Bertrada (Prüm) de Laon (abt.0685-aft.0721) | WikiTree FREE Family Tree
Bertrada (Prüm) de Laon
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Bertrada (Prüm) de Laon (abt. 685 - aft. 721)

Bertrada "die Ältere, Bertha" de Laon formerly Prüm aka of Prüm
Born about [location unknown]
Ancestors ancestors
[spouse(s) unknown]
Descendants descendants
Died after after about age 36 [location unknown]
Profile last modified | Created 5 Jul 2015
This page has been accessed 35,199 times.
European Aristocracy
Bertrada (Prüm) de Laon was a member of aristocracy in ancient Europe.
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Contents

Biography

Birth and Parents

The only information known about Bertrada or Berta comes from the founding of the Abbey of Prüm with Charibert in 721.... However, it's disputed as to whether the Bertrada in question was actually Charibert's wife. [1]

Bertrada [1] was born about 670. [2] or [3]

A popular genealogy shows her born 0730 in Rouergue, Toulouse, France. Such a date would move her in time by two or three generations

Bertrada de Laon's parents are unknown. [1]

Cawley states that Bertrada's parents are unknown. [1] The following have been suggested as possible parents:

  • Diederik III der Merovingen and Chrodechild der Merovingen.
  • Bertrada die Ältere (died after/ gestorben nach 721), Gründerin der Abtei PrümBertrada die Ältere von Prüm german info. See image: Bertrada Castle in Mürlenbach, named after Bertrada die Ältere von Prüm Merovingian. Bertrada (c. 670-c. 721), was mother of Caribert Comte de Laon. They founded Prüm Abbey in 721. His daughter Bertrada of Laon is the mother of Charlemagne. Two solutions to the question of her parentage have been suggested: either she was daughter of Pfalzgraf Hugobert and Irmina of Oeren, or she was daughter of Theuderic III, King of Neustria and Austrasia, and Clotilda of Heristal. The nickname of die Ältere translates into "the older" probably to make the distinction between her and a granddaughter who is likely her namesake, Laon-14 called Bertrada (Berta) "au grand pied, Queen of the Franks" des Francs formerly Laon aka de Laon.

She was also called Berthe or Bertree, She was perhaps a Merovingian Princess.

Marriage

The name of her husband is unknown. [1]

This profile is showing her married to Fredelon Toulouse formerly De Toulouse

Some genealogies show Martin de Laon as the husband of Bertrada and father of Charibert, however, no verification has yet been found for this.

Christian Settipani has proposed in an updated family tree table for Charlemagne that Bertrada married an unnamed son of Irmina. [4]

Monastery of Prum

The editor of Einhard's Annals in the MGH SS series records that "Pippinus…uxoris pater et Avia Charibertus et Bertradana" founded the monastery of Prüm[599]. This is presumably based on the charter dated 23 Jun 720 under which "Bertrada seu Berta et filius meus Chairibertus" donated property to Prüm, witnessed by "Bernarius, Chrodolande, Theodericus"[600], although the charter is probably spurious as it predates the foundation of the abbey. It is assumed that this refers to the mother of Charibert, father of Queen Bertrada, although another possibility is that it refers to the wife of Charibert and an otherwise unknown son of Charibert, brother of Queen Bertrada. The Monumenta Epternacensia record a donation by "Berta, filiis meis Chardradus et Harbertus"[601]. [1]

She may also have donated land to the Abbey of Echternach, along with Charibert and another son Hardrad in the same year.

Death and Burial

She died after 721 in France. It is not known where she died or is buried.

The Find A Grave reference showing her buried in Saint Denis Basilica has confused her with her granddaughter who is buried there. [2] The Cathedral of Saint Dennis is specific that it is "Pépin Le Bref (751-758) et Berthe, dite au grand pied (726-783)" who is buried there. [5]

Issue

Charles Cawley reports that Bertrada had three children:

  1. Hardrad, died after 720. The Monumenta Epternacensia record a donation by "Berta, filiis meis Chardradus et Harbertus"[602]. [1]
  2. Charibert [Heribert], died after 23 Jun 720. "Bertrada seu Berta et filius meus Chairibertus" donated property to Prüm by charter dated 23 Jun 720[603], although the charter is probably spurious as it predates the foundation of the abbey. The Monumenta Epternacensia record a donation by "Berta, filiis meis Chardradus et Harbertus"[604]. Comte de Laon. m ---. The name of Charibert’s wife is not known. [1] She is known to be the mother of Charibert of Laon, with whom she is co-founder and benefactor of the Prüm Abbey. They founded the abbey in 721. Through her son, Charibert's daughter Bertrada of Laon, wife of Pippin the Short, Bertrada is the great-grandmother of Charlemagne.
  3. Weta . "Asuarius" abbot of Prüm noted a donation to the abbey by "filia in Christo Wetane", which names "genetricis tue [Wetane] Bertradane" and "Cario et coniuge tue Wettane", by undated charter dated to [762/804][610]. It is not certain that "Bertradane" was the same person as the mother of Charibert, although the common connection with Prüm indicates that this is possible. If this is correct, the charter is probably datable to the earliest part of the suggested date range, assuming that the date of Bertrada's 720 charter (see above) is correct and at that date her son Charibert was already an adult. She married Cario. [1]

Sources

  1. 1.0 1.1 1.2 1.3 1.4 1.5 1.6 1.7 1.8 Charles Cawley. Medieval Lands: A Prosopography of Medieval European Noble and Royal Families, Online at Foundation for Medieval Genealogy Website. Bertrada Accessed April 1, 2017. jhd
  2. 2.0 2.1 Find A Grave: Memorial #146139249 Profile for Bertrade de Prum.
  3. Wikipedia
  4. Christian Settipani. Updated Family Tree, page 17.
  5. Tourism 93 Cathedral of Saint Dennis

See also:


Bertrada Gisele DeLaon (born Merovingian) was born in 695, at birth place, to Hugobert Chugoberctus Hociobercthus Von Ecternach Prince Senechal of De Aquitaine and Irmina "Saint of Liege" Abbess von Aquitaine (born Oeren). Hugobert was born in 635, in Bayern, Germany. Irmina was born circa 640, in Ohren, Limburg-Weilburg, Hessen, Germany. Bertrada had 2 sisters: Chrodelinde von Autun (born BAVARIA) and one other sibling. Bertrada married Heribert DeLaon at marriage place. (if she died at age 3 how would this be possible? Such is the problem with internet trees). Heribert was born in 687, in Laon, Aisne, Pays de la Loire, France. They had 2 daughters: Mlle V De Saint Quentin (born De Laon) and one other child. Bertrada passed away in 698, at age 3 at death place.

Another internet tree has this information: Claribert I (Heribert), Count of LOAN was born in BET 700 AND 705 in of, Laon, Aisne, France. He died 4 in 751. Claribert married Bertrada, Countess of LOAN in 719. Bertrada, Countess of LOAN was born about 695 in of, Laon, Aisne, France. Bertrada, married Claribert I (Heribert), Count of LOAN in 719. They had the following children. Berthe (Bertrade) Countess of LOAN was born about 720. She died on 12 Jul 783. But it at least does have sources associated with it. See http://www.dustyhills.net/aqwg216.htm list of sources below.


  • https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugobert does not show this Bertrada. Shows the one who was an Abyss and was born in 670 and died in 721 while this one only lived 3 years. Yet this one is often attached to Hugobert in internet trees.
  • http://www.dustyhills.net/aqwg216.htm has her marrying Claribert and having a daughter with similar name. This internet tree cites the following sources:
  • 1Medieval Research Dept., FHL, SLC, Ancestral File submission by the SLC, FHL Medieval Research Dept., LDS Family History Library, 35 N West Temple Street, Salt Lake City, UT 84150-3440, USA, 35 N West Temple Street Salt Lake City, UT, 84150-3440, USA.
  • 2Christian Settipani, Addenda to Les Ancêtres de Charlemagne (France: Heraldique et Généalogie in 1990), p. 17, Tim Farr, 756 N Monte Verde Circle, Washington, UT 84780, USA, 756 N Monte Verde Circle Washington, UT, 84780, USA.
  • 3Addenda to Les Ancêtres de Charlemagne, p. 17.
  • 4Addenda to Les Ancêtres de Charlemagne, p. 17.




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Comments: 21

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I don t know if this is nonsense what Im saying now. Im verry confused.

I found a father with about the same age as Bertrada "die Ältere, Bertha" de Laon formerly Prüm aka of Prüm. Childebrand "germanus, Count in Burgundy, Duke in Provence" Autun formerly Heristal aka Heristal, Perracy (678-751): https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Heristal-40

He got an other wife, but his child is Nibelung (Nibelung I) "Nivelon, the historian" d'Autun formerly Autun: https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Autun-38 Can Nibelung I be the same child as "Unknown Nibelung", the child of Bertrada? Nibelung is no child of the wife of Childrebrand in his profile.

Greetings Richard

posted by Richard Ameling
edited by Richard Ameling
Daughter of Theodoric (Merovingian) Bourgogne [uncertain] and Chrothechildis (Unknown) Franken [uncertain] has to be removed people make take this to FamilySearch and use it as a fact.
posted by Rod Piper
Merovingian-106 and Prüm-5 appear to represent the same person because: One profile appears to be a garbled version of the other, which has historical facts. I suggest that they are merged.
Shouldn't we disconnect the parents? Settipani only proposes possibilities, so his aims are different.
posted by Andrew Lancaster
Thanks Andrew, I'll update the biography next week and look at disconnecting them and instead adding them to a research note.
posted by John Atkinson
Thanks John. Given that we also post uncertain connections, I guess the question is whether there is one very clearly leading possibility? I had the impression that it was debatable in this case.
posted by Andrew Lancaster
Needs removing fictitious

Born about 0685 [location unknown] ANCESTORS ancestors Daughter of Theodoric (Merovingian) Bourgogne [uncertain] and Chrothechildis (Unknown) Franken [uncertain] Sister of Chlodovech (Merovingian) Franken, Childebert (Merovingian) Franken and Chrotlind (Unknown) de Neustria [half]

No one will do that here despite evidence supplied, there is no fact checking of parents in this time period in Medieval History.

Christian Settipani. Updated Family Tree, page 17. no one reads his work correctly anyway.

--- means uncertain and that is basic 101 genealogy further ---?--- means questionable not fact. see no one reads his pedigree chart and this propagates the falsity on Wikipedia and that moved to FamilySearch. Despite a citation needed added there and no one can come up with one.

posted by Rod Piper
edited by Rod Piper
The biography above includes this comment "Cawley states that Bertrada's parents are unknown." The link to FMG in source 1 certainly seems to confirm, but I'm seeing another FMG link that states "[BERTRADA [Berta]. Abbess of Prüm. Settipani suggests that Bertrada, abbess of Prüm and great grandmother of Charlemagne, was the daughter of King Theoderich III, basing this on the transmission of the names Charibert and Theoderich into the Carolingian family", see http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/MEROVINGIANS.htm#_ftnref502. She is clearly listed here as the third child of Theoderich and the abbess of Prum.

I have seen this before in Cawley where the reader gets conflicting results between entries found going up a tree line and entries going down a tree line. I'd be inclined to put her as a child of Theoderich and chalk the conflict up to a failure to correct inconsistent entries in FMG for the same person..

posted by David Kearns
Thanks David, she is currently linked to Theoderic III but marked as uncertain, but that is just one theory about her parentage, and there are others. However no primary records exist that definitely refer to her parents, or husband by name, and the theories can only remain as theories.

The biography does need some clean up but I can't see that we would want to mark her parents as certain, unless other information comes to light.

posted by John Atkinson
The merge between Prüm-5 and Bertha-24 was completed.
posted by Laura (Pennie) Bozzay
In the thread below it says: Unknown-247976 and Merovingian-36 are not ready to be merged...

When clicking on Unknown-247976 it takes you to Moss-5764 born in the 1800s...

posted by Laura (Pennie) Bozzay
Since the sources are clear that Bertrada's husband/Charibert's father is unknown, I have remove the link to Martin de Laon, retaining a refrrence in the bio.
posted by Jack Day
Is Bertrada Prum-5, mother of Charibert Laon-1 the same person as Bertrada Bertha-24 ?
posted by Robert Wood
Merovingian-36 and Prüm-4 appear to represent the same person because: Note on Merovingian-36 says to merge this direction.
posted by Marty (Lenover) Acks
Unknown-247976 and Merovingian-36 are not ready to be merged because: Recent discussion on G2G decided that Prum may be the better LNAB for this profile. Merge proposals should be directed to that name.
posted by John Atkinson
There has been some discussion on the correct LNAB for this profile here http://www.wikitree.com/g2g/151941/bertrada-of-prum-what-should-her-lnab-be and the final consensus seems to be that if should be Prüm in which case this profile should be merged with http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Prüm-4 If you have any queries or comments about this, please respond to the G2G question above. Thank you
posted by John Atkinson
Unknown-247976 and Merovingian-36 appear to represent the same person because: Same child and husband
posted by Marty (Lenover) Acks

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