Father-daughter alliance: Chrissy Gephardt comes out to help get her dad, Rep. Dick Gephardt, elected president. Can she make him more pro-gay than he already is? (Politics).
Chrissy Gephardt is going where no child of a presidential aspirant has gone before--out of the closet and onto the campaign trail to talk not only about her father, U.S. representative Dick Gephardt, but also about being gay.The 30-year-old is talking about how she figured out in 2000 that she is a lesbian: Gephardt's graduate school classmate (and now her partner) Amy Loder came out to her at a St. Louis coffee shop. Gephardt, who was married to physician Marc Leibole at the time, says she immediately realized her feelings for Loder, now 31, were more than friendship, and as a result, she threw up.
She's talking about coming out to her family--the Missouri congressman and his wife, Jane, and their other children, Matt, 32, and Kate, 26--in 2001: They're never going to love me anymore, she thought at the time.
She's talking about the comparisons to Vice President Dick Cheney's lesbian daughter, Mary Cheney. Although Cheney has acknowledged being gay, she has not discussed it in the press. When a reporter asked the vice president's wife, Lynne Cheney, about her daughter being a lesbian, she responded, "Mary has never declared such a thing."
Chrissy Gephardt also is talking about her passion for her father's platform: As a social worker who worked with abused and mentally ill women until she started full-time with the campaign on June 2, Gephardt is most impressed with her dad's near-universal health care plan, which would scrap George W. Bush's tax cuts to provide tax credits to employers who provide health insurance to their employees.
But first things first. Before Dick Gephardt can hope to do anything to Bush's tax cuts, dismantle the military's antigay "don't ask, don't tell" policy, or use the bully pulpit to fight for hate-crimes laws and employment protections, as he promises, he must first win the Democratic nomination. And to do so he must outshine a field of contenders who--recognizing the power of the gay electorate, estimated to be at least 5% of the vote in the general election--are all jockeying to prove they are more pro-gay than the others.
"If you look at all of the different campaigns, you can see they're all really making an effort to reach out the LGBT community," says Dave Noble, executive director of the gay political group National Stonewall Democrats. "We had an event [in May] where we invited the top openly gay staff of all the different campaigns, and every campaign sent someone. That's a real sign that all of the campaigns are hiring openly gay staff, including them in their inner circle, and will be including them in a Democratic administration."
No doubt the Gephardt campaign is betting Chrissy's willingness to talk so openly about herself will help give them an advantage at the finish line. After all, they must surmise, their candidate isn't someone who just understands the importance of equal rights. This is a man who also wants the best for his daughter.
The Advocate talked with Chrissy Gephardt, Amy Loder, and Dick Gephardt in Gephardt's Washington, D.C., campaign headquarters.
So how does it feel to now be out to millions of people?
Chrissy Gephardt: It's kind of intimidating. I had mostly come out to my close friends and family, and that was it--and work. But it wasn't like I told all the people from grade school and high school.
Would you have compromised yourself if you had worked on the campaign without coming out?
C.G.: I think when the opportunity [to come out] presented itself, it was like, Wow. This is great! First of all, I wanted to help my father. [Coming out] was sort of like an extra bonus on top of it. But it wasn't like I was going to help my father for myself, you know? It was mainly because I think he's the best candidate for president.
I'm a social worker, so I'm very concerned about health care. I just had a woman today who is diabetic and she needs insulin, and she has Medicare. She is probably going to die this weekend because there is no way she can get insulin, because she doesn't have health insurance.
What do you say to someone like that?
C.G.: "Too bad. Sorry. Go to the emergency room. By the time you get seen you might be dead." You know? It's just crazy. It's like we're living in a third world country.
So coming out so publicly was just a bonus to joining the campaign.
C. G.: Exactly.
Were you afraid of being outed?
C.G.: No. It never really was an issue. I didn't live my life any differently because of it. Obviously, I told my family, I told my friends. I came out. I brought Amy to my Christmas party at work. It was never anything that I hid.
And Amy was on your family's Christmas card last year?
C.G.: Yeah.
I don't know if Mary Cheney's partner is on the Cheney family Christmas card.
[Laughter]
C.G.: No.
Do you get the Cheney family Christmas card?
Dick Gephardt: [Laughing] No, I got dropped. Early on.
People are now comparing you to Mary Cheney.
C.G.: Oh, I'm sure.
What do you think about that?
C.G.: I respect whatever Mary Cheney feels is important for her to do. I don't think that it's fair for me to sit and judge. It sounds like she's taking her own role in her own way. This is what I've chosen to do. That's what she chose to do. I don't think there's anything wrong with either path. They're just different.
This is completely hypothetical, but would it have been tougher for you if your dad were antigay?
C.G.: Oh, yeah. Absolutely. But would I have still told him? Yeah, because that's what I felt like I needed to do. But the fact that my parents were so accepting of it was great. I was floored. I think I had more of my own internalized homophobia, in terms of, What are they going to think? They're never going to love me anymore. And then when I got the reaction that I did, I was like, You made it into a bigger deal than it was. Their main concern was if I was going to be happy and that I was getting a divorce.
It must have been harder because you were in the marriage.
C. G.: It was very hard. That's why that day, when I knew, I got sick. When [Amy] said "I'm gay," I got sick. I knew that for me to ever get to the point where I could be in a relationship with her--openly, like a marriage--I would have to go through a whole lot. I had to get divorced. I had to tell my parents. I had to break the news to the families. I had to tell my friends. I had to disappoint people who really liked my husband and me as a couple.
You say that you realized you were gay that day, when Amy told you she was a lesbian. But did you have a hunch before that?
C.G.: I had an idea, but I think I had convinced myself so well and lied to myself to make believe that those thoughts and feelings were really just made-up. Or [that] maybe I was just curious. I tried to convince myself that it wasn't true. There were women that I thought were really cool. And I thought they were really, really cool.
"I want to be like her."
C.G.: [Laughing] Yeah. Exactly. "And I want to be friends with her." And then you wonder why you might start fantasizing about her, and you think, Wait a minute, she's not just cool.
[Laughing]
D.G.: Beyond cool.
C.G.: [Laughing] Wa-a-ay co-o-ol.
[To D.G.] Did you have any idea?
D.G.: Jane and I had talked about the possibility because [Chrissy] was spending a lot of time with Amy. We'd call the house, and she was with Amy a lot. So it occurred to us. We talked about it. But we weren't sure, and we didn't know until, I think, you talked to Jane first on the phone.
C. G.: Mmm-hmm.
D.G.: We weren't shocked.
Did it scare you?
D.G.: It never scared me. I love my kids more than anything. And I just want her to be happy. She has unconditional love. And so I just wanted to know that she was where she wanted to be and that she was in the life that she wanted.
It sounds like you would have had the same fears as if she had just come to you and said she wanted a divorce.
D. G.: Right. That was the really traumatic part of this. A divorce is a traumatic thing for everybody.
So Amy, what was it like for you? You came out to Chrissy, and she was married, had to get a divorce, and her dad was the minority leader of the House of Representatives? [Laughterl
Amy Loder: To be honest, I didn't know who he was. [Laughing]
C.L.: One day I told her, "My dad is in politics." And she said, "OK."
A.L.: And she said, "He's in Congress." And I said, "Oh, that's nice." And then she said, "Well, actually, he's your congressman. He represents the district that you live in." I was like, "All right." I had just moved to Missouri, and I didn't even know what district I lived in.
C.G.: But I liked that. I did not want to be with somebody or be friends with somebody who was so into politics that that's all they want to talk about.
Have you always supported your dad's stands on gay issues?
C.G.: No, not necessarily. One of the issues that we don't see eye to eye on is gay marriage. [All of the Democratic candidates but Rep. Dennis Kucinich of Ohio, former U.S. senator Carol Moseley Braun of Illinois, and the Reverend Al Sharpton are opposed to equal marriage rights for gay people. Gephardt and most of the other candidates are on record supporting civil unions legislation.] We've talked about that, and I'm working on him. Obviously, it helps that I'm his daughter, and that's something that's important for me. Amy and I are not at that point. But maybe someday I do want to marry her, and right now I can't do that. We've talked about that.
What do you say to him?
C.G.: First of all, I tell him why it's important. If you do a civil union--yeah, legally, everything is the same as a marriage. But then you don't have the sanctity of the relationship like you do with a marriage. Even though the country maybe isn't in the position to [support] gay marriage, why not shoot for it? Why not shoot for the stars? Why settle for something less?
And what do you say to her when she says that?
D.G.: "I'm listening." She's a very effective advocate. She has been since she was a little kid. She's very smart, very effective. So, "I'm listening."
Is it possible to think differently about it as a father than you do as a presidential candidate?
D.G.: Well, I've always tried to put myself in other people's shoes and understand what they go through and what they think. My mother, who died [in May], used to always say, "Treat other people the way you would like to be treated." She even made it graphic. She'd say, "Think how you would like something said to you before you say it. Think how you would like something done to you before you do it." I try to look at issues in that way. But obviously, when you have someone in your own family who can relate an experience to you or can make you aware of something, it's more powerful. No question about it.
Would the country support equal marriage rights for gay people?
I think right now we'd be probably fortunate to be able to get civil unions. They did it in Vermont and had some difficulty with it. Vermont is a pretty liberal state. Someday we may be at that point. I don't think we're there today.
I know [former Vermont governor Howard] Dean is attractive to some gay voters because of his support for civil unions. In fact, nearly all of the Democrats are trying to appeal to gay voters in some way. But when I heard that you were coming out, I said to myself, How can you trump that?
[Laughterl
C.G.: I know. Someone was joking with me the other day who actually works for Dean, and they said, "Damn, he doesn't have any gay kids." And I said, "Well, there's still time."
What is it about this bunch of Democrats that is so different?
D.G.: I think people's feelings about [gay issues] have changed. We aren't where we need to be. We have a long way to go. We don't have civil rights for gay people. We don't have [the Employment Non-Discrimination Act]. But progress is made every day. Gays in the military didn't turn out the way it should have, but it did increase people's understanding. We're making progress. But we've got a long way to go.
Have you taken any heat for your stands on gay issues?
D.G.: I haven't had voters come up to me and say they don't agree with what I say. We did have calls to the office [after Chrissy came out].
Did they reach you?
D.G.: I haven't talked to them. But I've talked to my staff at home, and they said they've got some--I don't think a lot. But it was some, like "Gephardt ought to straighten his daughter out." Whatever.
How?
[Laughter]
C.G.: Run me over with one of those trucks you do pavement with.
D.G.: It's like any human issue. Intolerance and misunderstanding and prejudice are powerful human emotions. And we face a lot of it still. But so do African-Americans. So do Hispanics. So do all kinds of people.
But I imagine the emotion as a father to protect your daughter from that sort of bigotry is as strong.
D.G.: I've often said that the feeling I have between myself and my children is almost an animal thing. I can't explain it. But if they're in trouble, I would do anything. The protective instinct is overwhelming. And it's beyond reason in its emotion.
Are you afraid of her facing some of that bigotry head-on?
D.G.: She might, but I think she can handle it.
Are you afraid, Chrissy?
C.G.: I'm sure it will be intimidating at first. But I'm sure I'll grow into it.
What are you going to tell gay voters about your dad? Why should they vote for him?
C.G.: He can understand where I'm coming from, and he listens to me. And he tries to put himself in my shoes. The day that I came out, he said, "Well, we will accept you no matter what. We just want you to be happy." And ever since then, he has asked me a lot of questions, like "What is it like to be gay?" Just curiosity. [Turning to her father] You guys know a lot about it because [Amy and I] lived with you for five months. [After they graduated from Washington University in St. Louis, Loder and Gephardt lived with the congressman and his wife in Washington, D.C., from January to May 2002.]
My dad is a really good listener. You take any diverse group and he can sit there and hear what their problems are, hear what their concerns and their issues are. And he can really process it. That's something that gay voters should know. They've got me as an advocate, and he's a good listener.
That must be nice to hear from your daughter.
D.G.: It is. We have a great relationship. She's really a terrific person. I'm really proud of her.
Find out takes from this interview and a link to the Gephardt campaign site at www.advocate.com
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| Author: | Barrett, Jon |
|---|---|
| Publication: | The Advocate (The national gay & lesbian newsmagazine) |
| Date: | Jul 8, 2003 |
| Words: | 2677 |
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