Cold summers, thick fog, and beautiful views. Welcome to the subreddit for the gorgeous City by the Bay! San Francisco, California, USA.
Heading to a work conference next month in San Francisco. It’s always been one of my favorite cities. However, I haven’t been in about 5 years. A lot of friends and coworkers have told me how bad it’s gotten over the past 2-3 years. I always chalked that up to people being unfamiliar with the city and California in general (I live and work in Texas unfortunately). It’s always been one of my favorite cities in the world. I am very familiar with BART and loved exploring all the different neighborhoods. Mission is one of my favorite places to walk around in all my travels. I plan on utilizing to BART to explore quite extensively as I am very familiar with it.
But I’m curious, from people who aren’t biased, and people who actually live there. What’s it like now?
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The nice parts are very nice, the gritty bits are rather horrifying. But mostly to look at - I walk past homeless encampments downtown unscathed, but watching carefully where I step :/ I'm not harassed or harmed when doing so, it's just that filth and homelessness and open-air drug use is very depressing. I assume extra depressing for the homeless drug users themselves :/
There are 3 areas that are much worse than 5 years ago (SOMA, TL, Mid market). Overall there is more homelessness but I find areas are completely safe, including the mission. If you avoid those 3 areas your trip should be fine.
SOMA and TL went from bad to apocalyptic.
Other than that, same SF. Slightly thinner retail options and less overall fun than pre-pandemic.
TL really wasn’t that bad when I went a month ago (during the day of course). There were community ambassadors from Urban Alchemy on every single street, dozens of porta poties so actually very little shit on the street, a bunch of new murals and “tenderloin community” stuff. On most streets I saw the addicts and homeless kept to one side of the street, whereas before i remember them being on both sides of the sidewalk on both sides of the street. Don’t get me wrong, still horrible, but I’ve seen it worse around 2019 I think. Not sure about 5 years ago, though.
Thinner doesn't really cut it. 50% of businesses closed due to covid and many store fronts were closed prior to the pandemic. Certain neighborhoods have many empty retail store fronts that used to be bustling.
Diminished retail options then?
It's bounced back here in the avenues, but not fully. Might be worse elsewhere no doubt.
Yeah definitely situational. 9th and Judah doesn't feel like there's been any change, but parts of the Mission, Castro, Hayes, Haight...they just have lots of empty space. Haven't been to Geary street or Japantown in a long time, but from what I hear those two were hit hard. As was Chinatown.
People were saying the same shit 5 years ago. It's as true now as it was then.
No they weren't.
They were also saying it 10, 15, 20 and more years ago.
I was here, and they absolutely were.
It's not even difficult to go back and see for yourself from this subreddit if you really want to.
get the source. no one I was talking to was going back to 1980.
I'll wait for link.
You want me to find a "source" for my personal conversations with people? Really? Keep waiting, mate.
Also you think 1980 was 5 years ago? Are you Marty McFly?
Some parts are crappy just like other cities . Just be careful where you go
There was a video posted the other day to this sub of a gentleman walking down a street in the Mission when two assailants jumped out of a car, pointed a gun in his face, and took his iphone.
I’ve lived here 13 years (admittedly not a local). The phone theft thing is normal. Guns pointed in face for petty crime is new to me in last few years. If you are walking, I recommend not focusing on your phone. Or take Uber.
One other thing that's changed in the last 5 years, although I don't think it's SF-specific: I see a lot more drivers blowing through stop signs and red lights without looking. One almost hit me with a stroller right by Precita Park.
SFPD only gives out 10% of the traffic tickets they gave out 10 years ago.
To answer your post’s question: no it hasn’t gotten THAT bad. I find there’s less people and I get better service. If you come at this with a trauma-informed lens and start asking what happened to San Francisco and it’s people and not what’s wrong with the city and it’s people - you’ll find people use this city for all its glory and then leave. Many of us have stayed from boom to bust but we all take and give back. Most of the people who are gone and talk shit about our city lived here within the last decade and probably stayed here a max of 5 years. That’s my guess. Be present and admire our hills and openness. Those haven’t changed.
There are about 5 guys who repost every crime they hear about. Most of them don't even live here. So what you see on Reddit is not a fair representation of the city.
That said, the wealth disparities have indeed gotten worse. As the cost of living skyrockets, there are a lot of people in the Bay that society has abandoned, who have nowhere to turn for help.
With work from home there is far less activity downtown, which means that the homeless 'types' are more prominent in comparison.
Otherwise, it's pretty much the same.
Exactly this - the crazies are more visible in areas that were formerly busy with office workers and tourists. Other areas feel very much the same - some are more lively with closed streets and lots of outdoor dining like Valencia and Hayes Valley.
Echoing what others have said, it’s not that bad. It’s still a beautiful and fun city. Just use your street smarts like any other big city. People blow things out of proportion and context. Yes, there’s crime and homelessness, but there always has been.
It is “that bad”, to the point that Im moving
Really not that bad. BART has declined since Covid, recommend budgetting extra for lyft/uber to get around.
I live in SOMA and walk around daily. It looks the same as 5 years ago minus all the tech people that were around. Much more empty seeming and the homeless are very visible because of that. But has it gotten worse? I’m having a hard time believing the folks who don’t live SF telling me what’s going on in my neighborhood. I just don’t really see anything that surprises me at least.
Wear long sleeved outer coat to hide your watch. Don’t look like a tourist. Avoid the sketchy parts of town. We are more paranoid because of the news, more looking about and walking with more people. We hope to never get mugged.
Now remember getting this exact same advice before traveling to Barcelona, Southeast Asia…
After Covid and this stressful economy which place is exempt and can feel unscathed.
You will have to see and find our for yourself.
Please report back your findings.
Walk around and see it yourself.
Its just drifting back to its original state of the 1990s. SF has always been disparity
That is a load of shit.
So many carpetbaggers always say that.
"80's-90's was much worse." Yeah, in like the only neighborhood which was the Tenderloin and maybe could argue Mission was "rough" in that period.
Mission street pre 70's was vibrant Irish and Italian enclave pre BART. Once the city tore up Mission and thwarted commerce for years, along with white flight and the influx of Chicano migrants, the area became known as a "latino cultural neighborhood."
Sure, Bayview, Hunters Point and a couple other little pockets.
From my point of view there is widespread degradation of the city and most of its neighborhoods on many fronts.
"Original state..."
San Francisco's soul, as a whole, always has had an underbelly, but to say that San Francisco is returning to its 90's state is a bad take and so tired of people saying that.
Show me anytime in history in San Francisco, and during a pandemic to add, where we had more self inflicted drug overdoses in consecutive years than we did deaths to a worldwide virus?
Show me 700 overdose deaths in the 90's
Show me wide spread blight and shop closures 90's
Show me wide spread theft in the 90's
Show me muggings and car break ins in the 90's
Show me a downtown practically dead in the 90's
Show me public officials begging for a "return" in the 90's
Show me widespread "Asian Hate" in the 90's
Show me Chinatown security patrols in the 90's
Show me the art scent today that was around the 90's
I could keep going and going .
Haight was a giant shit hole also… i am not sure how old your are but i actually experienced the 90s.
The crack epidemic ravaged the bay area. The institutional racism was even stronger.
Why the name calling?
Why was rent so cheap in the past? Why were all the marginalized artists there?
I think it’s time for a mega thread of “is it safe”
The Tenderloin and SoMa have gotten worse, so don’t go there. The Mission is a mixed bag: Overall, it’s gotten worse, but there are lots of great new restaurants and bars and the area southeast of Tartine Manufactury is getting a lot nicer.
The rest of the city is arguably nicer than ever before. Since so many people are working from home, there’s been a lot more investment in the neighborhoods. Some of my favorite areas are: Bernal Heights (all of it is magical), Noe Valley (24th Street and Sanchez Street), Inner Sunset (around 9th St), Outer Sunset (area around Outerlands), Inner Richmond (Clement Street) and Potrero Hill (18th St). Chrissy Field and Golden Gate Park are amazing as ever and have a lots of new stuff. My favorite coffee shop at the moment is Neighbor’s Corner in Eureka Valley.
BART doesn’t really get you to these places. Take MUNI instead (which is more pleasant anyways) or get a Lyft/Uber.
Personally, I find that using the Lyft bikeshare ebikes is the easiest way to get around, but it’s rather expensive unless you have a Lyft Pink or Baywheels membership.
In summary… if you want to look for dystopian SF, you can certainly find it. The other 75% of the city are more amazing than ever and I love living here!
It hasn't changed much. The one thing you'll notice is how many businesses have closed. The charm of our small town hoods isn't what it used to be, this started way before covid and was accelerated by it.
You will notice more crack heads and people on the street who are dirty and stinky. There are more of them and less people who aren't on drugs and/or stinky to hide them.
Other than the many boarded up businesses and less people walking around there hasn't really been that big of a change.