it goes
nothing will come out of it. If they vote to defeat the beginning of
negotiations, we won't have negotiations. If the vote is to start
negotiations on a total ban, then nothing will come out of it either
-- except a convention ratified by a few states. But [there will be]
no universal convention. It will be a gimmick."

Several diplomats and sources within the United Nations, who represent
countries on all sides of the issue, voiced similar opinions.

"It is highly possible that we'll never have a treaty," a U.N. source
said. "People are pushing their agenda -- it is part of a bigger
game."

Currently, few countries have enacted legislation in the area, a
situation described by the Western European diplomat as "anarchic." He
added, "The most troubling thing right now is only 20 countries out of
192 have legislation on the subject at all. [There's no law] in some
countries that have the scientific potential to [achieve] cloning,
like the U.S., which does not have laws."

According to the U.N., 21 countries have adopted legislation which
explicitly prohibits human reproductive cloning and eight other
countries have interpreted their existing legislation as implicitly
prohibiting human reproductive cloning.

Legislative attempts in the U.S. Congress have stalled because of a
similar divide on the issue of research cloning.

American overreach

Global efforts to prohibit human cloning began in 1997 after British
scientist Ian Wilmut announced the birth of Dolly; the sheep was the
first mammal to be cloned from an adult cell. Unesco, the United
Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization, denounced
human cloning in its Universal Declaration on Human Genome and Human
Rights, adopted that year. The declaration, which is not binding, was
endorsed by the General Assembly.

The United Nations took up the issue in 2001, at the behest of France
and Germany -- the first time, according to many U.N. observers, in
its nearly six decades of existence that the world body got involved
in a bioethics issue. The two countries said a U.N. convention,
besides providing a set of moral guidelines, would lead member states
to enact national legislation, preventing those who have vowed to
clone human beings from taking advantage of the legal vacuum that
exists in most parts of the world.

The Vatican, which has an observer status at the United Nations, was
the first to propose that the convention be expanded to include a ban
on research cloning as well. The Catholic Church considers embryos as
human beings and is opposed to all research on embryos.

Several scientists and diplomats blamed the United States for the U.N.
stalemate. They said the American insistence on a comprehensive ban --
and that of Costa Rica, its main ally on the issue -- makes any
universally accepted treaty banning just reproductive cloning
unlikely, despite a strong consensus in favor of outlawing the
practice.

Yumiko Iuchi, an advisor to Japan's U.N. mission, said "very strong
opinions" of countries such as Costa Rica and the U.S. was the
problem. "The most regrettable point is that we can all agree on the
prohibition on the so-called reproductive cloning."

Also, faulting the United States was Ian Wilmut, the scientist who
created Dolly.

"It is very disappointing that the United States has obstructed moves
to prevent reproductive cloning," he told the center just after the
U.N. vote last December. "Because they have insisted on trying to
block everything, they are missing the opportunity to make
reproductive cloning illegal all around the world. I think it's a
great shame that that is happening."

The strong push for a ban on research cloning by the U.S. government
surprised some at the U.N., especially because there is no domestic
consensus on the issue.

"The United States is promoting a convention at the U.N. level which
[if passed] they would find difficult to ratify themselves," a Middle
Eastern diplomat involved in the negotiations told the center.

For U.N. treaties to become binding on a country, it must ratify them.
In the past, the U.S. Senate, which has the constitutional power to
ratify or reject treaties a president signs, has voted down some
conventions the United States helped advance. A well publicized
example is the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty, a convention that bans
nuclear weapons tests, which has not been approved by the United
States.

U.N. diplomats said a treaty banning research cloning would not be
ratified by many Western nations, nor by other countries, such as
Japan, China, South Korea, Singapore, India and South Africa, which
have advanced stem cell research infrastructure.

There are those that see U.S. domestic politics as the driving force
behind the administration's position at the United Nations.

All the Bush Administration wanted was a convention for its
"constituency," the Middle Eastern diplomat said. A U.N. vote for
banning all cloning research would have allowed the White House to
show religious conservatives, by far the most vocal opponents of the
embryonic cloning, some specific progress toward outlawing the
research.

A White House-backed bill banning all cloning was passed by the House
last year, but it remains stalled in the Senate.

"Perhaps they can use [the U.N convention] as a tool to force a vote
within the U.S. at the federal level," said Jose Cibelli, a professor
at the Michigan State University who is engaged in cloning research.
Recently, Cibelli addressed national delegates at the U.N. on behalf
of a group campaigning against prohibition of research cloning. "They
can go to the Senate and say the U.N. has just acted and we have to do
the same."

When reached for comments at the U.S. mission, an official who
declined to be identified rejected these assertions. The White House
did not respond to requests for comment.

Diplomats from nations supporting research cloning also pointed out
that many of the countries pushing for a complete ban on cloning have
themselves no laws or regulations, while many countries that favor a
limited ban do.

Britain was among the first countries to prohibit reproductive
cloning; other nations such as Germany, France, Belgium, Japan,
Singapore and China, which favor regulation of research cloning, have
outlawed reproductive cloning.

"The countries that supported the Belgian position have laws," a
diplomat from a European country that supports research cloning said,
referring to a proposal submitted by Belgium favoring research
cloning. "It is a fairly big disconnect in the case of the other
group."

Economic interests

Restrictions on research cloning are resisted by a number of groups,
which claim that they will shut down a research area that holds
promise for curing disease.

Some nations that opposed a complete ban on the research have already
made heavy investments on research cloning and stem cell experiments.
In fact, a growing number of countries see -- besides therapeutic
promises -- great economic potential in embryonic cloning, stem cell
research and other related biotechnology research. Great Britain leads
this pack that also includes China, South Korea, Singapore, Australia
and India.

Britain has said it will opt out of any treaty that bans research
cloning. "[T]he United Kingdom would never be party to any convention
which aimed to introduce a global ban on therapeutic cloning, neither
will the UK participate in the drafting of such a convention nor apply
it in its national law," British envoy Thompson said in his December
address. "Therapeutic cloning research will continue to be permitted
in the U.K."

"Britain clearly has edge on this field and they don't want to give up
this for nothing," said a diplomat, referring to British opposition to
a complete ban on cloning research. However, the envoy pointed out
that, to its credit, Britain has enacted laws on the subject as early
as 1990. Currently, Britain has clearly delineated laws on stem cell
research, prohibiting research on embryos without a license from a
regulatory authority and restricting other stem cell experiments.

Last week, Britain opened a £4.6 million "Stem Cell Bank," the world's
first national stem cell repository, to help medical researchers
obtain stem cell lines.

The United Kingdom has the world's second largest biotechnology
industry after the United States, comprising nearly 400 biotechnology
companies, according to the British government. In 2001, it employed
19,000 workers and generated $2.6 billion in revenue.

A British official at the country's permanent mission in New York said
that economic interests had no role in his country's stand on the
issue.

"They are starting to lose enthusiasm on [the idea of a UN
convention]," a U.N. source said of the British. "It [the way some
countries are trying to ban all cloning] is wrong in their eyes."

Asian countries that favor research cloning, including Singapore,
China, South Korea and Japan, have also made investments in
biotechnology.

Singapore, which suffered an economic slump during the Asian financial
crises of the mid-1990s, is in the process of revamping itself as a
biotech nation. Last October, the city state unveiled an ambitious
biotechnology corridor/complex called Biopolis, which has a capacity
to host some 2,000 scientists and is expected to further expand the
country's US$5 billion biotech business.

The island nation hosted a stem cell research conference last year,
attended by scores of prominent scientists from across the world. The
country has chalked up plans to attract reputed scientists from the
West and it scored an early victory in this regard by luring British
scientist Alan Colman, former research director at PPL Therapeutics, a
prominent biotechnology company that collaborated in the creation of
Dolly, as well as Polly, Holly, Molly & Olly, the first transgenic,
cloned mammals.

Singapore has an eye on the U.S. market as well. The country's
economic development board had a presence at the 2003 annual
convention of the Biotechnology Industry Organization, the industry
trade group and lobbying arm that boasts a membership of more than
1,000 biotech firms.

South Korea is a leading country in research cloning. The government
funded the work of the two South Korean scientists who stunned the
world in February, announcing they had cloned human embryos and
extracted stem cells from them.

"We are not thinking about compromising our position," said Eunju Ahn,
a second secretary at the South Korean mission at the United Nations.
The progress of science and the benefits of medical research are the
important things, she stressed.

Singapore, South Korea, Japan and China, all have legislation
prohibiting reproductive cloning and regulating research cloning.

"The government of Japan has already enacted a regulatory law on human
reproductive cloning in 2000," a Japanese diplomat told the Center.

Religious intervention

During last fall's U.N. negotiations, the preference of a group of
mainly Islamic states for inaction prevailed. The proposal to postpone
the U.N. action was initiated by Iran and other Islamic nations. The
Organization of the Islamic Conference (OIC), a coalition of 40 odd
Muslim nations, was at the forefront of the move.

Few Muslim nations conduct any research related to cloning and, last
fall, most members of OIC had not formulated a policy on cloning. And
prior to the U.N. discussions, prominent Islamic theologians had not
ruled on the morality of the issue of research cloning, a legal
adviser at the Iranian mission at the U.N., Mostafa Dolatyar, said.

Dolatyar added that Muslim nations have a better understanding of the
issue since last fall.

Also, expressing reservations about the U.N. discussions were some
African nations. Other than South Africa, no African country is known
to be conducting any research in the field.

A European diplomat said some African nations opposed what they
thought were unreasonably large amounts of time and resource spent on
the issue at the U.N. level. From their perspective, it's
understandable, he said. "For them the more immediate problems are
poverty and diseases such as AIDS."

The diplomat said some African nations were concerned about potential
problems that could arise if research cloning becomes a standard
medical practice. "Many of them have concerns about a danger of
trafficking in embryos of which women from developing countries could
be victims," he said.

The Costa Rican draft also mentioned the issue of the potential
exploitation of women.

Successful nuclear transfer currently requires availability of a large
number of female eggs. The South Korean scientists who extracted stem
cells from cloned embryos reportedly had access to more than 200 eggs.

The research lobby

According to diplomats, a feature of the U.N. debate was the
relentless lobbying by non-governmental and other independent groups
on different sides of the issue. Opposing the move to allow research
cloning were mainly religious and pro-life groups. Patients' rights
groups, such as Parkinson's Action Network and Coalition for the
Advancement of Medical Research, campaign for legalization of research
cloning.

Also joining the fray were scientists who formed a global coalition
last fall to lobby against the U.S.-Costa Rica proposal. The group,
which has the support of some 50 Nobel laureates, called on the United
Nations to allow stem cell research to proceed with strict
regulations.

The scientific community's involvement at the U.N. level has been
unprecedented for any issue, said a diplomat from a Western European
country that supports research cloning. Such intense international
lobbying efforts brought to the fore issues such as "scientific
freedom" and "politicization of science."

"Science always had political implications, and there's nothing bad in
itself," the diplomat said. "But the research interests of the
scientists should not dictate the laws. I think it should be the other
way around. Laws should govern the scientific research to make sure
that science should not go beyond what's ethically relevant."

Franco Furger, the executive director of the Human Biotechnology
Governance Forum, which favors government regulation of cloning and
other types of human genetic engineering, agreed.

"Scientists tend to assume that they can answer [ethical] questions
themselves," he said. "In a democratic society, they cannot impose
their will on [what is] a moral issue."

Forcing the issue

Advocates of a total ban are hoping to impose their will on states
that favor some research into therapeutic cloning, and are unperturbed
by questions over the a potential international treaty's lack of
legitimacy, should majority of nations opt out.

Responding to suggestions that a convention banning all types of
cloning will lack legitimacy in the absence of a consensus, a diplomat
from a nation that supports a complete ban said, "That's not how
international treaties work." He pointed out that, at the time they
were adopted, there was no unanimous consensus on such groundbreaking
treaties such as the "International Covenant on Civil and Political
Rights" and "Universal Declaration of Human Rights."

Those opposing a total ban are not prepared to back off. "The problem
is that if we end up in a deadlock again, who is it a big problem for?
Is it a big problem for our camp or a big problem for their camp?"
Heinrich Hahn, counselor at Denmark's U.N. mission told the center.
"Time is on our side. If we go forward five years on this there will
be significant research."

Some contend that delaying a treaty is not a sound option either.

"If we have to postpone the discussion for another year, that would be
a disaster," South Korean diplomat Ahn said.

Alexander Cohen contributed to this report.




_____________________________________________________________________________________________



ABORTION

Exodus 20:13 (NRSV)
13 You shall not murder

Humm!!
Obviously that statement wasn't clear enough for some because suddenly
they came to the conclusion that the developing human being was
somehow not human and they could do what ever they liked to it even
though that developing human being had its own UNIQUE DNA and
fulfilled the definition of what a life is.

Revelation 13:7-9 (NRSV)
7 Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them.
It was given authority over every tribe and people and language and
nation, 8 and all the inhabitants of the earth will worship it,
everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the
world in the book of life of the Lamb that was slaughtered.

9 Let anyone who has an ear listen:

Humm!!
"everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the
world" does that sound like each individual human life starts from
before he comes out or after? The whole process is human from
fertilized egg to the adult as it has been planned from the beginning.

Isaiah 41:4 (NRSV)
4 Who has performed and done this,
calling the generations from the beginning?
I, the Lord , am first, and will be with the last.

Humm!!
Calling the generations "BEFORE" they even existed because God knew
them.

Isaiah 49:5 (NRSV)
5 And now the Lord says,
who formed me in the womb to be his servant,
to bring Jacob back to him, and that Israel might be gathered to him,
for I am honoured in the sight of the Lord ,
and my God has become my strength—

Humm!!
God knew Isaiah as he was forming in the womb, that's from the very
beginning.

Exodus 21:22-23 (NLT)
22 "Now suppose two people are fighting, and in the process,
they hurt a pregnant woman so her child is born prematurely.
If no further harm results, then the person responsible must
pay damages in the amount the woman's husband demands and the
judges approve. 23 But if any harm results, then the offender
must be punished according to the injury.

If the result is death, the offender must be executed.

Humm!!
To kill the unborn on purpose was a death penality!

Isaiah 44:28 (NRSV)
28 who says of Cyrus, "He is my shepherd,
and he shall carry out all my purpose";
and who says of Jerusalem, "It shall be rebuilt,"
and of the temple, "Your foundation shall be laid."

Humm!!
Cyrus like Jesus was predicted to come into the world before they were
even born. Whose life did you kill murder, you who kills the
developing human being?

Isaiah 65:19-20 (NLT)
I will rejoice in Jerusalem and delight in my people. And the sound of
weeping and crying will be heard no more.

20 " No longer will babies die when only a few days old. No longer
will adults die before they have lived a full life. No longer will
people be considered old at one hundred! Only sinners will die that
young!

Humm!!
A life can be cut short but when Christ rule's every human being will
live out their whole lives without the murders cutting it short.

Isaiah 57:4-5 (NRSV)
4 Whom are you mocking?
Against whom do you open your mouth wide
and stick out your tongue?

Are you not children of transgression,
the offspring of deceit—
5 you that burn with lust among the oaks,
under every green tree;
you that slaughter your children in the valleys,
under the clefts of the rocks?

Humm!!
People that mock others are under the delusion that somehow they are
better than others and yet they don't repent of the evil they do
because it is acceptable to their society. What is acceptable to God
is another matter!

Isaiah 66:23-24 (NLT)
" All humanity will come to worship me from week to week and from
month to month. 24 And as they go out, they will see the dead bodies
of those who have rebelled against me. For the worms that devour them
will never die, and the fire that burns them will never go out. All
who pass by will view them with utter horror. "

You shall not murder
Post by martus
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'enry VIII
2004-06-18 02:26:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
Dim Chance for Global Cloning Ban
By M. Asif Ismail
Center for Public Integrity
More than 150 countries have no law on the books that bars
reproductive cloning, including many -- like the United States -- that
have the scientific resources and facilities necessary to produce a
human clone. In the absence of either national laws or an
international agreement outlawing the procedure, researchers are
developing techniques around the world -- in South America and Asia --
that could be used for reproductive cloning.
This is a good thing! Cloning would mean an end to pregnant women, then the
would be available for fun all of the time!

'enry VIII
martus
2004-06-17 16:17:04 UTC
Permalink
HEBRON, Kentucky (CNN) -- President Bush was out of line to ask the
Vatican to get U.S. bishops more involved in promoting his
conservative social agenda, Democratic presidential candidate John
Kerry said Tuesday.

"I think it was entirely and extraordinarily inappropriate, and I
think it speaks for itself," the Massachusetts senator, who is
Catholic, told reporters in a question-and-answer session outside
Cincinnati, Ohio.

A Vatican official privy to discussions between Bush and Cardinal
Angelo Sodano, secretary of state to Pope John Paul II, said Bush
"complained that the U.S. bishops were not being vocal enough in
supporting him on social issues like gay marriage and abortion."

The discussion took place June 4 during Bush's visit to the Vatican.

The Vatican official said that Bush, a Methodist, asked Sodano to
"push the bishops to become more actively involved" in promoting those
issues that are part of his social agenda. The official said Sodano
did not respond to Bush's request.

Bush supports a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage and
opposes abortion rights.

White House spokesman Scott McClellan confirmed that Bush met with
Sodano, but would say only that it was "a good private discussion" in
which "they discussed a number of shared priorities."

Pushed to give details about the discussion, McClellan said, "The
positions of the president and the Vatican are well-known on those
issues. ... I would just leave it at that."

Some U.S. church leaders have criticized Kerry's support for abortion
rights, which the Vatican opposes.




===================================================================================


Mat 25:32-46 GNB

and the people of all the nations will be gathered before him. Then
he will divide them into two groups, just as a shepherd separates the
sheep from the goats. (33) He will put the righteous people at his
right and the others at his left. (34) Then the King will say to the
people on his right, 'Come, you that are blessed by my Father! Come
and possess the kingdom which has been prepared for you ever since the
creation of the world.

(35) I was hungry and you fed me, thirsty and you gave me a drink; I
was a stranger and you received me in your homes, (36) naked and you
clothed me; I was sick and you took care of me, in prison and you
visited me.' (37) The righteous will then answer him, 'When, Lord,
did we ever see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you a
drink? (38) When did we ever see you a stranger and welcome you in
our homes, or naked and clothe you? (39) When did we ever see you
sick or in prison, and visit you?'

(40) The King will reply, 'I tell you, whenever you did this for one
of the least important of these followers of mine, you did it for me!'

(41) "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Away from me, you that
are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been
prepared for the Devil and his angels! (42) I was hungry but you
would not feed me, thirsty but you would not give me a drink; (43) I
was a stranger but you would not welcome me in your homes, naked but
you would not clothe me; I was sick and in prison but you would not
take care of me.' (44) Then they will answer him, 'When, Lord, did
we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in
prison, and we would not help you?'

(45) The King will reply, 'I tell you, whenever you refused to help
one of these least important ones, you refused to help me.'


(46) These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the
righteous will go to eternal life."
Post by martus
End
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'enry VIII
2004-06-18 02:28:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
HEBRON, Kentucky (CNN) -- President Bush was out of line to ask the
Vatican to get U.S. bishops more involved in promoting his
conservative social agenda, Democratic presidential candidate John
Kerry said Tuesday.
"I think it was entirely and extraordinarily inappropriate, and I
think it speaks for itself," the Massachusetts senator, who is
Catholic, told reporters in a question-and-answer session outside
Cincinnati, Ohio.
A Vatican official privy to discussions between Bush and Cardinal
Angelo Sodano, secretary of state to Pope John Paul II, said Bush
"complained that the U.S. bishops were not being vocal enough in
supporting him on social issues like gay marriage and abortion."
The discussion took place June 4 during Bush's visit to the Vatican.
The Vatican official said that Bush, a Methodist, asked Sodano to
"push the bishops to become more actively involved" in promoting those
issues that are part of his social agenda. The official said Sodano
did not respond to Bush's request.
Suppositivity, the Pope never screwed a woman! So what does he know?

'enry VIII
martus
2004-06-25 08:42:11 UTC
Permalink
Anglican Archbishop of Canterbury in England support poisoned version
of New Testament!

___________________________________________________________________________________

A radical translation of the New Testament released with the personal
backing of the Archbishop of Canterbury, and aimed at the those
disillusioned with institutional religion, has been met by the
mainstream media with a focus on a small number of biblical passages
that relate to sexual ethics.

The ONE translation aims at a "new, fresh and adventurous" translation
of the early Christian scriptures. It is designed both for mature
Christians and for those who have limited experience of traditional
Christianity or "may have found it a barrier to an appreciation of
Jesus".

But in its reporting the new translation, press and radio commentary
has focused on translations of the small number of passages that refer
to sexual matters. The Times newspaper talks of "St Paul's notorious
condemnations of gay sex" being "deleted and Christians are told to go
out and have more sex."

"Instead of condemning fornicators, adulterers and 'abusers of
themselves with mankind'," says Ruth Gledhill, the Times Religious
Affairs correspondent, "the new version of his first letter to Corinth
has St Paul advising Christians not to go without sex for too long in
case they get 'frustrated'."

"The new version, which Dr Williams says he hopes will spread 'in
epidemic profusion through religious and irreligious alike', turns St
Paul's strictures against fornication on their head" concludes the
Times' Religious Correspondent.

Members of One, the organisation that produced the translation, agree
a set of to principles including the promotion of harmony between
Christians and participation with others in prayerful activity to
"establish peace, justice, dignity and rights for all." They also have
a focus on living in a manner that supports sustainable use of the
earth's resources, and that challenges oppression, injustice,
exclusion and discrimination. The resolve to accept one another,
valuing their diversity and experience.

The translation is pioneering in its accessibility, and changes the
original Greek and Hebrew nomenclature into modern nicknames. St Peter
becomes "Rocky", Mary Magdalen becomes "Maggie", Aaron becomes "Ron",
Andronicus becomes "Andy" and Barabbas becomes "Barry".

In other passages the translator John Henson, a retired Baptist
minister, renders "demon possession" as "mental illness" and "Son of
Man", the phrase used frequently to refer to Jesus, as "the Complete
Person".

Parables become "riddles" and to baptise, to "dip" in water. Salvation
becomes "healing" or "completeness" and Heaven becomes "the world
beyond time and space."

Mr Henson is the translation co-ordinator for ONE, a network of
radical Christians that was one of the first organisations in Britain
to make the case for "inclusive language", in a 1981 pamphlet Bad
Language in Church.

In his foreword to the new version of the New Testament, which also
includes the non-canonical Gospel of Thomas, Dr Williams describes it
as a work of "extraordinary power" because it is "so close to the
prose and poetry of ordinary life". He writes: "Instead of being taken
into a specialised religious frame of reference — as happens even with
the most conscientious of formal modern translations — and being given
a gospel addressed to specialised concerns . . . we have here a
vehicle for thinking and worshipping that is fully earthed,
recognisably about our humanity."

The Archbishop praises Mr Henson's translation for screening out "the
stale, the technical, the unconsciously exclusive words and policies".


DIPPING INTO A NEW TRANSLATION (as reported in the Times)

Mark 1:4

Authorised version: "John did baptise in the wilderness, and preach
the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins."


New: "John, nicknamed ‘The Dipper', was ‘The Voice'. He was in the
desert, inviting people to be dipped, to show they were determined to
change their ways and wanted to be forgiven."


Mark 1:10-11

Authorised version: "And straightway coming up out of the water, he
saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon
him. And there came a voice from the heaven saying, Thou are my
beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."


New: As he was climbing up the bank again, the sun shone through a gap
in the clouds. At the same time a pigeon flew down and perched on him.
Jesus took this as a sign that God's spirit was with him. A voice from
overhead was heard saying, ‘That's my boy! You're doing fine!' "

Matthew 23:25

Authorised version: "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!"

New version: "Take a running jump, Holy Joes, humbugs!

Matthew 26:69-70

Authorised version: "Now Peter sat without in the palace: and a damsel
came unto him, saying, ‘Thou also wast with Jesus of Galilee.' But he
denied before them all, saying, I know not what thou sayest".


New: Meanwhile Rocky was still sitting in the courtyard. A woman came
up to him and said: "Haven't I seen you with Jesus, the hero from
Galilee?" Rocky shook his head and said: "I don't know what the hell
you're talking about!"






-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
Anglican church of England that bends to the habits of it supreme
leader, the future king.
This same church that was first created because the original church
would not bow down to the king wishes of that time and go against
bible teaching.
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-27 08:46:06 UTC
Permalink
THE HEAVENLY DIVINE COUNCIL
For nearly the past two millennia, there has been a general
misunderstanding of the way God governs the earth. As this study will
establish, there is a heavenly council of spirit beings that currently
rules over our world. Paul referred to this group of spiritual
entities in the sixth chapter of Ephesians:

EPHESIANS 6:12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but
against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the
darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the
heavenly places. (NKJV)
This Scripture clearly tells us that there are evil spiritual powers
in the heavens that rule over mankind and oppose God's people. This is
a fact verified in many other biblical passages. However, due to
scribal changes in the text and the doctrinal leanings of translators,
this truth is generally not well understood by most believers. In this
article, we're going to examine this vital information about the
spiritual realm.

Let's start by looking at a controversial passage of Scripture from
the farewell song of Moses in Deuteronomy 32. First, we'll examine the
passage as it appears in most translations based on the traditional
Hebrew text (the Masoretic Text, which was finalized between the 8th
and 10th centuries C.E.):

DEUTERONOMY 32:7 "Remember the days of old, consider the years of many
generations. Ask your father, and he will show you; your elders, and
they will tell you: 8 When the Most High divided their inheritance to
the nations, when He separated the sons of Adam, He set the boundaries
of the peoples according to the number of the CHILDREN OF ISRAEL. 9
For the LORD's portion is His people; Jacob is the place of His
inheritance. (NKJV)
However, there is a variant rendering of this passage. It's based on
the third-century B.C.E. translation of the Hebrew Scriptures into
Greek, the Septuagint, as well as Hebrew manuscripts of Deuteronomy
found among the Dead Sea Scrolls at Qumran:

DEUTERONOMY 32:7 Remember the days of old, consider the years of many
generations; ask your father, and he will show you; your elders, and
they will tell you. 8 When the Most High gave to the nations their
inheritance, when He separated the sons of men, He fixed the bounds of
the peoples according to the number of the SONS OF GOD. 9 For the
LORD's portion is His people, Jacob His allotted heritage. (RSV)
Here is this same passage as it was rendered by Sir Lancelot C.L.
Brenton in his 1851 translation of the Septuagint into English:

DEUTERONOMY 32:7 Remember the days of old, consider the years for past
ages: ask thy father, and he shall relate to thee, thine elders, and
they shall tell thee. 8 When the Most High divided the nations, when
He separated the sons of Adam, He set the bounds of the nations
according to the number of the angels of God. 9 And His people Jacob
became the portion of the Lord, Israel was the line of His
inheritance. (Brenton's LXX)
The Greek phrase translated "angels of God" is aggelon theou; this
interpretive phrase is found in nearly all the extant Septuagint
manuscripts. However, several earlier manuscripts have instead huion
theou, or "sons of God." This is a literal rendering of the Hebrew
phrase beney 'elohim found among the Dead Sea Scroll copies of
Deuteronomy 32:8.

The Septuagint translators plainly understood that the "sons of God"
(beney 'elohim) spoken of in Deuteronomy 32:8 and elsewhere were
spirit beings ("angels"), and rendered it that way several times (Job
1:6; 2:1; 38:7) in order to clarify the meaning. Thus the textual
change from huion theou to aggelon theou.

The idea that the separation of mankind into 70 nations at the Tower
of Babel was by and for the angelic "sons of God" is supported by the
ancient Book of Jasher (Jos. 10:13; II Sam. 1:18):

JASHER 9:31 And they built the tower and the city, and they did this
thing daily until many days and years were elapsed. 32 And God said to
the seventy angels who stood foremost before him, to those who were
near to him, saying, Come let us descend and confuse their tongues,
that one man shall not understand the language of his neighbor, and
they did so unto them. (pub. 1887, J.H. Parry & Company, Salt Lake
City, Utah)
The paraphrased Aramaic translation of Deuteronomy 32:8-9 found in the
ancient Targum called Pseudo-Jonathan supports the Septuagint
rendering of verse 8, but also hints at the origin of the later
alternate reading ("sons of Israel"):

DEUTERONOMY 32:8 When the Most High made allotment of the world unto
the nations which proceeded from the sons of Noach, in the separation
of the writings and languages of the children of men at the time of
the division, He cast the lot among the seventy angels, the princes of
the nations with whom is the revelation to oversee the city, even at
that time He established the limits of the nations according to the
sum of the number of the seventy souls of Israel who went down into
Mizraim [Egypt]. (Targum Pseudo-Jonathan, translated by J.W.
Etheridge)
The dispute over whether the Masoretic Text or the Septuagint
represents the original is more than a scholarly argument among
biblical text experts. The implication of the latter rendering of
verse 8 is significant with regard to understanding how God governs
the earth.

As the Targum explicitly brings out, Moses' mention of the separation
of "the sons of men" refers back to God's division of Noah's
descendants into 70 different nations, as recorded in the 10th chapter
of Genesis:

GENESIS 10:32 These are the families of the sons of Noah, according to
their genealogies, by their nations; and out of these the nations were
separated on the earth after the flood. (NASU)
Chapter 10 of Genesis is the backdrop for Moses' statement in
Deuteronomy 32:8 that God is responsible for the creation and
placement of the nations (Heb. goyim). In fact, variations of the same
Hebrew root word parad ("separate") are used in both Genesis 10:32 and
Deuteronomy 32:8.

If Moses was indeed referencing God's separation of the nations
according to Noah's offspring (specifically their physical separation
at the Tower of Babel), it is important to note that Israel is not
listed in the index of the 70 nations found in Genesis 10. The nation
of Israel did not yet exist at that time. Therefore, the statement
that God "set the boundaries of the nations according to the number of
the children of Israel" clearly seems out of context here.

However, if we accept the rendering of Deuteronomy 32:8 found in the
Septuagint and the Hebrew copies of Deuteronomy from Qumran (which is
supported by the testimony of the Book of Jasher), we face the same
dilemma that the Jewish scribes later faced. Did the Hebrew Scriptures
at one time suggest polytheism in the religion delivered to the
Israelites?

Ancient Hebrew language expert Michael S. Heiser has shown that there
is good reason to accept the earlier version of this Scripture. In his
article on this passage, he writes:

. . . What could possibly be meant by the textual option that created
a correspondence between the number of the nations in Genesis 10-11
and heavenly beings?
Literary and conceptual parallels discovered in the literature of
Ugarit, however, have provided a more coherent explanation for the
number 70 in Deuteronomy 32:8 - and have furnished powerful ammunition
to textual scholars who argued against the "sons of Israel" reading in
MT. Ugaritic mythology plainly states that the head of its pantheon,
El (who, like the God of the Bible, is also referred to as El Elyon,
the "Most High") fathered 70 sons, thereby setting the number of the
"sons of El" (Ugaritic, bn 'il ). An unmistakable linguistic parallel
with the Hebrew text underlying the LXX reading was thus discovered,
one which prompted many scholars to accept the LXX reading on logical
and philological grounds: God (El Elyon in Deut. 32:8) divided the
earth according to the number of heavenly beings who already existed
from the time of creation.

. . . Understanding "sons of God" as the correct reading in
Deuteronomy 32:8 in no way requires one to view Israelite religion as
polytheistic. (p. 3, "Deuteronomy 32:8 and the Sons of God")

Ugaritic is an ancient near eastern language that is closely related
to biblical Hebrew. Evidently, Ugarit developed a divine mythology
based on antediluvian truths regarding the one true God and His
government of the world through the angelic creation. Ugaritic
literature contains many council scenes where the chief deity 'El
presides over the council of his divine sons, who stand before him on
the holy Mount of Assembly.

We see a very similar scene portrayed in the Bible at I Kings 22 and
II Chronicles 18, where YHVH's prophet Micaiah describes a vision of
the heavenly council that he had been given in regard to a question
posed to him by Ahab, king of Israel and Jehoshaphat, king of Judah:

II CHRONICLES 18:18 Then Micaiah said, "Therefore hear the word of the
LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven
standing on His right hand and His left. 19 And the LORD said, 'Who
will persuade Ahab king of Israel to go up, that he may fall at Ramoth
Gilead?' So one spoke in this manner, and another spoke in that
manner. 20 Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, and
said, 'I will persuade him.' The LORD said to him, 'In what way?' 21
"So he said, 'I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all
his prophets.' And the Lord said, 'You shall persuade him and also
prevail; go out and do so.' 22 Therefore look! The LORD has put a
lying spirit in the mouth of these prophets of yours, and the LORD has
declared disaster against you." (NKJV)
Here we see mention of the "host of heaven" (Heb. tzeva' hashamayim)
which stands before YHVH. Clearly this is speaking of angelic beings,
including those on the heavenly divine council. This vision seen by
Micaiah shows that YHVH is in complete control of events. He only
approves the course of action that suits His purpose, which in this
case was to bring about the death of evil King Ahab (I Kings 22:20; II
Chr. 18:19).

The "host of heaven" is spoken of in many Scriptures. Some Bible
scholars attempt to downplay the true meaning of this phrase and imply
that it speaks mainly of the stars in the sky. Contextually, however,
it is evident that tzeva' hashamayim often refers to the realm of
spirit beings in the heavens.

The New Bible Dictionary says this about the "host of heaven":

This phrase (tzeva' hashamayim) occurs about 15 times, in most cases
implying the object of heathen worship (Dt. 4:19, etc.). The two
meanings 'celestial bodies' and 'angelic beings' are inextricably
intertwined. The LXX translation, using kosmos, stratia, or dynamis,
does not help to resolve this. No doubt to the Heb[rew] mind the
distinction was superficial, and the celestial bodies were thought to
be closely associated with heavenly beings. . . . The Bible certainly
suggests that angels of different ranks have charge of individuals and
of nations; no doubt, in the light of modern cosmology this concept,
if retained at all (as biblically it must be), ought properly to be
extended, as the dual sense of the phrase 'host of heaven' suggests,
to the oversight of the elements of the physical universe--planets,
stars and nebulae. (p. 495, "Host, Host of Heaven")
Regarding the meaning of the related title "Lord of hosts" (Heb. YHVH
tzeva'ot), the New Bible Dictionary states:

It is thought by some to have arisen as a title of God associated with
his lordship over the 'host' of Israel; but its usage, especially in
the prophets, clearly implies also a relationship to the 'host of
heaven' in its angelic sense; and this could well be the original
connotation. (p. 495, "Host, Host of Heaven")
The following Scriptures indicate that the "host of heaven" is more
than just the stars in the night sky:

NEHEMIAH 9:5 . . . "Stand up and bless the LORD your God forever and
ever! Blessed be Your glorious name, which is exalted above all
blessing and praise! 6 You alone are the LORD; You have made heaven,
the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth and everything
on it, the seas and all that is in them, and You preserve them all.
The host of heaven worships You." (NKJV)
Only living creatures can worship God. Clearly, the "host of heaven"
here refers to sentient created beings which reside in the heavens.

JEREMIAH 19:13 "And the houses of Jerusalem and the houses of the
kings of Judah shall be defiled like the place of Tophet, because of
all the houses on whose roofs they have burned incense to all the host
of heaven, and poured out drink offerings to other gods." (NKJV)
Here Jeremiah draws a parallel between "the host of heaven," to whom
incense was burned and "other gods," to whom drink offerings were
poured out. This grammatical construction in Hebrew is meant to show
that both the "host of heaven" and the "other gods" were the same.
They were "the gods of the nations," the angelic rulers assigned by
God over the nations of the earth.

One of the most grievous sins of the ancient Israelites was their
continual idolatry. Instead of worshiping the one true God, they
instead worshiped the inferior "sons of God," the "host of heaven":

II KINGS 17:15 And they [Israel and Judah] rejected His statutes and
His covenant that He had made with their fathers, and His testimonies
which He had testified against them; they followed idols, became
idolaters, and went after the nations who were all around them,
concerning whom the LORD had charged them that they should not do like
them. 16 So they left all the commandments of the LORD their God, made
for themselves a molded image and two calves, made a wooden image and
worshiped all the host of heaven, and served Baal. (NKJV)
II KINGS 21:3 For he [Manasseh] rebuilt the high places which Hezekiah
his father had destroyed; he raised up altars for Baal, and made a
wooden image, as Ahab king of Israel had done; and he worshiped all
the host of heaven and served them. 4 He also built altars in the
house of the LORD, of which the LORD had said, "In Jerusalem I will
put My name." 5 And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the
two courts of the house of the LORD. 6 Also he made his son pass
through the fire, practiced soothsaying, used witchcraft, and
consulted spiritists and mediums. He did much evil in the sight of the
LORD, to provoke Him to anger. (NKJV)
The Bible shows that the "host of heaven" was on the scene during the
creation of the earth. In Job 38:4-7, we see YHVH questioning Job in
order to prove a point to him. During that interrogation, He asks Job
where he was during the creation of the universe:

JOB 38:4 "Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth? Tell
Me, if you have understanding, 5 Who set its measurements? Since you
know. Or who stretched the line on it? 6 On what were its bases sunk?
Or who laid its cornerstone, 7 When the morning stars sang together
and all the sons of God shouted for joy?" (NASU)
This Scripture clearly indicates that the "sons of God" (beney
'elohim, also called "morning stars" here) were present at creation
week. This fact is supported by the first chapter of Genesis:

GENESIS 1:26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our
likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of
the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the
creatures that move along the ground." (NIV)
This verse is often used by modern scholars to attempt to prove that
the doctrine of the Trinity can be found in the Old Testament.
Regarding this erroneous contention, The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary
states:

The "us" in "Let us make man in our image" (Gen. 1:26; cf. 3:22;
11:6-7) refers to the "sons of God" or lesser "gods" mentioned
elsewhere (6:1-4; Job 1:6; Ps. 29:1), here viewed as a heavenly
council centered around the one God (cf. Ps. 82:1). In later usage
these probably would be called "angels." (p. 1019, "Trinity")
Deuteronomy 32:8 is paralleled by a passage from Deuteronomy 4 that
speaks of the allocation of the heavenly host:

DEUTERONOMY 4:19 "And beware not to lift up your eyes to heaven and
see the sun and the moon and the stars, all the host of heaven, and be
drawn away and worship them and serve them, those which the LORD your
God has allotted to all the peoples under the whole heaven. (NASU)
The "host of heaven" here is said to be "allotted to all the peoples
under the whole heaven." The word allotted in Hebrew is chalaq, which
literally means "apportioned" or "assigned." In a statement similar to
Deuteronomy 32:8, we are told here that God has assigned "the host of
heaven" to the peoples of the earth.

The "host of heaven" are the same spiritual "principalities,"
"powers," and "rulers" Paul speaks of in Ephesians 6:12. These
heavenly "powers" are mentioned many times in the New Testament:

MATTHEW 24:29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun
will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will
fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken."
(NKJV)
MARK 13:24 "But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun will be
darkened, and the moon will not give its light; 25 the stars of heaven
will fall, and the powers in the heavens will be shaken." (NKJV)
LUKE 21:25 "And there will be signs in the sun, in the moon, and in
the stars; and on the earth distress of nations, with perplexity, the
sea and the waves roaring; 26 men's hearts failing them from fear and
the expectation of those things which are coming on the earth, for the
powers of heaven will be shaken." (NKJV)
ROMANS 8:38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels
nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come,
39 nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to
separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
(NKJV)
I CORINTHIANS 15:24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom
to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority
and power. 25 For he must reign till He has put all enemies under his
feet. (NKJV)
EPHESIANS 1:20 Which He worked in Christ, raising him from the dead
and seating him at His right hand in the heavens, 21 far above every
principality, authority, power, and dominion, and every name that is
named not only in this age but also in the one to come. (NAB)
EPHESIANS 3:8 To me, though I am the very least of all the saints,
this grace was given, to preach to the Gentiles the unsearchable
riches of Christ, 9 and to make all men see what is the plan of the
mystery hidden for ages in God who created all things; 10 that through
the church the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the
principalities and powers in the heavenly places. 11 This was
according to the eternal purpose which he has realized in Christ Jesus
our Lord, (RSV)
COLOSSIANS 1:15 He [Christ] is the image of the invisible God, the
firstborn of all creation. 16 For in him were created all things in
heaven and on earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones or
dominions or principalities or powers; all things were created through
him and for him. (NAB)
COLOSSIANS 2:9 For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead
bodily; 10 and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all
principality and power. (NKJV)
COLOSSIANS 2:13 When you were dead in your transgressions and the
uncircumcision of your flesh, He [God] made you alive together with
him [Christ], having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14 having
canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us,
which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having
nailed it to the cross. 15 When He had disarmed the rulers and
authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over
them through him. (NASU)
1 PETER 3:22 [Christ] who has gone into heaven and is at the right
hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made
subject to Him. (NKJV)
In Hebrews 2:5, the author indirectly establishes the current
rulership of our world by powerful angelic beings:

HEBREWS 2:5 It is not to angels that He has subjected the world to
come, about which we are speaking. (NIV)
By saying that God will not subject the coming world to the rule of
angels, the author implies that the current world is being ruled by
spirit entities.

Chapters 1 and 2 of the book of Job show two instances of the divine
council composed of the sons of God (the beney 'elohim) gathering in
heaven for a meeting of the council:

JOB 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present
themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them. 7 And the
LORD said to Satan, "From where do you come?" So Satan answered the
LORD and said, "From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking
back and forth on it." (NKJV)
JOB 2:1 Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present
themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present
himself before the LORD. 2 And the LORD said to Satan, "From where do
you come?" So Satan answered the LORD and said, "From going to and fro
on the earth, and from walking back and forth on it." (NKJV)
What we see described here appear to be accounts of the "sons of God"
(beney 'elohim) coming to regularly scheduled meetings of the divine
council. Satan also came to these meetings, but from the text we
cannot tell if he is one of the members of the council, or if he
simply appeared to bring a petition before the council. Other
Scriptures seem to indicate, however, that Satan may be a high-ranking
member of the divine council given charge over the kingdoms of the
world (e.g. Luke 4:5-7).

A couple of other Scriptures mention the divine council in passing:

JOB 15:7 "Are you the first man that was born? Or were you brought
forth before the hills? 8 Have you listened in the council of God? And
do you limit wisdom to yourself? (RSV)
JEREMIAH 23:16 This is what the LORD Almighty says: "Do not listen to
what the prophets are prophesying to you; they fill you with false
hopes. They speak visions from their own minds, not from the mouth of
the LORD. 17 They keep saying to those who despise Me, 'The LORD says:
You will have peace.' And to all who follow the stubbornness of their
hearts they say, 'No harm will come to you.' 18 But which of them has
stood in the council of the LORD to see or to hear His word? Who has
listened and heard His word?" (NIV)
Psalm 82 is the most detailed description we have of a meeting of the
heavenly divine council which was given rulership over the 70 nations
of the earth:

PSALM 82:1 {A Psalm of Asaph.} God has taken His place in the divine
council; in the midst of the gods He holds judgment: 2 "How long will
you judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked? Selah 3 Give
justice to the weak and the fatherless; maintain the right of the
afflicted and the destitute. 4 Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver
them from the hand of the wicked." 5 They have neither knowledge nor
understanding, they walk about in darkness; all the foundations of the
earth are shaken. 6 I say, "You are gods, sons of the Most High, all
of you; 7 nevertheless, you shall die like men, and fall like any
prince." 8 Arise, O God, judge the earth; for to thee belong all the
nations! (RSV)
In this psalm, we see God take His place as the leader of the divine
council. The psalmist records that, during this meeting of the
council, God criticizes the "gods" ('elohim) for their unfairness and
wickedness in carrying out the responsibilities He has assigned to
them. Asaph tells us that the sin and rebellion of the 'elohim have
shaken the foundations of the earth. He records God's warning to these
divine spirit entities, that their fate for corruption and
disobedience will be to "die like men" (Heb. 'adam). Since clearly all
men will "die like men," attempting to apply this Scripture to human
rulers, as some scholars do, is illogical. Asaph ends the psalm by
exhorting God to judge the earth and its divine rulers, because all
nations truly belong to Him and not to them.

Psalm 82:7 refers to the governing 'elohim as "princes." This
designation connects these council members to whom rulership of the
nations was given (Deu. 32:8) with another passage of Scripture found
in Daniel:

DANIEL 10:5 I lifted my eyes and looked, and behold, a certain man
clothed in linen, whose waist was girded with gold of Uphaz! 6 His
body was like beryl, his face like the appearance of lightning, his
eyes like torches of fire, his arms and feet like burnished bronze in
color, and the sound of his words like the voice of a multitude. . . .
12 Then he said to me, "Do not fear, Daniel, for from the first day
that you set your heart to understand, and to humble yourself before
your God, your words were heard; and I have come because of your
words. 13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me
twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came
to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia.
(NKJV)
The Scripture above gives us an intriguing glimpse into the order and
activities of the spiritual realm. Gabriel was sent by God to give
Daniel insight into what would happen to his people (the Jews) in "the
latter days." However, this mighty angel was delayed for three weeks
because "the prince of the kingdom of Persia" contested God's command.
This prince of Persia clearly was not human; he was the divine council
member who had authority over the nation of Persia.

Indeed, if Michael (who is described in Dan. 12:1 as the great prince
who stands over the people of Israel) had not helped Gabriel, God's
message to Daniel might not have been delivered. For additional
information on Michael, the spiritual prince over God's portion,
Israel, refer to my article "Christ in the Old Testament."

DANIEL 10:20 Then he said, "Do you know why I have come to you? Now I
must return to fight against the prince of Persia, and when I am
through with him, the prince of Greece will come. 21 But I am to tell
you what is inscribed in the book of truth. There is no one with me
who contends against these princes except Michael, your prince."
(NRSV)
After conveying his message to Daniel, Gabriel states that he must
return to again do battle with "the prince of Persia." Furthermore, he
states that he will also have to combat "the prince of Greece" after
he has finished with "the Prince of Persia." The picture portrayed by
this brief narrative is one of opposition to God's will by the spirit
beings of the council who have been given rule over the nations.

The book of Daniel mentions the fate of some of the "host of heaven"
under the coming Antichrist:

DANIEL 8:10 And it [the little horn] grew up to the host of heaven;
and it cast down some of the host and some of the stars to the ground,
and trampled them. 11 He even exalted himself as high as the Prince of
the host [Yeshua, cf. Eph. 1:21; Col. 2:10; I Pet. 3:22]; and by him
the daily sacrifices were taken away, and the place of His sanctuary
was cast down. (NKJV)
We see from Daniel 8 that the Antichrist will come against these
spiritual powers and "cast down some" of them and "trample them." It's
likely that the remainder will join his end-time rebellion against
God.

Just as Psalm 82 speaks of the eventual fate of these heavenly
princes, the prophet Isaiah tells of their coming punishment in a
couple of passages:

ISAIAH 24:19 The earth is broken asunder, the earth is split through,
the earth is shaken violently. 20 The earth reels to and fro like a
drunkard and it totters like a shack, for its transgression is heavy
upon it, and it will fall, never to rise again. 21 So it will happen
in that day, that the LORD will punish the host of heaven on high, and
the kings of the earth on earth. 22 They will be gathered together
like prisoners in the dungeon, and will be confined in prison; and
after many days they will be punished. (NASU)
As Isaiah 24:21 shows, the "host of heaven" ruling from "on high" are
differentiated from the kings ruling on the earth below. Let's look at
another prophecy of their doom:

ISAIAH 34:1 Come near, you nations, to hear; and heed, you people! Let
the earth hear, and all that is in it, the world and all things that
come forth from it. 2 For the indignation of the LORD is against all
nations, and His fury against all their armies; He has utterly
destroyed them, He has given them over to the slaughter. 3 Also their
slain shall be thrown out; their stench shall rise from their corpses,
and the mountains shall be melted with their blood. 4 All the host of
heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled up like a
scroll; all their host shall fall down as the leaf falls from the
vine, and as fruit falling from a fig tree. 5 "For My sword shall be
bathed in heaven; indeed it shall come down on Edom, and on the people
of My curse, for judgment." (NKJV)
Like the "host" of the nations that come against the Messiah will be
slain, the "host of heaven" (Heb. tzeva' hashamayim) who rule these
earthly nations will also be defeated. The sword of the Eternal,
wielded by the Messiah, will "drink its fill in the heavens" as well
as on the earth.

We are told in Isaiah 34:4 that "the host of heaven shall be
dissolved" (Heb. namaqu, literally "waste away," "decay"). In
Zechariah 14:12, the same Hebrew root word maqaq is used to describe
the fate of those who come against Jerusalem at the end of the age.

There is a similarity between Isaiah 34:4 and II Peter 3:10-12 that
deserves some attention. Peter speaks of an end-time fire in the
heavens, which will melt and dissolve the elements:

II PETER 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then
the heavens will pass away with a loud noise, and the elements
[stoicheia] will be dissolved with fire, and the earth and the works
that are upon it will be burned up. 11 Since all these things are thus
to be dissolved, what sort of persons ought you to be in lives of
holiness and godliness, 12 waiting for and hastening the coming of the
day of God, because of which the heavens will be kindled and
dissolved, and the elements [stoicheia] will melt with fire! (RSV)
The Greek word stoicheia, translated "elements" in the passage above,
is understood by many scholars to refer to heavenly spirits. This
understanding can be seen in several passages written by the apostle
Paul:

GALATIANS 4:1 I mean that the heir, as long as he is a child, is no
better than a slave, though he is the owner of all the estate; 2 but
he is under guardians and trustees until the date set by the father. 3
So with us; when we were children, we were slaves to the elemental
spirits of the universe [ta stoicheia tou kosmou]. (RSV)
GALATIANS 4:9 But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be
known by God, how can you turn back again to the weak and beggarly
elemental spirits [stoicheia], whose slaves you want to be once more?
(RSV)
COLOSSIANS 2:8 See to it that no one makes a prey of you by philosophy
and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the
elemental spirits of the universe [ta stoicheia tou kosmou], and not
according to Christ. (RSV)
COLOSSIANS 2:18 Let no one disqualify you, insisting on self-abasement
and worship of angels, taking his stand on visions, puffed up without
reason by his sensuous mind, 19 and not holding fast to the Head, from
whom the whole body, nourished and knit together through its joints
and ligaments, grows with a growth that is from God. 20 If with Christ
you died to the elemental spirits of the universe [ton stoicheion tou
kosmou], why do you live as if you still belonged to the world? . . .
(RSV)
The Dictionary of Paul and His Letters has this to say about the
"elements" as spiritual powers:

A number of interpreters, perhaps even a majority, have concluded that
ta stoicheia tou kosmou refers to spiritual powers of some sort. . . .
The earliest extant extrabiblical Jewish evidence for the stoicheia
being associated with both spirits and stars is later than the first
century (second and third centuries A.D.), but it is well attested and
may very well represent beliefs contemporaneous with Paul (cf. Lohse,
99 n.41). The Testament of Solomon, a Jewish-Christian work usually
dated to the third century A.D., but possibly containing material
dating to the first century, testifies to a belief in star spirits
called stoicheia. Seven bound spirits appear before Solomon and reveal
their identity: "We are the stoicheia, rulers of this world of
darkness [kosmokratores tou skotous, cf. Eph 6:12] . . . our stars in
heaven look small, but we are named like gods" (T. Sol. 8:2-4). (pp.
231, 232, "Elements/Elemental Spirits of the World")
If we understand the usage of stoicheia by Peter to be the same as
Paul's usage in the Scriptures cited above, we can see that Peter was
simply reemphasizing what the prophet Isaiah had said about the fate
of the spiritual powers aligned against God. Isaiah stated the "host
of heaven" would be dissolved; Peter said that these same "elemental
spirits" would be dissolved by fire.

YESHUA'S RELATIONSHIP TO THE DIVINE COUNCIL
In the tenth chapter of John's Gospel, Yeshua answers the Jews'
question regarding his identity:

JOHN 10:24 Then the Jews surrounded him and said to him, "How long do
you keep us in doubt? If you are the Christ, tell us plainly." 25
Jesus answered them, "I told you, and you do not believe. The works
that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. 26 But you do
not believe, because you are not of my sheep, as I said to you. 27 My
sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. 28 And I
give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall
anyone snatch them out of my hand. 29 "My Father, who has given them
to me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of
My Father's hand. 30 I and My Father are one." 31 Then the Jews took
up stones again to stone Him. 32 Jesus answered them, "Many good works
I have shown you from my Father. For which of those works do you stone
me?" 33 The Jews answered Him, saying, "For a good work we do not
stone you, but for blasphemy, and because you, being a man, make
yourself God [theon]." 34 Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in
your law, 'I said, "You are gods [theoi]" '? 35 If He called them gods
[theous], to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be
broken), 36 do you say of him whom the Father sanctified and sent into
the world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of
God'? 37 If I do not do the works of my Father, do not believe me; 38
but if I do, though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you
may know and believe that the Father is in me, and I in Him." (NKJV)
The passage above starts with the Jews asking Yeshua if he was the
prophesied Messiah (v. 24). He answered by saying that he had already
told them he was, and they didn't believe him (v. 25a). Yeshua goes on
to say that the works he had performed before them in the Father's
name were a testimony to his identity (v. 25b). Next he differentiated
between those blinded Jews and the sheep his Father had given him (vv.
26-29). Yeshua finished his comments to the Jews by proclaiming that
he and his Father were "one" (v. 30).

This answer prompted the Jews to charge him with blasphemy and prepare
to stone him (vv. 31-33). In verses 34-36, Yeshua addressed the charge
that the Jews had leveled against him, namely that he had blasphemed
by proclaiming himself to be "God." The Greek word theon is the
equivalent of the Hebrew 'elohim.

Based on Yeshua's answer to the Jews, why were they planning to stone
him? Did they think that he, a man, had proclaimed himself to be God
the Father? Or did they understand his claim in a way that was
different from the common Trinitarian understanding of today?

Rather than assume that we know, let's allow the Jews themselves
define for us what they took Yeshua's claim to be:

JOHN 19:6 Therefore, when the chief priests and officers saw Him, they
cried out, saying, "Crucify Him, crucify Him!" Pilate said to them,
"You take Him and crucify Him, for I find no fault in Him." 7 The Jews
answered him, "We have a law, and according to our law He ought to
die, because he made himself the Son of God." (NKJV)
Clearly the Jews understood Yeshua's claim to be that he was an
'elohim, one of the divine sons of God. Carefully notice Yeshua's
specific reply to the charge of blasphemy. He first references the
members of the divine council, who were called "sons of God" in the
Old Testament (Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7; etc.), by quoting from Psalm 82:6
(v. 34). Then Yeshua asked the Jews, "Why do you say I'm blaspheming
just because I've proclaimed myself to be the Son of God, when the
Father Himself in the Scripture calls the members of the divine
council gods ('elohim)?" (vv. 35-36).

Yeshua's response, including the reference to Psalm 82:6, was intended
to convey the understanding that Yeshua, the Son of God, had
preexisted his mortal appearance and was one of the members (in fact,
the foremost member) of the divine council addressed in Psalm 82.
Yeshua here was proclaiming himself to be an 'elohim (divine); he was
NOT saying that he was the 'Elohim, the Most High, God the Father.

Many Christians base their understanding of this passage solely on
verse 30. They assume that Yeshua's statement that he and the Father
are one is an affirmation of the Trinity doctrine (or the less popular
"Oneness" doctrine). However, the Bible clearly shows that the state
of being "one" does not entail being "the same as" (i.e., Yeshua = the
Father).

The example of Adam and Eve clearly illustrates this biblical
principal:

GENESIS 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall on Adam, and
he slept; and He took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh in its
place. 22 Then the rib which the LORD God had taken from man He made
into a woman, and He brought her to the man. 23 And Adam said: "This
is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called
Woman, because she was taken out of Man." 24 Therefore a man shall
leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and they shall
become ONE FLESH. 25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife,
and were not ashamed. (NKJV)
Yeshua himself quoted this passage when defending the sanctity of
marriage to the Pharisees (Matt. 19:3-9; Mark 10:2-12). Clearly, a man
and woman do not literally become one flesh when they marry. So out of
necessity, it is essential to understand "one" here in a different
sense. The Hebrew word for "one" (echad) often means "unity." It is
this meaning that Jesus intended when he said that he and his Father
were "one." Jesus was unified with the Father in accomplishing God's
purpose and will (Matt. 26:39; John 5:30; 14:10, 24).

Yeshua's prayer to the Father before his crucifixion, recorded in John
17, confirms this understanding of "one":

JOHN 17:11 "Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the
world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those
whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are." (NKJV)
Yeshua prayed that the disciples God had given him would become one,
just as he and the Father were one. How then were the disciples to
become one? Were they to become some sort of divine triune being? Or
were they to be united through the Holy Spirit to do the will of God,
just as Yeshua was united to his Father during his entire life on
earth?

JOHN 17:20 "I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will
believe in Me through their word; 21 that they all may be one, as You,
Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that
the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You
gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one: 23
I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and
that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as
You have loved Me." (NKJV)
When he prayed "that they may be one just as we are one," Yeshua was
not praying for all believers to become a part of the Trinity. Yeshua
clearly tells us that he and the Father are "one" by the Father being
in him (through the Holy Spirit) and by Yeshua being in the Father (by
doing God's will instead of his own). Yeshua always knew God's will
because of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit; he remained in the
Father by always doing His will. Yeshua's prayer for all believers was
that the Father would make them one with both of them; this would be
accomplished by God's Spirit flowing through Christ (the mediator) to
dwell within them.

CONCLUSION
The world is currently ruled over by angelic principalities and powers
that God gave authority over the nations. Just as the nations over
which they rule, these mighty spirits have often chosen to go against
the will of God. In choosing not to submit to God's authority, they
have become the enemies of God and His chosen people. Eventually, the
rebellion of these wicked spirits will lead to their judgment and
punishment. The Messiah, the ruler of the sons of God on the divine
council, will triumph over them at his second coming and will rule the
nations according to the will of God.

Bryan T. Huie
January 22, 2002
Revised: September 28, 2002

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SATAN, THE ADVERSARY OF MANKIND
Satan, also known as the devil, is mentioned frequently in the Bible.
There are many popular ideas about this evil spirit being. Some think
that Satan is not real, but is rather a personification of the
wickedness that abides in the world. Others admit that the devil
exists, but presume that he is now confined in the fiery pits of an
ever burning hell. Still others believe that Satan is free and
actively promoting sinfulness in our world today. What is the truth?
What does the Bible tell us about this evil being?

God's Word clearly teaches the reality of Satan as a personal entity.
He is presented as an evil being who affects humanity by his actions.
Many details about the devil are available in the Bible, but the facts
have to be searched out. In this article we will piece together what
the Scriptures have to say about Satan and draw conclusions from the
Bible and other available sources.

Although the Bible doesn't tell us explicitly, evidence suggests that
the angelic realm was formed sometime during the first three days of
creation, before God brought forth the dry land on the earth. This
understanding is supported by passages from Nehemiah and Job:

NEHEMIAH 9:6 You alone are the LORD; You have made heaven, the heaven
of heavens, with all their host, the earth and everything on it, the
seas and all that is in them, and You preserve them all. The host of
heaven worships You. (NKJV)
JOB 38:4 "Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth?
Tell Me, if you have understanding. 5 Who determined its measurements?
Surely you know! Or who stretched the line upon it? 6 To what were its
foundations fastened? Or who laid its cornerstone, 7 when the morning
stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy? (NKJV)
The "host of heaven" mentioned in Nehemiah 9:6 is a reference to
angels, as are the parallel terms "morning stars" and "sons of God" in
Job 38:7. The passage from Job suggests that the angels were present
when God "laid the foundations of the earth" (probably a reference to
the separation of the dry land from the water on the third day of
creation).

Now that we have an idea when the angels were originally formed, let's
examine what the Bible reveals about the creation of Satan:

EZEKIEL 28:12 "Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of
Tyre and say to him: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: "'You were
the model of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty. 13 You
were in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone adorned you:
ruby, topaz and emerald, chrysolite, onyx and jasper, sapphire,
turquoise and beryl. Your settings and mountings were made of gold; on
the day you were created they were prepared. 14 You were anointed as a
guardian cherub, for so I ordained you. You were on the holy mount of
God; you walked among the fiery stones. 15 You were blameless in your
ways from the day you were created till wickedness was found in you.
16 Through your widespread trade you were filled with violence, and
you sinned. So I drove you in disgrace from the mount of God, and I
expelled you, O guardian cherub, from among the fiery stones. 17 Your
heart became proud on account of your beauty, and you corrupted your
wisdom because of your splendor. So I threw you to the earth; I made a
spectacle of you before kings. 18 By your many sins and dishonest
trade you have desecrated your sanctuaries . . ." (NIV)
Satan is never mentioned by name in this passage. However, there are
some clues in Ezekiel 28 that identify the entities being spoken of
here. The chapter starts with God's proclamation against the "Prince
of Tyre" (v. 2). This prince is proud and says, "I am a god, I sit in
the seat of gods" (v. 2). These words mirror what Paul says about the
"Man of Sin" (II The. 2:4). Ezekiel 28:1-10 is speaking figuratively
of the coming Antichrist.

We see another message beginning in Ezekiel 28:11, this one addressed
by God to the "King of Tyre." However, because of the things said
about this king, it is clear that God is not speaking to a mere man.
This king is the one who will give his authority to the Prince of Tyre
at the end of the age (Rev. 13:2). This king is the ancient dragon,
Satan.

The first thing to notice from this passage in Ezekiel is that the
"king of Tyre" (Satan) was in the Garden of Eden and he was "the seal
of perfection." When does the Bible show that the Garden of Eden was
created?

GENESIS 2:8 The LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden, and there
He put the man whom He had formed. (NKJV)
Genesis 2:8 seems to indicate that the Garden of Eden was planted by
God after He created man. Ezekiel 28:13 reveals that Satan was in Eden
before he sinned. Therefore, contrary to traditional understanding,
Satan was in the Garden of Eden with Adam and Eve before he fell.

This anointed guardian cherub was likely one of the two angels who
covered the mercy seat with their wings (see Heb. 8:5; 9:5, 23-24;
Exo. 25:20; 37:9; I Kings 6:19-28; 8:6-7; I Chr. 28:18; II
Chr.3:10-13; 5:7-8). However, because of pride, this cherub's wisdom
was corrupted, as I Timothy 3:6 implies.

I TIMOTHY 3:6 Not a novice, lest being puffed up with pride he fall
into the same condemnation as the devil. (NKJV)
How did pride cause Satan to fall into condemnation? The Bible doesn't
tell us directly, but there are enough clues to figure out the answer
to this question.

Genesis 1:26-28 shows that God made mankind in His "image":

GENESIS 1:26 Then God ['elohim] said, "Let us make man in our image,
according to our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the
sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the
earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." 27 So
God ['elohim] created man in His own image; in the image of God
['elohim] He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God
['elohim] blessed them, and God ['elohim] said to them, "Be fruitful
and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the
fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living
thing that moves on the earth." (NKJV)
There are several theories about what it means to be made "in the
image of God." This passage makes it clear that being made in God's
image is what makes mankind (both men and women) different from the
rest of the creation.

Mankind is like 'elohim in some way because we are made in the image
of 'elohim, but how? Michael S. Heiser, an ancient Hebrew language
expert, gives the following explanation in answer to this question:

. . . This points to viewing the image in a FUNCTIONAL sense (i.e., we
are created to "image" God) as opposed to a QUALITATIVE sense (as
though the image is some quality or ability given to us; i.e., the
image is some possessed attribute).
. . . When Scripture speaks of mankind being created in the image of
God, what is meant is that mankind has been created to represent God
on earth.

. . . God deliberately created mankind to rule the earth, and to
accomplish this purpose, he created man as his own image - He made man
his co-regent / representative ruler.

The image of God then, refers to our unique status as human beings,
rulers in God's stead, according to His own will. We are created AS
his image - to function as he would were he administering His own
affairs directly. Our abilities - unequally given to us in the
providence of God are not THE image, but only a means to carrying out
His expressed and often secret end. (pp. 8, 9, 10, 11, "The Image of
God in Scripture")

This understanding of "the image of God" is supported by the immediate
text, which shows that mankind's duties included having dominion over
the earth and every living creature on it. This interpretation is also
supported by a related passage of Scripture in Psalm 8:

PSALM 8:4 What is man that You are mindful of him, and the son of man
that You visit him? 5 For You have made him a little lower than the
angels, and You have crowned him with glory and honor. 6 You have made
him to have dominion over the works of Your hands; You have put all
things under his feet, 7 all sheep and oxen -- even the beasts of the
field, 8 the birds of the air, and the fish of the sea that pass
through the paths of the seas. (NKJV)
In addition to showing the position of mankind on the earth, this
psalm also alludes to the reason for Satan's ultimate fall. Verse 5
tells us that humanity was made "a little lower than the angels."
However, it was men, not angels, who were given rulership over the
earth.

As Ezekiel 28:12 tells us, Satan was "the model of perfection, full of
wisdom and perfect in beauty" when he was created. Yet neither he nor
any of the other angels were given dominion over the earth initially.
Rather, Adam, a being Satan must have considered inferior to himself,
was given this power. It's easy to see why Satan's pride led him to
sin.

Ezekiel 28:16 tells us that Satan was filled with violence and sinned
through his "widespread trade." The Hebrew word rendered "trade" in
Ezekiel 28:16 is rekullatekha; it is a form of the noun rekulla, which
means "merchandise" or "traffic." However, rekulla is derived from the
root word rakal, which means "to go about." A closely-related
derivative, rakil, means "slanderer." In the New Testament, Satan is
often called the "devil," or diabolos in Greek. Not coincidentally,
the literal meaning of diabolos and its variations is also
"slanderer."

The account of Satan in Ezekiel 28 probably involves aspects of both
"merchandising" and "slander." The Scriptures imply that Satan, likely
through peddling his slander, turned one-third of the angelic host
against God (Rev. 12:3-4). It's not hard to imagine that Satan went
around to the angels, seeking to build support for his contention that
they were far better qualified to run the earth than mankind was. It
was through this slanderous "merchandising" that Satan became filled
with violence against humanity.

Eventually, Satan developed a plan that he must have felt would
deliver to him the position he believed should have rightfully been
his in the beginning. He decided to deceive the humans in the Garden
into disobeying God's direct command. After having proven mankind
unworthy of the rulership position God had placed them in, Satan, in
his arrogant pride, must have thought God would see that he should be
given authority over the world in their place.

It's in this context that we see Satan approach Eve in the Garden of
Eden:

GENESIS 3:1 Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the
field which the LORD God had made. And he said to the woman, "Has God
indeed said, 'You shall not eat of every tree of the garden'?" 2 And
the woman said to the serpent, "We may eat the fruit of the trees of
the garden; 3 but of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of
the garden, God has said, 'You shall not eat it, nor shall you touch
it, lest you die.' " 4 Then the serpent said to the woman, "You will
not surely die. 5 For God knows that in the day you eat of it your
eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."
6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, that it was
pleasant to the eyes, and a tree desirable to make one wise, she took
of its fruit and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he
ate. (NKJV)
The Bible elsewhere identifies Satan with the serpent in this story.
In Revelation 12:9 and 20:2, he is called "that serpent of old, called
the Devil and Satan." Did he appear to Eve in the form of a talking
snake? Probably not.

The Hebrew word translated "serpent" in the above passage is
&#1504;&#1495;&#1513; (nachash). In addition to "serpent," this Hebrew
root word has three other possible meanings. It can be used as a noun
to mean (1) "one who practices divination," or (2) "shining brass."
However, nachash can also be used as a verb to mean (3) "to shine" or
"to glow."

In Genesis 3, it is possible that nachash is used in the verbal form
as a noun. If that is the case, the proper translation of hanachash in
Genesis 3 would be "the Shining one." This understanding of nachash
fits in very well with Paul's description of Satan appearing as an
"angel of light" (II Cor. 11:14).

Notice Satan's tactics with Eve. He didn't lie to her outright, but
instead he twisted the truth. He led Eve to doubt God's word.

GENESIS 3:7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew
that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made
themselves coverings. 8 And they heard the sound of the LORD God
walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and Adam and his wife
hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of
the garden. 9 Then the LORD God called to Adam and said to him, "Where
are you?" 10 So he said, "I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was
afraid because I was naked; and I hid myself." 11 And He said, "Who
told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree of which I
commanded you that you should not eat?" 12 Then the man said, "The
woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I
ate." 13 And the LORD God said to the woman, "What is this you have
done?" The woman said, "The serpent deceived me, and I ate." (NKJV)
Although Satan apparently believed that the downfall of mankind would
benefit him, it actually turned out to be his undoing. God was not
pleased with his role in man's disobedience, and he was cursed for his
deviousness:

GENESIS 3:14 So the LORD God said to the serpent: "Because you have
done this, you are cursed more than all cattle, and more than every
beast of the field; on your belly you shall go, and you shall eat dust
all the days of your life. 15 And I will put enmity between you and
the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your
head, and you shall bruise His heel." (NKJV)
Satan's plan to rectify the "mistake" God had made by putting humans
in charge of the earth backfired. As well as showing God the flaws of
man, Satan revealed his own shortcomings. This resulted in God placing
an age-lasting animosity between mankind and Satan. From that point
forward, "the Shining one" became "the Adversary" (Heb. haSatan) of
humanity. The enmity God placed between man and Satan is alluded to by
Paul in the conclusion of his letter to the Romans:

ROMANS 16:20 And the God of peace will crush Satan under your feet
shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen. (NKJV)
Satan's actions did achieve their desired aim; God cast man out of the
Garden of Eden for his sin (Gen. 3:24). In his fallen state, man was
condemned to suffer death because of Adam's sin, as Paul tells us in
his letter to the Romans:

ROMANS 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world,
and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all
sinned . . . 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even
over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the
transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come. (NKJV)
Because Satan enticed mankind to sin and bring death upon themselves,
he is called a murderer:

JOHN 8:44 "You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the
desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does
not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he
speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the
father of lies. (NASU)
"The beginning" spoken of by Yeshua refers to the beginning of God's
plan, when mankind was in the Garden of Eden before the fall (Gen. 2).
"The beginning" here is not referring to Satan's creation, because we
know God originally made him perfect (Eze. 28:15; Gen. 1:31).

John also speaks of Satan being a sinner from "the beginning":

I JOHN 3:8 The one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil
has sinned from the beginning. . . . (NASU)
In man's place, Satan became the temporary ruler of the world. The
devil's temptation of Yeshua in the wilderness clearly shows this:

LUKE 4:5 Then the devil, taking Him up on a high mountain, showed Him
all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. 6 And the devil
said to Him, "All this authority I will give You, and their glory; for
this has been delivered to me, and I give it to whomever I wish."
(NKJV)
Satan tempted Yeshua for the same reason he had enticed Eve in the
Garden. He knew that Yeshua was in the process of regaining rulership
over the world and replacing him. He also knew that if he could get
Yeshua to sin (as he had with Adam and Eve), then he could thwart
God's plan and remain the ruler of the world. Where Adam and Eve had
succumbed to Satan's deception and disqualified mankind from ruling
the earth, Yeshua withstood the temptation and triumphed. This victory
paved the way for him to eventually reclaim rulership at his second
coming.

Just before his crucifixion, Yeshua alluded to Satan's status as the
current ruler of the world:

JOHN 14:30 "I will no longer talk much with you, for the ruler of this
world is coming, and he has nothing in Me." (NKJV)
Paul refers to Satan as "the god of this age" in his second letter to
the Corinthians:

II CORINTHIANS 4:3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to
those who are perishing, 4 whose minds the god of this age has
blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory
of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them. (NKJV)
Mark's Gospel clearly shows us that Satan is the one who is
responsible for blinding those who can't see the good news of the
Messiah:

MARK 4:14 "The sower sows the word. 15 And these are the ones by the
wayside where the word is sown. When they hear, Satan comes
immediately and takes away the word that was sown in their hearts.
(NKJV)
As the "god of this age," Satan rules over the other fallen angels and
the demons:

MATTHEW 12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it they said, "It is only
by Beelzebul, the prince of demons, that this man casts out demons."
25 Knowing their thoughts, he said to them, "Every kingdom divided
against itself is laid waste, and no city or house divided against
itself will stand; 26 and if Satan casts out Satan, he is divided
against himself; how then will his kingdom stand?" (RSV)
Here Satan is called "Beelzebul," which literally means "lord of the
flies." He is identified as the "prince of demons." We also know from
the Scriptures that Satan is the ruler of the fallen angels (Matt.
25:41; Rev. 12:9). For an examination of the difference between fallen
angels and demons, refer to my related article.

When demons bring sickness and ailments upon people, we find that
Satan is blamed:

LUKE 13:11 And behold, there was a woman who had a spirit of infirmity
eighteen years, and was bent over and could in no way raise herself
up. 12 But when Jesus saw her, He called her to Him and said to her,
"Woman, you are loosed from your infirmity." 13 And He laid His hands
on her, and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God. . .
. 16 "So ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan
has bound -- think of it -- for eighteen years, be loosed from this
bond on the Sabbath?" (NKJV)
ACTS 10:38 "How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit
and with power, who went about doing good and healing all who were
oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him." (NKJV)
Contrary to popular opinion, the Bible clearly shows that Satan has
not been restricted to hell after his fall. Indeed, the Old Testament
shows that, before the first coming of Yeshua the Messiah, Satan
continued to have access to the very throne of God:

JOB 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present
themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them. (NKJV)
JOB 2:1 Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present
themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present
himself before the LORD. (NKJV)
Satan used his access to the heavenly throne to slander and accuse
God's people before YHVH and the divine council, as the story in Job
shows. Zechariah also saw Satan in action as the accuser in a vision:

ZECHARIAH 3:1 Then he showed me Joshua the high priest standing before
the Angel of the LORD, and Satan standing at his right side to accuse
him. 2 The LORD said to Satan, "The LORD rebuke you, Satan! The LORD,
who has chosen Jerusalem, rebuke you! Is not this man a burning stick
snatched from the fire?" (NIV)
When Christ triumphantly returned to heaven after his crucifixion and
resurrection (Rev. 12:5), Satan and his angels were cast out and no
longer had access to the throne:

REVELATION 12:7 Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels
fighting against the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, 8
but they were defeated and there was no longer any place for them in
heaven. 9 And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent,
who is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world --
he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with
him. (RSV)
Some have incorrectly believed that this passage refers to Satan's
initial fall. Yet the time sequence established in Revelation 12
clearly indicates that this ejection from heaven is after the Messiah
returned from the earth and before his second coming at the end of
this age.

Yeshua, just before his crucifixion, stated that his triumph on the
cross would allow for Satan to be cast out of heaven:

JOHN 12:31 "Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the ruler of
this world be cast out; 32 and I, when I am lifted up from the earth,
will draw all men to myself." (RSV)
JOHN 16:11 "Concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is
judged." (RSV)
Christ told his disciples that when he had gone back into heaven after
his resurrection, the Father would send His Spirit to teach them all
things and bring them into remembrance of all the things that he had
said to them (John 14:26). But in addition, he warned them of the
coming of Satan to the earth after his departure.

John records an angel speaking from heaven who gives warning to the
earth about Satan:

REVELATION 12:10 Then I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, "Now
salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of
His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused
them before our God day and night, has been cast down. 11 And they
overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their
testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death. 12
Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! Woe to the
inhabitants of the earth and the sea! For the devil has come down to
you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has a short time."
(NKJV)
Satan now roams the earth looking for those whom he can prey upon:

I PETER 5:8 Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls
around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. (NIV)
Paul tells us how to avoid becoming the prey of Satan:

EPHESIANS 6:10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the
power of His might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be
able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle
against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers,
against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual
hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore take up the
whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day,
and having done all, to stand. 14 Stand therefore, having girded your
waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15
and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
16 above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able
to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one. 17 And take the
helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of
God; (NKJV)
James also gives believers advice on thwarting the devil's schemes:

JAMES 4:7 Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee
from you. 8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse
your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
(NKJV)
Paul, in his second letter to Timothy, speaks of those who have been
caught by the devil:

II TIMOTHY 2:24 And a servant of the Lord must not quarrel but be
gentle to all, able to teach, patient, 25 in humility correcting those
who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so
that they may know the truth, 26 and that they may come to their
senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by
him to do his will. (NKJV)
Now that we've examined Satan's origin and activities, let's look at
the final destiny of Satan. What do the Scriptures say will be his
ultimate fate? Yeshua briefly mentioned this in his dissertation on
the judgment in Matthew 25:

MATTHEW 25:41 "Then He will also say to those on the left hand,
'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for
the devil and his angels: (NKJV)
Revelation 19 describes the battle between the forces of the
Antichrist and Yeshua at the end of this age. After the defeat and
destruction of "the beast" and "the false prophet," the Bible reveals
that Satan himself will be captured and imprisoned for a thousand
years:

REVELATION 20:1 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, having
the key to the bottomless pit [abussou, "Abyss"] and a great chain in
his hand. 2 He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is
the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he cast
him into the bottomless pit [abusson, "Abyss"], and shut him up, and
set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till
the thousand years were finished. But after these things he must be
released for a little while. (NKJV)
ISAIAH 24:21 So it will happen in that day, that the LORD will punish
the host of heaven on high, and the kings of the earth on earth. 22
They will be gathered together like prisoners in the dungeon, and will
be confined in prison; and after many days they will be punished.
(NASU)
REVELATION 20:7 And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be
loosed from his prison 8 and will come out to deceive the nations
which are at the four corners of the earth, that is, Gog and Magog, to
gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. 9
And they marched up over the broad earth and surrounded the camp of
the saints and the beloved city; but fire came down from heaven and
consumed them, 10 and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into
the lake of fire and sulphur where the beast and the false prophet
were, and they will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
(RSV)
Satan's final rebellion against God will be thwarted, and God will
finally deal with the devil. The tenth verse of Revelation 20
describes how God handles Satan. Just what does this verse tell us
about the fate of the Adversary?

The first part of the answer lies in the Greek word basanisthesontai,
translated "tormented" here. Understanding the true meaning of
basanisthesontai, which comes from the verb basanizo and the noun
basanos, is one of the major keys to accurately interpreting
Revelation 20:10.

According to Friberg, basanisthesontai means "strictly, rub upon the
touchstone (basanos), a Lydian stone used to test the genuineness of
metals; hence, test or make proof of anything . . ."

The history found in the Theological Dictionary of the New Testament
of how the meaning of these words evolved over time is very helpful in
correctly understanding this verse:

. . . The &#946;&#940;&#963;&#945;&#957;&#959;&#962; [basanos]
originally belongs to the calling of the inspector of coins. It is
linked with the Heb. root &#1489;&#1495;&#1503; ("to test") . . .
&#946;&#940;&#963;&#945;&#957;&#959;&#962; is generally accepted to be
a loan word . . . The testing of gold and silver as media of exchange
by the proving stone, was first developed by the Babylonians, then
came to the Aramaeans and Hebrews by way of Lydia . . . and from them
to the Gks. In non-biblical Gk.
&#946;&#940;&#963;&#945;&#957;&#959;&#962; is a commercial expression,
or is used in relation to government. It then acquires the meaning of
the checking of calculations, which develops naturally out of the
basic sense of &#946;&#940;&#963;&#945;&#957;&#959;&#962;,
&#946;&#945;&#963;&#945;&#957;&#943;&#950;&#949;&#953;&#957;
[basanizein] . . . In the spiritual sphere it has the figur. sense,
which is closely related to the original concrete meaning, of a means
of testing . . .
The word then undergoes a change in meaning. The original sense fades
into the background. &#946;&#940;&#963;&#945;&#957;&#959;&#962; now
comes to denote "torture" or "the rack," espec. used with slaves . . .
&#946;&#940;&#963;&#945;&#957;&#959;&#962; occurs in the sense of
"torment" . . .

The change in meaning is best explained if we begin with the object of
treatment. If we put men instead of metal or a coin, the stone of
testing become[s] torture or the rack. The metal which has survived
the testing stone is subjected to harsher treatment. Man is in the
same position when severely tested by torture. In the testing of metal
an essential role was played by the thought of testing and proving
genuineness. The rack is a means of showing the true state of affairs.
In its proper sense it is a means of testing and proving, though also
of punishment. Finally, even this special meaning was weakened and
only the general element of torture remained (pp. 561, 562, vol. I,
emphasis mine).

The meaning of Revelation 20:10 is that Satan (and implicitly, all
those who haven't submitted to God by the end of the Millennium) will
be cast into the lake of fire. There Satan and the wicked will be
punished for their rebellion. In addition to punishing, the lake of
fire will also test, prove, and refine those in it. However, this
process is not "eternal" as we understand the concept.

To verify this, let's look closely at the final phrase "forever and
ever." Friberg says that this phrase, translated from the Greek eis
tous aionas ton aionon, literally means "into the ages of the ages."
The Greek nouns aionas and aionon are plural forms of the Greek aion,
which simply means an "eon" or "age." This word refers to an
indefinite period of time; however, it does not convey the idea of
eternity.

This Greek phrase is used numerous times in the Scriptures (see Gal.
1:5; Phi. 4:20; I Tim. 1:17; II Tim. 4:18; Heb. 13:21; I Pet. 4:11;
Rev. 1:6, 18; 4:9, 10; 5:13, 14; 7:12; 10:6; 11:15; 15:7; 19:3; 22:5).
Most people assume that this phrase means "eternity"; however, some
scholars realize that this connotation was not present in the original
Koine ("common") Greek of the New Testament. In his work on the
original meanings of aion and aionios, Louis Abbott writes:

The Greek phrase eis tous aionas ton aionon, "for the eons of the
eons," occurs about twenty times in the Greek New Testament in this
combination. The ASV margin and some other versions, lexicons,
dictionaries, and commentaries translate the phrase correctly.
Windet, in De Vita Functora Statu, of 1633 says (p. 170), "eis tous
aionas ton aionon, of the New Testament meant a finite period."

At 1 Cor. 15:25, where the Greek text shows, dei gar auton basileuein
achri hou the pantas tous echthrous hupo tous podas autou, "For He
must be reigning until He should be placing all His enemies under His
feet." This clearly states that Christ's reigning is limited. There is
no Scripture to contradict the statement when aion and aionios are
correctly translated.

Dr. William Barclay concurs in his commentary (p. 166-169) on The
Letters to the Corinthians. If the Greek words eis tous aionas ton
aionon mean endless time, as translated in the KJV, "forever and
ever," we have a contradiction in Scripture, for Rev. 11:15 says, in
the same version: "The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms
of our Lord and His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever." That
contradicts 1 Cor. 15:25, which says: "He must be reigning till . . ."
If Rev. 11:15 is translated "eons of the eons," or "ages of the ages,"
there is no contradiction. The ASV says (1 Cor. 15:24-25), "Then
cometh the end, when He shall deliver up the kingdom to God, even the
Father; When He shall have abolished all rule and all authority and
power. For He must reign till He hath put all His enemies under His
feet;" consequently, the reigning of Christ Jesus and the saints (Rev.
22:5) will be "for the eons of the eons" or "for the ages of the
ages." (ch. 5, An Analytical Study of Words)

A correct understanding of "into the ages of the ages" shows that
Satan, as well as those who worship the "beast" (Rev. 14:11) will be
refined in the lake of fire for an indeterminate, probably lengthy,
but still finite, amount of time. The use of the phrase "day and
night" in Revelation 20:10 also bears this out, since time as we
understand it does not exist in eternity.

One final point regarding Satan needs to be addressed. Some believe
that God created Satan to be evil and to fulfill a specific purpose
here on the earth as the adversary and tempter of mankind. Those who
teach this doctrine primarily cite three Scriptures in support of
their position: John 8:44, I John 3:8 and Isaiah 45:7. We've already
looked at John 8:44 and I John 3:8, so let's now examine Isaiah 45:7:

ISAIAH 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and
create evil [ra']: I the LORD do all these things. (KJV)
On the surface, this verse appears to give a scriptural basis for the
belief that God created Satan with an inherently evil nature. However,
when we research this passage, a different picture emerges.

The KJV does imply that God was the creator of evil. However, this
same version also renders the Hebrew word ra' (translated "evil" in
this passage) as "adversity" and "affliction" elsewhere.

If we look at this verse more closely, we can see what YHVH is saying
through Isaiah. God is obviously differentiating between two opposites
with the first pair of things He mentions ("light" and "dark"). To
stay consistent, the second pair of things God lists ("peace," shalom
in Hebrew, and "evil") must also be opposites. Yet we know the
opposite of evil is good. However, "adversity," another valid
translation of ra', is the opposite of shalom, which can mean
"prosperity," "safety," and "contentment" in addition to "peace."

Many modern versions translate this phrase more accurately than the
KJV, as the following examples show: "I make peace and create
calamity" - NKJV; "I make weal and create woe" - RSV; "I make good
fortune and create calamity" - Jerusalem Bible; "author alike of
prosperity and trouble" - NEB. When translated properly, this verse
cannot be used to "prove" that God created Satan to be the evil enemy
of mankind.

Yes, Satan did sin from the beginning (John 8:44; I John 3:8). But
these verses, when correctly understood, do not substantiate the
belief that God created Satan evil. This doctrine contradicts the
Scripture, which shows that all of God's creation was perfect at
first:

GENESIS 1:31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it
was very good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
(NKJV)
CONCLUSION
The Bible gives quite a bit of information about Satan. To understand
the truth, all the information has to be pieced together. Satan is
currently the "god" of this world; he is the highest ranking evil
spirit being. The devil has authority over the fallen angels and the
demons. In the end, Christ will return and subjugate all who won't
submit to God's authority, including Satan and his angels. Their
punishment will be age-lasting destruction and refinement within the
lake of fire.

Bryan T. Huie
July 12, 1997
Revised: January 17, 2003



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GENESIS 6 - WHO WERE "THE SONS OF GOD"?
GENESIS 6:1 Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the
face of the earth, and daughters were born to them, 2 that the sons of
God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took
wives for themselves of all whom they chose. 3 And the LORD said, "My
Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet
his days shall be one hundred and twenty years." 4 There were giants
on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God
came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those
were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown. (NKJV)
There has been much speculation about who these "sons of God"
mentioned in the sixth chapter of Genesis were. Three basic
interpretations of this passage have been advanced.

The first, and oldest, belief is that "the sons of God" were fallen
angels who consorted with human women, producing giant offspring
called nephilim (Heb. &#1504;&#1508;&#1500;&#1497;&#1501;). This view
was widely held in the world of the first century, and was supported
by Flavius Josephus, Philo, Eusebius and many of the "Ante-Nicene
Fathers," including Justin Martyr, Clement of Alexandria, Origen,
Tertullian, Irenaeus, Athenagoras and Commodianus.

The second view is one which was first suggested by Julius Africanus
and later advocated by Saint Augustine, the Catholic Bishop of Hippo.
Augustine rejected the concept of the fallen host having committed
fornication with women. In his early fifth century book The City of
God, he promoted the theory that "the sons of God" simply referred to
the genealogical line of Seth, who were committed to preserving the
true worship of God. He interpreted Genesis 6 to mean that the male
offspring of Adam through Seth were "the sons of God," and the female
offspring of Adam through Cain were "the daughters of men." He wrote
that the problem was that the family of Seth had interbred with the
family of Cain, intermingling the bloodlines and corrupting the pure
religion. This view has become the dominant one among most modern
biblical scholars.

The third view is that "the sons of God" were the sons of pre-Flood
rulers or magistrates. This belief became the standard explanation of
rabbinical Judaism after Rabbi Simeon ben Yochai pronounced a curse in
the second century C.E. upon those Jews who believed the common
teaching that the angels were responsible for the nephilim. This
interpretation was advocated by two of the most respected Jewish
rabbis of the Middle Ages, Rashi and Nachmanides, and became the
standard explanation of rabbinical Judaism. However, it is not widely
accepted by modern scholars.

To determine who these "sons of God" were, we'll first examine what
various outside sources have to say about this topic. Then we'll
examine the ultimate authority, the Bible, to see its position.

Let's start with a quotation and footnote from William Whitson's
translation of the respected first century Jewish historian Flavius
Josephus' history of the Jewish people:

Now this posterity of Seth continued to esteem God as the Lord of the
universe, and to have an entire regard to virtue, for seven
generations; but in process of time they were perverted, and forsook
the practices of their forefathers, and did neither pay those honors
to God which were appointed to them, nor had they any concern to do
justice towards men. But for what degree of zeal they had formerly
shown for virtue, they now showed by their actions a double degree of
wickedness; whereby they made God to be their enemy, for many angels*
of God accompanied with women and begat sons that proved unjust, and
despisers of all that was good, on account of the confidence they had
in their own strength; for the tradition is, that these men did what
resembled the acts of those whom the Grecians called giants. But Noah
was very uneasy at what they did; and, being displeased at their
conduct, persuaded them to change their dispositions and their acts
for the better; but, seeing that they did not yield to him, but were
slaves to their wicked pleasures, he was afraid they would kill him,
together with his wife and children, and those they had married; so he
departed out of that land. (p. 32; bk. 1, ch. 3, §§72-74, The
Antiquities of the Jews, translated by William Whitson)
* This notion, that the fallen angels were, in some sense the fathers
of the old giants, was the constant opinion of antiquity.

As you can see, Josephus believed and recorded that "the sons of God"
mentioned in Genesis 6 were fallen angels. As Whitson's footnote
acknowledges, this belief was standard in the ancient world.

Another well-known first century Jewish writer, Philo of Alexandria,
shared Josephus' views on this topic. In his work "On the Giants,"
Philo wrote:

"And when the angels of God saw the daughters of men that they were
beautiful, they took unto themselves wives of all them whom they
chose." Those beings, whom other philosophers call demons, Moses
usually calls angels . . . (p. 152, The Works of Philo, "De
Gigantibus," translated by C.D. Yonge)
The Book of Enoch (also called I Enoch) is a collection of
pseudepigraphic writings by various authors which dates to the first
or second century B.C. This book was well-known by the early church;
in fact, Jude, the brother of Jesus, quoted Enoch 1:9 in verses 14 and
15 of his epistle. Obviously Jude felt that the Book of Enoch he had
access to in the first century was trustworthy. This work, which
survived to our day against great odds, deals extensively with the
fall of the angels. It was viewed favorably by some early "Christian"
writers also (Irenaeus, Clement of Alexandria, and others). However,
it was never universally accepted as inspired Scripture. Below is a
selection from the Book of Enoch which records the sin of angels:

1 ENOCH 6:1 And it came to pass when the children of men had
multiplied that in those days were born unto 2 them beautiful and
comely daughters. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and
lusted after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us
wives from among the children of men 3 and beget us children.' And
Semjaza, who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not 4
indeed agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the
penalty of a great sin.' And they all answered him and said: 'Let us
all swear an oath, and all bind ourselves by mutual imprecations 5 not
to abandon this plan but to do this thing.' Then sware they all
together and bound themselves 6 by mutual imprecations upon it. And
they were in all two hundred; who descended in the days of Jared on
the summit of Mount Hermon . . . (From The Apocrypha and
Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, translated by R.H. Charles)
A similar passage is also found in the pseudepigraphic Book of
Jubilees:

JUBILEES 5:1 And it came to pass when the children of men began to
multiply on the face of the earth and daughters were born unto them,
that the angels of God saw them on a certain year of this jubilee,
that they were beautiful to look upon; and they took themselves wives
of all whom they 2 chose, and they bare unto them sons and they were
giants. And lawlessness increased on the earth and all flesh corrupted
its way, alike men and cattle and beasts and birds and everything that
walks on the earth - all of them corrupted their ways and their
orders, and they began to devour each other, and lawlessness increased
on the earth and every imagination of the thoughts of all men 3 (was)
thus evil continually . . . (From The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of
the Old Testament, translated by R.H. Charles)
The Genesis Apocryphon, one of the texts uncovered among the Dead Sea
Scrolls, also contains references to the angels interbreeding with
human women. In this text, a conversation between Lamech, the father
of Noah, and his wife Bathenosh is detailed. Lamech questions his wife
because he thinks that the conception of Noah was due to either an
angel or one of their offspring, a nephilim. The Book of Enoch, the
Book of Jubilees, and the Genesis Apocryphon all clearly show that the
common understanding at the time of Christ was that the fallen host
had committed fornication with women in the period before the flood.

As stated previously, many early Christian writers accepted the story
told in Enoch as fact. Let's examine the writings of two of them,
beginning with Justin Martyr, who lived from 110 C.E. to 165 C.E. Here
is what he had to say in chapter 5 of his Second Apology, entitled
""How the Angels Transgressed":

God, when He had made the whole world, and subjected things earthly to
man, and arranged the heavenly elements for the increase of fruits and
rotation of the seasons, and appointed this divine law - for these
things also He evidently made for man - committed the care of men and
of all things under heaven to angels whom He appointed over them. But
the angels transgressed this appointment, and were captivated by love
of women, and begat children who are those that are called demons; and
besides, they afterwards subdued the human race to themselves, partly
by magical writings, and partly by fears and punishments they
occasioned, and partly by teaching them to offer sacrifices, and
incense, and libations, of which things they stood in need after they
enslaved by lustful passions; and among men they sowed murders, wars,
adulteries, intemperate needs, and all wickedness. . . . (p. 363, vol.
1, The Ante-Nicene Fathers)
Now let's examine chapter 3, "The Worship of Demons," from The
Instructions of Commodianus, a North-African bishop who lived about
240 C.E.:

When Almighty God, to beautify the nature of the world, willed that
that earth should be visited by angels, when they were sent down they
despised His laws. Such was the beauty of women, that it turned them
aside; so that, being contaminated, they could not return to heaven.
Rebels from God, they uttered words against Him. Then the Highest
uttered His judgment against them; and from their seed giants are said
to have been born. By them arts were made known in the earth, and they
taught the dyeing of wool, and everything which is done; and to them,
when they died, men erected images. But the Almighty, because they
were of an evil seed, did not approve that, when dead, they should be
brought back from death. Whence wandering they now subvert many
bodies, and it is such as these especially that ye this day worship
and pray to as gods. (p. 435, vol. 4, The Ante-Nicene Fathers)
The idea that the nephilim or giants were the offspring of the fallen
host and human females was not unique to Judaism. This understanding
was likely behind the Greek, Roman, and Egyptian mythologies, as well
as those of India and the near east. All these beliefs resulted not as
mere inventions of fertile human imagination, but as a corruption of
antediluvian truths which were distorted as their origin was forgotten
over time.

Take, for example, the legend of the Titans. In Greek mythology, the
Titans were a family of giant gods who were the offspring of Uranus
(heaven) and Gaea (earth). The most famous of the Titans was Cronus,
who killed his father. Cronus later led the Titans in their losing war
against Zeus and the Olympian gods. After their defeat, the Titans
were imprisoned in a section of the underworld called Tartarus.

In his second epistle, the apostle Peter uses part of this Greek myth
to explain the fate of some of the fallen angels. He states that for
their sins, these angels had been tartarosas, which The NKJV Greek
English Interlinear New Testament translates literally as "confining
them to Tartarus" (also known in the Bible as "the Abyss").

II PETER 2:4 For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast
them down to hell [tartarosas] and delivered them into chains of
darkness, to be reserved for judgment; (NKJV)
This is the same Tartarus where Greek mythology says the Titans were
imprisoned. It's highly unlikely that Peter would have used such an
analogy if this pagan legend wasn't based on at least some grain of
truth which his readers would have knowledge of. The idea that evil
angels mated with human women and had offspring (the nephilim) appears
far-fetched to us in this modern era, but it seems to have been widely
accepted as fact in the ancient world.

As we've seen above, the word translated "giants" in Genesis 6:4 is
nephilim. Let's look at what The International Standard Bible
Encyclopedia has to say about the possible origins of this Hebrew
word:

The etymology of nepîlîm is uncertain, the following explanations have
been advanced with mixed reception. First, it may derive from the
niphal of the verb pala, meaning "be extraordinary," i.e.,
"extraordinary men." Second, it may be derived from the verb napal,
"fall," in one of the following senses: (1) the "fallen ones" - from
heaven, i.e., supernatural beings; (2) morally "fallen men"; (3)
"those who fall upon," in the sense of invaders or hostile, violent
men; (4) "those who fell by" the sword (cf. Ezk. 32:20f.); (5)
"unnaturally begotten men" or bastards (from cf. nepel, "abortion" or
miscarriage"). (pp. 518-519, vol. 3)
The Greek version of the Old Testament, the Septuagint, renders the
Hebrew term nephilim as gigantes, which literally means "earth-born."
This is often misunderstood to mean "giants" - which the nephilim
apparently were also.

From the sources we've just examined, it's readily apparent that the
general understanding of Genesis 6:1-4 at the time of Christ was that
the angels had sinned by committing fornication with human women. But
does the Bible support this theory?

First, let's look at all of the Old Testament references to "sons of
God." This phrase is translated from the Hebrew beney 'elohim
(&#1489;&#1504;&#1497; &#1488;&#1500;&#1492;&#1497;&#1501;), beney
ha'elohim (&#1489;&#1504;&#1497;
&#1492;&#1488;&#1500;&#1492;&#1497;&#1501;) and beney 'elim
(&#1489;&#1504;&#1497; &#1488;&#1500;&#1497;&#1501;):

GENESIS 6:1 When men began to increase on earth and daughters were
born to them, 2 the divine beings [beney ha'elohim] saw how beautiful
the daughters of men were and took wives from among those that pleased
them. 3 The Lord said, "My breath shall not abide in man forever,
since he too is flesh; let the days allowed him be one hundred and
twenty years." 4 It was then, and later too, that the Nephilim
appeared on earth when the divine beings [beney ha'elohim] cohabited
with the daughters of men, who bore them offspring. They were the
heroes of old, the men of renown. (Tanakh, the new Jewish Publication
Society translation according to the traditional Hebrew text)
DEUTERONOMY 32:8 When the Most High gave to the nations their
inheritance, when he separated the sons of men, he fixed the bounds of
the peoples according to the number of the sons of God [beney
'elohim]. (RSV)
JOB 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God [beney ha'elohim]
came to present themselves before the Lord and Satan also came among
them. (NKJV)
JOB 2:1 Again there was a day when the sons of God [beney ha'elohim]
came to present themselves before the Lord and Satan came also among
them to present himself before the Lord. (NKJV)
JOB 38:4 "Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth?
Tell Me, if you have understanding. 5 Who determined its measurements?
Surely you know! Or who stretched the line upon it? 6 To what were its
foundations fastened? Or who laid its cornerstone, 7 when the morning
stars sang together, and all the sons of God [beney 'elohim] shouted
for joy? (NKJV)
PSALM 29:1 O give the Lord you sons of God [beney 'elim], give the
Lord glory and power; 2 give the Lord the glory of his name. Adore the
Lord in his holy court. (The Psalms: A New Translation)
PSALM 89:5 The heavens proclaim your wonders, O Lord; the assembly of
your holy ones proclaims your truth. 6 For who in the skies can
compare with the Lord or who is like the Lord among the sons of God
[beney 'elim]? (The Psalms: A New Translation)
As you can see, each reference above is to angels. There are no
instances in the Old Testament where the phrase "sons of God" refers
to men. Let's see what E.W. Bullinger has to say about these "sons of
God" in Appendix 23 to The Companion Bible:
"The Sons of God" in Gen. 6.2, 4.
It is only by the Divine specific act of creation that any created
being can be called "a son of God." For that which is "born of the
flesh is flesh." God is spirit and that which is "born of the Spirit
is spirit" (John 3.6). Hence Adam is called a "son of God" in Luke
3.38. Those "in Christ" having the "new nature" which is by the direct
creation of God (2 Cor. 5.17; Eph. 2.l0) can be, and are called "sons
of God" (John 1.13; Rom. 8.14, 15; 1 John 3.1).

This is why angels are called "sons of God" in every other place where
the expression is used in the Old Testament. Job 1.6; 2.1; 38.7; Ps.
29.1; 89.6; Dan. 3.25 (no art.). We have no authority or right to take
the expression in Gen. 6.4 in any other sense. Moreover in Gen. 6.2
the Sept. renders it "angels". (pp. 26, 27, Companion Bible
Appendixes)

Now let's look at Genesis 6:9, which discusses Noah's genealogy. This
Scripture is further proof that fallen angels had interbred with
humans.
GENESIS 6:9 This is the genealogy of Noah. Noah was a just man,
perfect [tamim] in his generations. Noah walked with God. (NKJV)
In Genesis 6:9, the Hebrew word tamim, here translated "perfect,"
means "physically without blemish." As the first sentence makes clear,
it's referring to the genealogy of Noah; it does not refer to moral
perfection. Below is what Appendix 26 of The Companion Bible has to
say about this word as used in verse 9 of Genesis 6:
The Heb. word tamim means without blemish, and is the technical word
for bodily and physical perfection, and, not moral. Hence it is used
of animals of sacrificial purity . It is rendered without blemish in
Ex. 12.5; 29.1; Lev. 1.3, 10; 3.1, 6; 4.3, 23, 28, 32; 5.12, 18; 6.6;
9.2, 3; 14.10; 22.19; 23.12, 18; Num. 6.14; 28.19, 31; 29.2, 8, 13,
20, 23, 29, 32, 36; Ezek. 43.22, 23, 25; 45.18, 23; 46.4, 6, 13.
Without spot: Num. 19.2; 28.3, 9, 11; 29.17, 26.

Undefiled: Ps. 119.1.

This shows that Gen. 6.9 does not speak of Noah's moral perfection . .
. (p. 28, Companion Bible Appendixes)

Now let's examine what Jude said about the fallen angels in the New
Testament:

JUDE 6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left
their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under
darkness unto the judgment of the great day. 7 Even as Sodom and
Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves
over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for
an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. (KJV)
Because of the punctuation of verse 7, this Scripture appears to say
that Sodom and Gomorrah, as well as the cities around them, gave
themselves over to sexual immorality. However, the underlying Greek
text does not support this interpretation. Kenneth Wuest writes of
verse 7:

This verse begins with hos, an adverb of comparison having meanings of
"in the same manner as, after the fashion of, as, just as." Here it
introduces a comparison showing a likeness between the angels of verse
6 and the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha of this verse. But the likeness
between them lies deeper than the fact that both were guilty of
committing sin. It extends to the fact that both were guilty of the
same identical sin. The punctuation of the A.V. [KJV] is misleading,
as an examination of Greek text discloses.
The A.V. punctuation gives the reader the impression that Sodom and
Gomorrha committed fornication and that the cities about them
committed fornication in like manner to the two cities named. . . .
The words "in like manner" are related to the verbal forms, "giving
themselves over to fornication" and "going after strange flesh." In
addition to all this, the Greek text has toutois, "to these." Thus,
the translation should read, "just as Sodom and Gomorrha and the
cities about them, in like manner to these, having given themselves
over to fornication and having gone after strange flesh." The sense of
the entire passage (vv.6, 7) is that the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha
and the cities about them, in like manner to these (the angels), have
given themselves over to fornication and have gone after strange
flesh. That means that the sin of the fallen angels was fornication.
(pp. 241-242, vol. II, Word Studies in the Greek New Testament)

The underlying Greek text indicates that the fallen angels left their
own domain and indulged in sexual immorality, going after "strange,"
or "other" flesh. The KJV obscures this fact, probably because the
view that the fallen angels were "the sons of God" spoken of in
Genesis 6:2, 4 was not accepted when it was translated in 1611.
However, some translations do more clearly show the meaning of this
passage. The New English Bible better presents what Jude was saying:

JUDE 6 Remember too the angels, how some of them were not content to
keep the dominion given to them but abandoned their proper home; and
God has reserved them for judgement on the great Day, bound beneath
the darkness in everlasting chains. 7 Remember Sodom and Gomorrah and
the neighbouring towns; like the angels, they committed fornication
and followed unnatural lusts; and they paid the penalty in eternal
fire, an example for all to see. (NEB)
It's clear that Jude wrote of the fornication of the angels as a fact.
In verse 7 of his epistle, he compares the sexual wickedness in Sodom,
Gomorrah, and the surrounding cities to the sin of the angels.

The nature of the angels' fall is also clearly stated in Jude 6, where
it is said that they left their own "abode" (Gr. oiketerion). This
word occurs in the New Testament only here and in II Corinthians 5:2,
where it is used of the spiritual body of a resurrected saint.

II CORINTHIANS 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house, this tent,
is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with
hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly
desiring to be clothed with our habitation [oiketerion] which is from
heaven, (NKJV)
There is a great deal revealed in the Bible about angels. Angels could
and did assume human form and even eat men's food (Gen. 18-19).
Although the Bible doesn't tell us how, Jude 6 shows that some angels
left their proper abode (their spiritual bodies) and took on fleshly
bodies so as to marry and produce offspring by the daughters of men.

Although the angels committed sexual sins and corrupted the human
lineage to some extent, they did something else that threatened to
foil God's plan for humanity. Let's go back to 1 Enoch to see what
these fallen angels did that affected the human race enormously:

1 ENOCH 8:1 And Azazel taught men to make swords, and knives, and
shields, and breastplates, and made known to them the metals of the
earth and the art of working them, and bracelets, and ornaments, and
the use of antimony, and the beautifying of the eyelids, and all kinds
of costly stones, and all 2 colouring tinctures. And there arose much
godlessness, and they committed fornication, and they 3 were led
astray, and became corrupt in all their ways. Semjaza taught
enchantments, and root- cuttings, Armaros the resolving of
enchantments, Baraqijal (taught) astrology, Kokabel the
constellations, Ezeqeel the knowledge of the clouds, Araqiel the signs
of the earth, Shamsiel the signs of the sun, and Sariel the course of
the moon. And as men perished, they cried, and their cry went up to
heaven . . . (From The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old
Testament, translated by R.H. Charles)
As the text above shows, the angels brought with them knowledge which
humanity did not have beforehand. This information led to a rapid
advance in the knowledge base of the antediluvian society, including
the invention of advanced methods of waging warfare. In the NKJV
translation of Genesis 6:4, the nephilim are called "mighty men who
were of old, men of renown;" however, the NRSV translates that same
phrase as "heroes that were of old, warriors of renown."

Genesis 6:11 shows that the earth was filled with violence; this is
very likely the direct result of the nephilim, who apparently were
mighty warriors. If the ancient legends are indeed based in fact, as
they appear to be, these angelic offspring were superhuman in size and
great in strength. There is also an indication from the ancient text
known as the Book of Jasher that this corruption of bloodlines
extended to the animals also.

JASHER 4:18 And their judges and rulers went to the daughters of men
and took their wives by force from their husbands according to their
choice, and the sons of men in those days took from the cattle of the
earth, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and taught
the mixture of animals of one species with the other, in order
therewith to provoke the Lord; and God saw the whole earth and it was
corrupt, for all flesh had corrupted its ways upon earth, all men and
all animals. 19 And the Lord said, I will blot out man that I created
from the face of the earth, yea from man to the birds of the air,
together with cattle and beasts that are in the field . . .(From The
Book of Jasher, published by J.H. Parry & Company, 1887)
The Book of Jasher is mentioned twice in the Bible (Jos. 10:13; II
Sam. 1:18). While it's evident the copy of this book that has survived
to our time has been corrupted to some extent, the Scriptures seem to
confirm the information contained in this section of Jasher:

GENESIS 6:7 So the LORD said, "I will destroy man whom I have created
from the face of the earth, both man and beast, creeping thing and
birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them." (NKJV)
It appears likely that the objectives of the Flood were the
destruction of the polluted human and animal bloodlines and the
eradication of the forbidden knowledge that humanity had learned from
the fallen host.

There is one other New Testament passage which hints at the sin of the
angels before the flood. It is an enigmatic scripture found in Paul's
first letter to the Corinthian church.

I CORINTHIANS 11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, since
he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man. 8 For
man is not from woman, but woman from man. 9 Nor was man created for
the woman, but woman for the man. 10 For this reason the woman ought
to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels.
(NKJV)
In I Corinthians 11, Paul states the position of women in relation to
men and says that the symbol of authority on a woman's head is needed
"because of the angels." Without an understanding of what took place
anciently between the fallen host and women, this verse is cryptic at
best.

There is opposition to the view that the fallen angels are the "sons
of God" referred to in Genesis 6. Some cite Matthew 22:29-30 and Mark
12:24-25 as objections, saying that these Scriptures clearly teach
that angels do not marry.

MATTHEW 22:29 Jesus answered and said to them [the Sadducees], "You
are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God. 30 For
in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but
are like angels of God in heaven." (NKJV)
MARK 12:24 Jesus answered and said to them, "Are you not therefore
mistaken, because you do not know the Scriptures nor the power of God?
25 For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given
in marriage, but are like angels in heaven." (NKJV)

First, these verses do not state whether angels can marry or
procreate. Here Christ was referring only to the way things will be
after the first resurrection of the dead. Additionally, the angels in
heaven who did not sin are the example cited, not the angels confined
to Tartarus because they sinned by marrying humans and producing
offspring. To get a better perspective of what Christ was saying,
let's look at the parallel account of this conversation in Luke's
Gospel.
LUKE 20:34 And Jesus answered and said to them, "The sons of this age
marry and are given in marriage. 35 But those who are counted worthy
to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry
nor are given in marriage; 36 nor can they die anymore, for they are
equal to the angels and are sons of God, being sons of the
resurrection." (NKJV)
Christ's primary purpose in his answer was to affirm the reality of
the resurrection to these questioning Sadducees, who did not believe
that there would be a resurrection. As you can clearly see from Luke's
account of this confrontation, Christ is making two points about the
age to come: (1) Resurrected humans will not marry, and (2)
resurrected humans will be given eternal life, which the holy angels
now have. Interpreting these Scriptures to mean that angels have never
been able to marry or procreate reads more into them than was intended
by Jesus.

Some also object by saying that Genesis 6:4 shows that there were
nephilim on the earth before "the sons of God" came in to "the
daughters of men" and also afterward; therefore, these giants cannot
be the offspring of this union. Does the phrase "in those days, and
also afterward" mean that the nephilim were present before the the
sons of God cohabited with the daughters of men?

"In those days" plainly means the time after the "sons of God" had
come down to earth; the fact that they had taken wives is disclosed in
Genesis 6:2. In time sequence, chapter six of Genesis should follow
chapter four; the fifth chapter is an inset into the story flow.
"Afterward" specifies after the flood, when we see another instance of
giants appearing, this time in the land of Canaan which the Israelites
were to inherit (Num. 13:33). Satan once again tried to thwart God's
plan by using these savage hybrids to occupy the land of Canaan and
keep Abraham's offspring out. Obviously none of the nephilim survived
the flood.

These giants are often mentioned in the early books of the Old
Testament until the last of them were finally killed off. The word
nephilim only appears twice in the Old Testament (Gen 6:4; Num.
13:33), but these giants are also referred to as gibbor (Gen 6:4; Num.
13:33; Job 16:14) and rephaim when they reappear in a more limited
fashion after the flood (Gen. 14:5; 15:20; Deu. 2:11, 20; 3:11, 13;
Jos. 12:4; 13:12; 15:8; 17:15; 18:16; II Sam. 5:18, 22; 21:16, 18, 20,
22; 23:13; I Chr. 11:15; 14:9; 20:4, 6, 8; Isa. 17:5; 26:14). They
were known by the proper names of Rephaim, Emim, Anakim, and
Zamzummim.

CONCLUSION
As shown above, the evidence that "the sons of God" mentioned in
Genesis 6 are fallen angels is substantial. By their sexual
immorality, these angels produced offspring which were strong and
violent. The concept of a race of giants which resulted from the union
of gods and humans is virtually universal in the world's early
civilizations.

The original intent of the angels may have only been to satisfy their
forbidden lust. Yet the knowledge they brought with them and taught
mankind caused society to develop at a more rapid technological pace
than God had intended. This societal development was not positive, and
it gave rise to a very violent society, one in which the nephilim
apparently played a large role. God was forced to restrain in the
Abyss the wicked angels that produced the nephilim, and cleanse the
earth of them and the violence they brought with the great Flood.

Bryan T. Huie
December 26, 1996
Updated: February 1, 2002


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For nearly 2,000 years, there has been much discussion and speculation
about the Antichrist. Through the centuries, this entity (mentioned by
John, Paul, Daniel, Ezekiel, and other biblical writers) has been
identified as numerous individuals or as various governmental and/or
religious systems. Does God's word tell us enough about the Antichrist
to accurately determine who or what it will be? This study will
examine the Bible to see if a specific identification is supported by
the Scriptures.

Let's start with the epistles of John, the only place in the Bible
where the term "Antichrist" is actually used:

I JOHN 2:18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have
heard that the Antichrist [ho antichristos] is coming, even now many
antichrists [antichristoi] have come, by which we know that it is the
last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if
they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went
out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
(NKJV)
The first occurrence in the Bible of the term "Antichrist" is in I
John 2:18, where the Greek word antichristos (a nominative masculine
singular noun) is used. The definite article ho before antichristos
indicates grammatically that John is speaking about a specific,
singular entity: The Antichrist. John is talking about ONE particular
individual who will be anti Christ. The Greek preposition anti
literally means "instead of" (cf. Matt. 2:22; Luke 11:11; Jam. 4:15).
This individual will be "instead of" Christ, not one who falsely
proclaims to be the returned Christ.

In verse 18, John makes a statement regarding the coming Antichrist
(the title of a single masculine entity who will be a substitute for
Christ). He says that those he was writing to had previously heard
that the Antichrist would come at the time of the end. Then, to
demonstrate the lateness of the hour, John contrasts the future
appearance of the Antichrist with those numerous "antichrists" who had
already appeared. These "antichrists," he states, had gone out from
among congregations of believers because they truly never had been a
part of them. Since John identifies the "antichrists" of his day as
personal entities (as opposed to "systems" or "governments"), the
parallel future Antichrist must also be a personal entity, not an
impersonal governmental/religious system.

I JOHN 2:20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know
all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the
truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth. 22
Who is the Liar [ho pseustes] but the one who denies that Jesus is the
Christ? This is the Antichrist [ho antichristos], the one who denies
the Father and the Son. (NASU)
Verses 20 and 21 contrast the "antichrists" who went out from among
them with the true believers who knew the truth and had God's Spirit
(the "anointing from the Holy One," cf. Isa. 61:1;Luke 4:18; Acts
10:38). Verse 22 has generally been misunderstood to be referring only
to those plural "antichrists" John had referenced in the latter part
of verse 18. However, the Greek text indicates that John is saying
that all those who deny the fleshly coming of Yeshua are types of the
future Antichrist. These "antichrists" are like the future "Liar" who
will deny that Yeshua is the Messiah. In fact, John tells us that the
Antichrist will deny both the Father and the Son.

We can see from this passage that the Antichrist will do something
specific: he will deny that Yeshua is the Messiah. Later on in his
letter, John lists a second identifying characteristic of the
Antichrist:

I JOHN 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that
confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, 3 and
every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the
flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist [tou
antichristou], which you have heard was coming, and is now already in
the world. (NKJV)
John tells his readers that those who confessed that Yeshua the
Messiah had come in the flesh did so by the Spirit of God, while those
that did not confess that Yeshua the Messiah had come in the flesh
were not of God but had another "spirit" influencing them. Here John
gives us a another test for identifying the Antichrist and those who
are aligned with him spiritually.

Therefore, we have two identifying characteristics given by John for
identifying the Antichrist and those lesser "antichrists" like him:

(1) Denial of Yeshua as the Messiah, and
(2) Denial that Yeshua came in the flesh.

To be scripturally identified as "antichrist," a person or
organization must meet BOTH criteria.

Additionally, John reemphasizes the fact that the saints he was
writing to had previously heard that The Antichrist was coming. His
point again is that even though the Antichrist had not yet arrived,
the blasphemy he would promote was already in the world. John directly
equates the false teaching that the divine Son of God had NOT come in
the flesh with the future Antichrist.

In his second epistle, John again compares those who were teaching
that Yeshua had not come in the flesh with the future deceiver, the
Antichrist:

II JOHN 7 For many deceivers [planoi] have gone out into the world,
those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This
is the Deceiver [ho planos] and the Antichrist [ho antichristos].
(NASU)
How could John state that those deceivers (plural) who had gone out
into the world were THE DECEIVER and THE ANTICHRIST (both singular)?
Because the denial of the fleshly existence of Yeshua (which those led
by the "antichrist" spirit in his day proclaimed) will be the primary
identifying doctrine of the future Antichrist. Again, John confirms
the current deceivers as types of the coming Antichrist.

Twice in his writings, John mentions that the believers he was
addressing had heard that the Antichrist was coming (I John 2:18;
4:3). James Hastings wrote: "St. John . . . alludes to a popular
belief, and spiritualizes it, applying it to tendencies already at
work" (p. 226, vol. 3, A Dictionary of the Bible, "Man of Sin and
Antichrist"). Was this belief in a coming Antichrist a secret teaching
among early Christians that wasn't put down in writing, or is it
recorded elsewhere in the Scriptures?

John could have been referring to several passages of Scripture.
However, the most likely prospect for this reference is Paul's
exposition on the "Man of Sin" found in II Thessalonians 2:

II THESSALONIANS 2:1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord
Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to
be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by
letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no
one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the
falling away [he apostasia] comes first, and the Man of Sin [ho
anthropos tes hamartias] is revealed, the Son of Perdition [ho huios
tes apoleias], 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is
called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the Temple
of God [ton naon tou Theou], showing [apodeiknunta] himself that he is
God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you
these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be
revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already
at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of
the way. 8 And then the Lawless One [ho anomos] will be revealed, whom
the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with
the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the Lawless One is
according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying
wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish,
because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be
saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that
they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did
not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (NKJV)
Regarding the Antichrist as described by Paul in this passage of
Scripture, The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia states: "2
Thessalonians, written early, affords evidence of a considerably
developed doctrine being commonly accepted among believers" (p. 139,
vol. 1, "Antichrist"). Here Paul addresses the return of Yeshua from
heaven to gather the saints to him (v. 1). To dispel concerns the
Thessalonians had about missing this event, Paul clearly outlines what
must happen before the Messiah will return. In verse 3, he indicates
that two primary things will take place immediately before "the day of
Christ":

(1) The Apostasy, and
(2) The revealing of the "Man of Sin."

According to Friberg's Analytical Lexicon to the Greek New Testament
(ALGNT), the word apostasia literally means "a condition resulting
from changing loyalties revolt, desertion" (cf. Acts 21:21). Paul said
that there would be a widespread desertion of the faith by those who
claimed to be believers just before the return of Christ.

He follows up by stating that this falling away will immediately
precede or be accompanied by the revealing of "the Man of Sin," also
called "the Son of Perdition" (v. 3) and "the Lawless One" (v 8). The
Man of Sin is portrayed by Paul in this passage as a personal entity,
not a government or organization. This one is widely equated with the
Antichrist spoken of by John, as well as "the Beast" mentioned in the
book of Revelation (Rev. 11:7; 13:1-6; 19:19-20).

Paul tells us that the Man of Sin will "oppose and exalt himself above
ALL that is called God or that is worshiped" (v. 4). This would
include not only the one true God, but all other "gods and lords" (cf.
1 Cor. 8:5) as well. These "gods and lords" are the gods (Heb.
'elohim) of the nations (Deu. 6:14; 31:16; Jdg. 2:11-13; II Kings
18:33-35; Zep. 2:11), the ruling angels of the heavenly divine
council.

Paul then tells us that the Man of Sin will "sit as God in the Temple
of God, showing himself that he is God." The Greek verb apodeiknunta
("showing") literally means "to demonstrate, prove or proclaim"
something. Paul says that the reason the Man of Sin does this is to
prove TO HIMSELF that he is God.

To understand why this act would demonstrate to the Man of Sin that he
is greater than all other divine beings, we must determine what Paul
meant by the Man of Sin sitting in the Temple of God. How should we
understand this statement? Is it figurative or literal?

If Paul intended it to be figurative, what would the Temple of God
represent? In another of his letters, Paul speaks of the body of a
believer being the Temple of God because the Holy Spirit dwells within
it (1 Cor. 3:16-17; 1 Cor. 6:19). Similar references in the Gospels
refer to an individual (cf. Matt. 26:61; 27:40; Mark 14:58; 15:29;
John 2:19-21). However, the church as a whole is called the Temple of
God (2 Cor. 6:16), and also the House of God (1 Tim. 3:15; 1 Pet.
4:17) in the New Testament. Figuratively interpreting Paul's statement
to mean that the Man of Sin will dwell within the ranks of believers
(within "the church") is how some scholars have understood this
passage. However, other related Scriptures (which we will examine
later) show that this meaning is unlikely.

A literal understanding of this verse gives us two possible
interpretations. Paul could have been speaking of a rebuilt physical
temple in Jerusalem that would exist at the end of the age. Most
Christians who believe in a literal end-time Antichrist think that he
will take his seat within a reconstructed Jewish temple on the Temple
Mount.

However, one other literal possibility exists. Paul could also have
been speaking of the heavenly Temple of God (Heb. 8:2; Rev. 11:19).
The Scriptures tell us that the earthly tabernacle constructed by
Moses was patterned after this heavenly original, as were the later
temples in Jerusalem:

EXODUS 25:8 "And let them make Me a sanctuary, that I may dwell among
them. 9 According to all that I show you, that is, the pattern of the
tabernacle and the pattern of all its furnishings, just so you shall
make it." (NKJV)
HEBREWS 8:1 Now this is the main point of the things we are saying: We
have such a High Priest, who is seated at the right hand of the throne
of the Majesty in the heavens, 2 a Minister of the sanctuary and of
the true tabernacle which the Lord erected, and not man. 3 For every
high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices. Therefore
it is necessary that this One also have something to offer. 4 For if
He were on earth, He would not be a priest, since there are priests
who offer the gifts according to the law; 5 who serve the copy and
shadow of the heavenly things, as Moses was divinely instructed when
he was about to make the tabernacle. For He said, "See that you make
all things according to the pattern shown you on the mountain." (NKJV)
HEBREWS 9:11 But Christ came as High Priest of the good things to
come, with the greater and more perfect tabernacle not made with
hands, that is, not of this creation. (NKJV)
REVELATION 11:19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the
ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings,
noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail. (NKJV)
The idea that the Temple being spoken of in II Thessalonians is the
heavenly Temple is not as far out as it initially appears. In his
autobiography, Teddy Kolleck, former mayor of Jerusalem, gives us an
interesting reference to the heavenly Temple:

I receive about twenty or thirty letters a year, mainly from
Fundamentalist Christians of various churches, urging us to build the
Temple, because they regard this as a prerequisite for the return of
Christ. At press conferences I am often asked whether we plan to
rebuild the Temple. I usually reply that according to Jewish
tradition, the Temple already exists and will come down from heaven to
its proper place when Messiah comes . . . (p. 230, For Jerusalem)
If Paul is referring to the heavenly Temple of God in II Thessalonians
2:4, then the Man of Sin would have to be capable of traveling to
where this Temple resides in the "Jerusalem above" (Gal. 4:26). This
ultimately implies that the Antichrist will be an angelic being of
some sort (cf. Job 1:6-7; 2:1-2).

Not coincidentally, the Bible shows that during the events at the end
of this age, a powerful angelic king will be released from a spiritual
prison called the Abyss:

REVELATION 9:1 The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star
that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key
to the shaft of the Abyss. 2 When he opened the Abyss, smoke rose from
it like the smoke from a gigantic furnace. The sun and sky were
darkened by the smoke from the Abyss. 3 And out of the smoke locusts
came down upon the earth and were given power like that of scorpions
of the earth. . . . 11 They had as king over them the angel of the
Abyss, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek, Apollyon. (NIV)
This evil spirit being, symbolically named "Destroyer" in both Hebrew
and Greek, will be the leader of the end-time rebellion against God
and the heavenly forces of good. For more detailed information on this
angelic king, see my article "Who is the 'Destroyer'?"

Many (probably most) Christians regard even the consideration of the
possibility that the heavenly Temple could be conquered by the
Antichrist as foolishness which borders on blasphemy. However, several
passages of Scripture support this particular understanding of Paul's
statement. The first we will examine is from the book of Daniel:

DANIEL 8:9 And out of one of them came a little horn which grew
exceedingly great toward the south, toward the east, and toward the
Glorious Land. 10 And it grew up [tigdal] to the host of heaven; and
it cast down some of the host and some of the stars to the ground, and
trampled them. (NKJV)
If we take this prophecy literally, we see that the "little horn"
(another title for the Antichrist) will "become powerful" (Heb.
tigdal) enough to challenge the "host of heaven." We know from several
Scriptures that the "host of heaven" is often a reference to angels
(cf. I Kings 22:19; II Chr. 18:18; Neh. 9:6). "Stars" are also used
figuratively of angels (Job 38:7; Isa. 14:13; Rev. 1:20; 9:1; 12:4) in
the Bible.

Daniel's vision goes on to reveal even more information that indicates
the heavenly Temple is the target of the Antichrist:

DANIEL 8:11 It even magnified itself to be equal with the Commander of
the host [sar hatzava']; and it removed the regular sacrifice from
Him, and the place of His sanctuary was thrown down. 12 And on account
of transgression the host will be given over to the horn along with
the regular sacrifice; and it will fling truth to the ground and
perform its will and prosper. 13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and
another holy one said to that particular one who was speaking, "How
long will the vision about the regular sacrifice apply, while the
transgression causes horror, so as to allow both the holy place and
the host to be trampled?" 14 He said to me, "For 2,300 evenings and
mornings; then the holy place will be properly restored." (NASU)
Here we see that the Antichrist exalts himself as high as the
"Commander of the Host" (Heb. sar hatzava'). Later in this chapter,
when the angel Gabriel explains this vision to Daniel, this same one
is called the "Prince of princes" (Heb. sar sarim, v. 25). Clearly
both these references are to Yeshua the Messiah, the one who earlier
had revealed himself to Joshua (Jos. 5:13-15) as the "Commander of the
Host of the LORD" (Heb. sar tzeva' YHVH). For additional information
on the preincarnate activities of Yeshua, see my article "Christ in
the Old Testament."

We know that since his resurrection and ascension, the place of
Yeshua's sanctuary is the heavenly Temple of God, where he sits at the
right hand of the Eternal Father (Psa. 110:1, 5; Matt. 26:64; Mark
16:19; Acts 5:31; 7: 55-56; Rom. 8:34; Eph. 1:20; Col. 3:1; Heb. 1:3;
8:1; 10:12; I Pet. 3:22), acting as our High Priest (Heb. 2:17; 3:1;
4:14-15; 5:5, 10; 6:20; 7:26; 8:1, 3; 9:11; 10:21). Daniel's vision
shows that the Antichrist will stop the regular sacrifice in the
heavenly Temple and throw down the "place" of Yeshua's sanctuary (the
heavenly Jerusalem).

If this vision given to Daniel truly pertains to the heavenly
Jerusalem and the Temple of God there, then what are the "daily
sacrifices" that the Antichrist will remove? The New Testament gives
us the answer to this question in several places:

I PETER 2:5 You also, like living stones, are being built into a
spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices
acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. (NIV)
HEBREWS 13:15 Through Him then, let us continually offer up a
sacrifice of praise to God, that is, the fruit of lips that give
thanks to His name. (NASU)
REVELATION 5:8 And when he had taken the scroll, the four living
creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each
holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the
prayers of the saints; (RSV)
REVELATION 8:3 Another angel with a golden censer came and stood at
the altar; he was given a great quantity of incense to offer with the
prayers of all the saints on the golden altar that is before the
throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, with the prayers of the
saints, rose before God from the hand of the angel. (NRSV)
The New Testament shows that sacrifices remain for Christians. These
are spiritual sacrifices, which include praise and the prayers of
God's people to the heavenly Father. It is these sacrifices that the
Antichrist will stop, instead of literal, physical sacrifices.

We aren't told precisely how the Antichrist will stop these
sacrifices. However, we are told that the sacrifices will be stopped
for a period of "2,300 mornings and evenings." The reason "mornings
and evenings" are specified is because God commanded two sacrifices
each day in the temple: one in the morning and one in the evening
(Exo. 29:38-42; II Chr. 13:11). Since all things on earth were
patterned after the heavenly Temple, it stands to reason that the
pattern of sacrifices is consistent also.

The Antichrist will stop 2,300 total sacrifices. However, since there
are two sacrifices performed daily, the span of time being referred to
here is actually 1,150 days. It is very likely that this period of
time will be contained within the 42 months (1,260 days) that the
Beast will be given authority to rule the earth (Rev. 13:5).

Interpreting the symbols used in Daniel's vision consistently with
other Scriptures confirms that the Temple of God in heaven is the
target of the Antichrist. Therefore, it would be this Temple that Paul
referred to in II Thessalonians.

One other prophetic passage of Scripture from the book of Ezekiel
indicates it will be the heavenly temple which will be defiled:

EZEKIEL 7:22 I will turn my face away from them, and they will
desecrate my treasured place [tzepuniy] ; robbers will enter it and
desecrate it. (NIV)
This verse is located within a passage of prophecy which speaks of
events that occur during the time of the end, at "the day of the wrath
of the LORD" (Eze. 7:19). The Hebrew word tzepuniy is a form of the
root word tzapan, which means "hide, treasure, store up." It is
possible that tzepuniy is related to the Hebrew tzapon, which
literally means "north."

The Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament has this to say about
tzapon:

In Canaanite mythology the north was considered to be the place for
the meeting of the assembly of the gods. The gods assembled on Mount
Tzapan; tzapan may be taken as a proper name. . . . This concept of
the divine assembly on Mount Tzapan is alluded to in Isaiah's oracle
against Babylon in which he pictures the proud king saying, "I shall
sit on the mount of assembly in the far north" (Isa 14:13). The king
asserts for himself both universal and divine lordship. Such arrogance
was soon to encounter the fury of God's wrath.
The fact that Psa 48:2 [H 3] places Mt. Zion figuratively in the far
north means that God is the sole ruler of the universe. He alone is to
be reverenced and praised. . . . (p. 774, vol. II)

It is possible that Ezekiel 7:22 speaks of the end-time defilement of
God's treasured place, the Temple in heaven. This understanding helps
clear up an obscure passage from the book of Revelation:

REVELATION 11:1 Then I was given a reed like a measuring rod. And the
angel stood, saying, "Rise and measure the temple of God, the altar,
and those who worship there. 2 But leave out the court which is
outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to
the Gentiles. And they will tread the holy city underfoot for
forty-two months." (NKJV)
Many have understood this prophecy to be speaking of the earthly
Jerusalem, the holy city. But at the time of the end, when this
prophecy takes place, the earthly Jerusalem is NOT holy. In fact, just
a little further on in this passage, the earthly Jerusalem is likened
spiritually to Sodom and Egypt (Rev. 11:8). It seems clear that the
holy city containing the Temple of God mentioned in Revelation 11:1 is
the heavenly Jerusalem.

However, other prophecies, including one from Yeshua himself (Matt.
24:15-20; Mark 13:14-18; Luke 21:20-24), indicate that the earthly
Jerusalem will be besieged at the same time that the heavenly
Jerusalem is being attacked. As the Antichrist directs the combined
angelic armies of the 'elohim who rule over the earth against the
heavenly Jerusalem, physical armies will surround and desolate the
earthly Jerusalem. This fact again illustrates the irrefutable link
between the physical and the spiritual and the dual nature of biblical
prophecy.

This link can be explicitly seen in the 10th chapter of the book of
Daniel. In this chapter, we see revealed a spiritual battle between
one of God's holy angels (probably Gabriel) and the "prince of the
kingdom of Persia" (Dan. 10:13). This angelic prince, who did not want
Daniel to receive the information being brought to him from heaven,
resisted God's will and fought with His messenger for 21 days.

It's interesting to note that the holy angel told Daniel that he would
have to contend with the angelic "prince of Greece" after his battle
with the "prince of Persia" (Dan. 10:20). In history, we know that the
earthly Greek empire defeated the Persian empire and replaced it as
the preeminent power on earth. The words of the holy angel show that
this shift in power would also take place in the spiritual realm, with
the angelic prince of Greece afterward becoming the primary foe of
God's will.

Chapter 13 of the book of Revelation tells us of the rise and end-time
activities of "the Beast." We see that the heavenly Temple and those
angels who dwell in heaven are the particular focus of the Beast:

REVELATION 13:1 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast
rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his
horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. 2 Now the beast
which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear,
and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power,
his throne, and great authority. 3 And I saw one of his heads as if it
had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all
the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the
dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast,
saying, "Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?" 5
And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he
was given authority to continue for forty-two months. 6 Then he opened
his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His
tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. 7 It was granted to him to
make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given
him over every tribe, tongue, and nation. 8 All who dwell on the earth
will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of
Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. 9 If anyone
has an ear, let him hear. (NKJV)
For an explanation of what this composite beast symbolizes, refer to
my article "The Beasts of Revelation and Daniel."

Notice that one of the dominant characteristics of the Beast is his
mouth, which speaks pompous words and great blasphemies (Rev. 13:5-6).
This same characteristic is detailed in two of Daniel's prophecies
regarding the Antichrist (Dan. 7:8; 11:36). We see that two targets of
the Beast's blasphemy are the heavenly tabernacle and those who dwell
in heaven. Not coincidentally, these are two of the things the
Antichrist seeks to conquer to prove his worthiness (cf. II The. 2:4).

The prophet Daniel gives us information about the Antichrist, which he
sees as a "little horn":

DANIEL 7:8 I was considering the [ten] horns [on the fourth beast],
and there was another horn, a little one, coming up among them, before
whom three of the first horns were plucked out by the roots. And
there, in this horn, were eyes like the eyes of a man, and a mouth
speaking pompous words. (NKJV)
Daniel didn't understand this vision, so he requested an explanation
from an angel he saw in his dream:

DANIEL 7:19 "Then I wished to know the truth about the fourth beast,
which was different from all the others, exceedingly dreadful, with
its teeth of iron and its nails of bronze, which devoured, broke in
pieces, and trampled the residue with its feet; 20 and the ten horns
that were on its head, and the other horn which came up, before which
three fell, namely, that horn which had eyes and a mouth which spoke
pompous words, whose appearance was greater than his fellows. 21 I was
watching; and the same horn was making war against the saints, and
prevailing against them, 22 until the Ancient of Days came, and a
judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High, and the
time came for the saints to possess the kingdom. 23 Thus he said: 'The
fourth beast shall be a fourth kingdom on earth, which shall be
different from all other kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth,
trample it and break it in pieces. 24 The ten horns are ten kings who
shall arise from this kingdom. And another shall rise after them; he
shall be different from the first ones, and shall subdue three kings.
25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, shall persecute
the saints of the Most High, and shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand for a time and times and
half a time.' " (NKJV)
We see that this "little horn" which arises will be a "different" type
of king than the three he subdues. That's because they will be human
kings, while he is an angelic king (Rev. 9:11). Once again, we see
that the time period of his reign is specified to be 3 1/2 years ("a
time and times and half a time").

As we saw earlier in Paul's second epistle to the Thessalonians, the
end of the Antichrist will take place at the time of the Lord Yeshua's
return from heaven:

II THESSALONIANS 2:8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, and
the Lord Jesus will slay him with the breath of his mouth and destroy
him by his appearing and his coming. (RSV)
This passage doesn't give us the details of the Antichrist's final
defeat. However, we know from Psalm 82 that those fallen 'elohim who
have rebelled against God will die, just as mortals die:

PSALM 82:6 "I said, 'You are "gods" ['elohim]; you are all sons of the
Most High.' 7 But you will die like mere men; you will fall like every
other ruler." (NIV)
Several prophecies show us what will ultimately become of the angelic
king of the Abyss. One of those prophecies is found in the prophetic
book of Ezekiel:

EZEKIEL 28:1 The word of the LORD came to me again, saying, 2 "Son of
man, say to the prince of Tyre, 'Thus says the Lord GOD: "Because your
heart is lifted up, and you say, 'I am a god ['el], I sit in the seat
of gods ['elohim], in the midst of the seas,' yet you are a man, and
not a god ['el], though you set your heart as the heart of a god
['elohim] 3 (Behold, you are wiser than Daniel! There is no secret
that can be hidden from you! 4 With your wisdom and your understanding
you have gained riches for yourself, and gathered gold and silver into
your treasuries; 5 by your great wisdom in trade you have increased
your riches, and your heart is lifted up because of your riches)," 6
Therefore thus says the Lord GOD: "Because you have set your heart as
the heart of a god ['elohim], 7 behold, therefore, I will bring
strangers against you, the most terrible of the nations; and they
shall draw their swords against the beauty of your wisdom, and defile
your splendor. 8 They shall throw you down into the Pit, and you shall
die the death of the slain in the midst of the seas. 9 Will you still
say before him who slays you, 'I am a god ['elohim]'? But you shall be
a man, and not a god ['el], in the hand of him who slays you. 10 You
shall die the death of the uncircumcised by the hand of aliens; for I
have spoken," says the Lord GOD.' " (NKJV)
Here we see that the Antichrist is called the "Prince of Tyre." His
spiritual father, Satan, is addressed as the "King of Tyre" in the
related prophecy which immediately follows (Eze. 28:11-19). These
prophecies could be directed to men of Ezekiel's time who were types
of the Antichrist and Satan (since many prophecies are dual in
nature), or they could be symbolically referring to the Antichrist and
Satan.

In this passage, we see that the Antichrist is called "a man" twice
(vv. 2, 9). Many use this language to claim that the Antichrist cannot
be an angelic being. However, it's possible that this prophecy speaks
of a human prince of Tyre who was a type of the end-time Antichrist.
Regardless, at times the Tanakh refers to angelic beings as men or as
having the appearance of men (cf. Gen. 32:24; Dan. 9:21; 10:18; Eze.
1:5). Therefore, this usage does not automatically annul our previous
identification of the Antichrist as an angelic being.

We are told that this "Prince of Tyre" reckons himself to be a god,
and that he "sits in the seat of gods, in the midst of the seas" (v.
2). In the Scripture, the seas represent the nations of the world (cf.
Num. 24:7; II Sam. 22:17; Psa. 18:16; Rev. 17:1). We know from this
that the "Prince of Tyre" will be over the nations.

We also know that he will die an ignoble death (cf. Psa. 82:7). This
event is described in more detail in the book of Revelation:

REVELATION 19:20 Then the Beast was captured, and with him the False
Prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he deceived those
who received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image.
These two were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with
brimstone. (NKJV)
Certainly a humiliating end for a being that thought he was above all
other gods.

CONCLUSION
The "man of sin" spoken of in Paul's second letter to the
Thessalonians will not be a man. Instead, he will be an angelic king
named Abaddon/Apollyon. He is "the beast" who will ascend out of the
Abyss at the sounding of the fifth trumpet (Rev. 9:1-11). Abaddon and
his army of spirit beings will conquer the holy sanctuary in heaven
and gain victory over the angelic hosts of heaven. However, his power
to rule will only last for 3 1/2 years. After this time period, God
will take away his authority . Abaddon will muster the forces of evil
for one final attempt to destroy God's people and His plan, but he
will be thwarted. He will be cast into the lake of fire as Yeshua the
Messiah establishes the millennial Kingdom of God on earth.


___________________________________________________________________________________
Post by martus
End
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martus
2004-06-27 08:53:05 UTC
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WHO IS THE "DESTROYER"?
About 95 C.E., while in exile on the isle of Patmos, the apostle John
was given in vision a glimpse of the end of the age (Rev. 1:10),
called the "Day of the Lord" in numerous Old and New Testament
Scriptures. During this "day of the Lord's wrath" (Zep. 1:18), God
will punish humanity for their proud, sinful ways and their refusal to
acknowledge Him as the true God. John recorded the visions he saw in
the book of Revelation.

One of those punishments, chronicled in Revelation 9:1-11, will be the
release of the depraved demons and fallen angels currently locked in
the Abyss. The Bible teaches that the Abyss is a spirit prison (Luke
8:31; I Pet. 3:19; II Pet. 2:4; Jude 6). In the Abyss, some of the
fallen angels are now bound in "everlasting chains under darkness"
waiting "for the judgment of the great day." For more information on
these angels and the Abyss, refer to my articles "Fallen Angels and
Demons" and "Genesis 6-Who Were 'The Sons Of God'?."

In Revelation 9:11, an intriguing character is introduced:

REVELATION 9:11 They have as king over them, the angel of the Abyss;
his name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in the Greek he has the name
Apollyon. (NASU)
Abaddon and Apollyon both mean "destroyer." Who is this ruling spirit
called the "Destroyer," who is released from the Abyss during God's
wrath on mankind in the last days of this age? Does the Bible mention
this being anywhere else?

The true identity of the "Destroyer" has long been misunderstood. In
this article, I will attempt to piece together all the relevant
Scriptures to show who Abaddon/Apollyon really is and what his role
will be in end-time prophecy. Most have never realized how much the
Bible has to say about this vital end-time figure, who is called by a
variety of names.

The "Destroyer" Released
Let's start by reviewing the event that will allow this powerful
fallen angel entrance into the world. This occurrence is recorded in
Revelation 9:1-11. To rightly understand who this "king of the
bottomless pit" is, it's vital to correctly interpret what this
passage is saying. We must be guided by Scripture, not our
imagination.

REVELATION 9:1 And the fifth angel blew his trumpet, and I saw a star
fallen from heaven to earth, and he was given the key of the shaft of
the bottomless pit; 2 he opened the shaft of the bottomless pit and
from the shaft rose smoke like the smoke of a great furnace, and the
sun and the air were darkened with the smoke from the shaft. (RSV)
First, notice that at the sounding of the fifth trumpet, an angel
("star") descends out of heaven to the earth. This angel has in his
possession a key to the Abyss. With this key, he unlocks the
"bottomless pit." This is very likely the same angel who later comes
from heaven again with the key and a great chain to imprison Satan in
the Abyss for the duration of the Millennium (Rev. 20:1-3).

REVELATION 9:3 Then from the smoke came locusts on the earth, and they
were given power like the power of scorpions of the earth; 4 they were
told not to harm the grass of the earth or any green growth or any
tree, but only those of mankind who have not the seal of God upon
their foreheads; 5 they were allowed to torture them for five months,
but not to kill them, and their torture was like the torture of a
scorpion, when it stings a man. 6 And in those days men will seek
death and will not find it; they will long to die, and death will fly
from them. (RSV)
Regarding the "locusts" which ascend out of the Abyss, David H. Stern
writes:

Demonic monsters are released which fly like locusts (Exodus 10:12-20;
Joel 1:4, 2:4-14) and sting like scorpions (Ezekiel 2:6, Lk 11:12).
(p. 816, Jewish New Testament Commentary)
God grants these evil "locusts" from the Abyss the power which
scorpions have -- the power to inflict pain. God tells these paroled
demons and fallen angels not to harm the earth or those humans who
have His seal on their foreheads. Yet for five months God permits them
to torment the unrepentant among mankind.

REVELATION 9:7 In appearance the locusts were like horses arrayed for
battle; on their heads were what looked like crowns of gold; their
faces were like human faces, 8 their hair like women's hair, and their
teeth like lions' teeth; 9 they had scales like iron breastplates, and
the noise of their wings was like the noise of many chariots with
horses rushing into battle. 10 They have tails like scorpions, and
stings, and their power of hurting men for five months lies in their
tails. 11 They have as king over them the angel of the bottomless pit;
his name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek he is called Apollyon.
(RSV)
Here we have a fantastic description of what these fallen angels and
demons look like. The five-month period of their torture of mankind is
also reiterated in verse 10. Then in verse 11, we have our first
mention of Abaddon. He is identified as the angelic ruler over those
who were released from the Abyss.

Abaddon Is The "Beast" Who Ascends From The Abyss
In Revelation 9:1-11, Abaddon is clearly identified as the king of the
evil spirits released from the Abyss. This fact identifies him
throughout the rest of the book of Revelation. Twice specifically, and
once symbolically, Abaddon is referred to as the "beast" who is to
come up out of the Abyss:

REVELATION 11:7 When they [the two witnesses] have finished their
testimony, the beast that comes up out of the Abyss will make war with
them, and overcome them and kill them. (NASU)
REVELATION 17:8 The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is to
ascend from the bottomless pit and go to perdition . . . (RSV)
REVELATION 13:1 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast
rising up out of the sea . . . (NKJV)
Revelation 11:7 and 17:8 are clearly referring to Abaddon as the
"beast" who will ascend from the "bottomless pit." What we see
described in the first part of Revelation 13:1 is a symbolic reference
to the release of Abaddon from the Abyss. In Jewish thought, the Abyss
was often associated with the ocean depths. Speaking of the Greek
translation of the Hebrew Scriptures in use at the time of Christ, The
New Unger's Bible Dictionary says: "The LXX renders Heb. tehom, 'the
primeval ocean' (Gen. 1:2; Ps. 24:2; etc.) as 'abyss'." (p. 18,
"Abyss"). This identification of Abaddon as the primary "beast"
mentioned in the book of Revelation will help us to learn more about
his activities in the end-time.

There is one other Scripture that enigmatically mentions the release
of Abaddon from the Abyss. This obscure reference is found in II
Thessalonians 2, where Paul discusses the "man of sin." We'll look at
this passage in depth to truly grasp the significance of what Paul is
saying:

II THESSALONIANS 2:1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord
Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to
be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by
letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no
one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the
falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of
perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called
God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God,
showing himself that he is God. (NKJV)
Here, Paul is talking about the return of Christ. He tells the
Thessalonian church not to be deceived if someone tells them that
Christ has already returned, because some definite events have to
occur before that event will happen. The first of those events is the
"falling away" (Gr. apostasia) from the truth. Another event Paul says
must take place is the appearance of the "man of sin," who will
attempt to usurp the power of God.

II THESSALONIANS 2:5 Do you not remember that when I was still with
you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining
[katechon], that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery
of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do
so until He is taken out of the way [ek mesou genetai]. 8 And then the
lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the
breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming.
(NKJV)
Paul says that the Thessalonians know what is now "restraining" the
"man of sin" (v. 6), yet he doesn't state what it is in his letter.
Paul had already taught the Thessalonians these things when he had
been with them earlier (v. 5). The Greek word translated "restraining"
here is katechon. According to Friberg's Analytical Lexicon to the
Greek New Testament, this verb means "hold back, detain, prevent . . .
figuratively restrain, check."

The phrase "only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out
of the way" in the latter half of verse 7 implies that the one
restraining the "man of sin" is a person. However, the Greek text here
literally reads "only the thing holding back now will continue until
out of the midst he comes [Gr. ek mesou genetai]." With an
understanding of what is taught in Revelation about the release of
Abaddon, we can see what Paul is saying. The following translation of
verses 6 and 7 clarifies this passage:

II THESSALONIANS 2:6 And you now know the thing [the Abyss] that is
holding back [Abaddon], that he may be revealed at the proper time. 7
For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only the thing [the
Abyss] which now restrains [Abaddon] will continue to do so until out
of the midst [of the Abyss] he comes. (literal translation)
Paul goes on to say that only after his release from that which is now
restraining him would the "lawless one" be revealed to mankind (v. 8).
We'll look at the last half of verse 8 a little later, and show how it
relates to some other prophetic Scriptures (Dan. 7:26; 8:25; Rev.
19:20).

Symbolic Description of Abaddon and His Kingdom
In symbolic language, Abaddon and the kingdom he will rule over are
described in detail in the 13th and 17th chapters of Revelation. These
chapters give us a great deal of information. Let's examine them,
along with several other parallel Scriptures, to see what we can learn
about this ruling fallen angel and his end-time kingdom.

REVELATION 13:1 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast
rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his
horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. (NKJV)
The last half of verse 1 describes Abaddon in symbolic terms. To
determine what this description means, we'll have to look at some
related passages in Revelation 17, where an explanation of these heads
and horns is given.

REVELATION 17:1 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls
came and talked with me, saying to me, "Come, I will show you the
judgment of the great harlot who sits on many waters, 2 with whom the
kings of the earth committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the
earth were made drunk with the wine of her fornication." 3 So he
carried me away in the Spirit into the wilderness. And I saw a woman
sitting on a scarlet beast which was full of names of blasphemy,
having seven heads and ten horns. (NKJV)
As you can see by comparing Revelation 17:3 to Revelation 13:1, the
"scarlet beast" the "woman" rides looks very similar to the "beast"
which arose from the sea.

REVELATION 17:4 The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and
adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a
golden cup full of abominations and the filthiness of her fornication.
5 And on her forehead a name was written: MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT,
THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. 6 I saw
the woman, drunk with the blood of the saints and with the blood of
the martyrs of Jesus. And when I saw her, I marveled with great
amazement. 7 But the angel said to me, "Why did you marvel? I will
tell you the mystery of the woman and of the beast that carries her,
which has the seven heads and the ten horns. (NKJV)
There are several opinions about the identity of the "woman" in this
passage. We are told that this woman is riding (being supported by)
the "beast" (Abaddon and his kingdom). Revelation 17:5 tells us that
the woman is the "mother of harlots." Her harlot daughters are the
false religious systems of this world. The "great harlot" is the sum
total of all satanically-inspired religious/societal/governmental
systems in existence since the fall of man in the Garden of Eden.

Revelation 17:5 tells us that the woman is "Babylon the Great." This
fact is verified in Revelation 17:18. Revelation 18:24 tells us that
in this woman "was found the blood of prophets and of saints, and of
all who have been slain on earth." This Scripture declares that this
woman is responsible for the blood of everyone who has ever been slain
on the earth. Obviously this cannot represent any one "human" system.

"Babylon the Great" is the false religious/societal/governmental
system of Satan, who has been a murderer from the beginning (John
8:44). The harlot is the "mother" of all human systems that have ever
existed apart from God. The end-time version of this system will be
hated by the "beast" and the "ten horns," and will eventually be
destroyed by them (Rev. 17:16), in fulfillment of God's will.

Now let's examine the scarlet beast ridden by the great harlot:

REVELATION 17:8 "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about
to come up out of the Abyss and go to destruction. And those who dwell
on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from
the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that
he was and is not and will come. (NASU)
What does the angel mean when he tells John that the "beast" he saw
"WAS and IS NOT and WILL COME"? The language used definitely implies a
time element. As stated earlier, John likely recorded this prophecy
around the year 95 C.E. The angel clearly tells John that, at that
point in time, the beast "is not" (present tense). Yet the angel says
that the beast "was" (past tense), and he also says that the beast
"will come up out of the Abyss" (future tense). What are we to make of
this cryptic statement?

Actually, the explanation isn't that difficult to understand. Abaddon
"was" free in the time before the Flood to interact with humanity. Yet
because of the devious and destructive nature of his sins, God saw
that it was necessary to imprison and thereby restrain him. So at the
time John received his vision, Abaddon "was not" because he was locked
in the Abyss. However, as the angel makes clear, this "beast" will in
the future be freed from his confinement and "will come up out of the
Abyss."

However, Abaddon is not the only entity that seemingly rises up from
nowhere. The kingdom that Abaddon appropriates and rules over also
figuratively comes up from the bottomless pit. This kingdom is
represented as a beast with seven heads and ten horns. What does the
Bible tell us about the symbolic representation of these features of
the beast?

REVELATION 17:9 Here is the mind which has wisdom: The seven heads are
seven mountains on which the woman sits. 10 There are also seven
kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And
when he comes, he must continue a short time. (NKJV)
In the Bible, a mountain figuratively represents a kingdom or the
ruler of that kingdom. The New Unger's Bible Dictionary states:

. . . When David says, "O Lord, by Thy favor Thou hast made my
mountain to stand" (Ps. 30:7), he means to express the stability of
his kingdom. In like manner the kingdom of the Messiah is depicted as
a mountain (Isa. 2:2; Dan. 2:35), as is also the Chaldean monarchy
(Jer. 51:25; Zech. 4:7). (p. 891, "Mountain")
Therefore, the seven mountains and the seven kings referred to in
Revelation 17:9-10 are one and the same.

What does the angel mean when he says that "five have fallen, one is,
and the other has not yet come"? Again, the angel is giving John a
time sensitive clue.

As of 95 C.E., five of the symbolic heads (kingdoms) of the beast had
already fallen from power. Those five were:

(1) Egypt
(2) Assyria
(3) Babylon
(4) Medo-Persia
(5) Greece

The kingdom in power at the time the Apocalypse was written was (6)
Rome.

Some may wonder how we can know that the six kingdoms listed above are
correct. There is one overriding principle about the Bible that gives
us assurance. The Bible was written about and for the people of God.
The six kingdoms listed above all have one thing in common that
identifies them as the first six heads of the beast: they were
satanically-inspired human empires that ruled over God's people.

That means that there is one remaining "head" yet to come which will
rule over God's people. This last empire will be global in scope, as
God tells us in the seventh chapter of Daniel.

DANIEL 7:7 "After this I saw in the night visions, and behold, a
fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, exceedingly strong. It had huge
iron teeth; it was devouring, breaking in pieces, and trampling the
residue with its feet. It was different from all the beasts that were
before it, and it had ten horns. . . . 19 Then I wished to know the
truth about the fourth beast, which was different from all the others,
exceedingly dreadful, with its teeth of iron and its nails of bronze,
which devoured, broke in pieces, and trampled the residue with its
feet; 20 and the ten horns that were on its head . . . 23 Thus he
said: 'The fourth beast shall be a fourth kingdom on earth, which
shall be different from all other kingdoms, and shall devour the whole
earth, trample it and break it in pieces. 24 The ten horns are ten
kings who shall arise from this kingdom. . . . (NKJV)
In his vision, Daniel saw four beasts: a lion with eagle's wings, a
bear, a leopard with four heads and four wings, and a terrible beast
with iron teeth and ten horns (Dan. 7:3-7). The beast John sees come
up out of the Abyss (Rev. 13:2) contains elements of all the beasts
seen by Daniel. It is an amalgamation of all the satanic empires that
have come before. For more information on the identification of these
beasts, refer to my article "The Beasts of Revelation and Daniel."

The fourth beast Daniel saw is the same as the seventh head of the
beast John saw. It is the soon coming global government, the "new
world order," which will arise out of the chaos that occurs during the
opening of the first four seals (Rev. 6:1-8). Daniel shows that this
one world government will be reigned over by ten kings, called "horns"
(Dan. 7:24).

God tells us in Revelation 17:10 that this "new world order" will last
only for a very short time. Revelation 13:3 records the apparent
demise of this seventh head of the beast:

REVELATION 13:3 One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but
its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth followed the beast
with wonder. (RSV)
What is this apparently deadly wound that will be inflicted on the
seventh head of the beast? Daniel gives us the cause of the wound:

DANIEL 7:8 "I was considering the [ten] horns, and there was another
horn, a little one, coming up [silqat, "ascending"] among them, before
whom three of the first horns were plucked out by the roots. And
there, in this horn, were eyes like the eyes of a man, and a mouth
speaking pompous words. . . . 19 Then I wished to know the truth about
the fourth beast . . . 20 and the ten horns that were on its head, and
the other horn which came up [silqat, "ascended"], before which three
fell, namely, that horn which had eyes and a mouth which spoke pompous
words, whose appearance was greater than his fellows. . . . 24 The ten
horns are ten kings who shall arise from this kingdom. And another
shall rise after them; he shall be different from the first ones, and
shall subdue three kings." (NKJV)
The fourth beast of Daniel 7 has ten horns, which we know is symbolic
for a king or kingdom. These horns represent the ten kings or nations
that will control the end-time global government. In his vision,
Daniel saw a "little horn" ascend and rise up among these ten. This
"little horn," Abaddon, king of the Abyss, will definitely be
different from the first ten kings.

Probably using the evil spiritual forces God allows to be released
upon mankind during the fifth trumpet as his army, Abaddon will
destroy three of the ten rulers of the "new world order" (and possibly
their nations). In so doing, he will appear to have "mortally wounded"
the seventh head, the ruling world government. However, instead of
totally destroying this satanic governmental structure, Abaddon will
seize control of it and become its leader. As Revelation 17:8 tells
us, almost the whole world will be amazed when they see Abaddon rise
up.

REVELATION 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, is himself also
the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition. 12 The ten
horns which you saw are ten kings who have received no kingdom as yet,
but they receive authority for one hour as kings with the beast. 13
These are of one mind, and they will give their power and authority to
the beast. (NKJV)
The beast is not one of the seven, he is the eighth; yet clearly he is
of the seven. That is, he is given his authority by Satan (Rev. 13:4),
just as the seven heads were. Apparently Abaddon will install three
kings to replace those he "plucked out by the roots" (Dan. 11:39), and
with the support of those ten kings (Rev. 17:12-13), he will become
the ruler of the entire earth in the ultimate and final realization of
Satan's governmental system.

REVELATION 13:4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the
beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, "Who is like the beast?
Who is able to make war with him?" (NKJV)
After the resurrection of the mortally wounded seventh head, almost
the entire world will worship Satan, who gives Abaddon his authority.
They will also worship Abaddon because of his conquest of the "new
world order."

The Length of Abaddon's Reign
The Bible tells us in several places how long Abaddon will reign. It
is stated as 42 months (Rev. 13:5) or "a time and times and half a
time" (Dan. 7:25; 12:7), which literally is "one year, two years, and
a half a year," or a total of 3 1/2 years.

REVELATION 13:5 And the beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and
blasphemous words, and it was allowed to exercise authority for
forty-two months; (RSV)
DANIEL 7:25 He shall speak words against the Most High, shall wear out
the holy ones of the Most High, and shall attempt to change the sacred
seasons and the law; and they shall be given into his power for a
time, two times, and half a time. (NRSV)
DANIEL 12:7 The man clothed in linen, who was upstream, raised his
right hand and his left hand toward heaven. And I heard him swear by
the one who lives forever that it would be for a time, two times, and
half a time, and that when the shattering of the power of the holy
people comes to an end, all these things would be accomplished. (NRSV)
Revelation 11:3 mentions the same time span in days, and equates it
with the testimony of the two witnesses. It's possible that this
period in which the two witnesses give their testimony may slightly
precede the 42 months that Abaddon is in authority.

REVELATION 11:3 "And I will grant authority to my two witnesses, and
they will prophesy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in
sackcloth. . . . 7 When they have finished their testimony, the beast
that comes up out of the Abyss will make war with them, and overcome
them and kill them." (NASU)
The "Abomination of Desolation" in the Heavenly Sanctuary
Several Scriptures record the blasphemous acts of Abaddon during the
time of his rule. Let's look at those passages now.

DANIEL 7:8 "While I was contemplating the horns, behold, another horn,
a little one, came up among them, and three of the first horns were
pulled out by the roots before it; and behold, this horn possessed
eyes like the eyes of a man and a mouth uttering great boasts. . . .
19 Then I desired to know the exact meaning of . . . 20 the other horn
which came up, and before which three of them fell, namely, that horn
which had eyes and a mouth uttering great boasts and which was larger
in appearance than its associates. 21 I kept looking, and that horn
was waging war with the saints [qadishin] and overpowering them 22
until the Ancient of Days came and judgment was passed in favor of the
saints [qadishey of the Highest One, and the time arrived when the
saints [qadishin] took possession of the kingdom. . . . 25 'He will
speak out against the Most High and wear down the saints [qadishey] of
the Highest One, and he will intend to make alterations in times and
in law; and they will be given into his hand for a time, times, and
half a time. 26 But the court will sit for judgment, and his dominion
will be taken away, annihilated and destroyed forever.'" (NASU)
The Aramaic root word qadish literally means "holy ones;" it can be
translated either as "saints" or as "angels." As we will soon see from
parallel Scriptures, translating this word as "angels" appears to be
the correct rendering in most instances listed above. This passage
shows that Abaddon will speak against the Eternal God, and will attack
the holy angels.

REVELATION 13:5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and
blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two
months. 6 Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to
blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. 7
It was granted to him to make war with the saints [hagion] and to
overcome them. . . . (NKJV)
As you can see in Revelation 13:6, along with God Himself, the
heavenly tabernacle and those who dwell in heaven (the holy angels)
are special targets of Abaddon's blasphemy. The word "saints" in
Revelation 13:7 is the Greek word hagion. Although this word is
generally used of humans, it can also refer to God's holy angels. This
usage can be found in the Septuagint (LXX, Psa. 88:6, 8), and in the
New Testament (I The. 3:13). Friberg's Analytical Lexicon to the Greek
New Testament gives the definition for hagion in I Thessalonians 3:13
as: "the holy ones, as a designation for angels."

Revelation 13:6-7 shows that Abaddon and his spiritual forces of evil
are permitted to fight against the holy angels and temporarily defeat
them. This defeat will allow Abaddon to occupy the courtyard of the
temple in heaven and proclaim himself to be "God."

REVELATION 11:1 Then I was given a measuring rod like a staff, and I
was told, "Come and measure the temple of God and the altar and those
who worship there, 2 but do not measure the court outside the temple;
leave that out, for it is given over to the nations, and they will
trample over the holy city for forty-two months. (NRSV)
II THESSALONIANS 2:3 Let no one deceive you in any way; for that day
will not come unless the rebellion comes first and the lawless one is
revealed, the one destined for destruction. 4 He opposes and exalts
himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he
takes his seat in the temple [naon] of God, declaring himself to be
God. (NRSV)
Paul clearly says that Abaddon will occupy the temple of God, taking a
seat in it and declaring himself to be God. The Greek word translated
"temple" here is naon, a form of the noun naos. It generally refers to
the (outer) Holy Place and the (inner) Holy of Holies in the temple
proper. However, it is also used in the Bible to refer to the temple
complex, including the courtyard. The Theological Dictionary of the
New Testament says:

Mt. 27:5 tells us Judas cast the thirty shekels into the temple (eis
ton naon) and went out and hanged himself. If naos is taken to mean
the temple in the narrower sense, one may ask how Judas could bring
the money into it, since only the priests were allowed access. We may
thus assume that it is used in a broader sense, as in Jn. [2:]19 . . .
(p. 884, vol. IV).
Most people interpret the "temple of God" in II Thessalonians 2:4 as
either a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem, or figuratively as the Church.
Yet the Bible clearly shows that the tabernacle, and later the temple
in Jerusalem, were earthly types patterned after the heavenly antetype
(Exo. 25:9; Heb. 8:2, 5; 9:11, 23). It appears from the Scriptures
that Abaddon's presence in the courtyard of the heavenly temple could
be the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel and Christ. This
heavenly desolation will likely have an earthly counterpart in
Jerusalem (Luke 21:20).

LUKE 21:20 "But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know
that its desolation has come near." (RSV)
MATTHEW 24:15 "Therefore when you see the 'abomination of desolation,'
spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever
reads, let him understand), 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to
the mountains." (NKJV)
DANIEL 8:9 Out of one of them came another horn, a little one, which
grew exceedingly great toward the south, toward the east, and toward
the beautiful land. 10 It grew as high as the host of heaven. It threw
down to the earth some of the host and some of the stars, and trampled
on them. 11 Even against the prince of the host it acted arrogantly;
it took the regular burnt offering away from him and overthrew the
place of his sanctuary. 12 Because of wickedness, the host was given
over to it together with the regular burnt offering; it cast truth to
the ground, and kept prospering in what it did. 13 Then I heard a holy
one [qadosh, "angel"] speaking, and another holy one [[qadosh] said to
the one that spoke, "For how long is this vision concerning the
regular burnt offering, the transgression that makes desolate, and the
giving over of the sanctuary and host to be trampled?" 14 And he
answered him, "For two thousand three hundred evenings and mornings;
then the sanctuary shall be restored to its rightful state." (NRSV)
Abaddon and his army will be given victory over the host (literally,
"army") of heaven. He will overthrow the sanctuary of the "prince of
the host" (Yeshua the Messiah), and will cause the "regular burnt
offering" to cease for "2,300 evenings and mornings." The evenings and
mornings are referring to the time of the daily sacrifices; this means
that the actual time period being defined is only 1,150 days, or half
of 2,300.

If Daniel truly is referring to the Temple of God in heaven, then what
are the "daily sacrifices" that Abaddon will cause to cease?

I PETER 2:5 You also, as living stones, are being built up a spiritual
house, a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable
to God through Jesus Christ. (NKJV)
HEBREWS 13:15 Therefore by Him let us continually offer the sacrifice
of praise to God, that is, the fruit of our lips, giving thanks to His
name. (NKJV)
REVELATION 5:8 Now when He had taken the scroll, the four living
creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each
having a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers
of the saints. (NKJV)
REVELATION 8:3 Then another angel, having a golden censer, came and
stood at the altar. He was given much incense, that he should offer it
with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar which was
before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, with the prayers of
the saints, ascended before God from the angel's hand. (NKJV)
Physical sacrifices according to the Mosaic Law are not currently
performed. Yet the New Testament does show that sacrifices remain for
believers; those sacrifices are spiritual sacrifices, which include
praise and the prayers of God's people to the Eternal Creator of the
universe. It is possible that these are the sacrifices spoken of here,
instead of literal physical sacrifices.

Below is Gabriel's explanation of Daniel's vision:

DANIEL 8:16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of the Ulai,
who called, and said, "Gabriel, make this man understand the vision."
17 So he came near where I stood, and when he came I was afraid and
fell on my face; but he said to me, "Understand, son of man, that the
vision refers to the time of the end." 18 Now, as he was speaking with
me, I was in a deep sleep with my face to the ground; but he touched
me, and stood me upright. 19 And he said, "Look, I am making known to
you what shall happen in the latter time of the indignation; for at
the appointed time the end shall be. . . . 23 And in the latter time
of their kingdom, when the transgressors have reached their fullness,
a king [Abaddon] shall arise, having fierce features, who understands
sinister schemes. 24 His power shall be mighty, but not by his own
power; he shall destroy fearfully, and shall prosper and thrive; he
shall destroy the mighty, and also the holy people. 25 Through his
cunning he shall cause deceit to prosper under his rule; and he shall
exalt himself in his heart. He shall destroy many in their prosperity.
He shall even rise against the Prince of princes; but he shall be
broken without human means. (NKJV)
Gabriel clearly states that the events Daniel saw in his vision will
occur at "the time of the end." At that time, when transgressors have
reached their full measure, Abaddon will come on the scene. His power
and authority will come from Satan (Rev. 13:4). The "Destroyer" will
live up to his name; he will destroy the mighty and the holy ones
(both the saints and the holy angels), as well as those humans who
oppose him. He will delude himself because of pride in his
accomplishment, thinking and even proclaiming that he is "God" (II
The. 2:4). He will oppose Messiah, the "Prince of princes," but he
will eventually be defeated "without human means," as we will see in
the next section.

This same time is detailed in the eleventh chapter of Daniel also:

DANIEL 11:31 Forces from him shall appear and profane the temple and
fortress, and shall take away the continual burnt offering. And they
shall set up the abomination that makes desolate. 32 He shall seduce
with flattery those who violate the covenant; but the people who know
their God shall stand firm and take action. 33 And those among the
people who are wise shall make many understand, though they shall fall
by sword and flame, by captivity and plunder, for some days. 34 When
they fall, they shall receive a little help. And many shall join
themselves to them with flattery; 35 and some of those who are wise
shall fall, to refine and to cleanse them and to make them white,
until the time of the end, for it is yet for the time appointed. 36
And the king shall do according to his will; he shall exalt himself
and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak astonishing
things against the God of gods. He shall prosper till the indignation
is accomplished; for what is determined shall be done. 37 He shall
give no heed to the gods of his fathers, or to the one beloved by
women; he shall not give heed to any other god, for he shall magnify
himself above all. 38 He shall honor the god of fortresses instead of
these; a god whom his fathers did not know he shall honor with gold
and silver, with precious stones and costly gifts. (RSV)
The Destruction of Abaddon and His Kingdom
As previously shown, Abaddon will have the support of most of the
world after his conquest of the global human government. Daniel 11:39
shows the conveyance of rulership on some (the "ten kings") who
acknowledge his power and authority:

DANIEL 11:39 He shall deal with the strongest fortresses by the help
of a foreign god; those who acknowledge him he shall magnify with
honor. He shall make them rulers over many and shall divide the land
for a price. (RSV)
REVELATION 17:12 "The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have
received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority for one hour as
kings with the beast. 13 These are of one mind, and they will give
their power and authority to the beast. 14 These will make war with
the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and
King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and
faithful." (NKJV)
After the Israelites have returned to the Holy Land, Abaddon will
summon his vassal rulers and their armies to help him attempt to
destroy them (Eze. 38-39). These kings and their troops will gather at
Megiddo, north of Jerusalem:

REVELATION 16:13 And I saw, issuing from the mouth of the dragon and
from the mouth of the beast and from the mouth of the false prophet,
three foul spirits like frogs; 14 for they are demonic spirits,
performing signs, who go abroad to the kings of the whole world, to
assemble them for battle on the great day of God the Almighty. . . .16
And they assembled them at the place which is called in Hebrew
Armageddon. (RSV)
These forces will then march toward Jerusalem. At this great battle,
Yeshua, the Prince of the armies (hosts) of heaven, will destroy the
armies of the beast and capture him. Then Abaddon, along with the
false prophet, will be cast into the lake of fire:

REVELATION 19:19 And I saw the beast, the kings of the earth, and
their armies, gathered together to make war against Him who sat on the
horse and against His army. 20 Then the beast was captured, and with
him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he
deceived those who received the mark of the beast and those who
worshiped his image. These two were cast alive into the lake of fire
burning with brimstone. 21 And the rest were killed with the sword
which proceeded from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse. And all
the birds were filled with their flesh. (NKJV)
ZECHARIAH 14:12 Now this will be the plague with which the LORD will
strike all the peoples who have gone to war against Jerusalem; their
flesh will rot while they stand on their feet, and their eyes will rot
in their sockets, and their tongue will rot in their mouth. 13 It will
come about in that day that a great panic from the LORD will fall on
them; and they will seize one another's hand, and the hand of one will
be lifted against the hand of another. (NASU)
Let's look at one other passage from Isaiah 14 that explicitly shows
the defeat and fate of Abaddon. This Scripture is commonly thought to
refer to Satan. However, if we look at the context and put away our
preconceived ideas, it becomes apparent that Abaddon, not Satan, is
the subject:

ISAIAH14:1 The LORD will have compassion on Jacob and will again
choose Israel, and will set them in their own land, and aliens will
join them and will cleave to the house of Jacob. 2 And the peoples
will take them and bring them to their place, and the house of Israel
will possess them in the LORD's land as male and female slaves; they
will take captive those who were their captors, and rule over those
who oppressed them. 3 When the LORD has given you rest from your pain
and turmoil and the hard service with which you were made to serve, 4
you will take up this taunt against the king of Babylon: "How the
oppressor has ceased, the insolent fury ceased! 5 The LORD has broken
the staff of the wicked, the scepter of rulers, 6 that smote the
peoples in wrath with unceasing blows, that ruled the nations in anger
with unrelenting persecution. 7 The whole earth is at rest and quiet;
they break forth into singing. 8 The cypresses rejoice at you, the
cedars of Lebanon, saying, 'Since you were laid low, no hewer comes up
against us.' 9 Sheol beneath is stirred up to meet you when you come,
it rouses the shades to greet you, all who were leaders of the earth;
it raises from their thrones all who were kings of the nations. 10 All
of them will speak and say to you: 'You too have become as weak as we!
You have become like us!' 11 Your pomp [ga'on, "arrogancy"] is brought
down to Sheol, the sound of your harps; maggots are the bed beneath
you, and worms are your covering. (RSV)
The scene is set in verses 1 through 3. This is the time when God has
given rest to His people; this is the Millennium, when the Israelites
will be back in their land and Yeshua will be ruling from Jerusalem.
Verse 4 identifies the subject of the passage: Abaddon, the "king of
Babylon." Verses 5 through 8 show that God has broken the power of
this king who had oppressively ruled the whole earth. Verse 9 shows
that Abaddon has been cast into sheol. Sheol is used figuratively for
the abode of those who are dead; in this instance, those wordly
leaders who were under this king are specifically mentioned. Verse 10
shows them symbolically exulting in the fact that Abaddon, although at
one time extremely powerful, has suffered the same fate they did.
Verse 11 reaffirms that this arrogant king has been delivered to
sheol. It's clear that Abaddon is no longer around during the
Millennium.

ISAIAH 14:12 "How you are fallen from heaven, O Day Star [Helel], son
of Dawn! How you are cut down to the ground, you who laid the nations
low! 13 You said in your heart, 'I will ascend to heaven; above the
stars of God I will set my throne on high; I will sit on the mount of
assembly in the far north; 14 I will ascend above the heights of the
clouds, I will make myself like the Most High.' 15 But you are brought
down to Sheol, to the depths of the Pit. 16 Those who see you will
stare at you, and ponder over you: 'Is this the man who made the earth
tremble, who shook kingdoms, 17 who made the world like a desert and
overthrew its cities, who did not let his prisoners go home?' 18 All
the kings of the nations lie in glory, each in his own tomb; 19 but
you are cast out, away from your sepulchre, like a loathed untimely
birth, clothed with the slain, those pierced by the sword, who go down
to the stones of the Pit, like a dead body trodden under foot. 20 You
will not be joined with them in burial, because you have destroyed
your land, you have slain your people. "May the descendants of
evildoers nevermore be named!" (RSV)
In verse 12, this dead king is given a name: Helel. Some translations
render this Hebrew name as Lucifer, which is Latin for "light-bearer."
However, the real meaning of Helel is subject to conjecture by
scholars. The Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament says that
the hithpael form of "hll means 'pride oneself,' often with overtones
of 'brag, boast'" (vol. III, p. 409). That meaning fits nicely with
the depiction of the arrogant king in this passage of Scripture.

In this prophecy, Abaddon, although he conquered the nations and even
heaven for a time, has fallen from heaven and been cut down to the
earth. In verses 13 and 14, we see that Abaddon decided to ascend
above the clouds and the stars into heaven. He wanted to establish his
throne there, at the very place of God's heavenly temple, the mount of
assembly. He wanted nothing less than to rule in place of God. Yet
verses 15 through 20 show that he will be brought down to sheol, his
power destroyed. The theme of this entire passage is the overthrow of
the arrogant king, Abaddon, who wanted to be like the Most High God.

After the crushing defeat of Abaddon's forces, Satan, the power behind
Abaddon's throne, will be captured also. He will be locked in the
Abyss during the 1,000 year reign of the Messiah on earth:

REVELATION 20:1 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding
the key of the Abyss and a great chain in his hand. 2 And he laid hold
of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and
bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he threw him into the Abyss, and
shut it and sealed it over him, so that he would not deceive the
nations any longer, until the thousand years were completed; after
these things he must be released for a short time. (NASU)
Conclusion
While some end-time prophecies of the Bible are still not clear,
events will not occur as has commonly been expected. The "beast" who
ascends out of the Abyss during the "last days" will be an angelic
king named Abaddon. He, with his army of fallen angels and demons,
will overpower the human global government and take over as ruler of
the earth. Abaddon will even conquer the holy sanctuary in heaven and
gain victory over the angelic hosts of heaven. Nevertheless, his rule
will be for a limited time only; after 3 1/2 years, God will take his
authority away. Abaddon will marshal his forces and attempt to finally
destroy God's people, but he will be unsuccessful. He will end up in
the lake of fire as Yeshua the Messiah establishes the Kingdom of God
at the beginning of the Millennium.

Bryan T. Huie
December 27, 1997
Revised: April 9, 2004


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THE GOAT FOR AZAZEL
In this article, we are going to examine the ritual that was conducted
anciently by the Israelites on the Day of Atonement (Yom Kippur). I
believe this ancient ceremony is significant regarding the fulfillment
of end-time prophecy. First, let's start by looking at what the
Scriptures tell us about this ceremonial observance.

LEVITICUS 16:1 The LORD spoke to Moses, after the death of the two
sons of Aaron, when they drew near before the LORD and died; 2 and the
LORD said to Moses, "Tell Aaron your brother not to come at all times
into the holy place within the veil, before the mercy seat which is
upon the ark, lest he die; for I will appear in the cloud upon the
mercy seat. 3 But thus shall Aaron come into the holy place: with a
young bull for a sin offering and a ram for a burnt offering. 4 He
shall put on the holy linen coat, and shall have the linen breeches on
his body, be girded with the linen girdle, and wear the linen turban;
these are the holy garments. He shall bathe his body in water, and
then put them on. 5 And he shall take from the congregation of the
people of Israel two male goats for a sin offering, and one ram for a
burnt offering. 6 And Aaron shall offer the bull as a sin offering for
himself, and shall make atonement for himself and for his house. 7
Then he shall take the two goats, and set them before the LORD at the
door of the tent of meeting; 8 and Aaron shall cast lots upon the two
goats, one lot for the LORD and the other lot for Azazel. 9 And Aaron
shall present the goat on which the lot fell for the LORD, and offer
it as a sin offering; 10 but the goat on which the lot fell for Azazel
shall be presented alive before the LORD to make atonement over it,
that it may be sent away into the wilderness to Azazel. 11 Aaron shall
present the bull as a sin offering for himself, and shall make
atonement for himself and for his house; he shall kill the bull as a
sin offering for himself. 12 And he shall take a censer full of coals
of fire from the altar before the LORD, and two handfuls of sweet
incense beaten small; and he shall bring it within the veil 13 and put
the incense on the fire before the LORD, that the cloud of the incense
may cover the mercy seat which is upon the testimony, lest he die; 14
and he shall take some of the blood of the bull, and sprinkle it with
his finger on the front of the mercy seat, and before the mercy seat
he shall sprinkle the blood with his finger seven times. 15 Then he
shall kill the goat of the sin offering which is for the people, and
bring its blood within the veil, and do with its blood as he did with
the blood of the bull, sprinkling it upon the mercy seat and before
the mercy seat; 16 thus he shall make atonement for the holy place,
because of the uncleannesses of the people of Israel, and because of
their transgressions, all their sins; and so he shall do for the tent
of meeting, which abides with them in the midst of their
uncleannesses. 17 There shall be no man in the tent of meeting when he
enters to make atonement in the holy place until he comes out and has
made atonement for himself and for his house and for all the assembly
of Israel. 18 Then he shall go out to the altar which is before the
LORD and make atonement for it, and shall take some of the blood of
the bull and of the blood of the goat, and put it on the horns of the
altar round about. 19 And he shall sprinkle some of the blood upon it
with his finger seven times, and cleanse it and hallow it from the
uncleannesses of the people of Israel. 20 And when he has made an end
of atoning for the holy place and the tent of meeting and the altar,
he shall present the live goat; 21 and Aaron shall lay both his hands
upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the
iniquities of the people of Israel, and all their transgressions, all
their sins; and he shall put them upon the head of the goat, and send
him away into the wilderness by the hand of a man who is in readiness.
22 The goat shall bear all their iniquities upon him to a solitary
land; and he shall let the goat go in the wilderness. 23 Then Aaron
shall come into the tent of meeting, and shall put off the linen
garments which he put on when he went into the holy place, and shall
leave them there; 24 and he shall bathe his body in water in a holy
place, and put on his garments, and come forth, and offer his burnt
offering and the burnt offering of the people, and make atonement for
himself and for the people. 25 And the fat of the sin offering he
shall burn upon the altar. 26 And he who lets the goat go to Azazel
shall wash his clothes and bathe his body in water, and afterward he
may come into the camp. 27 And the bull for the sin offering and the
goat for the sin offering, whose blood was brought in to make
atonement in the holy place, shall be carried forth outside the camp;
their skin and their flesh and their dung shall be burned with fire.
28 And he who burns them shall wash his clothes and bathe his body in
water, and afterward he may come into the camp. 29 And it shall be a
statute to you for ever that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of
the month, you shall afflict yourselves, and shall do no work, either
the native or the stranger who sojourns among you; 30 for on this day
shall atonement be made for you, to cleanse you; from all your sins
you shall be clean before the LORD. 31 It is a sabbath of solemn rest
to you, and you shall afflict yourselves; it is a statute for ever. 32
And the priest who is anointed and consecrated as priest in his
father's place shall make atonement, wearing the holy linen garments;
33 he shall make atonement for the sanctuary, and he shall make
atonement for the tent of meeting and for the altar, and he shall make
atonement for the priests and for all the people of the assembly. 34
And this shall be an everlasting statute for you, that atonement may
be made for the people of Israel once in the year because of all their
sins." And Moses did as the LORD commanded him. (RSV)
As this passage of Scripture shows, the high priest was to enter into
the Most Holy Place of the tabernacle only one time per year, on the
Day of Atonement (Tishri 10 on the Jewish calendar). This entry into
the Most Holy Place was allowed so atonement could be made for the
people, to cleanse them of their sins so that they would be clean
before the Lord (Lev. 16:30).

The ceremony with the two goats is the main focus of the rite
conducted on the Day of Atonement. In addition to the information
recorded in Leviticus 16, we are given additional details about this
observance in the Mishnah, which is the body of Jewish oral law
recorded in the second century A.D. The tractate Yoma describes this
ceremony in detail.

In Yoma we are told that a box was brought to the high priest which
contained two lots, one marked "for the LORD" and the other marked
"for Azazel." The high priest put his hands in the box and brought out
a lot in each hand; he held up the hand which contained the lot for
the LORD. The high priest then tied a crimson thread on the head of
the goat which was to be sent forth (the goat for Azazel), and another
crimson thread around the throat of the goat which would be slain as a
sin offering (the goat for the LORD).

After the high priest atoned for his own sins and those of his family
by the blood of the bull (Lev. 16:6, 11-14), the goat which had been
designated "for the LORD" was brought to him. The high priest then
slaughtered this goat, and its blood was used to purify the Most Holy
Place from the uncleanness of the Israelites. Who or what did this
goat represent? The author of Hebrews clearly shows us the answer.

HEBREWS 9:11 But Christ came as High Priest of the good things to
come, with the greater and more perfect tabernacle not made with
hands, that is, not of this creation. 12 Not with the blood of goats
and calves, but with His own blood He entered the Most Holy Place once
for all, having obtained eternal redemption. (NKJV)
Unquestionably the goat chosen "for the LORD" was symbolic of Yeshua
the Messiah. As the high priest of the new covenant, he entered the
Most Holy Place in the heavenly tabernacle and cleansed us of our sins
with his own blood, not that of a goat.

HEBREWS 9:24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with
hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to
appear in the presence of God for us; 25 not that He should offer
Himself often, as the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every
year with blood of another 26 He then would have had to suffer often
since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the
ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.
(NKJV)
Through our acceptance of the sacrifice of Yeshua, we have access to
the Most Holy Place in heaven and can go into the very presence of God
our Father.

HEBREWS 10:19 Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the
Holiest by the blood of Jesus, 20 by a new and living way which He
consecrated for us, through the veil, that is, His flesh, 21 and
having a High Priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near with a
true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled
from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. (NKJV)
Now after the goat for the LORD had been slain and its blood sprinkled
on the mercy seat, the goat for Azazel was brought to the high priest.
He laid both hands on its head and made the following confession:

"O Lord, your people, the house of Israel, has committed iniquity,
transgressed, and sinned before you. Forgive O Lord, I pray, the
iniquities, transgressions, and sins, which your people, the house of
Israel, have committed, transgressed, and sinned before you, as it is
written in the Torah of Moses, your servant, For on this day shall
atonement be made for you to clean you. From all your sins shall you
be clean before the Lord" (The Mishnah, A New Translation, Yoma 6:2)
At that time the high priest gave the goat for Azazel over to the man
who was to lead it out into the wilderness. Anyone could be chosen for
this task, but later high priests made it a practice of selecting
someone other than an Israelite to lead the goat. The goat was taken
to a ravine, thought by some scholars to be a precipice about 12 miles
east of Jerusalem. At that time, the man leading the goat divided the
crimson thread on the head of the goat. Half of it he tied to a rock,
and the other half he tied between the horns of the goat. He then
pushed the goat backwards until it fell into the ravine. Because of
the steep and jagged nature of the chasm, the goat for Azazel was
usually dead before it had fallen halfway down the mountain.

Who or What is Azazel?

We've seen from the Bible who the goat for the LORD represented, but
what about the goat chosen for Azazel? Who or what did this goat
represent? What is the true meaning of the Hebrew word 'azazel used in
Leviticus 16?

These questions have caused a lot of disagreement among theologians.
Generally, scholars have advanced four different explanations for the
etymology and meaning of 'azazel. The Theological Wordbook of the Old
Testament outlines these four theories:

Azazel. This word appears four times in OT, all in Lev 16 (8, 10, 26)
where the ritual for the Day of Atonement is described. After the
priest has made atonement for himself and his house, he is to take two
goats on behalf of Israel. One is to be a sacrifice to the Lord, the
other is to be the "scape goat," i.e., the goat for Azazel. In all
four appearances of this word, it has the preposition "to" attached to
it.
This word has been variously understood and translated. The versions
(LXX, Symmachus, Theodotian and the Vulgate) have understood it to
stand for the "goat that departs," considering it to be derived from
two Hebrew words: 'ez "goat" and 'azal "turn off."
By associating it with the Arabic word 'azala "banish," "remove," it
has been rendered "for entire removal" (IDB loc. cit.).
The rabbinic interpretation has generally considered this word to
designate the place to which the goat was sent: a desert, a solitary
place, or the height from which the goat was thrown (cf. Lev 16:22).
The final possibility is to regard this word as designating a personal
being so as to balance the "Lord." In this way, Azazel could be an
evil spirit (Enoch 8:1; 10:4; cf. II Chr 11:15; Isa 34:14; Rev 18:2) .
. . standing logically in antithesis to Lord. . . . (vol. II, pp.
657-658)
Regarding the four possible derivations of the word delineated above,
the New International Dictionary of Old Testament Theology and
Exegesis says of 'azazel:

This word appears 4x in the prescriptions governing the Day of
Atonement . . . Its undetermined origin and limited use in the OT has
resulted in much speculation and uncertainty with regard to its
precise and original meaning . . . Four major explanations have been
suggested for the word . . .
The fourth position suggests that the Azazel is a reference to a
desert demon . . . In support of this position is the book of Enoch,
which uses this name for a chief demon (En 8:1; 9:6; 10:4-8; 13:1-2;
54:5; 55:4; 69:2). The OT also associates the appearance of goats with
demons . . . Furthermore, the desert or wilderness is frequently
described by both the OT and NT as the abode of evil spirits (Isa
13:1; 34:13; Matt 12:43; Luke 11:24; Rev 18:2). This interpretation
also balances the parallel expression "for the Lord" in 16:8 and makes
sense of the remaining grammatical expressions. . . .
The fourth [position] makes the most grammatical sense (vol. 3; pp.
362, 363).
Regarding the use of 'azazel in Leviticus 16, The Abingdon Bible
Commentary states: "The translation dismissal in the R.V. mg. here
(cf. removal in A.S.V. mg.) is inadmissable, being based on false
etymology. What the word meant is unknown, but it should be retained
as the proper name of a wilderness demon" (p. 289).

The revised HarperCollins Bible Dictionary records this about Azazel:

A demonic figure to whom the sin-laden goat was sent on the Day of
Atonement (Lev. 16:8, 10, 26). The Hebrew word had been traditionally
understood as a phrase meaning "the goat that escapes," giving us the
word "scapegoat." But in the light of modern research, both this
interpretation and those that understand it as a place name are
incorrect. The word is a proper name and means something like "angry
god." Yet, though Azazel is a demon, he does not play an active role
in the rite as corresponding figures do in similar rituals of the
ancient Near East ("Azazel," p. 90.)
In his Bible dictionary, James Hastings states: "'Azazel must have
been such a[n evil] spirit, sufficiently distinguished from the rest,
in popular imagination, to receive a special name, and no doubt
invested with attributes which, though unknown to us, were perfectly
familiar to those for whom the ceremonial of Lv 16 was first designed"
(A Dictionary of the Bible, vol. 1, pp. 207-208).

In I Chronicles 5:8, the father of Bela, a Reubenite, is named "Azaz,"
which means "strong." This name cames from the Hebrew verb 'azaz, a
which means "to be strong." Regarding this word, the Theological
Wordbook of the Old Testament says:

The verb 'azaz can be predicated of both God and man. . . . When used
of man, this word carries the idea of prevailing as in a war or
struggle . . . or as being belligerent, particularly to God. . . .
(vol. II, pp. 659)
The Soncino Chumash says that 'azazel "is a compound of azaz, 'to be
strong,' and el, 'mighty'" (p. 706). The Hebrew word el is often
translated as "God" in the Old Testament. It is frequently used in
combination with other words in proper names (i.e., Daniel, "God is my
judge," Samuel "name of God," Penuel "face of God," etc.). Therefore,
as a proper name, Azazel could positively mean "strong one of God" or
negatively it could imply "belligerent toward God."

Azazel in the Book of Enoch

The Book of Enoch (also called First Enoch) gives us quite a bit of
information about a demon named Azazel. Regarding the origin of the
Book of Enoch, The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia says:

First Enoch is obviously a composite work, consisting of at least five
different parts. . . . Since Aramaic fragments of ten different MSS,
representing four parts of the book, have been found in the Qumrân
caves, it is quite certain that the book in its several parts was
originally written in Aramaic and then translated into Greek at an
early date. Considerable fragments of the Greek version have been
found . . . The Greek version was translated into Ethiopic. In 1773 a
traveller, James Bruce, brought three MSS in Ethiopic from Abyssinia
to Britain. We now possess twenty-nine MSS, but all of them more or
less corrupt. We have no materials to trace the history of the five
parts of Enoch as individual books or as a collection.
Few objective criteria exist by which to date the production of these
books and their collection. Most scholars believe they were written
between 165 and 64 B.C., but conclusions vary considerably (vol. 1, p.
156).
Furthermore, The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary says of First Enoch:

Portions of the work were well known in Christian circles. 1 En. 1:9
is quoted explicitly in the Epistle of Jude (vv. 14-15) . . . The work
was accepted as Scripture in various early Christian writings (e.g.,
Barn. 16:5; cf. 4:3; Clement of Alexandria Ecl. ii; Irenaeus Adv.
haer. iv.16.2) . . . (p. 337)
Clearly, the Book of Enoch was widely known and used by early
believers. It's apparent that Jude considered his quote from Enoch to
be genuine. Because the present version has suffered some corruption
while coming down to us through the centuries, it is not now
considered to be holy Scripture. However, it is reasonable to assume
that the original text did faithfully record the words of Enoch.

Since Jude quotes from the Book of Enoch, we can also do so, if we are
careful to ensure that what is used does not contradict or conflict
with the Bible. By combining what we are told about Azazel in the Book
of Enoch with what the Bible reveals, we can come to better understand
the ceremony performed on the Day of Atonement and also end-time
events.

Let's start with some background information from the Book of Enoch
about a very important event that is recorded in Genesis 6:1-2, 4.

GENESIS 6:1 Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the
face of the earth, and daughters were born to them, 2 that the sons of
God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took
wives for themselves of all whom they chose. . . . 4 There were giants
on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God
came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those
were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown. (NKJV)
This same event is addressed in much greater detail in the Book of
Enoch.

ENOCH 6:1 And it came to pass when the children of men had multiplied
that in those days were born unto 2 them beautiful and comely
daughters. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and lusted
after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us wives
from among the children of men 3 and beget us children.' And Semjaza,
who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not 4 indeed
agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a
great sin.' And they all answered him and said: 'Let us all swear an
oath, and all bind ourselves by mutual imprecations 5 not to abandon
this plan but to do this thing.' Then sware they all together and
bound themselves 6 by mutual imprecations upon it. And they were in
all two hundred; who descended in the days of Jared on the summit of
Mount Hermon and they called it Mount Hermon, because they had sworn 7
and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it. And these are the
names of their leaders: Samlazaz, their leader, Araklba, Rameel,
Kokablel, Tamlel, Ramlel, Danel, Ezeqeel, Baraqijal, 8 Asael, Armaros,
Batarel, Ananel, Zaqlel, Samsapeel, Satarel, Turel, Jomjael, Sariel.
These are their chiefs of tens. 7:1 And all the others together with
them took unto themselves wives, and each chose for himself one, and
they began to go in unto them and to defile themselves with them . . .
(The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
The "sons of God" mentioned in Genesis 6:2, 4 are identified as angels
in the Book of Enoch. This was the commonly accepted understanding of
this Scripture until the fifth century A.D. For additional information
on what the Bible teaches about these sons of God, refer to "Genesis 6
- Who Were 'The Sons Of God'?."

As you can see from the list of angelic chiefs named above, Azazel was
not one of the angels specified as having come down on Mount Hermon.
An angel named Semjaza is identified as the leader of the small group
of angels who lusted after human women. However, we soon see Azazel
appear in the antediluvian world.

ENOCH 8:1 And Azazel taught men to make swords, and knives, and
shields, and breastplates, and made known to them the metals of the
earth and the art of working them, and bracelets, and ornaments, and
the use of antimony, and the beautifying of the eyelids, and all kinds
of costly stones, and all 2 colouring tinctures. And there arose much
godlessness, and they committed fornication, and they 3 were led
astray, and became corrupt in all their ways. . . . (The Apocrypha and
Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
Although Azazel is not initially listed among the rulers of the 200
angels who came down to earth to mate with human women, he appears
soon after this event. Later in the book (Enoch 54:4), Azazel is shown
to be the ruler of this host of rebellious angels. Azazel, a powerful,
high-ranking evil angel, apparently sought to take advantage of the
lawless environment in the period of angelic rebellion before the
Flood to wreak havoc on humanity. He accomplished this by teaching
mankind how to make weapons and the art of warfare, among other
things. This displeased the Eternal God greatly, and Enoch shows that
He decreed a stiff punishment for Azazel's sins.

ENOCH 10:1 Then said the Most High, the Holy and Great One spake, and
sent Uriel to the son of Lamech, 2 and said to him: 'Go to Noah and
tell him in my name "Hide thyself!" and reveal to him the end that is
approaching: that the whole earth will be destroyed, and a deluge is
about to come 3 upon the whole earth, and will destroy all that is on
it. And now instruct him that he may escape 4 and his seed may be
preserved for all the generations of the world.' And again the Lord
said to Raphael: 'Bind Azazel hand and foot, and cast him into the
darkness: and make an opening 5 in the desert, which is in Dudael, and
cast him therein. And place upon him rough and jagged rocks, and cover
him with darkness, and let him abide there for ever, and cover his
face that he may 6,7 not see light. And on the day of the great
judgement he shall be cast into the fire. . . . 8 . . . the whole
earth has been corrupted 9 through the works that were taught by
Azazel: to him ascribe all sin. (The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of
the Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
We see from the excerpt we just read that Azazel's punishment was to
be bound and cast into an opening made in the desert and sealed up
there, covered by rough and jagged stones in darkness. He was to
remain in this place until the time of his judgment, when he would
then be cast into the fire. When we examine the punishment later
decreed for the remainder of the angels who sinned before the Flood,
we get a little more information about this place where Azazel and the
other demons were imprisoned.

ENOCH 54:3 And there mine eyes saw how they made these their
instruments, iron chains of immeasurable weight. 4 And I asked the
angel of peace who went with me, saying: "For whom are these chains
being prepared? And he said unto me: "These are being prepared for the
hosts of Azazel, so that they may take them and cast them into the
abyss of complete condemnation, and they shall cover their jaws with
rough stones as the Lord of Spirits commanded. 6 And Michael, and
Gabriel, and Raphael, and Phanuel shall take hold of them on that
great day, and cast them on that day into the burning furnace, that
the Lord of Spirits may take vengeance on them for their
unrighteousness in becoming subject to Satan and leading astray those
who dwell on the earth." (The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old
Testament, R.H. Charles)
As the Book of Enoch shows, the hosts of Azazel were bound in chains
and cast into the abyss, to be covered with rough rocks just as Azazel
had been. It's logical to conclude that this abyss is the same place
into which Azazel was earlier cast.

The Bible gives us some information about this place of restraint for
the demons. First, let's look at an incident during the ministry of
the Messiah that Luke records.

LUKE 8:26 Then they sailed to the country of the Gadarenes, which is
opposite Galilee. 27 And when He stepped out on the land, there met
Him a certain man from the city who had demons for a long time. And he
wore no clothes, nor did he live in a house but in the tombs. 28 When
he saw Jesus, he cried out, fell down before Him, and with a loud
voice said, "What have I to do with You, Jesus, Son of the Most High
God? I beg You, do not torment me!" 29 For He had commanded the
unclean spirit to come out of the man. For it had often seized him,
and he was kept under guard, bound with chains and shackles; and he
broke the bonds and was driven by the demon into the wilderness. 30
Jesus asked him, saying, "What is your name?" And he said, "Legion,"
because many demons had entered him. 31 And they begged Him that He
would not command them to go out into the abyss. 32 Now a herd of many
swine was feeding there on the mountain. So they begged Him that He
would permit them to enter them. And He permitted them. 33 Then the
demons went out of the man and entered the swine, and the herd ran
violently down the steep place into the lake and drowned. (NKJV)
As the Scripture above shows, the demons who inhabited this man were
terrified of being banished by Yeshua into the abyss. Evidently this
is the same place of restraint where Azazel and his host of fallen
angels were being kept, and the demons who had possessed this man
definitely did not wish to join them there in their prison.

Clearly some demons are free to spawn evil in the physical world.
However, there are Scriptures which demonstrate that a portion of the
evil angels are currently restrained in darkness and chains, as the
Book of Enoch details.

JUDE 6 And the angels who did not keep their own position, but left
their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains in deepest
darkness for the judgment of the great Day. 7 Likewise, Sodom and
Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which, in the same manner as they
[the angels], indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural
lust, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
(NRSV)
II PETER 2:4 . . . God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast
them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be
reserved for judgment; (NKJV)
I PETER 3:19 . . . He [Christ] went and preached to the spirits in
prison, 20 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine
longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being
prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through
water. (NKJV)
The Scriptures above confirm what we have seen in the Book of Enoch.
Jude specifically states that it was those angels who committed sexual
sins with human women that were being kept in age-lasting chains in
darkness. These same angels are referenced by Peter in his second
epistle. We are even told that the preincarnate Christ went and
preached to these imprisoned spirits in the days while Noah was
preparing the ark.

Azazel in the Bible

By combining what we have seen from the Book of Enoch with the Bible,
we can understand who Azazel is and why he is currently imprisoned.
Now let's see what the Bible tells us about Azazel and his host of
demons at the end of the age.

In the book of Revelation, John gives us a prophecy regarding the
unsealing of the abyss and the release of the evil spirits imprisoned
there. This event, symbolized by the sounding of the fifth trumpet, is
part of God's wrath on an unrepentant mankind.

REVELATION 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star from
heaven fallen unto the earth: and there was given to him the key of
the pit of the abyss. 2 And he opened the pit of the abyss; and there
went up a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and
the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. 3
And out of the smoke came forth locusts upon the earth; and power was
given them, as the scorpions of the earth have power. 4 And it was
said unto them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth,
neither any green thing, neither any tree, but only such men as have
not the seal of God on their foreheads. 5 And it was given them that
they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five
months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when it
striketh a man. 6 And in those days men shall seek death, and shall in
no wise find it; and they shall desire to die, and death fleeth from
them. 7 And the shapes of the locusts were like unto horses prepared
for war; and upon their heads as it were crowns like unto gold, and
their faces were as men's faces. 8 And they had hair as the hair of
women, and their teeth were as teeth of lions. 9 And they had
breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their
wings was as the sound of chariots, of many horses rushing to war. 10
And they have tails like unto scorpions, and stings; and in their
tails is their power to hurt men five months. (ASV)
The "star" which falls from heaven to earth is an angel who has the
key to the pit of the abyss. This angel opens the abyss and releases
the demons imprisoned there to torment humanity. God uses them for
five months as an instrument of His wrath; they are allowed to torment
those on the earth who don't have God's seal on their foreheads (Rev.
7:2-8).

REVELATION 9:11 They had for their king the angel of the abyss, whose
name, in Hebrew, is Abaddon, and in Greek, Apollyon, or the Destroyer.
(NEB)
In Revelation 9:11, the mysterious angelic "king" of the abyss is
called by the names Abaddon and Apollyon. Both these names mean
"destroyer." If you will recall, the primary sin for which Azazel was
imprisoned was for teaching men how to create weapons and destroy one
another through warfare. Undoubtedly, Azazel and Abaddon/Apollyon are
the same being. Although not specifically mentioned by these names
elsewhere in the Bible, Azazel plays a major role in the events at the
end of this current age. For additional information on this powerful
demon and his activities in the end-time, see my article "Who Is The
'Destroyer'?"

In Revelation 9:11, Azazel is identified as the king of the demons who
is released from the abyss. This point identifies him throughout the
rest of the book of Revelation. Twice Azazel is specifically referred
to as the "beast" who will come up out of the abyss.

REVELATION 11:7 When they [the two witnesses] have finished their
testimony, the beast that comes up out of the abyss will make war with
them, and overcome them and kill them. (NASB)
REVELATION 17:8 "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about
to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. . . ." (NASB)
Going back to the ceremony performed on the Day of Atonement, we saw
that the sins of the people were placed on the head of the goat for
Azazel. Then this goat was led into the wilderness and was eventually
pushed over a cliff backward to its death, carrying with it the sins
of the people. The Bible records a very similar fate for Azazel.

REVELATION 19:19 And I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with
their armies gathered to make war against him who sits upon the horse
and against his army. 20 And the beast was captured, and with it the
false prophet who in its presence had worked the signs by which he
deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who
worshiped its image. These two were thrown alive into the lake of fire
that burns with sulphur. (RSV)
This precise destiny for Azazel is confirmed in the Book of Enoch.

ENOCH 10:7 . . . On the day of the great judgement he [Azazel] shall
be cast into the fire. . . . (The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the
Old Testament, R.H. Charles)
As both the Bible and the Book of Enoch record, Azazel/Abaddon will be
cast into the lake of fire at the end of this age of mankind. His
defeat will inaugurate the reign of the Messiah on the the earth for a
thousand years.

CONCLUSION

The religious ceremony performed by the high priest on the Day of
Atonement had great figurative significance. The reality of Azazel's
eventual vanquishment was portrayed symbolically for hundreds of years
through this ritual. Just as the goat "for the LORD" in this ceremony
pictured the sacrifice of Yeshua the Messiah for the cleansing of our
sins, the fate of the goat chosen by lot "for Azazel" on the Day of
Atonement depicted Yeshua's soon-coming triumph over Azazel and the
forces of evil at the end of this age.

Bryan T. Huie
Updated: October 11, 1998

Back to Topic Index
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-06 08:17:52 UTC
Permalink
After 2 Weeks of visiting his family/saying goodbye, Aussie Bloke came
back and true to his word, posted on the 29th of May who he is. His
comments are noted below:

Aussie Bloke
5/29/2004
5:19 am EDT Re: Aussie Bloke Vol.#3

Ok...here it is. I AM DR GARTREL. Happy now? As for what I
know....I've already told you. You want bloody details....you have
them already. You want to know what will happen?...read the above
posts. You don't believe me?...YOUR problem! YOU have brains...USE
THEM....as I've encouraged you all to do all along!!! READ THE BLOODY
SIGNS>>>>>>>but no...some remain flaming BLIND!!!! because they WANT
TO. Wont change a thing. I am screwed now...cats out of the bag
now...I am who I am....and who gives a ____. IM BLOODY ANGRY!!!!! DO
you people have ANY BLOODY IDEA at ALL what it has been like for
myself and others who have known about this for BLOODY TWO
DECADES!!!!!!!! But no...WELL BUGGER IT ALL!!!!!! For those who have
patiently waited for me I am truly sorry for not doing the expected. I
told you all weeks ago exactly where and when...you have the details
already. The reason? THINK about it!!! IF I had told you all back then
that the information WAS in fact THE information you all wanted....the
site would have shut down. I had to do it this way...the information
has been out for over two weeks now...and the ptb can now do bugger
all about it. I have been around them long enough to know how they
think and what they would do...now they can do nothing. The times
locations and eta of the cloud and objects has already been posted.
NOW all you have to do is hope to hell that someone out there copied
it. NOW...GET THE WORD OUT!!!! THIS IS LEGIT. FAREWELL TO ALL. SEE YOU
IN ETERNITY.

Someone did some research on Aussie Bloke and found out that he is
indeed who he say's he is, which makes the entire thread that I had
sent you several weeks ago even more disturbing. Here is the info
that has been pulled about him:

http://www.imo.net/bib/metshw0.html
Bibliographic Meteor Database - Meteor Showers
GARTRELL G., ELFORD W.G. (1975):
SOUTHERN HEMISPHERE METEOR STREAM DETERMINATION
Austral. J. Phys. 28, 591-620

http://www.darksky.org/infoshts/is044.html
Olsson-Steel, D.I. & Elford, W.G., The Use of Radars in the Detection
of In falling Space Debris International Dark-Sky Association --
Information Sheet 44 Astronomical Society of the Pacific Conference
Series, Vol. 17 08/98

http://www.terrapub.co.jp/journals/EPS/abstract/5107_08/51070691.html
Meteor observations with an MF radar
Masaki Tsutsumi1, David Holdsworth2, Takuji Nakamura3, and Iain Reid4
1National Institute of Polar Research, Tokyo, Japan
2Atmospheric Radar Systems, Adelaide, Australia
3Radio Atmospheric Science Center, Kyoto University, Uji, Kyoto, Japan
4University of Adelaide, Adelaide, Australia
(Received August 19, 1998; Revised June 6, 1999; Accepted June 10,
1999)
Earth Planets Space, Vol. 51 (Nos. 7, 8), pp. 691-689, 1999 in the
bibliography of the pdf: Steel, D. I. and W. G. Elford, The height
distribution of radio meteors: comparison of observations at different
frequencies on the basis of standard echo theory, J. Atmos. Terr.
Phys., 53, 409–417, 1991.

I am going to leave your readers (if you decide to post this) with
several links, and information that I have been able to pull about
this "end of the world" scenario. It is not just Aussie Bloke who is
talking about these inbound comets, there are also some very
disturbing signs happening which leads one to believe that either
there are some incredible coincidences going on, or Aussie Bloke is
right, and we will have "hell on earth" in June.

By the way, here are the days and the events which are supposed to
happen on them:

June 8-9 Dust Cloud begins to reach the Earth and darkening of the
skies.
June 18-20 1st impact
June 24-25 2nd impact
June 27-28 3rd impact of the "anomaly"
Now for the coincidences. The first is stock market site article
http://www.urbansurvival.com/week.htm that talks about something I had
posted on my last email to you about an intercepted transmission from
Ham operators about something that is supposed to hit earth in June.
It was called: Is "Snowball" A Coincidence?

Here is an interesting article I pulled just a few days ago. These
fireballs have increased significantly over the last several weeks and
are happening EVERYWHERE.

Fireball Near Grover´s Mill, N.J.

Startled New Jersey residents tied-up the phone lines late this
evening calling authorities to report a large orange fireball that
passed over the town and apparently hit the ground several miles west
of Grover´s MIll. No reports of fires or injuries from the area have
been made, but locals expressed concern that the unknown phenomena had
made a rumbling noise when it passed over that was strong enough to
rattle windows and frighten pets.

"I thought a jet was coming down right in the street," said Betty
Ocker, a housewife in Grover´s Mill, "it was loud, and I mean really
loud."

Police have asked residents to clear up the telephone lines and use
them only for emergency purposes until things get worked out, said a
town spokesperson. Apparently the local districts received so many
calls after the meteor passed overhead that the lines jammed and they
have been unable to handle normal calls for police assistance.

Local fire teams were dispatched to the woods west of town to make
sure that no fires were started by the space rock, but none of them
have reported finding anything as yet.

Here was a comment from someone on the same "Aussie Bloke" thread
making comments about what was being discussed (too many coincidences
going on to not believe that something is coming from the heavens and
will reach us soon)

I am an historian from the border region of Austria with some
background in the diplomatic corps, 65 years old and now semi-retired.

I have heard about the ´Aussie Bloke´ postings from a young relative
of my family and what I have read has struck a chord in me. In short,
there are things happening at a diplomatic level in Europe that point
to a major catastrophe within weeks, if not days.

RE: Emergency planning, naval and military mobilization

Yes, this is indeed something I wanted to highlight, although I am
aware that some aspects of the naval mobilization are now in the
public news domain.

What you are seeing here is only the tip of the iceberg in terms of a
longer and finely coordinated military posture that is being
coordinated in tandem with confidential inter-governmental briefings
taking place under the auspices of Swiss officials in Geneva.

Signs abound. There is a certain sub-strata of the civil service in
London that, together with senior emergency planning officers, has
been evacuated from its headquarters in the British capital. This took
place very recently.

Many US military bases outside of home territory that were falling
into disuse have been frantically refurbished and restocked over the
last 18 months, and one must ask oneself why this is happening. The
standard reason given for these unprecedented upgrades is
´preparedness´ in the
so-called war on terrorism.

The United States military infrastructure is actually quite widely
dispersed; a catastrophe affecting the land mass of North America
alone would therefore not imperil the operational integrity of the US
High Command. The same principle applies to American financial and
economic instruments deployed ´in expatriate´: instruments largely
inured against an anticipated collapse of the domestic banking and
credit markets.

I found this gentleman's writings on projected meteor impacts rather
interesting, as his predicted dates of arrival dovetail rather neatly
with the current and future logistics pertaining to premium shipping
lines, the navies of several large nations, military contingents and
the movements of elite personnel.

The nation most advanced in this field of planning is Switzerland,
where many in senior positions, especially in the security and medical
professions, have been put on Stufe 2 since the beginning of April
2004. Even during the Cold War, most memorably the Cuban Crisis, the
levels raised were hardly ever above Stufe 3.

I believe the levels in both Austria and Germany are lower. In the
case of the latter, this is on no account due to ignorance or poor
planning resources, but rather because of their concerns with secrecy
and forcing a run on resources. People in Germany - and I live on the
border, so I know - are becoming aware that something strange is
transpiring within the emergency planning regime, if only because
there has been extensive re-testing of the outdated airborne attack
warning sirens.

I still keep in touch with many friends and colleagues who work for
the diplomatic corps in Germany, Austria, Switzerland and the United
Kingdom, many of whom are currently spending an inordinate amount of
their residual time locked in emergency preparedness that goes way
beyond any threat that can be reasonably ascribed to terrorism.

Here is one that talks about some very strange things that the federal
reserve is doing which leads one to think they know something is about
to happen. I don't know what the heck they are talking about, but it
sounds like something quite disturbing is coming:
http://www.safehaven.com/article-1597.htm

"Let me just say from the outset that the Federal Reserve has
confirmed our Stock Market Crash forecast by raising the Money Supply
(M-3) by crisis proportions, up another 46.8 billion this past week.
What awful calamity do they see? Something is up. This is
unprecedented, unheard-of pre-catastrophe M-3 expansion. M-3 is up an
amount that we´ve never seen before without a crisis - $155 billion
over the past 4 weeks, a $2.0 trillion annualized pace, a 22.2 percent
annualized rate of growth!!! There must be a crisis of historic
proportions coming, and the Federal Reserve Bank of the United States
is making sure that there is enough liquidity in place to protect our
nation´s fragile financial system. The amazing thing is, the Fed´s
actions mean they know what is about to happen. They are aware of a
terrible, horrific imminent event. What could it be?

One can draw no other conclusion except that the Fed is acting
irresponsibly in its managing the money supply, in fulfilling its duty
to "maintain a stable currency." I reject the notion that the Fed is
acting irresponsibly. No, something is up, bigger than we have ever
seen in the history of the United States. Let me ramble. Perhaps they
simply see the ominous technical landscape we have been warning about
in recent issues, and are attempting to pull out all the stops to
avert the predicted crash. The recent rally in just about everything
is similar to 2003´s market behavior when the Fed pumped massive
amounts of liquidity into the system during the first half of the
year. This time seems different. The amount of liquidity is too large.
The Fed is deflating the value of the monetary base by a fifth! Why
are they willing to do this? Wisdom says something bad is up - big
time."

Yet another one which talks about the UK preparing for evacuations:
http://www.globalcontinuity.com/article/articleview/10265/1/30/

Lastly, did you know that just about every major countries navy's will
be at sea in June? Apparently, deep water is much more safe than
docking in shallow water if strong waves are blown inland. Here are
some comments from one of the forums along with some links for proof
of what is going on.

Just why is it that nearly our entire naval fleet, have unprecedented
orders to leave for the Oceans? AND, they aren't alone. At least parts
of Iran, Britain, Australia, China, France, India, Indonesia, Japan,
South Korea, Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Vietnam are going too. Makes me
want to find out where the British Navy is holing up these days. And
what of the Russians? hmmm.... Does anyone ever stay home and protect
their own borders anymore? Isn't that what they are supposed to be
doing? Something is very, very fishy here!"

Let's go through a list of which countries are putting navies to sea
for the month of June. Take the U.S. naval group's departure from San
Diego. What's the official story of the 6,000+ sailors leaving Monday?

(Norfolk) a local television station in Norfolk reports that a total
of seven carrier strike groups are putting to sea in June - which if
I'm not mistaken is an unprecedented move: "While the Navy won't say
where the seven carrier groups are going, the carriers not already
deployed are expected to be gone for only one to two months." Story
(RealPlayer needed) at
http://www.wavy.com/Global/story.asp?S=1902088&nav=23iiNU2h (England)
The British are also putting an unusual number of ships to sea during
June. http://www.navynews.co.uk/articles/2004/0405/0004052601.asp
Meantime, Channel 13 in Hampton Roads, VA reports in part that:

"Called "Exercise Blinding Storm" by the United States and "Exercise
Rapid Alliance" by the U.K., the training will involve about 30,000
troops from seven nations in exercises off and on the coast of North
Carolina. Dutch marines and French soldiers will take part, as well as
a Peruvian submarine and contingents from Germany and Canada. The
flotilla is expected to set sail Tuesday, with the two-week amphibious
exercise scheduled to begin June 10. The British landing platform dock
ship Albion has already arrived. It carried four Challenger II battle
tanks — the British equivalent of the U.S. M1-A1 Abrams tank. The
tanks will be sent ashore aboard the ship's new landing craft during
the exercise. The biggest British ship — the aircraft carrier
Invincible — also has docked with a crew of 1,050. "
http://www.wvec.com/sharedcontent/APStories/stories/D82SAKN80.html

Also look at this huge list of other recent deployments...

Carrier Group Leaves On Deployment
Ships Are Not Scheduled To Support Operations In Iraq
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/3339032/detail.html

HUGE NAVAL STRIKE GROUP IS DEPLOYED! Western Pacific
(1) Aircraft carrier Stennis (CSG)
(2) Guided-missile cruiser USS Lake Champlain (CG 57)
(3) Burke-class destroyer USS Howard (DDG 83)
(4) Guided-missile frigate USS Ford (FFG 54)
(5) Fast-attack submarine USS Salt Lake City (SSN 716)
(6) Replenishment ship USNS Rainier (T-AOE 7) Also
(7) amphibious assault ship Belleau Wood
(8) amphibious transport dock ship Denver
(9) amphibious transport dock ships Comstock
(10-11) Burke-class guided missile destroyers Preble and Hopper --
will depart next month.
(12) USS Tucson Departs on Western Pacific Deployment
(13) Arleigh Burke-class guided-missile destroyer USS Russell

Also: USS McCampbell (DDG 85) departed May 5 for its first
deployment. The ship and its crew are headed to Southeast Asia in
support of a Cooperation Afloat Readiness and Training (CARAT) cruise.
McCampbell will be conducting joint naval exercises with the countries
of Singapore, Thailand, Brunei, Malaysia and the Philippines.

Also: Twenty Royal Navy ships, led by HMS Invincible, are heading
off to take part in the exercise called Rapid Alliance, which is
taking place off the eastern seaboard of the United States.

Article: Marines Take off for Naval Exercise with U.S.

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=2918574

Mediterranean Sea Surface Strike Group deployment:
(14) Guided-missile destroyer USS Ramage (DDG 61)
(15) Guided-missile destroyer USS Ross (DDG 71),
(16) Guided-missile frigate USS Elrod (FFG 55)

USS John C. Stennis Strike Group Deploys for Pacific Operations:
Navy-Marine strike group leaves on 6-month deployment:
More than 5,000 sailors and Marines with the Belleau Wood
Expeditionary Strike Group will leave San Diego Thursday for
a six-month deployment in support of the war on terrorism
The amphibious assault ship Belleau Wood and the amphibious
transport dock ships Denver and Comstock will depart from 32nd
Street Naval Station beginning at 8:30 a.m. Thursday. "It is the
first time an expeditionary strike group will be commanded by a Marine
general, according to the Navy.
http://www.nctimes.com/articles/

2004/05/27/military/20_54_265_26_04.txt

"The Army begins a major staging operation today at the port to ship
equipment to southwest Asia." Article: Army to ship vehicles overseas
via Olympia:
http://www.theolympian.com/home/news/20040520/topstories/54346.shtml

Official explanation: Strike Group Deploys Early To Help Quell
Insurgency "The plan was developed to train naval forces for quick
response to crises and in support of national interests."
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/militaryconnection/3351632/detail.html

Ford heads to sea Frigate's crew departs for 4 months
http://www.heraldnet.com/stories/04/05/27/loc_ford001.cfm

USS Tucson Departs on Western Pacific Deployment
http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=13418

Surface Strike Group Ships Deploy From Norfolk
http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=13096

"coastal patrol ships Typhoon and Sirocco prepared to leave port at
the Little Creek Naval Amphibious Base Friday to relieve two sister
ships" http://home.hamptonroads.com/stories/story.cfm?story=69752&ran=237692

ROTA, Spain (NNS) -- USNS Patuxent (T-AO 201) accompanied patrol
boats USS Typhoon (PC 5) and USS Sirocco (PC 6) on their journey
across the Atlantic Ocean to Naval Station Rota, Spain, and arrived in
port with the two PCs May 12.
http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=13328

So, I have to ask, are all these things happening a coincidence, or
did Aussie Bloke provide us truthful information that the world as we
know it will not exist after June? I personally think its true, there
are just too many coincidences. Something is going on, and inbound
comets seem to be the likely thing causing this.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


In my time on earth I have seen Haileys commet go by, a meteor shower,
planetary line ups and now it seems another light show but Jesus told
us those thing will appear in the end times. The end times will
certainly come but it will be in ever increasing destructive
occurences beginning with the destruction of New York city and
culminating with the destruction of the world starting 7 years later
called the tribulation period.

As the below verse states, lift up your heads people of God because
your redemption draws near!





Luke 21:25-28 (NRSV)

25 "There will be signs in the sun, the moon, and the stars, and on
the earth distress among nations confused by the roaring of the sea
and the waves. 26 People will faint from fear and foreboding of what
is coming upon the world, for the powers of the heavens will be
shaken. 27 Then they will see ‘the Son of Man coming in a cloud' with
power and great glory. 28 Now when these things begin to take place,
stand up and raise your heads, because your redemption is drawing
near."
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Never anonymous Bud
2004-06-06 11:22:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
After 2 Weeks of visiting his family/saying goodbye, Aussie Bloke came
back and true to his word, posted on the 29th of May who he is. His
Aussie Bloke
5/29/2004
5:19 am EDT Re: Aussie Bloke Vol.#3
Ok...here it is. I AM DR GARTREL.
Actually, the REAL Dr. Gartrell KNOWS how to spell his own name,
this hoaxer doesn't.
--
The truth is out there,

but it's not interesting enough for most people.
'enry VIII
2004-06-06 17:57:04 UTC
Permalink
Very interesting "martus", will you be posting again on the 1st of July
2004?

Don't forget.

'enry VIII
Post by martus
After 2 Weeks of visiting his family/saying goodbye, Aussie Bloke came
back and true to his word, posted on the 29th of May who he is. His
Aussie Bloke
5/29/2004
5:19 am EDT Re: Aussie Bloke Vol.#3
RetroProphet
2004-06-06 22:35:20 UTC
Permalink
Grover's Mill, NJ, eh?
Man, first War of the Worlds and now this.
Scary place to live...
Post by martus
Here is an interesting article I pulled just a few days ago. These
fireballs have increased significantly over the last several weeks and
are happening EVERYWHERE.
Fireball Near GroverŽs Mill, N.J.
Startled New Jersey residents tied-up the phone lines late this
evening calling authorities to report a large orange fireball that
passed over the town and apparently hit the ground several miles west
of GroverŽs MIll. No reports of fires or injuries from the area have
been made, but locals expressed concern that the unknown phenomena had
made a rumbling noise when it passed over that was strong enough to
rattle windows and frighten pets.
martus
2004-06-03 13:33:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
God fills the universes and is in everything everywhere, the Father!
Mankind in comparison to God is less than the size of the smallest
particle of the smallest atom but God knows us personally and speaks
to us through God's Word who was made small enough not to destroy us
by that very same power of God, Jesus the Son of God, the voice of God
contained in the form of man.
The power of God to shape and change the bulk of God, the Father, to
the shape of The Word of God, the Son, is done by the Holy
Spirit(Michael and the angels that obey God).
There is only one God and God operates through God's Word and power in
creating!
Psa 139:5 You both precede and follow me.
You place your hand of blessing on my head.
6
Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
too great for me to know!


7
I can never escape from your spirit!
I can never get away from your presence!
8
If I go up to heaven, you are there;
if I go down to the place of the dead,* you are there.
9
If I ride the wings of the morning,
if I dwell by the farthest oceans,
10
even there your hand will guide me,
and your strength will support me.
11
I could ask the darkness to hide me
and the light around me to become night-
12
but even in darkness I cannot hide from you.
To you the night shines as bright as day.
Darkness and light are both alike to you.






----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-05 08:22:07 UTC
Permalink
Rebbe With a Cause
Rabbi Shmuley Boteach


No Soul Left to Sell
We are indeed in a crisis of soullessness, says Rabbi Shmuley. But
there is a way back.


For many centuries Christians were warned that Satan would come to
them as a seducer and offer them the world's bounty—prosperity,
beauty, fame—in return for their immortal soul. This legend has
survived in modern America in the form of many films, novels, even
songs—remember ‘The Devil Went Down to Georgia'?—depicting Satan
promising untold riches in exchange for a soul.
In our age Satan need not bother. Who among us has a soul left to sell
anyway? America, the greatest country ever founded, is today
foundering as its original ideals are eroded through a culture of
suffocating soullessness. Pope John Paul II's warning that America is
in danger of surrendering to a "soulless vision of life" is an
understatement. America, the only country in the world to have G-d
stamped on its money—not even the Vatican or Israel have it—is being
laid low by mind-numbing materialism, vapidity, and vulgarity in a
culture that increasingly resembles a soulless corpse.

The Declaration of Independence affirms the dignity of every human
being and asserts their right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of
happiness.

But where is the dignity, and where are these rights, in modern-day
America? Is it dignity that we see when men eat bugs and women have
sex with complete strangers on reality TV as they lust for the
attention of the camera? Is it dignity we witness when young women—who
are paying tens of thousands of dollars to educate their minds—lift
their blouses for the "Girls Gone Wild" videos so that some vulgar
pornographer can become a millionaire? Is it dignity we witness in a
culture of serial dating among professional young men and women that
rarely culminates in commitment? How can we have forgotten even how to
fall in love?

And where is the second promise of the Declaration—liberty! Is it
liberty we witness today in a culture where we all feel imprisoned by
the latest need-to-see movie? Are we really free when we feel the
incarceration of working to the bone in order to keep up with the
Joneses, even as our children are neglected and raised by TV? Are we
really so free if we don't even have time to call on neighbors and
grandparents go unvisited while "Shrek" rakes in half a billion
dollars at the box office? Are teenagers today really free when they
seem so imprisoned by their hormones and slaves to peer pressure?

The soul allows us rise above the needs of the body. But is it
liberation of the body that is being exhibited in a culture where men
and women spend hours a week at the gym but rarely ever read a
wholesome book? Is it liberation that we witness in America among a
generation of individuals who have enough time to check every email
but not enough time to recite even a single daily prayer? It is
liberation that we feel in America as our hearts become smaller while
our cars become bigger?

Oh yes, the pursuit of happiness. Is it happiness that we see in
America today in a culture that boasts a 50 percent divorce rate? Can
we really speak of soulful celebration in a country where one out of
four Americans is on an antidepressant? Is it a celebration of life
that we are witnessing across America as shopping malls have replaced
parks for Sunday family outings, and the impulse purchase has replaced
churchgoing for a weekly feeling of satisfaction? If our kids are so
happy, why are they numbing themselves with marijuana and thrilling
their underdeveloped bodies with sex?

Children are the most spiritual of all creatures. But today they can't
wait to escape the soulfulness of childhood in pursuit of the
fleshiness of being yet another corrupt adult.

The Jews taught the world of the existence of G-d and alerted the
earth's inhabitants to the existence of a fragment of the divine that
lurks within each and every person. And that community held
steadfastly to G-d through torture and persecution for more than
two-thousand years. So why did so many decide to let go when they
finally experienced emancipation? Why are the Jewish community
centers—with their swimming pools, bowling alleys, and gyms—filled on
Sundays while the synagogues remain unfilled on Saturdays?

The great Martin Luther King Jr. brought nobility to the
African-American community by calling on the words of the Hebrew
prophets: Let justice flow like a river, and righteousness like a
mighty spring. Is that spirit of soulful majesty evident today in a
community that has allowed out-of-wedlock births to mushroom to over
60 percent? The black community invented soul music and liberated
their spirit, even while in chains, by singing the grand old
spirituals. But is it soulfulness that we are witnessing in this
music's successor, the rap culture, with its misogyny, deadly guns,
and thick gold chains?

Meanwhile, middle-class, suburbanites boast a TV in every bedroom, as
if what their kids really need is a celluloid stranger rather than Mom
and Dad reading them a bedtime story. Their kids get cars at 16, which
usually just speeds them down the road of expecting everything and
earning nothing. Parents have forgotten how work and effort are
themselves soulful.

Grapes need to be pressed in order to produce wine. But our kids are
like a different kind of grape: spoiled, and many don't know how to
treat even their own parents with respect. If all our children—of
every ethnic group and religious background—were conditioned to
understand that they had a spark of the divine within them, they would
be far less prone to wasting their lives.

Evangelical Christians and religious Catholics, whom I so admire,
exhibit a profound attachment to G-d and country that is rousing and
inspiring. But an attachment to G-d must breed a distinct humility.
Being in touch with one's soul must lead us to experience the soul of
the other and acknowledge the divine worth of every human being. So
homosexuality can be opposed. But homophobia has no place in religious
life. The right to life may be affirmed. But using any kind of
violence against those who perform an abortion is itself an abortion
of one's own soul, and an abomination against G-d's law. Yes, even we
religious people can experience a spiritual renewal in America.

The secret of recapturing soulfulness lies in recapturing the spirit
of sacrifice. Unlike the body, with its constant needs, the soul is
prepared to give up unimportant things in favor of important ones. One
of the places that we witness true soulfulness today is in the U.S.
military, where men and women give up lucrative jobs to serve, and
where courage inspires men and women to risk their lives so that
others might live. It is no coincidence that the U.S. military boasts
a disproportionately high number of men and women of deep religious
faith. Yes, they have to take orders from superiors, and yes, they
have to dress according to a strict regimen. But compared to us, they
are truly free because they are liberated from the most incarcerating
and soul-destroying cage of all: the prison of the ego.

We don't have to sign up for military duty to experience this soulful
rejuvenation. Rather, we need only put service before selfishness and
the interests of others on a par with our own.




----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
martus
2004-06-05 09:00:13 UTC
Permalink
Guess who's at super-secret Bilderberg meeting today
Italy hosts 50th-anniversary confab of mysterious society of world
leaders

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: June 4, 2004
1:00 a.m. Eastern



© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com

The 50th anniversary conference of the elite Bilderberg group – which
many believe conspires semi-annually to foster global government – is
under way in Stresa, Italy.

The conference, which began yesterday and will run through Sunday, is
being hosted at the Grand Hotel des Iles Borromees.

Since 1953, the Bilderberg group has convened government, business,
academic and journalistic representatives from the U.S., Canada and
Europe with the express purpose of exploring the future of the North
Atlantic community.

According to sources that have penetrated the high-security meetings
in the past, the Bilderberg meetings emphasize a globalist agenda and
promote the idea that the notion of national sovereignty is antiquated
and regressive.

'Shadowy aura'

"It's officially described as a private gathering," noted a BBC report
last year, "but with a guest list including the heads of European and
American corporations, political leaders and a few intellectuals, it's
one of the most influential organizations on the planet."

And according to a current BBC report on the conference in Stresa:
"Not a word of what is said at Bilderberg meetings can be breathed
outside. No reporters are invited in and while confidential minutes of
meetings are taken, names are not noted. The shadowy aura extends
further – the anonymous answerphone message, for example; the fact
that conference venues are kept secret. The group, which includes
luminaries such as Henry Kissinger and former UK chancellor Kenneth
Clarke, does not even have a website."

But, counter participants, the secrecy is not evidence of a grand
conspiracy, but only an opportunity to speak frankly with other world
leaders out of the limelight of press coverage and its inevitable
repercussions.

"There's absolutely nothing in it," argues the UK's Lord Denis Healey,
one of the four founders of Bilderberg. "We never sought to reach a
consensus on the big issues at Bilderberg," he told the BBC. "It's
simply a place for discussion."

Here is the partial guest list of the current meeting obtained by
WorldNetDaily – which includes Senators John Edwards, D-N.C. and Jon
Corzine, D-N.J., Henry Kissinger, Richard Perle, Melinda Gates (wife
of



Bill Gates),





David Rockefeller, Timothy F. Geithner, president of the Federal
Reserve Bank of New York, Donald Graham, chairman and CEO of the
Washington Post Company, and even Ralph Reed, former head of the
Christian Coalition:


N - Auser, Svein - CEO, DnB NOR ASA; D - Ackermann, Josef - Chairman,
Group Executive Committee, Deutsche Bank AG; I - Ambrosetti, Alfredo -
Chairman, Abbrosetti Group; TR - Babacan, Ali - Minister of Economic
Affairs; P - Balsemao, Francisco Pinto - Chairman and CEO, IMPRESA,
SGPS, Former Prime Minister; ISR - Barnavie, Elie - Department of
General History, Tel-Aviv University; I - Benedetti, Rodolfo De - CEO,
CIR; I - Bernabe, Franco - Vice Chairman, Rothschild Europe; F -
Beytout, Nicolas - Editor In Chief, Les Echos; INT - Bolkestein, Frits
- Commissioner for the Internal Market, European Commission, former
leader of Dutch right wing Liberal Party VVD; USA - Boot, Max -
Neoconservative, Council on foreign Relations, Features Editor, Wall
Street Journal; CH - Borel, Daniel - Chairman, Logitech International
S.A.; I - Bortoli, Ferrucio de - CEO, RCS Libri; S - Brock, Gunnar -
CEO, Atlas Copco AB; GB - Browne, John - Group Chief Executive, BP
plc; NL - Burgmans, Antony - Chairman, Unilever NV; F - Camus,
Phillipe - CEO, European Aeronautic Defence and Space NV; I -
Caracciolo, Lucio - Director, Limes Geopolitical Review; F - Castries,
Henri de - Chairman, AXA Insurance; E - Cebrian, Juan Luis - CEO,
PRISA (Spanish language media company), former Chairman, International
Press Institute; TR - Cemal, Hasan - Senior Columnist, Milliyet
Newspaper; GB - Clarke, Kenneth - Member of Parliament (Con.), Deputy
Chairman, British American Tobacco; USA - Collins, Timothy C - MD and
CEO, Ripplewood Holdings LLC, Yale School of Management, Trilateral
Commission; USA - Corzine, Jon S. - Senator (D, New Jersey), Chairman
and CEO, Goldman Sachs; CH - Couchepin, Pascal - Former Swiss
President, Head of Home affairs Dept.; GR - David, George A. -
Chairman, Coca-Cola Hellenic Bottling Company SA; B - Dehaene,
Jean-Luc - Former Prime Minister, Mayor of Vilvoorde; TR - Dervis,
Kemal - Member of Parliament, former senior World bank official; GR -
Diamantopoulou, Anna - Member of Parliament, former European
Commissioner for Social Affairs; USA - Donilon, Thomas L -
Vice-President, Fannie Mae, Council on Foreign Relations; I - Draghi,
Mario - Vice Chairman and Managing Director, Goldman Sachs; USA -
Edwards, John - Senator (D. North Carolina), Democratic Presidential
Candidate; DK - Eldrup, Anders - Chairman, DONG gas company (becoming
privatised) A/S; DK - Federspiel, Ulrik - Ambassador to the USA; USA -
Feith, Douglas J. - Undersecretary for Policy, Department of Defense;
I - Galateri, Gabriele - Chairman, Mediobanca; USA - Gates, Melinda F.
- Co-Founder, Gates Foundation, wife of Bill Gates; USA - Geithner,
Timothy F. - President, Federal Reserve Bank of New York; I -
Giavazzi, Francesco - Professor of Economics, Bocconi University;
adviser, world bank and European Central bank; IRL - Gleeson, Dermot -
Chairman Allied Irish Bank Group (currently being investigated for
personal and corporate tax evasion); USA - Graham, Donald E. -
Chairman and CEO, Washington Post Company; USA - Haas, Richard N. -
President, Council on Foreign Relations, former Director of Policy and
Planning staff, State Department; NL - Halberstadt, Victor - Professor
of Economics, Leiden University; B - Hansen, Jean-Pierre - Chairman,
Suez Tractabel SA; S - Heikensten, Lars - Governor, Swedish Central
Bank; USA - Holbrooke, Richard C - Vice Chairman, Perseus, former
Director, Council on Foreign Relations, former Assistant Secretary of
State; USA - Hubbard, Allen B - President E&A Industries; USA -
Issacson, Walter - President and CEO, Aspen Institute; USA - Janow,
Merit L. - Professor, International Economic Law and International
Affairs, Columbia University; USA - Jordan, Vernon E. Senior Managing
Director, Lazard Freres & Co LLC; USA - Kagan, Robert - Senior
Associate, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace; GB - Kerr, John
- Director, Shell, Rio Tinto, Scottish American Investment Trust; USA
- Kissinger Henry A. - Chairman, Kissinger Associates Inc.; TR - Koc,
Mustafa V. - Chairman, Koc Holdings AS; NL - Koenders, Bert (AG) -
Member of Parliament, president, Parliamentary Network of the World
Bank; USA - Kovner, Bruce - Chairman Caxton Associates LLC, Chairman,
American Enterprise Institute; USA - Kravis, Henry R. - Founding
Partner, Kohlberg Kravis Roberts & Co., acquisitions financier; USA -
Kravis, Marie Josee - Senoir Fellow, Hudson Institute Inc.; FIN -
Lehtomaki, Paula - Minister of Foreigh Trade and Development; FIN -
Lipponen, Paavo - Speaker of Parliament; CHN - Long, Yongtu -
Secretary General, Boao forum for Asia; P - Lopes, Pedro M. Santana -
Mayor of Lisbon; USA - Luti, William J. - Deputy Under Secretary of
Defense for Near Eastern and South Asian Affairs; CDN - Lynch, Kevin
G. - Deputy Minister, Department of Finance; USA - Mathews, Jessica T.
- President, Carnegie Endowment for International War Peace; USA -
McDonough, William J. - Chairman and CEO, Public Company Accounting
Oversight Board, former president, Federal Reserve Bank of New York;
CDN - McKenna, Frank - Counsel, McInnes Cooper, former premier of New
Brunswick; I - Merlini, Cesare - Executive Vice Chairman, Council for
the United States and Italy, Council on Foreign Relations, former
director, Italian Institute for International Affairs; F - Montbrial,
Thierry de - President, French Institute of International Relations;
INT - Monti, Mario - Competition Commissioner, European Commission;
USA - Mundie, Craig J. - Chief Technical Officer, Advanced Strategies
and Policies, Microsoft Corporation; N - Myklebust, Egil - Chairman,
Scandinavian Airline System (SAS); D - Naas, Matthias - Deputy Editor,
Die Zeit; NL - Netherlands, HM Queen Beatrix; GB - Neville-Jones,
Pauline - Chairman, QuinetiQ (UK privatized military research/services
company), governor of the BBC, Chairman Information Assurance Advisory
Council, formar Chairman Joint Intelligence Committee, former Managing
Director NatWest Markets; USA - Nooyi, Indra K. - President and CEO,
PepsiCo Inc.; PL - Olechowski, Andrzej - Leader, Civic Platform; FIN -
Ollila, Jorma - Chairman, Nokia Corporation; INT - Padoa-Schioppa,
Tommaso - Director, European Central Bank; CY - Pantelides, Leonidas -
Ambassador to Greece; I - Passera, Corrado - CEO, Banca Intesa SpA;
USA - Perle, Richard N. - Resident Fellow, American Enterprise
Institute for Public Policy Research, former Likud policy adviser,
former chair Defence Policy Board, former co-chairman, Hollinger
Digital; B - Phillipe,


HRH Prince;



USA - Reed, Ralph E. - President, Century Strategies; CDN - Reisman,
Heather - President and CEO, Indigo Books and Music Inc.; I - Riotta,
Gianni - Editorialist, Corriere della Serra; USA - Rockefeller, David
- Member JP Morgan International Council, Chairman, Council of the
Americas; E - Riodriguez Inearte, Matias - Vice Chairman, Grupo
Santander; USA - Ross, Dennis B - Director, The Washington Institute
for Near East Policy; D - Sandschneider, Eberhard - Director, Research
Institute, German Society for Foreign Policy; I - Scaroni, Paolo -
CEO, Enel SpA; D - Schilly, Otto - Minister of the Interior; USA -
Schnabel, Rockwell A. - Ambassador to the EU; A - Scholten, Rudolf -
Director, Oesterreichische Kontrollbank AG; D - Schrempp, Jurgen E. -
Chairman, DaimlerChrysler AG; E - Serra Rexach, Eduardo - Head, Real
Institute Elcano; RUS - Shevtsova, Lilia - Senior Associate. Carnegie
Endowment for International Peace; PL - Sikora, Slawomir - President
and CEO, Citibank Handlowy; I - Siniscalo, Domenico - Director General
Ministry of the Economy; P - Socrates, Jose - Member of Parliament;
USA - Strmecki, Marin J. - Smith Richardson Foundation; B - Struye de
Swielande, Dominique - Permanant repressentative of Belguim, NATO; IRL
- Sutherland, Peter D. - Chairman, Goldman Sachs International,
Chairman, BP plc; USA - Thornton, John L. - Chairman, Brookings
Institution, Professor, Tsinghua University; I - Tremonti, Giulio -
Minister of Economy and Finance; INT - Trichet, Jean-Claude -
President, European Central Bank; I - Tronchetti Provera, Marco -
Chairman and CEO, Pirelli SpA; N - Underdal, Arild - Rector,
University of Oslo; CH - Vasella, Daniel L. - Chairman and CEO,
Novartis AG; NL - Veer, Jeroen van der - Chairman, Committee of
Managing Directors, Royal Dutch/Shell; GB - Verwaayen, Ben J. M. -
CEO, British Telecom; former director, Lucent Technologies; I - Visco,
Ignazio - Foriegn Affairs Manager, Banca D'Italia; INT - Vitorino,
Antonio M. - Justice and Home Affairs Commissioner, European Union;
INT - Vries, Gijs M. de - EU Counter Terrorism Co-ordinator; S -
Wallenberg, Jacob - Chairman, SEB investments (including biotech);
Chairman, W Capital Management AB; D - Weber, Jurgen - Chairman of the
Supervisory Board, Deutche Lufthansa AG; GB/USA - Weinberg, Peter -
CEO, Goldman Sachs International; NL - Wijers, Hans - Chairman,
AkzoNobel NV; D - Wissmann, Matthias - Member of Parliament; GB -
Wolf, Martin H. - Associate Editor/Economic Commentator, The Financial
Times; INT/USA - Wolfenson, James D. - President, The World Bank; RUS
- Yavlinsky, Grigory A. - Member of Parliament; USA - Yergin, Daniel -
Chairman, Cambridge Energy Research Associates; D - Zumwinkel, Llaus -
Chairman, Deutche Post Worldnet AG.

In addition, according to the Bilderberg.org website, two reporters
("rapporteurs") from the British publication The Economist will also
be attending: Gideon Rachman, Brussels correspondent, and Adrian D.
Wooldridge, the magazine's foreign correspondent.

That may afford slightly more transparency than in the past. In 1998,
British free-lance journalist Campbell Thomas attempted to cover the
conference in Turnberry, Scotland, for the Daily Mail. Thomas began by
seeking the opinions of neighbors to the secret meeting being held
nearby. One of those was a young woman who told him he was in the
hotel's staff quarters and should leave immediately, which he did. A
short while later, two local police officers arrested Thomas, who
reportedly remained in custody for eight hours.

British journalist Jon Ronson, who is the author of a book on
Bilderberg, had this to say: "I'm a sort of semi-conspiracy theorist
when it comes to Bilderberg because I think they wouldn't go to that
much trouble of having this incredibly expensive international
conference every year and they'd go to all this trouble to keep
themselves out of the press and be really secret and invite the
world's most powerful people if it was just a chat and a game of golf,
which is basically what they say it is. So I do think they have some
impact on world affairs."

Some observers are even speculating that President Bush will make an
appearance at this year's event, just as Bill Clinton did at the
group's 2000 meeting. By coincidence, it just happens that Bush will
be in Italy over the weekend …





----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Daniel 11:36-39 (DARBY)

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt
himself, and magnify himself above every god, and speak monstrous
things against the God of gods; and he shall prosper until the
indignation be accomplished: for that which is determined shall be
done. 37 And he will not regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire
of women; nor regard any god: for he will magnify himself above all.
38 And in his place will he honour the god of *fortresses; and a god
whom his fathers knew not will he honour with gold and silver, and
with precious stones and pleasant things.

39 And he will practise in the strongholds of fortresses with a
strange god: whoso acknowledgeth him will he increase with glory; and
he shall cause them to rule over the many, and shall divide the land
to them for a reward.

(*Strongholds/fortresses of power)
Post by martus
End
http://www.geocities.com/mart1963/
Besq
2004-06-07 01:33:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by martus
Guess who's at super-secret Bilderberg meeting today
Italy hosts 50th-anniversary confab of mysterious society of world
leaders
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
Post by martus
Posted: June 4, 2004
1:00 a.m. Eastern
© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com
The 50th anniversary conference of the elite Bilderberg group - which
many believe conspires semi-annually to foster global government - is
under way in Stresa, Italy.
The conference, which began yesterday and will run through Sunday, is
being hosted at the Grand Hotel des Iles Borromees.
Since 1953, the Bilderberg group has convened government, business,
academic and journalistic representatives from the U.S., Canada and
Europe with the express purpose of exploring the future of the North
Atlantic community.
According to sources that have penetrated the high-security meetings
in the past, the Bilderberg meetings emphasize a globalist agenda and
promote the idea that the notion of national sovereignty is antiquated
and regressive.
'Shadowy aura'
"It's officially described as a private gathering," noted a BBC report
last year, "but with a guest list including the heads of European and
American corporations, political leaders and a few intellectuals, it's
one of the most influential organizations on the planet."
"Not a word of what is said at Bilderberg meetings can be breathed
outside. No reporters are invited in and while confidential minutes of
meetings are taken, names are not noted. The shadowy aura extends
further - the anonymous answerphone message, for example; the fact
that conference venues are kept secret. The group, which includes
luminaries such as Henry Kissinger and former UK chancellor Kenneth
Clarke, does not even have a website."
But, counter participants, the secrecy is not evidence of a grand
conspiracy, but only an opportunity to speak frankly with other world
leaders out of the limelight of press coverage and its inevitable
repercussions.
"There's absolutely nothing in it," argues the UK's Lord Denis Healey,
one of the four founders of Bilderberg. "We never sought to reach a
consensus on the big issues at Bilderberg," he told the BBC. "It's
simply a place for discussion."
Here is the partial guest list of the current meeting obtained by
WorldNetDaily - which includes Senators John Edwards, D-N.C. and Jon
Corzine, D-N.J., Henry Kissinger, Richard Perle, Melinda Gates (wife
of
Bill Gates),
David Rockefeller, Timothy F. Geithner, president of the Federal
Reserve Bank of New York, Donald Graham, chairman and CEO of the
Washington Post Company, and even Ralph Reed, former head of the
N - Auser, Svein - CEO, DnB NOR ASA; D - Ackermann, Josef - Chairman,
Group Executive Committee, Deutsche Bank AG; I - Ambrosetti, Alfredo -
Chairman, Abbrosetti Group; TR - Babacan, Ali - Minister of Economic
Affairs; P - Balsemao, Francisco Pinto - Chairman and CEO, IMPRESA,
SGPS, Former Prime Minister; ISR - Barnavie, Elie - Department of
General History, Tel-Aviv University; I - Benedetti, Rodolfo De - CEO,
CIR; I - Bernabe, Franco - Vice Chairman, Rothschild Europe; F -
Beytout, Nicolas - Editor In Chief, Les Echos; INT - Bolkestein, Frits
- Commissioner for the Internal Market, European Commission, former
leader of Dutch right wing Liberal Party VVD; USA - Boot, Max -
Neoconservative, Council on foreign Relations, Features Editor, Wall
Street Journal; CH - Borel, Daniel - Chairman, Logitech International
S.A.; I - Bortoli, Ferrucio de - CEO, RCS Libri; S - Brock, Gunnar -
CEO, Atlas Copco AB; GB - Browne, John - Group Chief Executive, BP
plc; NL - Burgmans, Antony - Chairman, Unilever NV; F - Camus,
Phillipe - CEO, European Aeronautic Defence and Space NV; I -
Caracciolo, Lucio - Director, Limes Geopolitical Review; F - Castries,
Henri de - Chairman, AXA Insurance; E - Cebrian, Juan Luis - CEO,
PRISA (Spanish language media company), former Chairman, International
Press Institute; TR - Cemal, Hasan - Senior Columnist, Milliyet
Newspaper; GB - Clarke, Kenneth - Member of Parliament (Con.), Deputy
Chairman, British American Tobacco; USA - Collins, Timothy C - MD and
CEO, Ripplewood Holdings LLC, Yale School of Management, Trilateral
Commission; USA - Corzine, Jon S. - Senator (D, New Jersey), Chairman
and CEO, Goldman Sachs; CH - Couchepin, Pascal - Former Swiss
President, Head of Home affairs Dept.; GR - David, George A. -
Chairman, Coca-Cola Hellenic Bottling Company SA; B - Dehaene,
Jean-Luc - Former Prime Minister, Mayor of Vilvoorde; TR - Dervis,
Kemal - Member of Parliament, former senior World bank official; GR -
Diamantopoulou, Anna - Member of Parliament, former European
Commissioner for Social Affairs; USA - Donilon, Thomas L -
Vice-President, Fannie Mae, Council on Foreign Relations; I - Draghi,
Mario - Vice Chairman and Managing Director, Goldman Sachs; USA -
Edwards, John - Senator (D. North Carolina), Democratic Presidential
Candidate; DK - Eldrup, Anders - Chairman, DONG gas company (becoming
privatised) A/S; DK - Federspiel, Ulrik - Ambassador to the USA; USA -
Feith, Douglas J. - Undersecretary for Policy, Department of Defense;
I - Galateri, Gabriele - Chairman, Mediobanca; USA - Gates, Melinda F.
- Co-Founder, Gates Foundation, wife of Bill Gates; USA - Geithner,
Timothy F. - President, Federal Reserve Bank of New York; I -
Giavazzi, Francesco - Professor of Economics, Bocconi University;
adviser, world bank and European Central bank; IRL - Gleeson, Dermot -
Chairman Allied Irish Bank Group (currently being investigated for
personal and corporate tax evasion); USA - Graham, Donald E. -
Chairman and CEO, Washington Post Company; USA - Haas, Richard N. -
President, Council on Foreign Relations, former Director of Policy and
Planning staff, State Department; NL - Halberstadt, Victor - Professor
of Economics, Leiden University; B - Hansen, Jean-Pierre - Chairman,
Suez Tractabel SA; S - Heikensten, Lars - Governor, Swedish Central
Bank; USA - Holbrooke, Richard C - Vice Chairman, Perseus, former
Director, Council on Foreign Relations, former Assistant Secretary of
State; USA - Hubbard, Allen B - President E&A Industries; USA -
Issacson, Walter - President and CEO, Aspen Institute; USA - Janow,
Merit L. - Professor, International Economic Law and International
Affairs, Columbia University; USA - Jordan, Vernon E. Senior Managing
Director, Lazard Freres & Co LLC; USA - Kagan, Robert - Senior
Associate, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace; GB - Kerr, John
- Director, Shell, Rio Tinto, Scottish American Investment Trust; USA
- Kissinger Henry A. - Chairman, Kissinger Associates Inc.; TR - Koc,
Mustafa V. - Chairman, Koc Holdings AS; NL - Koenders, Bert (AG) -
Member of Parliament, president, Parliamentary Network of the World
Bank; USA - Kovner, Bruce - Chairman Caxton Associates LLC, Chairman,
American Enterprise Institute; USA - Kravis, Henry R. - Founding
Partner, Kohlberg Kravis Roberts & Co., acquisitions financier; USA -
Kravis, Marie Josee - Senoir Fellow, Hudson Institute Inc.; FIN -
Lehtomaki, Paula - Minister of Foreigh Trade and Development; FIN -
Lipponen, Paavo - Speaker of Parliament; CHN - Long, Yongtu -
Secretary General, Boao forum for Asia; P - Lopes, Pedro M. Santana -
Mayor of Lisbon; USA - Luti, William J. - Deputy Under Secretary of
Defense for Near Eastern and South Asian Affairs; CDN - Lynch, Kevin
G. - Deputy Minister, Department of Finance; USA - Mathews, Jessica T.
- President, Carnegie Endowment for International War Peace; USA -
McDonough, William J. - Chairman and CEO, Public Company Accounting
Oversight Board, former president, Federal Reserve Bank of New York;
CDN - McKenna, Frank - Counsel, McInnes Cooper, former premier of New
Brunswick; I - Merlini, Cesare - Executive Vice Chairman, Council for
the United States and Italy, Council on Foreign Relations, former
director, Italian Institute for International Affairs; F - Montbrial,
Thierry de - President, French Institute of International Relations;
INT - Monti, Mario - Competition Commissioner, European Commission;
USA - Mundie, Craig J. - Chief Technical Officer, Advanced Strategies
and Policies, Microsoft Corporation; N - Myklebust, Egil - Chairman,
Scandinavian Airline System (SAS); D - Naas, Matthias - Deputy Editor,
Die Zeit; NL - Netherlands, HM Queen Beatrix; GB - Neville-Jones,
Pauline - Chairman, QuinetiQ (UK privatized military research/services
company), governor of the BBC, Chairman Information Assurance Advisory
Council, formar Chairman Joint Intelligence Committee, former Managing
Director NatWest Markets; USA - Nooyi, Indra K. - President and CEO,
PepsiCo Inc.; PL - Olechowski, Andrzej - Leader, Civic Platform; FIN -
Ollila, Jorma - Chairman, Nokia Corporation; INT - Padoa-Schioppa,
Tommaso - Director, European Central Bank; CY - Pantelides, Leonidas -
Ambassador to Greece; I - Passera, Corrado - CEO, Banca Intesa SpA;
USA - Perle, Richard N. - Resident Fellow, American Enterprise
Institute for Public Policy Research, former Likud policy adviser,
former chair Defence Policy Board, former co-chairman, Hollinger
Digital; B - Phillipe,
HRH Prince;
USA - Reed, Ralph E. - President, Century Strategies; CDN - Reisman,
Heather - President and CEO, Indigo Books and Music Inc.; I - Riotta,
Gianni - Editorialist, Corriere della Serra; USA - Rockefeller, David
- Member JP Morgan International Council, Chairman, Council of the
Americas; E - Riodriguez Inearte, Matias - Vice Chairman, Grupo
Santander; USA - Ross, Dennis B - Director, The Washington Institute
for Near East Policy; D - Sandschneider, Eberhard - Director, Research
Institute, German Society for Foreign Policy; I - Scaroni, Paolo -
CEO, Enel SpA; D - Schilly, Otto - Minister of the Interior; USA -
Schnabel, Rockwell A. - Ambassador to the EU; A - Scholten, Rudolf -
Director, Oesterreichische Kontrollbank AG; D - Schrempp, Jurgen E. -
Chairman, DaimlerChrysler AG; E - Serra Rexach, Eduardo - Head, Real
Institute Elcano; RUS - Shevtsova, Lilia - Senior Associate. Carnegie
Endowment for International Peace; PL - Sikora, Slawomir - President
and CEO, Citibank Handlowy; I - Siniscalo, Domenico - Director General
Ministry of the Economy; P - Socrates, Jose - Member of Parliament;
USA - Strmecki, Marin J. - Smith Richardson Foundation; B - Struye de
Swielande, Dominique - Permanant repressentative of Belguim,