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"the 11th hour" with stephanie ruhle starts now. tonight, michael cohen back on the stand. the former president's defense team grows him on a 2016 phone call and paints him as a liar. how today's heated testimony could impact the jury. plus, a new trump entourage outside the courtroom. how republican antics in new york are risking gop control in washington. then, new reporting on why some wall street donors may be warming. as "the 11th hour" gets underway on this thursday night. good evening once again, i am stephanie ruhle . we are now 173 days away from the election and today outside of manhattan courthouse people were lined up in the rain, hoping to witness the latest developments in donald trump's criminal trial.

inside the courtroom was another day of tough cross- examination. defense attorney todd blanche leaned hard into the former fixers credibility issues, pressing for his history of lying and criminal record while accusing him of being out for revenge. blanche challenged cohen's claim about a crucial phone call. laura jarrett was there and takes us inside the courtroom. >> reporter: tonight, star witness michael cohen facing a scathing day of cross- examination as former president trump's defense team tries to paint him as a spurned former employee desperate for payback. >> i hope this man ends up in prison. >> reporter: the jury hearing cohen on his podcast. >> revenge is a dish best served cold and you better believe i want this man to go down and rot inside for what he did to me and my family. >> reporter: tension in the room building to a dramatic

moment. todd blanche accusing cohen of lying about a key part of his testimony. two days ago telling the jury that mister trump's bodyguard, keith schiller, passed the phone to mr. trump on october 24, 2016. cohen says he informed mr. trump at the time the deal to pay off stormy daniels would be done. blanche today raising his voice, saying, that was a lie. showing the jury never before seen text messages suggesting the call was for another purpose entirely. cohen had reached out for help dealing with a 14-year-old prank caller and schiller texted back telling cohen to call him. the call lasted just 97 seconds. the clear implication, the phone was never passed to mr. trump. cohen appearing blindsided . blanche grilling him. that was a lie. you did not talk to president trump. you talked to keith schiller. you can admit it.

cohen responding i don't know that it is accurate and adding, i believe i also spoke to mr. trump about the stormy daniels matter. blanche shooting back, we are not asking what you believe. cohen's credibility is key to the states case as he is the only one who testified the former president had advanced knowledge of the plan to pay off daniels to protect his campaign and signed off on a scheme to pay cohen back, falsifying business records to disguise reimbursements. mr. trump has pleaded not guilty as his defense attorneys argued nothing was falsified and once again challenging the prosecutor's theory today that the former president only cared about shielding his campaign from the damaging story. blanche pushing cohen about mister trump's reaction the first time the former president learned of the story. asking, the first thing president trump said to you was that his family would not like that very much.

cohen saying, that's true. the self-described former fixer turned foe, maintaining his composure on the stand when pressed at length about his criminal history. cohen has been convicted and disbarred. the defense arguing he has a motivation to lie now and a history of doing it. you lied under oath, correct? yes sir, cohen says. the defense saying that he is also not telling the full story about his desire for a white house job, which mr. trump never offered. you were disappointed after all the work you have done for 9 1/2 years, nobody, including president trump, offered you a position in the white house, blanche asked. that's not accurate, cohen said . >> i think it was a very interesting day. it was a fascinating day and it shows what a scam this all is. >> cohen is expected to resume

on the stand when the trial resumes on monday. with that let's get smarter with our panel tonight. john allen joins us. tim o'brien is here, bloomberg opinion senior executive editor and from biographer and legal analyst kristy greenberg, a former deputy chief. you are both in court today and based on what it appears you are wearing, i believe you are a rangers super fan. >> yes, go rangers. >> okay, you are our legal counsel, so you get to go first. what stood out to you about the face-off between todd blanche and michael cohen? >> as laura said in the lead up, michael cohen is a necessary witness. the only witness so far who is able to tell us about direct conversations with donald trump where donald trump was not only aware of the hush money payment is stormy daniels, but he approved it and reimbursed michael cohen and knew what he

was reimbursing him for. those conversations are really important and one of the things todd blanche did successfully today was cast doubt on one of those conversations. it wasn't clear to me that this was a miss up from cohen or that he is even lying about this. it was a misstep from the prosecution may be to not show him these messages to orient him to a specific date and time that happened in 2016. how many people could go through their call logs and know the precise date and time when a call happened? that is hard to do. i was surprised he did not testify more broadly. generally it was the sock over timeframe. -- was this october timeframe. you would expect them to have looked at that and made sure if they were going to pin it down, that they knew exactly what they were talking about and had the full context. so it was a misstep, but i will

say this was not a hat trick. he did not clinch the game, the game is still very much in play. i expect the prosecutors will come back on monday and and redirect they will clean some of this up. >> even if the context of the conversation is off, they have the documentation. they have the checks. >> and they have ample corroboration. hope hicks, david pecker, et cetera. i preface this by saying no one can predict what the jury is going to do and we can't get inside the jurors minds, but sitting there today i think todd blanche is not a great defense attorney. he came into the trump world through boris epshteyn who came in through eric trump and you had this series i think of players who get donald trump sears and he gives them a lot of responsibility that maybe

they would not otherwise earn and i think there were other people sitting at the defense table who were much more capable than todd blanche. i think he had a horrible first day of cross. i think he recovered today, but what he went through today is an assault on michael cohen's credibility and i think he established that michael cohen is a serial liar, like donald trump's. >> okay, that's the thing. michael cohen, yes, was a liar for 10 years, at the direction, at the behest of donald trump. if they wrote a job description, be my hush money, my liar, my fixer. >> write the media for me. please lie to them and put the story on a different track. if i have business people or competitors, help me undermine them. women are coming out and saying that i slept with them. please put that story in a

different place. so that was his job and i think he is an important witness. i think the prosecution has done a very good job of establishing a fact pattern that transcends michael cohen and i don't think the jury has to rely entirely on michael cohen any longer to believe that a crime has committed here. you had allen weisselberg signing invoices with all of the information in his own handwriting, outlining the fraud that took place and allen weisselberg is not somebody who is ever going to turn on donald trump. he was doing what he was told every day of his life by donald trump. i think that todd blanche did not tell a narrative to the jurors. in a way that a good, i think, defense attorney or prosecutor is capable of doing. standing up in front and thematically walking them

through a story that makes sense to them and undermines, in this instance, the prosecution's case. >> michael cohen's credibility issues are well-established, as are donald trump's. you have covered trump world for years. how did you view what we saw in court? >> that is a great question. this is the pitfall of resting a lot of your case or having her star witness be michael cohen, perhaps best known for the lies he told and many of them on behalf of donald trump. the problem for the jury, of course we don't know what they will do and how they will assess this information and there is a lot of other information that the jury has been given, corroborating material and evidence for david pecker and others as well as the documentation, but this is the pitfall. this was a good day for the defense and a bad day for the prosecution and i think it is

the first time you could say that in 18 days of this trial. the jury will have a lot to assess. the prosecutor will have a chance to redirect. todd blanche slipped one back past the goalie if we continue with the hockey metaphor and the question is will the prosecutor be able to score more? >> i want to go back to the last point you are making, kristy. monday, redirect time. is this where the prosecution cleans up that sloppiness? what do you expect from them? >> i do, i think they need to go back through that day in particular, the october 25 day where the phone call happens. look at the messages that day and see if there was greater context that they can put forth to really put other evidence before michael cohen and see if he can explain it. what he said on the record was,

this was my belief about what happened and i think todd blanche said the jury doesn't want to know what you think happened, they want to hear what you know happened. that is where you get into danger trying to pinpoint things from a decade ago with call logs. it is a dangerous thing to do, but i think they need to go back to the evidence and see what they have. the other thing that i thought was really damaging and i'm not sure how you recover from this on redirect. sitting here today in testimony that he still believes there was a corrupt prosecution brought against him federally. not having anything to do with the finance violation, but conduct separate from donald trump. mainly the tax fraud. he said look, the prosecutor should not have come for me. he said he pled guilty in 2018 and then in the civil fraud trial he said he did not do it. then he said he lied during the

guilty plea. now it is i never disputed the facts, which he did under oath and it is, they should not have come after me. it was $4 million tax fraud over five years. why shouldn't they prosecute that case? i was in that office and supervised cases with that duration and that kind of money. those were serious criminal cases. calling the judge corrupt, which he did on the stand. not that i shouldn't have said that. it was that the federal judge is in on it and he also said that he was confronted with statements about the prosecutors and the judge being animals. there was no contrition for that. there was no i should not have blamed them. it was blame the bank, the accountant, the prosecutor, and blame donald trump. when you set it up that way as the defense did today, it makes it seem like he has a problem with everybody and will never take the blame himself and i'm

actually not sure how you recover from that on redirect. this is a man who seems unable to accept responsibility for his own criminal conduct that does not involve donald trump. that is a problematic thing to ask a jury to believe somebody who, again, can't really seem to get his story straight. >> we heard another new name or new to me today, robert costello. a former advisor to michael cohen. his name came up in court and then he showed up on fox news tonight. watch this. >> doing this payment and taking care of this was his way of getting himself back into the good graces of donald trump because he could then go afterwards and say boss, that is what he called him, you could have had a big and embarrassing problem, but i, michael cohen, took care of it. >> tim, remind us why this guy is important. >> because costello was an

ambassador for rudy giuliani when they were worried about michael cohen going rogue. >> an ambassador for rudy giuliani. wow. >> and they introduce a letter or an email to michael cohen saying, we love you. you have to understand, we love you, so do the right thing. cohen in his testimony when they said what do you think his motive was, they said they wanted to make sure i didn't flip. at that point, michael cohen desperately did want to be loved. he said he really thought they considered him a member of the family. i guarantee they never thought he was a member of the family and he had this longing to belong. >> trump's told him that fantasy. >> he sells a lot of people that fantasy. they did not do the smart work of keeping michael cohen in the

tent before it came to this and never letting him slip out into the wild. once they did and there was panic about it, costello is the guy saying come back. so to appear on fox saying he cannot be trusted, he is garbage, you know, carrying water for trump. >> my gosh, with everything going inside the courtroom trump is still running for president. going outside the courtroom and talking to cameras. he is even reading the polls. do you think anyone outside the maga world, who is already all in for trump, are there americans going i heard what trump said today outside the courtroom. he made a good case. i think i will vote for that guy. are there independents and swing voters that he is talking to when he is out there that he is winning over? >> i'm not sure he is winning people over with the commentary outside the courtroom and i would like to point out that if

michael cohen had been a member of the trump family he would've had a job in the trump white house. he should've known that since he cannot get a job he was not a member of the family. as far as reaching the swing voters, i don't think that is what he is doing. however, i do believe that if he is found not guilty or if there is a hung jury, that that will weigh on the swing voters in terms of his argument that he has been gone after unfairly. >> i don't know about him getting a job. eric and junior didn't get a job in the white house. they were babysitting the trump business, but trump was really running it. maybe if you are the favorite child or the smart son-in-law, but junior did not get a job and eric either. congratulations to your rangers tonight. when we returned, a new day and another parade of republicans skipped their day jobs. jobs that are paid for.

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judge merchan is doing his best to keep the trump criminal trial on track, but outside the courtroom the circus continues. trump's political entourage has been lining up outside the courthouse to trash the trial and today they are not just donald trump's friends, they are members of congress not in washington doing their jobs. they are at the courthouse. lauren boebert and matt gaetz were outside the courthouse cheering him on. watch this. >> this is a made-up crime. no other american in the country would be charged with this type of crime. it is like the mister potato head doll of crimes. >> we have corrupted judges who he is not even allowed to speak of because of their corrupt miss. it is a sham, it is a show and we are here to expose every bit of it.

>> what in the world is the mister potato head of crimes? i don't know. educate me, lauren boebert. for more, maybe these men can help. senior advisor to president barack obama. cofounder of the lincoln project and has worked on a number of campaigns including john mccain, arnold schwarzenegger and george w. bush. what you make of these republicans rolling up to support trump and i know i sound like a nerd, this is a work day today for them. i assume none of them took vacation. they didn't show up to work in washington. they came to new york. are their constituents aware? >> they should be and it should be interesting to see if we get visibility into the expenses. how was this paid for? the train tickets to new york. this has become a parade now. i think there must be a sense that donald trump is keeping a list of who shows up and who

doesn't, so i am sure we will see more early next week. if, in fact, let's hope this isn't the case, but if the jury decides he is not guilty i'm sure there will be a rally with the gop contenders. it is a pathetic display, but this is kind of what happens. he expects people on his behalf and it has been quite a procession over the last seven days to see really serious people, governors, members of congress, senators, who have really good day jobs, make a spectacle of themselves. >> it doesn't sound like serious people. as on-site people with very serious jobs they are not showing up to. today the gop actually risked their majority because so many of them -- the control on the house floor -- because so many of them were in new york. >> i think we always have to remember that they don't actually care about governing

and they don't care about what speaker mike johnson wants anymore, either, because they are mad at him, too. these are the people, matt gaetz, lauren boebert, these are the people you have come to the microphone to defend you? these are not paragons of good personal behavior. they are exactly the type of people that donald trump would want around because they are clones of him. speaking of constituents, lauren boebert doesn't even live in her district anymore. she is not worried about her constituents. these are bad people doing bad things and they don't care about their jobs in the first place and they live in districts or states where they will not lose and they want the beautiful, perfect phone call that says they will be the next person who might be threatened with hanging. >> oh my god. okay, here's another thing. before his arrival at the courthouse matt gaetz also

tweeted that he was standing back and standing by. did he write this to wink at extremist groups or did he write it so we would set our hair on fire? or was it a 2-for-1 and both? >> i think it was a wink, a nod, a bullhorn, all of it. we see this like we saw in texas today with governor greg abbott pardoning a man who shot someone during a black lives matter protest. this is not an accident. matt gaetz trying to be too cute by half and also saying people can take extrajudicial actions into their own hands and we will think it is fun and funny and encourage it between now and november. >> a new topic. let's talk about the presidential debates. president and biden are saying they are up for not one, but two debates. you believe trump is actually going to show up or was agreeing to these debates a way for him to create a narrative

so we are talking about something else when it comes to him rather than being a criminal defendant? >> it's a great question. i don't know if there is a human being in the history of our country -- >> he did not show up to the primary debates. >> i think for once maybe he listened to his team. it is so counter to everything we know about donald trump. joe biden issues a debate challenge and donald trump says sure. maybe we should take him at his word, but certainly if i was the biden campaign i would certainly, and i am sure they do understand that trump may try to weasel out. it is so against type that this went down easily. that said we have a history of presidential debates in this country. enormously important. i think it is great that one of them is going to happen early, before the conventions. i think it is also great that the second one happens before people start voting.

the problem with the schedule is that a lot of america already voted, so they were stuck in the past in terms of the way people vote. you are asking if we will have any, let's assume we do. i love to see the aggressiveness from joe biden and i think at the end of the day if donald trump still tries to weasel out of this, i think the biden campaign and president can make him pay full price. the thing that sticks out to me as it was so counter to everything we know about this man. maybe he was so hungry to change the channel from the trial. let's remember that first debate was ugly on style points across the board, but joe biden got the better of donald trump. he stood up to him and handled him quite well and i think joe biden has a lot to gain, more than donald trump i think from having a strong first debate. >> i want you to weigh in, but i only have time for one more question and i need to ask.

david, before you go i've got to ask about your new project. you will be cohosting a podcast with kellyanne conway, who is trump's accomplice number one. the creator, the woman who coined the term alternative facts, who made this idea of blatantly lying okay. i would not think she is the other side of your coin. why are you doing this? >> listen, i had a podcast during the last two cycles. i talked to a lot of democratic operatives and republicans. i love coming on this network. a lot of my former colleagues have great podcasts. for me i want to talk about this election with someone who has led a presidential campaign successfully, who understands trump world. the entire party is supporting an insurrection. she was not an election denier and maybe that is all you can say. listen, we will go at it. we will also find a way

hopefully to get your opinion on early votes. i think it is important to understand this election is so important and someone like me who has led a successful democratic campaign and knows that coalition and how to put it together. we are quite passionate and i think we will be quite heated during a lot of it, but i hope we can also talk about the mechanics of the presidential campaign. that, for me, has been missing. when i have had discussions over the past two or three cycles it is generally people in my party or people who think like me. as painful as i think it will be, there is also value. >> it is also important because we talk about people on other networks lying every day and they don't get fact checked and real-time every podcast you will be doing just that. thank you for joining. when we come back, food prices are down and the markets could not be hotter. we will be talking big business

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inflation is on the mind for all sorts of voters and it has been a vulnerability for the president, but today the white house is celebrating and they should be. markets have been hitting record highs and food prices are finally starting to cool, so you would think wall street

would be all in for biden. some are, but the new york times is reporting that some big donors are warming to trump again. saying that in many instances it is less that they are enthusiastic about mr. trump. i still hate the man, one hedge fund manager said. more that they are exasperated with the policies of president biden. here to discuss, host of the on the tape podcast. and correspondent for bloomberg and host of the big take podcast. these wall street donors suddenly think a trump presidency could be good for the economy. think about the unrest. think about trump aligning with putin. think about pulling out of nato, what that would do to markets. >> not only that, the paris accords. that is the first time they really got into what could happen under this

administration. when it comes back to all these years later it is about taxes, about regulation and now it is about israel, support of israel or lack thereof by the biden administration. i get it, where they are coming from. i don't agree with it because at the end of the day if we want people to come here and do business with us, we don't want them to think that democracy is really unhinged. at the moment i think the ability for these folks to align or forget about january 6 i think is a real problem. >> i get it. they hate regulation. they fear that joe biden is going to raise their taxes. that is enough for them to say fine, i will take trump again. >> it is remarkable to look back at the response after january 6 because there was a unified response from executives on wall street and other sectors to what had happened there and using the term, sedition. a riot on capitol hill.

strong statements from companies, executives and trade groups. it has only been a few years and that has dissipated. jamie dimon was nodding to the fact that maybe trump was not that bad after all. a stunning reversal of what he said after january 6. i was at the conference in new york and they told the story about post- charlottesville he was on a board that trump convened. one of his daughters wrote a letter saying we need to cut ties with this guy. his family was on that and another daughter said, ditto. i don't dispute that the head of the world's biggest bank has to acknowledge that you will be head of that bank regardless who is president, but i think it is remarkable how there was this lack of equivocating that happened that has dissipated. i don't expect the biden administration to come out and embrace wall street wholeheartedly. as you pointed out, the market has all but done that.

you have the dow hitting 40,000 today. you have inflation going down. all of this is going quite right for those in business, so there is a cynicism about the economy and the state of markets that i think is ignored. looking for if not to contrast, an alternative. >> how about the false narrative of this we don't like biden's immigration policies. okay, because you want to go back to trump, what did donald trump do? say we are going to build a wall that mexico will pay for. the wall was not built. mexico did not pay for it. steve bannon goes out and raises money from donors for this wall that he ended up stealing and getting charged with a crime for. we don't like biden's immigration policies. maybe he was slow. we saw on a bipartisan basis they put together an immigration package which we have not seen in years and by the way no president, no congress, nobody has done anything on comprehensive

immigration reform since ronald reagan and donald trump locked it. wall street, supposedly the smartest guys out there are going we don't like biden and the open borders. they are not open and he is trying to do something. >> it is interesting to go back to after the inauguration. really were okay with being vocal about it. i think you have to separate and you know this well. you have the investor class and a set of constituencies and responsibilities. then you have ceos. jamie dimon is speaking to cnbc and offering a structure for other ceos of much smaller companies -- >> because he is the man. >> he has employees around the world, has all of the stakeholders and is doing business around the world. that is the bigger issue to me and i think we all know where his heart lies in this sort of thing.

at the end of the day there are a lot of other folks who will take their cues off of a guy like him. that is one of the reasons i was disappointed with that. >> let's talk about the new report from the congressional budget office showing people have more purchasing power. they have more ability to buy stuff than they did in 2019, yet people don't feel that way. is it because they've got more money in their wallet, but in order to buy something that stuff costs more? is it just emotional? >> it is emotional. prices have gone up and are higher than they were. there is still an adjustment being made to the fact that prices are higher, so i think that sentiment issue is one that is continuing to dog this president, this administration, and it is going to take time. something you were saying a moment ago. i was struck by something said at a bloomberg conference this week, that he is now considering supporting trump. >> okay, really? he was always considering

supporting donald trump, are you kidding me? >> what i would bring up is he is waiting to hear who his running mate will be and that is fascinating to me. we are long past this moment of 2016, which is who will be the neutralizing force? >> he is saying that because he would like to have some control over it, because he would like it to be someone he has in his pocket. if you think you will not vote for donald trump, give me a break. >> we talked about the signaling jamie dimon is doing. why does he need to weigh in at all? >> here's why, because he wants trump to give him a call. he wants to floated out there and make sure he has some power. give me a break. i'm leaving it there. i didn't even have time to get to the tracker and i really wanted to tonight. when we come back, white nationalism is invading the right wing of politics. we will talk to two people with very different backgrounds about how they are fighting racism in america from the inside out when "the 11th hour" continues.

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that everyone can truly get behind. look at our little st. jude pin there on the fridge! we're just regular people donating. yeah. and i think it's cool to be able to make a difference in someone's lives in a way that is meaningful. it is time now for our keynote conversation. and tonight, it is a heavy one. white nationalism in america. the southern poverty law center warns that members of the movement are placing much of their energy into harnessing the anger and resentment of trump supporters into a broad authoritarian movement potentially creating division and violence as the 2024

campaign is heating up. but our next guests both have experience in helping white supremacists renounce their ideology. his effort to fight racism are by engaging members of the actual ku klux klan. and derrick black joins us. his father was a grand wizard of the ku klux klan and he wrote a book about the experience. it is out now. how did you start doing this? you are a musician. >> that is true. well you know, i grew up as a child of parents in the service. traveling the world at the age of three and my first experience in school was 1961. you go to a country two years and you are back home.

two years again, another country. my classmates and my schools overseas were from all over the world. anybody that was at an embassy we were assigned, we were all at the same school. but at home i would be in all black schools or black and white schools. and there was not the amount of diversity. so one time i came back at the age of 10, 1968. i was in the fourth grade. one of two black kid ins the entire school. i joined the cub scouts. i was the only black scout in the area and we had a parade. and, nothing but white people on either side marching down the street. people waving, cheering, smiling. until we got to a certain point when i began getting hit by bottles and rocks and i didn't understand it. i didn't understand racism. i had never experienced it before. so that is what prompted me to investigate it at that age. >> tell me about the work that you do now. >> well i spent a lot of time meeting people like derrick.

and others you know who were involved in white supremacy. and trying to find out what makes them tick and help them come out and lead productive lives. as a result, many of them have come out and are also trying to deradicallize people in the movement and prevent young people going down that rabbit hole. >> extraordinary. and derrick, for you, what was your journey? >> i grew up in one of the leading families of white nationalism. my parents had worked on building it for decades by the time i was born and gave my first interview advocating it when i was ten years old. and it was from that point on, i really believed that i believed in the ideology. as a teenager, i ran for office. i advocated for it and saw myself trying to take on the mantle of white nationalist politics. trying to take it as a movement that could be much bigger and could tap into a lot of blatant racist beliefs and amplify them. >> but thousand did you break? >> it was in college.

i believed that this movement had all these facts and had this world view that made sense. and i also believed i didn't want to be somebody who harmed other people. and i didn't want to be someone who saw themselves that way. and at college, i got to know people. i was home schooled. my family took me out of school moe i was in south florida. very multiracial. a lot of jewish people. and this antisemitic movement. in college was the first time i got very close to people without telling them about my background. thinking i could lead both lives and eventually that was not true. and i faced this ostracism and criticism from a community that really i had gotten to know and people i had come to love and i just wanted to understand, is there some kind of misunderstanding? is there something i can bridge here? that was my first question. >> daryl, you get close to dangerous people. you literally go to ku klux

klan rallies as a black man. you meet with leadership. how physically dangerous is this for you? why have you chosen this work? >> listen, stephanie, our country can only become one of two things. one, that we sit back and watch it become or two, what we stand up and make it become. and i have chosen the latter. >> what's it like for you in those scenarios, though? >> well you know, i have seen things as derrick points out. his change came from being exposed to different people. and he began questioning things so i bring that to people vicariously when i attend these klan rallies. i'm a firm believer that a missed opportunity for dialogue is a missed opportunity for conflict resolution. >> how concerned are you about the threat, the growth of white nationalism? >> i think it is an enormous threat. i have never seen a moment in my lifetime, definitely not in any recent decades where there was more political reception for this movement.

it is always what they are trying to do. they are not powerful because they have millions and millions of members. they are powerful because their ideas aren't alien to our society and they are always trying to find a larger megaphone to amplify what they believe. and i have just never seen a moment where more mainstream sections of the american right are willing to tolerate white supremacy, anti-semitism, antiimmigrant rhetoric and violent rhetoric. >> what do you think about this moment? >> i can tell you what is going on. it is the demographic shift in this country. >> the browning of america. >> the browning of america. white genocide and all these other beliefs and that is why we are seeing more and more lone wolves. when i first started with this thing, there was the kkk, some neo-nazis, white power skin heads. now you have a ton of groups saying come join us to take back the country and when people fail to take back the

country, some people get frustrated, become lone wolves and say i will do it myself. that is when they walk into a synagogue, a black grocery store in buffalo. things like that. they are trying to stop this demographic shift and looking for what they call rahowa. the first two letters are three words. racial holy war. the race war. >> well, we are blessed that you two are trying to stop it. thank you both for being here. thank you for your work, congratulations on your work. >> thank you stephanie. a huge thank you, again, to derrick and daryl and we will be back after a quick break. k. yep, there's plenty of space. i've even got an extra seat. wait! no, no, no, no, no. [ gasps ] [ indistinct chatter ] [ sigh ] let's just wait them out. the volkswagen atlas with three rows of seating for seven. everyone wants a ride.

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thank you for watching. ari melber is up next. and are reminder you can catch my full extended interv