....message sent

> note my location.

b.

So you have a budget of $3000 (or less). You want it to be playable and have a good setup (similar asks in my head). And I am assuming that having a well set-up, quality banjo is more important to you than the name on the headstock or fretboard.  I have one really good banjo, and while it is nice looking, what sets it apart is the quality of the craftsmanship and (especially) the tone.  

To me, playability has more to do with the setup, rather than the amount spent on the banjo. More money will get you nicer woods, high quality hardware (tone ring, tailpiece, etc.), more handwork, better craftsmanship, perhaps some bling (like fancy inlays) etc. While it is reasonable to expect the banjo to be set up correctly out of the box, that is not a given depending upon where you purchase the banjo.

Looked at Canada's version of Ebay, as well as your version of Craigslist. Not much there. I seem to remember that there might be a few banjo builders in Canada, although that information may not be current. I did a search on the Marketplace here (look on the upper left side of this page) and found some really nice used banjos in the $2-3000 range. I narrowed my search to Canada and found a couple Arcand resonator banjos and the "Second Life Banjo" website which features open back banjos.

Assuming it's legit (and it appears to be), that 1981 gold star gf100hf in the classified ads is a very functional banjo that hits all three requirements abet with some wear. $1750 leaves enough budget to go pick it up in person (although i have bought 4 banjos, a case and a neck via post).

Check the Twelfth Fret in Toronto.
They will ship to you.
They have new and used banjos.
Amazing people to deal with.
You can see there inventory on line.
Last time I looked there were some used Nechvilles and Deerings in your price range.

Well I know you haven't been reading about my "brand" but I build some pretty playable instruments...bruceberrybanjos.wordpress.com/

Be sure to follow this discussion started by a Hangout member looking to spend upwards of $2500 (US) on a high quality banjo. All the suggestions given to her apply to you. The $500 extra in your budget affords you opportunities for higher up models from the same manufacturers.

For some of those makers (Deering, Hatfield) I think the difference is mainly more bling because I believe you get the same pot. (I'm excluding the banjos that are different animals). For some makers (Huber, Sullivan) additional $$ gets different tone rings and maybe something else.

A new banjo will come you set up (well, maybe the bridge laying down and needing to be placed) IF the seller states that in its product listings. Otherwise, you may be on your own.

Is it hairsplitting to worry or obsess over missing out on banjos you should have seen or chosen? Maybe. It happens. But if you have several banjos on your could-buy list (which it seems you'll need) then you should try not to worry about choosing one vs another. It seems like you're going to need several banjos you're prepared to buy and will just have to go with one when it becomes available. Or pass if it's not high on your list and just wait.

Do I understand that it's costly to order from a US seller and bring the banjo into Canada?

Final word: Despite recent inflation it still seems to me that a budget of $3000 US lets you afford a used example from every US maker, and in some cases something higher up than their base line professional instruments.

It also buys you new instruments of all the quality import models as well as a new Hatfield Buck Creek, Deering Sierra or Eagle II, and maybe a Sullivan or Companion (about which I know nothing). 

Good luck shopping.

You don't mention what type of banjo music you are working on. Old time clawhammer? Bluegrass?

You DO NOT need to spend $3000 to get a banjo that will be pro quality and that will challenge you and inspire you.

Set up indeed determines much about the sound and feel of a banjo. An excellently made but poorly set up banjo will leave you feeling cold and puzzled. "I thought it would be much better than this!".

There is NO SUBSTITUTE for playing a lot of banjos. Take $1000 of your money that is dying to be spent and TRAVEL to try out many banjos and develop your own "feeling" for what YOU can discern between different banjos.

A banjo that truly inspires you will let you know when you play it. Ordering something from a distance is a crap shoot. One that you may find yourself repeating many times.

Most banjo players would advance a relatively small step from the beginner banjos you've been playing to an "intermediate" banjo. For bluegrass these might include Recording Kings Mod. 35 and 36. Or a Gold Star 85. Or a Gold Tone. Think "between $1000 and $1500".

Having $3000 to spend might be your worst enemy right now...

One big issue for us in Canada is the duty and customs charges buying in the U.S.
It can be very costly, plus a 35% exchange rate.

Many years ago I attended the British Columbia Bluegrass Workshop (now Nimble Fingers Music Camp) and there were plenty of Vancouver banjo players there; and they got their banjos somewhere.

I would try contacting local bluegrass groups to get information about local sources, such as the Pacific Bluegrass and Old Time Music Society pacificbluegrass.ca/

It never ends, believe me. Don't focus on buying a a new banjo with the plan that it will be the banjo you marry. You will always want that other sound that your banjo can't make - no one banjo (or set up) does it all, and your tonal pallette will change the more you play and listen.

You aren't going to really outgrow your GTS, that's not really a legitimate concern unless you have a specific context and feel like it doesn't cut it (not loud enough, doesn't have an appropriate tone). We all fall into the trap, it's easy when everyone talks about how great this or that banjo is, or calls your banjo a beginner banjo. In reality it's a great banjo and you are lucky to have one, and that won't change years from now. And you don't even know yet what tones you are capable of making with your right hand, or what different picks, bridges, etc. can do for your tone - and that isn't a criticism, that's a universal truth and part of what makes banjos fun.

All that said, I support buying another banjo if you want it! Go nuts, seriously, there isn't anything wrong with it. Just make sure it's appreciably different to your Special and know what it is - a luxury purchase that probably (hopefully!) won't be the last one you ever make.

What Dick said.

I realize I offered thoughts on spending to your max, but Dick's right that a typical, reasonable, and demonstrably superior upgrade from any Goodtime is one of the banjos he suggested: Recording King RK-35/36 or Gold Tone OB-150. These are $1100 - $1200 (US) banjos available new. I don't think Gold Star make the GF-85 any more. One from this century will probably run around $1000 used. From the 1980s, $1500 US and maybe more.

The great thing about the Recording King banjos is that the rim, tone ring, flange, and other pot hardware are the same as in their $1800 RK-Elite models.

RK, Gold Star and Gold Tone all have new banjos in the $1800-$2000 range (US), so those are other options. 

If you want an openback, look to Rickard. Canadian made and superb quality.

Apologies, I forgot in my earlier response that you are renting the GTS you are currently playing, so you are really looking for your first banjo.

I defer to the other wise responses here. Knowing you are going to want another banjo sooner or later, I concur with spending less money now. If you want a Mastertone sound the RKs are a solid choice (as discussed above).

But don't expect to be blown away from minute 1, I maintain your current rental is a solid banjo. And if you have to buy sight unseen, please buy if from someone you know will set it up well and ship it to you safely - it is easy to discount those things to save cash but they will make a pretty huge difference for you, worth spending extra on IMO.

Theresvhigh end professional quality and there highbend with historical significance.

3k limits you on the latter.

If bluegrass is what you seek, Hatfield and GT Twanger is what Id suggest for best banger for your bucks. Gibson has the RB250 and newer RBs with a tone hoop.

Don't be afraid to buy a used banjo. You can get a lot more for your money than buying a brand-new one. Start with the classified ads on here. Most of the people who list banjos for sale here know what they have, know how to take care of an instrument, and know how to pack one for shipping.

Assuming you are looking for a Bluegrass banjo, there are 96 banjos in the classified ads that are within your price range.

Theres a really good place here in the states. You can call him and he is really good at helping you to figure out which one is right for you. He also ships all over the world. All banjos there are professionally set up and the price range you are talking about you usually get a free hardcase and a bunch of other cool s***. His name is Ross Nickerson and the website is:
banjoteacher.com/
and, no, I am not a shill for him..he just has been real helpful and very knowledgeable

I will echo what others have said. Play as many as you can get your hands on. I don't know how many (15?) I played before I found my Nechville. Some I found at shops, others I bought and resold (easier in the US).
Used is a great way to go, but you need to be careful with the setup and make sure it is good.
As far as improving playing? It could. My Banjo has a wider than the typical bluegrass finger board and it is radiused. I find it more comfortable than a standard fingerboard. I did not know that going into my search.
I did own at least 5 for an extended period of time before I let someone else be their caretakers. I needed time to mull them over a bit, I guess.

* is the playability automatically better with a higher end instrument?

NO! Just my personal experience, but if you play outside in the hot summer, or have sweaty hands, beware of the glossy necks. My first high end banjo was a Deering Calico, and the second there was any hand moisture, I stuck to that neck like maple syrup. I used several slick neck products, and baby powder etc, and it just made a sloppy gross mess of everything. I got rid of that banjo, and never missed it.

I can also mention that the playability of your goodtime is very good. I started with one, and wore out the frets, and had a refret. With proper fret dressing, and rounding the edge of the fretboard, it had the sweetest neck I ever played. I ended up giving the banjo to a student, but have always missed it. Over the years I owned and played 3 professional level banjos. All great, but never as slick as that old well worn Goodtime. Now I'm old and retired, don't play out anymore, with an aching back... and playing a Goodtime again. I watched some YouTube videos, got some fret files and emery pads... and after about 4 hours of elbow grease... oh baby, I have a dream neck again. So basically just saying don't expect any earth shattering playability out of a high end banjo. It will be great, but don't expect it to blow the GTS away.

quote:

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Originally posted by From The Basement

Check the Twelfth Fret in Toronto.
 

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FTB, thanks for the tip, I've had a look at their website and contacted them - Shane is going to keep an eye out. Apparently they don't have as many banjos in stock as their website shows - it's "out of date" according to Shane. 

Cheers!

quote:

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Originally posted by Bruce Berry Banjos

Well I know you haven't been reading about my "brand" but I build some pretty playable instruments...bruceberrybanjos.wordpress.com/

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Thank you for the heads up - you're on my list now. 

-RF

quote:

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Originally posted by The Old Timer

You don't mention what type of banjo music you are working on. Old time clawhammer? Bluegrass?

You DO NOT need to spend $3000 to get a banjo that will be pro quality and that will challenge you and inspire you.

Set up indeed determines much about the sound and feel of a banjo. An excellently made but poorly set up banjo will leave you feeling cold and puzzled. "I thought it would be much better than this!".

There is NO SUBSTITUTE for playing a lot of banjos. Take $1000 of your money that is dying to be spent and TRAVEL to try out many banjos and develop your own "feeling" for what YOU can discern between different banjos.

A banjo that truly inspires you will let you know when you play it. Ordering something from a distance is a crap shoot. One that you may find yourself repeating many times.

Most banjo players would advance a relatively small step from the beginner banjos you've been playing to an "intermediate" banjo. For bluegrass these might include Recording Kings Mod. 35 and 36. Or a Gold Star 85. Or a Gold Tone. Think "between $1000 and $1500".

Having $3000 to spend might be your worst enemy right now...

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Thanks for your reply, your recommended approach is definitely the preferred one - trying many before buying, and perhaps lowering my sights. Impatient lad that I am, I was hoping for a quicker result, but I'll tap the brake pedal a little. :-)

quote:

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Originally posted by Patrick1962

Theres a really good place here in the states. You can call him and he is really good at helping you to figure out which one is right for you. He also ships all over the world. All banjos there are professionally set up and the price range you are talking about you usually get a free hardcase and a bunch of other cool s***. His name is Ross Nickerson and the website is:
banjoteacher.com/
and, no, I am not a shill for him..he just has been real helpful and very knowledgeable

 There's a wealth of banjo-related establishments in the US, up here in the cold country we're not so fortunate. Thank you for the link!

quote:

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Originally posted by aaronoble

Many years ago I attended the British Columbia Bluegrass Workshop (now Nimble Fingers Music Camp) and there were plenty of Vancouver banjo players there; and they got their banjos somewhere.

I would try contacting local bluegrass groups to get information about local sources, such as the Pacific Bluegrass and Old Time Music Society pacificbluegrass.ca/

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I've lived here a _long_ time and never heard of them before. I'll drop into the Anza Club before June for a jam! Thank you. 

quote:

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Originally posted by Old Hickory

Be sure to follow this discussion started by a Hangout member looking to spend upwards of $2500 (US) on a high quality banjo. All the suggestions given to her apply to you. The $500 extra in your budget affords you opportunities for higher up models from the same manufacturers.

For some of those makers (Deering, Hatfield) I think the difference is mainly more bling because I believe you get the same pot. (I'm excluding the banjos that are different animals). For some makers (Huber, Sullivan) additional $$ gets different tone rings and maybe something else.

A new banjo will come you set up (well, maybe the bridge laying down and needing to be placed) IF the seller states that in its product listings. Otherwise, you may be on your own.

Is it hairsplitting to worry or obsess over missing out on banjos you should have seen or chosen? Maybe. It happens. But if you have several banjos on your could-buy list (which it seems you'll need) then you should try not to worry about choosing one vs another. It seems like you're going to need several banjos you're prepared to buy and will just have to go with one when it becomes available. Or pass if it's not high on your list and just wait.

Do I understand that it's costly to order from a US seller and bring the banjo into Canada?

Final word: Despite recent inflation it still seems to me that a budget of $3000 US lets you afford a used example from every US maker, and in some cases something higher up than their base line professional instruments.

It also buys you new instruments of all the quality import models as well as a new Hatfield Buck Creek, Deering Sierra or Eagle II, and maybe a Sullivan or Companion (about which I know nothing). 

Good luck shopping.

 

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You've put a lot of detail in your reply, very interesting and useful to me. Thank you. 

I'm realizing there are many more nuances in this thread than I originally thought and will need to recalibrate my thinking a bit and perhaps lower my sights to something more appropriate for my skill level. I was thinking that buying the best banjo I could afford would leave plenty of room for improving my skills without having to ratchet up my instrument every once in a while. Maybe that's a better approach. 

quote:

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Originally posted by 2ndString

quote:

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Originally posted by From The Basement

Check the Twelfth Fret in Toronto.
 

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FTB, thanks for the tip, I've had a look at their website and contacted them - Shane is going to keep an eye out. Apparently they don't have as many banjos in stock as their website shows - it's "out of date" according to Shane. 
 

you are welcome..hope they come up with something.

being in Vancouver have you thought about seeing if there are any good banjo stores in Seattle area.

buy down there and drive it back across.

 

 

Cheers!

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