Vanilla Sky 4K UHD (2001) - Page 10 - Blu-ray Forum

yetanotherone · 05-07-2024, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yetanotherone

There's supposedly a better quality European UHD.

Paramount vs "European UHD":

Though per the metadata it only goes up to 1000 nits vs 4000 for the Paramount UHD, but who knows if there is any actual difference. Both Dolby Vision (note: my screenshots do not take into account the DV layer).

I'm going to guess it's the recent Scandinavian release. I'll order it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordanwalkert

Please report back, I would gladly repurchase any Paramount UHD titles that have less DNR and higher bitrate encodes. Some of their releases have good masters but poor encodes and excessive DNR. Those screencaps of Vanilla Sky have much better grain, Paramount’s encode is only 42mbps average so a lot of room for improvement.

Done! It's the real deal. It looks much better - in fact it looks a bit too good as the compositing in the final scene now reveals its shockingly poor nature that the subpar encoding of Paramount's UHD managed to conceal a bit better by blurring the edges!

Otherwise it's identical in length, with identical English audio, and English subtitles.

Paramount:

Quote:

Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L5.1@High
HDR format : SMPTE ST 2086, HDR10 compatible
Codec ID : 36
Duration : 2 h 15 min
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth : 10 bits
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : PQ
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color pri : Display P3
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0050 cd/m2, max: 4000 cd/m2

Scandinavian:

Quote:

Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L5.1@High
HDR format : SMPTE ST 2086, HDR10 compatible
Codec ID : 36
Duration : 2 h 15 min
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth : 10 bits
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics : PQ
Matrix coefficients : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color pri : Display P3
Mastering display luminance : min: 0.0001 cd/m2, max: 1000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level : 1000 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light : 400 cd/m2

Paramount:

Code:

Disc Size:      62,646,913,838 bytes
Protection:     AACS2
Extras:         Ultra HD, BD-Java
BDInfo:         0.7.5.8

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00100.MPLS
Length:                 2:15:59.109 (h:m:s.ms)
Size:                   62,111,441,664 bytes
Total Bitrate:          60.90 Mbps

(*) Indicates included stream hidden by this playlist.

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description     
-----                   -------             -----------     
MPEG-H HEVC Video       42398 kbps          2160p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / Main 10 @ Level 5.1 @ High / 10 bits / HDR10 / BT.2020
* MPEG-H HEVC Video     10641 kbps          1080p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / Main 10 @ Level 5.1 @ High / 10 bits / Dolby Vision / BT.2020

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             English         2017 kbps       5.1 / 48 kHz /  2017 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz /  1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Dolby Digital Audio             English         640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB
Dolby Digital Audio             German          640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB
Dolby Digital Audio             French          640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB
Dolby Digital Audio             Japanese        640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         30.021 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           English         36.087 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           German          35.919 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         27.985 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         30.863 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           French          28.433 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Japanese        20.680 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           German          0.056 kbps                      
Presentation Graphics           Japanese        0.582 kbps

Scandinavian:

Code:

Disc Size:      78,205,795,858 bytes
Protection:     AACS2
Extras:         Ultra HD
BDInfo:         0.7.5.8

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00002.MPLS
Length:                 2:15:59.109 (h:m:s.ms)
Size:                   77,348,877,312 bytes
Total Bitrate:          75.84 Mbps

(*) Indicates included stream hidden by this playlist.

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description     
-----                   -------             -----------     
MPEG-H HEVC Video       67131 kbps          2160p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / Main 10 @ Level 5.1 @ High / 10 bits / HDR10 / BT.2020
* MPEG-H HEVC Video     91 kbps             1080p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / Main 10 @ Level 0 @ Main / 10 bits / Dolby Vision / BT.2020

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             English         2017 kbps       5.1 / 48 kHz /  2017 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz /  1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Dolby Digital Audio             Italian         640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB
Dolby Digital Audio             Spanish         640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB
Dolby Digital Audio             Czech           640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB
Dolby Digital Audio             Hungarian       640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz /   640 kbps / DN -31dB

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         31.857 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Italian         31.611 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         29.560 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Czech           29.731 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Hungarian       31.300 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Danish          32.173 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Swedish         30.796 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Norwegian       28.393 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Finnish         28.212 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Chinese         21.749 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Chinese         21.747 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Italian         0.226 kbps                      
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         0.230 kbps                      
Presentation Graphics           Hungarian       0.172 kbps

For me that I don't do DV, there's a 25Mbps difference between the two!

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiltmilk

This is interesting. Especially since also The Firm, Flashdance and Beverly Hills Cop have recently been released in the Nordic countries. At least The Firm could definitely benefit from a better encode. It will be interesting to see if there's an improvement.

Maybe I should buy The Firm next! I haven't seen the film before though.. but it looks interesting.

King O.A. · 05-07-2024, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yetanotherone

Done! It's the real deal. It looks much better - in fact it looks a bit too good as the compositing in the final scene now reveals its shockingly poor nature that the subpar encoding of Paramount's UHD managed to conceal a bit better by blurring the edges!

Where do I purchase? I love this movie.

yetanotherone · 05-07-2024, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King O.A.

Where do I purchase? I love this movie.

This store: https://imusic.co/movies/73330180295...ky-4k-ultra-hd claims to ship worldwide.

jordanwalkert · 05-07-2024, 07:38 PM

This is really great to hear. There were several titles paramount released that I felt had really disappointing encodes. I see the same company has released The Truman Show and Almost Famous, I wonder if those discs are better as well. Almost Famous had the same bit starved poor encoding, especially on the bootleg cut.

yetanotherone · 05-07-2024, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordanwalkert

This is really great to hear. There were several titles paramount released that I felt had really disappointing encodes. I see the same company has released The Truman Show and Almost Famous, I wonder if those discs are better as well. Almost Famous had the same bit starved poor encoding, especially on the bootleg cut.

Almost Famous was released in Scandinavia back in 2021 the same year as the Paramount releases, so IMO it's not going to be any different.

On the other hand, Vanilla Sky, The Firm, Truman Show are all Paramount titles that were all released last month, months or years after their worldwide counterparts. So I think there's a chance for The Firm and Truman Show to be improved similarly to Vanilla Sky.

I just ordered The Firm, because I had a good laugh when I saw how low the bitrate for the worldwide UHD is. Let's see how it turns out - and I hope I like the film too since it's going to be a blind buy!

Back to my new Vanilla Sky disc, I was watching the club scene, and its aftermath, earlier and it finally looked how it should look. Firmly 4K detail throughout and when they do close ups it looks stunning.

The disc seems to be a Paramount disc judging by its select language menu,

the length is down to the millisecond the same as Paramount's, and the audio is identical to the Paramount in bitrate too.

To me it looks like Paramount themselves redid the encode recently for future releases and Scandinavia benefited from it. But what do I know.

jordanwalkert · 05-07-2024, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yetanotherone

Almost Famous was released in Scandinavia back in 2021 the same year as the Paramount releases, so IMO it's not going to be any different.

On the other hand, Vanilla Sky, The Firm, Truman Show are all Paramount titles that were all released last month, months or years after their worldwide counterparts. So I think there's a chance for The Firm and Truman Show to be improved similarly to Vanilla Sky.

I just ordered The Firm, because I had a good laugh when I saw how low the bitrate for the worldwide UHD is. Let's see how it turns out - and I hope I like the film too since it's going to be a blind buy!

Back to my new Vanilla Sky disc, I was watching the club scene, and its aftermath, earlier and it finally looked how it should look. Firmly 4K detail throughout and when they do close ups it looks stunning.

The disc seems to be a Paramount disc judging by its select language menu,

the length is down to the millisecond the same as Paramount's, and the audio is identical to the Paramount in bitrate too.

To me it looks like Paramount themselves redid the encode recently for future releases and Scandinavia benefited from it. But what do I know.

Thank you for all of this detective work you�ve done! I probably would�ve never known these releases exist or were so significantly better than the worldwide Paramount release. It�s very satisfying finding superior versions of films and finally seeing them presented how they should be.

yetanotherone · 05-07-2024, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordanwalkert

Thank you for all of this detective work you’ve done! I probably would’ve never known these releases exist or were so significantly better than the worldwide Paramount release. It’s very satisfying finding superior versions of films and finally seeing them presented how they should be.

Indeed!

One more comparison to show the difference in close ups:

Worldwide vs Scandinavia:

Technically the worldwide release could potentially look better than my screenshot of it if they have playback capability that decodes the DV layer, but I think anyone can get the idea this is a substantial improvement no matter what.

yetanotherone · 05-07-2024, 09:02 PM

I didn't even notice this - the disc itself has on it identical UK, Irish, and German ratings, copyright date, and serial code to my older European disc. The 2 discs look 100% identical.

But, hey, maybe new pressings even in other European countries are going to be the new disc? Since it is rated for UK, etc.

jordanwalkert · 05-07-2024, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yetanotherone

Indeed!

One more comparison to show the difference in close ups:

Worldwide vs Scandinavia:

Technically the worldwide release could potentially look better than my screenshot of it if they have playback capability that decodes the DV layer, but I think anyone can get the idea this is a substantial improvement no matter what.

I'm sold! I just ordered Vanilla Sky and even took a gamble ordering The Truman Show as well, so I will report back on that one. I love that movie and the 4K is a substantial improvement over the old Blu Ray but if it's the same situation as Vanilla Sky- it can definitely look better. I'm afraid the DNR might be down to the director as his other films suffer the same fate, but I'll take a better encode or higher bitrates on any Paramount release.

James Luckard · 05-07-2024, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordanwalkert

took a gamble ordering The Truman Show as well, so I will report back on that one.

Please do, thanks!

James Luckard · 05-07-2024, 09:32 PM

Trust Paramount to bork the original release, and then silently issue a corrected version in one of the few major markets in the world that doesn't have an Amazon...

I do feel like Paramount has been pretty good about replacement programs recently, maybe it's worth contacting them and asking for corrected discs in the US, so we don't all have to buy a second copy from Scandinavia...

barrett75 · 05-07-2024, 09:43 PM

very interesting. all these titles came up in italy recently as well, distributed by plaion pictures. re: vanilla sky it looks like it's same disc as scandinavian release:

https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Vanil...lu-ray/351375/

same audio set comparing to this report:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...&postcount=181

in fact scandinavian disc has also italian language. could try buying italian release and report back... looks like in this particular case plaion did the encoding using LSP as per their tradition, in fact disc has a DV MEL instead of usual Paramount FEL... seems strange that paramount re-did the encoding not using their huge DV layer...

Sky_Captain · 05-07-2024, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yetanotherone

I didn't even notice this - the disc itself has on it identical UK, Irish, and German ratings, copyright date, and serial code to my older European disc. The 2 discs look 100% identical.

But, hey, maybe new pressings even in other European countries are going to be the new disc? Since it is rated for UK, etc.

Maybe, but Paramount have been known to mislabel their discs.

The UK release of Sonic 2 has a German ratings logo, but there's no German audio or subs on the disc.

Geoff D · Yesterday, 02:35 AM

Wow...so Plaion ARE re-encoding these after all? I mean, they need to be a newly authored disc by default because the Paramount UHD carries no Italian language support at all, right, but that they're redoing the compression is amazing. Anyone gonna take a punt on The Firm?

James Luckard · Yesterday, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barrett75

very interesting. all these titles came up in italy recently as well, distributed by plaion pictures. re: vanilla sky it looks like it's same disc as scandinavian release:

https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Vanil...lu-ray/351375/

same audio set comparing to this report:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...&postcount=181

in fact scandinavian disc has also italian language. could try buying italian release and report back... looks like in this particular case plaion did the encoding using LSP as per their tradition, in fact disc has a DV MEL instead of usual Paramount FEL... seems strange that paramount re-did the encoding not using their huge DV layer...

Wow, that's REALLY important news!

So the Italian discs are the same as these Scandinavian discs?

It's MUCH, MUCH easier to order from Italy here in the US, because Italy has an Amazon.

James Luckard · Yesterday, 06:40 AM

The difference between the Scandi and US UHDs of Vanilla Sky is STARTLING! I showed the comparison caps to a coworker today, and he instantly saw rthe difference.

The US UHD looks like a blocky, detail-free upscaled BD, but the Scandinavian one looks like a real UHD, with fine detail and grain.

GiorgioV · Yesterday, 06:56 AM

Between these Plaion releases and the Eagle Pictures' ones, it seems for once I happen to be in the right place

spiltmilk · Yesterday, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Wow...so Plaion ARE re-encoding these after all? I mean, they need to be a newly authored disc by default because the Paramount UHD carries no Italian language support at all, right, but that they're redoing the compression is amazing. Anyone gonna take a punt on The Firm?

It's SF and not Plaion in Scandinavia, so hard to tell whether it's Plaion or SF doing the re-encoding, or someone else. In any case, it must be the same disc in Scandinavia and Italy.

Like I mentioned before, there are also most likely new encodes for Flashdance, Beverly Hills Cop (1), Truman Show and The Firm, which were released at the same time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Luckard

It's MUCH, MUCH easier to order from Italy here in the US, because Italy has an Amazon.

Sweden also has Amazon.se, but you rarely find the Swedish releases there though. It's more of a Swedish storefront for Amazon.de.

yetanotherone · Yesterday, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Anyone gonna take a punt on The Firm?

Scroll up a bit

HippieDalek · Yesterday, 08:10 AM

Does the Scandinavian release have all the same special features? I never got around to picking up the UK release so might be worth importing this one. Thanks for all the detective work!

05-07-2024, 09:02 PM	#188
yetanotherone Senior Member Member since:Aug 2013	I didn't even notice this - the disc itself has on it identical UK, Irish, and German ratings, copyright date, and serial code to my older European disc. The 2 discs look 100% identical. But, hey, maybe new pressings even in other European countries are going to be the new disc? Since it is rated for UK, etc. Last edited by yetanotherone; 05-07-2024 at 09:06 PM.

05-07-2024, 09:43 PM	#192
barrett75 Expert Member Member since:Feb 2014 Location:Italy	very interesting. all these titles came up in italy recently as well, distributed by plaion pictures. re: vanilla sky it looks like it's same disc as scandinavian release: https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Vanil...lu-ray/351375/ same audio set comparing to this report: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...&postcount=181 in fact scandinavian disc has also italian language. could try buying italian release and report back... looks like in this particular case plaion did the encoding using LSP as per their tradition, in fact disc has a DV MEL instead of usual Paramount FEL... seems strange that paramount re-did the encoding not using their huge DV layer... Last edited by barrett75; 05-07-2024 at 10:05 PM.

05-07-2024, 07:38 PM	#184
jordanwalkert Expert Member Member since:Feb 2011 Location:Des Moines, Iowa Blu-ray collection:5 Trading Score:5	This is really great to hear. There were several titles paramount released that I felt had really disappointing encodes. I see the same company has released The Truman Show and Almost Famous, I wonder if those discs are better as well. Almost Famous had the same bit starved poor encoding, especially on the bootleg cut.

05-07-2024, 09:32 PM	#191
James Luckard Blu-ray Baron Top contributor Member since:Jan 2011 Location:Los Angeles, CA 4K collection:261 Blu-ray collection:1587 Blu-ray reviews: 34	Trust Paramount to bork the original release, and then silently issue a corrected version in one of the few major markets in the world that doesn't have an Amazon... I do feel like Paramount has been pretty good about replacement programs recently, maybe it's worth contacting them and asking for corrected discs in the US, so we don't all have to buy a second copy from Scandinavia...

Yesterday, 02:35 AM	#194
Geoff D Blu-ray Emperor Top contributor Member since:Feb 2009 Location:Swanage, Engerland 4K collection:1133 Blu-ray collection:2416 Blu-ray reviews: 6 Trading Score:33	Wow...so Plaion ARE re-encoding these after all? I mean, they need to be a newly authored disc by default because the Paramount UHD carries no Italian language support at all, right, but that they're redoing the compression is amazing. Anyone gonna take a punt on The Firm?

Yesterday, 06:40 AM	#196
James Luckard Blu-ray Baron Top contributor Member since:Jan 2011 Location:Los Angeles, CA 4K collection:261 Blu-ray collection:1587 Blu-ray reviews: 34	The difference between the Scandi and US UHDs of Vanilla Sky is STARTLING! I showed the comparison caps to a coworker today, and he instantly saw rthe difference. The US UHD looks like a blocky, detail-free upscaled BD, but the Scandinavian one looks like a real UHD, with fine detail and grain.

Yesterday, 06:56 AM	#197
GiorgioV Special Member Member since:Jan 2016 Location:Italy Blu-ray reviews:1 Trading Score:1	Between these Plaion releases and the Eagle Pictures' ones, it seems for once I happen to be in the right place

Yesterday, 08:10 AM	#200
HippieDalek Senior Member Top contributor Member since:Nov 2011 Location:UK 4K collection:49 Blu-ray collection:279 DVD collection:80 Blu-ray reviews:2	Does the Scandinavian release have all the same special features? I never got around to picking up the UK release so might be worth importing this one. Thanks for all the detective work!

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