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[Film/TV] Why does Alan Moore hate “Watchmen” (2009) so much?

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r/DCcomics - [Film/TV] Why does Alan Moore hate “Watchmen” (2009) so much?
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u/Outrageous-Blue-30 avatar

He usually generally hates anything adapted from his comics, I think the only exception is an episode of the Justice League animated series adapting For the Man Who Has Everything in which he allowed his name to be inserted among the authors.

However, although I personally find it to be a generally decent transposition, talking about it with some friends they didn't like it as an adaptation either due to some changes such as the fight scene at the beginning, the absence of the alien squid and Nite Owl II witnessing the death of Rorschach because according to them these are points that should not have been touched.

u/shugoran99 avatar

I remembered some stories about "For The Man Who Has Everything", and how McDuffie and maybe Bruce Timm made a point to reach out to Moore and say what their intentions for the episode were. I think they really wanted to get his blessing before they even made the episode.

And maybe that's what made the difference. Because the episode was not a purely loyal adaptation in a lot of ways.

u/azmodus_1966 avatar

Yeah, the JLU episode also completely changed the point of the story tbh.

But I guess being a children's cartoon, they couldn't have adapted Moore's critique of the political exploitation of nostalgia. So they settled for a more simplistic version of the story.

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u/Bamboominum avatar

Adding Rorschach to that list: him fighting before being arrested made him more of a Batman character than a human being, as he was in the book.

u/locuas642 avatar

I actually had a talk with someone when doomsday clock was coming out. About how the entire point of the comedian fight was that by that point he had already given up from having found out about ozymandias' plan. And that making it an actual fight takes from that.

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Why wouldn't he. The movie glorifies everything the comic criticizes. It feels made by someone who only saw the drawings and didn't read it and was like "woah superheroes fucking and killing cool rad bro!"

u/locuas642 avatar

It's that one Simpsons joke with Alan Moore doing a cameo lol

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He hates everything derived from his work generally.

u/kylepm avatar

He hates everything derived from his work generally.

Except beards

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He hates that DC did it because they swiped the rights to it from him. In his opinion anyway.

Oh he has been stabbed on the back so many times it’s horrific.

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u/immigrantsmurfo avatar

Moore doesn't really like anything that's come out of his work besides an episode of the Justice League.

To be fair, there also isn't really much that does a great job at adapting any of this work I don't think. But Watchmen is a particularly bad adaptation, it totally misses the point that Moore was trying to make. It's a deconstruction of the superhero genre and Snyder is a seemingly nice and decent bloke but I think he's a bit of a dumbass. He appears to only really have adapted the cool imagery of the novel and not understood that Moore was saying something more to the effect of no this isn't cool it's ridiculous and stupid and ultimately dangerous.

After Rebel Moon, I don't think anyone is going to take him seriously. Two just absolutely horrific and boring movies.

u/DementiaPrime avatar

Well the big one is if you look just a little then you'll see he hates DC/WB in general and suits on all their adaption of his work. Of all his work the only thing he has been positive about is Superman For the Man Who Has Everything.

u/Inside_Painter1697 avatar

He doesn’t hate it.

Imagine making a masterpiece that took years and I mean years of hard work to create a graphic volume.

Unexpectedly, your graphic novel becomes the greatest, most well received and most sold graphic novel.

Then, instead of reaping the awards, getting the recognition you deserve: you lose all ownership, and you don’t get the money you deserve.

Imagine a master piece of your own creation is stolen from you to benefit others that had nothing to do with its creation.

Ok are you done imagining. Now you know why.

u/proesito avatar

Add that they use the rights they took from you to create an adaptation that destroy everything you built because the director is an edgy teen that didnt understood your piece.

u/Inside_Painter1697 avatar

That too lol

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Edited

No one answers the question. What I gathered is that, first the movie radically changed the ending, changing the morale of the whole story completely. Second, the characters do a lot of bullet-time which is at the opposite of how Moore imagined them. The owl doing a punch in bullet-time is probably how he sees himself doing it, cool, heroic. But those characters are everything but. Or at least they're not supposed to be portrayed as cool as they are in the movie. I'm talking about the Owl, Silk Spectre and the Comedian specifically. Even Ozymandias in one scene, those who have seen it know what scene. It's not just the bullet-time shots, there are a couple shots where you see them pose for the camera. That would irritate Moore soooo much I think lol.

He hates almost every adaptation of his work

He hates superhero movies in general

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u/MrMalredo avatar

I mean the movie is dull and Snyder directs it like a superhero movie and not the mystery where the characters happen to wear costumes, which it is.

But that's not the reason Alan Moore hates it since he allegedly has never seen it (or most of adaptions of his work), it's because he's a very grumpy man who seems to enjoy being grumpy.

u/FightingDreamer9 avatar

Basically because Snyder read Watchmen and change most of the things that makes the story unique. It’s like the comic tries to talk you about Jews and how they viewed the nazis (meaning from their perspective they’re the bad guys) and then Snyder saw this story and makes the nazis the heroes. That’s exactly the opposite point Snyder for gods sake! Like Rorschach is meant to be a creep who may be right about making an stand for the ozymandias’ lies but is totally wrong about everything else like his view on women, government and so, but the movie make him cool and forget all the issues of someone like him in order to let Snyder jerk off thinking about how great he is.

To be fair, there's a whole lot of things in appendix in the graphic novel that are not included in the movie (the whole rorschach psychic evaluation, for instance).

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u/Kevinmld avatar

He got screwed out of the rights to watchmen in his view.

But also the movie isn’t that good so…

u/_N1T3N_ avatar

bc it's ass

Edited

Because he disavows all his works from DC and everything that stems from it. He doesn't bother to watch them...but even if he did, Im sure he'd still hate it. He wrote a masterpiece for the medium it was born in. Want meant to be anything else as it defeated the purpose...so he's not going to be happy about it.

That said, and while nothing will ever compare to the gr. novel, the movie was a fantastic adaptation. Those who say it sux don't understand a thing. It's a movie. Meant to be visual. You always have the book for something deeper. And While the original octopus ending would have been great, the movie chose to ground it a little more in reality. Remember this was all pre-MCU days...audiences weren't conditioned yet to crazy, gonzo, comic stupidities.

u/Hidden-Squid1216 avatar

Cause it sucks monkey balls

u/LuthorCock avatar

I really liked it this movie. don't know why it gets so much hate

Edited

Unpopular opinion #1: I prefer the 2009 Watchmen ending over the original comic book, where Ozymandias' plan is about Doctor Manhattan blowing up New York and not a giant alien squid monster.

Unpopular opinion #2: Watchmen is Zack Snyder's best movie, followed by Dawn of the Dead.

Unpopular opinion #3: Moore may complain as much as he wants, but the movies based on V for Vendetta (2006) and Watchmen are... great, actually.

[EDIT] For the record, I'm not saying that the Watchmen movie is overall better than the comic. Of course the comic is much superior (the same goes for V for Vendetta). Just that I prefer the movie final plot twist than the one we see in the comic.

Hard agree on the last two. No opinion on the first one since I haven't watched it but honestly sounds like a tighter narrative.

It's a decent movie! But I haven't seen the extended "Snyder cut" that runs almost 4 hours and include the Tales of the Black Freighter in animated format. I think that would be a little tiresome.

Weed is legal in my state, so I can go for four hours.

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u/NomadNuka avatar

The ending to the movie defeats the purpose though! The idea was that humanity needed a common enemy they could rally together against. Doctor Manhattan however is a known and feared asset of the United States, something that wouldn't exactly unite the Soviets and US even if the American super weapon went rogue...

I like the idea that a creature that humanity was conditioned to see as a god had turned their backs on them and is now attacking mankind. Maybe it's a flawed plan, but Doctor Manhattan is a menace so big that the Soviets and the US would have no choice but to unite to try to protect themselves. The squid alien thing always seemed such a random idea for an universe where it wasn't established that if aliens exist or not (also, scientists researching the squid would soon find out that this thing isn't exactly alien in origin...).

It's a much more emotionally satisfying ending, especially because we the audience and the people from that universe already know Manhattan, but nowhere in the movie or comic is established that there are intelligent life outside of Earth, so it seems like a random idea for me. It would be kinda if a "serious" and un-fantasy-like political drama about, I dunno, Vietnam or World War II suddenly threw some aliens in there.

u/NomadNuka avatar

The whole point is that it was random. It wasn't something that could be predicted by design. And I really don't think Manhattan apparently going rogue against his own country and then fucking off into space again would do much. The implication for the comic is that Veidt's plan is temporary at best even, but I can't imagine the film's would work even that well.

The squid it was random for the people in the universe. Problem is, it was also random for the audience. It would be like if in Lord of the Rings suddenly Sauron opened a black hole from which some alien species from other planet would come out in spaceships and help him in the battle against the Middle Earth. It wasn't earned. So the Manhattan ending, even if imperfect, is more emotionally impactful because we already know him, we the audience know he exists in that reality and that the people living on it consider him a god, so a god that lives and breathes (ok, maybe doesn't breathe, lol) among the common person turning on them is more emotionally resonant.

This is why I prefer the Manhattan ending over the squid: it's more emotionally impactful for the audience and the characters.

But I know it's an unpopular opinion, I might be the only one who thinks like this.

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u/Randy_Chaos avatar

He never watched it...plus, it sucks.

He boycotted it?

u/Randy_Chaos avatar

After one adaptation,he stopped watching them. He doesn't take money for them either. He asks his share be given to the artist. He prefers his name being taken off them too, but I don't think they listen to him on that.

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