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  • Originally posted by Bret_Hart View Post
    Tony Khan needs to hire a marketing strategist,
    Wasn't this suppose to be their WrestleMania? It just doesn't really make much sense. Didn't really feel important. The four pillers kind of came out of nowhere none of the three challengers were really on a great run to even earn the shot. Elite vs Blackpool is a great match up but just doesn't feel that important. Also I feel the crowd reacts to the heels more than the elite who are suppose to be face.

    orange Cassidy deserves a nice reign but at the same time you got make him and underdog and believable character. Him running through a whole battle royal to retain isn't very realistic imo. Just booking everybody to be main eventers just doesn't let anybody stand out again. Totally agree they need a head of creative that'll put their foot down. Just idk who Khan could trust like that. I feel like even if he got a big name to do it if they disagree with him he'd probably just be like "man this guy is old and out of touch" and do things his way anyways because it's his show. I just don't think he understands the business yet like VKM but hopefully over time he'll get better

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    • Double or Nothing was good, but some weird booking decisions. A no sanctioned match usually ends a feud, and the ending to Cole vs Jericho was clear and decisive. Really is no point in continuing their feud, but since they are, Jericho should have won it so Cole could get his revenge later. Otherwise, there's really no point in the feud continuing.

      The main event was great, but the ending was anticlimactic. Take****a is a good wrestler, but the fans really don't care enough about him for the show to end with him turning heel. Fans can't really invest in these New Japan guys because they know they'll only show up sporadically. Just seem like a wasted opportunity to give to someone who will only be in AEW part time. They basically just ended a good PPV to build up to their next PPV, which is fine but I think should have just ended it with MJF and the pillars match.

      Wardlow vs. Christian was a really good match, but it was just too predictable that Wardlow would win. Same with FTR, MJF, and Cargill winning, but Kris Statlander coming back to beat Cargill was a nice touch and unexpected.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
        ...The reason Verne didn’t get the NWA title had more to do with the promoters and there being heat because they saw him as taking money out of their pocket. Due to him being popular on Chicago tv and setting himself up as United States champion, essentially acting as a sort of competitor to their heavyweight champion in certain regions of the country. ...
        I don't believe that for a minute. Thesz and NWA President Sam Muchnick controlled that belt and did whatever they wanted with it. The NWA created the United States Heavyweight Championship (Chicago version) specifically for Gagne as a consolation prize, because they wouldn't give him a world championship run and wanted to placate him.

        Their shennanigans with the NWA title are infamous, i.e. the Nomellini and Carpentier scandals. President Muchnick would do whatever he could to get his pound of flesh or, more accurately, his 2% of the gate for the champ's appearance.

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        • Originally posted by $Bullsfam$ View Post

          Wasn't this suppose to be their WrestleMania? It just doesn't really make much sense. Didn't really feel important. The four pillers kind of came out of nowhere none of the three challengers were really on a great run to even earn the shot. Elite vs Blackpool is a great match up but just doesn't feel that important. Also I feel the crowd reacts to the heels more than the elite who are suppose to be face.

          orange Cassidy deserves a nice reign but at the same time you got make him and underdog and believable character. Him running through a whole battle royal to retain isn't very realistic imo. Just booking everybody to be main eventers just doesn't let anybody stand out again. Totally agree they need a head of creative that'll put their foot down. Just idk who Khan could trust like that. I feel like even if he got a big name to do it if they disagree with him he'd probably just be like "man this guy is old and out of touch" and do things his way anyways because it's his show. I just don't think he understands the business yet like VKM but hopefully over time he'll get better
          Agreed on the booking point. And not sure about their Wrestlemania. I guess maybe. Or maybe the upcoming show in Wembley. Crowd probably liked Blackpool Combat Club because they're cooler and more badass. Plus they used to be faces, so there's that. I consider their real pillars to be definitely MJF is one of them. Other 3 IMO would have to be FTR, Britt Baker and maybe Omega. I know home grown is important, but at least 1 tag team should be included and 1 woman. If not, you could add Sammy Guevara. Or The Acclaimed. Might have also been why Elite used to be heels. Or the crowd not reacting strongly because they used to be heels and because of the backstage fight with Punk. Because even though Punk's a douche, some fans still sided with him for some reason.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Batko10 View Post

            I don't believe that for a minute. Thesz and NWA President Sam Muchnick controlled that belt and did whatever they wanted with it. The NWA created the United States Heavyweight Championship (Chicago version) specifically for Gagne as a consolation prize, because they wouldn't give him a world championship run and wanted to placate him.

            Their shennanigans with the NWA title are infamous, i.e. the Nomellini and Carpentier scandals. President Muchnick would do whatever he could to get his pound of flesh or, more accurately, his 2% of the gate for the champ's appearance.
            Wow, funny how history repeats itself. Speaking of percentages, The Fabulous Moolah always notoriously got huge percentages of most of the female wrestler's paydays when she was around to get her "pound of flesh." Because she was also married to the booker and managed them, she saw it as her booking fee. Word has it, amounts could sometimes be up to 40-50% before a female wrestler's check even arrived. And women were already paid much less than men. Even by the 80s, which had a boom in the business.

            Another way wrestling history repeats itself. We have Vincent K. McMahon, Paul "Triple H" Levesque controlling both the WWE and Universal title belts, keeping them on Joe "Roman Reigns" Anoa'i. First to give him a 1000 day reign and now reportedly to surpass the 4 year reign of Hulk Hogan, which is 1474 days. Doesn't even make sense as that's the WWE title and he's actually held the UNIVERSAL title for that long, so that record would be meaningless. According to Wikipedia, Roman's only held the WWE title for 421 days.

            Anyway, my point is that WWE promoters create a new World Heavyweight Championship as a consolation prize as well. One of the 2 wrestlers in the finals of this tournament, AJ Styles, even admitted as such because he knew it was a bunch of BS. Because even if they weren't on TV as much, champions at least would defend their title at house shows and later at pay per views and we wouldn't wait so many months to see a title defense. And just like with Gagne, this was done recently because the promoters knew they screwed up the booking of their most recent title match and tried to placate fans with a shiny new title. But we're not buying what they're selling. Just like Verne didn't back then. But Verne went off on his own and made the AWA World Title relevant. So maybe, if booked properly, Seth Rollins will make this new WWE World Heavyweight Title relevant as well.

            Batko10 Batko10 likes this.

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            • CLASSIC RIP OFFS OF THE 20TH CENTURY:

              LOU THESZ vs. LEO NOMELLINI NWA TITLE SWITCH SCAM

              In 1955 after 6 years of Thesz as champ some promoters wanted a change and were pushing for Buddy Rogers or Verne Gagne to get a title run. In a move to deny Rogers and Gagne well deserved title runs, Sam Muchnick engineered a split of the title between Lou Thesz and Leo Nomellini.

              The scheme was to have Thesz lose the title under dubious circumstances and then for a period of time bill both as World Champions. Then there would be a "title unification match" which Thesz would win. This killed two birds with one stone. It shook things up and ended the boredom of one champ for so many years. Secondly, it would put a lot of extra $$$ in the pockets of the powers that be with two champs defending on the circuits.

              In San Francisco on March 22, 1955 Nomellini defeated Thesz in the third fall by disqualification. The NWA "protested" that the title couldn't change hands on a DQ, but the California State Athletic Commission recognized the title switch and Nomellini as champ.

              After that match Muchnick began booking both Thesz and Nomellini as World Champions. During that era the champ earned 12.5% of the gross gate. Out of that Muchnick, as NWA president, took 2.5% of the gross gate which came out of the champion's cut and left the champ with 10%. With both Thesz and Nomellini defending as champs Muchnick was collecting 2.5% of each ones gate and cleaning up BIG TIME!

              Three and a half months later on July 15, 1955 Thesz defeated Nomellini in St. Louis in a title reunification match and they ended the scheme before anyone could get wind of what was really going on.

              Last edited by Batko10; 05-29-2023, 11:57 AM.

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              • Originally posted by Batko10 View Post

                I don't believe that for a minute. Thesz and NWA President Sam Muchnick controlled that belt and did whatever they wanted with it. The NWA created the United States Heavyweight Championship (Chicago version) specifically for Gagne as a consolation prize, because they wouldn't give him a world championship run and wanted to placate him.

                Their shennanigans with the NWA title are infamous, i.e. the Nomellini and Carpentier scandals. President Muchnick would do whatever he could to get his pound of flesh or, more accurately, his 2% of the gate for the champ's appearance.
                Sam Muchnick called the shots ultimately. The promoters had the power then in wrestling, just like they do now in boxing.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Batko10 View Post
                  CLASSIC RIP OFFS OF THE 20TH CENTURY:

                  LOU THESZ vs. LEO NOMELLINI NWA TITLE SWITCH SCAM

                  In 1955 after 6 years of Thesz as champ some promoters wanted a change and were pushing for Buddy Rogers or Verne Gagne to get a title run. In a move to deny Rogers and Gagne well deserved title runs, Sam Muchnick engineered a split of the title between Lou Thesz and Leo Nomellini.

                  The scheme was to have Thesz lose the title under dubious circumstances and then for a period of time bill both as World Champions. Then there would be a "title unification match" which Thesz would win. This killed two birds with one stone. It shook things up and ended the boredom of one champ for so many years. Secondly, it would put a lot of extra $$$ in the pockets of the powers that be with two champs defending on the circuits.

                  In San Francisco on March 22, 1955 Nomellini defeated Thesz in the third fall by disqualification. The NWA "protested" that the title couldn't change hands on a DQ, but the California State Athletic Commission recognized the title switch and Nomellini as champ.

                  After that match Muchnick began booking both Thesz and Nomellini as World Champions. During that era the champ earned 12.5% of the gross gate. Out of that Muchnick, as NWA president, took 2.5% of the gross gate which came out of the champion's cut and left the champ with 10%. With both Thesz and Nomellini defending as champs Muchnick was collecting 2.5% of each ones gate and cleaning up BIG TIME!

                  Three and a half months later on July 15, 1955 Thesz defeated Nomellini in St. Louis in a title reunification match and they ended the scheme before anyone could get wind of what was really going on.

                  Yep. Just like the title splits in 2002 on WWE Raw. That was at least legit because two separate shows and brands, so 2 separate champs. Now they unified them last year, so they were left to invent another new title for the opposite brand after denying Cody Rhodes a title run. Just like how Rogers and Verne were denied back then. And Vince Mcmahon and Paul Levesque are just as petty as Sam Muchnick was. If WWE promoters pull the same crap, Cody should hit the road and find somewhere he'll get the much better booking he deserves. Just like Verne knew his value and walked away from Muchnick's BS. At some point, you gotta say "enough is enough, it's time for a change."
                  Batko10 Batko10 likes this.

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                  • Originally posted by Batko10 View Post

                    I don't believe that for a minute. Thesz and NWA President Sam Muchnick controlled that belt and did whatever they wanted with it. The NWA created the United States Heavyweight Championship (Chicago version) specifically for Gagne as a consolation prize, because they wouldn't give him a world championship run and wanted to placate him.

                    Their shennanigans with the NWA title are infamous, i.e. the Nomellini and Carpentier scandals. President Muchnick would do whatever he could to get his pound of flesh or, more accurately, his 2% of the gate for the champ's appearance.
                    Did you really stop watching wrestling in the early 60s? So what made you lose interest eventually?

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                    • Originally posted by Anthony342 View Post

                      Did you really stop watching wrestling in the early 60s? So what made you lose interest eventually?
                      Buddy retired due to angina in the Autumn of 1963. After he left I started to watch less and less. Then gramps passed in 1964. Together my grandfather I religiously watched the Thursday evening broadcast of "Capitol Wrestling From Washington, DC" with Ray Morgan on channel 5 (NYC) since 1958. When I say "religiously" I'm saying that next to attending Divine Liturgy every Sunday watching wrestling every Thursday was an unquestioned fact of life. LOL

                      I kept up on the game for a few years, but by the mid to late '60's I just dropped wrestling completely. When my son became a fan around 1998 I started to take him shows and we watched RAW and SMACKDOWN together on TV. Thanks to our state's governor being a former WWF wrestler, Vinny, Jr. brought in his troupe to the Xcel Center in Saint Paul (MN) quite frequently. In addition to attending WWF shows at the Xcel Center we saw WCW shows at the Target Center in Minneapolis.

                      They were all well done and quite spectacular. But in my opinion, the BEST shows were the Indies at the various Armories and small venues in the Twin Cities area. We got to meet and talk to wrestlers like Sean Devary, ODB, Horace the Psycho, etc. Also, we always had first row ringside which was GREAT. At one show in the Hastings (MN) Armory Mitch Paradise was thrown from the ring and landed on me. LOL He asked me if I was O.K. When I said I was fine he asked if he could borrow my chair. I said, "Sure." Then he took the chair into the ring and beat the hell out of his opponent with it! I LOVED the Indies! LOL

                      I'll close this post with a little story that confirms my belief that the "wrestling" in my day trumps the present day "sports entertainment." When he was about 12 and watching wrestling for a few years I asked my son if he would like to see my hero, Buddy Rogers, wrestle. He agreed and I put on a video tape of the ROGERS/O'CONNOR NWA title switch at Comiskey Park, Chicago on June 30, 1961. I figured that being brought up on Stone Cold, Taker, The Rock, and Kane he would get bored after 5 minutes. Keep in mind that I made sure he was well aware that wrestling was a work. I didn't want him to be a "true believer" like I was at his age.

                      Well, the kid sat through the entire 35 minute video without moving. When it was over he turned to me and said, "So, pop. In your day some of the matches were for real." Out of the mouths of babes...

                      FROM MY SON'S COLLECTION THAT I NOW "MANAGE." He's got a lot more action figures from WCW as well as WWF. I'll check for photos if there is any interest to see them.




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