Michigan QBs in the Pros, 1969-now | mgoblog

Michigan QBs in the Pros, 1969-now

Submitted by PopeLando on May 13th, 2024 at 11:50 AM
Yeah, a lot of this guy

Almost four years ago, I heard a tidbit about Jim Harbaugh – that at the time he was the first Michigan QB in years to throw a TD pass in the NFL…and that this little factoid kept Rick Mirer from committing to Michigan. 

Well, with the Harbaugh Era closed, and with Jim’s last starting QB heading to the NFL, I thought it would be a good opportunity to update that piece. We’ll power through the Bo years, sigh with longing for the Moeller and Carr years, and try to stay calm about the Rodriguez and Hoke years. The Harbaugh years will earn a bit more scrutiny due to recency (and many narrative changes over the past few seasons).

I reserve the right to play fast and loose with the term “’Starting’ QB” – tons of fuzziness there: backups who played due to injury, transfers, and decisions like "let's turn Devin Gardner into a wide receiver then ask him to start at QB again after we forgot to have any other reasonable option" and "let's bench Devin Gardner for ‘motivational reasons’."

Bo. Bo Schembechler arrived at Michigan to take over after Bump Elliot’s 1968 team went 8-2, losing badly to Ohio State (National Champions and one of the most stacked OSU teams in history btw). Elliot’s final QB was Dennis Brown, a 3-year starter who set a lot of Michigan career records, including career TD passes with 20. Wait. 20? I’m checking again…yep, still 20. 20 career TD passes in 3 years as a starter. Brown didn’t sniff the NFL, instead spending 20+ years as an assistant coach, and Bump Elliot had a cup of coffee as the Michigan Asst. AD before spending the next 21 years as AD the for Iowa, where 20 TD passes in a career is still record-setting (sorry, couldn’t resist). RIP Bump (1925-2019). 

So Bo had to start fresh with a new QB.

The Bo Years:

So...yeah, Jim Harbaugh can say that he was the one successful NFL QB that Bo produced. Bo’s early QBs were breaking passing records at Michigan…but when the new record is something like “a 57% career completion rate”, maybe that’s not a good thing for their pro prospects...

Bo’s legacy gets more tarnished the more scrutiny it gets (for, uh, multiple reasons). It’s not like his offenses cared much about the passing game, but even if I was to do the Running Back version of this Diary, there wouldn’t have been many Michigan RBs in the NFL from this era either. His successor as Head Coach was a good one though, someone who clearly cared about offense.

[side note: Do you think that Dave Brandon was deliberately treating the Bo-era players like shit as some sort of “I’ll show them” thing? He was very sensitive about his failures as a football player, he’s clearly a petty, vindictive man, and that would be entirely in character for him…]

Oh, and I got pipped on this fun fact, but one of QB/basketballer/decathlete David Hall’s daughters, Kara (UM tennis captain and Zendaya’s stunt double), ended up marrying John Wangler’s son Jack (UM wide receiver 2013-2017). Besides the certainty that their kids will be phenomenal athletes, I’m pretty sure we could eventually wed one of the Hall-Wangler kids to a Glasgow heir and thereby produce the Kwisatz Haderach.

Next up are the all-too-short Moeller Years:

That's solid success, even if two data points technically doesn’t make for a track record. Both Grbac and Collins had long pro careers, and coupled with Harbaugh, who was still mid-career at the time, you can see why the Michigan QB started to be someone you paid attention to. Moeller had an interesting career path too: how many guys go DC -> OC -> HC? RIP Gary.

Fun fact: the 2000 Kansas City Chiefs’ QB room was Elvis Grbac, Todd Collins, and 44-year-old Warren Moon (who once passed for 500+ yards against the Chiefs).

You can argue that Carr rode Moeller's coattails, but that would be a disservice to the dominant teams that Carr put together in the late 90s. 

The Carr Years: Better Than You Remember

Lloyd Carr’s legacy is 1) 1997, and 2) “the game passed him by”, but dude he could pick ‘em at QB. 

At one point during this era, the Michigan QBs playing (some form of) pro football all at once were: Harbaugh, Grbac, Collins, Dreisbach, Griese, Brady.

Here's a mind-bender: when Chad Henne entered the NFL, Scott Dreisbach was just retiring from the AFL. Carr sent EVERYONE to the NFL, even if all they got was a cup of coffee or a sad dose of reality. I included Matt Gutierrez and Ryan Mallett, because why not - I don't think Michigan 'owns' their NFL success or lack thereof, but they were part of the program...even if I was rooting for Mario Manningham to punch Mallett on the sideline during that Wisconsin game where he kept completing passes to the WRs' feet.

Here’s another fun fact (courtesy of u/Gitback): During the 1999 season every AFC West team had a Michigan QB on the roster, 3 of them starters.

  • Harbaugh (San Diego)
  • Grbac (Kansas City)
  • Griese (Denver)
  • Dreisbach (Oakland) [IR]

Note: you need to conveniently forget that in 1999 the Seahawks (with starting QB Jon Kitna) were still in the AFC West, and in fact won the division that year, but I’ll allow it.

Ok, grab your ice cream and turn on The Notebook, because things are about to get ROUGH. 

RichRod and Hoke Years: 

Here's a sobering thought about Rich Rodriquez: Justin Feagin notwithstanding…we were (presumably) one injury away from having a senior Antonio Bass as RichRod’s first QB at Michigan. How different does 2008 look with Bass at QB? Instead, we got square-peg-round-hole’d with Threet and Sheridan…who each had one moment-of-brilliance game.

My hot take is that Tate Forcier was Johnny Manziel before there was Johnny Manziel. Without the on-field success. But given that he was the only one on the roster who could even vaguely quarterback at the time, he did really well. And don’t forget that he was the QB that RichRod went to whenever a lot of passing was going to be required. Probably was never going to be a pro. Also, he had to deal with the Michigan fanbase going, "wait a second, weren't you named Jason last year?"

I will never forgive Hoke, Borges, and Nussmeier for what they did to Denard Robinson and Devin Gardner. If we're being honest, Denard probably wasn't going to be a pro QB either, but damned if Hoke and Borges didn't snuff that little flame of hope even so. Trying to make Denard an under-center pocket passer was a crime against the Football Gods, and the Football Gods duly punished us for it. Oh yeah, and that tendency Brady Hoke had for refusing to acknowledge injuries? By the end of his career, the most exciting player in football couldn’t throw a pass.

Gardner…man. If there's anyone who fought against a coaching staff determined to break their spirit, it's Devin Gardner. Aside from basically having to coach himself for 3 years, he also had to learn the WR position during that time (remember he was the #1 receiver for a good chunk of 2012). I wish he would have gone to a more patient NFL team: you’re not beating out Tom Brady, and some other team could have used him…after putting all his ribs back into place. 

Shane Morris, as much as Gardner, is an indictment on the Hoke Era, because 1) Hoke staked the team's entire future on the assumption that he'd work out, 2) he got starts over Gardner for non-injury reasons, 3) as far as I can tell nobody bothered to coach him - he threw only a risky fastball when he got here and threw only a risky fastball when he played, and, of course 4) the Shane Morris Fiasco (TM). He spent his year under Harbaugh in a weird/ineffective WR package. 

Anyway, here’s Wonderwall.

The Harbaugh Era

I’d like to start off this section with a user comment made 4 years ago:

Not exactly wrong. Not exactly right.

Took the long route, but shoutout to this dude, who predicted a pro career for Joe Milton after one game in 2020 and will likely be proven right. If Joe applies himself. Which took until his second year at Tennessee – his fifth year of being a college football player – for him to start doing. I’m rooting for Joe, if for no other reason than wanting another “sometimes you gotta unleash the dragon” QB in the pros.

So…this wasn’t like the Carr transition, where Moeller clearly started something special and left the cupboard STOCKED. Harbaugh had to basically start fresh after an abysmal predecessor, and though he gets credit for developing Rudock, he also gets the blame for whatever it was that John O'Korn did while he was here. Speight too was on an upward trajectory before injury, and we also need to remember that Brandon Peters had his head taken off a couple times. QBs can be broken.

Shea Patterson earned himself some ribbing with his commitment to golf and his Infinite Regression in 2019, but I have an alternative theory: Shea Patterson hates golf, he was just hiding out at the golf course so that then-OC Josh Gattis couldn’t find him and ‘coach’ him. I could make an entire post just about Patterson, but I do feel for the guy. He had talent. My memory of him is that he could be an absolute sniper…if he understood what he was looking at and if his pre-snap decisions were correct. Those things happened less and less over his last season, and so my memory of him is also a lot of instances of “bailed out of a clean pocket and ran himself into a sack while DPJ was 10 yards past the nearest defender”…

And I will never understand what happened between 2019 and 2020. Whatever Joe Milton did to ‘earn’ the starting role in 2020 over Dylan McCaffrey, we can only speculate. What we do know is that out of 2 handpicked Harbaugh QBs, we got a grand total of 5 starts, 4 of them disasters, before losing both. Cade ”Moxie” McNamara was pressed into service early, and honestly it all kinda worked out in the end: if Milton had stayed, I would bet anything that he would have started for Michigan in 2021…

My $1 says that Cade “a Chip On Your Shoulder is a Double-Edged Sword” McNamara doesn’t play in the NFL; athletic limitations aside, neither Michigan nor (especially) Iowa are great places to pad one’s stats, and he’s had a few rough injuries over the past couple of years. Next season he returns to Iowa, where, for the 3rd season in a row, he will try to prove himself worthy of the starting job at Michigan. 

Conclusion

Interesting that a coaching change and a QB change coincided with each other so much over the past 55+ years. Bo, Moeller, Carr, RichRod, Harbaugh, and now Sherrone Moore all started their Michigan head coaching careers needing to choose a new starting QB – none of them even had the option to retain the prior starting QB. Hoke, of course, was gifted Denard Robinson and though he did his level best to fumble that gift, 2011 was the best offense Hoke ever fielded. That’s not a coincidence. Experienced quarterbacks matter.

Michigan’s run of pro QBs came to a grinding halt after Henne, and the offense struggled for a good long while. That’s not a coincidence either. I’m hopeful that Sherrone Moore can restart the QB success story again…because we’re not always going to have a generationally good running game courtesy of Blake Corum. QB is still the most important position on the field.

At this point, I don’t know if Harbaugh’s former reputation as an offense-first coach holds up under scrutiny, and, looking at this list, I don’t know about his former reputation as a ‘QB whisperer’ either. “Josh Johnson, Andrew Luck, and probably JJ McCarthy” does not a guru make.

We're also in an era of unprecedented mobility in college football: top QBs who lose playing time competitions are almost sure to transfer. The pressure is there for QBs to shine on Day 1 or not at all, meaning development time is compressed and the question of which school "owns" a QB's NFL success, or lack thereof, will become even more murky than it already is.

And now it's been a couple years since a Michigan QB has thrown an NFL touchdown pass. Brady carried a LOT of water for us in the League, but his career is over, and JJ’s is just starting. 

Go Blue

Comments

PopeLando

May 13th, 2024 at 11:50 AM ^

Ugh that text is really small on mobile. Sorry

I’m tempted to do a similar history for Ohio State and MSU. Ohio State has that “great college QBs, terrible pro QBs” reputation, but my memory says that a lot of their QBs made it to the NFL and stayed for a bit, and of course Stroud looks poised for one heck of a career. Sparty has had a few really successful pro QBs as well, starting with…Earl Morrall in the 1950s? Cousins and Hoyer have/had long pro careers, and Smoker also journeyman’d it for a good while. 

Even Connor “Such a Notorious Asshole That ’Career 57% Passer in College’ Was the LEAST of His Draft Concerns” Cook, who was such a notorious asshole that “career 57% passer in college” was the LEAST of his draft concerns, made a couple starts in the pros. Idk. Might be interesting.

[sorry to Not Another Teen Movie that, but this cannot be repeated enough: Cook peaked at a 58% completion rate in college and all the pro scouts instead focused on how much of a jackass he was] 

Ali G Bomaye

May 20th, 2024 at 11:27 AM ^

Ohio State deserves that "terrible pro QBs" reputation, at least before C.J. Stroud, who looks like the real deal.

  • Justin Fields (2021) - drafted 11th overall, lasted three years on the Bears before being traded to the Steelers for a bag of expired peanuts.
  • Dwayne Haskins (2019) - drafted 15th overall, had big performance and attitude issues before being cut and signing with the Steelers (who love Ohio State bust QBs, evidently).
  • JT Barrett (2018) - undrafted, bounced around a couple practice squads but never played in the NFL.
  • Cardale Jones (2016) - drafted 4th round, threw a total of 11 passes in the NFL.
  • Braxton Miller (2016) - never played QB in the NFL, spent a couple years as a WR.
  • Terrelle Pryor (2011) - drafted in the 3rd round of the supplemental draft after leaving OSU in the wake of tattoogate, never played QB well in the NFL, spent a few years as a WR, where he had one good season.
  • Todd Boeckman, Joe Baueserman, Justin Zwick - lol no
  • Troy Smith (2007) - drafted 5th round, started 8 games over four years.
  • Craig Krenzel (2004) - drafted 5th round, started five games his rookie year for a Bears team with an absolutely abysmal offense, never played again.
  • Steve Bellisari (2002) - drafted 6th round but never played in the NFL.
  • Joe Germaine (1999) - drafted 4th round, threw 16 career passes.
  • Bobby Hoying (1996) - drafted 3rd round, started 14 games, had one of the worst statistical passing seasons in modern history for the 1998 Eagles (3.0 net yards per attempt, 51% completions, 0 TDs, 9 interceptions, sacked on 13.5% of his dropbacks).

I don't want to keep going back in detail, but literally the only OSU QBs prior to that who earned any NFL playing time whatsoever are Kent Graham (who started 38 games over 9 years and literally never had a season with decent stats), Tom Tupa (threw 504 career NFL passes but stuck around as a punter for 13 years) and Art Schlichter (who was drafted 4th overall in 1982, played horribly over three seasons, and was permabanned from the league for repeated gambling issues). 

You could absolutely argue that even now, in 2024, Tom Tupa is the 2nd best OSU QB alum in terms of NFL success due to his punting. It's almost certainly either him or Justin Fields, despite a decent number of draft picks.

blueheron

May 13th, 2024 at 12:08 PM ^

Michael Taylor, referring to Les Miles and Jim Harbaugh:

"... because of too many other guys who had direct links to making sure they didn't get an offer ..."

And who might those guys be? Let the speculation begin. Brandon? Anyone else?

Tex_Ind_Blue

May 13th, 2024 at 12:22 PM ^

Clayton Richard never "played" for Michigan, did he? I mean no one was clamoring for him to start over Henne. I forgot everything about that time besides the starters. 

Tex_Ind_Blue

May 13th, 2024 at 1:21 PM ^

Thank you for taking the time and putting this together. Very informative and puts everything in one place. Much handy to fight with the fans of other schools :D

In week 13 of the 2004 season, three Michigan QBs started and they went 2-1 with Brady/Griese winning and Navarre losing. 

I do not recall any other school having that (it's possible that I didn't pay much attention to other schools). 

Amazinblu

May 13th, 2024 at 12:29 PM ^

Tom Brady - 35 Rushing TD's - Are you sure?   It looks like 28 rushing TDs to me - still that figure suprised me.

Some other TB12 stats - two punts - for an average of 34 yards / punt.

Grossly under-rated as a receiver.   Yes - he's average "Yards per catch" - as a RECEIVER - is 21.7 yards.   Of course, the number of receptions is "low" - with a total of three (3) receptions over his career.

And - there's another often overlooked aspect of his performance - defense.  Yes - Tom has 14 TACKLES over his career - all solo tackles - no assists.

AWAS

May 13th, 2024 at 12:37 PM ^

I have a dream that Joe Milton makes his way to the Raiders and channels his inner Kenny Stabler in running the scariest vertical offense the game has seen in decades.  And puts and end to the Mahomes as GOAT chatter permanently.

PopeLando

May 13th, 2024 at 3:19 PM ^

Well, with a career 59% completion rate, more INTs than TDs, and a career passer rating of 75, Ken Stabler might be a decent comp to Milton.

Mahomes is a LONG way away from GOAT. HoF-worthy, no doubt, but he's 28 and Time remains undefeated. I'll put my stake in the ground here: Mahomes is a younger, better, version of Russell Wilson...whose abilities aren't surviving his mid-30s.

Tom Brady and Peyton Manning are who they are because they took their games UP a notch in their 30s AND 40s before He Who Walks Behind The Rows took them. Manning was held together by bubble gum and PEDs, but he was still elevating the team around him. Brady was still setting passing records.

Wolverine 73

May 13th, 2024 at 12:43 PM ^

Very interesting work, although the cheap shot at Bo’s QB’s was undeserved.  For at least the first half of his tenure, his QBs were more runners  than passers.  Slade.   Leach.  Franklin.  Smith.  That was the focus of the Michigan offense, as it was the focus for many other teams.  (There were exceptions, of course, including the PAC 10 for the most part.). Those guys were likely not playing QB in the NFL because the pro game was different from the college game.  Same with OSU and Kern, Cornelius Green and Rod Gerald. 

PopeLando

May 13th, 2024 at 1:16 PM ^

I didn't intend it as a cheap shot, but I can see how it comes off like it. Wasn't trying to ding them. The same way that I don't ding JJ McCarthy for a (relative) lack of passing TDs: it's all about the offense you play in.

In the mid 60's, Bump had a couple QBs throw for 1500-1600 yards per season. Bo wouldn't reach that kind of passing total until 1980. 

If you graduated in 1973, you were witness to some of the best scoring defenses Michigan has ever rolled out. Great defenses can paper over a lot of the sins of mediocre offenses, and they did. Our QB rushing offenses weren't great either in that era.

PopeLando

May 13th, 2024 at 5:29 PM ^

Went into medicine:

lol

I forgot to include Casey. He DID make 4 starts at QB in 1971...and then no more stats. Apparently he had a tryout with the Cowboys, and that's the last the internet tells me. It looks like he worked at Catholic Central High School (his HS) at some point maybe?

Grampy

May 13th, 2024 at 7:11 PM ^

No discussion of Michigan QBs in the NFL can ignore what Benny Friedman did.  George Halas certaiinly didn't:

"Benny revolutionized football. He forced the defenses out of the dark ages." George Halas

I know that the OP was only looking at 1969-onward, but when I read the sentence "Jim Harbaugh threw the first TD in the NFL by a Michigan Quarterback", I got lit up.

Blue@LSU

May 13th, 2024 at 7:52 PM ^

This is excellent work!

I've always been confused about the contrast between Harbaugh as a player and a coach. I'm too young to have any memory of his playing days, but from what I can gather (watching old clips, talking to people that remember him, etc.) he was pure confidence as a runner and passer. Yet as a coach, he's very conservative with his QBs (running and throwing). Am I off base here? If not, how do we reconcile Harbaugh the QB vs. Harbaugh the QB coach? Is it just another feature (not glitch) of the Harbaugh operating system?

Also, how long have you been waiting to use that screenshot of Montana41GoBlue's comment? I'm impressed, but also a bit worried about what other comments you might be saving for the future. 😊

PopeLando

May 13th, 2024 at 9:12 PM ^

I don't know how to reconcile QB Harbaugh vs. Coach Harbaugh. He won a lot of games with great defenses and offenses which weren't exactly prolific...and that might be in his mind as The Right Way to win games. My previous line of "Harbaugh will find a way to turn everything into Harbaugh" is how I cope.

Lol I went back to my previous version of this Diary from 4 years ago and read through it. I don't have some folder of archived comments. Nope. Not at all. That would be weird...right? I mean...who does that...

ShadowStorm33

May 14th, 2024 at 2:57 PM ^

Yeah, I've never been able to reconcile it. Harbaugh was the most successful M QB in the NFL until Brady, and is still the second most successful by a mile. Yet he'd seemingly much rather run a FB dive than let his QBs (even 1st round NFL QBs) throw. 

It will be very interesting to see how his time in LA plays out, since he has a very expensive gunslinger at QB. It's one thing to do that in college where there's no salary cap, but it's another thing to have the (now, after Goff's extension) third most expensive player in NFL history taking up cap space if you're reluctant to use him...

dickdastardly

May 14th, 2024 at 2:32 AM ^

Uh, Devin Gardner might have a bone to pick with you describing him as a Michigan podcaster/youtuber. 

He was doing color commentary for Fox for college games (and I believe still will be doing so) and now:

 

Former University of Michigan quarterback Devin Gardner adds to his role as a FOX Sports college football reporter by working as an analyst and sideline reporter for the newly created United Football League (UFL) in 2024.

PopeLando

May 14th, 2024 at 8:34 AM ^

Thank you! I had no idea. He’s definitely got the voice and the knowledge for it.

I’m hoping he gets added to the Michigan AD or media at some point. If there’s ever a “your sacrifices have earned you our everlasting gratitude” situation, it’s Michigan-Gardner. Probably right up there with Penn State- Sean Clifford

805wolverine

May 14th, 2024 at 1:25 PM ^

Thanks for doing this, I enjoyed it.  I think you have to give Bo at least some credit for Elvis, seeing as how he recruited him and Elvis ended up playing quite a bit during Bo's last season due to injuries.

PopeLando

May 16th, 2024 at 12:36 PM ^

You know what, that’s a good point. And it’s not just about Grbac. Bo was upping the passing game a bit even before that: Michael Taylor and Demetrius Brown both were allowed to sling it a bit. A BIT. Elvis was a pocket passer.

But I don’t believe that Elvis Grbac becomes ELVIS GRBAC without Moeller at the helm. The Bo offense was just too regressive, too much an afterthought. 

I don’t think that it’s a strike against those QBs’ abilities. Just the offense that they played in. Kind of like how Jim Harbaugh has never produced a 1,000 yard receiver in his college coaching career. Not one. 

Seth

May 16th, 2024 at 10:56 AM ^

A few guys you missed:

MOELLER

  • 1990: Nate Holdren. 4-star QB who came in with Todd Collins, chose MLB, never made it out of the minors.
  • 1991: Craig Randall: 3-star, transferred to Tulane in '92.
  • 1992: Eric Boykin: 4-star out of Ohio. Transferred to West Virginia when Moeller was fired.
  • 1993: Scot Loeffler: Top-100 guy, got injured, now HC of Bowling Green and buddies with Craig Ross

CARR

  • 1996: Jason Kapsner: 5-star out of Minnesota, injured and fell behind on depth chart.
  • 2001 (as jr): Spencer Brinton: Transfer from SDSU after a 2-year Mormon mission. Played some backup snaps.
  • 2006: David Cone: 3-star career backup, gave up promising rap career to become a far-right demagogue.

RODRIGUEZ

  • 2008: Justin Feagin. Had some snaps in an Orji role, got kicked off the team for selling drugs.
  • 2010: Conelius Jones. Unable to enroll, ended up at Marshall.

HARBAUGH

  • 2015: Alex Malzone. Technically belongs to Harbaugh but was recruited by Hoke. Never climbed the depth chart, transferred to Miami (NNTM) after he got his degree.

    -----------------STILL PLAYING ELSEWHERE-----------------

  • 2020: Dan Villari. Last-minute addition to the class when their commit had to retire from football and CJ Stroud chose OSU. Now a very good tight end for Syracuse.
  • 2021: Alan Bowman. Transfer from Texas Tech, now the starter for Oklahoma State.

PopeLando

May 16th, 2024 at 11:59 AM ^

Great context for recruits of those eras! I don’t have any memory of the Moeller and Carr era guys you listed - did Scott Loeffler ever take a snap at Michigan? 

When Tim Biakabutuka attempts more passes than you…even by my low standards, I’d have a hard time including them in this list…

PopeLando

May 16th, 2024 at 12:05 PM ^

Pretty sure there’s a sci fi/fantasy reference in everything I’ve written on this site. One episode of Iowatch had DEEP cuts into 1990s era Star Wars books and comics.

I’ve loved Dune since I read it for the first time in…2011 maybe. Yeah, I got started late, but I think I’ve been through it 3 or 4 times since. Great book. 

mickblue

May 18th, 2024 at 11:22 PM ^

Pope, I really appreciate the work you must have put in on this. I started reading it at 10pm Saturday night. I was curious and also planning to stay with it until my eyes got tired, to help me sleep, However, I couldn’t stop reading it and it cracked me up at numerous spots. I ended up reading the entire piece. I have had tickets for 40 years, which represents half my years on earth. 1984 was JH’s sophomore season and Sparty took him out mid-season, with a cheap shot. I think he was going for payback in East Landfill last year with the 49-0 ass kicking he administered. Anyway, thanks and good night, It is 11:23 and I’m really tired.