Roger (Quincy) de Quincy (abt. 1195 - 1264)

Born about 1195 in England [uncertain]

Ancestors

Descendants

Died 25 Apr 1264 at about age 69 in England

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Magna Carta Surety Baron Descendant (see text). Join: Magna Carta Project Discuss: magna_carta

Biography

Roger de Quincy, Knt., 2nd Earl of Winchester, was the son of Saher de Quincy and Margaret Beaumont.^[1] He was probably born about 1195^[2] (in 1217/18 he consented to a charter made by his father, so must have been of age).^[3]

Roger was the second but eldest surviving son of Saher de Quincy, a Magna Carta Surety, and became his heir after his older brother Robert died.^[1]

Roger married first to Ellen,^[4] daughter of Alan Fitz Roland, Lord of Galloway, by his first wife, a daughter of Roger de Lacy, Knt.^[1][5]

Roger and Ellen had three daughters:^[1]

• Margaret (or Margery) de Quincy, married William de Ferrers, 5th Earl of Derby^[1][6]
• Elizabeth (or Isabel) de Quincy, married Alexander Comyn^[1][7]
• Ellen de Quincy, married Alan la Zouche of Ashby de la Zouche in Leicestershire^[1]

Roger's wife Ellen (or Helen) of Galloway died after 21 November 1245 and was buried at Brackley, Northamptonshire, England.^[1]

By 12 June 1250, Roger had married second to Maud de Bohun. They had no children.^[1] She was alive on 4 August 1252, when she and Roger are mentioned in the Close Rolls.^[8] Maud died on 20 October 1252.^[1]

Just previous to 17 January 1252/53, Roger married third to Eleanor Ferrers,^[1] the widow of William de Vaux and daughter of Roger's son-in-law William de Ferrers, (Margaret's husband).^[6][9] They also had no children. Eleanor survived Roger and remarried in 1267 to Roger de Leybourne.^[1] A Close Rolls entry for 6 December 1252 records Eleanor's lands being temporarily taken by the escheator, pending Roger's appearance before the king, with a pledge by Henry III to entrust them to John de Grey, as Roger and Eleanor married without royal consent (the right to determine Eleanor's marriage vested with Henry III).^[10] A Patent Rolls entry for 20 January 1253 records Roger being fined 5 marks of gold for the marriage.^[11]

Roger de Quincy, 2nd Earl of Winchester, Constable of Scotland, died 25 April 1264 and "was probably buried at Brackley, Northamptonshire."^[1][12] Inquisitions Post Mortem were held in 1263-4 (48 Henry III), and they give the death date.^[13]

After his death, his lands were held in dower by Eleanor and her husband Roger de Leybourne to be distributed to Roger de Quincy's three daughters.^[14]

Life Events

On 16 December 1215, Roger was excommunicated by the Pope, along with his father, in consequence of his father guaranteeing the provisions of the Magna Carta.^[1]

He "probably joined his father on the Fifth Crusade in 1219, where the elder de Quincy fell sick and died. Since Roger's older brother Robert had died a few years earlier, he inherited his father's estates on his return, but was not recognised as earl until his mother died in 1235."^[2]

Roger married Helen, eldest daughter and co-heiress of Alan, Lord of Galloway. Without legitimate sons to succeed him, Alan's lands and dignities were divided between the husbands of his three daughters, so Roger acquired Alan's position as Constable of Scotland, and one-third of the lordship of Galloway (although the actual title of Lord of Galloway went through Helen's half-sister Devorguilla to her husband John I de Balliol).^[15]

The Fine Rolls record

• Roger owing relief for knights' fees in Kettlestone and Buckby, Northamptonshire in late 1221^[16]
• Roger undertaking to pay a fine of £100 for his inheritance from his mother in 1235^[17]

Close Rolls entries for the 1230s record gifts of deer to Roger from the royal forests.^{[18][19][20][21][22]}

In 1247, Roger's too strict rule of Galloway incited a revolt. His castle was besieged and, deciding to make a dash for it rather than starve to death, he mounted his horse and bolted through the gates with a few followers. They cut their way through the enemy lines and rode all the way to the Scottish court, where King Alexander came to his aid, punished the rebels and restored the earl's authority.^[1]

In 1252 there was confirmation of Roger's right to a moiety of the liberties of the honour of Leicester which had been granted by King John to Robert, Earl of Leicester (of whom his mother was co-heir).^[23]

"In the parliament of Oxford of 1258 he was one of the twelve elected by the 'community' to attend the three annual parliaments and exercise the rights of parliament. He was further elected one of the twenty-four commissioners to treat of aid to the king (Annals of Burton, i. 449–50), and was one of the witnesses to the king's confirmation of the acts of the council (ib. p. 456). When Richard of Cornwall was returning from Germany early in 1259, Earl Roger, in company with Walter, bishop of Worcester, and others, on behalf of the barons met him at St. Omer, and forbade him to cross over to England until he had sworn to observe the provisions of Oxford. After eleven days of dispute they obtained a satisfactory guarantee (Wykes, iv. 121–2)."^[15]

Arms

The arms of Roger de Quincy are described as "Gules, seven mascules conjoined, three, three, and one, or."^[24]

Professor Salisbury, Family Memorials (1885), page 308, reports that Roger de Quincy assumed the device of the seven mascules and goes on to explain that "it appears that the descendants of the younger sons of Saher de Quincy were very numerous, and, as the lands and property were divided, they went into different employments, and became part of the yeomanry of England, but yet carefully retained the arms, and the tradition of their Norman descent." This may explain the use of this device by the Quincys of Massachusetts to this day.^[25]

According to Richard Thomson in An Historical Essay on the Magna Charta of King John, these arms were borne by Ferrers of Groby,^[26] who were descendants of William de Ferrers, a younger son of Margaret de Quincy and William de Ferrers, 5th Earl of Derby.

Sources

1. ↑ ^{1.00 1.01 1.02 1.03 1.04 1.05 1.06 1.07 1.08 1.09 1.10 1.11 1.12 1.13 1.14} Richardson, Douglas. Royal Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families, 5 vols., ed. Kimball G. Everingham (Salt Lake City, Utah: the author, 2013), vol. IV, pages 446-449, QUINCY #7.
2. ↑ ^{2.0 2.1} Wikipedia: Roger de Quincy, 2nd Earl of Winchester.
3. ↑ Roger de Quincy, entry in Charles Cawley's Medieval Lands: A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, © Foundation for Medieval Genealogy & Charles Cawley 2000-2018, accessed 10 April 2019
4. ↑ Wikipedia calls her Helen. Marriage date of about 1221 is based on the birth years in the WikiTree profiles of their daughters (1222, 1223) and her estimated birth year of 1204.
5. ↑ Alan of Galloway, daughter, entries in Cawley's database (see MedLands). The WikiTree profile Alice de Lacy is attached as Ellen of Galloway's mother as of 20 October 2018. Alice's profile notes debate about Ellen's mother, and says (in part) that "Douglas [Richardson]'s pointing to the descent of the Manor of Kippax as proof of his 1st wife's ancestry" is why the profile for a Lacy daughter is attached as Ellen's mother. It also says that "Alex Stewart names her Alice, according to Hans Vogels, in an e-mail." (Lacy-878, accessed 20 Oct. 2018)
6. ↑ ^{6.0 6.1} About 14 years after Margaret de Quincy married William de Ferrers, 5th Earl of Derby, her father Roger de Quincy married as his third wife Eleanor de Ferrers, the daughter of William de Ferrers, 5th Earl of Derby, by his first wife Sybil Marshal, the daughter of William Marshal. Margaret de Quincy was Roger's daughter by his first wife, Ellen of Galloway. (Royal Ancestry, Volume II, pages 561-564 FERRERS #7.)
7. ↑ Elizabeth de Quincy and Hugh de Neville were "betrothed by contract dated Feb. 1240/1.... It is uncertain if this marriage ever took place." (Royal Ancestry, Volume II, page 3 BUCHAN #8). In Richardson's earlier work, Magna Carta Ancestry, Volume I, page 150 BEAUMONT #3. (Google Book online), he noted that the "marriage subsequently ended in divorce about 1256."
8. ↑ 'Close Rolls, August 1252', in Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry III: Volume 7, 1251-1253, ed. A E Stamp (London, 1927), pp. 133-152, British History Onlne, accessed 23 October 2021
9. ↑ Royal Ancestry, Volume II, pages 561-564 FERRERS #7.
10. ↑ 'Close Rolls, December 1252', in Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry III: Volume 7, 1251-1253, ed. A E Stamp (London, 1927), pp. 285-299, British History Online, accessed 23 October 2021
11. ↑ '1253, membranes 20, 19, 18, 17, 16, 15, 14, 13, 12, 11, 10', in Calendar of Patent Rolls, Henry III: Volume 4, 1247-1258, ed. H C Maxwell Lyte (London, 1908), pp. 160-195, British History Online, entry for 20 January 1253, accessed 5 October 2021
12. ↑ Datafield had "(bur.) Church of St. Peter's & St. James, Brackley, Northamptonshire, England" but I couldn't find support for that in the text or sources I could access. Death in England is assumed. ~ Noland-165, 20 October 2018
13. ↑ 'Inquisitions Post Mortem, Henry III, File 31', in Calendar of Inquisitions Post Mortem: Volume 1, Henry III, ed. J E E S Sharp (London, 1904), pp. 184-192, entry 587, British History Online, accessed 5 October 2021
14. ↑ Calendar of inquisitions post mortem and other analogous documents preserved in the Public Record Office by Great Britain. Public Record Office; Kirby, J. L. (John Lavan); White, Andrew Dickson, 1832-1918. available at Archive.org.
15. ↑ ^{15.0 15.1} William Hunt, Dictionary of National Biography, Vol. 47, subentry for Roger de Quincy (WikiSource)
16. ↑ Henry III Fine Rolls Project, 6 HENRY III (28 October 1221–27 October 1222), web, accessed 5 October 2021
17. ↑ Henry III Fine Rolls Project, Fine Roll C 60/34, 19 HENRY III (1234–1235), entries 136 and 137, web, accessed 5 October 2021
18. ↑ 'Close Rolls, June 1232', in Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry III: Volume 2, 1231-1234, ed. H C Maxwell Lyte (London, 1905), pp. 66-81, British History Online, accessed 23 October 2021
19. ↑ 'Close Rolls, February 1235', in Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry III: Volume 3, 1234-1237, ed. H C Maxwell Lyte (London, 1908), pp. 45-54, British History On;ine, accessed 23 October 2021
20. ↑ 'Close Rolls, March 1235', in Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry III: Volume 3, 1234-1237, ed. H C Maxwell Lyte (London, 1908), pp. 54-68, British History Online, accessed 23 October 2021
21. ↑ 'Close Rolls, December 1236', in Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry III: Volume 3, 1234-1237, ed. H C Maxwell Lyte (London, 1908), pp. 399-408, British History Online, accessed 23 October 2021
22. ↑ 'Close Rolls, September 1237', in Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry III: Volume 3, 1234-1237, ed. H C Maxwell Lyte (London, 1908), pp. 491-499, British Hidtory Online, accessed 23 October 2021
23. ↑ '1252, membranes 14, 13, 12, 11, 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1', in Calendar of Patent Rolls, Henry III: Volume 4, 1247-1258, ed. H C Maxwell Lyte (London, 1908), pp. 122-155, British History Online, accessed 5 October 2021], entry for 6 August 1252, subscription required
24. ↑ A.C. Fox-Davies: A Complete Guide to Heraldry, London, 1909, page 147, available here.
25. ↑ Salisbury, Edward E. Family Memorials: A Series of Genealogical and Biographical Monographs. (private printer, 1885). Vol. I, page 308. Not available online (vol. II is available online and starts at page 375).
26. ↑ Richard Thomson, An Historical Essay on the Magna Charta of King John (London, 1829), p XXIII; available at Archive.org.

• Richardson, Douglas. Magna Carta Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families, 4 vols., ed. Kimball G. Everingham. 2nd edition. (Salt Lake City, UT: the author, 2011). See also WikiTree's source page for Magna Carta Ancestry.
• Richardson, Douglas. Royal Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families, 5 vols., ed. Kimball G. Everingham. (Salt Lake City, UT: the author, 2013). See also WikiTree's source page for Royal Ancestry.

See also:

• Richardson, Douglas. Magna Carta Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families, 2nd edition, 4 vols., ed. Kimball G. Everingham (Salt Lake City, Utah: the author, 2011), vol. III, pages 412-414, QUINCY #2.
• Phillimore, W.P.W and Fry, George S. Abstracts of Gloucestershire Inquisitiones Post Mortem Returned Into the Court of Chancery (British Record Society, London, 1893) Part IV. 20 Henry III. to 29 Edward I. 1236-1300, page 48
• Calendar of Inquisitions Post Mortem and Other Analogous Documents preserved in the Public Record Office (H.M. Stationery Office, London, 1904) Vol. 1: Henry III., Page 187-8: #587. Page 233: #732.

• Page 254-8: #776. Roger de Quency alias de Quincy, sometime Earl of Winchester. "...Roger de Leyburn and Eleanor his wife hold as dower of the said Eleanor, of the inheritance of Roger de Quency late her husband, in order that Margaret de Ferariis, countess of Derby, Ellen, late the wife of Alan la Zouche, and Alexander Comyn, earl of Buchan (Bochan), and Elizabeth his wife, the co-heirs of the said Roger ... 14 Oct. 55 Hen. III."

• Sir Roger de Quincy, 2nd Earl of Winchester, Constable of Scotland, "Our Royal, Titled, Noble, and Commoner Ancestors and Cousins" (website, compiled by Mr. Marlyn Lewis, Portland, OR; accessed 20 October 2018)
• Weis, Frederick Lewis.The Magna Charta Sureties, 1215, 4th ed. (with Additions and Corrections by Walter Lee Sheppard, Jr., M. S.; 1971).
• Weis, Frederick Lewis. Ancestral Roots of Sixty Colonists Who Came to New England. 6th ed. (Baltimore, MD: Genealogical Publishing Co. 1988).
• Roger de Quincy - Seals of the Earl of Winchester on Ancestry.com (requires paid login).
• Thaler, David. database online, entry for Roger de Quincy.
• Robert Sewell
• Geni: Roger de Quincy (extensive biography and references).
• Cannon and Griffith. The Oxford Illustrated History of the British Monarchy.
• Simpson, Grant G. An Anglo-Scottish Baron of the Thirteenth century: the Acts of Roger de Quincy Earl of Winchester and Constable of Scotland (unpublished PhD Thesis, Edinburgh, 1963).
• Complete Peerage, vol. 12 pt. 2 p. 753, 934, vol. 2 p. 199
• The Battle Abbey Roll, vol. 1, p. 26, vol. 3, p. 47-49, 87
• The Roll of Battle Abbey, p. 93-94
• Doomsday Book, p. 7
• Notes and Queries 5s, vol. 2 p. 129, 171
• Dugdale's Baronage of England, vol. 1 p. 686-88
• Peerage of the British Isles 1883, p. 447
• For additional information about early baronies, see the top-level category page Early English Feudal Baronies. Individual category pages (links below) should include information specific to the category.

Acknowledgements

Click the Changes tab to see edits to this profile. Thank you to everyone who contributed to this profile.

Thank you to Carol McDonald for sharing information she found in State records.

Magna Carta Project

This profile was re-reviewed and approved for the Magna Carta Project by Thiessen-117 29 December 2019.

Roger de Quincy is the son of Magna Carta Surety Baron Saher de Quincy and is in trails badged by the Magna Carta Project to the following Gateway Ancestors:

• Robert Abell (MCA I:1-2 ABELL): badged in September 2017. See the trail HERE.
• Dannett Abney (2 trails): badged November 2015 and June 2022. See the trails HERE.
• Batte Gateways (Henry, Thomas and William) (MCA III:114-123 MALLORY): trail badged Oct 2022. See the trail HERE.
• John Baynard: badged 3 July 2021. See the trail HERE.
• Thomas Bressey (MCA I:309-313 BRESSEY): badged 22 April 2020. See the trail HERE.
• Obadiah Bruen (MCA I:331-333 BRUEN): badged 27 February 2021. See the trail HERE.
• Bulkeley Gateways (Peter, Martha, and Elizabeth): badged 2015; re-reviewed Feb 2020. See the trail HERE.
• Jeremy Clarke: badged in 2016. See the trail HERE.
• Saint Leger Codd: connected to existing trail badged in 2015. See the trails HERE.
• Elizabeth Covert (MCA I:555-559 COVERT): badged in 2015 and re-reviewed in March 2020. This trail can be seen HERE.
• Margaret Domville: does not appear Magna Carta Ancestry, but see this post: soc.genealogy.medieval. Trail was developed and badged in Jul 2020 and can be seen HERE.
• Eltonhead Gateways (sisters Jane, Agatha, Eleanor, Martha and Alice) (MCA II:118-123 ELTONHEAD): developed and badged in July 2020. See the trail HERE.
• John Fisher: badged in 2015 and re-reviewed in April 2020. See the trail HERE.
• Katherine Hamby (MCA II:329-331 HAMBY): trail badged Nov 2022 HERE.
• Elizabeth Haynes: badged January 2022. See the trail HERE.
• Warham Horsmanden: badged May 2020. See the trail HERE.
• Thomas James: badged 2015 with his mother wrongly as Gateway; re-reviewed Feb 2020. See trail HERE (Bulkeley).
• Agnes Mackworth (MCA III:91-93 MACKWORTH): badged March 2022. See the trail HERE.
• Mallory Gateways (Roger and Thomas) (MCA III:114-123 MALLORY): trail badged Oct 2022. See the trail HERE. Also see Batte, above.
• Manwaring Gateways (Oliver and Mary) (MCA III:126-129 MANWARING): badged in Feb 2015 and needs re-review. See the trail HERE.
• Elizabeth Marshall: badged May 2020. See the trail HERE.
• Nelson Gateways (John and Margaret): badged in 2015 and 2016 and need re-review. See the trail HERE.
• Anne Skipwith: badged in July 2014, needs re-review. See the trail HERE.
• Elizabeth St John: badged 2015; re-reviewed Feb 2020. See the trail HERE (Bulkeley).
• Katherine St Leger: badged 2015. See the trail HERE.
• John Stockman (MCA IV:107-111 STOCKMAN): badged January 2023. See the trail HERE.
• James Taylor: badged Feb 2021. See the trail HERE.
• Torrey Gateways (William and Samuel) (MCA II:376-380 HAVILAND): badged in May 2022. See this trail HERE.
• Olive Welby: badged 2015; re-reviewed Feb 2020. See trail HERE (Bulkeley).
• Mary Wolseley (MCA IV:362-365 WOLSELEY): badged June 2022. See trail HERE.
• Amy Wyllys (MCA IV: 386-388 WYLLYS): badged 7 April 2021. See trail: HERE.

Roger de Quincy is also in unbadged trails (needing work) to the following Gateways:

• Dannett Abney (2nd): needs development. See the trail HERE.
• Deighton Gateways (Jane, Frances, and Katherine) (MCA II:34-40 DEIGHTON): trail has not yet been developed. See the trail HERE.
• John Fenwick: trail to Quincy needs development. See the trail HERE.
• Humphrey Gateways (Daniel, Benjamin, Rebecca, and Anne) (MCA III:279-281 OWEN): trail has not yet been developed and is set out HERE.
• Owen Gateways (Rebecca, Joshua and Elizabeth) (MCA III:279-281 OWEN): trail has not yet been developed and is set out HERE.
• Thomas Rudyard (MCA III:461-465 RUDYARD): trail has not yet been developed and can be seen HERE.
• Mary Johanna Somerset (MCA IV:38-55 SOMERSET): trail needs development. See the trail HERE.
• Washington Gateways (John and Lawrence) (MCA IV:293-295 WASHINGTON): needs development. See the trail HERE.

See Base Camp for more information about Magna Carta trails. See the project's glossary for project-specific terms, such as a "badged trail".