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TheAlterEggo

Early in Tree With Deep Roots, I have a questions about the power of Taejong and the first Joseon monarchs

Discussion

First time posting here, so hello everyone.

In the past several years, my mom has gotten really into watching kdramas, and when I'm able, I've watched a handful with her as well. One particular show I have interest in is the famed historical drama Six Flying Dragons (2015), but it's too long and apparently restricted from US streaming for us to watch right now. In light of this, we instead just started Tree With Deep Roots (2011) due to its shorter length and connection with SFD as a preceding show. We're now three episodes in, and while I can broadly follow along with what's going on, we're a bit puzzled by some political details that may be due to our American ignorance of Korean history. I would therefore appreciate it if you can fill us in on what we may be missing:

If Former King Taejong is so insistent on calling all the shots, why did he abdicate the throne to his son Sejong? Even if Taejong is confident about paternally bullying his son into compliance, it seems unnecessary compared to wielding power directly and downright counterproductive as we see Sejong begin to act defiantly.
If everyone acknowledges Sejong as the king of Joseon, why does Taejong appear to wield the most realized power when the two are at odds? Sejong appears to only have command over a small staff, particularly his bodyguard Moo-hyul, while everyone else follows the orders of Taejong. Is it sheer loyalty to (or fear of) Taejong personally over loyalty to the throne?
In the first episode, what's the point of Sejong's intercepted letter to the prime minister being replaced with a fake bearing a seemingly-innocuous message? Even if the prime minister's immediate capture wasn't guaranteed, I'd think that it would be suffice for Taejong to prevent the prime minister from getting any letter at all, no need for a fake.

For guidance, I thankfully have Dramabeans recaps and Wikipedia to refer to, but I don't want to read too much into the real history that would spoil (or conflict with) plot points from TWDR or SFD. Rather, I'd just like to be as historically-informed as an average Korean viewer would be. Therefore, with cursory research, my understanding of the relevant history is as follows:

In 1392, Taejong's family (Yi) overthrew the Goryeo Dynasty and established the Joseon Dynasty with Taejong's father Taejo as its first king. In the show, Taejong gives himself a lot of credit for making all of this happen.
In 1398, Taejong led a coup that killed many of his political enemies, including brothers as well as Prime Minister Jeong Do-jeon, who was largely responsible for creating much of the new Joseon government. In the show, Jeong Do-jeon also created the shadow organization Hidden Root with the goal to transfer power from the reigning monarch to non-royal bureaucrats, a cause that his remaining family hope to take up. As a result of the bloody affair, Taejo abdicates in disillusionment, and Taejong lets his oldest brother Jeongjong take the throne as to not appear power-hungry
In 1400, Taejong comes into armed conflict with a different older brother, ultimately defeating and exiling him. As a result, King Jeongjong abdicates to Taejong in fear.
King Taejong reigned as an absolute monarch until 1418, when he abdicated to his son Sejong for reasons I can't discern.

Do I have the right of things here, or am I making errors? Are there other historical points I ought to know?

Thanks for any clarity you can offer.

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rak_leader

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If Former King Taejong is so insistent on calling all the shots, why did he abdicate the throne to his son Sejong?

Two main reasons. First, being king means having to deal with the day-to-day affairs of the country, as well as a lot of ceremonial events. Letting someone else handle the boring and useless stuff allows you to focus on the important issues. Second, it makes the future succession much more secure, which is always a real concern at the start of a new dynasty. When Taejong dies, it becomes more difficult to remove Sejong if he's already king. It is quite easy to depose a crown prince and replace him with another prince, but the the difficulty level is much higher if you want to depose a reigning king.

If everyone acknowledges Sejong as the king of Joseon, why does Taejong appear to wield the most realized power when the two are at odds?

Like Varys would say, power resides where men believe it resides... Taejong is a giant based on his former position and achievements. And he is ruthless, no one would dare cross him. Besides, he still has control over the military and all the important positions are staffed with his people. If Sejong was brave enough to fight with his father, no one would think he'd win, that's why everyone supports Taejong.

TheAlterEggo

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Thank you for providing rational answers to my main questions. The situation with Taejong as former king makes sense to me now, and I'll be sure to pass this along to my mom as well since she was especially perplexed.

1Fower

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I know this is late, but as the person above mentioned, Yi Bang Won (King Taejong) maintained control of the military. This wouldn’t become an unusual thing in Joseon History. Kings would often give a faction or party control of the military as part of concessions to the faction. Taejong was also a skilled swordsman, horseman, and archer before being king and had a strong connection to the army. These connections don’t go away when you quit your job. This is a man who helped overthrow the last dynasty, killed (perhaps even personally, political rivals and even his brothers. He even killed the founder of the Joseon Dynasty, Jeon Do Jeon.

More replies

Narnia77

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"Tree With Deep Root" is a work of fiction. The writers of the drama also made some changes to the characters in the book like Moo-hyul. In the book, he is a monk but in the drama, he is King Sejong's trusted guard.

"Six Flying Dragons" is a fusion sageuk. 3 of the dragons are historical figures and 3 are fiction. This is the link to Bodashiri's SFD notes. https://bodashiri.tumblr.com/search/Six%20Flying%20Dragons

If you are a fan of Korean history like me, then you might prefer "Jeong Do-jeon." No cheesy made-up romance, just straight-up history.
I watched them live and enjoyed them all!
"If Former King Taejong is so insistent on calling all the shots, why did he abdicate the throne to his son Sejong?"

Taejong was ruthless and cunning. He had no intention of giving up his power. Abdicating the throne was a well-calculated move to test the loyalty of his ministers. Those who shift their support to the crown prince were eliminated or fired from the court. Some of them were Sejong's uncles and in-laws.
As for the letter, that is how Taejong set up his rivals for treasons they didn't commit. The prime minister was Sejong's father in law.

pinesilver

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If Former King Taejong is so insistent on calling all the shots, why did he abdicate the throne to his son Sejong?

Taejong made Sejong, despite being the third son, to be Crown Prince for his talent. As Taekong who was not the firstborn himself ascended to the throne though coups, he was well aware of the need to secure Sejong's position as his heir against potential coups. Had he kept Sejong as Crown Prince, such coups were to happen after his death. By throning Sejong as soon as possible, Taejong was trying to deal with any threats against Sejong's legitimacy by himself and consolidate Sejong's position as his heir.

If everyone acknowledges Sejong as the king of Joseon, why does Taejong appear to wield the most realized power when the two are at odds?

Sejong was unexpectedly made Crown Prince in June 1418 and, within two months was made King in August 1418 at the age of 21. He was not only young but also totally unprepared to be King. Even though Taejong made Sejong King, in his mind Sejong was an intern King to learn so much from himself. Sejong's legitimacy was not questioned - those who did or would have done were purged by Taejong - but everyone in the government regarded Taejong as the true King for quite some time.

In the first episode, what's the point of Sejong's intercepted letter to the prime minister being replaced with a fake bearing a seemingly-innocuous message?

I remember it only vaguely. I think the fake letter could have potentially frame Sejong as attempting treason against Taejong and to prevent that from happenning the prime minister did not claim innocence for himself.

+ This is one of the fusion sageuk, rather free with imagination based loosely on historical facts. The almost antagonistic Oedipal relationship between Taejong and Sejong portrayed in Tree with Deep Roots is based more on the imagination of the screenwriters of this drama.

LcLou02

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There's a wonderful blog on Tumblr called Bodashiri ( Google Bodashiri and it will come up) that gave good historical notes episode by episode for SFD. I'm assuming that he did the same for TwDR. Check out his archives.

Also,

https://campusconnection.blogspot.com/2017/05/tree-with-deep-roots-synopsis.html?m=1

Should take you to an episode-by-episode synopsis of the drama without spoilers. If you scroll after that part there are 3 videos about historical subjects -the kings and the making of Hangul. After that are photography examples from the drama.

LcLou02

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P.s. the secret society is a figment of the screen writer's imagination.

TheAlterEggo

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Yes, I figured as much that the Hidden Root is the primary fictional element to the show, but I mentioned it specifically not to mix it up with real history, but rather to be sure that I'm getting the show's plot correct.

Unfortunately, it appears that the Tumblr blog you indicated doesn't cover TWDR, but thanks for the input regardless.