Cyril Holland son of Oscar Wilde Killed 1918

Does anyone have any details on the military career of Cyril Holland. I believe he was killed in 1918. I checked the CWGC and I cannot find him there.

Much appreciated,

David Blanchard

This , undoubtedly, would be Lieut. C.T.T. Holland , of 33rd Bde. Royal Field Artillery, who died 9th May, 1915, and is buried at Fleurbaix.

Dave

Lieutenant C T T HOLLAND 33 Brigade RFA.

KIA 9.5.1915 Buried at Rue-du-Bois Military Cemetery FLEURBAIX.

Best wishes

Sotonmate

[Thanks guys obviously had the wrong year,

Regards

David

I was in contact with the grandaughter of Cyril Hollands servent a few years ago, Albert Barnett

He was supposed to have pulled the mortally wounded Cyril from an advanced trench where he had been sniping at germans (but they obviously got him instead).

Hi David,

Both Cyril and his younger brother Vyvyan served in France. Cyril was shot through the head by a sniper at Neuve Chapelle on the 9th May 1915

he is listed on CWGC...here. His entry on SDGW shows him as Captain.

This could be his MIC...here

cheers, Jon

David

I havn't checked the facts yet, but I believe that Oscar had another son, "Vivian", there is a Vivian Ernest Holland, on CWGC, Died 8/11/18. What bad luck! I don't know, off hand, if this is a relation, but if so, it could account for the 1918 issue.

Howard

Howard, Vyvyan survived the war and died in 1967,

cheers, Jon

Thanks again for all your help,

Regards

David

Hi David,

Something strange, the epitaph on Cyril's grave is

"Beloved Only Son of the Late Colonel TREVENEN HOLLAND. CB

At Rest"

How to explain it ?

Send me a PM if you want the photo.

Regards.

Pierre

Hello,

This doesn't seem to be the same man. Cyril had one brother, and as we know he was the son of Oscar Wilde. Unless Oscar's wife re-married the Late Colonel TREVENEN HOLLAND....

Are you sure this is right grave, as the one below?:

Name: HOLLAND

Initials: C T T

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Lieutenant

Regiment/Service: Royal Field Artillery

Unit Text: 33rd Bde.

Date of Death: 09/05/1915

Additional information: Eldest son of playwright and poet Oscar Wilde, and Constance Lloyd Wilde, later Holland.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: II. C. 12.

Cemetery: RUE-DU-BOIS MILITARY CEMETERY, FLEURBAIX

Regards

David

Hello David,

Could you send me a email address, mine is on my website,

I'll send you the photo of the grave, I have been at Fleurbaix this afternoon.

Best Wishes.

Pierre

This entry:-

"However, he had apparently not developed his homosexuality and in 1884 he married Constance Lloyd and had two sons, Cyril, born in June 1885, who died in World War I, and Vyvyan, born in November 1886, who became a writer using the surname Holland."

gives the impression that Vyvyan adopted the surname Holland but that Cyril may not have?

Phil, he did.

OK! One wonders what an RFA offocer was doing sniping in a front trench.

Could Holland be this man:-

Following C. T. Hook's death, the family soon appointed a retired army officer, Lieutenant-Colonel Trevenen James Holland (1836-1910), as manager of the mill. He built Ivymeath (now the offices of the Mid-Kent Water Company) during the 1880s, but lived there for only a few years before moving to Tunbridge Wells. Nevertheless, he remained formally in charge until his death in 1910, although William Dedrick , the General Manager, effectively and efficiently ran the business, which contined to prosper, even in difficult times.

If so, he was probably much travelled:-No complete record of the artillery cast by Tewodros appears to exist. Clements Markham, the historian of the subsequent British expedition to Maqdala, states that it comprised a total of nine brass mortars, "some with neat inscriptions in Amharic", The official account of the campaign, by Trevenen Holland and Henry Hozier, suggests, however, that one or more of Tewodros's five howitzers were also of "native" make.

Colonel Holland died in 1910 and lived latterly in Tunbridge Wells. Can the photo of the grave inscription be posted? Most interesting.

Here is the photo,

Who want a larger size can ask me via my website.

Cheers.

Pierre

I think that there has been a bit of a cock up on the CWGC database front. In 2005 I checked the CWGC database and there was no mention of Cyril Holland being the child of Oscar Wilde, and I could have sworn that his burial place was given as Richebourg, in fact I asked Matt Dixon if he would take a snap of the grave for me, which he very kindly did. Clive Holland, also killed on the 9/5/1915, appears to have taken his place with Cyril being moved to Fleurbaix...very strange.

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/i...?showtopic=5034

Andy

Cyril had one brother, and as we know he was the son of Oscar Wilde. Unless Oscar's wife re-married the Late Colonel TREVENEN HOLLAND....

David

Wilde's wife Constance died in 1898 without re-marrying.

Cyril was born on 5th June 1885 and I think that I have found his entry on FREEBMD during the September quarter 1885, and as I thought he was registered as plain Cyril, no sign of middle initials T.T. Cyril had been a career officer before the war (8 years service I think), could someone with access please check the army lists?

Andy

I have checked the Times archive and have found the following:

12th May

HOLLAND - Killed in action on the 9th inst., Captain Cyril Holland, Royal Field Artillery, aged 30.

17th May

Holland - Killed in action on the 9th May, Charles Trevenen Holland, RFA., only son of the late Colonel Trevenen Holland CB, and of Mrs TrvenenHolland, Ephraim House, Tunbridge Wells.

I am absolutely certain that the CWGC database is wrong

Andy

Something amiss here.

This is a job for SuperDenham!

I presume they will have to replace the Fleurbaix stone to remove the false inscription - or though I suppose they may have transposed the graves completely but the former seems more likely.

Something amiss here.

This is a job for SuperDenham!

Hello Ian

I have PM'd the Telster...I think that its probably just a bit of an admin cock-up with the CWGC database

Andy

Hi Andy - Perhaps Cyril has liked being wrongly identified as the son of an anonymous Colonel for all these years!

That said Colonel Holland had an interesting career which included pillaging Ethiopia of early Christian manuscripts in the 1870's and running Kent's Snodland paper-mill in retirement

Hi Andy - Perhaps Cyril has liked being wrongly identified as the son of an anonymous Colonel for all these years!

That said Colonel Holland had an interesting career which included pillaging Ethiopia of early Christian manuscripts in the 1870's and running Kent's Snodland paper-mill in retirement

Hello Ian

I think that the mis-identification is a bit more recent...............I can't imagine that a colonial colonel ever reduced himself to pillaging, surely he would have his man do it on his behalf.

Andy

Yes Andy, he was a Major at the time and the British Museum report is co-authored by a Captain so no doubt these 2 drank large gins while the soldiery liberated the paperwork and broke a few heads.

No doubt the Ethiopians have lodged a totally unjustified request for the stuff to be returned.