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This is split off from Rituals and Invocations

Warshield73 wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 11:16 pmWhat I envisioned was a way for ordinary people to do rituals like protection circles, tracking spells, maybe even open a rift like you see in shows like Supernatural or even Buffy. To balance things out I planned to require non-mages to have components or even artifacts that an actual spellcaster wouldn't need. This would be a lot of work for a house rule so I never did much with it. The most of what I did list a few things for a couple of spells like portal to the Nightlands and such.

I think a system like this would work for most PB games but like I said especially for BtS, NB, and HU.

thorr-kan wrote: ↑Sun May 12, 2024 6:22 pm

Warshield73 wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 11:16 pmAlso, I have rarely needed this in RIfts as there is almost always a mage in the group and really it just fits BtS and my dark version of HU/NB.

It would fit a modern, lower mana world better, I agree. BtS, NB, HU, DR, even TMNT and N&SS/MC.

I think there's design space for a hedge mage and kitchen witch subsytem to fit this need. I also think there's room for a pact magic subsystem that is not a full-on witch or warlock OCC. This would be an excellent model for a fey bargain, someone who keeps the old ways, or a devout but mundane follower of something.

None of the three would be a threat to a real mage. But they would be useful allies to hunters, exorcists, or other adventurers. It could also server as an interesting focus for a PC.

I think this is a discussion that we might take to another thread.

This idea has been kicking around in my head for over 20 years, back when I was running a Heroes Unlimited game themed around Vampire TV show of the time. The PCs were mostly high school students and we had several categories but we didn't have a spell caster. I eventually just introduced a magic store owner who sold them scrolls which also required artifacts or ingredients but this was kind of sloppy and required a lot of hand waving.

What I wanted was a parallel system for non-mages to cast some rituals with the following limitations.
- Belief, every person in the ritual must believe
- The needed a written spell description including the invocation necessary
- They needed to be able to read it, even just phonetically
- They needed all the components for the ritual (which is the biggest problem with house ruling this as we don't have ingredients for rituals listed)
- They needed a source of PPE to make up the difference, this could be an artifact or just more people.

This is where your idea would come in. Maybe for the PPE they would need to pray to a god, make a deal with demon or other such thing.

I really liked this for my HU and NB games but sadly since rituals aren't really defined then making this is kind of tough.

Ah, you beat me to the punch. I'll compose my thoughts and rough out what I was thinking, then come back later.

If I were to write something up, I'd just make it a skill/proficiency you could learn. Given a few pre-reqs (I'd likely say Lore: Magic, Literacy, and Singing or similar skill), you can pick up the ability to learn rituals up to a certain level. Always cast at 1st level, always cost twice the PPE.

There's also story reasons that someone might need to learn a ritual, or you might give them a scroll or have a page from a book function as such... it's not that ANYONE can cast Summon Boojum, it's that if you have this book and follow this ritual, you can cast Summon Boojum (and maybe only under these circumstances).

Library Ogre wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2024 3:56 pm If I were to write something up, I'd just make it a skill/proficiency you could learn. Given a few pre-reqs (I'd likely say Lore: Magic, Literacy, and Singing or similar skill), you can pick up the ability to learn rituals up to a certain level. Always cast at 1st level, always cost twice the PPE.

There's also story reasons that someone might need to learn a ritual, or you might give them a scroll or have a page from a book function as such... it's not that ANYONE can cast Summon Boojum, it's that if you have this book and follow this ritual, you can cast Summon Boojum (and maybe only under these circumstances).

I think you get exactly what I am going for. Summoning, calling on a spirit, these should be things that anyone can do, if they have the text for it. It should also be possible for ordinary people to be able to cast certain protections and be able to pass along that knowledge.

Warshield73 wrote: ↑Fri May 17, 2024 9:07 am

Library Ogre wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2024 3:56 pm If I were to write something up, I'd just make it a skill/proficiency you could learn. Given a few pre-reqs (I'd likely say Lore: Magic, Literacy, and Singing or similar skill), you can pick up the ability to learn rituals up to a certain level. Always cast at 1st level, always cost twice the PPE.

There's also story reasons that someone might need to learn a ritual, or you might give them a scroll or have a page from a book function as such... it's not that ANYONE can cast Summon Boojum, it's that if you have this book and follow this ritual, you can cast Summon Boojum (and maybe only under these circumstances).

I think you get exactly what I am going for. Summoning, calling on a spirit, these should be things that anyone can do, if they have the text for it. It should also be possible for ordinary people to be able to cast certain protections and be able to pass along that knowledge.

The original text of Mysteries of Magic included some options for acquiring magical powers through skill usage. Things like a latent warlock ability, some introductory wizard magic, minor priestly powers... in line with my other rules for getting psychic powers by spending skills, rather than a random roll.

Library Ogre wrote: ↑Fri May 17, 2024 3:44 pm

Warshield73 wrote: ↑Fri May 17, 2024 9:07 am

Library Ogre wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2024 3:56 pmIf I were to write something up, I'd just make it a skill/proficiency you could learn. Given a few pre-reqs (I'd likely say Lore: Magic, Literacy, and Singing or similar skill), you can pick up the ability to learn rituals up to a certain level. Always cast at 1st level, always cost twice the PPE.

There's also story reasons that someone might need to learn a ritual, or you might give them a scroll or have a page from a book function as such... it's not that ANYONE can cast Summon Boojum, it's that if you have this book and follow this ritual, you can cast Summon Boojum (and maybe only under these circumstances).

I think you get exactly what I am going for. Summoning, calling on a spirit, these should be things that anyone can do, if they have the text for it. It should also be possible for ordinary people to be able to cast certain protections and be able to pass along that knowledge.

The original text of Mysteries of Magic included some options for acquiring magical powers through skill usage. Things like a latent warlock ability, some introductory wizard magic, minor priestly powers... in line with my other rules for getting psychic powers by spending skills, rather than a random roll.

This sounds similar to what is in BTS 1e the "Read Magic" skill of the Arcanist and parapsychologist. In BTS 1e it doesn't even seem like most characters can even read magic scrolls. This would be an interesting skill and it you make it harder by having pre-recs like Lore: Magic, lit in the language, and maybe something like poetry or singing or even public speaking.

Skills would be good way to make it possible while still not making it automatic.

Warshield73 wrote: ↑Fri May 17, 2024 10:41 pm This sounds similar to what is in BTS 1e the "Read Magic" skill of the Arcanist and parapsychologist. In BTS 1e it doesn't even seem like most characters can even read magic scrolls. This would be an interesting skill and it you make it harder by having pre-recs like Lore: Magic, lit in the language, and maybe something like poetry or singing or even public speaking.

Skills would be good way to make it possible while still not making it automatic.

I read a *lot* of Palladium sources working on MoM.