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Latin isn’t used for prestige, it’s used because it’s a dead language, which is beneficial in official settings like academics and law etc…
Bingo. It's not 'evolving' as a language anymore because no one is speaking it as a native tongue so it's safe to use to set exact terminology.
It's also the basis for words that are used across many European languages. There's a good chance that someone from Europe will see a Latin word and understand it's general meaning no matter what European language they speak.
At one point it was the de facto language of Europe, sometimes de jure. It's the basis for some languages (Portuguese, Italian, et al) but I'd say that a good per cent of European languages have some Latin in them. Words such as Kaiser, Tzar, etcetera.
Most western and southern European languages (Portuguese, Spanish, French, Italian, Romanian, etc) are based on Latin due to being part of the former Roman Empire. Only Germany managed to escape Latinisation thanks to Arminius.
Fun Fact: Kaiser and Caesar are supposed to be pronounced the same way.
Nice
I see what you did there.
I love everything you’ve done here.
Sorry I don't speak Latin. What?
its
In the second instance of the word, you're right. I think people are downvoting because they think you meant the first word of the paragraph.
This only goes for French, Spanish and Italian
According to Wikipedia: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romance_languages
“The following is a list of groupings of Romance languages, with some languages and dialects chosen to exemplify each grouping. These groupings should not be interpreted as well-separated genetic clades in a tree model:
Ibero-Romance: Portuguese, Galician, Asturleonese/Mirandese, Spanish, Aragonese, Ladino;
Occitano-Romance: Catalan/Valencian, Occitan (lenga d'oc), Gascon (sometimes not considered part of Occitan);
Gallo-Romance: French/Oïl languages, Franco-Provençal (Arpitan);
Rhaeto-Romance: Romansh, Ladin, Friulian;
Gallo-Italic: Piedmontese, Ligurian, Lombard, Emilian, Romagnol;
Venetan (classification disputed);
Italo-Dalmatian: Italian (Tuscan, Corsican, Sassarese, Central Italian), Sicilian/Extreme Southern Italian, Neapolitan/Southern Italian, Dalmatian (extinct in 1898), Istriot;
Eastern Romance: Romanian, Aromanian, Megleno-Romanian, Istro-Romanian;
Sardinian: Campidanese, Logudorese”
Although, there is a common trend in fantasy media to use Latin as a 'magical language' where the spells are clearly derived from latin words.
So stuff like "Ignis", or "Igni", or "Incendio" all being spells that create fire, from different franchises. Or ancient curses being scribed in Latin (that the protagonist will read aloud for some reason).
That sort of thing can create a kind of odd reverence for Latin.
Or whole language of Alterans.
Really? Just the other day I heard a bunch of kids using “Alea iacta est” as a dis against someone’s mom.
Now i am curious how did they use it? It's meaning isnt a diss.
Yo momma so dumb, on January 6 she crossed the Potomac and said "alea iacta est".
wow, never thought about it like that, its like "the British national standard kilogram" platinum iridium alloy sphere they keep for reference.
But if dead languages are so damn useful, wouldn't that mean that new concepts in science, law and medicine get latin names instead of english ones? Which doesn't seem to be the case - except for when we already have existing english terms with latin or greek roots?
And why so many words with greek roots in the first place, as greek is still spoken and not a dead language? Maybe because ancient Greek was immensely popular in educated circles in centuries past, like Latin?
Latin isn’t exactly dead since it’s still the official language of Vatican, and neologism appear sometimes.
But it's not the ONLY language the Pope or anyone else at the Vatican speak. Native language and official language are slight but distinct differences. It's the official language because for whatever reason, Catholics have decided Latin is the language of God 🤷 go figure, it's not that old, but it will never change or evolve in the future. It's a dead language.
Mmmmmh…. No. The official languages are Italian and Latin. However, almost no one in the clergy outside of Italy speak Italian while almost all speak Latin. Of course, Latin isn’t their native language since one doesn’t belong to the clergy since birth and clergy members cannot have children.
Being the official language means that any official document is written in Latin. Of course, they are translated as well in other languages and you may find clergy member that don’t know Latin. This doesn’t mean that’s a dead language. Latin evolved during the centuries and what you usually refer mentioning it is the one of the Rome republic and first part of empire.
No one in the clergy believes that Latin is the language of God. It’s simply the fact that the Catholic Church started in Rome and it’s still there after thousands of years and they naturally spoke Latin since then.
that doesn't make sense to me. laws need to change as new information arises and language along with it.
Laws can change, but you don't want the meaning of an existing law to change by itself accidentally. You want legislators to change laws with intention, that's the whole point
And yet... it happens constantly
You would have to change the words to change the law. I'll give you an example using individual letters. We name the law "AB" "AB" will always mean "AB" because that language is dead and the meaning of the word will never change. Hundreds of years pass and people are calling on the reform of law "AB" because it's old and out dated and archaic. We decide that instead of "AB" the law should be changed to "AC". That doesn't change what "AB" means, it just changes the law to "AC" which means something else.
And yet lawyers will have no problems to know what AB exactly means in their profession, and that it has nothing to do with your muscled ABs from the fitness studio.
it was also a way for scientists to hide their science from religious nutbags
What's your basis for saying this? Anything to back that statement up?
Latin was used in the church and for virtually all academic work in Western Europe well past the Middle Ages. It remains as a relic of the past, associating today’s academia with the academic tradition of the past. It’s the same reason we have things like graduation robes.
Right? It's used because it was the historical lingua franca for law and science. It's still used because it's now an entrenched convention.
Absolutely! It is the literal lingua franca, the language of the Franks.
This is the only right answer here.
Surprised this is so far down.
Up until the 1960s all Catholics had to learn Latin. It was just easier to do everything in Latin, especially when the churches themselves were pushing a lot of scientific innovation.
No, it's used because it was historically used.
It was historically used because in Europe, it was a widely used language. If you named something in Latin or Greek then people all over Europe could use that word easily and without confusion. People used to communicate in Latin as we do now in English.
It's a relic. English is the language of science now.
Yes, English is the most common language for writing scientific papers etc. But since other languages are still obviously used in academia, like top commenter said it still holds a place in many fields of science, and law. That place is having a "dead" language to use for naming stuff, which won't favour one language (we would otherwise have competing English and French naming schemes in this area too), will be internationally understood, and unchanging.
For example in medical science using only English words for diseases and body parts can bring vagueness and inaccuracy...
in time when someone reads it 200 years from now
in translations, or someone just reading/listening it who understands the language as a 2nd language
Also the way Latin is structured is usually more descriprive in less words and characters than English, which is useful especially in medical science and healthcare, but also in other sciences.
So yes, part of it is the history, but I'd say a bigger part of it is just that it's simpler, easier and clearer to have internationally understood names for scientific things in a language that nobody speaks normally.
In the case of law, it has to do with the roman law being the source of most modern law systems, some concepts have not even changed since then, so changing the name is unnecessary.
"According to Roman law."
"Is there some other form of law, you wretched woman?"
Common law?
No? Latin was historically the language of education (which gave it prestige), and hence was used for all official matters, and that continues today. Latin being used in official matters has absolutely nothing to do with it being a dead language. This is a bad take.
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It’s because the definitions in Latin are static, so there’s much less chance of misunderstanding or things getting lost in translation.
As opposed to languages still in use that evolve over time.
Doubtful this is the reason for the use of Latin in science etc though. That just seems like a historical artifact.
It's because during the middle ages the Bible was exclusively in Latin. You wanted to become a biblical scholar you had to learn to read and write in Latin. Those same scholars were also doing the basic science of the era and writing about it also in Latin.
It's both. But it's also important to note that English is actually the dominant academic language at the moment. And before that it was French. Latin hasn't been the language of science (in the sense that it was what scientific texts were written in) since sometime in the 17th century.
Latin became the language of the Church, and by extension law and academia, some time in the 4th century. Vulgar Latin continued to develop into the Romance languages, but Classical Latin, with its matching written form became fixed in its grammar as declining literacy rates meant it gradually drifted away from the spoken Romance languages.
Eventually some time in the 7th or 8th century, Latin only existed as the language of the Church. This was out of tradition, but its fixed forms and grammar made it incredibly useful as an international legal or academic language, as it leaves little room for muddled interpretation, and most people from the middle ages who would deal in academia or law would almost certainly receive their education from or around the Church (at least as far as writing goes). This useful rigidity, as well as the fact Latin was used internationally, meant that it was quickly adopted by the many fields and disciplines of Western European science. Especially in medicine, where knowing what you're dealing with despite language barriers is incredibly important.
Carl von Linné just felt quirky idk.
Latin isn't used in science with any real frequency. The rare uses are just historical because Latin was the English of the enlightenment.
English is the language of science. It's wild to hear scientists in a language you don't speak talk about some topic because you still understand 1/3 of the words.
Its not used in science
It is beneficial because it doesn't change anymore.
lol you made this up
Also for a bit and a while, a couple hundred years, it was the lingua franca of upper class Europe. The same people who made up academia for a bit and a while.
Why is it beneficial?
It's a dead language, which means its meanings don't change; this is an extremely useful trait for terms of art, the actual important usages of Latin in law/science.
Oooh thx, that’s very interesting
Our interpretation of latin concepts change over time though.
There needed to be a separate language that not many people speak to represent concepts and terms across multiple disciplines.
Also Monty Python
It’s used in civil law systems since they are derived from the ius romanum. Instead, the common law is partially based on the Norman law, but was initially influenced by the clergy, that used Latin in all official matters.
Don’t forget that Latin was the common language of the whole Europe. An equivalent of what is now English.
Wouldn't the addition of new words on a regular basis that correspond to newpy discovered species make it not dead? I get that it's not spoken, but it isn't entirely inert.
The names we give new species for popular usage are made up, but the way we categorize new species phylogenetically is in Latin.
For example…we’re people and humans in common language, but we’re Homo sapiens sapiens from a strict scientific perspective.
I heard it's also incredibly logical, easy, and applicable for giving names to the never-ending complexity of the human anatomy.
TBF, so is common Greek.
Not so common after all huh, Greek
Meh. In my family they were telling jokes in Latin and I didn’t understand one of them.
Okay… but who killed it and why? What language is next? Should I be scared?
Also most western languages borrowed so much from latin, so even though few of us actually learned latin, we can usually still make sense of what many latin words mean without needing to translate anything.
For example, we know exactly what "aero port" and "multi media" mean, even if we've never taken a latin class.
latin is the language of justice
Citation needed, you're talking out of your ass
He's not; terms of art being defined in Latin is extremely useful.
Again, citation needed
It is also very precise. English, for example, can be highly ambiguous; whereas Latin is very specific.
How is it beneficial because it’s a dead language? Just you your native language
I’d like to add to all the other points that Greek also uses a different alphabet, so it’d be much harder for us to use and read, unless one actually studied Greek. Latin can easily be read and used by anyone and you only have to learn individual words to understand it.
Yeah, I know enough words and phrases that I can take a general meaning from many Latin bodies of texts. Like a Latin cloze test
Couldn't do the same for Greek. And half of that is because I know more Latin-based words in other languages than Greek-based by a mile
I couldn't even tell you a single thing about Greek grammar
Just as the Roman senators Justitianus Anus, Oculus Myopus and Fabius Fiscus intended.
It's not really difficult learning a different alphabet, especially Greek, most of the letters map to same or similar sounds. Also, we use greek letters all the time in equations, so many people already know half the alphabet already.
Yes, however it still requires extra effort and nobody outside of science would be able to read it. Knowing the symbols doesn’t really help with writing either, since you only know their names, not how to use them in a cohesive word.
I mean does "lex" look easier to learn or "νόμος"?
And Greek ended up in math.
Classical Latin and Medieval Latin are so different in their use of writing that they might as well be different alphabets.
I can read Classical Latin but not the original documents. Especially not for Medieval Latin with its millions of weird abbreviations.
The correspondence between greek alphabet and Latin one is almost one to one. I don’t know where are you from and which is your primary language, but unless you’re German I don’t think you will find Latin easy to learn due to declinations and conjugations that are almost non existent in English in comparison.
They often learned Greek as a second language. They still spoke Latin as a first language.
also highly depends what era where talking about. ofc some would of spoke greek at all points but highly depends on era
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