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User:Nemzag

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UTC+1 This user’s time zone is UTC+1.
Wikipedia:Babel
aln Ky përdorus e flet dialektin gegshqypës.
sq Gjuha amtare e këtij përdoruesi është shqipja.
fr-4 Cet utilisateur parle français à un niveau comparable à la langue maternelle.
en-3 This user can contribute with an advanced level of the English language.
nl-2 Deze gebruiker heeft een middelmatige kennis van het Nederlands.
it-2 Questo utente può contribuire con un livello intermedio di italiano.
es-1 Este usuario puede contribuir con un nivel básico de español.
la-2 Hic usor media latinitate contribuere potest.
grc-2 Ὅδε ὁ χρήστης δύναται συμβάλλεσθαι μετρίᾳ γνώσει τῆς ἀρχαίας ἑλληνικῆς.
el-1 Αυτός ο χρήστης μπορεί να συνεισφέρει σε βασικού επιπέδου ελληνικά.

Template:User phn-1

arc-1 ܗܢܐ ܡܦܠܚܢܐ ܝܕܥ ܫܘܬܣ̈ܐ ܕܠܫܢܐ ܐܪܡܝܐ.
he-1
משתמש זה מסוגל לתרום ברמה בסיסית של עברית.‏

Template:User syr-1

ar-2 هذا المستخدم يستطيع المساهمة بالعربية بمستوى متوسط.
fa-1 دانش فارسی این کاربر درسطح مبتدی است.
sa-2 एष उपयोजकः माध्यमिकेन संस्कृतेन लेखितुं शक्नोति।
rom-1 Kado jeno vakyarel e Romani chib tsira.
cu-1 Сь польѕевател҄ь глаголѥтъ словѣньскы зълѣ.
mk-1 Корисникот почетнички зборува македонски.
bg-1 Този потребител има начални познания по български език.
ru-1 Этот участник владеет русским языком на начальном уровне.
uk-1 Користувач може робити внесок українською мовою на початковому рівні.
sr-1 Овај корисник пос(ј)едује основно знање српског језика.
bs-1 Ovaj korisnik poznaje osnove bosanskog jezika.
hr-1 Ovaj suradnik posjeduje osnovno znanje hrvatskog jezika.
cs-1 Tento uživatel má základní znalosti češtiny.
tr-1 Bu kullanıcı Türkçeyi düşük düzeyde anlıyor.
ota-1 Bu zat-ı muhteremin Osmanlıca’ya vâkıf olma yolunda istidâdı vardır.
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Contents

Arrowë indicatë ðë ʒênêr‑ãl com‑pôsi‑ti‑ôn of their têrmë‑së, basë‑édë ônë [taô‑qôdêksë] ofë qrã‑ana‑graph‑ma

→⊕United Nations →⊕Organisation of Islamic Cooperation →⊕Europe 
→⊕Kosovo ←⊖Albania →⊕Republic of Macedonia ←⊖Greece →⊕Byzantine Empire
→⊕Tirana →⊕Skopje
→⊕Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia →⊕Bulgaria ←⊖Soviet Union ↔⊜Russia ↔⊜Commonwealth of Independent States ↔⊜Israel
↔⊜Iran ↔⊜India ↔⊜Pakistan ↔⊜Romani people
→⊜Morocco →⊜Algeria →⊜Egypt →⊜Qatar →⊜United Arab Emirates
↔⊜Kazakhstan ↔⊜Turkmenistan →⊖Turkey ↔⊜Ottoman Empire

→⊖Turkey ↔⊜Ottoman Empire
(Türkia safalsaʃa‑latinis‑édë سفل فلس فلش ههد scriptë :

  • Alɸaë [a æ] in Elfa [e ɛ ə] wið‑out ac‑qênθë قحنث :
    • E = (H)Épsilon – Ε ε – Ϩ ϩ ه [e h] (N°0.005.)
    • E = (Ħ)Êta – Ͱ ͱ – Η η ح [ħ ɛ] (N°0.008.)
    • E = (0)Ë‑katarjsθasë اْ [ə] (N°0.000. Nê‑vtrë‑ãlë.)
  • nôë Q ق ällë jnë K ك,
  • nôë Θ ث ällë jnë S س,
  • nôë Ʒ ژ ällë jnë ←⊖(GǏ)DƷË دژ Ϫ→⊕ƷDË ژدر جدر, ژژد ججد, ژدد جدد {in Ĩ‑slami‑c / Ã‑shalmi‑c Alqrãnic term’s},
  • nôë Ħ ح ällë jnë H ه,
  • nôë Ϧ خ [x] ällë jnë H ه,
  • nôë Ɣ ällë inë Ğ.

←⊖⊖⊖ Érronêusë هررعنح
←⊖⊖⊖ okʃë عكس
(toxic, toscar, tuscan, t’occidus)
←⊖⊕⊕ Ħêrufë حرف
←⊖⊖⊖ Hérupë هرڡ
→⊕⊕⊕ of
→⊕⊕⊕ Arãbuë ارأبۇ
→⊖⊖⊖ qqalë‑édë
←⊖⊖⊖ Ärapë عرپערף
{←⊖⊕⊖ θrêadë ثرحاد
{←⊖⊕⊖⊕ déθradë دثر رداءة هر déθérjôrë
{←⊖⊕⊖⊕ rë‑tardë tradë طرد
{→⊕⊖⊕ träpë طرعڡ
{←⊖⊖⊖ roptë رعڡط
{↔⊜⊜⊜ …

2016‑08‑10 ‒ 18H26 (UTC+1)
My Wikipedia profile page : Nemzag.
→⊖United States Canada ←⊖France →⊕Italy ↔⊜Portugal →⊕Spain →⊕South America ↔⊜Romania ↔⊜Roman Empire
←⊖Belgium →⊖Netherlands ←⊖Sweden ←⊖Denmark ←⊖England ←⊖Commonwealth of Nations ←⊖United Kingdom ←⊖Republic of Macedonia
(Dénuéshmäny : Johanssen Janssen Jessa (FRUSSUK) SS Johnson, mbyti qamosë qoʃmotos në vatamundunia, tê Zôθë :
- Sulfure - Clopixol (Lundbeck), Seroquel (Astra Zeneco neco Zênun Arifi Qrêgwë Crase),
- Fluor : Risperdal, Haloperidol (degrade, decerebrate, desynapsate),
- Chlore - Haldol, Debilify (Aripiprazol ערף {Wexham, SL3 6PJ, UK} DéféraSérpéntaGoni سهرڡ ܥܓܢܐܥܓܢܐ‬ Londoni لعندعنىِ ←⊖Θhérapy ←⊖RP Crape Mbrapë Néuroléptë أرم Mrapametën),
←⊖⊕⊖ Illegal Ãrma أرم Phãrmacia Kimi‑Gʰêmia‑Chimique (Article 5 UN & Geneva Convention about interdiction of chemical weapon) Ãrsénalë أرسهنال Nãrconecro نأركعنهقر Samôtrovë سامغطرعۋ Hélmë هلم)

Description / De‑ʃkri‑pθi‑unoë

HI,
ĦÊLLÔ - حللغ - חללע‬
I’M
NEMZAG - ΝΕΜΖΑΓ - НЕМЗАГ - نهمزاج
AN
AUTODIDACT / AVTO‑DI‑DAQΘE
AND
I
WANT
TO
CONTRIBUTE / CON‑TRIBUΘE
IN
WIKTIONARY
&
WIKIPEDIA
MAINLY
IN
MY
GEG - גֵגGEGNISHT / GEGONIST - ΓΕΓ‑ΩΝ‑ΙΣΤ‧ΗΣ [geg‑ɔn‑jʃθ]
GEGEI - ΓΈΓΕΙΟΣ
GEGON - ΓΕ‧ΓΟΝ‧ΟΣ - ججناث
OTƩALVARBUMÉNIÃNΘHË - عطشالۋربمنياني (Otman + Olm + Tavr + Alban + Arben + Orb + lumen + ruman)
DIALECT / DIA‑LÉGΘË
AND
IN
STANDARD[1]
TOSCAR
TUSCAN
ALBANIAN / ALBANI‑AN

BY
ADDING / AD‑DING
TERMS
&
ALTERNATIVE / AL‑TER‑NAΘIVE
FORMS / VORMS - ڤعرم

- TOSKË (toscanë, toscarë [n ⇒ ʀ])
- ARBËR‧ÊS (T.Als.) {Rhotacism / Motacism}
- ARBAN‧ÊS (G.Aln.) {Nutacism [nu‑θaqi‑ʃmë] / Mutacism [mu‑θaqi‑ʃmë]}
- ARWAN‧ITÊS - ΑΡΒΑΝΊΤΕΣ − ارواني
- ARNAWUDËارناود
- GHEG

FROM / VROM - ڤرعم
ANTIQUE,
MEDIEVAL
&
OTTOMAN - عثمان
ERA
…

I
WANT
ALSO
TO
ADD / AD‑D
SOME
VORDS
PRO
COMPARISON / COM‑PARI‑SON
IN
ETYMOLOGY / VET‑UMO‑LOGY
SECTION / SEC‑TIÔN
OF
THE / THË
SEVERAL / SE‑VÉR‑AL
LANGUAGES / LANGUAGË‑SË
THAT / TʰAT
I
LISTED / LISΘ‑ED
IN
MY
PAGES / PAGË‑SË
…

MOSTLY / MOSΘË‑LY
FROM / VROMË - ڤرعم
SEMITIC / ƩÊMIΘICË − ساميܫܝܡܝܐ‬ - ܫܝܡܝܐ‬ − שמיא‬
SANSKRIT / ƩAṂS‑KṚΘAË − संस्‑कृत
PERSIAN / PERFΘSIAN − 𐎱𐎠𐎼𐎿
SLAVIC / ƩÃLVUNIC − שַאלווּני‬
LATIN / LAΘINË
&
ANCIENT / ANCIENTË
→⊕⊕⊕ QRÊGWË[2] (ϘΡΑΥΓΉ)
←⊖⊖⊖ GRÊQWË
ORIGIN.

My compounded languages

MY
COMPOUNDED / COM‑POUND‑ED
MAZG‑ÉD {→⊕⊕⊕ JANGË (YANG)}
MIGS‑ÉD {←⊖⊖⊖ YINQË (YIN)}
MERG‑ÉD − ژرحمجد [ʒrɛmgd megdi medi m‑edi] (ماجد [maʒd] : Glorious, م‑جيد [m‑ʒjd] : Ameliorator, Improvator, Goodest.)
LANGUAGË : מזגננאם‬ − ܢܗܡܙܓ‬ - ܢܗܡܙܓ‬ − مزج نما ننم [nɛmzagda],

ISË
ÐË
QƩAKPÊMLOVERÊGUΘSINIΘIG [qʃakpɛmloverɛguθsin‧iθigə]
OR
KƩAPÊQMLOVERÊGUΘSINIΘIG [kʃapɛqmloverɛguθsin‧iθigə]…
IƩÉDARGFSË − ІШЕДАРГФСЪדרג‬ + הדר‬ + דרש‬  = שהדרג‬ − ܕܪܓ‬ + ܕܪܫ‬ = ܕܪܓܫ‬ − ܕܪܓ‬ + ܕܪܫ‬ = ܕܪܓܫ‬ - درج / رجد + درس = درجدس

Bab‑yl‑ôn

ΒΑΒ‑ΥΛ‑ΩΝ - بابإله - देववेदद्वार्
(deva‑veda‑dvār, “Door of Per‑fêqθ Ʒʒuodd Know‑Ledge”)
𒆍𒀭𒊏𒆠
(baba‑ale, “Gate of God”).

Who I’m

ƷAZMÊN‑DJËجازمحندي (Tosqë. Mêlikië. مالكي) - Ζ΄Α‑ΖΜΗΝ‑ΔͿƏ
GAZ‑MÉNIËجازمهندي (Gegë. Ħênunifië. حنفي‎) - ΓΑ‑ΖΜΕΝΙƏ - ГАЗ‑МЕН‑ДІ
AR - ار - אר‬ (Light, Gold)
ARÊFÊË − ΑΡΗΦΗ - АРИФИ - ܐܥܪܚܦܚܐ‬ - ܐܥܪܚܦܚܐARIFI − АРІФІ - أ‑ترفيشريفي عريفيأ‑رِفِعيأ‑رأف
(V)ARI - (Ϝ)ΑΡΙ - ܐܪܝܐ‬ − ܐܪܝܐ‬ - ארי‬ - वर
ARISTOCRAT / VARI‑ƩΘO‑QRÃΘË - ВАРІ‧ШѲО‑ҀРАѲЪ - ۋارىِ‑شثۆ‑قرأث
ARITHMETIC / VARI‑FMÊΘIGË - ВАРІ‧ФМИѲІГЪ
AVATɕARË - АВАЌАРЪ
AVA‑TƩARË - АВА‑ТШАР अव‑तार ‎(ava‑tāra)
ǏǏƩVËRË - ІІШВЪРЪ ईश्‑वर ‎(īś‑vara) − سوترا سورات ← إ‑شۋراث
IIƩ‧VËR‧AΘË (“ê‑levaθë to avstrue per‑ffêq‧θ‧ion” − ففائق ففاق and פקח ܦܩܚ)
VERIPH - ϜΕΡΙΦ‧ΟΣ,
VOROPH / VEREPH - ϜΟΡΟΦΗ / ϜΕΡΕΦΗ,
CORYPH - ϘΟΡΥΦ‧Η
=
ΑΕϜϘΟΦΙΡΥΦΟΕ‧ΟΣ − اهۋقعرفعهياܐܗܘ݂ܩܥܪܦܥܗܝܐ‬ − ܐܗܘ݂ܩܥܪܦܥܗܝܐ‬ − [aevqofirufoe‧os]
A‑OTƩPRORFOSA − ܐܥܬܫܦܘܪܦܥܣܐשפע[a‑tʃporfosa],
ZOT‧NI‧JA
&
ZOT‧RI‧JA
ZAOTARIܟܛܐܢܓܬ‬ − ܟܛܐܢܓܬ‬ − श्रोत्रिय,
VÉTÉ‧ËВѢТРЪ वातृ,
AUTOCEPHAL / AVTOɕÉPALË − ܐܰܘܛܳܘ‑ܩܦܰܠ‬ − ܐܰܘܛܳܘ‑ܩܦܰܠ‬
AUTOCRATE / AVTOQRÃΘË − ܐܰܘܛܳܘ‑ܩܪܰܛܳ‬ − ܐܰܘܛܳܘ‑ܩܪܰܛܳ‬
VETERUTH / VÉTÉRUΘIÔ − ܘܼܐܬܪܘܛ‬ − ܘܼܐܬܪܘܛ‬ (“véro + vété + truth”).

GAZIMÊNDOS - عظيم
ALARÊFSIO
AVRIQËDIVRÔ
ÆDÊS
QARM‧ÊNΘ‧IS
CUMÆ
გმირი ‎(gmiri)

GAZMANË − گازمان 
KARMANË − كارمان - कर्मन्
AQRMANΘË − اقرمآنث
ALË‑RÃFJOË − الرِفيع 
DAHRMANËدهرمان 
ZVARÃNSË‑TRÃNË − زۋارأنس‑طرأن
KARMA − कर्म
DʰARMA − धर्म
ϜΡΗΜΑΓΖΗΝΩΝΙΗ - رامگزنوني (“pro my father ZÊNUN”).
GAZIMÊNISË - ΓΑΖΙΜΗΝΙΣƏ
MÊN - ΜΉΝ / ΜΆΝ (“moon, lunatic”)
MÊNU - ΜΕΝΥ‧Ω
MEN - ΜΕΝ‧ΟΣमेने
MENOJNA - ΜΕΝ‧ΟΙΝ‧ΑΩ
GAZAË - جزاء - ܓܙܐ‬ − ܓܙܐ‬ 
GAZAPHYLACHT - ΓΑΖΑΦΥΛ‧ΑΧΤ‧Ο - ܣܩܠܪܐ‬ − ܣܩܠܪܐ‬
KLAR - ΚΛΗΡ‧ΟΣ - ܩܠܪܣ‬ − ܩܠܪܣ‬
QRÊGU - ϘΡΗΓΥ‧ΟΣ
QORUPH - ϘΟΡΥΦ‧Η
QORÊGUFA - ϘΟΡΗΓΥΦΑ‧ΟΣ©® 
KOLQARÊGUFA - ΚΟΛϘΑΡΗΓΥΦΑ‧ΟΣ©®.

Socials Medias

*FaceBook Pro‑file
*Ex‑Wiktionary‑Page
*My Pin‑ter‑ests

My models

AVÊTƩRÈNÉFΘ‧OS
TƩÊNG‧IS − طسسانجييس
KHAQANخاقانĦÊAQ‑QANAN حاق‑قانن (ĦAQ‧KING ĦACK QRAG‧KING)
AGA − آقا‎ أغا
AOABAUDDʰOA − أعاباوددعاءबौद्ध
ÐË
DÉRWIJIƩO − درويشع 
AOTƩVAPJRFAOË / AOTVƩAPJRFAOË - عثشۋڡيرفاع ۋڡيرܥܬ݁ܫܘ݂ܦ݁ܝܪܦ݂ܐܥ‬ − ܐܥܬ݁ܫܘ݂ܦ݁ܝܪܦ݂ܐܥ‬ (“əm‑ménse en‑rich‑mènθ”).

My beliefs


Ʒʒuddjusë − درجدسججود‎ درجدسجودد‎
M‑ÊƩ‑ƩÊNGË‑RË,
AJZGDË (GAZMENDË) − ܐܝܙܓܕܐ
TABULARË − ܛܒܠܪܐ (TAÔCODÊKS)
ƩLJϦË − شليخܫܠܝܚܐשליח‬ 
RSULË − رسولܪܣܘܠܐ [rʃul / rsul]
ALILEHË − الإله [al-ile]
NBJË − נביא‬ − ܢܒܝܐ‬ − نبي [nbije] [rsul al-ile nbije]
MESSAGER
DE
AL‑ILEH
=
OUTIL
MECANIQUE آلي [aali]
ALAË − آلة [ala]
ALTË − الت [alt] 
AVTO‑MAΘIQUE
ALIË − آلي [aːliː] 
DU
ĦAULΘ
على [ola]
DE‑SQÊNDUË
ILAË − إلى [iːla], pré‑fixë avant l’at‑tribuθ إائيل [ajil].
حجهۋارائيله حشملكهروبائي
ÔMÊLEKTRIQË − ΩΜΗΛΕΚΤΡΙϘΌΝ
KARUBJMË − ΚΕΡΥΒΑΙΙ − كاروبيمܟܪܘܒܐ‬ − כרוב‬
ΖΕΎΣ
ΗЃΕϜΡΕΪ‑ΊΛΗ − غبراء‑ائيل 
LË
PRO‑TEGΘ‧OR
TUT‧OR
DË
L’ADÊMÊTÊRRA-MARÉ
GAÏA.
SON
LIVRË
E‑SPRIT − ܣܦܪسفراءספר‬
&
MANUÊL
ÊƩÞË
L’AL‑ILÉ
QA’OVRĀNË − القاعۋرأنאלקאעורן‬
TʰÉORAH − تاوراةתאֵוֹרַה‬
PVRANA − پآورانىפֵאוּרַאן‬ − पुराण
VÉDA − वेद
OLA [ola]]
ALA [ɒla]ألعلى 
SONT
LES
DÉITÉS
DIVINES
AVASTRALE
D’EN
HAULΘ
(ϷΑΛ‧ΑΣ [ʃɑl·ɑs]
(ϷΑΛ‧ΗΝ‧Η [ʃɑl·ɛn·ɛ]द्यु
(BRILLANCËS
(DIUS / ديووس ديو
(DEUS
(DIU − दिव [dju]
(DEVA − देव,
(AUSSI
(NOMMÉ
(EN
(ORBITIEN − عربيث
(MALAJIKATH − ملائكات)
(AETHER).
ET
LES
ALI − آلة آلي
SONT
LES
DÉITÉS
DE‑SQÊNDUS − إلى [ila]
D’ICI
BAS (SHÊMERA).
ÃLĦÊ ألح
LË
MIRAGË − إلى آل 
(L’A‑QÊNS‧ION − ܣܘܠܩܐܡܰܣܩܳܢܐ‬
(DU
(PRO‑PHÊΘË − پرع‑فاتح 
(=
(VOYANΘ − عراف
(PORÊFË − پعراف [PORƐF]
(QOER‧AΘ‧OR
(المعراج‎ الإسراء و [ƐL-ˀISRAʔ WA ƐL-MORAG]
(פרוּפֶּא‬ − पित्र्य
(الإسراء [ƐL-ˀISRAʔ]
(LË
(VOYAGE
(NOCTURNE
(&
(المعارج‎ [ƐL-MOARG]
(LES
(VOIES
(D’A‑SQÊNS‧ION − ܣܘܠܳܩܐܡܰܣܩܳܢܐ‬.
ĨLÉ − إله (“god”)
ĨLAH − إله (“god”)
AOLAʔ − اعلاء (“elevation”)
AOLA − اعلی
OALIË − عالي 
OALAË − عالة
OLIAË − عليا 
OLA − علی 
ALITË − ٱلإت 
ILAΘË − آلات 
HÉLLAΘ − هلات 
ALAΘI − آلاتي‌ 
ALAH − آلة 
ALI − آلي 
IYAL‧AΘ − إِيَالَت 
VILAÏAΘ − ولایت 
WOLΘ-ÂGË − ولتاژ 
DAWL‧AΘ − دأولآت 
AL-VILAY‧AΘ − الوِلاَيَاتٌ 
L’ETAT − أل لٱتى [AL-LAΘA]
L’ALΘESSË
ULΘIMË,
LA
DÉESSE
UΘILË
HALTIالتی
MITËRL‧AΘ − مإترلات
IL‧AΘ − إلٱت
DAWL‧AΘ − دأولآت
AL‧AΘ − الت
ΜΟΎΣΑ
ἈΛΊΤΤΑ
ἈΛΙΛΆΤإلاهات ألهات,
DES − ائيل [ajˀɪl]
OVRANIANS − ΟΎΡΑΝΊΗΝعۋرأنياث [ovrɑ̃njɛn]
ἈΦΡΟΔΊΤΗاڡرعذیثهאפּרידיטה[aproðjθɛ]
ALILATH − ἈΛΙΛΆΤ / ἈΛΊΤΤΑאַפָּראוראניהאַפַלַוַדַתַה‬ − اللات‎  أورانيا آپريديته

ÃHÉVRAË − اهۋرا (AHÉVRA, “ZÔTË, GODË”)
HÉVAË − هۋا (HVA / ÉVA, “HÉAVÈNË / HEAVEN”)
Ã‑HÉVAÃË − أ‑هواء (A‑HVAA / A‑ÉVAA, “ÄLLÔVOË, AF‑FÊC‑ΘI‑ÔNË / ALLOVING, AFFECTION”)
ISË
ÐË
DWAAË − دۋاء (DÊWA, “RÈ‑MÉDY / REMEDY”),
دهۋاء أۋإدهۋراء / आविद्देववर (VIDÉVARA, “OƷDAGOË (ODG {{{2}}}‬ ) ISË PÊRË‑FÊQΘË / IS PERFECT”),
ΕϜΡ‧ΩΣ (VÉRÔSË or ÉVRÔS, “LOVE”),
ΕϜΡΙΤ‧ΙΟΝ
ΕϜΤΑΡ‧ΙΟΝ,
MÉDË − مَهَّدَ (“lévël‧ing, nivil‧ing, êqwal‧ing”) [medigwid]
M‑ÉDIJIË م‑هدی (“THE UNI‑FJCA‑TÊVRË GWIDË”) [medigwid]
ISH‑VAPARMAGFO ישע‬ (ISHWO, “SHALVAΘ‧ION”)
ΑΛ‑ΙΣΣΟΙ‧ΟΣ / אֱלִ‑ישָׁע‬ / ܐܶܠ‑ܝܫܰܥ‬ / ال‑يسع
OJƩA − [ojʃa] / OJSA [ojsa]عيسى ܥܝܣܰܐ‬
AL‑IƩOLIMA − אֱלִ‑ישָׁעלימא‬ / ال‑يسعليما [al‑isholjima].
TOLVOÊRUΘË
=
TOLÊRÔ
+
VERUS (TRUE)
LOVË
VROMF
ÐË
OLÉVÈNÉGZAODÉI − علهۋحنهجده.
∞ ‎(“THE ËN‑FIN‧ITË”).
QRAFMAΘE − ϘΡΑΦ‑ΜΑΤΕΎΣقرأקרממטאוס‬ − [qram·maθ·evs]
QRAPHE − ϘΡΑΦΕΎΣ [qraf·evs]
QRYBMENE − ϘΡΥΒΜΈΝΕΎΣ
ΜΝΗΜΟΝΕΎΣ [mnɛm·on·evs]
ΙϷΕΡΕΎΣישהר‧אוּסיראוס‬ − يشهر‧اوس  [jer·evs]
ΖΕΎΣΗזאוס‬ − 雷神 [z·evs]
ΠΕΡΣΕΎΣ [pers·evs]
ϜὈΡΦΕΎΣאורפיֵאוס[orf·evs]
ἈΧΙΛΛΕΎΣאַכילֵאוס ‬ −  [aqʰil·levs]
ΑΎΣΤΡΑΛΕΎΣאַוסטרַאלֵאוס[avs·tral·evs]
ΆΝΩΡΧΕΎΣ [anɔrqʰ·evs]
ΣΘΙΝΑΡΕΎΣ [ʃθin·ar·evs]
ΣΘΡΑΤΗΓΕΎΣאיסתרַטגֵאוס[ʃθraθ·ɛg·evs]
ΑΎΓΟΎΣΤΕΎΣאַוגוּסטֵאוס[avgovsθ·evs]
ϷΕΒΑΣΙΛΤΕΎΣ [ʃe·bas·ilθ·evs]
ΓΑΛΑΞΊΕΎΣ [galagzi·evs]
ἈΘΗΛΕΎΡΟΥΝΑΣΤΙΛΕΎΣ [atɛlevrunasθil·evs]
ΑΣΤΕΡΟ‑ΕΙΔΕΎΣאַסטֵרוֹאִידֵאוס[asθero·ejð·evs]
VÉDË − वेद ‎(veda)
DÉVË − देव ‎(deva)
ASTRA − अस्त्र ‎(astra)
ΜΕΤΈΩΡΟ‑ΛΟΓΕΎΣ − מֵטֵאוֹרֵאוס[meθ·eɔro·lug·evs]
PHONEUS − ΦΟΝΕΎΣ
Ë‑VIDÊEUS − Ά‑ϜΙΔΗΕΎΣ [ʰadɛ·evs]
ΔΊΕΎΣ
ΣΟΊΔΕΏΔΕΎΣ
स्वर्ण [ɳərʋsə↔səʋrəɳ]
اۋسثا اۋسعअवस्थ [avso avesθa (t̪ʰsəʋə↔əʋsət̪ʰ)]
AVSSË − אוסה[avsa]
ΑΎΤΕΎΣ [avθ·evs]
ΩΜΖΕΧΆϜΡΗΊΟΤΣΊΌΥΝΣΩΤΉΡΌΝ  אוּ’מזִאַכּאֶורִיסִטוּנִיֶסָתַארִסצתרה[ɔmzeqʰavrɛjoθsjunijɛsɔθɛr]
ΩΜ
+
ΏΧΡ‧Α
+
ΏΡΟΣ
+
ΧΡΥΣ‧ΌΝ
+
ΧΡΗΣΜ‧ΟΣ
+
ΧΡΙΣΤ‧ΌΝΧΣΑΡΤ‧ΌΝ
+
ΣΩΤΉΡ
+
ΖΕΎΣ
+
ΏΡ‧Α
+
ΧΆΡΩΝ


ΘΏΘΘΕ‧ƏΝ [tɛħuti te·uni ]
ϷΟϜΡΑΝ‧ƏΝ − ƩOVRAN‧US 𒌷𒀭 [ovr·ɛn·uni]
𒀭 | 天神
ΤΎΡΑΝΝ‧ƏΝ [θyr·ɛn·uni]
ΤΙΤΆΝ‧ƏΝ [θiθ·an·uni]
ΤΙΡΆΝ‧ƏΝ [θir·ɛn·uni]
ΘΡΌΝƏΝ [trun·uni]
SATORN‧ƏΝ [saθ·orn·uni]
ΣΕΤ‧ƏΝ [seθ·uni]
ϘΡΌΝ‧ƏΝ [qrun·uni]
ϘΟΡΏΝ‧ƏΝ [qorun·uni]
ϘΡΑΝ‧ƏΝ [qrɛn·uni]
ϘΟΡΩΝ‧ƏΝ [qorɔn·uni]
ϘΟΥΡΟΎΝ‧ƏΝ [qovruvn·uni]
QORNIQS [qor·niqs]
QORÞÊGS [qorθ·ɛgs]
QOR‑RÊGÞ‧ÔR [qor·rɛgθ·ɔr]
QŒRAÞ‧ÔR [qoer·aθ·ɔr]
QOJRAN‧ƏΝ [qojran·uni]
QARAN‧ƏΝ [qaran·uni]
QŒRULE‧VS [qajr·ul·evs]
QRÊGU‧VS [qrɛgu·us]
QORAGS − ϘΌΡΑΞ [qor·ags] 
RAWÊNरवण ‎(ravaṇa) [raw·ɛn]
DRONA − द्रोण ‎(droṇa) [droɳa]
RÊM‧ANرحمان [rɛm·an]
RUMANرومان [rum·an]
RUWÊ‧ANIروحان [ruwɛ·an]
VERAGS [vɛrɑ̃gs]
VORÔNغرابانܥܘ݂ܪܒܐ‬ − עורֵבּן‬ (ovrɛb‧an) [vorɔn]
VERÊN [ver·ɛn]
VERANÏÊ [veraɳɛ]
VERAN [ver·an]
VARAN [var·an]
VARUNÏË [ʋəruɳ]
QŒLESÞË [qoɛl·esθ]
ÊKKLÊSIAËܐܰܩܠܝܣܺܝܰܐ[ɛq·qles·ja]
SQÊÔË [sqɛ·ɔ]
SQULLËܣܶܩܠܐ[sqəl]
ƩKʰOLAשכל[sqol·a]
ƩQALAܫܰܩܶܠ[ʃqala]
ϷΕΛΛΗΝΊϘ‧Α [ʃellɛniqa]
СОҀОЛ [soq·ol] 
AQVILA [aqvil·a]
QOÊL [qo·ɛl]
ÊQWALISواليسحق [ɛq·wal·is]
KLEMÊNSكله [kle·mɛns]
KLAREÔ [klar·eɔ]
QLIMAÞ‧Ëܩܠܝܡܐ[qlim·aθ·us]
KYLARAÞ‧Ë [qyl·ar·aθ]
QÔLD‧Ë [qɔld]
ƷOLDËژعلد (“ar, avrum, or”) [ʒold]
QAÊLܩܰܠܶܣ[qa·ɛl]
KALVERN‧Aكالۋحرنة [kalvɛrn·a]
QRAN‧A [qran·a]
ÔQʰRAN‧A [ɔqʰr·an·a]
OVRAN‧Aعۋرأنةवरण (varaṇa) [ovrɑ̃n·a]
OVARI‧UMعۋرة [ov·um / ovarjum]
AV‧Ô [av·ɔ]
ΕΊΣ [ejs]
AVIS [avjs]
AVE [ave / awe]
OV‧Ô [ov·ɔ]
ΑΡΣΑΦΗΣآرأس
ΆΡΤΕΜΙΣ
ΕΡΜΉΣܐܰܪܡܝܣ‬
&
ΊΡΙΣ (“rainbow”),
ΈΡΩΣ (“love”)
ΙΕΡ‧ΌΣ (“sanctified, holy, sacred”)
ΏΡΟΣ (“Horus”)
ͶΑΡ‧ΗΣ (“war”)
&
ͶΈΡ‧ΙΣ (“discord”)
ΊΣΙΣ (“Isis”)
ΟΣΙΡΙΣ (“Osiris”)
ΙΕΡΕΎΣ (“priest”)
ΙΈΡΑΞ
ΙΕΡΈΑΣ (“clergyman”)
ΑΙΡΓΤ‧ΌΣ (“falcon, hawk”)
ΠΑΡΘΕΝ‧ΟΣ (“virgin”)
ΜΙΘΡ‧ΑΣ (“Mithras”)
ΜΗΤΕΡ‧ΕΣ (“mother”)
ΠΟΡ‧ΟΣ (“passage, way”)
ΘΟΗΡΙΣ (“Thoeris”)
ΑΤΑΡΓΑΤΙΣ (“passage, way”)
ΆΡΠΟ‑ϘΡΑΤΗΣ (“passage, way”)

Vrôm – Ʃrômë – Prômë – Rômfë

Belʒium
Pêlgium پلگيومبرژيوم
Otshwapulovarubégth عثواشڡولعۋاروبهجت,
Ruman רוּמַן / رومان,
lind
në
Scupi [ʃkupi]
(Shkupi / Сҁопје :
(Scipii
(Cornelii
(Covrênë
(Al-Ile
(Ovarium
September
1979,
Ʃɕyp‑ni‑alë (Qrêgwë. Gégë.)
and
S.P.Q.R
Shqipëri (Roman. Tosk.)
Ala
Iprimalea Im‑periala אמפריאלה, Per Me : Peri परी, Pari پری, Freya פריה, fury, fairy, fée, théa…
Mëgaheadinô مگاهدينه
Maggedunia מַאגֵהדוּנִיָה / щита читать चित ‎(cita)
चित्त ‎(citta)
इन्द्र ‎(indra) [rədni↔indrə]
رعدين [rodin] 雷電 ;
Për
unë|unê
e
prun
Peruni पुराना ‎(purānā)
प्रण ‎(praṇa)
प्राण ‎(prāṇa)
Ʒɛvosþ ‎(Ʒɛvosþ)
زأڤس Zevsê
فوزي [Fevzi / Fawzi]
le
Phaseur
Waleöla ואלהלה | والهالا
אַרגדינַאלֵה מִן עָדִין | جنات عدن | Arbogudin‑ali‑mên‑Odinë (Госъдарь Гоздару Господін قعدوس) :

Perpetual Student / Pérë‑pêθw‑alë Ʃθudë‑ênθë ‑ عطالۋاربانفثسيان :

ΚΈΡΒΕΡΟΣقربرومקרברום‬
− عقربעקרב‬
− ϘΑΡΑΝϒΣ قرنקרןΙΛΗ [ʰilɛ] :  Al‑Ilé − اللهאל’לה‬
→⊕⊕⊕ ϷἍΓͿƏ‑ΝƏ [ʃagjə·nə] : 
→⊕⊕⊕ ΛΕΓΙΏΝ [legi·ʰɔn] : 
→⊕⊖⊕ ΑΛΙΛΑΤ [alileθ] : 
→⊕⊕⊕ ϘΑ’ΟΎΡΑΝΌΝ [qa·ovr·an·un] : QAVRUANUNË − قآورآنونקאוראנון‬
↔⊙⊕⊕ Ə‑ΜΕΤ‑ΡƏ‑ΜƏ [ʰə·meθə·rə·nə] (mésô, mêns‑unô, →⊕méθô, ←⊖mênθô) : 
ΘΕΟΡΑΤƏ‑ΜƏ [teʰo·raθ·ə] : TʰÉORAΘON − تٱوراثونתאֵוֹראַטוֹןΗΠΟΎΡΑΝΙΣ [ɛpovr·an·is] :  OPUVARUNI − پآۋرونإهاפִאורוּנִי‬ 
ϘΥΒΕΡΝΏ [qyvern·ʰɔ] :  − أكبر
TƩÉVÊRIË
ΓΗΒΟΥΡΕΙΉΛ [gɛb·ovrej·ʰɛl] : ƷVÉDARUJÊLË − جابورائيلגיבּוּראל‬  
ΏΧΡΥΣΩΤΆΡΗΣ [ɔqʰrysɔt·ʰarɛs] :  − زراسطآرس
AL‑ÏUPAΘIR − اليوفإطر היוּפיטֵריוּפיטֵר[ju·fit·or
ΠΆΣΘƏ‑ϜΡƏ‑ΣƏ פָּסטוֹרָ[pasθə‑vrə]
ΠΑΤΡΙΏΤƏ‑ΣƏ פַּטרִיוֹט[pa·tri·orθ]
→⊕⊕⊕ TPALIRFSIË ⇔ ←⊖⊖⊖ ΦΙΛƏ‑ΠΑ‑ΤΡΙ‑ΣƏ
ΜͿΝƏ [mjn] : MJNË − منמִן‬
ƩOMALË [ʃomal] : − شماء שַׁמיםΖΕΎΣΗ [z·evs·ɛ] : 
→⊕⊕⊕ PARJFSÉË פאריפ׳ס‬ →⊕⊖⊕ ΠΕΡΊΦΑΣ [perʰif·as] : 
→⊕⊖⊕ ΖΉΝΩΝ [zʰɛnɔn] : ZÊNŨNË
→⊕⊕⊕ ΑΚΡΙΒΉΣ [aqrjbʰɛs]
→⊕⊕⊕ VRÉHË‑USË ⇔ →⊕⊖⊕ ϜΈΡΟΣ [ver·os]
→⊕⊕⊕ ƩAOJZÔNOSË - ΣΏΖΩΝ [sʰɔz·ɔn]
→⊕⊕⊕ ϘΟΡΆΓΩΝ [qorʰag·ɔn] פְּרוֹטֶסטוֹר [pro·teʃ·θ·or
→⊕⊕⊕ ϘΆΡΓΙΑ [qʰarg·ja]
ΙΈΡΑΓΩΝ [jerag·ɔn]
ΑΠΌ [apʰo]
→⊕⊕⊕ ΆΡΤΑΡΤƏ‑ΜƏ (Dajãnë.) [ʰarθ·arθ·un] טַרטַרוֹס [tarθs·tarθs·os
ΠΕΡΊ‑ΟΔƏ‑ΜƏ [perʰjoð·un]
Ο [o]
ΦΟΙΤΗΤΉΣ [fojθɛθ·ʰɛs] : AL‑TALJIB − التالب ה‑טליבּ‬
ΑΠΌ [apʰo] :  min − منמִן‬
ΘΡΗΣΚΕΊΑ [trɛsge·ja] : DÏNI − دينדת‬
ΤΟΥ [θu]
ΕΙΡΉΝΗ [ejrʰɛn·ɛ] : AL‑I‑ƩOLIIMAƏ − إسلامعيرانيאישׂלַם‬
ΕΙΡΗΝΦΩ [ejrɛnf·ɔ]
ΝΙΡΗΦΩ [nirɛf·ɔ]
ͰΗΚΑ͂ΤͶΑΛΗΝΑΘΕϨƏ‑ΣƏ [ħêkɑ̃twalɛθehə·sə]
→⊕⊖⊕ ϘΕΡΒΟ − قهربو[qerbo]
→⊕⊖⊕ ϘΡΑΝΟ − قرآن[qrano]
→⊕⊕⊕ ϘΡΑΒΟ − قرآب[qrabo]
→⊕⊕⊕ ϜΑΡΟΎΝΑ[[wikt:#Arabic|]][varuna]
→⊕⊕⊕ ΟϜΡΑΝƏ‑ΣƏآۋران[ovranən]
ϜΡΥΝΤΉ − ڤرونث[vronθɛ]
ϜΡΥΝΏ − ڤرون[vrun‑ɔ]
ϜΡΈΝΑ − [[wikt:#Arabic|]][vrena]
→⊕⊖⊖ ΝΕϜΡ‑ΏΝ − نهڤرغن[nevrɔn]
→⊕⊖⊖ ΝΕΡΟ − نهرو[nero]
→⊕⊖⊖ ΝΑΥΤΙΛΊΑ − [[wikt:#Arabic|]][navθilia]
ΝΑΥΣ − [[wikt:#Arabic|]][navs zevs divs vessɛl]

Sacred Language for the French Larousse / Shakrê‑édë Lêngwagë‑së vor dhë Vrêngʰ Laroussë :

01. Vedic‑Sanskrit (Hinduism)
02. Avestan (Zoroastrism)
03. Pali (Buddʰism)
04. Biblical or Ancient‑Obriti‑an (Jéhudai‑ʃm)
05. Ge’ez
06. Qranic‑Orbiti‑an (I‑ʃlam)
07. Bohairic & Coptic
08. Buzanthine‑Qrêgu

References

* Bab‑yl‑ôn Dic‑ti‑ôn‑ary
* Lingvo‑soft Dic‑ti‑ôn‑ary
* Qenshrin Syriac Onlinë Fr/Eng Dic‑ti‑ôn‑ary
* Spoken‑Sanskrit Onlinë Eng Dic‑ti‑ôn‑ary
* Sanskrit Onlinë Eng Dic‑ti‑ôn‑ary
* Wik‑ti‑ôn‑ary
* Dictionnaire Français-Albanais / Fjalor Shqip-Frengjisht, Vedat Kokona, Tiranë, 2002, ISBN 99927-726-4-6
* Fialuur i voghel Sccyp e ltinisct (Small Dictionary of Albanian and Latin), by P. Jak Junkut, 1895, Sckoder
* Albanian Etymological Dictionary, by Vladimir E Orel, 1998 (based on standard Tosk made by devaluting revolutionary communist, and not recognized by Academy of Sciences of Albania & the Gheg ethnicity…)
* Dictionnaire Français‑Macédonien Macédonien‑Français, by Marija Dameska, 2003, Shtip, ISBN 9989-884-14-5
* Dictionnaire Français‑Serbe Rečnik Srpskohrvatsko‑francuski, by Alksandar P. Perić, 1959, ISBN 
* Dictionnaire Le Grand Bailly Grec Français, by Anatole Bailly, Paris ISBN 201167939-7
* Dictionnaire Larousse Compact Plus Arabe‑Français, root 1888, by Daniel Reig, 2008, ISBN 978-2-03-584217-6
* Dictionnaire Gaffiot Latin‑Français

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It’s Magic.

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Writing Systems

ipa-3
ə
This user has an advanced understanding of the International Phonetic Alphabet.
Latn-N
t
This user has a native-like understanding of the Latin script.
Cyrs4
Ѭ
This user has a near complete understanding of the Early Cyrillic alphabet.
Cyrl4
Д
This user has a near complete understanding of the Cyrillic script.
Grek3
Ω
This user has an advanced understanding of the Greek alphabet.
Phnx3
Δ
This user has an advanced understanding of the Phoenician alphabet.
Arab3
ع
This user has an advanced understanding of the Arabic script.
Hebr3
ש
This user has an advanced understanding of the Hebrew alphabet.
Deva2
This user has an intermediate understanding of the Devanagari.
Hang2
This user has an intermediate understanding of the Hangul.
Hira2
This user has an intermediate understanding of the Hiragana.
Kana2
This user has an intermediate understanding of the Katakana.
Jpan1
This user has a basic understanding of the Japanese writing system.
Hani1
This user has a basic understanding of the Chinese characters.
Armn1
Թ
This user has a basic understanding of the Armenian alphabet.
Geor1
This user has a basic understanding of the Georgian scripts#Mkhedruli.
elder-2 This user has an intermediate understanding of the Elder Futhark.
Thai1
This user has a basic understanding of the Thai alphabet.
Egyp-0
Egyptian-A.PNG
This user has no understanding of the Egyptian hieroglyphs.
  1. Dictionnaire Le Grand Bailly Grec Français, by Anatole Bailly, Paris ISBN 201167939-7

2008

Arabic

Every entry you make is a huge mess for me to clean up. Either learn to do better or I will just delete everything you do. Start with جن. Its etymology is NOT from جنة. Most of the terms you put under Related terms are NOT related. And you have omitted the verb and other important senses. If you don’t know Arabic, stop messing with it. Before you do any other Arabic articles, you have to clean up جن, with a proper etymology, definitions, verb (including verb classes), and fix the Related terms. I spend so much time cleaning up after you that I can’t do anything else. —Stephen 20:48, 12 October 2008 (UTC) Sorry Guy

אנוס

Why are you not distinguishing between ‘anus’ and ‘inus’? —RuakhTALK 15:11, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

in fact, I use the http://www.babylon software to study & understand the books of god, some word don’t have diactritc in the program so I don’t know the real prononciation, so I add word in wiktionary, to know the ipa transcription i’m sorry if i’m not an expert, i’m a student… Nemzag 08:36, 15 October 2008 (UTC)
In that case, please stop adding Hebrew entries. If there’s a word you’d like to see an entry for, please add it to [[Wiktionary:Requested entries:Hebrew]]. —RuakhTALK 12:14, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

عبد

Obedient is an adjective, not a noun. SemperBlotto 21:59, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Reply to request

Ruakh says that he has blocked you for three days, and the reason is « Inserting false information: not responding to talk-page inquiries ». It would cause a big problem if I were to unblock you, but it’s only a short block. I believe he asked you a question here on your talk page and apparently you did not respond. When the block expires (Oct. 17), be sure to answer any questions about your contributions that are posed. —Stephen 20:32, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

I’ve unblocked now. I’m not sure why I went for a three-day block; one-day would have been more appropriate for a first block. —RuakhTALK 00:09, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Requested entries:Ancient Greek

I have reverted your edits, as they add nothing to the request process, and merely make the page more cluttered and less useful. While the letters you added did exist, they are basically never used in any request (because they were so incredibly rare in actual Ancient Greek). The numbers are not relevant to the request process. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 15:28, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

پری

Hi, could you give some more information about the definition of this word which you added, ‘fury’, since I haven’t heard of it. Are you sure it is accurate? Thanks. Kaixinguo 01:11, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I’m sure that the same entity : Fairy פֵּרי, Peri פֵרי, Pari-ka פַרי, Fury פֻּרי, if you know the key (Hebrew/Arab Numeral Alphabet Code), you will understand. All are fallen angels, Fury are Peri (Fallen angel, who avenge people that they protect, in greek they are called Ἐρινύες or Horae), that’s the same entity. It’s a pun. Those creature are coming from heaven.[1] [2] [3]
If you check image of Fairy (Phairy), Fury (Phury) & Peri, it’s the same, winged feminine creature, the symbol of wing, symbolise that these spirit are coming from heaven, it’s the same entity who incarnate them self on earth, called differently because of language and purpose. Nemzag 10:07, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
Right, I thought you meant ‘anger’ but I after seeing it capitalised on Wikipedia I recognise it now. Yet one is from Roman mythology and one is Iranian, therefore I don’t think this is an ideal translation. Kaixinguo 14:01, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
But it’s the same…
The same in what way? Do you mean one culture has borrowed it from the other? Kaixinguo 17:32, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
Yes Nemzag 18:20, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

Wiktionary:Requested entries:Latin

The Latin word you are looking for is deus, not « dius ». —EncycloPetey 20:24, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Dius (DIVS) exist, is my name, and it’s the name of Nemzag CAESAR DIMUNOS TYRANNOS, 20:40, 6 November 2008 (UTC) DEUS is the god upstair (Theos), DIUS is the incarnation of DEUS ΔΙΑΣ ΖΕΥΣ ΣΩΤΗΡ…
If it is your name, then it’s not a Latin word. —EncycloPetey 23:30, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

δαίμων

May I ask what your source is on this? All my sources imply that the word is connected to a verb related to « dividing/distributing, » and so I wasn’t expecting « shining. » Also, I couldn’t find the word you posted at Wiktionary:Requested entries:Ancient Greek, and have left a comment there. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 19:14, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

אלהים and Κάϊος

Please identify your source for the erroneous edits to these pages. You seem to be back-revising the meanings of early languages to suit some agenda. —EncycloPetey 23:29, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

Dictionary Babylon 7 & Livingston, אלה means goddess, אל means god, אלהים means androgynous goddesses.Nemzag 23:44, 13 November 2008 (UTC)
I’ve never heard of « Dictionary Babylon 7 », but Strong’s clearly gives the definition as plural masculine. The Hebrew « -im » ending is masculine only, as far as I know. Please refer to WT:ELE#Translations which says, in part: « NEVER use automatic translation software to generate translations. » Translation software seldom gives an accurate translation. —EncycloPetey 01:19, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
EP is right. The suffix ים (-im) is masculine plural, while the suffix ות (-ot) is feminine plural. This is not the first time mistakes have been made because of edits made to languages you are not familiar with. Please be more careful. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 01:27, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
Pedant that I am, I have to point out נשים (nashím, women); but yes, the word in question here is grammatically masculine (and semantically singular). —RuakhTALK 03:05, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
Ok, if Alehim אלהים is masculine, how do you say goddesses in hebrew ? I’m sure that אלה means goddess… What’s the difference between feminine plural ות (-ot) & ית (-it) ? Nemzag 10:30, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
First of all, the word you mention is not Ale[k]im, but Elo[k]im. It’s structurally the plural of Elo[k]a « G-d », not of ela « goddess ». (Elo[k]a and ela are spelled the same in defective spelling, but are pronounced differently.) Secondly, the plural indefinite of אלה (elá, goddess) is אלות (elót, goddesses), exactly as you’d expect; it’s a perfectly regular plural. (Since you didn’t expect it, you obviously don’t speak any Hebrew at all, and have no business editing Hebrew entries.) Thirdly, we have an entry for ־ות (-ót), which is fairly thorough if I do say so myself. We don’t have an entry for ־ית (-ít) yet; I’ll try to create one today, and then comment back here. (If I don’t create it within the next day or so, feel free to nudge me on my talk-page.) —RuakhTALK 12:43, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
O.K., I’ve created an entry for ־ית (-ít). I’m not sure if it’s complete; I included all the senses I could think of, but there are likely other senses that are also worth including. —RuakhTALK 17:38, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
אלהים is strange god/goddess, is transgenic or androgynous ? Gods or Goddesses or both ? —This unsigned comment was added by Nemzag (talkcontribs) at 09:56, 15 November 2008 (UTC).
I don’t really understand your question, sorry. —RuakhTALK 14:46, 15 November 2008 (UTC)
You don’t understand, me to, but it’s to late… —This unsigned comment was added by Nemzag (talkcontribs) at 23:35, 28 November 2008 (UTC).

Odd Ancient Greek requests

So, I can’t find Σγλάϝος (Sgláwos). I wonder if you might mean Σκλάβος (Sklábos). I considered the possibility that Σγλάϝος (Sgláwos) might be an alternative spelling, but Ancient Greek never follows a sigma with a gamma; it’s always a kappa. Additionally, as far as I can tell, Σκλάβος (Sklábos) doesn’t show up til Byzantine, in which case the digamma would have been long dead. So, I guess, in short, I’m confused. This is not the first time I’ve been puzzled by your requests, which seem to sometimes not only not exist, but could not have existed. So, I’m wondering if perhaps the source you’re taking some of these words from is not very reliable. Additionally, some of the words you’ve requested would have been found had you simply followed our standard orthography (i.e. don’t use all caps, we don’t do that here). I find it unlikely that you have a keyboard which can only do capitals. Finally, since I’m taking the time to investigate and, when possible, write these entries, I would appreciate it if you could get back to my questions about them. If you’re not willing to spend the time giving me feedback on this stuff, I’m not going to bother spending the time to look over your requests. Thanks. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 02:16, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

In fact, the Latin word of sclavus [sglawus] came from ancient root Σγλάϝος (Sgláwos), in the past the Gamma was pronounced [g], when they reform the Greek after Pyromanes Phôtomanes Empire, they changed the sound of gamma to [ɣ]. So I think that the real root of SCLAVVS is Σγλάϝος (Sgláwos) [sglawos]. Old Ellên book have been burned by Christian Judas (satan), so I’m sure that you will never find the real root of Latin words. C is Gamma. Exemple : cosmos root is not modern Greek κόσμος [kosmos] but ancient Ellên ΓΟΣΜΟΣ [gosmos]… —This unsigned comment was added by Nemzag (talkcontribs) at 10:36–10:43, 1 December 2008 (UTC).
Ok, that didn’t help at all. First of all, Σκλάβος (Sklábos) is not attested until the fifth century AD. A Latin word Sclavus is perfectly reasonably derived from Σκλάβος (Sklábos) as Latin v and Greek beta both went through a /β/ and /v/ phase (though I don’t know how they coincided temporally). Also, are you asserting that you’ve made Σγλάϝος (Sgláwos) up, based on some theory of yours? Unless you can point to a respectable source which backs up what you’re saying, it has no place here on Wiktionary. Oh, and κόσμος (kósmos) was never γόσμος (gósmos). It was always κόσμος (kósmos). –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 17:48, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Pronunciation

Query

I have replied on my page. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 19:56, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

Your reverting of more qualified editors is getting tiresome. Please desist. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 06:23, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

I have not undo I corrected ethymology but with removing attribute of Zeys (Sky Deity)… Nemzag 11:10, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

2009

Derr & Derdhe

Derr Etymology

Deviation of latin verres (boar) [wɛrres] to derr [dɛr], like versare (to pour) was deviated to derdhe [deɾðɛ]. Nemzag 13:28, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

A Word play, from universae [unɪversɛ] & verres [wɛrres], using the Persian word دهر (universe / door) to replace prefix vero, still this pun, is false because VERRES use W [wɛrres] and VERSE from VERTERE & VERAX RECTUS REX [verags rɛgθus rɛgs] use V. Gmazdên 10:11, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

Also if True is VERAX RÊCTUS RÊGULA RÊX ρήγας (rḗgas) [verags rɛgθus rɛgula rɛgs rɛgas] ВЕРЕН [verɛn] (VEREN [verɛn]) deviated in Germanic in WARA (True [vara] ; caution & attention [wara] !), some word like guarantor & guerissor would be correctly pronounced [ʒvarranθɔr] & [ʒverrɪssɔr]… Also War from Gwarra & Gwerro, writed in old latin GVARRA & GVERRO is related to VRÔ [urɔ], so the meaning of guerra & guerro is to burn / furn the Uêrres (URÔ VÊRRES [wɛr·res]). Gmazdên 09:12, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Qen, Çan, Çen

Etymology

From latin canis deviated to çan [ʧan] (still used in Xhakova, Kosova) then çen [ʧɛn] (still used in Macedunia Dialect) and reformed (1947) in albania by the communist power to qen [ʨɛn] . Nemzag 11:17, 01 February 2009 (UTC)

Lirë, Liber, Illyria

Lirë Etymology

(Can this(+) etymology be sourced?) Contraction of latin liber & Illyria. First prounounced lyrë then reformed to lirë.

Lirë Pronunciation

Lirë Noun

2009

  1. independent, unimpeded

Lirë Adjective

  1. cheap

njeri

What was that??? Clearly you have little understanding of Indo-European, if you think that *h₂nḗr gave Arabic anything. As far as I can tell, you have contributed next to nothing to this project. You bog down multiple request pages with droves of requests (and while I can’t speak for any other languages, the majority of the Ancient Greek requests were gibberish or misspelled). Nearly every mainspace edit you’ve ever made has been reverted. I’ve blocked you for a week, as I’m sick of checking all your contribs to make sure they’ve been reverted. If you’d like to contribute to this project, then I suggest you try listening to some of the feedback you’ve been getting. If you have questions, ask. If you are getting criticisms, try to find out what you’re doing wrong. Further edits along the lines of what you’ve done so far will result in a permanent block. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 03:30, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Njeri Etymology

From Proto-Indo-European *h₂nḗr, greek ΑΝΉΡ [anɛr / anir] & arab نِيَرْ [ɲær].

grc Request

I’m copying this here, as you might find it useful. All of the rest of your edits are being undone, and will be again should they reappear.

(copied from WT:RE:grc)

Zot, Zotëri

Hello, I’m nemzag, i created those entry i’m an albanian greek, orthodox pop and i’m sure of what I say please leave my add… Thanks

Yes, I know who you are. You add those etymologies before and we had to remove them. You have unconventional and unsupported ideas about etymologies, which is something that we do not like here. Please do not add any more etymologies here. —Stephen 23:55, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
Wiktionary is open to everyone, i know my language and my people more than other people and if i can explain is my right to express my self. Please be nice and accept others ideas & opinions.
We don’t allow w:original research. Even though you know your language, you must follow best practices and widely accepted standards. In the past you have tried to create links and entries to support unconventional ideas of etymology, especially in regard to Arabic and Hebrew. We have never allowed those kinds of contributions and you must avoid that kind of work. —Stephen 08:38, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

Do not add unsourced material

Please only include etymologies from academic (especially linguistic) sources. Thanks. Azaleapomp2 06:02, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Yes Nemzag, and also please refrain from fringe theories and original research whilst adding your sources. We must focus on the most current scholarship, and arrange theories by the level of acceptance in the linguistic community (usually in reverse chronological order). —Ivan Štambuk 07:14, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

With regards to the zot entry, please do not add unsourced material. All of the other etymologies have been sourced from academic materials. Thanks. Azaleapomp2 06:01, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Don’t need source just greek logic… Also some say that zotëri & zot in Albanian came from the Persian word Zaotor (Zût, Zot) Persian Zoroastrian Head Invoker Priest (source : [[1]] & [[2]]). Still the word connect to greek σωτήρ : savior (messia in hebrew), also called ώχρα χρυσός Χρισωτάρης ήλιοσωλαριστα (Chrisotarês), who is the head sacrificator priest of Zeys  : ιερεύς από Ζεύς (سر رأس رئيس زيوس), the zotëri, the Zaotar, श्रोत्रिय, the Sôtêr צתרה (Savior, Messiah Christ מוֹשִׁיעַ מָשִׁיחַ משה). So please leave my information… I’m an albanian from Macedonia, and Shqipëria is near greece, so a lot of word came from very ancient Creg orthodox Nemzag.

About your source vladimir orel is a Russian, not an albanian romanian persian, and the two others source are deutsch, both tryed to conquer albania in the second world war. So please, leave my information Nemzag 11:54, 11 November 2009 (UTC).
And all his explanation about Zotëri made by Azaleapomp2, are just inadequate, and useless Nemzag 12:40, 11 November 2009 (UTC)
Zotëri is Sôtêr (in greek) and have no etymology with Hindu Praja Pati, विश्पति (víś-páti), “‘lord of the house’”) जास्पति (jā́s-pati : “‘head of a family’), *desyās + *poti (“‘lord, master’”) *deywós (“‘skyling, deity’”) + *átta (“‘father’”), Praja Pati & Others are the roman Iupiter Dius (God of Earth Sky, because Ouranos / Varuna is the god of Universal Sky). Every body know that roman cult came from persian & hindu (aryan), because roma is a persian colony, made after the alexander & Darius / Xerxes war on greece, to take it from the west. Nemzag 19:35, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Please Nemzag no more of this fringecruft. Use reliable, peer-reviewed linguistic sources for etymologies or you’ll be blocked for pushing OR and PoV. —Ivan Štambuk 18:48, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

I understand but you are wrong, when somebody don’t agree with you, or don’t accord with your opinion, you block them, it’s not fair, and not democratic, for me is like dictatory. I explain my language, you never know better than me the origine of my people. A lot of people of my family are teacher. So please, leave my information.Nemzag 19:24, 11 November 2009 (UTC)
No, this is not a democracy but a dictatorship of logic and reason. Languages are not « owned » by people who speak them. If you persevere in in adding dubious etymologies you’ll be blocked. There is so much other useful things you could do here, please desist from making such contentious edits. —Ivan Štambuk 19:30, 11 November 2009 (UTC)
Ok, but understand, i agree about some information added by Azaleapomp2 about Zot, like live, life it’s related to greek ζων or ζῶ [zɔ], again is a name of ζήνων Ζεύς (ζέων ζέω ζήνων ζέση). Those information are true again σωτήρ [Sôtêr] is an epithet of Ζεύς. About the word zonjë, feminine form of Zot, is related to life ζων and arabo-persian زن [zɒn] who mean fornication زان [zæn]. The life. So Zotëri is the Sôtêr Zaotar priest of Life aka ζήνων Ζεύς ώχρυσωτάρης, god of thunder & lightning, who give life to machine, automate and animal cortex. Oki? Also in macedonia we say for a lady zojë. Nemzag 19:36, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

What do you mean with Macedonia? The province in Greece or FYROM? Neither Slavomacedonian nor Greek is written in Latin script, so zojë is not a valid spelling in either case. The uſer hight Bogorm converſation 21:10, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Aryan Romanian Albanian Shqiptar from FYROM Skopje, Shkupi : latin Scupi Nemzag 09:30, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
No, zotëri is a synchronic derivation from zotër, plural form of zot. It has absolutely nothing to do with the priesthood of fire or Ancient Greek deities. —Ivan Štambuk 19:37, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

So, how we do now ? About Zot, Zaotar, Sôtêr, life and Zeys ? Nemzag 19:42, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Here’s how: These have absolutely nothing to do with each other, so we don’t mention them. —Ivan Štambuk 19:54, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

I don’t understand that you leaved etymology so long time. Before that Azaleapomp2 remove my etymology information, i don’t wan’t to remove is add but just to leave my add.

Because nobody noticed that it was wrong. Hopefully with guys such as Azeleapomp here, we’ll eventually weed out all the nonsense on mythical Iranian/Aryan substratum in Balkanic languages. —Ivan Štambuk 20:21, 11 November 2009 (UTC)
Who is that Azaleapomp2, is he the all knowing guy from east deutschland & russia ? You are trying to remove our ancient god Nemzag 20:25, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

He is the knowledgeable dude :) Look Nemzag, I don’t want to discuss this any further. I hope you understood what I meant to say about non-reliable and non-scholarly sources – they’re not only unallowed, but are strongly discouraged and their continual pushing will result in sanctions for the fervent PoV fundamentalist. That « colonizer’s » type of scholarship is the only thing we’re truly interested in. Search on the Internet for Orel’s historical grammar of Albanian and Albanian etymological dictionary and try to obtain some real knowledge on your mother tongue without the layer of nationalist/religious mythology. That kind of information you’d be allowed add on Wiktionary. But no more of this Greek/Aryan deity stuff, please. —Ivan Štambuk 20:58, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

About what you said « No, zotëri is a synchronic derivation from zotër, plural form of zot. » isn’t true, in albanian, plural form masculine is « ËT » feminine is « AT » like arab/persian: derr & derrët, derra & derrat (door & doors درات), kerr & kerrët, kerra & kerrat (Car & cars), nënë & nënët, nëna & nënat (mother, mothers), babë & babët, baba & babat (father, fathers), Zot & zotët, zota & Zotat (deity & Deitys), zotëri & zotëriët, zotëria zotëriat (Lord, Savior & Lords Saviors), Zotëri is derivation of Sôtêr & Zaotar like kundër [qundəɾ] & qendër [ʨɛndəɾ] came from κόντρα [qontra] & κέντρο [qentro] (kund & qend didn’t exist in albanian the extension « ËR » is not plural form Read This (the only word I founded is Femër (sq : [femər] = meurt [mœr]) spelled Femnat ([femnat] mk & kosovo) (Women from latin FEMINA : p.95 of « Albanian Etymological Dictionary », « Orel Vladimir », also Zotëri is Tosk, Gheg use Zôtëni) ; same type of latin derivation exist in italian, spagnol & french, where the S became Z, K / G [g], G [g] / DƷ, D / T, phonetic deviation), Zotëria Shqipëria (« Feja Shqiptare është Shqiptaria »), also zotër didn’t exist in my dictionary (lingvosoft, babylon), zotëri, zotëroj, zotësi exist. 09:44, 12 November 2009 (UTC) (PS : Can you explain me how to add information about my knowledge in some language, like those you added in your user page ?)

Well, several dictionaries I checked all list zotër as one of the plural forms of zot. E.g. this one online. Two of them are etymological, one is « normal » (Albanian-Russian).
You need to use templates and language codes if you want to display your knowledge of a particular language. For example, for Albanian you use: {{Babel-1|sq}}, where sq is the ISO language code for Albanian (which you can find e.g. on Wikipedia). You can add additional codes with |code1|code2|code3... with various levels. See Wiktionary:Babel for more information. —Ivan Štambuk 10:35, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
I use babylon, lingvosoft & Fjalor i gjuhës së sotme shqipe (by Rilindja of Nazmi Rrahmani), there is no Zotër but Zotëroj, Nemzag 11:06, 12 November 2009 (UTC).
I’m not sure your online dictionary is a good one who made it ? (Arizona U.S of N.A)
In Albanian after communist regime, they made a reform (1947), and changed a lot of word, adding double consonne like ND (n), Përk, derr, hund, mb (m)… In macedonia the albanian who didn’t learned the reformed language at school, still use the ancient prononciation, so i have made a list of word corrupted by reformator. So if your online dictionary use the reformed is fake then, like spouse : nusë / nusja (sq) is nase / nasja (mk) from arabic نساء, lady : zonje (sq) is zojë (mk), build : mbaroj (sq) maroj (mk), impossible : pamundësi (sq), pamunësi (mk), end : fund (sq) fun (mk of latin finis), honor : nderoj (sq) neroj (mk) king : mbret (sq : brutus britannic) mret (mk : mat مت mortis मृत्य / مرت : death=Mret (king), life=zôt (god)), lamb kingj [kinɟ] (mk שֶׂה שַׁח), qingj [ʨinɟ] (kosovo), qëngj [ʨənɟ] (sq); dog : qen [ʨɛn] (sq), çen [ʧɛn] (mk) & çan [ʧan] (kosovo xhakova from latin canis)… Nemzag 11:14, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

Nemzag, Ivan was suggesting that you add the input/text {{Babel-2|sq|en-2}} for example, if you speak Albanian as native language and English at an intermediate level at your user page. The number (in this case 2) corresponds to the number of languages you speak. If you speak French as well, add {{Babel-3|sq|en-2|fr-2}} and so on. The uſer hight Bogorm converſation 11:53, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for Advice Bogorm, i added information. Nemzag 22:04, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
I’m well aware with the communist-imposed reform of switching the official literary dialect to reflect Hoxha’s mother tongue but this has nothing to do with this. —Ivan Štambuk 17:21, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
I don’t think it’s ever been our policy to « only add sourced material ». Users are allowed to use their own brains and even sourced etymologies are speculative. If you want to remove dubious etymologies, fine, but I don’t think we’er going to start removing every etymology that doesn’t have a source. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:31, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

That is the purpose of the Template:rfv-etymology – to demand and provide plausibility for the etymology mostly by means of referencing. I would not agree to erase all unsourced etymologies either. The uſer hight Bogorm converſation 11:53, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
There is a difference between « speculative » and « plausible ». Not all speculative theories (which is a yes/no quality) are equally plausible (which can be scientifically gauged and given certain probability). Your logic is the same what creationists (ab)use to « teach the controversy » at schools. Nemzag’s theories are essentially made-up nonsense and we cannot allow that. It’s enough annoying that he doesn’t accept Western scholarship at all (according to him Western etymologists are biased by colonizers’ anti-Albanian prejudice, and only Albanians have divine right to etymologize their languages), but now him claims that there is no such thing as zotër plural of zot despite the fact that it can be found in just about any dictionary. —Ivan Štambuk 17:21, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree with Ivan. Sources from academic and peer-reviewed materials will always trump unsourced information or materials which are not from academia. For etymologies, the best sources of course will come from linguistics as this is the qualified authority on etymologies. I hope to look over more of the etymologies to check with the academic sources. Removing every unsourced etymology would not be needed as often some users will recognize right away if the etymology is correct or not. I know enough of some etymologies from Indo-European languages to spot blatant errors right away. This is why « zot » stood out right away as I have known of that word’s etymology due to me reading academic sources on that word. Azaleapomp2 20:04, 12 November 2009 (UTC)
Your source are fake and useless, i don’t understand why you add hindu god instead of our Ellêno-Creg gods Nemzag 23:51, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

عباد / عبد

I know nothing of Arabic – but isn’t obedient an adjective? SemperBlotto 11:36, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Perhaps, but i would like that you find the noun of obedient , How do you add name & date ? Nemzag 11:50, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

obedience? (use 4 tildes instead of 3) SemperBlotto 11:44, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

It does not mean obedience. Your source for this information either does not know Arabic or does not know English. Stop using that source. If you want to continue using it, do not bring it here. —Stephen 00:03, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

Blocked

You are blocked for 1 month for deliberately adding fake and unscholarly etymologies, despite numerous warnings not to do so. —Ivan Štambuk 21:14, 13 November 2009 (UTC)


2010

Welcome back

Hi Nemzag. I hope that your new edits will prove to be much less controversial. It would gravely sadden me to see a knowledgeable editor being blocked simply because he persists in making contentious edits. Perhaps you should focus on your mother tongue Albanian, we’re painfully thin in that area. Entries with IPA and thorough inflection will bring you a lot of community karma ;) —Ivan Štambuk 10:50, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, every where i go, they reject me, i’m habituated, no problem, i will leave this planete soon Nemzag 10:58, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

Stephen Gi. Brown

Can you send me a picture of you ? (link facebook or else). منارة [minɛrah] of מִינֵרָלִי (mineralis, Mineral), from menhir (φαραώ φάρος). If my pronunciation is not true, correct it, and don’t remove IPA pronunciation please…

Sorry, I have no picture available. The approximate pronunciation is given after the entry. It is manaara, not mineerah. I don’t add or correct IPA pronunciations of MSA, but I remove them if they are not correct. The vowels in this word are fatHas.
I agree with Ivan. I don’t understand why you insist on contributing in languages that you do not know well, or at all. I suppose that you find Albanian to be boring, but we have a big need for Albanian work here. See how we add declensions of Russian nouns (карандаш) and conjugations of Russian verbs (издавать). We need entries like these for the Albanian words. Nobody wants to do Albanian, but Albanian is what we need. We have Arabic speakers to do the Arabic, so we don’t need help from non-speakers. —Stephen 08:20, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

My pronunciation is the turkish phothoman one. And not the saoudia one. Each sect (shia, sunny, hannafi, malaki, chafii, ismaili…) have is pronunciation.
The Turkish pronunciation must be applied to a Turkish word. منارة, as the heading shows, is Arabic, which means Modern Standard Arabic. Only the Modern Standard Arabic pronunciation is allowed on MSA entries. Different dialects of Arabic each must have a separate entry. MSA entries only accept MSA pronunciations. —Stephen 12:08, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

Ok Nemzag 18:56, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

pastroj

Why do you remove you Ataleas my land Etymology ??? You are not albanian and not greek.

Etymology

Related terms

Synonyms

Because I spent so much time determining that the word was, in fact, a verb and didn’t have time for anything else. I’ll restore the etymology, as it looks valid. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 22:05, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, when I add something i do with care & consciously, I respect you and your Campus innovation for mankind (M.I.T), so please respect my contribution to this world dictionary. I spend lot of my time to complete information. Bye Peace (why do you not let « related term » & « synonyms » ?).
Because I know some of them are bunk, and don’t have the resources to check them individually. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 12:17, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
Use this only dictionary resources Online Dictionary, good day Mag-Zen 10:08, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

kokë

First, let me say thanks for doing Albanian; we have a strong need for it here, and I’m glad to see it. However, there are some issues which need to be worked out. First, the etymology: Are all those words cognate, or does the Albanian derive from one of them? Also, I’m completely at a loss to see what Σατούρνους, θρόνος, etc. are doing in there at all. They don’t seem like they could possibly be relevant. Finally, why is there Arabic and Hangul in the synonyms section? This section is restricted to words of the same language, and I was under the impression that Albanian only used Latin script (I’m no Albanian expert, so please correct me if I’m mistaken). Many thanks. –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 21:15, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

Σατόρνινος Mag-Zen 16:34, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Kokë Origin Chronos Couranos Covranos Cavernus Ovarium Avô Ovum Ovô

Kokë Etymology

Kokë Pronunciation

Kokë Noun

2010 m

  1. cap, forefront, head, skull
  2. bulb, nob

Kokë Related terms

Kokë Synonyms

curator (quratɔr) uro (urɔ) & coerator (qœraθɔr) oro (orô)

Why do you remove coerator sister ??? Mag-Zen 15:30, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Because you made an absolute mess. You don’t seem to know which language you’re editing – is it Latin, or English? Mglovesfun (talk) 15:34, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

For Coerator is latin leave etymology & ipa prononciation please. And for English Curator you can deplace the english word to latin, rather than erase. Mag-Zen 15:39, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

There is no etymology and the pronunciation is wrong, so why would I leave them? I’m not even sure q is used in IPA – should be /k/. Mglovesfun (talk) 15:40, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Can i then add coerator related term in latin section of curator ??? Mag-Zen 15:44, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

VULGAR [wulʒar] LATIN [laθin] ALPHABEƟA Mag-Zen 15:50, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
You can add them. Mglovesfun (talk) 15:51, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Tʰanks ! Mag-Zen 15:53, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

About phonetic [k] is modern pronounciation ancient used [q], because in latin Q is used only before vowel [U] in other case C is used and have two phônetic walor [g] or [q], besides the kyril letter Ҁ [q] have a C shape. C it’s a strange letter and have many prononciation [s / ʦ, q / ʧ, ʤ / g, ʨ] in french, turkish, latin slavic (Ćć-Ћћ, Čč-Чч, Cc-Цц), also check Georgian [ʦ] or Egoptic [ʣ], also analyse Ellêniqo Ϟ Ϙ & Ϭ (Egoptic)… Mag-Zen 16:01, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
Also, it’s seems that the phônetic walue [k] came after byzantinë (ruman conqueror of Ellênic) adoption of Kappa instead of removed Qoppa [q]… The use of Q survived in Slavic until rewoluþion (1918 because of use of typewriter machine : Source, the sound ق [q] is only used in Arabia… Someone or a society are trying to trouble comprehension & magic ormfulatiôn of ancient text by removing letter, perhaps the Temple, Priests or Gods (Check Bible Gen 11-9). Nemzag (talk) 15:42, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
Since K is sound [k], you should perhaps use [q] for C & Q in Wiki documents to have more sound than only [k] Nemzag (talk) 20:48, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
I also believe that latin CH greek Χ was originaly pronounced [qʰ] after rôman conquest by remove of koppa the combination became [kʰ]. The CH [qʰ] still exist in georgian since Q [q] is Nemzag (talk) 13:20, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

G have two walor [g] & [ʒ], since in latin G [ʒ] (numeral walue 7 – Geobritian ז׳ Orbitian ژ) replaced ellênic Z [z] (numeral walue 7 – Geobritian ז Orbitian ز (z)). Nemzag (talk) 11:21, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Can you please revert the coerator removed IPA ? Mag-Zen 16:19, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Hi, what to do with ipa ? Mag-Zen 17:28, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

  • Well, I still think it’s wrong, but add it back and we’ll let someone else decide. Mglovesfun (talk) 17:30, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

Hello, someone removed coerator in Related terms of curator page, why ? Mag-Zen 09:35, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

I’m assuming it’s because they aren’t related. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:12, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

The English Curator have same definition with latin Coerator, so perhaps you could add the word in « related term », also you removed could you add a redirection to  ?. Agmzên 00:47, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

I’m not replying to anything you say unless you say something sensible. was speedy deleted as ‘attack page or other personally identifiable info », and it shouldn’t redirect, at the very least it is a translingual symbol. Mglovesfun (talk) 17:29, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

mret redirection to mpret

Hello, who did you erase the redirection to mpretpret ? Mag-Zen 19:34, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Hi. I erased the old redirect to mpret from mret because Wiktionary rarely uses redirects in the main namespace, and the creator of mret (who moved the entry and created the redirect) noted that mret was a typo anyway. — Beobach 19:38, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Shall i add entry or can you just keep the redirection please ? Mag-Zen 19:42, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Is mret a common misspelling, or alternative spelling, of the English word mpret? If it is, you could create a {{misspelling of|}} entry, or an alternative-spelling-of entry, like proctodaeumproctodeum. — Beobach 19:53, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

No mret is not mispelling is the ancient pronounciation, reformed to mbret (brute, burrë بور, Britannic U.K King) in 1947 by Sino-Russian communist gouvernement of Enver Hoxha … Mag-Zen 19:58, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

In that case, we do not need a redirect. — Beobach 20:06, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

I suggest to not add to much ::::: because the screen is little… Mag-Zen 20:10, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Shall i add the mret entry ? How can i lock the page to avoid erasing ? Mag-Zen 20:17, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

You say mret is only a different pronunciation; for that, we do not need a redirect at mret. Is mret an older spelling of the Albanian word mbret or the English word mpret? If it is, you could create an {{alternative spelling of|}} entry, quoting books that use the older spelling. — Beobach 20:22, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Mret is ancient albanian pronounciation. I’m not in albania right now and i can’t check a book using ancient word, but i’m sure that one day i will add reference, my father & mother tell me so, so i believe what they say. Peace Mag-Zen 20:24, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Again somehone are falsificating illyrian & albanian ethymology…

I suggest to any one that is admin of google book, to scan an albananian ancient dictionary (1919 to 1931) and upload. Agmzên 09:45, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Mret Etymology

From Proto-Ilyrian mret the death, from sanskrit मृत्य / مرت, cognate with checkmate from semitic arabic مات (māt) & hebrew מת, linked to latin mortis & slavic смерть (smertʹ); compare with zot (god : the life ζω ()). According to Vladimir Orel[1], it derives from Romance *imperātus from Latin imperātor. Caesar [qɛsar] Cutter [quθar] from quþa : MpretPret.

Mret Pronunciation

Mret Noun

2010 m (indefinite plural mbretër, definite singular mbreti, definite plural mbretërt)

  1. king (monarch or chess piece)

Mret Derived terms

Mret References

  1. ^ Vladimir Orel, Albanian Etymological Dictionary, Brill 1998, p. 252

Vladimir Orel[Orel]

Hello, can you please leave the illyrian ethymology of mbret, if you add information from Vladimir Orel (russian ethymologist), keep those added by others… Thanks Mag-Zen 09:32, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Please show a source which says this word is from Proto-Illyrian, borrowed from Sanskrit (!) and cognate with Semitic words (!!). —Vahag 10:54, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Source my cortex, and my teacher mother, if my formulation is untrue, correct rather than erase, peace Mag-Zen 11:00, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

I am sorry, but your cortex isn’t very knowledgeable in linguistics. Please, do not edit etymology sections any more. —Vahag 12:46, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Like said to me « Jamesjiao in phylax : If you think the definition is wrong, you can change it. » I’m free to add information since it’s open to any one, i would like that you stop to add albanian etymology from russian source since you even don’t speak shqip, still i’m honnest because I use my name to add info, while i can do anonymously… Mag-Zen 13:12, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

I founded the book you use for source of mbret and in reference of ABBREVIATIONS FOR LANGUAGES AND DIALECTS, I see an abbreviation called MBret who means Middle Breton ? So you are trying to tell that the king / imperator of Shqipëri are the Middle Breton (بريتون / ברטון) → burrë (بور / בר) → brutal Brutus (بروتوس / ברוטוס) → barbarian (ברבר / بربري) → Hebrew (עברית / عبرية) {[« Read this »]} instead of the Ala-Banian ال (al-)إبن Arabian Arian Perso-Indian of PyroManian PhôθoManian Alegzandros Empire using ancient word mret (king before 1947) who is linked to sanskrit Death मृत्य & semitic checkmate arabic مات (māt) & hebrew מת, latin mortis & slavic смерть (smertʹ) ??? Really funny indeed, still I checked the book and some word are missing, and the ancient pronunciation (before 1947) are not always mentioned (p.95 women : femër femra & femën femna)… Like deviation of word using M becoming MB, or N becoming ND, example : check pagë 284 ndër [ndəɾ] (sq) is nër [nəɾ] in Fyrom Macedonia, best example of falsification NDERÔJ [ndeɾɔɪ] (sq : Hônoriô [hɔnorɪɔ] page 283) is NERÔJ [neɾɔɪ] in Macedonia & Kosovo. So all these word using ND instead of N or D (exemple NDRÊTÔJ [ndɾɛtɔɪ] (sq) is DRÊTÔJ [dɾɛtɔɪ] (mk) from latin DIRÊCTUS RÊGS [dɪs·rɛgθ·us rɛgs] ), or MB instead M, or VD instead of D (exemple A VDÊS [a vdɛs] (sq) A DÊS [a dɛs] (mk) from ᾍδης (Hā́idēs)) are fake… Hope someone would find an ancient dictionary to confirm my hypothesis and upload in GoogleBook. To correct this erroneous book made upon a wrongful dialectical variant of Enver Hoxha (אנור / أنۋر) an anti-imperialist marxist leninist communist dictator. Hope someone would make a software dictionary for mk & kosova dialect (for Microsoft Office, Open Office & others soft, hope someone would unify theses dictionary’s by a standardised open sourced versions linked to of each nations ministry of language). I respect the works of his writer {Vladimir Orel Tel-Aviv University]}, but since is based on reformed dialectal version of Shqip, is not totally accurate in a kosovo macedonian dialectal view. Gmazdên 17:36, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

I’m asking the Admin, can I add for all shqip reformed word the two prononciation ? In this form :

Pronunciation

  • IPA(key): [mbɾet] (Albania {1947 reformed version})
  • IPA(key): [mɾet] (Republic of Macedonia / Kosovo)

Yes or No ? Gmazdên 13:41, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

Templates in header

Please don’t, like you did on my talk page and WT:RE:ur, put templates in header. It stops the headers working. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:04, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

Apparently you’re even trying to break your own talk page. IPA doesn’t use the Arabic script; what you actually did was turn the individual requests into headers. They don’t want to be headers, they are requests! They get removed once completed. Nothing wrong with adding a request in Devanagari script, mind you. You should have just stopped there. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:10, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

Oh, and don’t call me sister. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:17, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, i just wanted to improve urdu page Mag-Zen 11:21, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

phylax

  • Can i replace guard by keeper ? Mag-Zen 02:11, 7 December 2010 (UTC)
You mean ‘Can you replace the current definition with keeper‘? You don’t really have to ask. If you think the definition is wrong, you can change it. JamesjiaoTC 02:14, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

I prefer not do by my self because somehone would erase my add (pret, kuti) or falsificate my explication (check orator / coerator & curator, mbret, Перун). So i’m asking admin before to be sure to don’t have problem. (how to be admin ?) Mag-Zen 09:50, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

pret & kuti

Hello, Beobach972, check this reference : Online Dictionary and add pret & search, thanks. Mag-Zen 09:40, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Hi! That source and the printed dictionaries I checked (1, 2) confirms that the « lemma » (the main form of the word) is pres. Thus, « pret », an inflected form, is derived from « pres » — the opposite of what you had written in the entry. — Beobach 22:28, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Hi, Beobach972, yes is a inflected form, the word exist so keep it in your dictionary (to be precise & complete) and add pret to related term of pres (like pre, preva, preje). And about kuti ??? Have a good & happy day. (opposite – / + you readed my book ?) Mag-Zen 08:51, 8 December 2010 TC)

Alright, I’ve re-added what I was able to verify in printed dictionaries. Cheers! — Beobach 18:32, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, but why not keep etymology and ipa ? Agmzên 20:35, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Because I cannot verify them. Many of the etymologies and pronunciations you have added have been inaccurate. Another of Wiktionary’s knowledgeable editors can check the etymology and pronunciation of pret and kuti later, and re-add that information if it is accurate. — Beobach 21:23, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Hope you find a specialist, but i’m sure of etymology Agmzên 14:15, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Kuti [quti] → κουτί [quti] (koutí [quti]) (+800 M.G) → ϘΟΥΤΙ [quθi] (QOuTI [quthi]) (-300 Old Ellên) → Coffin [qɒfɪn], Sarcophagë סרקופג [qof], Catastrophe קָטַסטרוֹפָה [qaθa] & Qatal קטל [qaθal], Caesar [qɛsarɛs], Cutter [quθar] thë Kufar כופרкуфар (kufar) кофер & Koffer / coffer / coffreCoffeePrinCopsCorpsScorpioScipioSqʰypoSqupiAgmzên 16:29, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

Albanian

Kouti Etymology

From Ancient Greek κουτί (koutí, box)

Kouti Pronunciation

Kouti Noun

2010

  1. box
  2. caddy
  3. canister

מגד

I’ve created an entry for מגד. —RuakhTALK 02:20, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Tʰanks Ruakh Agm-Zdên 09:00, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

תא

Where did you get those senses from? —RuakhTALK 20:57, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

In babylon 7 & Lingvosoft, and Tevrathë & Qovrênë… Agm-Zdên 21:00, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Then Omnipaedista (talkcontribs) was quite right to revert. We can’t just steal translations from other dictionaries! —RuakhTALK 21:45, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

It’s your choice. You know hebrew better than me. Agm-Zdên 21:46, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

The content of your edit was only slightly mistaken, but the principle of it was quite wrong, regardless of how well or poorly anyone speaks Hebrew. —RuakhTALK 00:21, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

I wan’t to understand the books of my religion and the orbitian language (similar to geobrit), and i believed that cubicle & box, was linked to תא since the Kaaba / Cube כעבה | كعبة‎ is linked to Tʰeos תאוס Ouranos אוראנוס (𒌷𒀭 : OvrAnu)… You think the opposite, it’s your freedom. Agm-Zdên 00:25, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Tʰanks Wiki

I just wan’t to tʰanks wiki to allow people to express vreely (vreedom of thinking & speech : U.N.O Right vador)… And i wan’t to tʰanks the Internet for teaching me a lot of thing. Tʰanks again Jimmy Wales. Agmzên 19:22, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Etymology of « kuti »

Elsewhere, you write that you are sure of etymology of « kuti ». The important questions:

  • How do you know the etymology of Albaian « kuti »?
  • How can another Wiktionary editor verify that the etymology is correct?

In the area of etymology, Wiktionary mostly relies on verifiability via references to external reliable sources. Thus, if you want to dispel doubt about particular etymology, you should better list references from which you have sourced the etymology, so other editors can verify it. —Dan Polansky 14:53, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

I see, people have already been through this with you at #Do not add unsourced material, several sections above on this page, back in November 2009. —Dan Polansky 14:58, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

I know because i searched.

  • How I know ? I’m making a book about albanian language (and falsification) so i know some etymology of terms (some from Persian, Sanskrit, Slave, Turkish, Latin & Crêg). I know several language, i’m psy (big head), so i can find link that no one else would discover.
  • How Other ? User can check using a multi dictionnary like babylon 8, or using lingvosoft…

About adding referêncë, allright I will add in future (hope babylon or lingvosoft are good)… And [#do not add unsourced materiel]], isn’t true cause a lot of word in wiktionary don’t have source… Like said someone above, use you cortex « Users are allowed to use their own brains and even sourced etymologies are speculative ». I have time cause i don’t work so adding some IPA or Etymology is a pleasure. The purpose of Wiktionary is to allow all to add what they know, and not what is politicaly profitable… Agmzên 15:07, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

You have to distinguish definitions from etymologies, for the purpose of sourcing. Wiktionary is using quotations of use of words as evidence of use of terms, thus in parts supplanting using scholarly sources to reference definitions. Definitions can be estimated from the collected quotations; etymologies are not so easy to infer from observable material.
Wiktionary cannot allow all people to add what they think they know. The material of Wiktionary has to be verifiable: in case of definitions, quotations serve for verification; in case of etymologies, scholarly sources and dictionaries serve for verification.
It is nice that you are writing a book, but that does not explain how you know things. As a reader of your book I will ask myself: how does the author know what he writes? You have not provided any explanation for how you know etymologies, other than that you are making them up. You seem to be saying that that does not matter, as the etymologies in scholarly sources are also made up, based more on speculation than observation. Maybe, but you are not a scholarly source, so your made-up etymologies have no place in Wiktionary. Wiktionary cannot allow any self-proclaimed scholar with no published research to add made up etymologies.
You mentioned Babylon. Can you post a hyperlink to a Babylon page where I can verify the etymology of « kuti »? —Dan Polansky 16:23, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Well for etymology of Shqip i use english translation (from Lingvosoft & Babylon), e then i use babylon and i search the translation, i have multiple traduction in all language & then i check a word that ressemble… Easy no ? Of course for a guy like me that can read foreign script. Babylon, i suggest to download software, because the tool give multiple translation while website give one word. How I know, my genius tell me so ! (PK, TK, TP, MK Ultra) Agmzên 16:48, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

So you do not have any link to sources where other people could verify the etymology. Your answer to « how do I know » is « my genious tells me so », a curious answer for a wanna-be Wiktionary contributor. You have also sketchily described your method of inventing etymologies: you search for translations of an Albanian word in a multi-lingual dictionary, and form the etymology somehow based on the set of translations into other languages. Proper original etymological research requires much more input than that. I do not understand « PK, TK, TP, MK Ultra ». Your genius (is this some sort of omniscient spirit you are in connection with?) seems to be rather often wrong, as regards English writing anyway. —Dan Polansky 17:01, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Yes, what else to say, i suppose all etymologist do like that. Agmzên 17:03, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Competent etymologists do not work like that. They base their estimated etymologies on a much larger input than a set of translations of a word to other languages. While I admit that I do not know how exactly they work, they use much larger input information that they feed into the process. That is one of the reasons that, in etymologies, it is advisable that Wiktionary editors and admins require more reliable proof or sourcing than « my genius tells me so ». What does « PK, TK, TP, MK Ultra » mean? —Dan Polansky 17:11, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

You don’t understand the purpose of Wiktionary, it’s free & open to any one, not just expert or archeologist. If you don’t see the link between two neighbors state, i will not debate eternaly, the link is evident. Have a nice day. Agmzên 17:14, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Hey, what does « PK, TK, TP, MK Ultra » mean? (I have no crystal ball :p). —Dan Polansky 17:17, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Psychokinesia, Telekinesia, Telepathia, Mind Kontrol. Specialist. Search at google. Agmzên 17:18, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Now that is interesting. What did you mean by listing these terms? What is the relation to the discussed subject of how you know the etymologies? —Dan Polansky 17:23, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

I have been, but i’m not now, because of antipsy. And about what you said before, here is my response to Mglovesfun : « Like I said, you put non-etymology stuff in the etymology, and these can’t be synonyms as Albanian does not use the Latin script. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:55, 11 May 2010 (UTC) », response : « Albanian use latin but semantic is semitic (hebrew arabian) and root greco-Cyrillic 94.108.193.218 11:42, 13 May 2010 (UTC) ». So root of word is prehistoric semitic & sanskrit. And for Kuti the link with ancient greek is evident. Don’t have time to talk longer, peace Agmzên 17:27, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Okay, you say that you have been moving objects with the power of your thoughts (telekinesis), right? How does that feat qualify you to be an etymologist? —Dan Polansky 17:34, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

I don’t have to respond (i can’t control all elements like metal but only some of them like wind), i explained enough, if you don’t understand, i’m sorry, good bye Agmzên 17:42, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Sure, if you do not want to respond to questions about telekinesis, you don’t have to. It is you who has introduced telekinesis into the conversation, anyway. —Dan Polansky 17:44, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Shqipja

Do you know what « Shqipja » means? Does it mean « Albanian » (language)? Can you add it to Wiktionary? —Dan Polansky 17:15, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Po shqipja e kuptoj se jam shqiptar, amë skam vakt ? Kur do të kam koh e vnoj në wiktionary, ani ? Tung Agmzên 17:16, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Yes i understand shqip because i’m shqiptar, and when i have time i shall add this word. Ok ? Bye Agmzên 17:17, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

But Even If I add this word (root scipii) somehone would erase so why to add ??? Also Arês / Area / arena ארס / آرس (Head) آدم (Human) etymology is false because destruction is Erase / Eradô הרס הורד / هرس هدم. Agmzên 17:40, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

A, E, K & Q (Albanian Alphabet)

In some words E is pronounced [e], A is sometime pronounced [ɒ] (in MK FYROM for persian words), and K pronounciation is ق [q] and not ك [k] ([[1]]), and Q is [ʨ] (Ќќ / Ćć / Ћћ). Nemzag (talk) 23:58, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

C [k or q] ? Latin_alphabet

About phonetic [k] is modern pronounciation ancient used [q], because in latin Q is used only before vowel [U] in other case C is used and have two phônetic walor [g] or [q], besides the kyril letter Ҁ [q] have a C shape. C it’s a strange letter and have many prononciation [s / ʦ, q / ʧ, ʤ / g, ʨ] in french, turkish, latin slavic (Ćć-Ћћ, Čč-Чч, Cc-Цц), also check Georgian [ʦ] or Egoptic [ʣ], also analyse Ellêniqo Ϟ Ϙ & Ϭ (Egoptic)… Mag-Zen 16:01, 3 December 2010 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nemzag (talkcontribs)

Also, it’s seems that the phônetic walue [k] came after byzantinë (ruman conqueror of Ellênic) adoption of Kappa instead of removed Qoppa [q]… The use of Q survived in Slavic until rewoluþion (1918 because of use of typewriter machine : Source, the sound ق [q] is only used in Arabia… Someone or a society are trying to trouble comprehension & magic ormfulatiôn of ancient text by removing letter, perhaps the Temple, Priests or Gods (Check Bible Gen 11-9). Nemzag (talk) 15:42, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Since K is sound [k], you should perhaps use [q] for C & Q in wiki documents to have more sound than only [k] Nemzag (talk) 20:48, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

I also believe that latin CH greek Χ was originaly pronounced [qʰ] after rôman conquest by remove of qoppa the combination became [kʰ]. The CH [qʰ] still exist in georgian since Q [q] is Nemzag (talk) 13:20, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

Some exemple : track & Traque, Oceanë & Oqean (ωκεανός), Coran & Qoran, κούκος (quqos) & Cuckoo (Cuculus, coccum (qoqqum, “Scarlet”) from קאק (qôq, “Jackdaw”), κουρούνα (quruna, “Crow”), κορώνα (qorôna, “Corona”), κρανίο (qranɪo, “Cranium”), Κρόνος (qronos, “Cronos”), κόκαλο / кокал (qoqalo, “bone” calcium), κόκκυξ (qoqqyqs, “coccyx”), κοχλίας (qoqʰlea, “cochlea”), (qoqal, “Bone”) and others. Nemzag (talk) 18:42, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

[Archaic_Latin]

Z & G remplacement (3rd century BC) in latin

G have two walor [g] & [ʒ], since in latin G [ʒ] (numeral walue 7 – Geobritian ז׳ Orbitian ژ) replaced ellênic Z [z] (numeral walue 7 – Geobritian ז Orbitian ز). Nemzag (talk) 11:21, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Coerator IPA by Omnipaedista

Hi, you erased my ipa add in Coerator [qœr·aθ·ɔr]. About IPA, truly your prononciation is not good. But still if you wan’t to induce other in error with this negative prononciation, i will not try to change your mind. Tʰanks and Good Bye. Agmzên 11:58, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Sometime some book are fake & contain lots of errors… Agmzên 16:31, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Please stop. Thanks. —Omnipaedista 16:47, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Why do you remove discussion ? Agmzên 16:51, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Because it’s the product of off-wiki private communication. You’ve published it here without my permission, as if this discussion had taken place here. I could report you for doing that. Incidentally, posting repeatedly irrelevant and personal discussions on talk-pages of entries borders on vandalism. Thanks. —Omnipaedista 17:01, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

I’m sorry, your right about private message, should ask teou before adding in my page, i will not do anymore before asking teou (but you removed the discussion with user:Mglovesfun about coerator, and this discussion was not private). Agmzên 17:03, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

They might not be private (though I’d like to also hear Mglovesfun’s opinion on that) but they are irrelevant: talking about theology on a talk-page is senseless. Also, you are engaging in editing an archived discussion. As I said in my private message, I am puzzled by your idiosyncratic views on linguistics, especially phonology and etymology. Your approach is rather metaphysical, and non-standard to say the least. By academic criteria, most of your contributions border on misinformation. —Omnipaedista 17:30, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

It’s your point of view, you have right to express, i have right to express (Article 19 of U.N.O Universal Human Rights). Goodbye. Agmzên 17:59, 24 December 2010 (UTC)


2011

Table on dialect differences

In this table the etymologies (columns « root » and « source ») must be thoroughly revised.

For instance: ne « us » has no reason to come from Arabic rather than from Indo-European (cf. Latin nos); zot is « lord » (and « mister »), not properly « god » (Perëndia); mbret « king » is from Latin imperator (and regj from Latin rex, accusative regem).

If I had time, I would check the whole list using at least the standard works: B. Demiraj, Albanische Etymologien, 1997 (or http://iiasnt.leidenuniv.nl/ied/) (which has the words of Indo-European origin only); W. Meyer-Lübke, Romanisches Etymologisches Wörterbuch, 1939 (for the words of Latin origin, of course); G. Meyer, Etymologisches Wörterbuch der albanesischen Sprache, 1891.

Zxly (talk) 16:01, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

I used Root / Related no Etymology, I add word that cognate… Gmazdên (talk) 09:07, 8 February 2011 (UTC)
Zot is God, mister is Zotëni (Gheg) & Zotëri (Tosk)… Gmazdên (talk) 09:11, 8 February 2011 (UTC)
God can be called Perêni (Gheg) & Perëndi (Tosk) cognate with protects : Prun (Gheg) & Slavic God of Thunder & Lightning Perun also known has Zevs (Iupiter Imperator ImPerô / Parô / Prun)… Gmazdên (talk) 14:34, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Albania

Coat of arms of Albania.svg

Hello!
I noticed you’ve made edits or that you are in some way connected to Albania or Albanians related articles.

We are a group of editors working to improve Wikipedia’s coverage of Albania and Albanians related topics and are organized within WikiProject Albania.
I thought that you may be interested in viewing the current tasks of our WikiProject or its talk page and get involved. Furthermore, if you are interested in joining the wikiproject, please feel free to add your name in the Participants’ page!.

Thank you and, again, welcome among us!

Vinie007 16:34, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

wiki board

I want to ask you can I add in a wiki board such thing.

The board look like this :

????????????????????????
????????????

And I want to add a information in this form

|| ??? [ipa] ||

Between two || ||

I suppose that it looks like « || ??? (have to add something here but what ?)[ipa] || »

Thanks hope you understand, because I speak french… email comment from User talk:Nemzag

I don’t understand what you are asking. What is a wiki board? Do you means a table? If so, where do you want to put the table, in your talk page? Sorry if I misunderstand what you are saying. —Stephen (Talk) 23:41, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Well don’t vorry, I’m sorry for my English, I would like to add info in two line (one under other), between two column (word with ipa pronunciation under)… And I’m asking how to do that using a SYMBOLE CODE or else. Hope you understand. Thanks for help anyway. Gmazdên 23:48, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

I still don’t understand. Are you asking how to make a table? Or where to find IPA symbols? Do you mean how to make a two-column table? —Stephen (Talk) 00:02, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Hi, no no, i’m asking how to add two line text (one under other ; word & with ipa) in one cell column of table… Like this…

Word

[ipa]

In onë cell of the column, two line (one under other)… Gmazdên 01:04, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Well, here is one possible example:
ping
/ˈpɪŋ/
—Stephen (Talk) 02:30, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
Are you asking how to make line breaks? If so, it’s <br>. —Yair rand (talk) 02:39, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Hi, Steven, i don’t wan’t use you method because i use a « wikitable sortable », so using a line like you do, would cause problem if I reorder… Yair Rand I tried your command…

king
[kɪŋ]
regula
[rɛgula]
queen

Has you can see it work, I tested in wikipedia and is functioning, how to align table vertically to have same position with one or two line text ??? Gmazdên 09:45, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks Stephën, this is cell command, but for the whole board ? Gmazdên 00:27, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

I’m afraid that I do not know enough about HTML to be able to tell you a vertical-align command that applies to the whole table. It is a difficult subject for me. —Stephen (Talk) 02:22, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Ok, thanks for response, I asked Yair Rand by PM but I didn’t had response… Gmazdên 02:28, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

NA [na] & NË [nə] or NÊ [nɛ], UNË & UNÊ

Hello, (mister 151.21.71.106) you replaced etymology by your version, please keep info added by others (respect the works of those who spend their own time to complete info), add content, don’t erase.

Macedonian Shqiptar don’t use but NA نا (TE NA, TE NENA ΑΘΗΝΑ [atʰɛna]), and I would like to explain that we are Muslim from 500 years now. So lot of words that we use came from the holy Coran, and albanian language use the arabian grammar (like plural using AT -اتand ËT at end of word)…

Në [nə] is modern dialectal version from Shqipëria / Albania, also some other cities uses NÊ [nɛ]…

NA came from arabic نا & Unê or Unë is deviated from arabic أنا or latin uniô & unus.

It’s logical. Since we are Muslim (pacifist) (Albania is a member of the Organisation of the Islamic Conference (Muslims comprise 33.3% of the population of Macedonia, Macedonia has the fourth-highest proportion of Muslims in Europe, after those of Kosovo (90%), Albania (70%), and Bosnia-Herzegovina (48%).[89] Most Muslims are Albanian, Turkish, or Roma, although some are Slavic Macedonian Muslims.)… Gmazdên 06:14, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

ÊNÊ & UNÊ are more equal & similar than your totally strange etymology explication (From Old Albanian u(I) followed from the particle – (na & nê in gheggian) ; compare ti and (dialectal) tinë.). And what does ti & tinë means ? Gmazdên 06:22, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

If you use old albanian / latin, give source of your U meaning (i wan’t to read that book, if its vladimir orel from Tel Aviv university, this book is based on reformed dialect and contains lots of errors, the Orel definition link to νή () & ναι (nai) who means screen & yes, what relation with Me or Us ? I checked there are no Arabian reference in this book), U means WAS and is used with U KAN (mk : he was / sq : ka qenë) again arabic term كان (kān), He & I are not the same. You don’t have profile, you speak albanian but do you speak arabian ? I also noticed that you just erase content of other by adding fake source (like for zot & mbret), so if you add something keep others contributions or one day, someone else, would delete your add… Gmazdên 11:39, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

Unê | Unë Etymology

From Old Albanian u (“I”) followed from the particle –; compare and tënë. Deviation of أنا (’ana, I), from نا (na, us, we).

This etymology is confusing and needs a lot of work. It gives two different sources for unë, either from u+në or from Arabic أنا. Also, there is no explanation of tinë. Tinë has to be explained, and the two different sources have to be resolved somehow. —Stephen (Talk) 02:01, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
Let me explain something :
First I never eard someone using U in daily life communication but UN [un] (I, Me, One 1=I, Unique, Unus )… I never eared about TINË (your) but only TËNË→TËNDË (sq) / TANË [tɑn] (mk) !!! (I have eared TI (you) in some dialectal song, but for TINË).
Don’t confound NA/NÊ (US) with the -NË [nə] (word extension) remplaced by reform by -RË [ɾə] like TINË (mk) → TIRË (sq) « your », ATYNË (mk) → ATYRË (sq) « those », EMËN (mk) → EMËR (sq) « NOMÊN : name », FEMËN (mk) → FEMËR (sq) « femina : woman ».
We (macedonian, kosova alabanian) differentiate the NË / RË extension (generaly end of word) with the نا (na, us) NÊ [nɛ] (we) NA [na] (us) & أنا (’ana, I) UNÊ [unɛ] UNUS) that the Reformed albanian don’t distinguishes, Gheggatë use more vowel than Toskian (nazal [ĩ, ɛ̃, ɑ̃, ɔ̃, ỹ, ũ]), standard [e, ɑ] & [ɒ] (persian sound).
Your combination (ti « you » & ti+në « your » & u : ??? & unë : « I », « Me ») is false, cause « My » in Scipio is IM [im] / IÊM [jɛm] and not in our UN case : UNNË (mk:[un+nə]) / UNRË (sq:[un+ɾə]) :
(« You ») TI → (« Your ») TI+NË ≠ U+NË because « I ») is not « MY » who is IM (sq) / JÊM (mk) and NOT UNËNË / UNÊNË.

  • UNÊ/UNË is « singular I » (from uno, unus, unique, 1=I),
  • TI/TÊ/TË is « you singular » and became « your singular » if you add add NË/NÊ(mk) | RË/RÊ (sq) at end (TINË→TIRË KËTYRËVE (sq), TANË KTYNËVÊ (mk)), so if TI+NË = « your » the combination of UNË/UNÊ « I singular » would be UNËNË/UNÊNË : « my » but we use IM / JÊM [jɛm] and not UNËNË / UNÊNË. UNË & UNÊ is not combined form but an original word (arabic)
  • NA/NÊ/NË is « Us, We plural » (« TE NA » : among us : from ΑΘΗΝΑ ΟΥΡΑΝΟΣ (OuRANOS) = Quran القُرْآن
    ΑΘΗΝΑ [atʰɛna] TE NENA [te nena] to great mother) ; NA & ANA in Arab exist since 630, much older than you modern 1400 books…
Prove that NA & ANA/ÊNÊ – UNA/UNÊ is from arabic origin. Gmazdên 02:23, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
English Reformed
Albanian
Macedonian
Kosova
Dialect Root Source Variation
I UNE [un·ɛ]
MUA [mu·a]
UNÊ [un·ɛ]
MUÊ [mu·ɛ]
I : أنا | אני [ani] (I, me) ↔ ina (we are), i na (of us)
UnusNos
shemitic
latin
Me UNË [un·ə]
MË [mə]
UNË [un]
MU [mu]
Me : لي | לי
me [me] مه ↔ them هم
ме (me) мене (mene)
με (me) μι (mi) μου (mou)
shemitic
latin
slavic
greek
We NE [nɛ] NÊ [nɛ] We / Them : هن نا | הן אנו [enu] ↔ une (me, I)
ние (nie) [nie]
shemitic
slavic
Us NË [nə] NA [na] Us : لنا | לנו
ina (we are), i na (of us) ↔ אני [ani] (I, me)
нас (nas)
shemitic
alabanian
slavic
My (m) IM [im]
IME [imɛ]
JAM [jam] (i’m)
JÊM [jɛm]
JÊMÊ [jɛmɛ]
JAM [jam] (i’m)
me [me] مه ↔ them هم (εμάς (emás) / εμείς (emeís))
ми (mi) [mi]
latin
slavic
My (f) TIM [tim]
TIME [tim·ɛ]
TÊM [tɛm]
TÊMÊ [tɛm·ɛ]
me [me] مه ↔ them هم (εμάς (emás) / εμείς (emeís)) latin
Our TONË [ton·ə]
TONE[ton·ɛ]
TÔNË [tɔn·ə]
TÔNE[tɔn·ɛ]
Ours YNË [yn·ə]
YNI [yn·i]
JÔNË [jɔn·ə]
JÔNE[jɔn·ɛ]
Of us NEVË [nev·ə]
NEVE [nev·ɛ]
NEVË [nev]
NEVÊ [nev·ɛ]
You TË [tə] TÊ [tɛ] TI [ti] te [te]
ти (ti) [tɛ → ti]
تم
latin
slavic
urdu
Your NË→NDË [tənd·ə]
NE→NDE [tənd·ɛ]
TAN [tan]
TÃNÊ [tɑ̃n·ɛ]
TINË [tin·ə]
TINÊ [tin·ɛ]
teneô tenire tiens latin n [n] ↔ nd [nᵈ]
Yours NI→NDI [tənd·i] TÃNI [tɑ̃n·i] TINI [tin·i] teneô tenire tiens latin n [n] ↔ nd [nᵈ]
Your TUAJ [tu·aj] tua [tu·a] latin
Yours TUAJI [tu·aj·i] tua [tu·a] latin
Your YT [yt] YT αυτές (aftés) [aites]
Your YTI [yti] YTI αυτές (aftés) [aites]
Your (pl) JUAJ [juaj] You (pl) : JU [ju]
Your (pl) JÔTI [jɔti] You (pl) : JU [ju]
Him ATË [at·ə] ATË [at] αυτόν (aftón) אותו greek
Them (pl) KËTA [qət·a] KTA [qt·a]
These KËTO [qət·o] KTO [qt·o] αυτοί (aftoí) greek
Of These KËTYRËVE [qətyɾəvɛ] KTYNVÊ [qtynvɛ] n [n] ↔ r [ɾ]
Those ATYRËVE ATYN ΑΘΗΝΑ [atʰɛna] related to אותן & αυτές (aftés) n [n] ↔ r [ɾ] like Zotëri (sq) & Zôtëni (mk)
Of us NEVE [nevɛ] NEVÊ [nevɛ] Prove of falsification, compare nevê, yni with atynvê & ktynvê

Continuation

It is very difficult to understand what you are saying. First, no, I don’t know of any Albanian admins, Gheg or Tosk. You might ask at sq:Diskutim:Faqja Kryesore and at w:sq:Diskutim:Faqja Kryesore.
I am trying to understand you. I changed the above etymology to reflect some of what you said, but there is still the unacceptable confusion about an origin from Old Albanian (as above) or from Arabic, or even from Latin (which you mentioned down below somewhere). There is only one path, there cannot be two different paths. Are you saying that nobody knows how unë evolved, and that these are three possibilities? —Stephen (Talk) 02:36, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Listen Arabian are Ruman Army : Bismila Al-Rêmên Al-Rêyim Al-Rumi (the noble רום | روم)… Arabian Alabanian are linked to latin, and some word are used in latin & arab look criminel and جرم [grim] or aequitas [ɛqwita] & حق [ɛq], these word are related, the erroneous pronunciation divide (sect). In egypt ج (j) [ʤ] is [g]. Well I don’t know but NA (« us ») is NA & not NË ; UNË (« I ») is a complete word and not a combination since my is IM / JÊM, and you « TË » became your when « TË+NË », UN+NË (my) don’t exist, also UNË is not « my » but « I » and it’s not a combination of U+NË who should means « my » if TË+NË is « your » !!! Gmazdên 02:44, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

I prefer to wait for a gheggian admin, cause the sq page use the reformed dialect, and I prefer to don’t use this one… Hope someone make a ghegian/mk/kosova Wiktionary page. Gmazdên 03:24, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

I don’t think we are ever going to be able to communicate well enough to go forward from here. The above etymology is essentially what you had in your edit here, but now you seem to be saying that it was all wrong. I can’t figure out what you are proposing for an etymology. —Stephen (Talk) 03:26, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks that you try to understand, but I prefer to wait for gheggian admin and a gheggian wiktionary page, I don’t like to use SQ one cause it’s use falsificated version of Tosk (greek shqip : orthodox), I just say don’t believe the reference from Vladimir Orel (Tel Aviv), using an hypothetical invented old albanian, based on a falsificated version of Tosk (some word are writed in the two version, but lot of word don’t show variation), also this book use for reference old book from german, italian, slavic but no Arab, Persian, Hindu (tzigane, roma, ashkali) or Turkish source, all these people tried to conquer Albania in 1914-18 and 1940-45, since 500 years the gheggian language has evolved and we use lot of word from lot of foreign language (persian, turkish, arabic, slavic, latin this make richness of shqip : Etymology). So please prohibite use of this book has valid source for original gheggian shqip etymology… That’s all. Gmazdên 03:36, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

About some Albanian word like hypje (up : υψος (ypsos) / ὑπέρ (hupér) [ʰyps·os / ʰyp·er], p148 : « Albanian Etymological Dictionary »), is a gheggian language from Macedonia & Kosovo (adopted in media instead of Enver Hoxha dialect) and who is distinct from reformed Albanian based on Tosk (orthodox where Ypsilon (Old Ellêniqa) became Ipsilon (Modern Greek : 3 [i] ita, ipsilon, iota) and C/Qoppa [q] C/Gamma [g] (O.E) became Kappa [k] or Ghamma [ɣ] [(M.G), it’s the reason why albanian use K for sound c/q [q] & k [k], where other Latin language use c like prefix com- ; I noticed that Beobach checked and reverted some of my add (perun, hypi (mk / ks) / hipi (sq) : is there a tool to know all if his reverting on my contribution ?), it’s not nice, since those word exist & are true. You use falsificated dictionary based on toskian & reformed shqip, you don’t know the gheggian language & there is no gheggian admin to confirm my add… So please be tolerant, I’m conscious that I’m just a student who try to add some content for all world, perhaps i’m make mistake, but just be more comprehensive and positive upon me and improve not remove. I have been blocked one month by dictator like Ivan Štambuk (for telling that obedience is عبد / عباد) or reverted by Vahag (mbret / zot) using book writed by Vladimir Orel (Israel, Tel Aviv), but I keep in mind that 10 years ago Serbian Orthodox / Slavic Communist take pleasure to exterminate my people & falsificate our language in 1947 after victory against the National Socialist… Thanks to be more open-minded toward other (respect article 19 of U.N.O Universal Human Rights), if this Wiktionary is just about political interest I will not add any more entries, since I just lose my time if someone else remove my add… (also I’m sure that etymology of Obediô from Oboediô is not Ob+Avdiô) Gmazdên 04:06, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

For Etymology I propose to keep the link to أنا (’ana / êne, I), to remove the comparaison of TI & TINË & TË & TËNDË, since i proved is false in my explication, to remove U, and Keep Un, from Latin Unus, Uno, Unique (I, 1, Unë Ênê) & NA نا (na, us, we) and not NË who was end of word replaced by RË (in 1947 to divide & confuse comprehension between latin language)… And I proved to you using some latin exemple (EMËN (mk) → EMËR (sq) (NOMÊN : name), FEMËN (mk) → FEMËR (sq) (femina : woman) that these are falsification. I believe the source, not the deviation… Gmazdên 08:32, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

I finded a better etymology for Tënë (Tëndë) / Tänë from latin TENEÔ, french TENIR & TIENS (yours). Gmazdên 20:36, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

Unë & Unê ([Omnipaedista]

Hi, why do you not keep the arabian link of unê ??? Why do you believe a book from Slavic Israeli ? Instead of opinion of Albanian Muslim ? I don’t understand. This book is fake and don’t use it for my land etymology, because, it’s the communist anti-imperialist who falsified albanian rômanian words (1947 Enver Hoxha (אנור / أنۋر)), and this book is made upon the falsificated dialect that they try to impose by trickery to all, I checked in, there is no arabian reference inside… So please stop remove my contribution using this false reference, also you don’t speak shqip or arab (Albania is a member of the Organisation of the Islamic Conference). Thanks Gmazdên 00:26, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Macedonian Shqiptar don’t use but NA نا (TE NA / TE NENA [te nena] ΑΘΗΝΑ [atʰɛna]), and I would like to explain that we are Muslim from 500 years now. So lot of words that we use came from the holy Coran, and albanian language use the arabian grammar (like plural using AT -اتand ËT at end of word)…

Në [nə] is modern dialectal version from Shqipëria / Albania, also some other cities uses NÊ [nɛ]…

NA came from arabic نا & Unê or Unë is deviated from arabic أنا or latin uniô & unus. Since 500 years the language has evolved so don’t try to find etymology using only old albanian reference. Gmazdên 00:34, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Hope, Wiki allow new historic view : « suppressed content visible »

Hi, a lot of add are suppressed but keeped in history, sometime it would be interesting to see the point of view of other deleted abusively, so I’m hoping, that the Programmer add a function (in option) or link to wiki page, to be able to see the page with suppressed content displayed in red or green, using history information and a intelligent phrase structure and word recognition algorithm … Like that the page would be more complete, and the suppressed content visible to all, despite censorship. Hope !!! Gmazdên 07:22, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

You can link to an old revision like this: Older revision of unë. —Stephen (Talk) 02:18, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I know this function but I would like a merging process using all history and not just one variation. Gmazdên 02:41, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

wiki fauna

Hi, do you know if it’s possible to add wiki fauna & project in wiktionary profile like I use in wikipedia ?

Is it possible to use only one wikunited profile for all wiki page ? I means link of my wiktionary profile don’t function in wikipedia

Thanks

Projects that I am member
Coat of arms of Albania.svg This user participates in
WikiProject Albania.
Coat of arms of Albania.svgThis user participates in
WikiProject Albania.
Coat of arms of Albania.svgThis user participates in
WikiProject Albania.
Night Griffan.jpg This user is a WikiGryphon.
Night Griffan.jpgThis user is a WikiGryphon.
Night Griffan.jpgThis user is a WikiGryphon.
WikiWizard White.svg This user is a WikiWizard.Saving the universe, one article at a time.

It’s Magic.

WikiWizard White.svgThis user is a WikiWizard.Saving the universe, one article at a time.

It’s Magic.

WikiWizard White.svgThis user is a WikiWizard.Saving the universe, one article at a time.

It’s Magic.

Face-angel.svg This user is a WikiAngel.
Face-angel.svgThis user is a WikiAngel.
Face-angel.svgThis user is a WikiAngel.
Template elf.png This user is a WikiElf.
Template elf.pngThis user is a WikiElf.
Template elf.pngThis user is a WikiElf.
Template:User wikipedia/WikiCyclops
Gigant.PNG This user is a WikiGiant.
Gigant.PNGThis user is a WikiGiant.
Gigant.PNGThis user is a WikiGiant.

email text by Nemzag

Those are called « user boxes ». We don’t have any user boxes here in Wiktionary except for Babel boxes. The reason is that these boxes are for the purposes of a vanity page, and the only personal qualities that we are interested in here are language capabilities. —Stephen (Talk) 02:18, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Hope, avθomaθic add in user talk

I hope that procrammor add an avθomaθic add in a « user talk page », when someone is talking about him on other user talk page, it would be very useful. Using Frame like PHP site, with date post & title & inside communication, when a user name is mentioned the frame from other user page while be shown in the mentioned userpage… Because, else, how do we know if someone is talking about us ??? Gmazdên 05:49, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Në & Nê, Ftyr, qingj, mbëshel [Albanian)]

Hi, you replaced the në who i’m sure exist, check at Google Translation (check mbrënda to)… Can I add the word në in ghegërish ? Ftyrë is skopje pronounciation & qingj exist in a kosovo dialect, falemnderit exist in lingvosoft dictionary but you removed it and the word mbëshel (variant mbëçel, mbërshel) I finded this one in Albanian Etymological Dictionary of Vladimir Orel (can i add a mbëshel & mbërshel line under mbylle ?)… Do you know where they use NË & NÊ ?

Nemzag (talk) 23:36, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

Check this Nemzag (talk) 15:45, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

[οὐρανός] ϝορσανός

Hi where do you getted this word & etymology ? Gmazdên 22:18, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Well, I wrote that over two years ago, so I’m not entirely sure, but if I had to hazard a guess, it would be from Beekes (btw, that website is crap and doesn’t work half the time). –Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 02:05, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

is, and Nemzag

Hi, I created Arab entry cause I needed those for link definition of my web page, I just wished to to add info since it’s open to any one and I add entries (from Lingvosoft & Babylon Source) sometime that need to be corrected and completed but I don’t do vandalism like some other (I don’t know a better & precise electronic Arabic dictionary), since Stephën telled me to not add arabic anymore, because i’m level 2, I didn’t added anymore, adding request in Arabic that are there since two years without complement by Arabic expert.
About some Albanian word like hypje (up : υψος (ypsos) / ὑπέρ (hupér) [ʰyps·os / ʰyp·er], p148 : « Albanian Etymological Dictionary »), is a gheggian language from Macedonia & Kosovo (adopted in media instead of Enver Hoxha dialect) and who is distinct from reformed Albanian based on Tosk (orthodox where Ypsilon (Old Ellêniqa) became Ipsilon (Modern Greek : 3 [i] ita, ipsilon, iota) and C/Qoppa [q] C/Gamma [g] (O.E) became Kappa [k] or Ghamma [ɣ] [(M.G), it’s the reason why albanian use letter K for sound c/q [q] & k [k], where other Latin language use c like prefix COM- writed in Albania KOM- ; I noticed that Beobach checked and reverted some of my add (perun, hypi (mk / ks) / hipi (sq) : is there a tool to know all if his reverting on my contribution ?), it’s not nice, since those word exist & are true. You use falsificated dictionary based on toskian & reformed shqip, you don’t know the gheggian language & there is no gheggian admin to confirm my add… So please be tolerant, I’m conscious that I’m just a student who try to add some content for all world, perhaps i’m make mistake, but just be more comprehensive and positive upon me and improve not remove. I have been blocked one month by dictator like Ivan Štambuk (for telling that obedience is عبد / عباد) or reverted by Vahag (mbret / zot) using book writed by Vladimir Orel (Israel, Tel Aviv), but I keep in mind that 10 years ago Serbian Orthodox / Slavic Communist take pleasure to exterminate my people & falsificate our language in 1947 after victory against the National Socialist… Thanks to be more open-minded toward other (respect article 19 of U.N.O Universal Human Rights), if this Wiktionary is just about political interest I will not add any more entries, since I just lose my time if someone else remove my add… (also I’m sure that etymology of Obediô from Oboediô is not Ob+Avdiô) Gmazdên 04:06, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
What means IMO, RFC & RFV ??? Gmazdên 04:35, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
I stopped adding Arabic because of all of the arguments from so many people who were just beginning to learn it. I decided that life is too short to put up with all of that abuse, and if the beginners want Arabic to be done differently, let them do it themselves. Since I stopped, nobody else did any, so Arabic is in limbo at the moment.
IMO = « in my opinion ». RFC = « request for clean-up ». RFV = « request for verification ». —Stephen (Talk) 06:10, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
Beoback your profile don’t show what language you speak & write, are you albanian ? Why do you verify language that you don’t know, with use of dictionary made by an russian israeli based on falsificated toskian dialect, why do you removed mret redirection to mpret or mbret, are you trying to confirm a invented language by removing prove of origin ??? And I would like that you ask me before removing my add, perhaps I have some explication that you don’t know… Gmazdên 17:11, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
I don’t understand why you say the low quality of his work ? (his edits are mostly bad, rarely if ever useful). I use the structure of most wiktionary english word, with ==Language==, ===Etymology===, ===Pronunciation=== (I noticed that lot of wikiword don’t have IPA or reference, or related), ===Noun===, ====Related terms====, ====Synonyms====; ====References==== (someone tell me that I need to add this for proving my add), has I said before I use Lingvosoft, Babylon 8 & « translate.google.com », my definition are correct, since I use electronic dictionary. You check in printed dictionary, well, but don’t say low quality (since his lingvosoft & Babylon 8 the responsible) ??? And about theses entries I created what’s the problem with them the definition are correct ??? Just one question how to add inflected form like m (singular, plural) & f(singular, plural) with a good syntax, don’t forget I’m a beginner, about coerator why did you not keep this word in curator related term or in etymology ??? Gmazdên 08:14, 27 January 2011 (UTC)
Inflected forms can be entered like preguntó and hombres. Electronic dictionaries and computer translating programs are full of errors and do a poor job. Many of the words or translations entered in them were done by uneducated people, people who don’t speak the language well, speakers of various dialects, and so on. Please do not bring anything from an electronic source. I don’t understand your question about coerator. Coerator is Old Latin (Archaic Latin), not the classical language. Coerator did not come from curator, since curator is classical and therefore more recent. —Stephen (Talk) 10:57, 28 January 2011 (UTC)
I’m saying why do you not keep in etymology or related term of curator page, the word coerator. Does coera, procoerator & procoerator word exist ?. About, inflected form does your syntax function with Albanian words (any page link for syntax code) ? What book do you suggest then ? Do you know a good archaic latin & greek lexicon ? I would like that you add a function in wiktionary to list all word from a language (hope you added archaic Latin has a language), I searched this tool but I didn’t find (for Old Ellêniqë). Gmazdên 20:49, 28 January 2011 (UTC)
It is not usual to link Classical Latin words to their Archaic predecessors. Coerator is not a different word, but just an older orthography. Classical Latin words are linked immediately to Proto-Indo-European if this is known, or to some non-Indo-European source if that is known. I don’t believe that procurator was used at all in Old Latin…that term only came about in the Classical language. Please forget about Old Latin. Old Latin is not important in modern etymologies and is only of passing interest to students specializing in the Latin language. Until you know Latin at a level of at least Babel-3, you should not concern yourself with Archaic Latin and you should not be entering those words, especially if you don’t know how to decline them and don’t know which vowels are long and which short.
Archaic Latic is not considered a separate language, it has the same language code as Classical Latin, i.e., la. As to Albanian inflected forms, yes, the syntax functions with that. If an Albanian noun form is in the plural, it works just like hombres, except you use sq instead of es. —Stephen (Talk) 00:28, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
Hi, the meaning of Old Latin Coerator & Orô is better than modern Curô by Urô (heal by fire ??? really strange I think)… Also, you didn’t corrected unë etymology (modified by Oemnipedista who don’t speak Shqip but believe russian israeli book not authenticated by Gheggian Ministry of Language ! I proved that the explication of Vladimir is false… Do you know a link to a list of archaic latin word with variation with classical ? Gmazdên 12:19, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
He would be nice that you add new language code for archaic latin and for gheggian albanian to differentiate the sq (toskian) dialect, perhaps using (code ks : kosova or else), please. A gheggian wiki would be wonderful, to keep memory of variation. Thanks for your kindness and patient (explication, any wiki link for syntax ?), Good day. Gmazdên 02:00, 30 January 2011 (UTC)
Can I re add laj to synonym of pastroj page ??? I checked para and in etymology he would be usefull to add παράς (parás). In qen, somehone remove my information, can you re add since it’s more complete : « deviated to çan (still used in Xhakova, Kosova) then çen (still used in Gheggian dialect) and reformed (1947) in Albania by the communist power to qen. » Gmazdên 10:21, 30 January 2011 (UTC)
I was never able to understand what you were saying, and you wanted to wait for a Gheg admin. I didn’t correct unë because of this…I don’t know how to correct it. You should drop the subject of Vladimir, nobody here knows anything about him. You are the only person who ever mentions his name. We have no idea who he is and we do not know his book.
There are print dictionaries that list archaic words, but I do not know of anything online. There is no ISO code for Old Latin (appropriate since Old Latin is not very important). The ISO language code for Gheg Albanian is aln, and Tosk is als, so Gheg words can be added under the language name Gheg using the language code aln. It is possible to make a Gheg Wikipedia and/or a Gheg Wiktionary, but it requires a lot of work. You would have to translate all of the wiki terms into Gheg, such as My talk, My preferences, My watchlist, My contributions, Log out, Page, Discussion, View source, History, Watch, Toolbox, What links here, Related changes, Upload file, Special pages, Printable version, Permanent link, and thousands of other terms. It is a huge job and you really need at least three Gheg speakers to work on it together for many hours.
Yes, it is a good idea to add laj as a synonym of pastroj. I can’t add an etymology for qen because I don’t know the etymolgy, and I cannot understand what you wrote about it. If we can’t understand your etymology, then of course someone will remove it, because it serves no purpose if it makes to sense to anyone. —Stephen (Talk) 12:31, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
Hi, Stephën, it’s not me who mentioned his name but Ivan Stambuk in zot#Reference and Vahagn Petrosyan mbret#References, I searched who is this guy and I find it in Wikipedia. And the etymology used in unë is from his (300$) book p.486 , it’s why I’m talking about him, still I proved is explication is false, cause he use +1400AD reference book, but Shemitic Ana/Ênê and Old Latin Unus are more older than Hypothetical Old Albanian (Formula e Pagëzimit (1462), Fjalori i Arnold Fon Harfit (1497), Perikopeja e Ungjillit të Pashkës ( fundi i sh.XV-fillimi sh.XVI)), first albanian language never existed since we speak shqip (scipio latin), the name of this nation exist since Society of Nation created it in, when Ottoman empire collapsed after 1918, before we were Rumelia, and before Byzantine & before Ellêno-Macedonian, the Turkish term of Turkey is false to, cause they are not Altaic/Asiatic people like Turkistan but white Caucasian/Persian…
I writed in Etymology of qen, that in Macedonia we use çên [ʧɛn], and in Xhakova a city of Kosovo they use çan [ʧan]. So the deviation of word from the root is Canus → çan [ʧan] → çên [ʧɛn] → qên (sq[ʨɛn]).
To create the wiki gheg, we should perhaps first make a excel word list with toskian, gheggian, dialectal & root. And after create a program that convert automatically the toskian word in gheggian using the excel database (xml or else), I searched for such list, or a extracting tool to get term list from a an electronic albanian dictionary like Lingvosoft or Office (star or microsoft), but I didn’t find it. I’m not programmer but I can help for the word I know, I will talk to my cousin who are teacher in Macedonia to check the complete term list, if 50 person help me, we each can correct 1000 word. Perhaps we need first to create a SQL / XML page to list the word (tosk, dialect, gheg & root, add variant in and then make an automatic translation from albanian wiki to gheg. I can’t do all alone, I’m not rich I have to work to win money. I add word because, I don’t have job actually, so I have time, but complete a wiki need a team of people more knowledgeable than me, my mother can help me because she was teacher, but she don’t know how to use computer and how to program in Wiki Code. I’m from Belgium, and I don’t know all word, and I don’t know all variant from all gheggian city, the best would be to get list of term of each city from messenger communication and compare automatically difference, and then propose a corrected version based upon source and etymology, but for that we need a programmer and I’m not one. Gmazdên 13:24, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
« Deviation of word from the root » doesn’t make sense in English. There isn’t anything written there that I can understand or use.
If you are talking about a Gheg Wikipedia, you have to start in the incubator (Main Page). You’ll need to translate all of the wiki terms, messages, warning, guidelines, etc., before you will be able to leave the incubator. After that, you can start writing or translating articles in Gheg. If you want to make a Gheg Wiktionary, you have to apply here. I’m afraid I don’t know anything about SQL, XML or other program applications. —Stephen (Talk) 13:56, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
I’m sorry, I don’t speak English everyday, and for me it’s a bit difficult to communicate in this manner, perhaps we can continue in French ? Atalaes removed laj in pastroj synonym, so I prefer ask Admin before re add to not have problem… Gmazdên 14:02, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
Conversational French would be no problem, but this would require the use of technical French terms, French etymology language, and that would probably be too confusing. I think we have to forget about etymologies for the moment, communication is too difficult. —Stephen (Talk) 14:18, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
To link to a specific language, use [[wikt:cool#Dutch|cool]]. —Stephen (Talk) 20:22, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
Thanks Goodness. Still I really want to do something about UNÊ, the definition of Vladimir Orel cause me problem, I disagree with Omnipaedistia add (definition is false and his explication to), and I don’t understand why he remove the Arabic (Semitic) link & why not to add Uno (Unus, Unique, 1 I), if he add some info that he believe to be correct, why does not keep info of others ? I can add ANA/ÊNÊ by my self but if someone reverse it would be unpleasant… Is there a Great Judge in Wiktionary for such case ? Gmazdên 22:42, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
No, but the etymology must be logical and correctly formatted and entered in understandable English. That’s the problem, we have no way of understanding what the etymology should be, so we can’t write a logical, understandable etymology. —Stephen (Talk) 23:16, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
Ok, but why do you keep the Vladimir Orel Etymology ? It’s not an Shqip (Scipio Latin), and I checked his book and they are lot of error. Gmazdên 09:49, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
I don’t know anything about Vladimir Orel, but I am not competent to judge or edit the etymology. —Stephen (Talk) 10:09, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
I propose this Etymology : From Latin unus (un·us, one), uno (un·ɔ, single), cognate with Arabic أنا (’ana, I), Hebrew אני (ani, I) & Latin unicus (uniq·us, only, singular, one and no more). Gmazdên 10:37, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
Those look like cognates, not etymons. It might be cognate with either the Latin word or the Arabic word (but not both, since there is no evidence that the Latin and Arabic are related at all). It looks like a lot of guessing and very little solid evidence. —Stephen (Talk) 10:45, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
Still you keep Vladimir Ethymology and there is no prove that is correct since he link the word to Greek yes & screen (I said before he don’t use Arabic, Persian, Turkish, Hindu book in his reference)… Shqip (Scipio Latin) has a lot of word with Latin root, and I believe that Semitic I (ANA/ANI) have same structure than UNÊ (Vowel+N+Extension), but has you know A is singular vowel in Arabic & U plural. I would like to add my etymology, I will not remove the Vlad one, but I would like to be sure that my add would no be reverte, I explained to you with word crimen & جرم that arab & latin are related… If you don’t like etymology word : « cognate with » with what should I replace then ? Gmazdên 10:53, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
I didn’t write it, so I don’t keep it. It was written by someone else and kept by someone else. If it is wrong, then it is a blemish on the reputation of the one who wrote it. I am not competent to edit it one way or the other. Please stop mentioning Vladimir, it makes you sound neurotic. I do not know who Vladimir is and I have never seen his book.
You have to forget about this etymology until you learn English better and until you find concrete evidence. Until then, if it is wrong, then it is on the one who wrote it.
There are a small number of words that Latin borrowed from Arabic, and a few that Arabic borrowed from Latin. Other than those few borrowings, Latin and Arabic are not related whatsoever. I know all about the Nostratic theory, but no one has ever found one bit of evidence in support of it. Any such genetic relationship was more than 40,000 years ago, and languages have changed so much since then that it is impossible to prove a genetic connection.
As I said, I am not competent to edit this etymology. I will not edit this etymology. Please drop the subject and move on to something new. —Stephen (Talk) 11:16, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
With who should I talk or ask then ? Can we bring Omnipaedistia here ? This case concern me (unê, ênê, onë) and my people and I don’t like that a foreigner that even don’t speak Shqip remove link to Arabic or Latin root… I think I proved what I said. So if you can’t help me, tell me who can then. Omnipaedista is Admin ? I have understanded that the Tosk are Orthodox and it seems that they to don’t want to keep Muslim or Latin word or root in their falsificated language Etymology, but if so, can I add Tosk in definition and created an Gheggian etymology like anmik & armik, I tried to use syntax {{l|aln & {{l|als but this bug… Gmazdên 11:34, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
You can try to discuss with him on his talk page. There is no other choice that I know about. —Stephen (Talk) 11:58, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for your advice, but what about the syntax {{l|aln|word} & {{l|als|word} how to use in page definition ? Is Omnipaedistia admin ? About the book of Vladimir Orel Albanian Etymology Dictionary p.253, I noticed an other error, he link « protects » : mbron (tosk) / prun (gheg) to imparo, but it’s impero (Imperator, Perun God of Thunder, Lightnings Zeus), he seems to use contrary etymology for Latin term using… Stephën, I understand that you are not Shqip, but if someone falsificated your Mother tongue (English language), I’m sure that you would be trying to correct, like I do, did you know that the insurgency in Kosovo started when they (socialo-communist) imposed Tosk Dialect at University by Law (1990).
About Albanian etymology, when I check English word etymology (like peace the wiki team allow definition with « related to », « akin to », « cognate with », so why do you (Admins) not allow for UNÊ (Unus or Anus ? أنا (’ana, I), אני (ani, I))… It’s what I don’t understand, it’s unjust & unequal. Gmazdên 13:35, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
I finded an other term that cognate from Semitic & Latin like crimen, oculis & עגול / جولة [ogul·ɪs], don’t forget that in Egypt, letter djim ج (j) is [g]… Ana/Ênê could became Unê with time & Merging with Unus ??? Gmazdên 21:04, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
I don’t see anything wrong with {{l|aln|word}} or {{l|als|word}}. The only problem is that there is no Gheg or Tosk language section on the word page. If there were, then they would work. There are many, many errors here with words in the languages that I speak, including English. It does not bother me in the least. Your fixation appears to be a pathological obsession and you should try to control yourself and let this drop. Your life will be much happier if you learn to let go of such petty things. Ana did not become unus. This is well understood in linguistics, and the subject to too complex to discuss in a small paragraph here. You need to take a linguistics course at university for two to four years, then you will understand.
This is my FINAL word on this matter. I will not reply to any other question about the etymology of unë. I am finished with it, the matter is dead. It is an ex-matter. —Stephen (Talk) 23:22, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
Ok, thanks for response (still you didn’t tell me if Omnipaedista is admin), I will search an Gheggian Admin for the une case. Thanks for your help. Last question before I drop the subject, what word should I use then to link Ana/Ênê to definition : From Latin unus (un·us, one), uno (un·ɔ, single) unicus (uniq·us, only, singular, one and no more), look like Arabic أنا (’ana, I), Hebrew אני (ani, I). Correct my phrase because I want to keep the link. Gmazdên 10:16, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
No, he is not an admin. There is no Gheg admin here, but there might be one on the Albanian Wiktionary or Wikipedia. I don’t understand your question, but there is no connection between unus and أنا. —Stephen (Talk) 12:02, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
Thanks so much for your help, good & nice Day. Gmazdên 14:02, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

IPA gheggian k [q or k] anmik

Hi, I speak Albanian, and I’m sure that the gheggian K is pronounced [q], they are some word where we use [k], but for anmik is [q]… In Gheggian (K have two pronunciation [q & k]) Thanks

Read This I explain why C/Q Ellênika became K in Byzantinë…

The Q in Albania became [ʨ], because qoppa [q] ancient value 100 became Tshima value 100 Ϭ/ϭ in Coptic numerology, writed in Cyrillic Ҁ/ҁК/кЌ/ќ

The value 90 is not Qoppa but San I also believe that the value 90 in modern Greek shaped Ϟ/ϟ is a variant of San Ϻ ϻ [ʂ / ʦ] and not of the qoppa Ϙ/ϙ [q], in Greek a variant form of qoppa exist and look like the Cyril one… Gmazdên 12:51, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

01234567891020304050607080901002003004005006007008009001000
EllênicΑΒΓΔΕϜΖΗΘΙΚΛΜΝΞΟΠϺϘΡΣΤΥ/ͶΦΧΨϠΩ
Etruscan𐌀𐌁𐌂𐌃𐌄𐌅𐌆𐌇𐌈𐌉𐌊𐌋𐌌𐌍𐌎𐌏𐌐𐌑𐌒𐌓𐌔𐌕𐌖𐌘𐌗𐌙𐌜𐌚
Old LatinABCDEFZHIKLMNOPQRSTVX
LatinABC→G/GHDEVG→ƷHTHIK/KHLMNXOPQ→C/ĆRS/SHTU↔W/YF↔PHCHZÔ
Persianاب (b)ج (j) / گد (d)ه (h)ڤز (z) / ژح ()ط ()ي (y)ك (k)ل (l)م (m)ن (n)س (s)ع (ʿ)پص () / چق (q)ر (r)ش (š)ت (t) / ث ()و (w)ف (f)خ ()ذ ()ظ ()غ ()
Byzantineαβγδεϛζηθικλμνξοπϟρσςτυφχψω
CyrillicЪАБГ/Ѓ/ҔДЕВЗ/ЖИѲІКЛМНѮОПЧ/ЏҀ/ЋРС/ШТУ/ЫФХ𐌙Ц/ЅѠ
Phônetic[ə][a][b↔v][g↔ɣ][d↔ð][e↔ɛ][v↔f][z↔ʒ][ɛ↔i][t↔θ][ɪ↔y][k↔x][l][m][n][ks↔gz][o][p][sˤ↔ʂ] [ʧ↔ʤ][q↔c, ʨ][r][s↔ʃ][θ↔t][u↔w]/[y][f↔ɸ][qʰ↔χ→kʰ][ps][zˤ↔ʐ] [ʦ↔ʣ][ɔ]
Thanks for correcting me, I hate making mistakes. In Gheg is the letter q still [tɕ]? (Actually, I write q and gj as [cɕ] and [ɟʑ], because there’s definitely a noticeable difference between those sounds and the [tɕ] and [dʑ] in other languages, but that’s not really important at the moment) — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 14:24, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for you add, to tell you truth I don’t know the sound [c], but I believe that [c & ʨ] are same sound Ћћ / Ćć in Serbian and Ќ/ќ in Macedonian. The GJ is [ɟ] Ѓѓ Macedonian, [ʑ] is a sound that I don’t know, but Serbian use in Ђђ / Đđ [dʑ]. Gmazdên 14:45, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Two more questions: First one is, are you sure it’s [q] (pronounced further back in the mouth), or [c] (palatal, pronounced close to the front)? I notice you mentioned a comparison to Ќ, which is palatal in Macedonian (I think [c]).
Second question, in Gheg are the forms anmiq, anmiku and anmiqtë correct? — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 14:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I speak arab and I know difference between Kaf/Kappa & Qaf/Qoppa, and in Skopje, we use [q] sound, some word use [k], but for this one i’m sur is [q] & not [k], because in old latin C is [g / q], like Caius → Gaius & Pecunia → Pequnia Reference. I mention Ќ, cause i explain that Qoppa became Tshima and in modern macedonian there is no Qoppa Ҁҁ but only Кк that variate has Ќќ.

I never eard these form, but perhaps other city use it, in Skopje we use anmik, they are 47 dialect in all Shqipëri. Gmazdên 14:50, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

How much do you know about Tosk? That’s the only form of Albanian I’m really comfortable using, I know very very little about Gheg — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 14:55, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

I have to confront toskan dialect using electronic dictionary (for my albanian translation), and I noticed that those word were really different from gheg & root origin, I readed history of this language I learned that he was imposed in 1947 by Enver Hoxha. I don’t like this dialect, because I speak Gheg, French, English and I’m studying Latin so I constated, that the toskian is realy falsified language based upon a code that I deciphered. Gmazdên 15:00, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

It might not be as conservative, but I still like Tosk :p — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 15:05, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

It’s albanian, but realy deviated one. To tell the truth French, Portuguese, English, Italian, Spanish, Rumanian, Albanian are all Latin deviation. But the Tosk, is realy deformed variant of Gheg & Latin. I noticed that S became SH, TH became T, PR became MBR. In french -θɪɔn became -sɪɔn and in English -ʃɪɔn , based on letter Þþ [ʃo] who is [ʃ] in greek and [θ] in latin. Other exemple, the Latin G [ʒ] became [ʤ] in English. It’s a code and it come from hebrew / arabian alphabet where letter have two valor. Gmazdên 15:13, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

I think Tosk might just be like English. It’s not a Romance language, but it has a lot of words derived from Latin. — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 15:14, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Tosk are more Greek (Orthodox) than Latin (Roman Catholic), but still they are Shqiptar and first earthling so we are brother. To tell the truth (truni) Shqip has a lot of word from Greek, Latin, Persian, Arab, Slavic, Hindu and others, therefore, it’s interesting language made of a lot of source, this make his richness. But you should admit, that based upon root, some word are falsificated by a code, that only the temple and priest knows and that I deciphered and I want to teach to anyone. To know this code check Armenian alphabet east & western variant, look Georgian to. Gmazdên 15:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

The first earthling… Amazing… Hi Opi! :) —Dijan 17:33, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
Hey Dijan, haven’t talked to you in a while :) Hope all’s well — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 17:38, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

If you speak shqip, why did you not add babel level in your user page ? Do you readed my Mbret/Mret & Unë discussion in my user page ? What should I do, to keep information that I added without being removed by the reader of book of Vladimir Orel ? And about anmik why do not use the ISO code that gived today Stephen to me : « Gheg Albanian is aln, and Tosk is als » ? Gmazdên 19:51, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

It’s not on my page because I’m sq-1 and I only keep things on my page that I speak at at least level 2 unless I’m focusing on them currently. You can look at User:Opiaterein/Babel for more things I speak in small amounts.
I don’t use als and aln because I don’t use the headers ==Gheg Albanian== and ==Tosk Albanian==, I only use the code sq for Albanian. Gheg and Tosk both go under there. If there are differences, I use the templates {{Gheg}} and {{Tosk}} on the definition line. You can see that in use at anmik and armik. — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 21:48, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Ok but Tosk is Standard of Albania, and Gheg have been adopted has standard language in Media of Kosovo, also this variant is used in Macedonia and north Albania & South Montenegro, so perhaps we should make a difference between those (Localisation) ? You didn’t have advice about my problem with remover of my add ? Are you an admin ? Gmazdên 22:15, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

I noticed you add conjugation of Pastroj, I want to add mbroj/mbron (tosk) & pruj/prun (gheg) : protects, but the conjugation of Prun is not the same has pastroj, What syntax should I use ? The Prun use U instead of O like :

unëtiai/ajonejuata/ato
presentprujprunprunprujmipruniprujnë
imperfectprujaprujeprunte???prunim ???prunit ???prunin ???
simple pastpruvapruvêprujti ???pru???pru???pru???
futuredo të prujdo të prujshdo të prujëdo të prujmëdo të prujnido të prujnë

And so on… Gmazdên 11:25, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

I don’t know if Gheg verbs are conjugated exactly the same way as Tosk verbs but pastroj is an -oj verb so it needs a different conjugation template than one that ends in -uj. Category:Albanian conjugation-table templates contains all the Albanian conjugation templates that we currently have. — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 15:07, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
Hm, could you look at âsht to check that example sentence, and fix it if it’s incorrect? — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 15:13, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi, checked you added Asht, in Macedonia we write it ësht like in Shqipëri but we pronounces [ɑ̃ʃt] & not [ãʃt] (you need to add etymology from latin EST → EŠT → ËSHT → ÃSHT). Also friend is not ANMIKI (inimicus : who means enemy) but MIKI (amicus), or SHOÇI/SHOQI, we use JÊM (Gheg) and not IM (tosk), also we use ÇIKY [ʧiky] and not KY [ky] ([Exemple], KY exist in Gheg to, but for this sentence, ÇIKY/QIKY is more correct… The conjugation of PRUN look like « Template:sq-conj-uaj » but should be corrected to « Template:sq-conj-uj ». Gmazdên) 17:28, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

About Prun / Mbron Etymology from Vladimor Orel Albanian Etymology Dictionary p.253, I noticed an other error, he link « protects » : mbron (tosk) / prun (gheg) to latin imparô, but it’s parô imperô (Imperator, Perun God of Thunder, Perênija (Gheg) / Perëndia (Tosk), Lightnings Zevs Ʒɛvosθ), he seems to use contrary etymology for Latin term using… Gmazdên 17:36, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps you could add anmiq, anmiku, anëmik and anmiqtë in Anmik word variant… Gmazdên 10:28, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

It seems that we must add a conjugation variant for the verb LAJ. Gmazdên 10:34, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

I noticed you removed the phrase : keep it like « Qiky/Çiky ãsht miki jêm ». Also for ËSHT/ÂSHT [ɑ̃ʃt] dont usë  [ɑ̃] for nasalition but à [ɑ̃]. The Variant Âsht was writed in Gueg Page, and used  has a phonetic value for sound [ɑ̃], but in Macedonia and Kosovo we write it Ësht but pronounce it [ɑ̃]. Gmazdên 10:52, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

I checked word kënaq, you write the gheg variant (knaç/knaq) like Tosk, but know this lot of Tosk word using Ë, are writed without Ë in Gheg. Also, in Gheg we don’t pronounce the Ë in end of Word. Like shkatërroj / shkatrrôj, këta / Kta, nganjëherë / kanihêrë, shtrembëroj / shtremôj and others… Gmazdên 22:58, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

I believe the PR became MBR in albanian because in Arabic Alphabet there is no P and it’s replaced by B, the MR means rebellion & bitter (acidity). This falsification is a pun from the hebrew/arabian. Gmazdên 11:24, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Archives

Please don’t edit my user talk archives. Talking in something resembling English would also help. Thank you. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:02, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Ok, it’s just to complete what we talked before… Hope you readed. Gmazdên 13:12, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
I had to add a link to qoppa Ϙ for opiaterein discussion, and I noticed that you reversed IPA to [k]. I had again to correct to [q], since is the old Latin & archaic Ellênic pronunciation. Gmazdên 13:20, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Language Map removed by Local Hero

This map is usefull, even in Albania page, why remove ? Nemzag (talk) 22:05, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Albania Dialect Map

Hi, I noticed you removed the map, I would like to add it in Albania Language section. Can I ? Are you an Admin ? Nemzag (talk) 22:11, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Hello. I removed the map because that section is supposed to be about the languages spoken in Albania not just the Albanian language although it is the most spoken language in that country. That map focuses on only the Albanian language and it also shows dialects of that language in different countries which is irrelevant to the article as it is just supposed to focus on Albania. That map would be useful in the Albanian language article as that article discusses the different dialects of the Albanian language and where they are spoken. Regards. —Local hero talk 23:03, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Hi, I added the image in Albania Language, if you like you can add in the Albanian Language page. This map is useful for Albanian page, cause it shows the propagation of the language that make us albanian, and the section talk about Tosk & Gheg, so I think this image should be added there. We speak albanian despite border. Nemzag (talk) 00:33, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Okay, whatever. —Local hero talk 03:26, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Multiple edits

Hi. Would you be able to use the preview button to test your edits before you save them, instead of making many edits to the same text in a short space of time? It would be easier for the people patrolling Recent Changes to mark edits as legitimate or vandalism. Thanks. Equinox 17:37, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

OK, are you speaking in User Talk Page or Else ? When I write to people, sometime I add information after I searched to get, and I move from one place to other, so it’s why I add multiple edit… Sorry, it’s the way I’m doing add. To tell you the truth, I discovered the button preview just three day ago. And sometime I forgot to use. Sorry, Guy. On what page precisely ? Gmazdên 17:42, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
Perhaps, I suggest, you could add a function in Wiki, to merge multiple edit in short time from same user automatically. To facilitate add control. Gmazdên 18:02, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

OCULIS & עגול

I think Old Latin oculis (ogul·is, eye) was pronounced [ogulis], I finded a term that cognate עגול جولة. Gmazdên 21:00, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Derë sandali

Hi, you checked page ? I don’t understand why you remove ipa & persian etymology ??? Gmazdên 12:49, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Mglovefun your reversed sandali without checking ? Gmazdên 12:53, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Etymology

From {etyl|ota|sq} {term|صندلی|tr=sandali|sc=ota-Arab|lang=ota}, from {etyl|fa|sq} {term|صندلی|tr=sandali|lang=fa}.

Why exactly did you create an Albanian section then immediately nominate it for verification. Are you fairly confident that this exists, or do you think it doesn’t exist? Mglovesfun (talk) 12:54, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
Re derë, why add {{rfv}}? Do you believe that this word does not exist? Do you often add etymologies and pronunciation to words that don’t exist? Mglovesfun (talk) 12:56, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Yes, those word exist in Skopje, and has you can see in this page Etymology, some albanian came from other language. I added request to be more precise. Gmazdên 12:59, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

That’s not {{rfv}} then, use {{attention|sq|your comment here}}, which derë already has. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:01, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok, but can you keep those word please ??? I add RFV cause I believed his a call for Admin structure page Verification, and not a Word Verification, I’m mistaken. Has you can see lot of Albanian Word are from Foreign Languages Etymology. Gmazdên 13:04, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

I would like that etymology of Zot using Life from Ancient Greek ζῶ… Can you add in this form « {etyl|grc|sq} {term|ζῶ|tr=zô|lang=grc} » like that, zot would appears on this page : http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:sq:Ancient_Greek_derivations ???

Thanks, and what about sandali ? Gmazdên 13:45, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

AMË

Hi, I checked AMË page, and I noticed that Ivan Stambuk added unpleasant odour, but in my dictionary the meaning is matrix for tosk, also in Gheg it’s means « but » from persian AMA & Ottoman turkish, how to add ? Can you help ?

Etymology

From Ottoman Turkish اما (ama), from Persian اما (ama).

Pronunciation

Conjunction

2011

  1. but
  2. however

Thanks Gmazdên 12:44, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

I also add pronounciation & etymology with RFC add, for Derë & Sandali, but Mglovefun reversed ? Can you help ? Gmazdên 12:52, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi, JorisvS replaced IPA definition of derë [deɾə] by [dɛrə] who mean pig (derr), what should I do ? Can you respond please ? I’m sure it’s in gheg it’s [deɾ] & not [dɛr], has a explained about we don’t pronounce the Ë at end. Gmazdên 22:09, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

I think it would be wise to start putting Gheg under its own L2 header, so that there will be ==Albanian== and ==Gheg Albanian==. As far as I’m aware, there’s only [ɛ] in Standard Albanian and Tosk, and it would be a hassle to try to treat all three dialects under one header. I just don’t think it would work, so if you’d like to start making ==Gheg Albanian== entries, I can make more templates for you. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 23:42, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for response, I don’t know if Tosk use [e] or only [ɛ], but I’m sure that Gheg use it. Also JorisvS use [r] in his IPA derë but if you check this Page, you will observe that R is [ɾ] & RR is [r], so I think he make a mistake, so if he mistake for R, he make mistake for E. How to correct please ? I’m sure that is [deɾə] & not [dɛrə]. It’s more correct than saying pig for door ??? Still [e] epsilon exist in Greek Language & Alphabet, so its really astonished me if this sound doesn’t exist in Toskian (for Greek term), I know that [ɛː] became [i] after Byzantine, but I’m sure that [e] exist in Skopje dialect. Also Hypjê (gheg) became Hipje (Tosk) because Ypsilon [y] became [i], in Skopje we still use ancient pronunciation. Gmazdên 01:04, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

I would like to add etymology to Zot, add next to Life, Ancient Greek ζῶ in this form « {etyl|grc|sq} {term|ζῶ|tr=zô|lang=grc} » like that, zot would appears on this page : http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:sq:Ancient_Greek_derivations ??? And what about sandali ? Gmazdên 01:25, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Category

The reason you have Category:sq:Etymology at the bottom of your page is because you have [[Category:sq:Etymology]] in #Continuation. —Stephen (Talk) 01:37, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Derë

Hi, Someone JorisvS replaced IPA, has you can see he added [dɛrə] who his pronunciation of derrë (pig), if you check this Page, you will observe that R is [ɾ] & RR is [r], so I think he make a mistake, how to correct please ? I’m sure that is [deɾə] & not [dɛrə] Gmazdên 22:01, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Can you also check Sandali, please ? I would like to add second definition to amë (Ivan Stambuk added unpleasant odour, but in my dictionary the meaning is matrix for tosk, also in Gheg it’s means « but » from persian AMA & Ottoman turkish, how to add ? Can you help ?), but I don’t know how to separate the two definition

The definition look like :

Etymology

From Ottoman Turkish اما (ama), from Persian اما (ama).

Pronunciation

Conjunction

2011

  1. but
  2. however

Thanks Gmazdên 22:05, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

I noticed, that you corrected the R [ɾ] but not the E [e], has I said Tosk are neighboor of Greek, epsilon [e] exist in Greek Language & Alphabet, so its really astonished me if this sound doesn’t exist in Toskian (like for Greek term), in Albania E & K have two valour [e/ɛ] & [k/q]… So please correct, has I tell you before, I’m sure of pronunciation it’s [e] and not [ɛ]… Look this to : Albanian_alphabet. Thanks, can you unreverse my sandali add. Or are you verifying the word ? Gmazdên 10:36, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

If it’s Tosk pronunciation add info next IPA [deɾ·ə] (Tosk) & [deɾ] (Gheg), in Gheg we don’t pronounce the ending Ë [ə] Gmazdên 13:19, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi, correct JorisvS insult please, why he changed derë IPA ? Does he speak Shqip ? Language Babel isn’t shown in his user page, don’t insult my people please, I know it’s [deɾ·ə] and not [dɛr]… Gmazdên 00:42, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

On the Albanian language pages such as Albanian language, it indicates [dɛɾə]. Gheg has many more vowels than Tosk: Gheg Albanian. Nobody is insulting anybody. I am sure that he has found that pronunciation somewhere on Wikipedia. This is what I have been trying to explain to you for years. You are not responsible for the Albanian language or for any other language. You are only responsible for what you write. You do not have to be overly concerned about the mistakes that others make in a language that you know, but you must be absolutely vigilant about what you yourself write. The mistakes that others have made here have not harmed you in any way, but the mistakes that you yourself made have damaged your credibility, and that is why nobody wants to listen to you. You need to ease off the mistakes that others make, and you must make certain that you do not make mistakes in a language that you claim to know. You will lose the respect of other linguists very, very quickly, but it takes a long time indeed to regain their trust.
One thing that we have all learned is that being a native speaker of a language does not necessarily mean that one speaks the standard dialect using the standard pronunciation in an educated fashion. Our biggest headaches come from so-called native speakers who are uneducated in their language, or who left their land as a child and only remember how to talk like a child, or who have no experience in grammar and phonology. The fact that you are a native speaker of Albanian does not count as sufficient credentials. You have to be able to describe it without errors. Sometimes this means that you have to fix errors in the Wikipedia pages. It means that you have to be very careful about adding anything in other languages, such as Arabic. You made so many mistakes in Arabic in the beginning that now nobody wants to listen to you. It will take a long time to fix that, if it is even possible. —Stephen (Talk) 08:34, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

You right, I speak old Gheg, and those are Tosk (Orthodox) falsified Dialect. Don’t matter let them insult them self. I forgot about them, it’s not my problem anymore, I decided that I have to go to Mekkah to perform pilgrim and to learn the Qoran… Thanks for you help anyway. Gmazdên 22:02, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

zonjë (Tosk) & zôjë (Gheg)

Hi, in Macedonia & Kosovo we use Zôjë [zɔɪ], etymology : From « {etyl|grc|sq} {term|ζῶ|tr=zô|lang=grc} » [zɔ], can you add like for anmik & armik ? Also you didn’t added anmiq, anmiku, anëmik and anmiqtë has ===Alternative forms===. Can you help please ? Gmazdên 14:08, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

anmiq, anmiku, anëmik and anmiqtë aren’t « alternative forms », they’re « forms of ». Look at armik and see how they are listed. Also, remember how yesterday I said it might be wise to start using ==Gheg Albanian== headers? — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 15:07, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Yes those language are really different, so it would be preferable to use two header… In expectancy of an unified corrected version based upon source & root… Gmazdên 16:21, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

I changed anmik so it uses Gheg. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 16:34, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Why do you not add « From « {etyl|grc|sq} {term|ζῶ|tr=zô|lang=grc} » [zɔ] » in etymology ? I checked book of Vladimir, and he relate zot [zɔt] & zojë [zɔɪ] to greek life… Has you checked in my previous link for albanian greek term, lot of word are from Greek source… Can you also add a link (#REDIRECT) for zôjë [zɔɪ] for those who write it zojë [zɔɪ] ? Gmazdên 00:45, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

And what about derë, I’m sure we pronounce it [der] in Skopje and I believe that they don’t use the pig pronunciation for door. Do you have an albanian friend friend from Macedonia to ask to ? Gmazdên 00:50, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

We also use zonja (tosk) & zôja/zoja (Gheg) :

Abbreviation [please replace this header]

  1. mrs.

Noun

  1. patroness

This word exist in Czech, the etymology link to Zoê / Ζωή#Greek [zɔɛ → zoi], Greek term for life… I would like to add to. Gmazdên 00:53, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Richard, I believe that your etymology for Zôjë / Zonjë is wrongful, I checked the page GWEN : women & ʒena, and yes ʒêvo is life in slavic, but for Zôjë is related to more older greek Ancient Greek ζῶ (), Zôt & Zôjë are linked to Zô (life & Zevs Ʒêvosθ)… Gmazdên 18:57, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

It wasn’t my etymology. You need to talk to Ivan Štambuk, who know a lot more about Proto-Indo-European than I do.
You need to avoid using your own research as material here. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 20:04, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Ivan use for Shqip Slavic source (like those proposed by the book of Vladimir Orel, Russian Israeli from Tel Aviv University), I believe that Shqip have more ancient Greek, old Latin & Arabic/Persian/Ottoman root… Still has you know the Albanian language was reformed by Communist (Marx) who are Anti-Imperialist (Anti-Roman), because Roman Army destructed their temple in Jerusalem. It’s the reason why they invented lot of erroneous etymology, that they try to confirm with help of book based on a falsified dialect that Enver Hoxha imposed in 1947, telling that albanian/shqiptar are from Illyrian or Pelagian origin, Instead of Roman Clan Scipio. Those theory are interesting, but has I know Illyrian were exterminated by Roman Empire and Pelagian under their (byzantine) control, may be some Shqip individuals have Illyrian, Pelagian or Slavic Origin or maybe caucasian, persian and even Hindu, but still for me the Old Roman & Old Greek source are more realistic. I don’t know Ivan, but his name don’t seem to be Shqip/Albanian, so I prefer ask someone of my nation for Sqiptar/Albanian stuff (Sqiptar clan are known in Molise since +400). Has you know the ancient Greek (-300) alphabet and modern Greek (+800) are really different phonologically, since Byzantine removed letter and changing value to confuse & divide people, since Cyrillic alphabet is based on modern Greek, the code is wrong and the phonetic value to, like Epsilon [e] becoming Êpsilon [ɛ], Hêta [ɛ] becoming HITA [i], or Ypsilon [y] becoming Ipsilon [i], modern slavic alphabet does not differentiate the [ɔ] with [o], the E [e] & Ê [ɛ], the T [t] & the TH [θ] and the k [k] with [q], they are misleaded, and so they induce others into error, because the alphabet is based upon falsification of origin, I gived you the original code above… Gmazdên 00:13, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

What you’re talking about is doing your own original research, which isn’t allowed here. I’d rather have no etymology than etymology based on original research. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 00:16, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

I’m talking, that’s all, we have right to express, I’m asking your opinion has you seem to be interested in Albanian, the Shqip language concern me, because I’m Shqiptar and I want to protect it. I explain to you, that Slavic Etymology, for Shqip Old Latin & Ancient Greek related word are incorrect. Since Slavic book are more recent than ancient Greek source or even more ancient Semitic (Arab/Hebrew) & Sanskrit (perso-hindo) stuff. I search by my own, and I know that I’m sincere. Gmazdên 00:37, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

It’s fine to be curious and do your own research, you just have to know what’s ok to put here and what’s not. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 00:42, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Do you know that Zonjë in hebrew means prostitute זונה / زنى and fornication in Persian زناء since original spelling is zôjë from ancient Greek Zô life God Zevs, what etymology should I believe, one insulting my people, based on Russian Israeli falsificated language book, or original Ancient Greek source ? Check JorisvS insulting my people telling that derë [deɾ] (Door) is pronounced like Dêrr [dɛr] (pig) ? Has you know modern albanian (after 1945 war) use lot UND instead of UN in lot of word, who means dog in German, or nderoj (der : pig ?) instead of neroj (honor). Please understand, those Tosk (Orthodox) have really bad language, and I would like that you believe me, when I say it’s falsified by Communist. Gmazdên 00:55, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

That sounds like a coincidence to me. You know « voda » is water in Russian, but vagina in Bengali. Is that insulting to Russians? How is zona in Hebrew more offensive to your people than to the Greeks? Some languages are offensive to themselves. In old Persian, aurat meant both « woman » and « imperfection ». These days, it’s considered a sexist word, but it’s still used in Urdu. So I don’t care if something was falsified by communists, I don’t hate communists. Except for totalitarian dictators, but that’s beside the point. JorisvS wasn’t actively trying to insult your people, he just doesn’t know Albanian. I’m getting quite bored of this conversation. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 01:02, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok, then, I will stop, just hope that you add Zoja & Zonja ; and about Voda, Bengali don’t impose Russian Etymology Book to Russia, like they do with Albania… Good bye. Gmazdên 02:12, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

And about your correction of Derë, in Skopje know that we use : « derë f (indefinite plural Dyrë, definite singular dera, definite plural Dyrtë). Gmazdên 02:28, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

That’s why I’ve been using ==Gheg Albanian==. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 02:31, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Please use ==Albanian (Gheg)==, like that definition follow ==Albanian== without others language between them. Gmazdên 02:49, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

I can see your reasoning, but I still don’t like that. We don’t do it for any other related languages/dialects. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 02:51, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Be nice and make an exception for this case, please. It would be more convenient to have the 2 definition following each other. Gmazdên 20:00, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Do you plan to add zôja & zonja ??? Consider adding {{etyl|grc|sq}} {{term|ζῶ|tr=zô|lang=grc}} ; And about Voda, I have a funny word that I invented AQWAGGINA ha ha ha… Gmazdên 21:16, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

If you’re talking about the entries zôja and zonja, no. I don’t feel like taking the time to manually add noun-forms today, or tomorrow, or this month. I might do it by bot at some point, but I’m not going to be doing that manually. Also, I’m not going to add your primary research etymologies. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 21:44, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok then good bye… Gmazdên 19:40, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Albanian Header

Hello, I thought it might be preferable to use the header in this form like that the definitions will follow.

  • Albanian « Not shown : Official/Standard of Albania (since 1947 »
  • Albanian (Gheg)
  • Albanian (Tosk)

What do you think ? Gmazdên 11:04, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Also, has I said before I don’t know if differencing the two dialect is a good idea, because, has you know the Gheg use the correct one, since the Tosk use falsificated word, if you compare with root & term source… I hope that the government of Albania will correct those falsification. Gmazdên 11:14, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I will not play games of favoritism, just so you know. I decided to only separate out Gheg because standard Albanian is based on and mostly the same as Tosk. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 14:05, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

What you call standard is standard of South Albania, the Kosovo have adopted Gheg officially in media, and in daily discussion the Gheg dialect is used in Northern Albania, south Montenegro & West Macedonia… Also, I believe the new government of Albania will probably stop the Tosk utilisation, I proved with example that his a falsification of term.

But I still ask you to use : « Albanian (Gheg) rather than Gheg Albanian like that definition will follow the Albanian « Standard » and precede the Albanian (Tosk), rather than have big space between definition. Gmazdên 15:00, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I’m not sure what you’re talking about. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 19:45, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

derë

Hi, first I would like to ask if you can add language in your user page, I noticed that you replaced IPA, I’m from Makedonia, and I’m sure we use [deɾ·ə], you replaced by [dɛr·ə] who mean pig derr, are you insulting my people ? Gmazdên 12:21, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Well, I’m not talking about anyone’s dialect, but about the Standard. I know there are significant differences between the various Albanian varieties, does your native variety happen to be Gheg? I changed the phonetic brackets to phonemic slashes: from [der] to /dɛɾə/ (I didn’t note then it also said [r], an alveolar trill, which is, I know, written <rr>, which someone else corrected). <e> is phonemically indicated /ɛ/ in Standard (Tosk) Albanian, but there is no contrast with [e], so (phonetic) [ɛ] and [e] are both (phonemic) /ɛ/.

I don’t care about the Tosk dialect. Since a very small part of albanian speaker use this falsificated dialect, that Kosovo, Macedonian and Northern Shqip rejected & don’t like. Pig [dɛr] & Door [deɾ], have nothing common. Are you albanian ? Gmazdên 13:56, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Maybe, but since ‘Albanian’ will be interpreted as referring to the Standard (thus Tosk), mixing Gheg messes things up IMO (given the differences). Given the big differences between the varieties of Albanian, I will not object to a separate Gheg Albanian entry (like at zôjë), even when alongside a (Standard) Albanian entry (quite opposite to Serbo-Croatian, see my contributions). However, I don’t know about other editors, they might oppose/undo such an addition, so this might require a fair amount of discussion. —JorisvS 14:09, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Do you speak Shqip ? Are you Albanian or Greek ? Still you writed [dɛrə] pig (derr, I’m not sure you good enough in albanian phônology to correct my mother tongue. She is teacher and I’m sure of Gheg pronunciation, so your Greek Toskian dialect, it’s not interesting me at all since is a falsificated dialect invented and imposed in 1947 by a dictator… You made error with [r] so to for [ɛ]… It’s me who writed to Stephen to correct you RR [r] with R [ɾ], but he keeped the [ɛ] still is [e] epsilon… Also please add your speaked language in profile. Gmazdên 14:21, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

As I said above. Please try to read carefully what I say (maybe look up words here or there, I notice your English isn’t perfect, so you might miss some things of what I’m saying). The thing with [r] was just a human error (and I’m glad someone else did notice and correct it). I’m not stopping you to add Gheg at derë or anywhere else, but I am saying we shouldn’t mix things up. Also, realize I’m not correcting you. In fact, I would encourage speakers of Gheg to use their language instead of slowly assimilating to Tosk. —JorisvS 14:38, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

You don’t respond my question : are you Shqiptar/Albanian ? Also about language add you knowledge (babel) in user page, please. I’m level 3 English not 5 or 4 but 3… Edit only language that you know at level 4 or 5… Still stop reverse, it’s [e] and not [ɛ] pig & door aren’t related. Make the difference between those two term. Gmazdên 14:45, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I haven’t because it is totally irrelevant. Only what I’ve said above is relevant (at least so far). First read carefully what I’ve written above, then ask for clarification if you don’t understand something I’ve said. After that we can continue this discussion, I hate repeating myself. And if I may remark, I’ve seen your posts here and on Stephen G. Brown’s talk page, from which I suspect en-3 is on the high side for you, no offense. —JorisvS 14:56, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

You think that it’s irrelevant to add language you speak and write while editing a world dictionary ??? It’s really astonishing… Please, don’t insult my people. Good bye. Gmazdên 15:07, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

To this discussion, yes. I wonder, how have I « insulted your people »?? I really don’t see how I can have. —JorisvS 15:14, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Just an advice edit language that you personally speak at level 4 of 5. That’s all, if you don’t understand difference between pig [dɛr·ə] & door [dɛr·ə] it’s your problem, don’t impose to all world, your controversial point of view. Still, I’m sure it’s [deɾ·ə]. Good bye. Gmazdên 15:50, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I edit with sense, if I’m not certain of something, I don’t do it. This does not mean I won’t make mistakes, I’m human just like everyone else, so I’m bound to make mistakes here and there. Sometimes I notice them myselves and fix them, sometimes I don’t and someone else comes by. You are the one who doesn’t seem to be getting my point: Gheg ≠ Tosk. —JorisvS 16:08, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Errare humanum est, I know, but it’s seems that you don’t understand what I say, are you albanian ? What’s your Albanian Level ? Gmazdên 16:22, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

In response to that I’ve said that it doesn’t matter IMO. In the beginning I’ve said why I changed the (phoneTic) [e] to phoneMic /ɛ/, because that’s kind of the convention for Tosk, at least the one I’ve seen. (Do you know what the difference between a phonetic and a phonemic transcription is?) I realize Gheg makes a phonemic distinction between /e/ and /ɛ/ (well, at least now I do), but as I edited it with Tosk in mind that isn’t really very important (well, maybe to you it is; you edit them with only your native Gheg in mind? Then this is what I mean when I say « we shouldn’t mix these up »). —JorisvS 16:41, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Gheg Origin

Mir dita, ky djali I ka fshi informatat e orizhinës e Ghegat (Gheg), a munësh me thir ni admin ? Nemzag (talk) 13:26, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

It is unsourced. You need to cite the specific passage with a reliable source, per wp:rs.Alexikoua (talk) 13:31, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

It’s not me who added this section, but I would like that you keep it there, since it’s also writed in Shqip page of Gheg, if you want source search one, and find and add, don’t remove other add, please ; Thanks… Nemzag (talk) 13:36, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Since it’s sourced it can be readded. Unfortunately I have searched for it but no results found.Alexikoua (talk) 13:41, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I searched and the link of add his http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gheg_Albanian&oldid=353508204, the name of source is mentioned : Author and Politician Pashko VasaNemzag (talk) 13:43, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

and which book/paper does claim this?Alexikoua (talk) 13:45, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Check his page, and read his book, I’m sorry, I don’t added, this information, but it’s there, it’s correct and the info is in Shqip page to, the author source is mentioned, so just keep it, please, thanks. Are you albanian ? Nemzag (talk) 13:49, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Also, Pashko Vasa use his source from « referring to the verse found in the Homer’s Iliad, « beyond the mountains of Akrokeronis, the land is inhabited by the Giants (Greek: γίγας; Latin: GIGAS) ». So I don’t understand what source more you need ? Nemzag (talk) 14:00, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Verification of his claim, i.e. a source that says that « he sayed that ».Alexikoua (talk) 14:02, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Forget about that I don’t added this info but still the explication is good enough two source are mentioned author & old book. So why do you say don’t sourced ??? Please re add and add the wiki code « need source », if someone else knows he will add. Also ask someone in the WikiProject Albania. Thanks. Nemzag (talk) 14:12, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Although this sounds frindge from itself I will restore the sentence with the tags, for ca. a month period.Alexikoua (talk) 14:15, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, I will write in Albania Project Page for someone help. Good day Nemzag (talk) 14:24, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Why do you change the structure of phrase ? Just keep it has it is, please, you removed word Gjiant, Gegant, Gigand, Giant and added Epic is this necessary ? Nemzag (talk) 14:30, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Yes, these words are not necessary for the context, they mean nothing, also Iliad is an ‘Epic’.Alexikoua (talk) 14:42, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Your profile don’t show babel language and where you from ? Can I ask you why do you edit albanian page ? Nemzag (talk) 15:10, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

In general I’m interested in Balkan related topics, this means pov removals is in the daily agenda.Alexikoua (talk) 15:14, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I’m not specialist of abbreviation what does POV means ? Please, I would like that you keep the phrase structure of the adder, respect his contribution. Nemzag (talk) 15:54, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

wp:pov (point of view). Unfortunately no, it was completely bad written, not to mention that without a source this will not stay.Alexikoua (talk) 15:56, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok then, good bye… Nemzag (talk) 16:02, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Thank you. Anything you need just let me know.Alexikoua (talk) 16:06, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Gheg Origin remove by Alexikoua

Mir dita, ky djali I ka fshi informatat e orizhinës e Ghegat (Gheg), a munësh me thir ni admin ? Nemzag (talk) 13:26, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Te duhen referenca per ate qe ke permendur, ti e di kete, ndaj nuk mendoj se do te zgjidhe pune admini. Gjithsesi, perdoruesi Alexikoua e riktheu ndryshimin e vet duke vene nje [citation needed] dhe [original research?]: mendoj se me kete redaktim ka te drejte. Gjithsesi ne kete lidhje te jashtme (External link: Gheg Repartition thuhet gegerishtja nuk kuptohet nga toskerishtja(!) Atehere si u marrkemi vesh ne te dy?!

Gjithe te mirat Empathictrust (talk) 14:45, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Po, unê i thash, me vnu prap, edhe mi shtu wiki kodin për verifikim. Amë spê kuptôj, psê pi zê zori për at seksiôn, masi u kãnë a ty prej 9 muj, edhe po thot se ska sursa, amë ësht e shkrujtme emni Pashko Vasa edhe informata për librinë e Homer’s Iliadin… A munësh, mê nimu për me xhet sursat ? Tung, Zôti na nimôft. Nemzag (talk) 16:00, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

A je admin ? A e njê ni Admin Shiptar e si kâ munësi Gheg ??? Gmazdên (talk) 16:04, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

A munësh me verifiku ket faqën e Ghegat se JorisvS e ka modifiku. Gmazdên (talk) 16:41, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I cannot verify a source to justify the reversal of this edit. It seems like you have taken the information in the Albanian wikipedia here, where it is sourced with Vehbi Bala : PASHKO VASA – portret-monografi, botuar në : Pashko Vasa VEPRA 4, Rilindja, Prishtinë 1989. However, here in the English Wikipedia we have to provide the page number and possibly a quote. If you happen to have Bala’s book, and Bala would qualify as a reliable source, that would be sufficient to justify his claim and revert the edit. But in general unsourced paragraphs can be deleted in the English wikipedia. —Brunswick Dude (talk) 20:05, 7 February 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nemzag (talkcontribs)

I don’t added this section… His this guy who added. Don’t write to me for this problem, I have talked before with someone and we decided that we old one month more to let someone add source, good bye… Gmazdên (talk) 21:48, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

JorisvS

Mir dita, ky JorisvS, e ka ek informatat, amë i ki vnu apêt. A munësh mi vnu fjalën, shysh jan kanë për para, se aj Alexi, i ka ek do terma…

Qështu u kanë :

The renowned Albanian author and politician Pashko Vasa in the 19th century argued that the origin of the word Gheg derives from the word Gjiant, Gegant, Gigand, Giant, referring to the verse found in the Homer’s Iliad, « beyond the mountains of Akrokeronis, the land is inhabited by the Giants (Greek: γίγας; Latin: GIGAS).

E e dryshôj :

The renowned Albanian author and politician Pashko Vasa in the 19th century argued that the origin of the word Gheg derives from the Greek word for giand(Greek: γίγας; Latin: GIGAS), based on the verse found in the Homer’s Epic Iliad: « beyond the mountains of Akrokeronis, the land is inhabited by the Giants ».[citation needed][original research?]

Lejê çêshtu :

The renowned Albanian author and politician Pashko Vasa in the 19th century argued that the origin of the word Gheg derives from the word Gjiant, Gegant, Gigand, Giant, referring to the verse found in the Homer’s Iliad, « beyond the mountains of Akrokeronis, the land is inhabited by the Giants (Greek: γίγας; Latin: GIGAS). [citation needed][original research?]

Kam problem me kêt JorisvS në Wiktionary

Ja kam shtu phônetikën e fjalës Derë [deɾ·ə], aj e drôj me [dɛr·ə] (derr), po fôli mê të amë spo kuptôn mêndimin tem… Stephëni e korrektôj mê [dɛɾ·ə] se i thash se R ësht [ɾ] & RR [r], amë jam i sigurt, së në Shkup e përdormi [deɾ]… A munësh me nimu ? Unê jam i shkupit se di dialectin a kufitar e Greqiës, po besôj se nuk ë [dɛr·ə]… Gmazdên (talk) 17:08, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Pe kërkôj ni Admin Shqiptar (Për Project Albania) a e një do një ? Gmazdên (talk) 17:09, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I understand you well, no need to change your words, if you think I don’t get them. Anyway you seem to speak a « hard » form of Gheg dialect. And I’m not speaking the dialect « of the border with Greece »: it’s just the standard Albanian (gjuha letrare). Anyway I don’t see any problem with your discussion with the user JorisvS. He had just made a typing mistake in the pronunciation of [dɛɾ·ə] and there was no conflict between you…
Sa per admin qe me pyete sinqerisht nuk njoh.
Shqiptimi i fjales Derë ne dialektin tosk eshte [dɛɾ·ə], sa per shqipen standarte ajo lexohet sic shkruhet, pra po ashtu: [dɛɾ·ə].
Gjithsesi per origjinen e fjales Gege nga Pashko Vasa nuk gjeta reference te duhur, shiko ne literaturen tende mbase ne ndonje liber etimologjie. S’mund te ndryshoj me gje pasi me mungojne referencat. Gjeta kete[1] qe nuk eshte se te ndihmon shume… Mbase ti mund ta ndryshosh vete seksionin e origjines se fjales e te japesh argumentet e tua. Pune te mbare! Empathictrust (talk) 17:51, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Mfal amë kjo gjuha letrar ësht bash falsifikimi i fjalve prej arabit, latin, perse, edhe grek. Kta shka e flasin « Standartin » mendojni se ësht e drejt, amë esht ket ë gabimshëm, si ta kshyrsh orizhinës e fjalve.

Faliminerës për informatat për derën [deɾ·ən]. Për mendimin têm ky djalekti Tosk sësht hiç i mir, shnosh, çysh me përmirsu / amêlioru…

Së njêh ni Admin Shqiptar, ani, kujna mujna me vêt atë here ?

Po më dukët se edhe në Tosk E i ka dy vleft [e / ɛ] sikur K [k / q]. Masi shum fjalt shqip vin pi Greqiës, e Epsilon egzistôn te ta, pro besôj se edhe Shqiptar e përëdôrinë, e ket fjalat prej Arabit shka e përdorinë ق Qaf i shkrujnë Shqip mê K [q]… Qysh e di, Hypjê (Gheg) u ka bë Hipje (Tosk), sebep drimi e Ypsiloni [y → i] në +800. Gjuha jônë ka dryshu shum, amë më dukët se Shkupi e ka ni djalekt ma orginal edhe ma e pastër… Gmazdên (talk) 18:29, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Për librin e Pashko Vasa, nuk muj mê të nihmu, se si kam lixu, si kam shtu at lajmê në faqë, as sê njô, duhët mê vet at qa e ka shtu, amë aj se ka lënë emnin e vet, pro zôti na nimhôft. Besôj sê vêç ni lexuës, i librës e atina (Pashko Vasa) munët me na dhan lajmê. Shkruj në fakultet Tetovës a Tiranës, ata sigurisht e dinë… Gmazdên (talk) 18:38, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Fjala e parë nalt, u kãnë ma e kompletum mê : « Gjiant, Gegant, Gigand, Giant », besôj se duhët mê lënë… Gmazdên (talk) 19:01, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Early Cyrillic alphabet

emailed: I would like to add for Є є this IPA [e → ɛ] and for И и [ɛ → i] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Cyrillic_alphabet)

Є є already has IPA ɛ, and И и already has IPA i. No need to add anything. Cyrillic numeral values are already shown at Cyrillic numerals. —Stephen (talk) 22:04, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
Ok, but still the Qoppa is not mentioned, and from 100, I believe it’s wrong… Gmazdên (talk) 23:46, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
The koppa was short-lived, replaced very early by Ч. You can read about it at koppa. —Stephen (talk) 03:31, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok, Stephen, I believed Ч was San replacement. Whatever… Good day. Gmazdên (talk) 18:16, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

en-2

I think the rank en-2 is more fitting of your level of English than en-3. You might consider changing « en-3 » to « en-2 ». —Dan Polansky 11:24, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi, I keep level 3, cause I understand at level 4, but since I don’t speak English everyday, my level is two, so (2+4)/2=3… Thanks for you help. Good day. Gmazdên 19:58, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

If you look at the box of en-3, it says « This user is able to contribute with an advanced level of English », emphasis on « contribute » by me. Thus, the box does not state the level at which you understand English but rather the level at which you are able to produce English. That is why I think that en-2 would be accurate for you while en-3 is rather inaccurate. —Dan Polansky 20:21, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

I understand your point of view but I don’t add English stuff… But Arabian, Alabanian, and I begin to stop to add by myself since other reverte, so now, I ask admin to do the job, or I add in Request… But thanks for you advice. Good bye. Gmazdên 21:00, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

So you are saying that inaccurate information on your user page is okay as long as it does not affect anything, right? I do not share this stance. You should only state what is correct, no matter how consequential it is. —Dan Polansky 06:42, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi, think my level is correct. Good bye. Gmazdên 08:19, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Deri Sa & Derisa

Hi, the two variant exist, you corrected but deri sa is correct to… Do you speak albanian ? You replaced Board Title, may be it would be better to just keep, Toskian, Gheggian & Albania Standard, cause it’s not the standard of Macedonia, Kosovo, South Montenegro & North Albania… Gmazdên (talk) 00:16, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

I speak Albanian and have a degree in teaching it. Derisa is a conjuction (lidhez), unless it is used in the meaning of « deri sa arrita ». In the sense of « perderisa », « derisa » is one word. Std Albanian is used in Kosovo, Macedonia and Albania as lingua franca, although of course Kosovo, northern Albania and Macedonia’s Albanians use gheg Albanian at home. Are you one of Migjen Kelmendi followers? —Brunswick Dude (talk) 00:20, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

I don’t know who is Migjen Kelmendi, I’m born in Skopje and I speak Shqip since I’m kid like my parents & family…

I even didn’t know before two weeks that two dialect were used in Albania, and now, I know that I speak the Gheg dialect, I don’t want to use what you call Standard or Tosk, since is clearly falsified based upon root…

I thought you were Canadian & not albanian (have you albanian blood ?)…

May be we could keep two variant in board deri sa / derisa…

You use Arrita, I use Mrrina…

And for Perderisa, I never used this word and I don’t understand his meaning. Gmazdên (talk) 00:31, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

I am Albanian by blood. These lists are kind of unnecessary anyways, as Wikipedia is not a dictionary. They are all unsourced, so someone will remove them eventually as WP:OR. If you want to do a favor to the Albanian nation, please summarize a book written by an independent linguist such as this and write a Good Article. Please understand what wikipedia is. —Brunswick Dude (talk) 00:42, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

I don’t understand why someone would erase since it’s vandalism, and I just added IPA, root/source & some word, to show the variation of dialect, it’s interesting for any one to know these falsification… I believe Albanian Project would be grateful to know the variation. Remove it can be seen has vandalism. Gmazdên (talk) 00:47, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia is Encyclopedia, knowledge, and what I add is knowledge for all, that’s all… Gmazdên (talk) 00:50, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Word don’t need source, they exist, in communication, if you want source for those word, check in google, type the word + shqip, and you will get a lot of proof of existence of these term in forum communication… Gmazdên (talk) 00:58, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

I added link in end for Etymology, and I beginned to add Gheg word in Wiktionary… The Board List could be add in Wiktionary to, but I don’t know in what page. Gmazdên (talk) 01:02, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

It’s not original research, the root are from « Albanian Etymological Dictionary » of « Vladimir Orel », I will not add page & source for each word, also this book don’t use Ottoman Arabic Turkish Persian & Hindu reference, so for some word I searched by my self, based on my knowledge of the Qoran & Babylon 8 research… Gmazdên (talk) 01:07, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

So why don’t you reference to Vladimir Orel? —Brunswick Dude (talk) 01:13, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Because his book contain error, missing word.

I don’t see the necessity to add in reference, also his book his based on Tosk (and what you call Standard Albanian) and my add are Gheg word. Gmazdên (talk) 01:17, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

For Tosk variant I use lingvosoft Albanian. Gmazdên (talk) 01:22, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Albanian People need to keep memory for those Gheg /Tosk Variation, and Wikipedia is the best medium/media to publish at large scale (freely & internationally). I could make this board for my self only but I prefer to share with all world & Albanian Project. Gmazdên (talk) 01:26, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

And Thanks Wiki to allow anyone to share knowledge at large scale. Gmazdên (talk) 01:35, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Suit yourself. In my opinion you are waisting time here. If you are interested in promoting literary works in gheg Albanian, you can write the article « Lahuta e Malcis », which is the most important literary piece, or write more about Albanian writers in Gheg Albanian, especially the ones from Ilirida, of which you may be more cognizant than others, and can truly help wikiproject Albania. If you just want to highlight the differences between the dialects, who is that going to interest? The linguists that are interested in gheg Albanian can buy a book and read it, but how many people, non Albanian speakers are truly interested in that? What they might be interested in is the Albanian culture in Ilirida. Can you do something about that? —Brunswick Dude (talk) 02:05, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Listen, I’m not literature expert or book analyser, I add what I know and not what other needs and I don’t write good enough English to make article by my own, I just can help for adding or correcting some word & info… If I want to learn Gheg I will listen more modern audio record, than spending time reading book using the archaic system of book scripture that ancient used for memory record. I live in +2011 not 500. Also I don’t know the content of these book, perhaps I just will spend my time reading & learning falsified Tosk/Greek orthodox dialect. I never eared about book talking about dialect comparison. When I listen an Albanian Singer I can immediately identify is dialect, if it’s good or not. I’m not interested learning what you call Standard Albanian. And your focus on my add in Board, remind me that you are probably Tosk, or even someone who seems to try to prevent other to acquire the code / method used for falsification of albanian word in Albania. Also write me in Albanian for Albania discussion. Thanks. Gmazdên (talk) 08:19, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

I’m not telling you to learn standard Albanian or any language for that matter. If you read what I write, you’ll recognize that I said the opposite: expand on things that you know, such as the Albanian writers from Ilirida, or gheg Albanian writers. I would love to write in Albanian, but it’s not allowed in the talk pages of the English Wikipedia, because we have to be open to everyone. One more thing. Please don’t place what we say in talk pages into the talk pages of an article, that is not allowed either. For that I would suggest you undo this edit of yours [2].

I think the discussion is about that page, why to reverse ? It’s annoying, I don’t want to talk any more, good bye ; the root in board mean related term and not etymology… Gmazdên (talk) 11:20, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

And about Ilirida (Free), I’m consider my self descendant of Pyroman Phôthomanë Empire and of Scipio latin, the Illyrian have been exterminated by the legion, and their culture disappeared surely at 500AD… This modern theory of Illyrian origin of what you call albanian, and that I call Shqiptar came from anti-imperialist communist… Gmazdên (talk) 11:36, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Gheg Dialect talk page

emailed: Hi, sorry to disturb you, I added some discussion about Gheg Dialect Page that I add with Alexikoua & Brunswick_Dude, and Brunswick_Dude reverse it. I would like to keep the info there, since I explain why I added stuff and how… What do you think ? Gmazdên

It is not proper to copy discussions from one page to another. If you want to talk about something on the article’s talk page, you should start with it there, and then others can contribute as they like. Whenever anyone makes a personal comment in a discussion, the comment belongs to the author even though it might be on your talk page. You can delete it if it bothers you, but you can’t modify it in any way or move it to some other page.
Also, an article’s talk page is for discussions among editors and users, it is not to be used as a blog or as an article in its own right.
The only way that you will ever be able to contribute successfully here is if you learn how to cooperate and collaborate with others. This is a collaborative effort and nobody can do significant work here unless he can get along with and work with the other editors. This includes a requirement that you earn and keep the respect of the other editors. If you just make everyone angry and they lose respect for you, you won’t be able to do anything outside of your own talk page. —Stephen (talk) 11:57, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Your right Stephën, I did not think to start the threads on Page Discussion. But since it’s concern removal or modification of content, I believed it would be better to keep discussion there has archive, I don’t see why to be angry for such small reason. Gmazdên (talk) 12:11, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

email notifications

emailed: How to be notified, when someone modify page that are on my watchlist ?
I checked box in preference but I don’t receive email notification… Gmazdên

I don’t know. I don’t accept email notifications for page edits so I don’t know if it is even possible.

emailed: Hi, Stephen, I want to propose a feature, why do you not obligate people to add facebook identification in their profile ? It’s useful and better. I think you should propose this stuff for all Wiki… A plug-in to link the two would be wonderful (wiki user page communication and contribution memorised in face book, and facebook information (name, state, age) in wiki)… Gmazdên

I do not see what benefit this might be. Facebook is popular with housewives and teenagers, but I don’t see why any of us would be interested in it. —Stephen (Talk) 11:12, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

For identification purpose and authentication of real identity of contributor ; to avoid fake user. To get easily author of vandalism by the wiki police (to prevent vandalism). Gmazdên 11:43, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Also, I don’t understand why Wiki still allow Anonymous edit ? Or people without User Page information like babel & others stuff, or worse blank ? Gmazdên 12:14, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

We don’t have problems with fake users. Almost all users are unknown, so fake is meaningless. When necessary, we can use a « check-user » program that finds the location of a contributor, even an anonymous one. Many people insist on maintaining anonymity and would not contribute anything if their real identity were known. Some users who allow their identity to be known have been stalked by a cyberbully, with severe consequences in their real lives. In fact, it is advisable that the contributors here and on Wikipedia keep their identities a closed secret, in order to avoid being stalked by a cyberbully. —Stephen (Talk) 13:29, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

I don’t talk about user, but contributor, for some case you ask to apply rules, add sources & references, so I believes that using real identity for contributors will prevent some vandalism, and will impose contributor to be more precise & conscious. However, I have difficulty to understand your policy… Gmazdên 14:23, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

February 2011

I noticed that you have posted comments to the page User talk:ZjarriRrethues in a language other than English. When on the English-language Wikipedia, please always use English, no matter to whom you address your comments. This is so that comments may be comprehensible to the community at large. If the use of another language is unavoidable, please provide a translation of the comments. For more details, see Wikipedia:Talk page guidelines. Thank you. WhiteWriter speaks 11:33, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I write in Albanian cause it’s about Albanian Project, it seems that those aren’t Shqiptar, since they don’t respond, so probably they even don’t understand Albanian… I will use english next time, or perhaps both, like that you can read message, thanks for taking time to writing me… Gmazdên (talk) 19:43, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

It is common to write in English. But if you must use some other language, translation must be presented. And something like welcome, hello, or similar words really can be in native lang… All best! :) —WhiteWriter speaks 15:48, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Request entries

emailed: Hi, Request entries have disappeared on wiktionary home page ??? Gmazdên

Try clearing your cache. If your browser is Firefox, press alt-F5 to do this. (I don’t know about Windows Explorer.) —Stephen (Talk) 13:52, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

personnal wiki

emailed: Hi, with Incubator can I create a personnal wiki ??? For my idea, project, like a web page but using Wiki Server & Code ? Gmazdên

No, each project must be in line with the WikiMedia image and provide real value to the organization. WikiMedia owns each project and no editor or admin has any rights of propriety over any project or any page. I know that it is your dream to have your own personal wiki, but that is impossible under WikiMedia. The only way you can do it is to create your own website. You can find wiki software for free at http://sourceforge.net. That is the only way you can do what you have in mind. —Stephen (Talk) 06:57, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok, thanks, it’s would be great & wonderful If everybody can have his own wiki in a section of his facebook… Gmazdên 12:05, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

What’s the name of the wiki tool in sourceforge ? Gmazdên 14:02, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

I think it’s an application or program, not just a tool. Anyway, I suppose you should search for anything on SourceForge that has « wiki » in the name. Either you must know about programming or you will need to find a programmer to install it and set it up. I know nothing about it since I am not a programmer. There is an army of programmers that work for WikiMedia Foundation that work very hard to keep the Wikipedias and Wiktionaries up and running correctly, so I imagine that it is very complex. —Stephen (Talk) 07:27, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

I don’t know programmer that will help me freely, and I don’t have money to finance his work, I live in a small town & they are bad minded… I though perhaps I have to learn web programming. But really I don’t have time, since I’m sick (bone decease), and I prefer to learn Arabian, directly from the source by doing the pilgrim before my death. Hope that one day a personal wiki would be available for all, pre formated and easy access in face book profile or else, to allow any one to have is own encyclopaedia/dictionary/book (with an function that retrieve personnal contribution from other wiki automatically, and add to this « backup page »)… May be I’m just a dreamer. Thanks for your help any way. Good day. Gmazdên 19:33, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

kuptôj IPA

emailed: when adding this form in etymology : {{etyl|la|sq}} {{term|computo|tr=gomputô|lang=la}}

I would like to replace « tr= » by IPA how to do ? Thanks Gmazdên

You can’t do it like that. First, the « tr= » is for transcription of non-Roman scripts into Roman script. That is, it is for Cyrillic, Arabic, Armenian, Japanese, etc., but it is not intended for Latin, German, French, or Albanian. Second, we use IPA for the pronunciation (in the pronunciation section of an entry, under the header Pronunciation), we don’t use it in etymologies. So, that Latin etymology form can only be this way: {{etyl|la|sq}} {{term|computo|lang=la}}. —Stephen (Talk) 17:17, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok, thanks professor… Gmazdên 17:30, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

derë

emailed: Hi, in Derë, I would like to add noun deviation for Gheg, how should I structure this add ?
I tried to add « {{aln-noun| » but it doesn’t works. Thanks

===Noun===
{{sq-noun|f|dyer|dera|dyert}} (Tosk)

{{sq-noun|f|dyrë|dera|dyrtë}} (Gheg)

  1. door
Since they have different plural and other forms, I think you should do it this way:

===Noun===
{{sq-noun|f|dyer|dera|dyert}} (Tosk)

{{sq-noun|f|dyrë|dera|dyrtë}} (Gheg)

  1. door —Stephen (Talk) 11:23, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

kokë by JorisvS

I noticed that you replaced the pronunciation of kokë [qɔq] by kokë [kɔkə], you are diminishing variety of sound of Gheg people (we use nasal, uvular plosive, [e]), yes there is uvular in Gheg albanian because we use sound Qaf of the Quran like the Arab, I’m Gheg muslim, I’m not a tosk orthodox, using only kappa instead of removed Qoppa… Gmazdên 17:37, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

Check kuran [quran], kandar & kafaz (SQ_Arabic_Derivation), I said before K in albanian have two valor [k & q] like E [e / ɛ] & O [o / ɔ], and we use K [q] for Arabian word using Qaf ق [q]. Gmazdên 17:45, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

Interesting, that would make Gheg the only European language to use a uvular plosive (save for Caucasian languages). Can you point me to audio/video files in which Gheg is used? I would love to hear it for myself. —JorisvS 16:50, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Afrim Muqiqi, Adem Ramadani, Ramadan Krasniqi, Duli, Bekim Kumanova, Ilir Shaqiri, Mentor Kurtishi, Pandora, ERA TV (mk), RTK TV Sat, and many others (albasoul.com). The best word to use what I describe is Kalê [qalɛ] who means illuminate… I suggest you, to search for an ancient albanian dictionary using Ottoman Arabic script, like that you will see what word use Kaf ك [k] & Qaf ق [q]. I’m searching for such book, to complete info in Wiktionary by checking ancient writing system, I would like to add Greek Script version to (from Arbanite), to differentiate, Epsilon & Êta and Omicron & Ômega in albanian word… And I probably have to go in Albania to get one to scan & add in Google Book or else… Gmazdên 17:47, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

There is an another people who use Q [q], the Ashkali (Roma, Kale) who live in Balkan… Gmazdên 17:53, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Can you understand these Ashkali when they speak? —JorisvS 18:08, 21 February 2011 (UTC)
No, and it’s why I beginned to make research with Babylon 8 & Lingvosoft, to translate those term, those Ashkali, Malok & Majub, have really strange language, their language is from various source and from others space. But still I love listening their song, search Cita_Amza Sevcet, Dzemail or Nehat_Gashi on Youtube… Gmazdên 18:43, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Could you give me a minimal pair (words that differ only by one sound) of the [q] with [k] and [g]? Thanks in advance. —JorisvS 18:01, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

IPA

emailed: I added word (urroj) and Dick Laurent, replaced [ɪ] by [j], I prefer to use [ɪ] because it’s better for English user who read J has [ʤ]… Also he removed the separation [·] that I use to differentiate word extension like :

– [ur·ɔɪ]
– [ur·ɔva]
– [ur·aɾ]

http://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=urroj&action=historysubmit&diff=11934771&oldid=11932951
What do you suggest ? I noticed that some user use [.] or [‘], I prefer [·]… Gmazdên

IPA is a precise system that is not open to user preference. IPA [j] is always like English <y>, never like [ʤ]. [j] cannot be a separate vowel, it makes up part of a diphthong: aj, oj, ja, jo. IPA [ɪ] is a separate vowel (like the short ‘i’ of Dutch ik or English bit) and it does not produce a diphthong. Your hypothetical *urɔɪ has three syllables: u-rɔ-ɪ; on the other hand, urɔj has only two syllables: u-rɔj.
IPA does not use <·> for anything. The symbol ˈ means that the following syllable bears the word’s primary word-stress. It is not a separator, but a stress marker. The optional dot (.) is used to demarcate syllables. In the Albanian word urroj, there are only two syllables, and in IPA the syllables are marked like this: [u.rɔj]. If the word stress is on the ‘u’, then you can write [ˈu.rɔj]; however, if the stress is on the ultimate syllable, they you would write [uˈrɔj]. French words do not really have a stress, so stress is not marked in French. In Hungarian and Czech, the stress is always on the first syllable.
These symbols are not a matter of user preference, they each have a special and unique use in IPA, and no other symbols can be substituted. If you substitute [ɪ] for [j], or <·> for <.>, then it is not IPA. —Stephen (Talk) 04:25, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi, I listened the IPA, and I confounded the sound [ɪ] with [j]. I corrected my mistake. About [.] [·] the position of [·] look better. I separate the term at extension level, example interior (latin) /in·ter·jor/ or /com·put·ɔ/. May be everybody have his own pronunciation. I use Ô [ɔ] at end of verb because in Ancient Greek the verb extension is -ιζω [izɔ] / -ω [ɔ] and ָה [ɔ] in Hebrew, so I’m sure that in old Latin they used [ɔ] for verb ending like albanian use -ÔJ [ɔj] from -IÔ [jɔ], since noun use -O [o] & -OS/-US [os]. Gmazdên 08:15, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

IPA does not permit substitution of standard symbols, so « looks better » is irrelevant. [·] is not a permitted symbol, only [.] is allowed. And [.] cannot separate morphemes (extension level), but only syllables: [u.rɔj], [inˈte.rjor]. As I said, if you use [·] for anything, or if you separate morphemes (extension level) with [.], then it is not IPA. —Stephen (Talk) 09:20, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I used [·] for Latin extension & prefix, like com-, prae-, in-, im-, di- / dis- de-, re-… You suggest me to use [.] but really I don’t like his appearance, it’s not nice… What sign to use for prefix then ? In my point of view I use [·] to separate prefix·root·extension. And [.] is for syllables not prefix or extension. Since you speak Arabian, you know what I means by root (3 Semitics letters Combination) between prefix & extension (a, ô, iô, ia, atiô, -ens/-entis, -ins/-intis, -ans/-antis, -emens/-ementis…). Gmazdên 12:58, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

In the IPA pronunciation, nothing special is needed for prefixes or suffixes. The pronunciation section is not the place to worry about affixes and roots. In the word president, pre- is a prefix (it means « sitting before »). British and American syllables are often different, so for the British, write /ˈpɹɛ.zɨd.ənt/; for American, /ˈpɹɛz.ɨ.dɛnt/. It does not matter if the appearance is not nice, it is correct. Any IPA with [·] is not permitted.
In the etymology section, it is a different story. In the etymology, we don’t use IPA, but we do recognize prefixes and suffixes. For prefixes, we have {{prefix|sesqui|pedalian|t1=one and a half|t2=of the foot}}; for suffixes, {{suffix|sesquipedalian|ism}}: sesqui- (one and a half) +‎ pedalian (of the foot). —Stephen (Talk) 13:37, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

May be I invented the merging of IPA & Etymology by separating prefix & extension. One day, all will say I’m right to separate in IPA the prefix… What sign you suggest, since [ˈ] is stress & [.] syllable. Gmazdên 13:54, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

You can use [ˈ], [.], or nothing. It is correct to write [u.rɔj], [urɔj], /u.rɔj/ or /urɔj/. However, place the marks only between syllables…if a prefix or a suffix does not make an independent and complete syllable, then you can’t mark it. Prefixes and suffixes are addressed in the etymology. It would be helpful to mark the stress using [ˈ], but not mandatory. Linguists have been using IPA for years already, and nobody has ever suggested that your invention is right. Nobody will accept it and it would only lead to more trouble. —Stephen (Talk) 14:02, 21 February 2011 (UTC)
I don’t understand what you are doing with the [ˈ] mark. That mark is for the primary word stress, nothing else. You have indicated that Albanian pronounces « ab-SO-lut » (every other European language pronounces it either « ab-so-LUT » or « AB-so-lut »). Is it really true that Albanian says « ab-SO-lut »? Then you have « ab-SO-lu-TISHT », with two primary stresses. Some of the edits you made indicate that there are three or more primary word stresses. I do not believe this is possible in any human language.
Besides that, many of the stress marks are in the wrong position (assuming that they are stressing the correct vowel). The stress mark precedes the stressed syllable, not just the vowel. I suspect that you are making a bunch of serious errors and that we will either have to find another Albanian speaker to fix them, or we will have to revert everything. I am certain that you are using the stress mark incorrectly…but what is it that you are trying to do with it? —Stephen (Talk) 16:49, 21 February 2011 (UTC)
You put [abˈsɔɾbˈɔj]. I believe that you are using the stress mark to delineate prefixes and suffixes, and that you are not using it to show stress at all. If this is true, everything you are doing will have to be reverted. If you are doing that, stop it before you make our job much bigger. If you cannot edit according to the rules, then please do not edit. You are making a big mess. —Stephen (Talk) 17:00, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

I asked you before, about separating prefix, you don’t know what IPA standard sign to use. If this stress mark is a problem, then let me use [·], if it’s not good to, I will not use [ˈ] or [.] and keep it in form of absɔɾbɔj, but I would like to separate the prefix in the IPA, I’m not expert of all sign of IPA like you… I added {etyl|??|sq} in word to list them in [[1]]. Nobody else has done before, and someone (albanian) need to do it. Explain me where I’m mistaking, I will learn and improve my add. Why to reverse, just correct error. Gmazdên 17:10, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Stephen you speak French, please explain me in French about word stress I don’t understand his purpose in English… Gmazdên 17:15, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

If you want I can erase the stress mark to correct… Gmazdên 17:27, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

I will try one more time. Si vous pouvez lire un peu de grec, vous savez que le grec utilise les marques d’accentuation sur les syllabes accentuées: αγρονόμος, αγρυπνία, αγρόκτημα, αγρότης, αγρότισσα, αγχολυτικό, αγωγή. L’accent grec marque la syllabe accentuée. En IPA, ce sont environ ainsi : /a.ɣroˈno.mos/, /a.ɣripˈni.a/, /aˈɣro.kti.ma/, /aˈɣro.tis/, /aˈɣro.ti.sa/, /aŋ.xo.li.tiˈko/, /a.ɣoˈji/. La marque d’accentuation [ˈ] précède la syllabe contenant la voyelle accentuée.
En arabe, كتب est prononcée /ˈkæ.tæ.bæ/ (l’accent sur la première syllabe). أتان est prononcée /ʡæˈtæːn/. كسّر est prononcée /ˈkæ.sːæ.ræ/. La marque d’accentuation [ˈ] précède la syllabe accentuée dans chaque cas.
Vous pouvez utiliser la marque d’accentuation [ˈ] (pour marquer la syllabe accentuée, c’est-à-dire la syllabe soulignée) ou la marque des syllabes [.] ((pour marquer les autres syllabes), ou ne pas mettre n’importe quelle marque. I suspect that absorboj should be pronounced /abˈsɔɾ.bɔj/ (l’accent sur l’avant-dernière), but I am not sure. But I do know that what you wrote is wrong. If you do not want to put the stress mark at the beginning of the stressed syllable, and if you don’t want to put [.] between the other syllables, then don’t do use either mark at all. Just write /absɔɾbɔj/. Those are the only three choices you have. All of those marks that you put in will have to be removed because they are all incorrect. If you cannot place the marks properly, then please go back and removed all of them. Leave it as /absɔɾbɔj/ and edit all of the other words the same way. It is better to have no marks than to have wrong marks. —Stephen (Talk) 18:13, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

You right, our world dictionary must be precise & correct, I checked wikipedia page and it’s seems that it would be better to use [.] (syllable separation). For prefix, I hope that one day IPA group will allow [·]… I will correct my add, but not now cause I’m tired. Thanks for you explication & patience with me. To summarize, Stress Mark [ˈ] is Accentuation & [ˌ] Attenuation… I learn more every day. Gmazdên 18:22, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

[ˈ] s’agit de la syllabe la plus pondérée; [ˌ] s’agit de la syllabe moyenne pondérée (ou l’accent secondaire). Toutes les autres syllabes sont légeres. La plupart des langues n’a pas cette syllabe moyenne pondérée, mais seulement une syllabe plus pondérée et toutes les autres légères. En anglais, l’accent secondaire est très important, et beaucoup de mots anglais ont un accent primaire (la plus pondérée) ainsi que d’un accent secondaire (moyenne pondérée): encyclopedia = /ɪnˌsaɪ.kləˈpi.diə/. La seconde syllabe est moyenne pondérée, tandis que la quatrième syllabe est la plus pondérée. —Stephen (Talk) 19:32, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

I replaced the [ˈ] by [.]… My personal pronunciation of encyclopaedia based on my research his [en.sˤyglo.pajd.ja], from Cycle & Global גלגל גלובוס, also paedia (kid) is related to persan پدر (pedar, father)Gmazdên 08:25, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

I added in arrij, related term mrrij (Gheg) & mbërrij (Tosk), but I’m thinking if it would be better to add in alternative form ? What do you suggest ? Gmazdên 08:46, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

If they all mean the same thing, to arrive, then I would put them under synonyms. Put them under related terms if they share the same root (-rrij) but have different meanings, like arrive, arrival, and arriving. I would put them under alternative forms only if the only difference was in how some letter is written, as in oeuf and œuf. —Stephen (Talk) 09:23, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Well I readed etymology in the Book of Vladimir Borel, and he explain that mbërrij (tosk) is deviation of arrij (latin : arrivô), in Skopje, we & me use mrrij (Gheg)… Has I said before Tosk is falsification of Latin & Ottoman (by adding or changing consonant or by changing phonetic : n→nd, q/g→ng, j→nj, pr→mbr, b→br, g→gj, y→i, ê→i, ô→u, q→tsh, n→r), I hope you checked my add about variation of Gheg & Tosk term in wikipedia, the Shqip changed many time alphabet script, from Latin to Arabic (Ottoman), Greek & Cyrillic (Bulgarian & Slavic Empire), so errors & misspelling occurred… Gmazdên 10:16, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Ô & Ō Caladon

I use Ô for sound [ɔ], but O macron means [:o] long O, the ending verb is [ɔ] like Ancient Greek verb using -ιζω [izɔ] / -ω [ɔ] and not [o] (who is used for noun)… The sign Ô + Ō for long [:ɔ] don’t exist in Unicode Charts (the only thing that looks like his Ṑ Ṓ, zoom page to see macro + accent). Gmazdên 14:30, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

I cannot understand what you are trying to say, but please see the respective Latin entries, which contain macrons in the positions where you are placing circumflexes; see Wiktionary:ALA#Orthography_for_Latin_entries and the respective Wikipedia page on spelling and pronunciation Latin spelling and pronunciation. Caladon 14:37, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, for you link, all right I will read suggestion. In Old Latin V is [w/u] [v] is in classical, I is [j & i], G is [g & ʒ], O is [o & ɔ], E [e & ɛ], C is [g & q] and CH is [qʰ] and not [kʰ] and Q is [q] and not [k]… [2]. Gmazdên 14:55, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Latin never used any uvular, so no [q]. Latin did not use [ʒ] either, always [g] (which only later developed into [d͡ʒ] before front vowels). —JorisvS 16:44, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

It’s what you think and you mistaking, there is difference between old, classical & late Latin, such with ancient Ellêniq & modern Greek… G [ʒ] replaced Z [z] and in Slavic [ʒ] is Ž, I don’t know why Q [q] became [k] or [ʨ/ʧ] with time, but in Arabic & Muslim Dialect we still use [q], [d͡ʒ] is in English, in French lot of Latin word using G are pronounced [ʒ] & in French [d͡ʒ] doesn’t exist… Also, please, don’t interfere between my discussion with others people please… I’m feeling like spying by you. Gmazdên 16:54, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

There is no relationship between Arabic and Latin whatsoever. Latin did not use any uvulars, that is thoroughly documented. I am curious from where you got the idea, though. —JorisvS 17:58, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Well, there are a lot of Hebrew/Arabian word related to Latin & Greek… If you speaked Semitic you will understand, but since English have so deviated pronunciation, you will never understand the link between those, I’m proud to speak French & Albanian and to be able to understand Italian & to had eared Spanish. I hope that a wiki bot will shown you a automated list of related word between Semitic & Rôman…

How I had this idea, well I’m writing a book, so I searched, and all Latin & Greek word use Semitic binary combination (two letter) to make new term… If you had studied the Coran, the Torah, the Purana (Sanskrit), the Greek, the Latin & the Shqip, like I did, you would understand, still it’s my discovery & my work. I added a board above about code of mutation of letter based upon numerological value… It’s a puzzle and if you try to understand using only English, you will not understand, cause this language have really deviated phonology if you compare the source / root / origin. Gmazdên 18:08, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

arrivo

What makes you think that « arrivo » is a Latin word? You have entered « arrivo » into the etymology of arrij; what is the source of that etymology? —Dan Polansky 10:55, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

You begin to tired me with your source, it’s from Vladimor Borel book (p10), you should know that Shqip is Scipio Latin & use also Greek/Ottoman Persian root… From Latin arrivāre, present active infinitive of Arrivo (“to arrive”). Arrivo is Latin. Gmazdên 11:06, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
Check simple past conjugation of arrij (it’s arrive, arriva), are you always put into question/doubt the opinion and ideas of others ? You should perhaps have confidence & trust on others, I’m albanian (Shqiptar) why would I lie about language of my people ? Gmazdên 11:12, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
You don’t speak Shqip / Français / Spanish / Latin enough to see the difference, in albanian beginning letter of Latin word are removed like for Honor & Ner, or unio & një, nomen & emën, harena & rënë, computo & kuptoj. Also Ô is replaced by U or others variation (C & Q becoming K), and for Arrij the ending V is removed, only someone who speak many language can understand that, the Tosk falsification use removing of first or ending letter, or by adding double consonant… Gmazdên 11:19, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
Also the difference between Gheg & Tosk is flagrant, Gheg don’t pronounce ending Ë or Ë between word (added latter by tosk, like shtrembëroj & shtremboj), we use nasal, uvular [q] & [e], we use PR- and Tosk replace it with MBR-, and the orthodox have replaced -në ending by -rë, like zotëni & zotëri to prevent comprehension of word of Latin origin, I have the code and I know Ancient Gheg so I know the falsification… Still you don’t speak Shqip so why do you ask, you even don’t understand what I’m talking about ??? Gmazdên 11:23, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
Some etymology are evident (from Greek & Latin). From 300 to 1400 Roman have controlled Balkan (Rumely), until the arrival of Turkish Ottoman, now lot of Shqip & Shkup (Scipio & Scupi) new word are from Arabic/Persian source, and some other from Slavic, but for lot of word the root is evident. Gmazdên 11:43, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Can you point me to a Latin dictionary that contains « arrivo » as a Latin term? Alternatively, can you point me to quotations of Latin texts that contain « arrivo », « arrivere » or another inflected form of the supposedly Latin term? I have some serious doubts about « arrivo » being a Latin word, so I would like to see some references or evidence that I can check. I am not interested in your etymological reasoning and speculation, only in references to academic sources, and in evidence as found in quotations from primary sources–Latin texts.–Dan Polansky 11:35, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

It’s seems that you are right, Vladimir point arrivare to romanian, I confused rom & lat, the etymology of french arriver & spanish arribar, tell that is from vulgar latin arripare (arripo). Gmazdên 11:43, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
All apologies, I’m sorry you’re right. Gmazdên 11:52, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Kuptoj IPA Dick Laurent

Hi, read my talk with Stephen about IPA…

First thanks for correcting my error on [ɪ] & [j], I believed that [ɪ] was pronounced [j].

About Kuptoj, I use prefix-word-suffix separation and you use syllabic division, who is incorrect since everybody have his own pronunciation. I would like to asking you to don’t change my IPA Gheg version, please. Like Stephen said to me, British & American have different IPA. Your IPA look like American in example President :

British /ˈpɹɛ.zɨd.ənt/ (Gmazdên)

American /ˈpɹɛz.ɨ.dɛnt/ (Dick Laurent)

The British is more correct, because they separate prefix, affix & suffix (extension). To better understand word assembling. Your syllabic IPA is individual pronunciation, who can be different from persons to others, please keep my version using prefix-word-suffix(extension). Since it’s more logical… Please, Thanks Gmazdên 19:58, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Can you explain me the Wiki syntax code for Declension for noun, adverb & others of Shqip ? Any link ? Please. Gmazdên 20:28, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

I checked declension of burrë, and I’m asking, do you have masculine & feminine declension variant for NounF ? What is the -ët ending ? Like babë & babët, baba & babat. Can you explain me. Gmazdên 20:35, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

I noticed that you add for lot of word using GJ I.P.A [ɟʑ] don’t need to add two letter it’s [ɟ] alone… Gmazdên 22:24, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

  1. IPA is pronunciation, phonology. Not morphology. The affixes are not important to that. Showing affixes is for ===Etymology===, not ===Pronunciation===.
  2. Albanian gj may be [ɟ] in some places, but I’ve never heard it pronounced such. I was so hellbent on finding this that I had a Hungarian listen to albanian words with gj and q, because her language actually has [ɟ], and she says it sounds very different from the sounds in Hungarian. So I’m going to use [ɟʑ], at least for Tosk. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 22:24, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

You say « I’ve never heard », where do heared those ? What city are you talking about, did you lived there ? I still believe that your syllabic separation is not ideal. It’s a personal point of view, still the IPA pronunciation is the same, even if you use [kup.tɔj / kom.pu.tɔ] or [qupt.ɔj / gom.put.ɔ] (جمع / געם [gmo/gom] : with مع / עם [mo/om])… But for word structure representation, I still believe that prefix-word-suffix is better than binary syllabic sounds, if you use a IPA robot voice synthesiser, I’m sure that you will not ear difference in the pronunciation… I just downloaded some old movie from Albania, and their pronunciations is realy different, they use only [a] & not [ɑ & ɒ], the Gheg & Tosk are really different phonetically, I still prefer my Skopje language more rich & with more sound. Gmazdên 23:22, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

And about syntax code for declension ? Any link ? And the -ËT ending what’s his use, I speak Shqip, but I never learned grammar, because I’m living since I was a baby in Belgium. Gmazdên 23:24, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

If you want I send you a record of the pronunciation of Kuptoj Gheg & Tosk variant to check difference. About IPA, this is not how they (Tosk) pronounce. But how it should be perfectly pronounced, by respecting the source, prefix, root, etymology and original ancestral letter value, if a word is from Greek and use omicron [o] instead of ômega [ɔ] you should then use [o] & not [ɔ] in Shqip, like biologji, if the word use Epsilon, like energji, don’t use [ɛ] but [e], and for Arabic, we should look at a Arabic Script Albanian Dictionary of Ottoman Era, for the [q] & the [k]… Also Krijoj (Tosk) from latin crêô is misspelling caused by usage of Greek Script, where Ancient Ellêniqë ϘΡΗΩ / CRÊÔ [qrɛ.ɔ] became Modern Greek κρηω / krio [kri.o]. So alternative form deviation of Gheg version is caused by utilisation of translation of Modern Greek Script to Latin script by Tosk who don’t use ancient phonetic value of Ancient Ellêniqë Attic. Like Hypje & Hipje, krypë & Kripë or Hydro & Hidro and so on… Do you know an ancient Shqip (before 1945) dictionary using Greek script ? I believe that these people are Arvanites & living in Qameria. Gmazdên 11:25, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Other example of ê [ɛ] & i [i] variation : jêm [jɛm] & jim [jim] (ϳημ : Arbënit), têm & tim (τημ : Arbënit)… Ypsilon & Ipsilon, Ftyra / Ftira (φτυρα : Arbënit), Qiky / Qyky (Ϙ̇υϙυ : Arbënit). Gmazdên 15:49, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

I thinking about something, Kripë [krip] (Tosk) & Krypë [qryp] (Gheg) : Salt is a Crystal / ϘΡΥΣΤΑΛΟ [qrysθalo] (O.E) κρύσταλο [kristalo] (M.G) of Sodium Chloride, can be Cryo & Crystal be his crypted / ϘΡΥΠΤΗ (QRUPTĒ) [qrypθɛ] κρύπτη (krýpti) [kripti] origin  ? Gmazdên 13:16, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

About [ɟʑ], could it be possible to pronounce two consonant ? it’s [ɟ] or [ʑ], I don’t believe that both sound are used. Check IPA and for [ʑ] IPA. Gmazdên 14:30, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Are you there ? Gmazdên 11:23, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

I would like to add alternative for all word, using the Αρβανίτες (Arbanitês, Arbërêsh), using the Greek Script, I would like to find ΛΕΞΙΚΟΝ ΤΗΣ ΑΛΒΑΝΙΚΗΣ ΓΛΩΣΣΗΣ (1908), do you know where I could find a PDF version ??? I really need an Albanian Dictionary using Greek & Arabic script… Gmazdên 19:48, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Your English level

I am bothering you with this again. I have asked you to reduce your indicated English level to en-2, and you have refused. I am asking you again to reduce your English level at least to en-2; if you decide to reduce it to en-1, that is okay with me and quite possibly accurate. From what I have seen, your stating your level as en-3 is highly inaccurate. Several native English speakers had repeatedly difficulties understanding what you were saying on-wiki. Your English vocabulary seems rather rich, but your grammar and sentence structure makes it hard to understand what you are saying, although not impossible with some additional effort. While I admit that your stated English level is a minor issue to complain about, you should learn that accuracy matters, and the place where you can start learning that is at your indicated English level. So please reduce your indicated English level at least to en-2, for the sake of accuracy. —Dan Polansky 09:54, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

I have explained above, that I understand at level 4 & Level 2 in grammar (2+4=6/2=3). But since I don’t use English everyday cause I live in a French speaking country, I have forgotten some school teaching, and I don’t listen west music (MTV) since I beginned to listen Hindu/Persian/Arabic & Balkanic music… Because you ask me continuously to correct my English Level, I will decrease to 2… Like that you will be happy. I can understand that I use another sentence structure/syntax than yours, probably Shqip or French like. I understand your focus on my Babel Level, but it’s just informative, because some contributor don’t show their level on their personal user page, so why are you such occupy about those optional level… Are you an Admin ? Gmazdên 11:47, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Thank you; I appreciate it.
I have no admin rights; I cannot block people. I just like when people use Babel and when their Babel is accurate. —Dan Polansky 20:06, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

sound files

emailed: I have some misunderstanding with some people who don’t believe me when I say that we use [q] or [e] & nasal in Gheg, so I thinked to record my pronunciation, to add next IPA Gheg word, I can record both Tosk & Gheg variant.

My question is, what format of sound should I use (wav, ogg, m4a, mono / stereo ?), and where shall I put those files and how to make the audio player link.

It’s for derë, kokë and others ?

Audio IPA will help those who don’t believe me, to comprehend what I’m talking about (nasal, uvular, e/ê, o/ô).

Use the ogg format. Upload the ogg files to the Commons. The link is made like this: {{audio|Sq-derë.ogg|derë}} or {{audio|Sq-gheg-derë.ogg|derë}}. —Stephen (Talk) 16:19, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Copyright

emailed: I added some file in Commom, but wiki ask me for copyright & permission, I don’t what to add ? It’s free, can you grant me permission please ? Nemzag

I think you can click EDIT and just add this:

== {{int:license}} == {{PD-self}}
This will add the following copyright information:

I, the copyright holder of this work, release this work into the public domain. This applies worldwide.
In some countries this may not be legally possible; if so:
I grant anyone the right to use this work for any purpose, without any conditions, unless such conditions are required by law. —Stephen (Talk) 06:53, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Tonos en grec ancien

emailed: Bonjour, vous m’avez expliqué l’accent IPA à partir du Grec, j’aimerais vous demandez quel est l’utilité de l’accent aigu & grave, l’esprit dur & leger, et le Tonos en grec ancien ?

Quel difference entre un yspilon & ypsilon tonos ? Nemzag

We believe (nobody knows for certain) that Ancient Greek was a tonal language, like Swedish or Chinese. The accent aigu in Ancient Greek indicated the high pitch (l’accent de hauteur) on short vowels, or a high and falling accent (élévé et la baisse) on long vowels or diphthongs; the accent grave indicated the low pitch (accent de faible hauteur). The accent grave was identical to having no accent. Ypsilon (υ) was pronounced like French ‘u’ in du (à faible hauteur); ypsilon tonos (ύ) was like German ü in über (accent de hauteur).
In Modern Greek, it is different. —Stephen (Talk) 13:42, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for your explication but you don’t don’t explained Tonos, esprit doux & rude, may be you don’t understand esprit rude / leger because in English it’s called Psili & Dasia ; what difference between :

  • Όό Tonos (τόνος) : (high pitch / l’accent de hauteur)
  • Ὀὀ Psili (ψιλή spīritus lēnis = no h) : (unaspirated, no effect)
  • Ὁὁ Dasia (δασεία spiritus asper = English h) : (aspirated, pronounced ‘ho’ with English/German /h/)
  • Ὸὸ Varia (Βαρειά Grave) : low pitch (accent de faible hauteur). The accent grave was identical to having no accent.
  • Όό Oxia (οξεία Acute) : high pitch (l’accent de hauteur) on short vowels, or a high and falling accent (élévé et la baisse) on long vowels or diphthongs
  • Ὄὄ Psili Varia : (unaspirated, high pitch, = /ó/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)
  • Ὅὅ Psili Oxia : (aspirated, high pitch, = /hó/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)
  • Ὂὂ Dasia Varia : (unaspirated, low pitch, = /o/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)
  • Ὃὃ Dasia Oxia : (aspirated, low pitch, = /ho/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)

I readed that sometime Varia & Oxia are used for long vowel

I asked you difference between Ypsilon, because I don’t understand in Shqip : Contrary ὕψος / ὑπέρ / super & ὑπό, what difference ? Deviated in Shqip by hypje (ʰypjê, ascent) < ὕψος / ὑπέρ & zhdrype (Zhdrypê, descent) < ὑπό.

Also ὑπό & ἵππος are not the same, even if in modern Greek they are both pronounced with [i], I believe albanian Tosk misspelling in comparison to Gheg, is caused by use of Byzantine Greek letter value instead of ancient attic. Gmazdên 07:21, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

ὕψος = hýpsos (aspirated h, French ‘u’, high pitch on first syllable)
ὑπέρ = hypér (aspirated h, high pitch on second syllable)
ὑπό = hypó (aspirated h, high pitch on second syllable)
ἵππος = híppos (aspirated h, high pitch on first syllable) —Stephen (Talk) 08:03, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

I believe you mistaking in Psili & Dasia above, you added unaspirated, aspirated, high & low, do you confound ? Because Psili is unaspirated & Dasia Aspirated. I don’t understand…

  • Ὄὄ Psili Varia : (unaspirated, low pitch, = /o/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)
  • Ὅὅ Psili Oxia : (unaspirated, high pitch, = /hó/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)
  • Ὂὂ Dasia Varia : (aspirated, low pitch, = /o/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)
  • Ὃὃ Dasia Oxia : (aspirated, high pitch, = /hó/. Used only at the beginning of a word.)

About Hyper / Super & ὑπό, I’m not sure of pronunciation if it’s [ʰuper super] & [ʰypo], or [ʰyper syper] & [ʰupo], from Latin supo & Albanian Hup [ʰup]. Devanagari also use aspirated and it’s representation in IPA by [ʰ]. I will move the copyright section in sound section…. Gmazdên 08:38, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

No, Devanagari [ʰ] goes in combination with a preceding consonant: bʰ, tʰ, dʰ, etc. Ancient Greek h is like English h or German h: hyper, hypo, etc. —Stephen (Talk) 17:37, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

What is sc= in {{term ? Gmazdên 08:46, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

It means « script »…sc=Cyrl (Cyrillic), sc=Grek (Greek), sc=Arab (Arabic), etc. Albanian uses Roman script, so you do not need this parameter. —Stephen (Talk) 17:31, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

There is something that I don’t understand, when you write ancient Ellêniqë, you use diacritics & minuscule, but when I check old stone inscription on intelnet (Archaeological discovery), they use capital and no diacritics ? How do you know what diacritics to use, because has I know, old library of Ellêniqa & Latin book have been burned at Alexandria, Roma & Others by Christians/Judah after conversion to avoid polytheism ; also I believe that you should use minuscule for modern greek & capital for ancient Ellêniqë, since the two system of writing are different phonetically. Gmazdên 12:39, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

In earlier Greek writing, there was no uppercase/lowercase, there was only one single form, which corresponds to modern capitals. Also, they did not use any diacritics or word spaces. As the Ancient Greeks practiced their new writing, they began to see a need to separate words somehow, either with dots or with spaces…that is how word spaces were invented. As they wrote more and more, the old capital forms became cumbersome and awkward to use all the time, so they began to modify some letterforms into a more fluent script, needing which made writing much easier and faster. That is how the minuscule letters were invented. At first, some of the old capital letters were included at the beginning of a text as a decoration, but ultimately it became useful to begin each new phrase with a capital letter followed by minuscules…this helped to show where sentences and thoughts began and ended. Soon, writers decided to emphasis certain special words such as names of people by starting with a capital letter, and then uppercase/lowercase and capitalization were invented. Also, there was confusion between many readings that were spelled the same way, but pronounced differently…so they began to invent various diacritics to show breathing, tone, etc. Around this time, they saw the usefulness of punctuation marks, so some of those were invented. So, over the centuries, the word spaces, minuscules, diacritics, and punctuation were gradually invented and added to the orthography. By the time the classical stories such as Homer’s Iliad were written, the orthography had all of these amenities. —Stephen (Talk) 13:10, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for you explication, but do you know a good source (in ancient greek) using qoppa, san, zampi, vigamma for root / source seeking ? I still think that for ancient ellêniqë term, the use of Capital would be more logical, in my point view, the Capital (-300) & Minuscule (+800) are different system of writing, even if Byzantine use the capital for the first letter of term & pronoun, in fact the very ancient Crêggellênë used epichoric alphabet, are this variant implemented in wiktionary ? Is there original book using this alphabet still existing in Museum or scanned ? You spoked to me about old Latin, do you know a good dictionary or book (in English or French) using or explaining this language ? Gmazdên 13:55, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

w:History of the Greek alphabet. It is not feasible to use all capitals for some Greek words. For centuries, capital script and minuscule script coexisted, depending on the author, writing material, etc. I am sure that you would find some good books on Ancient Greek at Amazon. —Stephen (Talk) 14:21, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Any titles, I’m not an expert like you, you seams to know old Latin and ancient Ellêniqa so perhaps you have some title, about what you said about Homer, the version that we use don’t have qoppa, san, vigamma letter. I believe this version is a copy from Byzantine era. I’m not sure if the original still exist. What’s the oldest copy that we have in scan ? Oldest book were writed in gold to prevent corrosion. But only the library of Vatican keep those variant, I know that when Roma was burned by Christian, those old book using ancient script & letters were melted, so I’m not sure if those modern copy are authentic.

Do you know about positive & negative, like (sp)êlia / σπηλιά (spiliá) (under) & y(ps)o / υψηλώς (ypsilós) (up) and (ps)y / ψυ or plysê / πλύση (plýsi) ? How was writed pure in Old Latin ? I think that [up] is negative in Latin & [pu] positive. Gmazdên 10:42, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Removing letter Ômega & Hêta (Future_Perfect_at_Sunrise)

Hi, I’m Gheg Albanian from Skopje, and I know that Epsilon is [e] & not [ɛ] it’s important that you leave Hêta because Gheg & Tosk variant like Tim / Têm, Jim / Jêm are caused by Greek Hêta [ɛ / i] & Hypje / Hipje (ascent), Ftyrë / Ftirë (face), Krypë & Kripë (salt) by Ypsilon [y / i], Albanian peoples (Gheg / Tosk / Arbanitês) use [o] like in kos (yoghurt), and [ɔ] in Dorë (Hand). All albanian verb are ending with -ÔJ [-ɔj] like Greek verb using -ιζω or -ω. So Greek Ômega is [ɔ] and exist in Shqip.

The other letter are unsourced to ? Do you plane to erase ? I’m asking you to keep what I added please. Gmazdên (talk) 08:58, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Hello and thanks. I’m afraid it’s not entirely clear to me what you are talking about. You seem to be talking about phonology and phonological history of Albanian, and saying that there is a phonological contrast between /o/ and /ɔ/ in Albanian, and that some historical (loan word?) relationships between Greek and Albanian are sensitive to the presence of historical « η » in Greek. That may all be fine and true, but it’s not what that page is about. The Arvanitic alphabet page is not about etymological relations between Greek etymons and Albanian words, but about a specific system of spelling Albanian in the Greek alphabet, in Greece, and it says it is mainly describing the system used in a specific Albanian edition of the New Testament (I think the author meant the one by Grigor Gjirokastriti, and I seem to remember I once checked the table against that work.) If you believe Gjirokastriti used omega and eta in spelling Albanian, please provide a source; my understanding is that he apparently didn’t. I suppose his translation would have been in a form of Tosk anyway, which doesn’t apparently have the vowel contrasts you speak of. Fut.Perf. 09:23, 1 March 2011 (UTC)
emailed: Hi, can you check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arvanitic_alphabet, I added Hêta & Ômega to Arvanitic alphabet but Future_Perfect_at_Sunrise reversed arguing source, other letter don’t have source, so I don’t understand, it’s important to keep Hêta & Ômega because Gheg & Tosk use those sound. And variant of Gheg & Tosk are caused by Hêta [ɛ] becaming [i] & Ypsilon [y] becaming [i]. Also Epsilon is [e] and [ɛ]… Gmazdên
I’m not an admin here and Albanian is not one of my languages. In order to make any substantial change to an article, you have to be able to show a source, some good evidence that others can check and confirm. The only thing I could find on this was here: http://www.christusrex.org/www1/pater/alphabet/alban-greek-alpha.jpg … but this source does not support your position. It does not show the eta or the omega. —Stephen (talk) 10:42, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

I understand your point of view Future Perfect, but may be Arbanitês is incomplete. Also you use [ɛ] for Epsilon and in the source prowided by Stephen it’s [e]… Still, those letter exist in Greek and for Shqip Greek words. I would like to implore you to keep or to add Ômega & Êta [ɛ→i] to this alphabet. It’s a needed for Wiktionary, cause I need Êta & Ômega for variation [ɛ/i] [y/i] of Tosk/Gheg/Arbanitês in Alternative spelling… Has I said before the ending verb use Ômega [ɔ] in Ancient Ellêniqa & Old Latin / Etruscan. So Arbanitês surely use it in language, since Omicron is [o], we (Shqip) need Ômega [ɔ], may be their alphabet is incomplete and I would like to correct and complete.. Please, hope you understand. Don’t leave in the past by keeping only what Grigor Gjirokastriti said. Everything thing evolve. Are you Arbanitês / Arbëritês ?

If so, or not, I’m searching for ΛΕΞΙΚΟΝ ΤΗΣ ΑΛΒΑΝΙΚΗΣ ΓΛΩΣΣΗΣ (1908) of Kostandin Kristoforidhi (in PDF or else). Do you know an English Arbanitês dictionary using Greek Script, I really need this one for ==Alternative Term== in Wiktionary (I would like to add Arbanitês variant using Greek script but using Hêta, Qoppa & Ômega (for ê / i, O/Ô / y/i variante between Tosk & Gheg)… Gmazdên (talk) 12:57, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

I’m not able to access the page, cause you redirected to Albanian Alphabet, the page talk about Arbênitês but doesn’t show the letter can you add them or remove the redirection. Please. Gmazdên (talk) 13:05, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

I see you uploaded the « Albanesisch-Griechisch » table from Faulmann (File:Alban-greek-alpha.jpg). It’s interesting indeed. Perhaps, with that, the Meksi New Testament and the Christoforidis dictionary you mentioned, we could in fact turn the Arvanitic alphabet page into something better, say an article to be called Albanian-Greek scripts. Macrakis (talk · contribs) might be able to help, as he is the author of a relevant paper cited at the Albanian alphabet article. Fut.Perf. 13:58, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

May be it’s a good idea, you can call it Albanian-Greek scripts or Arvanitic alphabet, because only Arbanitês use this variant. I don’t know what you have in mind, but what I surely know, it’s that in Skopje we use e [e] (epsilon) & ê [ɛ] (Êta), o [o] (Omicron) & ô [ɔ] (Ômega), k [k] (Kappa) & k [q] (Qoppa) and Nasal. For me the actual Albanian Latin Alphabet is incomplete and I prefer Bashkimi alphabet (except for GJ, NJ ; about Ç I prefer TSH), but really, some letter must be added to Bashkimi like ê [ɛ] (êta), ô [ɔ] (ômage) & q [q] (qoppa), and nasal vowel ã ẽ/ѧ ĩ õ/ѫ ũ ỹ that Gheg/Slavônic use. Gmazdên (talk) 14:16, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Arvanitic alphabet

emailed: Future perfect, redirected the page to albanian alphabet, I’m not able to access the page any more, I need this page for my works. How to access history, he say that I redirected cause Albanian Alphabet speak about Arbanitês Greek script, but the letter are not describe in page… Can you help me please ? Gmazdên

Arvanitic alphabet history —Stephen (talk) 17:20, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

two sections

Hi, I added a variant in ka for Albanian, I add IPA but I don’t know how to separate the two section.

  • verb : ka [qɒ] (to have)
  • noun : ka [qa] (from) (Gheg) nga (Tosk)

In Skopje we use persian sound [ɒ]. Gmazdên

I don’t know what two sections you want to separate. Do you mean the verb section and the preposition section? —Stephen (Talk) 17:31, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Hi, I added a variant in ka for Albanian, I add IPA but I don’t know how to separate the two section.

   verb : ka [qɒ] (to have)
   noun : ka [qa] (from) (Gheg) nga (Tosk)

In Skopje we use persian sound [ɒ]. Gmazdên

   I don’t know what two sections you want to separate. Do you mean the verb section and the preposition section? —Stephen (Talk) 17:31, 1 March 2011 (UTC) 

Hi, Well I’m talking about section structure : if you check english ka. You use : for ==Ka English==

Ka Pronunciation

Ka Etymology 1

Ka Noun

Ka Etymology 2

Ka Verb

Ka References

Ka Anagrams

But In albanian I asked how to separate the noun & the preposition : 2.

2.1

2.1.1

2.2

2.2.1

I would like to use this structure : ==Ka Albanian==

Ka Preposition

Ka Pronunciation

Ka Etymology

Ka Alternative forms

Ka Verb

Ka Pronunciation

Ka Usage notes

What do you think ? What’s structure to use for title, you use Etymology first with ===, but I believe that it would be better to add noun / verb / adjectif / preposition in first place & after etymology / synonym / antonym / alternative forms / related term… What’s your suggestion about this ? Also English Ka (soul in Egyptian) in Hebrew it’s writed with the Qaf and not Ka, so pronunciation is קה [qa], I don’t know they write in Egyptian Arabic.

I use Ka in title for link to my user page. I will not add in word page… Gmazdên 10:12, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Qiky (Tosk) & Qyky (Gheg) (Dick_Laurent)

Hi, you asked me about a miki jêm, and I told you that for this case Qiky (this one) is better than Ky, but I made a mistake Qiky is Tosk, Gheg uses Qyky… It’s a detail but since it was for anëmik/anmik gheg variant page, and finally added in mik, I believe it’s important to correct (check Qyky exist)… Gmazdên 09:08, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Acar

I believe that Acar was pronounced [a.qar] after sometime by changing alphabet from Greek to ottoman script and at last latin the C [q] became [ʦ]… So acar [a.qar] became [a.ʦar]. ((Ϙρύβω (Ϙrývo) ϘρυπτοϘράφηση (ϘryptoϘráfisi) Qʰrio Qryo (Qryo) Qrysθal קר / قر κριάρι (kriári) κίρκος (kírkos)𐎤𐎢𐎽𐎢𐏁 (ku-u-ru-u-š) Cyrus κύριος (kýrios)cyroChiro)). Gmazdên 09:45, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

ϘΡΥΟ / Cryo / κρύο & ΝΕϘΡΟΣ / Necro / νεκρός are related. The cold (coêl) is death and cold is the dead. Gmazdên 12:34, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Wiktionary is not a polygon for your crazy etymological experiments

You have been warned not to add patently false etymologies before, but you continue to do so. You have been blocked many times for this behaviour. I am now blocking you for your seventh time. You get a prize for your tenth. —Vahag 05:39, 9 March 2011 (UTC)


2015

Krypë

Tungatjeta jote! Po më vjen mirë që paske pune goxha me i futë fjalët e shqipes në Wikilor. Nuk e kuptova pse shqiptimin e fjalës « krypë » gegnisht e ke dhanë si /qryp/ e jo /kryp/. Të fala, —Getoar TX (talk) 03:35, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

Unë jam i keq, Nemzag nuk është duke punuar këtu. —Stephen (Talk) 05:16, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

Mir‑dita, e shkruj q’ashtũ, psê zãni [k] vjên pi për‑para gojës, a [q] vjên prêj për‑mas, na Shqyptar My‑sliman e për‑dormi Ϙ ϙ ק ق [q] & Κ κ כ ך ك [k] amã shum s’din mê dalu, për‑shẽmël :

  • Kurban prej arabit قربان [qurban]
  • Ket/Krejt [qet/qrejt] & Kêt [kɛt].

Unê jêtoj në Bêlgi, e ktũ e për‑dorin zanorin [k] so i daloj kto dy [k] & [q]. Zãni i K Shqyptar për‑gãn ma shum si [q]. Gabimi vjên prêj alpha‑beti Grêk, sê ê kan hek germën Koppa Ϙϙ [q], edhê na Shqyptärt e kina hup çat germ në alpha‑betën ton, e kimi ni Q amã lixohët [c, ɕ] & te na K lixohët [k & q] sê fjält Turqê prêj Arabvê qê I kimi në Shkup jan shkrujtëm origjinalisht mê Κκ / Kk / כך / ك & Ϙϙ / Qq / ק / ق.

Duhët mi dalu kto dy germa & zãna. Gmazdên (talk) 12:48, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

DI‑GAMMA / VAU : Smooth‑breathing & SIGMA / SAN : Rough‑breathing

Hello, from the Ancient‑Greek studies at dis‑tance, that I have per‑formed in Belgium in 2012, the « Smooth‑breathing » and « Rough‑breathing » serves to in‑dicate & marking the ab‑olition of the archaic letter Di‑gamma Ϝ [v] (Smooth) or Sigma/San Σ/Ϻ [ʃ/s] (Rough) in the word, the Ϝ or Σ/Ϻ can be at beginning or middle, it de‑pend of the position of the breathing.

{Di‑gamma Ϝ {also called ϜΑΥ : vau/vaw} is V be‑cause W was Υ/ΟΥ [u/w] from Phoenician 𐤅 [u], Ϝ don’t share shape and sound with Υ / 𐤅, after some‑time Υ be‑came later [y] and [i] in Modern‑Greek ; Pamphylian Digamma/Wau/Waw Ͷ is [w] and is re‑formated one‑line Υ [u] to write it faster in one‑movement, also Ϝ [v] be‑came Latin F [f], V & F are labio‑dental sound and can be con‑fused, when W & F have nothing in com‑mon, so Latin letter F sound [f] come from Ancient‑Greek letter Ϝ sound [v]…}.

In the French pre‑cise book of Ancient‑Greek « Le Grand Bailly » or « Abrégé Bailly » breathing (spirit in French) are re‑pre‑sented in the words and in the de‑finition, in [RAC : racine/root] Section is ad‑ded the original word with Di‑gamma Ϝ or Sigma/San Σ/Ϻ. In older editions of « Le Grand Bailly » or « Abrégé Bailly », the « Table of roots » (which is no longer pre‑sent in the new editions) speci‑fies the list of roots using Di‑gamma Ϝ [v] & Sigma/San Σ/Ϻ [ʃ/s] , yet in Wikipedia English or French, no one mention that the « Smooth breathing » and « Rough breathing » were used for Di‑gamma Ϝ & Sigma/San Σ/Ϻ re‑moving, why ??? They talk only about a‑spired H (no one can make a‑spired H be‑fore a RHO, it’s im‑possible), so it’s wrong… Also In Wiktionary page for Ancient‑Greek words using breathing, the W/V or S/SH is never mentioned in « Archaic pro‑nunciation », like for ex‑ample :

  • ὙΠΕΡ / HYPER that was originally writed ΣΥΠΕΡ / SHYPER [ʃuper] (Latin : SVPERIOR), or
  • ἙΞ / HEX → ΣΕΞ / SHEX [ʃeks] (Latin : Six) or
  • ἘΞ / EX → ϜΕΞ / VEX [veks] (Latin : Ex‑) or
  • ἘΡΓΟΝ → ϜΕΡΓΟΝ [verg‧on] (English : Work, Dutch : Werk, French : Vergô ↔ Greve {strike (cessation of work)}) or
  • ἩΛΙΟΣ / HELIOS → ΣΗΛΙΟΣ / SHELIOS [ʃɛli‧os] {Attic} (Latin : Sol, Solis, English : Sun) or
  • ἉΛΙΟΣ/ HALIOS → ΣΑΛΙΟΣ / SHALIOS [ʃali‧os] {Dorian} (Latin : Sol, Solis, English : Sun) or
  • ΟἸΝΟΣ → ϜΟΙΝΟΣ [vojn‧os] (Latin : VINVM, English : Wine, French : Vin) or
  • ἈΡΗΣ / ARES → ͶΑΡΗΣ / WARES [warɛs] (God of War, War God, war it‑self personi‑fied) or
  • ῬΕΩ → ΣΡΕΩ [ʃre‧ɔ] (flow) & ῬΕΩ/ἘΡΩ → ϜΡΕΩ/ϜΕΡΩ [vre‧ɔ/ver‧ɔ] (Speak/Verbum/Verity/Love) or
  • ἈΝΑ → ϜΑΝΑ or ΑϜΝΑ [vana / avna] .

{I don’t use ac‑cent acute / grave in Ancient‑Greek words be‑cause at that time they didn’t ex‑ist, also writing Ancient‑Greek word in minuscule is an error, be‑cause at that epoch only capital script with‑out ac‑cent ex‑isted, minuscule should be used only for Modern‑Greek in your Wiktionary or Wikipedia…}. Gmazdên (talk) 12:09, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

First of all, this is the wrong place for such a discussion, since the people who know about such things aren’t necessarily the ones who patrol recent edits, and it’s only slightly relevant to this entry- better to ask about this at the About Ancient Greek page. Also, your use of hyphenation in the middle of words is distracting. As to substance: you’re jumbling together a long history of sound and orthographical changes as if they all happened at once. Whatever the origin of the rough breathing, it was described by Greek grammarians in enough detail (not to mention being reflected in loans to other languages) so we can say pretty confidently that it really was something like aspiration when it was in use (I don’t know enough about the matter of the pronunciation of the aspirated rho to comment, but it looks to me more like a spelling convention than an actual guide to pronunciation). As for the smooth breathing, are you seriously saying that all initial vowels in Ancient Greek started with a digamma? The diacritic may have had its origins in something else, but in the standard orthography as used here it merely indicates the lack of aspiration. As for the grave accent, we only use the acute in entry names, since the grave is only a positional variant. Chuck Entz (talk) 13:33, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
I ad‑ded this con‑versation here be‑cause like that every‑body reading the article can have this in‑formation, about the hyph‑en I use it to se‑parate pre‑fix and the root, be‑cause if you check their etymo‑logy they are com‑pound words. It’s may‑be dis‑tracting for you but for me is more pre‑cise, ex‑act & ac‑curate…. I’m not saying that « all in‑itial vowels in Ancient‑Greek started with a di‑gamma » but only those using « smooth‑breathing », it’s the in‑formation that I get in my dis‑tant learning course, and in dictionary like « Le Grand Bailly » or « Abrégé » they use it to… Mangêzd (talk) 14:11, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
I’m not entirely sure what you’re trying to say, but… words in Greek that start with vowels came from words in Proto‑Indo‑European that started with *s, *w, *h₁, *h₂, *h₃, or no consonant. All of these were lost at some point in Attic Greek (but *w became the digamma in West Greek dialects), except when *s (usually) or *w (occasionally) became /h/ (which also developed spontaneously in words such as ἵππος), which was marked in several ways—see w:Heta for more.

Various spellings of the name « Hera » in ancient Greek. Left: original spelling, right: modern transcription. Red: consonantal « Heta », blue: vocalic « Eta ».
1.) archaic non-Ionic
2.) classical Ionic
3.) intermediate (e.g. Delphi)
4.) intermediate (e.g. Tarentum)
5.) late antiquity.

As I recall, no word that had the rough breathing was ever spelled with sigma or san. (Also, please stop using hyphens to separate prefixes. What is etymological is not necessarily correct.) ObsequiousNewt (εἴρηκα|πεποίηκα) 18:39, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

I’m pre‑fer to write with hyph‑en, I always write like this, since 7 years… You seem to not be a Greek and it’s not your mother‑tongue, so I’m not sure if you know every‑thing about this ancient‑language (these variants like Dorian, Ionian, Attic, Beotian, Eolian, Thrace, Macedonian)… All of what I’m saying is in uni‑versity dictionary‑book like Le Grand Bailly and I learn it to, in my dis‑tance courses & lessons from the Official Walloon franco‑phone E‑ducation com‑munity of Bruxelles (Boulevard du Jardin Botanique 20-22), and based on books of Roersch – Hombert – Thomas : Grammaire grecque & Alessandra Lukinovich & Madeleine Rousset : Grammaire de grec ancien… So I’m sure of what I’m saying… I really don’t com‑pre‑hend and it’s very strange that no one writed about this in Wikipedia article & Wiktionary pro‑nunciation, in French or English pages, so I just want to warn you about this… Mangêzd (talk) 20:36, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
Ignoring the fact that there is no longer any such thing as a native Ancient Greek speaker, I have studied the language extensively (by the way, the dialects are usually spelled Doric, Ionic, Boeotian, Aeolic; and Thracian and Ancient Macedonian are in fact different languages) I still don’t understand what you’re trying to say—is it that words with a rough breathing originally started with Σ (they didn’t—in Proto-Indo-European they did but by the time Ancient Greek was written it the words were neither written nor pronounced that way) and that words with a smooth breathing originally started with ϝ (only in West Greek, and only when they came from a word beginning with *w in PIE, and only sometimes even then)? If not, it may be more useful to point out specific pages in these books that you are referencing. ObsequiousNewt (εἴρηκα|πεποίηκα) 21:48, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
When I write please don’t ad‑d :::: be‑cause with these, at end, we don’t have space to re‑spond (keep one « : » for you, zero « : » for me, if a third speak he can add « :: » and so on…). Ok you say « ‑IC » but in French we say « ‑IEN », so I say in English « IAN », my first language is not English so I make mistake… No‑body know the real Proto‑Indo‑European and this imaginated, re‑con‑structed & sup‑posed language as no re‑maining writing be‑cause at that time, scripture even not ex‑ist, all of that are just theory, and I really don’t be‑lieve that all Euro‑middle‑east‑asian languages are coming from one unique‑source root‑language, some word can be com‑mon be‑cause of nomadism. (Some‑time in word in Wiktionary etymo‑logy I see those kind of pseudo‑proto‑indo‑european root, and they share nothing in com‑mon with the structure or pro‑nunciation of that word, but they are writed like is sure & certain that it’s the origin & good etymo‑logy, for me these are just sup‑position), like you say for Ancient‑Greek « there is no longer any such thing as a native Ancient‑Greek speaker », I’m sure that there is no Proto‑Indo‑European speaker, at least Ancient‑Greek have re‑maining books & arti‑fact, the proto not. I’m sure that, at the origin, all humans tribes up‑on the Earth had dif‑ferent languages and from a very long‑time… So searching in that one‑root di‑rection is a wrong way… (The Bible say that at Babel god di‑vided languages but at that time and only at that place, they shared a com‑mon Sumerian/Semitic language, not Chinese, Indian, Germanic or Slavic one). Well about page, I don’t have these books here, I only have the pages of my course in a folder mentioning these books, I also have the well known « Le Grand Bailly » Ancient‑Greek/French dictionary and the Di‑Gamma & Sigma/San is mentioned in section [RAC : Racine/Root] in al‑most every‑page where a smooth or rough‑breath is used, some not and maybe those use the Hêta [h] that you pro‑posed (the old edition have a table of roots at end with word using re‑moved Di‑Gamma & Sigma/San)… I don’t com‑pre‑hend that great English searchers & students don’t know about this… But what can I do… No‑body knows every‑thing. I searched in vain in Inter‑Net for a page listing all words and variants using Qoppa, Di‑Gamma [v], Pamphylian Di‑Gamma [w], San, Tzampi but with no suc‑cess, nobody have done that work be‑fore, all archives have been burned by mono‑theist in the library of Alex‑andria and others places, so we will never know the totality of these words, the books that we have to‑day are not the original and are re‑writing (I don’t know which Ancient‑Greek books is the older one)… You say « I still don’t under‑stand what you’re trying to say is it that words with a rough‑breathing originally started with Σ [ʃ] or Ϻ [s] and that words with a smooth‑breathing originally started with ϝ [v] or Ͷ Υ [u/w] (Pamphylian digamma) », yes, it’s what are saying the Belgian courses and « Le Grand Bailly »… Mangêzd (talk) 22:51, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
I’m using colons because that is how Wiktionary talk pages are formatted. Similarly, Wiktionary policy is to display what is supported by evidence. Academic consensus is that Ancient Greek words did not all begin with consonants. If you’d like specific examples as to why, I can provide them. ObsequiousNewt (εἴρηκα|πεποίηκα) 02:47, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Hello there! I’d first like to say that I have thoroughly enjoyed reading your comments above (if only because they are quite funny). You are correct in your statement that “No-body knows every-thing” [sic]. I for instance was not super familiar with Le Grand Bailly, so I looked it up and downloaded all 450 MB of the original edition. Let me tell you what I found out:
On page viii of the of the introduction, Bailly lists his primary sources for his etymological information which were:

  • Georg Curtius’s Grundzüge der griechischen Etymologie (1873). This book claims to use Proto-Indo-European reconstructions on the first page of its introduction.
  • Other new etymological works in French and German, but primarily the Memoires de la Société de linguistique de Paris. The SLP was one of the earliest French publishers to adopt Proto-Indo-European theory.
The point I am making above is that Bailly is using early Proto-Indo-European reconstructions for his etymologies in his text. You cannot hold up le Grand Bailly as contradicting the findings of Proto-Indo-European theory as it uses them as its sources.
As to the specific examples you have used, I have looked at all the entries of le Grand Bailly and will write out the etymological information it provides for the first few:

  • ὑπέρ “(cf. skr. úpari, et lat. super avec s init.)” → (compare Sanskrit उपरि (upári) and Latin super with initial s)
  • ἕξ “(cf. lat sex, dor. ϝέξ de *sweks, cf. gall. chwech)” → (compare Latin sex, Doric ϝέξ (wéx) from (Proto-Indo-European) *swéḱs, compare Welsh chwech)
  • ἐκ “(ἐς pour ἐξ en crét., béot.; avec le datif en arc.-cypr.; cf. lat. ex etc.)” → (ἐς (es) for ἐξ (ex) in Cretan, Boeotian; with the dative in Arcadocypriot; compare Latin ex etc.)
  • ἔργον “(dor. ϝέργον, cf. ἕρδω; v.h.a. werc, etc.)” → (Doric ϝέργον (wérgon), compare ἕρδω (hérdō), Old High German werc, etc.)
While some of these entries do contain digammas, none of these forms are used as pronunciations or as ]earlier forms but as separate Doric forms. You’ll also find that the word ὑπέρ never had an initial sigma and that the initial s in Latin super comes from a later reanalysis of eks-uper in Latin. So, I’m afraid that le Grand Bailly, which seems like a good, if outdated, dictionary, does not support any of your claims. It is true that deletion of PIE *w and *s did result in the majority of words beginning in rough breathing and that in some dialects the ϝ is retained. However, this does not mean that the word ἕξ was ever pronounced [seks] (much less [ʃeks]) during the span of Ancient Greek. If we were discussing Proto-Greek, this would be a different matter, but we are not and I am sure you do not believe Proto-Greek exists in any case.
All of this is beside the point however, which is that you have been being quite rude to the other contributors. This might be overlooked if the majority of your claims were not also false or based out of a misinterpretation of an accurate source. Therefore:

  • Do not bring up le Grand Bailly to support your argument―it does not.
  • Do not edit any Wiktionary pages with your theories―they are inaccurate.
  • Do not use the Tower of Babel as evidence in a scholarly argument―it discredits you.
  • Do not continue writing with hyphens in your English―it is broken enough already.
We are prepared to have a reasonable discussion with you if you meet us half way. —JohnC5 04:46, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ Well, it’s good that you down‑loaded the book, but it doesn’t change nothing to what the pro‑fessors writed in my course, they states that :

  • Smooth‑breathing are in‑dication of Di‑Gamma re‑moving Ϝ [v] or Υ→Ͷ [u/w] sound {Ͷ is faster one‑line way to write Υ ancient value [u] in one movement},
  • Rough‑breathing for Sigma/San re‑moving [s] or [ʃ],

If you don’t want to be‑lieve it’s really bad & sad for you. May‑be Shigma & San from Phoenician 𐤔 [ʃ] & 𐤎 [s] was used by the proto‑shella‑nique (dorian form of Hellenic), then the Attic Hellenique re‑moved [ʃ] & [q] (be‑cause the Attic Ancient‑Greek don’t used those sounds, and they keeped only the value SAN [s] for Sigma. These letters [ʃ q] don’t ex‑ist any‑more in Modern‑Greek and re‑maining re‑writed book of Ancient‑Greek (not original burned one) that we uses today… {About your question, I be‑lieve that the proto‑shella‑nic had ex‑isted in archaic‑time using sound of Phoenician like [ʃ & q] , for me [w] was more a [u] like sound and was probably pro‑nounced [ua/ue/uo/ui] than [wa/we/wo/wi] }.

In Albanian some Greek word are used with [ʃ] like :

  • shurr (piss) from Ancient‑Greek ΟΥΡΩ] → ΣΟΥΡΩ [ʃur], we (Albanian) keeped the old pro‑nunciation, there are other ex‑amples like Kul‑shedra but I don’t know all of them,
  • do you think that URINA / ΟὙΡΟΝ (piss) & VRANUS / ΟΥΡΑΝ ὌΡΑΝ ὨΡΑΝ / אורנוֹס (sky) {from sup‑posed *ϜΟΡΣΑΝΟΣ (but I don’t be‑lieve in that origin)} share the same root ? No, one start with [s/ʃ] other VRANUS / ΟϜΡΑΝΟΣ [ovran‧os] with [v], and can be linked to shemitic אור ΑϜΡ [avr] (Latin : AVRUM) the light /fire (sky = sun, light & fire) {when the smooth‑breathing is up‑on ᾿Υ then you re‑place it by a Di‑Gamma Ϝ},
  • I don’t mention :
    • ΟΥΡΟΣ → ϜΟΥΡΟΣ [vur‧os] [R. : ϜΟΡ] (gardian / watch : Slavic « чувар », Latin Vereor) &
    • ΟΥΡΟΣ → ΟϜΡΟΣ [ovr‧os] (good wind) &
    • ΟΥΡΟΣ (canal, to dig) {from ὈΡΥΓΜΑ ὈΡΥΚΣΩ / ὈΡΥΚΤΩ & ὈΡΥΚΤΟΣ, Latin E‑RECTVS / E‑REGO} &
    • ΟΥΡΟΣ from ὈΡΟΣ → ϜΟΡΟΣ (montain, hill ; point of ob‑servation) &
    • ΟΥΡΟΣ from ὉΡΟΣ → ΣὉΡΟΣ (boundary, limit, marking stone)…
    • Five same words, meaning five thing ??? Bad writing be‑cause of e‑rased Ϝ & Σ/Ϻ

The ex‑ample I used above (S’HYPER, S’HALIOS, S’HEX), doesn’t show Sigma/Shigma in [R. (Racine/Root) section] of « Le Grand Bailly » de‑finition but were used in my course, but in others word with rough‑breathing the [R. is there]… But if you want to be wrong it’s your pro‑blem….

You say that there are used in se‑parate Doric‑forms, ok, for me Dorian & Eolian are the most original Ancient‑Greek…

I will con‑tinue to write with hyph‑en be‑cause I like that and it’s more pre‑cise & ac‑curate, never on any forums (like Nvidia, Intel, Ubisoft, Steam, Hwinfo, Guru3D, Microsoft…) some‑one told me to write how he want, some have asked why I do this but after ex‑planation they under‑standed, I don’t think you have the right to told me how to write… Pre‑fix can be se‑parated, since even in Wiktionary.org these words show in etymo‑logy that they are com‑pound words, also I don’t use that technique in de‑finition page but only in talk dis‑cussion… But that’s not the most im‑portant.

Still you con‑tinue to say that Di‑Gamma Ϝ is [w] when the links & ex‑plication I pro‑vided above told the con‑trary… So you want to in‑duce others in error be‑cause Old Germanic languages (like English de‑rivation) use [w] so for you Ancient‑Greek word to (in Latin W didn’t ex‑isted, for writing Old Germanic word they used Double V : VV [w] be‑cause V was [u/v] much later, in medieval time, W [w] ap‑peared as a com‑plete letter, all Latin variant like Espagnol, Portuguese, French, Italian use V or U for Latin words, only in English, we find W for Latin words like Wine (in French Vin for VINVM))…

Still in Modern‑Greek or others languages of that location of South‑East Evrope, like :

  • Macedonian (where I’m from),
  • Albanian (my origin),
  • Serbian, Bulgarian,
  • Turkish,
  • Italian,

W [w] don’t ex‑ist and is not used for original words (we are more near than England of Greece, I think if that sound [w] was used at a old‑time, these neighbor tribes will have it in the alpha‑bet), so why keep saying that Di‑Gamma Ϝ is a [w] & not [v] when clearly Latin F [f] came from Greek Ϝ [v] since [f] & [v] are labio‑dental sound and can be con‑fused, when [w] & [f] have nothing in com‑mon…

In the « Abrégé bailly » of 1965 (N°10‑1340‑26) the « Proto‑Indo‑Evropean » sources that you are mentioned are not pre‑sent, they are in « Le Grand Bailly » (there is « Liste des auteurs & des ouvrages » but all of them are shella‑nic one, in my 2005 edition N°16/7939/8 (re‑viewed by L. Séchan & P. Chantraine », pro‑fesseurs à la faculté des Lettres de Paris », I see the source you mentioned at bottom of the page VIII under the text (with 1. Grundzüge der griechischen Etymologie, von G. Curtius. 4° éd. Leipzig, 1873) but the link you pro‑vided is use‑less be‑cause I don’t know the German)…

I can use « Le Grand Bailly » to sup‑port my argument be‑cause (for me it’s true), and I don’t plan to add ancient‑greek word or etymo‑logy or archaic‑proto‑shella‑nic pro‑nonciation in Wiktionary, but I can do on my private‑web‑page, be‑cause here, non‑academic theory or new hypo‑thesis are al‑ways re‑jected (I just wanted to know about breathing and why no one mention Sigma or Di‑Gamma re‑moving re‑placed by smooth or rough‑breathing in Wikipedia or Wiktionary pages).

The pro‑blem about what you said about Sigma re‑moving in « Crêgu » (truth‑full) {con‑trary of « Greek » (the Roman called the Shella‑nic GRAECVS « un‑truth‑full‑one » or « false‑one »)}, it’s that you keep just ex‑ample that ac‑credit your re‑sponse, leaving others ex‑ample (using Sigma/San in « Le Grand Bailly [R. section] of the de‑finition ») on the side… It’s you choice…

Here are others ex‑ample writed in « Bailly » Table of Roots for Sigma re‑moving with Rough‑Breathing :

  • ἉΜΑ → ΣΑΜΑ (latin SIMVL)
  • ἉΔΟΣ → ΣΑΔΟΣ (R. ΣΑΔ)
  • ἉΛΣ → ΣΑΛΣ (R. ΣΑΛ, Latin : Sal)
  • ἉΛΛΟΜΑΙ → ΣΑΛΛΟΜΑΙ (R. ΣΑΛ, Latin : Salio)
  • ἉΡΜΑ → ΣΑΡΜΑ {SHARMONIA} (R. ΣΑΡ : union, link)
  • ἙΔΟΣ → ἙΔΟΣ (R. ΣΕΔ : sit)
  • Ἑ‑ΣΠΕΤΕ → ΣΕ‑ΣΠΕΤΕ (R. ΣΕΠ : to follow, Latin SEQVOR) from ἙΠΩ → ΣΕΠΩ (tie, to follow) ≠ ΕΠΩ → ϜΕΠΩ (say, Latin VOCARE) {in Greek P be‑came Latin Q}
  • And lot others but I’m gonna not search for all of them in the thousand pages book, I’m an amateur and I really don’t have much time for this, the best way for you is to look in Table of Roots of ancient editions be‑fore 1950 six‑teen re‑vision version (that e‑rased that « list » and re‑moved some [R. ] in‑formations in de‑finitions…

My hypo‑thesis about im‑possible only one‑root for all world languages is good but it seem that you don’t want to com‑pre‑hend.

In the past, I have make donation (not big) to Wiktionary.org, so for me, I have the right to con‑tribute and to ex‑press my self be‑cause it’s a United‑Nation Uni‑versal Human rights (article 19) and I can also use the right of « Freedom of Speech & Ex‑pression » that the con‑stitution of the U.S.A guaranty, these laws, allow me to do this, if I was a male‑ficent one, I will do it hided with‑out log‑in, but no, I use my name, to be honest and ask the opinion of others in talk‑page, thanks any‑way for your feed‑back… As I said I don’t plan to add Ancient or Proto‑Shella‑nic stuff… Mangêzd (talk) 09:53, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Well, I am going to gracefully resign from this conversation about Ancient Greek and your hypotheses thereon. I will say your right to free speech of course is protected. That doesn’t have actual bearing in this circumstance, but I feel that I would be getting into too much trouble trying to explain why. I warn, though, that if you do edit content using this theory, it may lead to you getting banned, which would be unfortunate. —JohnC5 10:09, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
Why should I be banned for giving an opinion or sharing my know‑ledge, ad‑mini‑strators are not as bad as this, so no need to threaten me, I’ve done nothing wrong… Your statement is not very demo‑cratic and open‑minded one… Good day. Mangêzd (talk) 12:32, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
I would add this, what I truly like in « Le Grand Bailly », it’s that every word, have in‑formations like :

  • hyph‑en (pre‑fix se‑parated from the root),
  • first time writed and by who (author), in Wiktionary etymo‑logy, that’s not the case, for ex‑ample you said that HYPER co‑gnate with upari उपरि (upári), but, when this word ap‑peared first, in Hindi or in Greek ? There is no in‑dication in upari or hyper page, is upari older or hyper ? I think that for better com‑pre‑hension for future‑generation, every word ad‑ded in Wiktionary should have at‑tested « date of first use » and in which « book or in‑scription » & « pre‑cise location » of first writing or en‑gravation and if possible, ad‑ding the scan (if book) or photo (if it’s upon a stone or else) on the Wiki page as a picture, that would be great for all…
I put for your under‑standing more ex‑amples of re‑moved Sigma in Ypsilon Rough‑breathing really writed in the dictionnary.

  • ὙΔΡΑ → ΣΥΔΡΑ [ʃudr‧a] (water snake, hydra ; Albanian : Kuçedra [kut‑ʃedɾ‧a] / kul‑shedra [kul‑ʃedɾ‧a] from ΧΕΛ‑ΥΔΡΟΣ / CHEL‑SYDRUS or ΧΕΡ‑ΣΥΔΡΟΣ / CHER‑SYDRUS).
  • ὙΣ ὙΟΣ → ΣΥΣ ΣΥΟΣ [su‧s su‧os] also writed in this manner : ΣΥΣ ΣΥΟΣ [su‧s su‧os] in « Le Grand Gaffiot » (pig, swine, hog ; Latin : SVS, SVIS ; German Schwein, Danish svin, and more distantly to Polish świnia, Russian свинья)
  • ΥἹΟΣ → ΣΥΙΟΣ [ʃuj‧os] ([R. ΣΥ] : son ; compare with Latin : SVVS, German : Ich).
  • ὝΛΗ → ΣΥΛϜΗ [sulv‧ɛ] ([R. ΣΥΛ] : wood, forest ; Latin : SILVA)
  • ὙΠΝΟΣ → ΣΥΠΝΟΣ [supn‧os] (sleep ; Latin : SOPOR)
  • ὙΠΟ → ΣΥΠΟ [sup‧o] (under ; Latin : SUB‑)
Mangêzd (talk) 15:10, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
Here’s the thing—I’m going to give it to you straight: you are making connections based on an incomplete understanding of linguistics. It’s a mistake that a lot of people make; I know I have made it myself, and I hope that you also will come to realize your (or your professors’) errors. Until then, however, take note that linguistics—like English—is not a field of opinions, it is a field of theories, a word which means « hypotheses that are supported by evidence ». One bit of evidence is that there are some words that originally started with a digamma—ἔργον is a great example—and we know this because there are Doric inscriptions (incidentally, Doric is not « more pure », unless you mean « more pure than Koinê », which could arguably be true) that have a digamma (ϝέργον) and also because there are cognates (English work, (Old) Armenian գործ (gorc), Avestan 𐬬𐬀𐬭𐬆𐬰𐬆𐬨 (varəzəm), etc.) that have an initial /w/ (or whatever *w became in that language.) Whereas ἐκ has neither of these things—there is no form **ϝεκ anywhere, and no cognates of it have any initial consonants. There’s a reason that « here, non‑academic theory or new hypothes[e]s are always rejected »—it’s that academic theories are supported by evidence, whereas new hypotheses are not. Incidentally, here is some evidence:
Words that start with a spiritus asper come from:

Words that start with a spritius lenis come from:

(EDIT: okay, not sure what happened there at all. I’ve put the page back like I meant to have it.)
Hi, thank for feed‑back. I under‑stand what your are saying… Think what you want, as I said I don’t plan to make ad‑ds of ancient‑greek or proto‑shella‑nic pro‑nunciation. I just asked some‑thing and you re‑spond that you think that you are right, and I’m wrong and for me you are wrong and I’m right, so no need to talk much more… Mangêzd (talk) 16:45, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
About αὐγή that you give as ex‑ample, the etymo‑logy mention Albanian AGON (Dawn) {and what is the link with Albanian Agoni (Agony) ?} but not mention IGNIS, AGNI or Slavic OGON and slavic‑god АГУНЯMangêzd (talk) 10:49, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
You said “so no need to talk much more,” and yet you continue editing this discussion… —JohnC5 16:57, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
I just re‑sponded to that one be‑cause I’m Shqyptar Albanian (Gheg), and I never used and eared that word (Agon), be‑cause at Skopje (Macedonia) and in Kosovo, we use Sabah, Agon is pro‑bably used by the Tosk Albanian (Shqipëtar Ortho‑dox, living in the south of albania at north of Greece)… But I just wanted to say that if αὐγή it’s a « bright light, like fire » then this co‑gnate with Agni, Ignis & Ogon/Agun… F.Y.I. Still, I don’t see the link between dawn & agony, there is no one. Mangêzd (talk) 18:36, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ The words you listed come from a different root, reconstructed as Appendix:Proto-Indo-European/h₁n̥gʷnis. In either case the words don’t have initial consonants. Additionally: once again, linguistics is not a field of opinions, there is no « for me I am right and you are wrong ». What is right is that (1) academic consensus is, among other things, that Proto-Indo-European is a real language which sometimes has initial vowels, (2) this academic consensus is supported by evidence, (3) Wiktionary publishes academic consensus for this reason. This is why your « etymologies » are not shown. ObsequiousNewt (εἴρηκα|πεποίηκα) 02:08, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Ok thank for your ex‑planation, but as I said I don’t be‑lieve in imagined & re‑con‑structed Proto-Indo-Evropean… So the root h₁n̥gʷnis is false be‑cause h₁n is not used in real ex‑isting word like Og‑on, Ag‑ni, Ig‑nis & Ag‑un (ex‑cept in Hebrew נוגה (NGE) & Arab نجم read it NGM in Egyptian manner), OG AG IG co‑gnate with AYG. This is just my point of view. I don’t ob‑ligate no one to be‑lieve it. But even a Academic con‑sensus begin with theory & hypo‑thesis. Mangêzd (talk) 08:07, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
I have one more thing to say after thinking a lot about this, you ex‑plain that the Rough‑breathing is a mark showing the a‑spiration [h] and not the Sigma re‑moving [s] or [ʃ], and the Ancient‑Greek words using it are written with H in Latin (ὑπέρhyper), but for the Smooth‑breathing there is no a‑spiration [h] & the words using it are not written with a H in Latin, so if the smooth sign is not an in‑dication of Di‑Gamma Ϝ ϝ [v] or Ͷ ͷ [u/w] re‑moving why using this sign, it is use‑less, in‑stead they could write normally the Ἀ Ἐ Ἠ Ἰ ὐ Ὠ ῤ → Α Ε Η Ι Ο Υ Ω Ρ, no need to a speci‑fic sign for that… This prove that this theories of [h] is false in a part. Mangêzd (talk) 07:34, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
Also the words ἅπ‧τ‧ω (« ap‧t‧us« ), ἅπ‧μ‧α, ἁπ‧σ‧ίς (« ap‧s‧is« ) are not written with H in Latin, I don’t know if there is others ex‑ample of Greek terms with Rough‑breathing with‑out H in their Latin versions. Mangêzd (talk) 22:00, 21 June 2015 (UTC)
In my Belgian Walloon Bruxelles French Federation curriculum (at di‑stance : col‑lege level) of Ancient‑Greek, they say that this is an in‑dication of re‑moving… And I be‑lieve them, I don’t know where they got this in‑formation… It is written in « Page 1 of series 6 of lesson 21.17 G of the curriculum of Greek n°066 » for Di‑gamma (Vau) re‑moving & Page 3 of series 4 of lesson 21.10 G of curriculum of Greek n°066 for Sigma re‑moving… The PDF file of the chapter of the curriculum
Since you seem to have know‑ledge about Ancient‑Qrêgu, do you know a page where all words (Doric, Ionian, Eolian, Attic) using Qoppa Ϙ ϙ / Ϟ ϟ are listed, I really need it for my works… Mangêzd (talk) 19:22, 22 June 2015 (UTC)

WT:AGRC

Hi, stephen

When talking in « About Ancient Greek » with people about breathing someone responded to my message but removed lot of content of the page, like history link (of 2010) and my previous message, I think is doing vandalism, can you check :

and then again reputed history & remove my response :

Can you check please ?

Thanks good day… This email was sent by User:Nemzag 12:01, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

It was obviously an accident. The editor is an admin, not a vandal. In the second instance, he reverted himself and added the material back in. —Stephen (Talk) 19:01, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

email

Hi, Stephen, sorry for your dif‑ficulty to under‑stand my English now… That really make me sad and con‑fuse… It’s be‑cause or Hyph‑en or the structure, grammar or vocabulary ? Can you ex‑plain to me ? It’s strange be‑cause in others forums or in on‑lines games, no one have dif‑ficulty to com‑pre‑hend what I’m saying…

I don’t under‑stand what you are saying about in formation what formation ??? Can you ex‑plain please… [1]

I ad‑ded the same comment on multi‑ple talk‑page like « Sigma, Digamma, San » for others users to give their opinions to this and to share the in‑formation (read it « information »), you want that this con‑versation to con‑tinue in Ancient‑Greek talk page, but no one go their and after some‑time, it would be in history « 2015 link », it would be more use‑full to have the comment in each talk pages : digamma, Sigma, San…

I’m happy to talk to you again, after so much time… Be‑cause I re‑member you are an nice & good man.

Take care, good day. email was sent by User:Nemzag 13:55 30 May 2015 (UTC)

I don’t know why it was difficult to understand. The hyphens are confusing, but when I remove them in my mind, your sentences often make no sense to me now. You said something about formation. I could not understand it. I doubt that there is no one else who has difficulty understanding you. Probably the few who replied to you were the ones who were able to understand you. Those who did not reply probably had difficulty understanding.
Most editors here do not read the talk pages for the entries here. People read their own talk pages, and those people who are interested in a certain language will read the talk page of the appendix for that language. —Stephen (Talk) 09:02, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
By the way Nemzag, I’d like to apologize for my harsh comments earlier. I was not in a good mood when I made them and regretted them afterwards. Please forgive my rudeness. —JohnC5 09:27, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
Ok, man, no pro‑blem, I ac‑cept your apo‑logize, may‑be my English is not very good now (I don’t speaked it for 3,5 years) & may‑be I use a French‑structure‑like in English, so may‑be you under‑stand or com‑pre‑hend it bad, and it look like I’m rude to… I apo‑logize to you and ObsequiousNewt, any‑way, thanks for your re‑sponses to my question. Mangêzd (talk) 09:39, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

derë

Hi, I checked Derë, and I see that some‑one e‑rased lot of co‑gnating words in etymo‑logy, why the ad‑mini‑strator allow this to happen ???

Good day… email was sent by User:Nemzag 15:47 2 June 2015 (UTC)

I do not know. You should ask Torvalu4, the one who made the change. —Stephen (Talk) 00:17, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Hi, about what I asked yester‑day, I don’t think it’s user job to pro‑tect and con‑trol data ad‑ded or re‑moved by other users, it’s the role of moderators & ad‑mini‑strators… I really think that this guy is doing vandalism in Albanian, and even, he is not one & he don’t speak it, using for re‑ference the work of Vladimir Orel, so why he is making ad‑d… I don’t think that using this book is good for Albanian as I said be‑fore :

Even a other user (Etimo) ex‑plained to him to not re‑move Albanian etymo‑logy krah based up‑on the theory of Russian Israeli Vladimir Orel that use the falsi‑fied standardized Tosk words to search origins, in‑stead of com‑paring with the authentic Geg variant to)… I don’t say that all etymo‑logy of Vladimir Orel are false or not true, some are cor‑rect, when he use Latin or Greek root for words (but I don’t be‑lieve in imagined Proto‑Indo‑Evropean one, his book don’t use Turkish, Persian, Hindu, Romi/Ashkali, Arabian source or words for etymo‑logy). I don’t think that users using the book of Vladimir for Etymo‑logy, have the right to e‑rase others Albanian etymo‑logy con‑tent be‑cause of it, in‑stead they should just ad‑d in‑formations from that book & keep others users in‑formations to (like « co‑gnate » or « new theory »), they don’t have the right to re‑move every‑thing be‑cause it’s not in that book, for Albania his book is not the best re‑ference… So we would be very grate‑ful if the ad‑mini‑strator & moderators re‑strict his usage.

Thank, good day. email was sent by User:Nemzag 00:16 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Admins can only control data if the data is known to them, or if an edit is clearly incorrect in some obvious way. If the admins do not know a language, and if the edit appears reasonable, we can’t do anything about that. Only the editors who know something about the matter can do anything about it. —Stephen (Talk) 06:11, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Hi, Stephen, I com‑pre‑hend what you are saying but in this case, even if the moderators or ad‑mini‑strators don’t know the languages, they can easily note that cognating words re‑moving is not a good think, but just less in‑formation & less con‑tent, the ad‑mini‑strators should really not allow those kind of « user‑e‑rasing », ad‑ding in‑formation it’s ok, but not e‑rase others con‑tributions (e‑specially with‑out talking with the con‑tributor first)… Since four years of my ab‑sence, do you finded a Albanian ad‑mini‑strator to pro‑tect Albanian (Geg & Tosk) words from this kind of vandalism ? I re‑member that be‑fore you didn’t have one… Thank for your feed‑back. email was sent by User:Nemzag, 01:45, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Such edits are common and are made for various reasons. You have to discuss it with the editor who made the changes.
No, we still do not have an Albanian-speaking admin. —Stephen (Talk) 22:20, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

mbrёmё

Hi, you added this word, but when we search fro mbrëmë (french keyboard), the word is not referenced, it’s seem you use cyrillic « yo » character for the « ё », why ? Why do you not use standard Latin script « ë » ? Mangêzd (talk) 11:26, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Deleted. Copied to mbrëmë. —Stephen (Talk) 22:35, 3 June 2015 (UTC)
The character ё is being regularly used. Please be more specific. Etimo (talk) 17:22, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Mir‑dita, Etimo, no the character is not used in Latin‑Script, I don’t under‑stand why you using it in Albanian word using Latin‑Script, if you want Ë or ë use Unicode character U+00CB & U+00EB, and not Cyrillic script one « yo » : Ё U+0401 & ё U+0451… I doesn’t mater if you say that is regularly used (only by Russia, Belarusia & Tajikistan), first tell me by who, and two, I never eard that be‑fore ??? No, the Albanian use Latin‑script so no need to use Cyrillic letter for some Albanian Latin‑script word, this ad‑d (mbrёmё) was re‑moved by ad‑mini‑strator, also others words in future using some Cyrillic letter in‑stead of Latin in Albanian Latin‑script word, would be re‑moved to… The peoples seeking de‑finition in the « search button » use a standard Latin key‑board, with Cyrillic letter in your ad‑d we can’t find the word in search, don’t use it any‑more it’s use‑less. Mangêzd (talk) 18:26, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

@Etimo mbrёmё was the original entry. It was spelled with ё, a Cyrillic letter. The entry has now been copied to mbrëmë (spelled with Roman ë), and the original mbrёmё has been deleted. —Stephen (Talk) 02:37, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

darkë

Hi, I want to ask you why you give de‑finition night (nätë) & evening (mbrëmje / mrãmje) to darkë ? At Skopje and Kosovo, this word don’t have that meaning.

  • In « Fialuur i voghel Sccyp e ltinisct (Small Dictionary of Albanian and Latin), page 21, by P. Jak Junkut, 1895, Sckoder » the word have the only meaning of « CENA« .
  • In « Dictionnaire Français-Albanais / Fjalor Shqip-Frengjisht, page 444, Vedat Kokona, Tiranë, 2002, →ISBN » this word has not that under‑standing (« night » or « evening »). Vedat Kokona give also the meaning « Réveillon » (Eve of Christ‑mas or New Year, feast), that I’m gonna add.
  • In « Flajor i gjuhës së sotme shqipës », they write « koha pasi perëndon dielli; mbrëmje, vakt darkës » ; « time after the sun goes down; evening, time for dinner » ; they write evening (mbrëmje) not night (natë)…

So can you cor‑rect it ? Mangêzd (talk) 08:16, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Hi there, you’re right, night is not one of the meanings, while evening is. Thanks for your remark.Etimo (talk) 17:19, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

kalb

Mir‑dita / Hi, I ad‑ded the phonetic for Gheg & Tosk variant, I use [k] for Tosk be‑cause this sound come from the front of the mouth, and [q] for Gheg be‑cause in this dia‑lect the sound come from the back of palate (soft), us Shqyptar Gheg we use Ϙ ق [q] & Κ ك [k], but lot of peoples can’t make the dif‑ference.

Here are some example :

  • kurban from arabic قربان & קרבן [qurban]
  • ket/Krejt (all) [qet/qrejt] & kêt (this) [kɛt].

I’m living in Belgium, and here they use the French sound [k] only so I can make the dif‑ference with the Gheg K [q] sound of my languages & dialects from Skopje (father) & Kosovo (mother). Be‑cause I have learn Arabic, I can make the dif‑ference be‑tween these two sound [k] & [q]. The sound K of Gheg Shqyptar look more like [q]. The pro‑blem & error come from Greek alpha‑beta, be‑cause they re‑moved the letter Koppa Ϙ and us, Shqyptart, we loosed that letter in our alpha‑beta, we have a Q but we read it [c, ɕ] and in our land K can be readed [k & q] be‑cause words from Turkish or Arabic (using Ϙ / ق [k]) that we have in Shqyp and in Shkup are writed only with letter K that which there‑fore have two value [k] & [q]. We need to dis‑tinguish these two letters & sounds.

I also ad‑ded dif‑ferent vowels since in Gheg the A of Kalb is pro‑nounced [ɒ]

Mangêzd (talk) 07:30, 6 June 2015 (UTC)

Hi, Tosk k is not automatically Gheg q for all words, most of the cases they are spelled k the same, Tosk kalb is the same in Gheg kalb..there are cases of k-q parallelism though, but they have to be analysed separately. Loanwords from Turkish (also Arabic words) beginning with k are rendered q in Albanian (koefte-qofte, kebab-qebab etc). The further palatalization of q into ç is a Gheg phenomenon and has nothing to do with Greek (or Turkish or Arabic for that matter)! Etimo (talk) 20:31, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

I don’t say that K is auto‑matically a [q] in Gheg but in some case the Ghegs pro‑nounce the K from the back of the palate, and is a [q], this sound ex‑ist like the nasal that Tosk don’t use… I agree with you that lot of Arabic / Turkish word using K [k] & Q [q] are trans‑formed to [c] but no all of them, but for me that is not normal, and those (a‑theist writers) who made these falsi‑fications just want to di‑vide the mu‑slims from under‑standing each others by con‑fusing their common words (lot of words from the Ottoman era (Arabic, Altaic & Persian) that we still use in Macedonia & Kosova are not in the standard Albanian dictionary and were re‑moved during com‑munist time, but in that sup‑posed Illyrian root based dictionary you can find lot of new ad‑ded words from « Greek / Ortho‑dox » & « Latin / Cath‑olic », why this hypo‑crisy against the i‑slamic culture ? Why to re‑ject it in our language)… I also noticed that in Tosk the Gheg P is often changed to MB, in mod‑ern Greek ΜΠ is [b], it seem that the Shqiptar Orthodox (from the south of Albania & north of Greece) have chosen to make P [p] to ΜΜΠ/ΜΒ [mb] (pruj mbroj (rujtar) ; prapa mbrapa ; prãmë mbrëmë ; shtremoj shtrembëroj). The Toskërisht change :

  • K to NG (kadal ngadal ; ka nga)
  • G to NG (garkoj ngarkoj from carr‧us)
  • K [k/q] to Q [c] (käjt Qajt ; kenef qenef ; koft qoft ; kebap qebap)
  • M to MB (mas mbas ; myt mbyt ; mrãm‧je mbrëm‧je)
  • P to MB (pruj mbroj ; prãm mbrëm‧ë ; mbret from im‑per‧at‧or)
  • N to ND (nër ndër ; ner‧oj nder‧oj ; kn‧oj kënd‧oj ; shn‧et shënd‧et from SANITAS ; as‑doni‑here as‑ndonjë‑here)
  • Ë is added at the end of lot of words or in middle (kput këput ; Zot Zotë ; ms‧oj mës‧oj ; burr burrë) in French Ë [ə] (euh [œ ə ʌ] is the sound that they make when they don’t know some‑thing, for me it is the sound of cow, the sound of dumb‑ness, that the Standard/Tosks heavily uses, the Ghegs don’t use it much, but Ghegs uses the nazal à [ɑ̃] sound of the mule / ass, animal who generally is very stubborn, ob‑stinate & ob‑durate…
  • ‑VE to ‑ËVE (aristo‑kratikve aristo‑kratikëve)
  • UN/ËN to UR (pasuni pasuri ; rujtën rujtun rujtur ; dashuri dashuni ; rrezitun rrezitur ; ‑UR is fire in Latin UR‧Ô (UaRWaRgUaRra / gUeRro ; fURno), English bURning, Arabic أور & Hebrew אור (OR/AVR is light אוֹר & UR אוּר is fire), ‑UR is a very bad ending)
  • D to VD (deka vdeka)
  • ‑OJA to ‑ONJA (shqypoja, shqyponja ; zoja zonja)
  • US me UES (ms‧us mës‧ues, re‑ag‧us re‑ag‧ues)
  • UJ me UAJ (gruja gruaja ; rujtun ruajtur)
  • Y to I (hyp hip ; hina hyra ; Shqypni Shqipëri) {be‑cause of mod‑ern Greek pro‑nunciation of ypsilon be‑coming ipsilon}
  • Ê to I {be‑cause of Hêta be‑coming Hita : Tem Tim ; Jêmja Im}
  • Tosks change the end of word with N with R (femën femër from FEMINA ; zotni zotëri, botnor botror botëror ; burrni burrëri ; bërë banë ; an‑mik ar‑mik from IN‑IMIC‧US

I’m a Shqyptar Shkupjan Gheg and truly I don’t like to learn & use the standard Shqip based on Tosk for me this language is a total falsi‑fication of our ancient words & my origin. I’m very sad that in Kosovo they beginned to use the standard in Tele‑vision & media, this is a re‑jection of the Gheg root that we have… I don’t want our di‑stinctive dia‑lect to dis‑ap‑pear. I don’t under‑stand that, when they made and im‑posed the standard in 1969, they don’t used the two variants for each words at same time, but only the Tosk one (read this)… Une foli Gegnisht e jam i knaqt se e foli qat guh e vjetër… Still I want to thank you be‑cause I noticed that when you ad‑d Albanian words, most of the time you ad‑d the Gheg variant to, and that is demo‑cratic & re‑spect‑full… Mangêzd (talk) 21:50, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

I don’t think I understand correctly the point you’re trying to make. Standard Albanian (or even Albanian etymologies in itself) are not based on religious considerations, this matter has nothing to do AT ALL with linguistics, contrary to what you’re trying to insinuate. Foreign words, be it Ottoman, Arabic, Italian or German, are identified as such, as foreign, period. If this hurts your religious sensibilities, that’s your problem, but they are not Albanian words, and this is a linguitic issue, not a religious one. If Greek or Latin words have been added, they are words from various fields (science, physics, bio‑logy, medicine etc) used in almost all European languages. No such words have been left in Albanian from Arabic or Ottoman Turkish (you shouldn’t lump them together in Islamic culture, be more specific), at least not in the degree comparable to Greek and Latin to have an influence on Albanian language. It has nothing to do with hypocrisy. If you’re trying to insinuate that Albanian identity (or language) is some kind bound to Islam just because of the long Ottoman dominion, then you have absolutely no clue of Albanian history, identity or language (I’m sorry to hear that mass islamization of Albanians in Kossovo and Macedonia is still a sad issue of national identity). Finally, adding Gheg Albanian variants is not a matter of respect, it has more to do with history (Gheg Albanian has the most ancient literature and would have been standard Albanian if were not for the Communist regime who made Tosk Albanian the official language), thus it goes without saying that the Gheg variant of a word must be indicated. I strongly advise you to study more the history of the Albanian people and language (and leave religion alone), because this is where you’ll find all the answers you need. Etimo (talk) 16:54, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Ad‑ding more words in our languages is a rich‑ness, if you look English : is made of old Germanic, Celtic, Saxon, Latin, ancient Greek, Scandinave, French… So why re‑jecting or de‑forming i‑slamic, Persian or Altaic words, we can use them to en‑rich our cultures and to ex‑press our‑selfs in a more varied way… You say Latin & Greek were ad‑ded be‑cause of sciences, biology, medicine & physics, but in Turkey, Iran (Persia) or in Arabic states they have sciences in‑stitutes (and the Arabian medecine is well known) but I’m not sure they need Latins or Greeks words for their dis‑coveries or to de‑scribe them, like those Albanian ad‑ded… I’m truly Albanian but I don’t re‑ject the i‑slamic culture and for me those who are mu‑slims are truly Albanian (and i‑slam is a part of Gheg identity that started since Christianity be‑cause the pro‑phets of the Holy Coran are the same than the Torah and even the archaic albanian believed in one zot), I don’t see the Ottoman era with a bad point of view like you, for me they were con‑querer like Bulgarian, Byzantine, Mongol {becoming the Ottoman after con‑version to i‑slam}, Roman, Shellênic, (Persian) empire was at their time, all of them have in‑vaded Illyria and im‑posed their languages & be‑lieve, so for me they are all on same level, why ac‑cepting the Roman & Greek cultures (architectures, icons, arts, statues, nudity) and re‑jecting the Altaic, Persian & Arabic/Hebrew/Semitic, it is just hypo‑crisy for me… I have lot of Turkish, Maghreban, Italian friends and I never had pro‑blem with them… Re‑jecting the re‑ligion is typically the com‑munist era way of thinking… Lot of Albanian after first world war fled to Turkey to save their live and they still live there in peace and under protection of the Turks, so no for me the Ottoman were not bad as are the Serbians…

I’m happy to ear that Gheg is older and that is the reason why you ad‑d it, I have read some article about that, but I can’t find the older book in archive.org, and even if I find it, it would be hard to de‑cipher be‑cause of the style of the script… For Albanian words I would like to have in « Alternative Forms » the Arvanitic in Greek, the Gheg, the Tosk, the Elbasan version using Elbasan Unicode script, the Ottoman era Arabic script version & the Cyrillic variant at the time of Bulgarian Em‑pire, that would be great and very pre‑cise… You say that re‑ligion is not im‑portant in linguistic but I’m sure that those who made the falsi‑fications in Albanian, do that with an anti‑re‑ligious mind… Mangêzd (talk) 20:46, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

This is not the place where to debate religious or political matters, especially when it comes to the role of Islam in modern Albanian politics, which is highly controversive. As a researcher of Albanian language and history, I have my own views on the matter which are exactly opposite to yours. Unfortunately, I have met many Albanians who have a quite distorted view of Albanian history, identity and language because they filter it through their religious identity, and this is especially true with Islam. I’m really sorry to assert that the long Ottoman rule have left such scars in Albanian national identity..I will answer to your questions, but I won’t continue this debate any further, since this is an etymological dictionary, not a forum where to debate religion. First of all: you CANNOT put the impact of Latin and Greek culture on Albanian on same level with the Ottoman one. Latin and Greek culture are THE BASIS of 2000 years of European culture and identity, and you cannot in any way compare those with the Ottoman tyranny on the Balkans who did absolutely NOTHING to enhance the culture and the spirit of the dominated people. The Ottoman dominion on the Albanian people was of the most vicious kind, as it attempted to delete the European identity of the Albanian people and substitute it with an islamic one for merely political and military reasons (something they achieved with success for large swaths of the population, and continue to do). Ottomans didn’t try to educate Albanians, foster their urban and cultural development as, for instance, Rome did, Albanians were enemies, infedels, who led the most stubborn resistence, and were always treated as such. Once they were conquered even the Albanian language itself was forbidden, so what kind of culture could you learn or spread if you’re not even allowed to teach your own language? At the end of the Ottoman rule, Albania resembled more a modern post-war Afghan village, with almost 95% of illiteracy, a data enough to make you understand how wrong it is to indulge in historical revisionism moved by religious motives. Contrary to what you declare, it clearly shows that you identify yourself first of all as a mu‑slim, then as an Albanian (proving my point). Albanians are EUROPEANS in language, culture and ethnicity, and just like any other European nation they embrace and have always embraced their European culture and traditions, and this is not a matter of opion, it’s a fact, a reality! 300 years of Ottoman islam cannot change that! Finally, you cannot compare the role of Islam with that of Christianity in the history of Albania or the Balkans. Gheg Albanians are and have always been Catholics, like the Arberesh people are orthodox, and the islamic identity you talk about came very late to have any historical weight. Islam was never an apostolic religion in the Balkans (like Christianity), and it was never digested by the cultures it came in contact with. It is an accepted fact by all mainstream scholars that islam got a foothold among Albanians only between the 17th and 18th century because of social and economic reasons, not because of spontaneous conversion (how can you spontaneously convert to the religion of an occupier??). So, that said, I renew my invitation to you to put aside religion when analysing the history of a people, and judge things dispassionately, otherwise you’re just taking sides, the side of those who have always used religion to advance their own agenda, and you’re simply playing their game.Etimo (talk) 22:12, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

I think in con‑trary that it is the per‑fect place to do it, since I meet you here, and since we are talking about Albanians terms re‑moved, ad‑ded, de‑formed or falsi‑fied…

The Roman Em‑pire was made of op‑pression, tax, cruci‑fixion, torture, crushing, per‑versity, slavery and circus game, the Semitic be‑lieve (Hebrew, Aramaic, Arab) have bring to them the com‑passion, forgive‑ness, love of the neighbor, altruism, Moses laws & Messianic Christianity, and the be‑lieve in one unique god re‑veled by the pro‑phets, if you re‑ject that and say that the only the Roman or Greek have made the basis of Evr‑ope you are lying, I’m sure that the German, Polish, Dutch, Norwegian, Swedish & Slavic (ex‑cept Russian) use very little Latin words in their languages (and they are very ad‑vanced)… Only France, England, Italy, Spain, Romania, Albania, Portugal (and their colonies) are really using it, but if you are a real Shqyptar, then you will pre‑fer to use our unique word from the Illyrian / Thracian era, than those of Roman or Greeks (so it is why I don’t under‑stand why in our time lot of new Latin & Greek word were ad‑ded in Standard Shqip & the Ottoman one re‑moved in the of‑ficial dictionary)…

I love the faith and I be‑lieve in one God, and I re‑spect the Altaic, Semitic, Persian, Bulgarian culture, I don’t re‑ject it and in Shkup we still use their words, like the Greek or Latin one… And that is all…

You say « Con‑trary to what you de‑clare, it clearly shows that you identi‑fy your‑self first of all as a mu‑slim, then as an as an Albanian (proving my point) », well at home I speak Shqyp and all my family is Arbanian, and some of them, have grown in the com‑munist era so they don’t like any re‑ligions at all… I don’t speak semitic Arab/Hebrew (I just know some words) or Turkish (but my mother, grand‑mothers & grand‑fathers knowned it living in Ottoman Em‑pire), but yes I’m a be‑liever, and God is up‑on any nationality… But that doesn’t change nothing, about my origins, I’m really an Shqyptar, and even if you are an a‑theist or a Christian ortho‑dox or cath‑olics that doesn’t make you a more real Shqyptarian, Arbanian, Albanian or Illyrian than me, be‑cause at the origin they were probably poly‑theist… The pro‑blem is how you de‑fine an Illyrian (-800 BC), an Albanian (150 AD), an Arbanian / Arvanian / Arbarian (1190 AD), an Shqyptar (1700 AD), an Gheg & an Tosk… Being an Gheg Shqyptar bring to me 10.000.000 of com‑patriot, being a be‑liever bring to me 3.000.000.000 of brothers & sisters in the faiths sharing com‑mon value & one unique & same God, be‑cause i‑slam con‑sider the Jehudi יהודי / يهودي, Nasari נוצרי / نصراني & Mu‑slims as « Peoples of the Book » & brother / sisters in the same unique faith, even if there is some di‑vergence, schism & con‑frontation…

You say that « Ottoman tyranny on the Balkans who did ab‑solutely NOTHING to en‑hance the culture and the spirit of the dominated people » this is un‑true and by saying that you don’t under‑stand the purity, morality & the nobility of the faith that they had (and that may‑be they didn’t cor‑rectly ap‑plied), and that lot of Gheg share hence‑forth, if you had study this re‑ligion and the rêmggy رحمجي (mercy), com‑paθsion, giving value that she have, you will not talk like that, but you seem to not com‑pre‑hend it at all… If they were able to main‑tain their huge em‑pire in Evr‑ope, Middle‑East, North‑Africa 500 years, prove their dominating in‑tel‑ligence, don’t forgot that the Ottoman were Turko‑Tataro‑Mongol of the tribes of Genghis Khan, who even had an older Em‑pire started in 1206

War al‑ways ex‑isted and this no‑body can do nothing about it. The stronger wins (this is the law of jungle) and we Illyrian were weak against the Hellenic Em‑pire, Roman Em‑pire, Bulgarian Em‑pire, Ottoman Em‑pire, that’s all, but I don’t hate these em‑pire for that, every one have bring some‑thing to us, and I ac‑cept all of them and not re‑ject some of them… But why de‑fending the Romans ? That is some‑thing I don’t under‑stand.

You say the Ottoman don’t al‑lowed you to speak Shqyp, very strange be‑cause the languages still ex‑ist and even the Gheg mu‑slims still use it (whereas the Tosk have de‑formed & falsi‑fied it even if they were Ortho‑dox or Cath‑olics, so I‑slam & Ottoman as nothing to do in this), Albania was only a little pro‑vince of the Ottoman Em‑pire and I don’t be‑lieve that they have forbid the Arabs under their dominion in the middle‑east or Maghreb to not speak & learn their language in private & at home or even the Shqyptar in south‑Evr‑ope (be‑cause they can’t con‑trol all of us, all the time, at all locations). The Serbian have forbid the Albanian to speak Shqip at school, uni‑versity & state‑jobs in Kosovo. I’m sure that at the time of Roman & Byzance Em‑pire, the Illyrian were ob‑ligated by force, con‑straint & co‑ercion, to speak Latin/Greek, this is why we still have their word in our mod‑ern language, so don’t say the Ottoman were worse than Roman. Even in Africa (& Maghreb), Indo-China, in south‑America & north‑America the native Indian American were forced to speak Portuguese, Spanish, French or English by the colonialists (and I don’t talk about the slavery & dis‑criminations that the Christians Cath‑olics & Pro‑testant made there with the Africans & Native Americans until 1964 : Civil Rights Acts & 1954 laws), this is very com‑mon situation that the dominating peoples force the op‑primed to speak their languages, even now the strangers who come to live in America have to speak these languages at works & school, even if they are not their mother‑tongues…

You say at that time 95% were il‑literate, but I live in Belgium and here (and may‑be even in France) going to school is ob‑ligatory & free by state since maximum 130 years (1870 in USA, 1882 in France, the Ottoman Em‑pire dis‑ap‑peared in 1918), and now in 2015 they are more than 10% of an‑alpha‑beta in the state of capital of Evr‑ope. In the past, from medieval to mod‑ern era, lot of peoples & e‑specially women (that even didn’t had the right to vote) were an‑alpha‑beta for most of them (women are 53% of population). All states of Evr‑ope had lot of il‑literate peoples at that time, the peasant class didn’t had the money to go to school & uni‑versity (only the nobility had the means), it was a global pro‑blem, the Ottoman have nothing to do in that, the first words of the re‑velation of i‑slam by the Angel is אקרא / ܐܰܩܪܝ / اقْرَأْ IQRA (Read & Teach), I’m sorry if you don’t under‑stand the power‑full cryptic meaning of that (Al‑Qur’an קוראן / ܩܘܪܐܢ / قرآن mean reading or re‑citation, the i‑slam pro‑mote & en‑courage literacy & learning)… In our era, lot of Albanians still pre‑fer to send their kids works with sheeps, on fields or to sell things like cigarettes or chewing‑gum on the street (have seen that with my own eyes), than sending them to school, and the Ottoman are not there any‑more, if they was no state‑law to ob‑ligate the Albanians to send their kids there, they would be many more il‑literates… No they was 95% of an‑alpha‑beta be‑cause they were to poor or lazy and not in‑ter‑ested by any cultures (Semitic, Latin, Greek, Slavic or Germanic)… Also the Evr‑opean culture that you are so proud of, come from middle‑east, the source is Semitic Phoenician & Aramaic Script (e‑volution of proto‑canaanite), that the Greek then Roman taken, the Greek & Latin script come from there and lot of words that you use in Latin / Greek have root from Middle‑Eastern source (Semitic, Egyptian, Caucasian, Mesopotamian, Hindi, Persian)… But there is a con‑spiration from the Western & Eastern Evr‑opean etymo‑logist to hide this verity…

« How can you spontaneously con‑vert to the re‑ligion of an oc‑cupier?? » it is very simple in fact, be‑cause it is a faith made up‑on the truth with honorable values, not telling that a man is God (شرك‎ Shirk, like the Christian say for Iesuo ישוע / ܝܫܘܥ / يسوع, that the Jews & Mu‑slims negate) and telling only God should be venered & re‑vered, if it was as bad as you say, they would not be Mu‑slims from far‑east Asia to far‑western U.S.A

Lot of French, German & Belgian con‑vert to this faith (be‑cause I read it in Belgian papers be‑cause I live here) and no one is oc‑cupying them or forcing them, this happen be‑cause this book follow the Jewish Semitic be‑lieve and com‑plete it, and be‑cause it is purest mono‑theism, with‑out idols, icons, per‑versions & statues that Greek & Latin worshiped in vain… Don’t take only as ex‑ample re‑tarded land like Afghani‑stan or land in war like Iraq to dis‑credit the i‑slam, but take good ex‑ample like Malaysia, Indonesia, Turkey, Qatar, Tunisia, Maroc or Arab‑Emirate, who are very ad‑vanced in their in‑fra‑structure, archi‑tecture, e‑ducation, morality & techno‑logy… I will not talk with you about this any‑more, I see what is your point of view. And I don’t share it at all. Mangêzd (talk) 13:42, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

You’re justifying domination and tyranny for your religious reasons..you just seem not to have an historical cultural identity of your own, since you’re clinging so desperately to the culture of who invaded and kept your country for 4 centuries..it just comments for itself, I have nothing to add to that!! Etimo (talk) 18:11, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

It is what you think, your identity is on the side of the (Ancient‑Greeks), Romans & Byzantine and they were even worse in their actions, per‑versions & be‑lieves than Ottomans. (The re‑ligion of Ottoman that lot of Shqyptar share, is the semitic one, based on Judaism then Messianism but with‑out Saints, Idols, Icons & Statues of Jesus, Maria, pro‑phets & angels…).

I know very well the Greco‑Latin antique cultures & mytho‑logies (be‑cause I use their terms in Shqyp and I live in Belgium since I’m a baby and here we speak French (Greco‑Gallo‑Franco‑Latin language), I readed some book & dictionary about Ancient‑Greek & Latin and I ana‑lyzed & com‑pared the etymo‑logy & roots of these languages as an auto‑didact and I have take course, also I studied the English and I have seen Spanish & Italian media & peoples in my life to know their customs & traditions)…

But in ad‑dition I have the Semitic, I‑slamic, Jewish, Nasari, Slavic, Persian (Zoroastrism Manicheism Shio’ism شيعة‎) Hindu/Romi/Ashkali & Ottoman Turkish Altaic (Shamanism Animism) culture in me… I’m cosmo‑polite, like my Macedonian capital Shkupi (Scupi)

Don’t judge me by saying that I have no identity, my identity is Gheg, Evr‑opean, in‑ter‑national, global & multi‑cultural and not auto‑centered only in Tosk‑Arbarian cath‑olistic, ortho‑doxistic or a‑theistic side… You are not an GJYKAC, ΔΙΚΑΙΟΣ, an IUDICIS, an DICTATOR or an HAKIM חכם / حكيم QADI קאדי / قاضي like God is, to judge me. Don’t think you are better than me be‑cause you are not a Mu‑slim or a be‑liever, you are not per‑fect & even not just, equitable & fair at all.

You don’t know me at all as a person, so keep these use‑less critics about my Shkupjan Gheg identity that you don’t know or don’t com‑pre‑hend & under‑stand… I’m not re‑sponsible of the actions of these em‑pires (Persian, Greek, Roman, I‑slamic, Byzantine, Bulgarian, Ottoman), I don’t com‑mitted their crimes, op‑pressions, wars or abuses. So I don’t have to justi‑fy & blame nothing. It is the past, and I’m looking to the future… But I don’t like the meth‑odo‑logy of the (ex‑com‑munist) Shqipërija about re‑moving Gheg, Persian, Turkish & Semitic words in the of‑ficial standard, to put some Latin, Greek and Tosk (falsi‑fied & de‑formed Gheg), this is not the true languages & root of Thraco‑Illyrian & old Albania.

In fact Shqipërija (in 1969 & after) choosed to sub‑mit her‑self to his real & ancient neighbors op‑pressors, and Shqipëria choosed to be hypo‑crites against the cultures of Middle‑east (Semito‑Persian) & Asia (Altaico‑Turko‑Mongol). I’m on the side of truth‑full Shqyp‑nia Arbania & Albania, not on the false & fake Shqipërija Arbaria & Albaria…

The Shqipëri & in parti‑cular the Tosks com‑munists rulers made laws to forbid the use of Gheg & even con‑demned & tortured it’s own peoples for reading & sharing Ghegs books and for speaking it, by sending them to prisons or may‑be by e‑rasing them… They were even worse than Ottoman for the Ghegs cultures (Read the « Sub‑human » post of 06-22-2014, 05:52 PM)…

But now after the com‑munism per‑secutions & op‑pressions against the religions, there is a re‑vival of the i‑slamic faith in our land, and the Ottoman are not there to force & con‑strain us any‑more, we do that by our own will, just be‑cause we be‑lieve in the Abrahamic re‑velation, Mu‑Ħamed S.A.V.S was not a Turkish… Also the Gheg ex‑dominant e‑lite (from Kosovo, Macedonia & North‑Albania) who lost their supremacy after 1945, are making pressure to ad‑d their terms in standard shqip of the a‑theist com‑munist era… (Look at the re‑form of 2013 of 5296 terms).

About il‑literacy of 95% I’m sure that this statistic is based & calculated only up‑on how many could read the Latin Cath‑olic or Greek Ortho‑dox Script : 90% of an‑alpha‑beta (85% in English Wikipedia), I’m sure that at the time of Ottoman Em‑pire lot of Gheg & Tosk Mu‑slims knew the Ottoman‑Arabic‑script and in a more great pro‑portion, like 30% to 40%. (The Cor’an קוראן / قرآن mean reading or re‑citation, the i‑slam pro‑mote & en‑courage literacy & learning)… And Albanians had the right to go to ancient & magni‑ficent city of I‑st‧an‑bul (Côn‑st‧ant‑inou‑polis) in Turkish schools & uni‑versities. Also lot of Arbanians had good positions in the states structures, like Pasha, Generals and Begs, so no for me the Ottomans did not dis‑criminate the Albanians, but only those who were violently against them and a against the peace…

I’m not « clinging so de‑sperately to the culture of who in‑vaded and kept your country for 4 centuries » be‑cause first I still speak Shqyp (but with some Ottoman (Persian, Semitic, Turkish), Slavic words in ex‑tra) and this Semitic (Obritian עברית / عبري بر & Orbitian ערבית & عربي) i‑slamic (Uni‑versal re‑ligions of the Peace : Selam שלום / ܣܰܠܶܩ ܫܠܶܡ / سلم) be‑lieve & cultures is in my country since 2500 years, first by the use of semitic Phoenician Aramaic script (of the Torah) that the ancient‑Greek & Etruscan (Roman) taken to write their own languages. Then by Semitic Aramaic Messianism & Christianity since 1900 years. And the Abraham re‑ligion I have is 4000 years old… I’m not clinging to the culture of the in‑vader who arrived in Albania 1415, this culture is now an in‑tegrated part of Gheg cultures for over 400~300 years and since 2500/1900 years, and when I’m born it was al‑ready my ancestors culture…

Mu‑slims Albanians from Shqyp‑nija (57%, the French Wikipedia say 86,64%, 2,5 millions up‑on a total of 3,1 millions habitants), Kosovo (95%), Macedonia (30%, 25% of total population is Albanian), Monte‑negro (15%, 5% of total population is Albanian), merged together are 80% of all Albanity (and I don’t count the Turkish Albanian who are probably at 90% mu‑slims), and we are real Albanians, we speak it and if you want to tell the con‑trary I think you should meditate twice be‑fore saying such think in front of us… In fact peoples like you are the minority of the mod‑ern & actual Albanian cultures. You are not re‑pre‑sentative at all… In fact we are the real Arbanians who held the land and did not flee be‑fore the ad‑versary, like the ARBËRESH (they fled to Italia be‑cause they con‑sider them‑self more as Romans & Latins de‑scendants than real Illyrians / Thracian (even their name is fake Arber instead of original Arben)… In‑deed, we (the real TRIMAT) stayed & keeped our land using the i‑slamic law‑full meth‑od of Taqija تقیة (Pious) by using & learning our language hidden & in secret…

The Albanians Mu‑slims as a state are an of‑ficial members of Organization of I‑slamic Co‑operation since the end of com‑munism & 1992.

Lot of Albanians have chosen to live in Turkey after the end of Ottoman em‑pire to flee from the per‑secution of the Greeks & Slaves Ortho‑dox after the first world war, and after the second world‑war to flee the eastern Evr‑ope com‑munism that forbid the re‑ligions, if the Ottomans Em‑pire & the demo‑cratic state of Turkey (of Atatürk) were so bad & evil for Albania, why these true Albanians (Tosk & Gheg mu‑slims) have chosen to live there with them ??? If I be‑lieve what I read, they are 3 millions of Albanian in Turkey or 1,3 millions in English wikipedia, here in a other wikipedia English page 5.000.000 and in Albanian wikipedia 8.470.954,95 in 1990 = 15% of 56.473.033.

Who say the truth I don’t know. But if I be‑lieve what my father say, they are more Albanians in Turkey than in Shqipëri, Macedonia, Montenegro, Kosova, Greece & Italia to‑gether…

In Belgium, I know lot of Albanians who vorks with Turkish (as patron or em‑ployee) or who are married… We don’t have any pro‑blem with them and I love & re‑spect the Turkish, I have lot of Turkish friends, they are honorable & trust‑full, and actually there is no mod‑ern Turkey law that forbid you to speak Shqyp (like the law of 31 May 1779, of Sultan Abdül‑Ħamid First, who punished by death those who speak it in public {but the source of that article is Greek so I’m not sure if it’s true, this in‑formation is not in the Albania article of English Wikipedia}), the Turks have e‑volved and are not « tyrannical (I cite you) » against us any‑more… Also this generations is not re‑sponsible of the actions of their pre‑de‑cessors & ancestors.

Even the Serbians, who are more anti‑i‑slam & anti‑Ottoman than you are, be‑cause they even tried in end of the twentieth century to make a geno‑cide against Albanian & Bosnian (and cath‑olic Croatian), to clean the Ottoman & Latin in‑fluence from the self‑called « Slavic Great Serbia« , are still using lot of Persian, Arabic & Turkish (Ottoman) terms in the Serbo‑Croatian languages, and even more than the of‑ficial « Standard Shqip » made by the a‑theist Tosk com‑munist team of Enver Hoxha after 1969…

I put them in Chrono‑logical order :

You can com‑pare with the Tosk/Standard Shqip :

The Serbo‑Bosniaco‑Monte‑negro‑Croatians don’t re‑ject these languages, they ad‑d them to their mother‑tongue (proto‑slavic) to en‑hance & ex‑pand their way to ex‑press them‑self.

This Serbo‑Croatian (made of lot of) ethnicities was the of‑ficial languages of Yugo‑slavia & of‑ficial languages of actual Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia & Monte‑negro (Macedonia use it to but they have a di‑stinct dia‑lect).

If you know only one terms you can’t truly ex‑press your‑self, by ad‑ding terms & words in your vocabulary, you en‑rich your know‑ledge, in‑tel‑ligence & com‑pre‑hension and your possibility to ex‑press your thinking with more pre‑cision, variation & di‑versity. Using these terms is a rich‑ness not a ethnic identity loss.

You are clinging & stagnating to the culture of Greco‑Romano‑Byzantine that in‑vaded your Illyrian Thracian land 2000 years ago…

You al‑ready loosed your Albanian Illyrian / Thracian identity by be‑coming a part of Roman then Byzantine em‑pire and by choosing the name Shqipëri (ana‑gram of S.P.Q.R and homo‑nym of SCIP‧IO & EX‑CIP‧IÔ {SHQIP‧ÔJ}) in‑stead of original Gheg pro‑nunciation : « Shqyp & Shqyp‑ni », look at the ancient Gheg pro‑nunciation of Shqyptar Shqyponj, it is from Ancient‑Greek ὨϘΥ‑ΠΤΕΡΟΣ & mod‑ern Tosk version of Shqipëtar Shqiponja / Skifter from Latin AD‑CIP‧ITER & EX‑CIP‧ERE, there is no link with Illyro‑Thracian cultures any‑more, the AQVILA in our flag is the sym‑bol of Roman and sub‑ordination & sub‑mission to the Roman & Holy Roman/German → GeRoman Em‑pire, even the term Shqyp & Shqyp‑ni have root from SHKUPI and SCUPI (ac‑cording to Petar Skok)… The Shkupjan are the real sources of the mod‑ern Albanian culture… Mangêzd (talk) 01:16, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Please stop clogging my message page with walls and walls of your personal religious rants..I told you what I think and your answer just further confirms my point of view..you can be whatever you want, a Semite, a neo-Ottoman, Persian or a citizen of the world, and follow whatever religion that pleases you, it’s your choice, but as I told you, we have two diammetrically opposed ideas of Albanian history and language and above all, what Albania was/is/and will be…and I’m really not interested in being lectured on history and linguistics. Again, this conversation stops here, thank you!!! Etimo (talk) 18:23, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Ok, I told you what I had to say (this is free‑dom of be‑lieve & ex‑pression Articles 18 & 19 and Talk‑Page are open to any‑one, you made some de‑claration against me so I had to re‑spond)… Mos e ku‑pto keq.

But I must ad‑d this : be‑cause of these re‑ligious rants & reasons and be‑cause they are so many messianists משיחי & مسيحي & mu-slims מוּ‑שלם & م‑سلم in Albanity, I think that the Tosk com‑munist a‑theist rulers who made & pro‑moted the standard (Tosk) in 1969 didn’t had the right to re‑move the Semitic com‑mon Obritian עברית / عبري & Orbitian ערבית / عربي terms from Ottoman & Christiano‑Byzantine era in our languages and they didn’t had the rights to ab‑olish & sup‑press the Gheg dia‑lect.

After making search about what you said and that I didn’t knew, I ad‑mit that the Ottoman rulers were rough with our nation. They didn’t ap‑plied & re‑spected the true & real pre‑cepts of i‑slam (peace & paci‑fism) of Mu‑Ħamed S.A.V.S, like :

Even to‑day there is not a single school in Albanian in Turkey, as my uncle told me yester‑day, whereas there are Turkish schools in Albania (but the Turkish pre‑sident Erdogan want to close them)…

Ottoman Em‑pire pre‑de‑cessors were rough with us to.

Good bye, Tu‑ngäth‑jetha, mir‑u‑päfshmi… Mangêzd (talk) 20:58, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Ah you did some research now and you’re able to answer!! And how objective do you think you are when you talk about things you don’t even have a clue about? Can’t you see how ridiculous the things you say are? No matter what you say, again, you confirm my point of view (which is also the point of view of every historian): Islam was embraced only through social cohertion and violence and it is absolutely foreign to true Albanian culture and nature and every Albanian who has a minimum of identity and dignity understands that quite easily. Unfortunately Albanians from Kosovo and Macedonia, like yourself, have completely lost their Albanian European identity as you all are under the absoulte rule and propaganda of Saudi Arabia and Turkey, who have turned you in obedient soldiers of Islam for their political purposes. It’s no surprise that Kosovo and Macedonia have the higher number of jihadist and throat-cutters fighting in Syria compared to their population. The sad thing about Albanians like yourself is that you don’t event understand it, you’re blind, cause this is everything you’ve ever known in your life!! You simply don’t know true Albanism, you only know an oriental surrogate of it! Instead of trying to rebuild your destroyed Albanian-European identity, traditions and language, you want to keep mixing it, you rejoy of the Ottoman era and religion. That’s hopeless and shameful beyond any limit! That’s called the philosophy of slavery (Kadare), a person that is afraid of being free because it has forgotten what he was. This kind of person does not deserve freedom, cause he’s born a slave and he enjoys it!! I had to answer one last time, your grotesque point of view and deformation of Albanian identity exceeds every possible understanding. Now you know that we have absoultely different point of views, so there’s no point in debating any further! Etimo (talk) 14:04, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

Mir‑dita, I only agree with you about the law of Abdül‑hamid First, that’s all, (again only French Wikipedia talk about that law, based up‑on an un‑sure Greek source of 14 août 1999, the Wikipedia English & Albanian don’t mention that), all my arguments about il‑literacy and other things are real & true.

I’m not sure of what your are talking, it is crap, be‑cause I don’t loosed my Albanian Evropean culture since I still use the language of my Gheg ante‑cestor (with Illyrian, Latin, Greek words in‑side) and not the fake one of the Tosk (Standard)…

For you al‑i‑slam ال‑إ‑سلام (re‑ligion of peace שָׁלוֹם / ܣܰܠܶܩ ܫܠܶܡ / سلام is a re‑gression, you are totally wrong… You make me pity, with your way of thinking… Truly.

This faith and my arguments & ex‑planation are not ridi‑culous…

80% of honorable (neruar) Albanity can be wrong, as I pre‑viously said above (but I written this com‑ment after so maybe you did not read it), we Ghegs mu‑slims מוּ‑שׂלם / ܐ‑ܣܠܩ ܡܰ‑ܗܓܪܐ / م‑سلم م‑ثالي (mu‑slm mu‑θali) are the real Albanians TRIMAT who stayed & kept the land, not fleeing in Italia by fear of the Otoman עותמאן תם / تمم, be‑cause in fact, these fleeing cowards were more Latins & Romano‑Byzantin than real Illyrian Albanian…

We don’t follow the pro‑paganda (as you say) of Orbia Soudia السعودية (but only the faith of the Orbitian Angels like GABRI’ÊL & the Meccan MU‑ĦAMED A‑Obudda אַעֹבֻּדהאלַאלֵה / أَ‑عْبَّدَ al‑ile אל‑אלה / ال‑إله, the laudable م‑حمد, the last messenger of Abraham ब्राह्म re‑ligion of the unique God essence and the bringer of the de‑scended book of re‑velation who mean reading / re‑citation. If you knew the history you will know that the Kobah כעבה / كعبة was build by the Orbitian Angels for the first Man Adam as a temple for him, the first KOB‧AH was de‑stroy during the flood at the time of Noah, then Abraham re‑build it and lived in that place… Is re‑lic are kept there. After the temple was de‑stroyed again and re‑builded in his Cubic form that we know today, but that place be‑came a poly‑theist, statues & idols ad‑oration place, then the pro‑phet Mu‑Ħamed came & de‑stroyed these use‑less faith and bringed back the true re‑ligion of Adam & Ibrahim, of the unique ever‑lasting creator of the Uni‑verse… Mecca is a saint place for all be‑liever of the Earth… This is Human origin history. And it is very fascinating not ridi‑culous. Orbia Soudia is a new state and only Mecca & Medina in‑ter‑est the mu‑slims all over the world… Not the politic of that re‑cent state.

If you knew better the i‑slam (re‑ligion of the peace) you will know that Shqypθarθ are Hanafit حنفي‎ and not Hanbalite حنبلي‎ like Arabia Saudia. We have other laws, practices and phonetic letters pro‑nounciation.

I don’t think that Orbians (Saudi سعودية, Qatar قطر, Oman عمان‎, Kuwait كويت‎, Jordan أردن‎, U.A.E) who are very wealthy by the grace of God in a hope‑less & desertic place (thanks to under‑ground black‑gold oil), need the people from the poorest land in Evrope (since 90 years Ottoman are not there any‑more so the eco‑nomic situation prove the in‑tel‑ligence of the a‑theist Albanians com‑munist rulers & soviet brain‑washed philo‑sopher thinker like Kadare), still the Orbs give us help to build hospitals but us we never gave them any‑thing (look this com‑parative picture from an Albanian pro‑file in FaceBook)…

Do you really think that the Arabs (Orbitians ערבית / ܥܪܒܝܐ / عربي) have an hidden agenda (like secret‑societies, as the il‑luminati) to con‑quer the world, and really need Albanians to do it ??? This is just stupid & moronic. This Tups‧id orm‧unic faith just want to save our souls not the flesh.

Also at the dif‑ference of the cath‑olic & ortho‑dox who have a strict hier‑archic clergy & de‑signed rulers (Pope, Cardinals, Arch‑bishops, bishops, priests, canons, Deacons, Abbots, Monks) the i‑slam don’t have this kind of authority and we don’t re‑ceive order from any‑body, we are free to make our choice & to choose the mosque & imam, hodja or mullah that we want to follow, and mine are Albanians who studied in Egypt and the other in Makka & Medina… I don’t see what pro‑paganda the Arabs are doing in Macedonia, Kosovo or Albania media… The Saint Coran was written in 647.

Also you seem to forgot that Ottoman (con‑verted Turko‑Mongol) ruled the Arabs to… I don’t know why now you speak against the Arabians, since they didn’t in‑vade us and never threat & mal‑treated our peoples. You seem to be an anti‑semite which is il‑legal based on the Belgian & the Evropean laws

I’m not a ob‑oedient soldier (like you say) and I never made any war, and thank God I never had to fight & e‑liminate no one. Again what you say is crap for most of 80% of Albanian mu‑slim (paci‑fist)…

I pre‑fer to be ob‑oedient / audient to God than to a dictator like a‑theist Enver Hoxha or men like you.

It is better to be an Albanian + Arbanian + Orbian : ΟΑΛϜΑΡΒΑΝ Oalvarabanianë + Aramian + Aryan = Oalvarabmanianë עאלורבּנוּיאן / عالۋاربانيان Oalbuddo עאלבּוּדדה from أبُدّي (abuddi) بِ‑هُدّوء (bi‑huddʰua) بُدّا (budda) بُدّاء (budaa) أبُدّع (budo) عبُدّ (obudd) ببائد (bbajud) than a Deb‧il‧is دابب (dabb) ددابة (ddab‧a) {⊖DB⊖ ↔ ⊕BD⊕} (DEBILIS is not a DE + BEL root but DEB with -ILIS like SIMILIS, AGILIS…).

These Albanians & Macedonians throat‑cutters (as you name them) in Syria are not a big part of us, may‑be 0,01% of all mu‑slim Albanians & Macedonians. But still they are free to de‑cide to make & do war if they want to. It is their free‑dom. I don’t need to judge others like you do…

What about mu‑slims foreign fighter who come in Kosovo & Bosnia and who died there to help us (un‑like you) against the Serb army. For us they were heroes & martyrs. And what about U.S fighter who come in Evrope to bombard Serbian or fight the anti‑semitic & anti-slavic Nazi & Fascist. Was these U.S warriors heroes or stupid men ?

Being a fighter, a com‑batant or a warrior is not bad as you seem to think. Why people like Alex‑ander, Aliskender‑beg الإسكندر بگ‎ or Adem Jashari are re‑spected by mod‑ern Albanians ? They were fighters and heroes who fought counter the op‑pressors…

All states have military and a de‑fense, even social in‑sect like the ants & termites have a soldier‑class in‑side them, it is some‑thing very natural, even for humans to pro‑tect the weak & young or to fight against the en‑emy…

I’m not blind, I’m awaken बोधि (bodhi) बोधति (bodhati) БУД‧АН, you are blind & your heart is locked to the truth & global reality, and you speak about i‑slam with‑out com‑pre‑hending is real essence (be‑cause you listen the Evropean pro‑paganda against it, i‑slam is not only Afghani‑stan and Syria & Iraq, they are lot of peace‑full mu‑slim states like the Kazakh, Azerbaijan, Malaysian, Moroccan…).

I lived in Belgium and I had French Christian Cath‑olic curriculum e‑ducation there, so I know very well this re‑ligion and his pre‑cepts… I‑slam is not the only think I had in my ex‑istence, you are trying to limit & re‑ducing my person, ex‑perience, culture & know‑ledge with‑out having any clue of my life and my e‑volution & pro‑gression, I think you should shut up…

I don’t need to be freed be‑cause I never been a (LOW) SGLAWË , I’m a WALGSË / ͶΑΛΓΣΟΣ → ͶΑΛΕΓΣΟΣ ͶΑΛΕΞ‧ΟΣ ©® ΛΕΓ‧Ω (WEALTHY) SHALVAΘED बोधि (bodhi